View Full Version : Bug Protection
Megapixel
03-14-2010, 12:40
I'm posting this here since we are considering this piece of gear:
http://www.rei.com/product/708136
for our upcoming thru hike of the JMT. Any thoughts or better yet experiences with this hat? It doesn't appear to have any mesh for the face, which is my biggest concern since I'm not aware of the capabilities of the bug shield the hat is treated with. Love the sun protection it will provide, just a bit worried about the mosquito protection.
Thanks in advance folks.
scottdennis
03-14-2010, 12:50
Personally it looks like a waste of money to me. It may be good for sun, but its open as you said.
So you will be putting a chemically treated garment right next to your face. I'm not too big on that.
What happens after 70 washes? You buy a new hat? (I would guess that a dirty hat would block the chemical that "keeps the bugs away."
It just looks gimmicky to me. (But I have no first hand experience.)
Megapixel
03-14-2010, 13:18
Yeah i'm leaning heavily towards mesh enclosure over a hat...i wasn't too concerned about the 70 washes as I don't wash hats very often, but all in all i agree that it won't offer solid bug protection.
Mountain Wildman
03-14-2010, 13:33
How did permethrin originate, and what are its uses?
Permethrin is a man-made version of a natural insect repellent found in certain chrysanthemum plants. The Insect Shield process binds a proprietary permethrin formula tightly to fabric fibers resulting in effective, odorless insect protection that lasts beyond the expected lifetime of apparel. Permethrin has been successfully used in the United States as an U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA)-registered product since 1977, with an excellent safety record. It is used in lice shampoos for children, flea dips for dogs, and various other products, some of which are regulated by the FDA.</SPAN></SPAN></SPAN></SPAN></SPAN>
Which insects does Insect Shield repel?
Insect Shield Repellent Apparel has been proven and registered to repel mosquitoes, ticks, ants, flies, chiggers, and midges (no-see-ums). Insect Shield Repellent Gear has been proven and registered to repel mosquitoes, ticks, fleas, and flies. The EPA requires extensive effectiveness data to prove a product's ability to repel insects. Many species and varieties of these insects have been tested, including those that can carry dangerous diseases.
Mountain Wildman
03-14-2010, 13:48
Insect shield is in the fabric material before the garment is produced, most people spray deet and other repellents directly on their skin or clothing, Personally, I've never liked the idea of spraying chemicals on my skin, I have camped outdoors since 1984 and never used any insect repellent, I don't carry it and never used it even when offered by companions. To each his own though. I plan to wear insect shield clothing on my Thru-Hike next year. I have experienced black flies personally, most flies just buzz around and annoy you, Black flies bite, As tiny as they are it feels like you have been bit by a huge Horse fly. Ouch!!!
Snowleopard
03-14-2010, 13:58
I have a hat that's almost identical. I like it for bug protection. Using it last summer I got away with no DEET for mosquitos or black flies, but it was a low bug year here. When mosquitos are bad you'll still need a headnet or DEET, but you'll need less DEET with this hat because you're partly protected.
So, I recommend the hat, but bring DEET or headnet anyway. I also recommend treating your clothing with Permethrin. When the bugs are bad use DEET on exposed skin.
Mountain Wildman
03-14-2010, 14:04
I have a hat that's almost identical. I like it for bug protection. Using it last summer I got away with no DEET for mosquitos or black flies, but it was a low bug year here. When mosquitos are bad you'll still need a headnet or DEET, but you'll need less DEET with this hat because you're partly protected.
So, I recommend the hat, but bring DEET or headnet anyway. I also recommend treating your clothing with Permethrin. When the bugs are bad use DEET on exposed skin.
Absolutely, I don't use deet by I do have the Outdoor Research Deluxe Headnet. I hate mosquitos!!!
JustaTouron
03-14-2010, 14:17
I have a hat that's almost identical. I like it for bug protection. Using it last summer I got away with no DEET for mosquitos or black flies, but it was a low bug year here. When mosquitos are bad you'll still need a headnet or DEET, but you'll need less DEET with this hat because you're partly protected.
So, I recommend the hat, but bring DEET or headnet anyway. I also recommend treating your clothing with Permethrin. When the bugs are bad use DEET on exposed skin.
Also eat garlic. I find if I snack on a clove of garlic the bug rarely bite (they don't like the smell of my skin/sweat).
The other benefit is it does an excellent job of repelling vampires. I am happy to report I have not once been attacked by a vampire...I attribute that to the garlic.
The only side effect it also very effective at repelling my wife. Sometimes that can be a good thing....some times not so much.
I'm posting this here since we are considering this piece of gear:
http://www.rei.com/product/708136
...
Thanks in advance folks.
I used it for the JMT section of the PCT last summer(late June/Early July). However, I also had treated my pants and long sleave shirt with Permithrin (same stuff used in that hat). The mosquitos would land on me and then fly off without biting through my clothing (they normally would have). The cape kept them off my neck and in general, they avoided my face, even when I was taking a break (though I still had a headnet just in case).
I personally perfer Permithrin on my clothing to regularly having to apply DEET. I didn't use DEET at all along the JMT part though I did resort to using it for 2 days in Northern Yosemite after I left the JMT as the mosquitos got reallly bad in comparison to the JMT. My exposed face and hands started to get bit allittle, so the DEET came out. Rae Lakes along the JMT was bad (it was still a swamp as it hadn't dried out yet) but as I hiked through it without stopping in the afternoon/evening, it wasn't an issue. Overall, I only got a handful of bites (mostly on my hands) after hiking from Kennedy Meadows to Lake Tahoe.
Helmuth.Fishmonger
03-18-2010, 13:16
I hike usually in early season when the bugs are really dense, and I only need a very small amount of DEET in the very bad areas. Usually, within 7-10 days up there, I don't even notice them any longer, and my blood is their favorite type. Have to try the garlic thing :)
HiKen2011
03-18-2010, 13:27
When treating your own clothes with permithrin how long does it last?
Snowleopard
03-18-2010, 14:47
When treating your own clothes with permithrin how long does it last?
for Sawyer pump spray permethrin:
"One treatment will last up to six washings or six weeks before clothing has to be treated again"
That matches with my experience. If you store the garment in a plastic bag when it's not being used the permethrin lasts longer.
I used this Dr. Shade add-on which fits over any baseball style hat. I could take it off when not needed, eg. in the evening.
http://www.bigedge.com/product.asp?pid=2208565&rf=gbase
Helmuth.Fishmonger
03-19-2010, 12:06
When treating your own clothes with permithrin how long does it last?
dunno, but I know it doesn't bother the mosquitoes. They happy land on freshly treated clothes. I even used US military grade and not the diluted Sawyer stuff. I'm sure it has ticks and other bugs run far away, but the Sierra mosquito let me know on day one that it didn't care. They do seem to be more reluctant to actually sting you once they land on your clothes, though, but they certainly don't stay away from you because of the permethrin.
Snowleopard
03-19-2010, 12:17
dunno, but I know it doesn't bother the mosquitoes. They happy land on freshly treated clothes. I even used US military grade and not the diluted Sawyer stuff. I'm sure it has ticks and other bugs run far away, but the Sierra mosquito let me know on day one that it didn't care. They do seem to be more reluctant to actually sting you once they land on your clothes, though, but they certainly don't stay away from you because of the permethrin.
Permethrin is not a repellent so they're not going to stay away from you because of it. It's basically an insecticide. It may kill some insects. In my experience mosquitos and black flies don't bite through a treated thin fabric. Crawling insects are more likely to drop off it before they reach flesh than with untreated fabric.
Using permethrin on clothes reduces the need for DEET. When mosquitos are bad, you'll still need DEET on exposed flesh. This is basically what the military uses now -- permethrin treated clothes and time release DEET (ultrathon) on exposed flesh. Black flies are somewhat different. What I've read, they don't like to go into an enclosed area; the hat that the OP asked about encloses your face enough that fewer black flies seem to go for your face and eyes. Again when they're bad add DEET to exposed flesh.
That is pretty much my experience in the Sierra with Permithrin. They will land on you and crawl around for a short time and fly off. But they won't bite through the treated fabric which was always the problem in the past. And for the most part, with the whole cape thing, they rarely tried to land on the face unless they were really thick.
khumbukat
03-22-2010, 22:44
Please take note that NPS in Yosemite asks you to not wash Permithrin treated clothing in streams and/or lakes during your trip , as the chemical gets in the water and can disrupt important life cycles and bio-accumulate in fish. Yes it is that bad. Personally i won't go near the stuff. Natural insect repellants work in Yosemite, they just require frequent applications. A headnet is the most important item in pack during mosquito season. Also note mosquitos are directly related to elevation, and time of year. Often a 2-300 ft change in elevation makes all the difference.
Happy Trails.
In my experience, permethrin is basically an insecticide, not a repellent. It will kill mosquitoes, lice and numerous other bugs -- and does great damage to critters that live in the water. Never rinse a garment sprayed with the chemical in a lake, river or stream. It's deadly to many valuable creatures -- including cats.
Weary
Is the 6oz permithrin clothing soak kit available at any outfitters in trail towns?
Helmuth.Fishmonger
02-24-2011, 13:40
Is the 6oz permithrin clothing soak kit available at any outfitters in trail towns?
there are no towns on the JMT
Blissful
02-25-2011, 21:51
Is the 6oz permithrin clothing soak kit available at any outfitters in trail towns?
Buy permethrin as a spray from Campmor (http://www.campmor.com/outdoor/gear/Product___56624) and spray your clothes ahead of time. We did it last year for Maine.