Hiking the GSMNP..opinions?

[bmwsmity]

So I'm getting ready to do my next section, which is from Fontana to (hopefully) Max Patch, starting 9/5...

So far I'm thinking my stops will be as follows:

Day 1 - Fontana to Russel Field (13.5 mi)
Day 2 - Russel Field to Double Spring Gap (16.4mi)
Day 3 - Pecks Corner (21.2 mi)
Day 4 - Davenport Gap (20 mi)
Day 5 - Max Patch Summit, then back to Max Patch Rd? (14.9 mi)

I've hiked from Fontana to Shuckstack, so I know 13.5 mi is doable for me the first day.

Main question is, I really want to make it to Max Patch, but is Max Patch Rd a point that I can get a shuttle from?

Any idea what water is like in the park right now?

Any idea what kind of temps I should plan for clothing-wise? I'm thinkin I'm gonna bring my Cap 3 baselayer just in case when I get up around Clingmans...

And finally, any exceptional shuttle service to get from Max Patch to Fontana? Or vice versa? I like leaving my car at my destination rather than my departure point, but is there anywhere near Max Patch I can leave it?

worst case, I could just end near I-40 if need be... I'm gonna do the whole park, but Max Patch would be an extra treat for me.

Thanks! I'm so excited!

[bulldog49]

For the shuttle, call Curtis at Standing Bear Farm. He runs a great hostel located right on the trail just past Davenport Gap.



http://standingbearfarm.tripod.com/

[bulldog49]

Also, if I were doing that trip I would stay at Spence Field on day 1 and Mt. Collins on day 2 (if not still closed due to bear activity). Russell Field shelter's water source is polluted with horse crap (a horse trail crosses the spring).

I wouldn't worry about Clingman's being cool, not during the day. Day's will be warm and humid even at that elevation. Base layer might be handy for sleeping but Cap 3 is overkill imo.

[bulldog49]

Final thought, I would feel better about leaving my car at the dam instead of Max Patch. If you use Curtis you could also leave your car at the hostel and arrange for Curtis to pick you up at Max Patch. Curtis will know if there have been problems with vandalism at Max Patch.

[bigcranky]

Yeah, I would park at Standing Bear and get rides both ways.

[bulldog49]

If you don't plan to spend the night on Max Patch, you can drop your gear at SBF and slack pack to Max Patch.

[jorhawle]

I'm pretty sure Russell Field shelter is closed because of bears. You technically won't be a thru hiker, have you called and set up reservations? You could stay at Mollies shelter night 1 and probably still make it to double spring gap if you really push it. That third day is going to be a tough one for you...good luck!!!

[bmwsmity]

awesome input everyone...

yeah i'm thinking maybe doing Mollies shelter first night... the climb to Shuckstack is gonna be tough since my last time on the AT was in May... should get me nice and warmed up for a 18.9 mile to Double Spring the second day...

"cap 3 is overkill" - maybe... but i use a hammock... that considered, what kinda temps will i be facing overnight? Double springs is at 5,500'...

i've got down to about 60 degrees with just my silk bag liner, sleeping pad, and shorts and t-shirt in my hammock and was just fine... but this time i'll take my sleeping bag too... so maybe the cap 3 is overkill? i'd love to shed some weight... maybe get a cap 2 layer instead?

thanks!

[bmwsmity]

oh, and how's the water sources in the park now?

[Ox97GaMe]

Water in the park is ok at the moment. Mollies is reporting dry, but there is a flagged route to a spring 100 yrds below the piped spring. Should still be ok in 2 weeks, as we are forecast to get periodic showers over the next week.

Day 2 and Day 3 are pretty aggressive. Your planned day 2, although shorter miles than day 3, will be your toughest. The section between Spence and Derrick is the toughest AT in the park. You would be better served to try to push to Spence the first day if you can (from Mollies to Spence is not a bad hike) and set up to make that long afternoon pull from Derrick to Double Springs the next day.

If you make it to Davenport Gap shelter, I would suggest going ahead and hiking on out of the park. It is just .9 more, and there are some really nice campsites between Davenport Gap Rd and I-40.

The other thing to be aware of is that you wont be allowed to set up your hammock at the shelters if the ridgerunner is at the shelter. You will want to have some sort of sleeping pad with you just in case you are required to stay in the shelter.

[bmwsmity]

Thanks Ox,

Spence would probably be doable day one for sure... I might do that...

And, I'm taking my new NeoAir pad (if it comes in time) with me so I have the option of using the shelters too :)

So is the tough section just super steep short climbs? Looking at the elevation profile it doesnt look too bad... but I know how it can be very deceiving..

Also, my pack should be around 18 lbs, so climbs aren't too bad for me so maybe that day 2 wont be too bad?

[Morning Glory]

I just finished a 7 day NOBO trip of GSMNP yesterday. It is still very warm at night, even in the high elevations. The coolest temperature reading I got was 54, and that was about 7:30 Monday morning on my way up Clingmans Dome. The days averaged in the mid to high 60s in elevations about 4500ft. during the day, and at night it got down to around 60. My 50 degree bag was perfect for me. Water was almost non-existent from the dam up to Mollies Ridge. The spring at Mollies was dry.

[bmwsmity]

awesome morning glory!! thanks for the info... gonna save me some weight for sure :D (except for the extra water i'm bringing now lol)

[bmwsmity]

So I called to reserve my shelters, and Double Springs and Silers were full, so now I'm hikin to Spence, then Mt Collins (19.8), then Pecks (14.9), then Davenport (20.0)... If I feel up to it, gonna continue to Roaring Fork on day 5 then head back to Max Patch rd for shuttle back to Standing Bear (those folks are AWESOME by the way!) can't believe they shuttle all the way to Fontana!

[Morning Glory]

So I called to reserve my shelters, and Double Springs and Silers were full, so now I'm hikin to Spence, then Mt Collins (19.8), then Pecks (14.9), then Davenport (20.0)... If I feel up to it, gonna continue to Roaring Fork on day 5 then head back to Max Patch rd for shuttle back to Standing Bear (those folks are AWESOME by the way!) can't believe they shuttle all the way to Fontana!
BTW...I find your schedule to be very ambitious, but you're probably in much better shape than I am. I think day 2 is really going to be tough.

[bmwsmity]

BTW...I find your schedule to be very ambitious, but you're probably in much better shape than I am. I think day 2 is really going to be tough.

It is gonna be very tough... but, my pack is only 17 lbs, which helps...and I wear trail runners, which also helps.

Hiking for 11 days in snow from Springer to the NOC with a 35 lb pack has made dry surface hiking with 17lbs seem like a cake walk LOL... after postholing over Wayah for 5+ miles, and coming out of Neels Gap with howling wind at 20 degrees crossing waist high snow drifts, my mental state is pretty hardened now haha...

[10-K]

Just an FYI - you can totally disregard the elevation profile if you're looking at the one on National Geographic map #229. I found it to be totally unreliable.

[bmwsmity]

looks like a similar section i've done is from Low Gap to Tray Mtn... which is 5,200' of elevation gain in 14.9 miles...or 349' per mile...

from spence to mt collins is a WHOPPING 6,960' of elevation gain :eek: over 19.8 miles... or 351.5' per mile... so basically, same steepness, but for 5 more miles...

considering the Low Gap to Tray section was ALL in 6-8" of snow, and with about 30 lb pack.. i'm thinking with my current set up i should be good for another 5 miles... (but I will definitely sleep like a baby!)

if you haven't noticed, i'm a total nerd about the numbers when it comes to my hikes... ;)

[bmwsmity]

actually, day one should be shorter, but tougher than day two... 16.9 miles and 6,435' elev gain, which is about 381' per mile...

yikes... 13,395' of elev gain in two days! :eek:

good thing i love challenges...

[bmwsmity]

Just an FYI - you can totally disregard the elevation profile if you're looking at the one on National Geographic map #229. I found it to be totally unreliable.

i use an elevation profile from some website, which is kinda decent..lol..

i think my new favorite on gauging difficulty is this thread where someone figured out how many feet of elevation gain per mile each section is... i'm in nerd heaven!

http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php?t=31293

[BSF-Hiker]

Are you going with Jeremy from central Ky area? He's SmokeEater on here. His group is leaving from Fontana on the 5th and was asking about parking at Davenport Gap area and getting a shuttle to Fontana. If not, maybe you all can do the same shuttle and save some money.

http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php?t=64287

[bmwsmity]

nope... but when i called Standing Bear, Maria said there are four other hikers getting a shuttle to Fontana on Friday morning with me :D gonna save me some mass $$$...

too bad i'm not gonna run into him..

[bmwsmity]

BSF, just noticed you're near Big South Fork... do you ever hike the Sheltowee Trace? My buddy and me are Bikepacking the trace on 9/23-9/30 :)

we ride in London on the trace all the time... love it there!

[BSF-Hiker]

That's good. The four others could be him, he had posted they were planning to leave out of Fontana on the 5th also.

[bmwsmity]

yeah, he post about the departure date was 8/10...so it could have changed and it could be him...

[BSF-Hiker]

Oh yea, I've hiked a lot of it in the Big South Fork area and up to the mouth of Laurel, but I've not been north of there on the ST.

Do you know Paul (PR) from Jackson County? He bikes the trace a lot in that area.

Are you going to start at the TH at Pickett? I work about 4 miles from where the ST crosses Hwy 27, if you need a supply drop or anything.

[BSF-Hiker]

his post was on the 10th, but his Fontana departure is planned for Sept 5th. I don't know what day he is heading down to the Davenport end.

[bmwsmity]

good to know! thanks :)

i'm not sure if we are starting at the northern terminus or southern... my buddy is doing most of the planning... i'll let you know

[Hikes in Rain]

l


if you haven't noticed, i'm a total nerd about the numbers when it comes to my hikes... ;)

"If you can't describe it with mathematics, it's only an opinion" --Robert Heinlein

[bmwsmity]

"If you can't describe it with mathematics, it's only an opinion" --Robert Heinlein

LOL!

well, i DO have a much better perspective on my Day 1 & 2 hikes now in comparison to my previous hikes... better start loading carbs now! and i think i'm gonna bring more food for during the day as well...

[Gray Blazer]

looks like a similar section i've done is from Low Gap to Tray Mtn... which is 5,200' of elevation gain in 14.9 miles...or 349' per mile...



I am a moron so this may be a dumb question. How can you gain 5200' when Tray mountain is only 4430'?

[bmwsmity]

total elevation gain... you go down a hill...then back up, repeat a few times, and though your max altitude may not have been much, you've racked up a lot of miles ascending. ;)

[BSF-Hiker]

good to know! thanks :)

i'm not sure if we are starting at the northern terminus or southern... my buddy is doing most of the planning... i'll let you know

I chatted with your buddy, the other smity on http://www.sheltoweetrace.com/forum a couple nights ago about your trip.

[Lyle]

I'll just say, get an early start on day one. Maybe it was just my attitude, but last year when I started from Fontana Hilton to Mollies Ridge, I thought the day went on FOREVER. Was mentally one of my longest days on the trail, and I'll be passing my half-way point mileage-wise within the next two weeks.

Others have said it's not that bad of climb, I've done much worse and longer ones, but this one kicked my butt last fall. Just psych yourself up for tough, then hopefully you'll find it much easier than your expectations.

Enjoy your hike. I'll be starting Sept. 9th at Newfound Gap, heading to US19, north of Erwin. Can't wait!!!!

[Gray Blazer]

total elevation gain... you go down a hill...then back up, repeat a few times, and though your max altitude may not have been much, you've racked up a lot of miles ascending. ;)

Wouldn't you subtract the mileage of descending from that total to get your total of elevation gain? Where's Wharrgy when you need him?

[Lyle]

Wouldn't you subtract the mileage of descending from that total to get your total of elevation gain? Where's Wharrgy when you need him?


We're talking Net Gain (difference between starting point and end point) vs. Gross Gain (total of all the climbs)

Gross Gain is a legitimate measure because just because you may descend, doesn't make the climbing any easier or less energy sapping.

[bmwsmity]

I know what you mean Lyle... I've done the climb outta Fontana...whew!

And, I'd rather climb than descend... descents kill my knees after a while, but climbs are just cardio.

Leavin tonight...cant wait! Put in 14 hour days to get finished with my project so I can go... after doing irrigation work for 14 hours in 95 degrees, this hike should be a breeze :p

[bmwsmity]

so, my hike was very ambitious indeed...very tough, but i kept the schedule... the hikers i started with had their 4th guy not able to make it, so i was tempted by an easy 13.5 mile 2nd day to take his shelter res., but i pushed all the way to Peck's for a 20 miler (maybe 21...i took a wrong turn by clingman's, and the map mileage from clingmans to the shelter said 3, but the sign said 4 miles...i was not happy! lol)...

actually, i did wind up hiking out of the park on the 4th day on past davenport gap shelter and on to my car for a 24 mile day! yikes! i felt decent up till that blistering fast downhill from mt. cammerer trail to the river.. but it felt great to go in to asheville that night for a hotel stay :)

i didnt hike to Max Patch, however... after the blisters i gave myself from half-jogging down out of the park, the thought of a 17 mile day was not appealing...so i drove up to Max Patch for the sunset...i wound up being the only one up there, so it was an incredible experience!

i gotta say, thus far, GSMNP was my favorite section of the AT, despite the difficulty of the miles I did... the views were well worth it!

:D

[BSF-Hiker]

Glad you had a good hike Smity!

Are you headed to the Sheltowee Trace next week?

[bmwsmity]

Sure am... next Thursday! 280 miles, 7 days... this time I'm on the mtn bike, which will be my first time bikepacking... can't wait, I love the trace, but have only ridden/hiked about 30-40 miles of it at most...