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View Full Version : Illegal posting of WhiteBlaze tags on AT



yktdan
10-14-2010, 14:57
Someone is posting WhiteBlaze tags on part of the AT in NY between Long Hill Rd and the Taconic Parkway.

Please stop, or tell anyone you know who might be doing this to stop. It is graffiti and will be removed.

I suspect it also violates ATCs copyright on the AT symbol that it uses.

Walt Daniels, AT Supervisor Bear Mt Bridge to Rt 301

northernstorm
10-14-2010, 15:08
The enthusiasm is appreciated for the site and the trail, but yes, let's keep it off the trail, and besides, a lot of the reason I hike the trail is to lose all sense of modern computing devices including phones and a wristwatch. The last thing I want to see is websites advertised on trees. Thanks.

StorminMormon
10-14-2010, 15:29
What's next...corporate sponsorship? This section of the AT brought to you by "Burma Shave". Or...maybe a Privy with a Pepto-Bismol Logo on it. Or...better yet, an advertisement on the side of a Black Bear with the showtimes for "When Animals Attack" on the Animal Planet.

mad4scrapping
10-14-2010, 15:46
What a great way to raise funds for trail maintenance. Privys could be named after various corporations. Just think of the possibilities!;)

max patch
10-14-2010, 16:12
What's next...corporate sponsorship?

If you belonged to the ATC you would know that corporate sponsorships already exist and are named in AT Journeys.

Back to the real issues; (1) someone is illegally advertising WB on the trail, and (2) does this site have permission to use ATC copyrights?

max patch
10-14-2010, 16:16
Back to the real issues; (1) someone is illegally advertising WB on the trail, and (2) does this site have permission to use ATC copyrights?

And while I have no doubt that the WB community will parse this issue to death without the benefit of the facts, there is probably only one person who knows the answer to the copyright issue. And he is out hiking.

Luddite
10-14-2010, 16:18
Its a whole different symbol. Theres a hiker obscuring the A so you can't really tell its an AT symbol. I doubt the ATC would care,

mister krabs
10-14-2010, 16:35
Pretty sure that the AT without the sunrise thingie is not owned by ATC. It might be owned by the USFS as seen below.

http://www.nps.gov/appa/images/ANST-Triangle-Logo_1.jpg

Jester2000
10-14-2010, 17:10
I think we're talking about trademark rather than copyright. ATC holds trademarks on the most recent Conservancy design (the one with the sun in it) and the ME to GA diamond. The "A" with the dropdown "T" is not, according to what I've found, trademarked in and of itself -- although both trademarked logos do include that element.

Jester2000
10-14-2010, 17:11
But, um, yeah, regardless of the legality of the image itself, putting them up around the trail is jackassery.

Smile
10-14-2010, 17:13
You can search copyright records :)

LIhikers
10-14-2010, 17:15
But, um, yeah, regardless of the legality of the image itself, putting them up around the trail is jackassery.

I like the way you put that!

northernstorm
10-14-2010, 21:24
But, um, yeah, regardless of the legality of the image itself, putting them up around the trail is jackassery.

Hahahaha!!!

rhjanes
10-14-2010, 22:57
What a great way to raise funds for trail maintenance. Privys could be named after various corporations. Just think of the possibilities!;)Naw....but I'd buy into naming them after politicians!

RedneckRye
10-15-2010, 00:33
If you are looking for wilderness, escape, no commercials, etc in the year of 2010, you're going to need to get further off of the path than the AT.

And, the ad worked.
It got yktdan to post for the first time.

Wise Old Owl
10-15-2010, 00:51
Very tough call, I am glad that the thread starter brought this to the groups attention, yes a clear oversight by one member who shouldn't have and overstepped. But I don't even give a damn about signs that say " no turn on red" Why? Demo, Govt passed laws to reduce gas consumption by allowing RTOR. then muncipalities suddenly realized that some corners were having too many accidents. Hense the sudden sign.. Today its clearly un -enforceable.. Its a joke and the officers have a higher priority.



Post away and clearly it will take more effort to take it down ... my ANSWER..WHOO cares?

fiddlehead
10-15-2010, 07:25
Pretty sure that the AT without the sunrise thingie is not owned by ATC. It might be owned by the USFS as seen below.

http://www.nps.gov/appa/images/ANST-Triangle-Logo_1.jpg


Hey, anybody know where I can get a full sized one of the above plaques?
I have the CDT and PCT but not the AT.
I'd appreciate a PM if anyone knows. (and I don't mean steal one)

StorminMormon
10-15-2010, 09:07
If you belonged to the ATC you would know that corporate sponsorships already exist and are named in AT Journeys.

You're right - I don't belong to the ATC yet. I'm new here. But thank you so much for the warm invitation. I guess I should just keep my head down and not speak up until I've gathered over 3,000 posts on a user forum.

Cookerhiker
10-15-2010, 09:21
What's next...corporate sponsorship? This section of the AT brought to you by "Burma Shave". Or...maybe a Privy with a Pepto-Bismol Logo on it. Or...better yet, an advertisement on the side of a Black Bear with the showtimes for "When Animals Attack" on the Animal Planet.


If you belonged to the ATC you would know that corporate sponsorships already exist and are named in AT Journeys.

Back to the real issues; (1) someone is illegally advertising WB on the trail, and (2) does this site have permission to use ATC copyrights?


You're right - I don't belong to the ATC yet. I'm new here. But thank you so much for the warm invitation. I guess I should just keep my head down and not speak up until I've gathered over 3,000 posts on a user forum.

The ATC has corporate members, accepts advertising in AT Journeys from corporations, and of course donations/contributions from corporations.

But as far as I know, "corporate sponsorship" doesn't extend to naming rights like sports stadiums and the like. So there's no "Mountain Hardwear" shelter or "Coca-cola" trail segment.

And hopefully, we'll never go there. I wish I was as sanguine about other public entities such as parks, schools, roads etc.

StorminMormon, welcome to WhiteBlaze! I'd encourage you to join the ATC. By doing so, you support Trail protection and help build and maintain a constituency for the AT. The nuimber of dues-paying ATC members is a much more relevant statistic than the number of WhiteBlaze members when Dave Startzel or other ATC officials testify before Congress.

We AT lovers should never take for granted the Trail's existance.

StorminMormon
10-15-2010, 09:32
StorminMormon, welcome to WhiteBlaze! I'd encourage you to join the ATC...

Absolutely. Just joined WB a couple weeks ago. I'm planning a weekend hike near Hot Springs, NC with the wife for next month. Hopefully it will be one of many hikes on the AT. Thanks for the invitation.

sherrill
10-15-2010, 10:00
But as far as I know, "corporate sponsorship" doesn't extend to naming rights like sports stadiums and the like. So there's no "Mountain Hardwear" shelter or "Coca-cola" trail segment.

Didn't some guy named "Cubby" sponsor some shelters a while back? ;)

weary
10-15-2010, 11:42
Didn't some guy named "Cubby" sponsor some shelters a while back? ;)
If I remember rightly, ATC has a role in one or two hostels, or did. I doubt if ATC owns any shelters. Shelters, like the trail itself, are built and maintained mostly by volunteers from local maintaining clubs.

Maine Appalachian Trail Club has occasionally named shelters and campsites for longtime volunteers. But generally does not name facilities in response to donations. I don't know anything about the policies of other clubs.

AMC has named the sporting camp on Long Pond that it is restoring for the founder of the modern LL Bean stores, but that is well off the trail and I doubt if it will be heavily used by thru hikers, though it is likely to become an important starting and stopping place for section hikers.

Weary

sherrill
10-15-2010, 12:04
Actually, weary, I was referring to the guy who was spray painting "Cubby was here" all over shelters, as well as other places.

But your info is good to have as well. Thanks. :)

weary
10-15-2010, 12:35
Actually, weary, I was referring to the guy who was spray painting "Cubby was here" all over shelters, as well as other places.

But your info is good to have as well. Thanks. :)

Shortly after MATC opened its new East Branch shelter opened a few years ago, a couple marked up the walls with giant letters. They were tracked down, fined and made to sand off the graffiti. Volunteers had worked all spring and summer cutting the timbers, milling them with a chain saw, and erecting the shelter. When they returned for a ribbon cutting they found their fresh new shelter grossly defaced. They notified the National Park service, who sent someone to successfully investigate.

northernstorm
10-15-2010, 12:46
If I remember rightly, ATC has a role in one or two hostels, or did. I doubt if ATC owns any shelters. Shelters, like the trail itself, are built and maintained mostly by volunteers from local maintaining clubs.

Maine Appalachian Trail Club has occasionally named shelters and campsites for longtime volunteers. But generally does not name facilities in response to donations. I don't know anything about the policies of other clubs.

AMC has named the sporting camp on Long Pond that it is restoring for the founder of the modern LL Bean stores, but that is well off the trail and I doubt if it will be heavily used by thru hikers, though it is likely to become an important starting and stopping place for section hikers.

Weary

Never forget those who give their time and strength so we may sleep dry and enjoy the simple luxuries out on the trail. Thanks.

Jonnycat
10-15-2010, 13:50
Absolutely. Just joined WB a couple weeks ago. I'm planning a weekend hike near Hot Springs, NC with the wife for next month. Hopefully it will be one of many hikes on the AT. Thanks for the invitation.

Heya Stormy! Good thing it's the norm to bottom post here! :D

Hoop Time
10-15-2010, 15:25
It is stupid to be putting these out there on the trail. But throwing around copyright and trademark claims won't scare anybody. Even if the WB logo would be held to violate a copyright or infringe on a trademark, it is a civil, not a criminal matter. And you'd need to be able to show damages to get a judgment beyond a cease and desist. Doubt you could make a case against whomever is putting out those tags. Would even be tough to make a claim against this site since it hardly uses that logo for commercial gain and it is doubtful anyone would buy a claim that people using this site are being fooled into thinking it is affiliated with the ATC or NPS.

Land_Shark
10-16-2010, 05:56
Land Shark on the move. There is way to much TRASH on the AT. If one is to hike other major trails you do not see the human foot print that you see on the AT. So asking for sponsership from corporations is note worthy but misguided. Nailing signs to trees is just STUPID and taking an AXE to a tree (CT trail) to blaze is STUPID. I have hiked many miles and the best way is to know the path that you are hiking and look for the eco painted blazes placed by those who maintance the trail. And for those individuals I thank you.

Blackbird
10-16-2010, 10:38
I'd go as much as .4 off of the trail to use the Paladino Privy.

lilricky
10-16-2010, 11:29
After looking at the Whiteblaze tag that the person was attaching on the AT, I don't think we have to worry about Trademark infringement, its an official Whiteblaze tag. If these tags are being place in numerous amounts, I think it might be someone attached to Whiteblaze trying to increase visitor hits to the site. I think thats an even more serious problem.

restless
10-16-2010, 11:41
Land Shark on the move. There is way to much TRASH on the AT. If one is to hike other major trails you do not see the human foot print that you see on the AT. So asking for sponsership from corporations is note worthy but misguided. Nailing signs to trees is just STUPID and taking an AXE to a tree (CT trail) to blaze is STUPID. I have hiked many miles and the best way is to know the path that you are hiking and look for the eco painted blazes placed by those who maintance the trail. And for those individuals I thank you.

Before paint blazes became the standard, axe blazing was the traditional means of blazing. In some circumstances, I believe it is still used and, if done correctly, cause no substantial harm to the tree.

Lion King
10-16-2010, 12:26
I know of one person who put these up at a hostel and in NH and I mentioned to them that it isn't a cool thing to do, especially without the Hostel owners permission.

I would be HIGHLY disappointed in this individual if they are the ones putting these stickers up on the trail...they should know better.

Jonnycat
10-16-2010, 12:39
Before paint blazes became the standard, axe blazing was the traditional means of blazing. In some circumstances, I believe it is still used and, if done correctly, cause no substantial harm to the tree.

This is correct. There are still large trees, very much alive, along a variety of trails here in Oregon. They still have their blazes (done by axe, the original standard for a blaze), which are still very much functional for navigation, remaining from before the practice was phased out in what I am assuming was the 70s or 80s, a testament to their functionality.

http://img524.imageshack.us/img524/9127/treeblaze2.jpg

Our fathers and our father's fathers were a lot wiser than we often give them credit.

Lone Wolf
10-16-2010, 22:12
a few WB stickers on trees ain't hurtin' nothin