View Full Version : Do I really need those maps?
flatfeet
10-20-2010, 07:16
The official maps are soooo expensive. Much more than I thought they would be.
I've heard people say you won't need/use them. But the idea of heading into the
woods with no map sounds crazy to say they least.
Is there perhaps a place to get some other maps that are just as good but not as expensive?
Cheers.
StorminMormon
10-20-2010, 08:14
There are several resources that I use. One is http://www.digital-topo-maps.com/
I also like Trails.com (although you have to be a member) because they have Topo maps and hundreds (if not thousands) of Trail Guides which make great maps.
Are there any specific maps you are looking for right now? Or do you want "the whole trail". Unless you're doing a through hike, just start "collecting" them a little at a time.
Can you hike and follow the trail without maps?
Yep, has been done many times and will be done many more. The trail is worn and marked quite well for the most part.
Will maps come in handy?
Yep, the last section I was on, I use them a few times. While overall the trail is well marked, there are exceptions. There were sections that were poorly marked at trail junctions - a blaze placed in the fork, BETWEEN two well-worn trails, then no additional blazes for about a half to three quarters of a mile. Caused me to backtrack, and pull out the map. I had followed the right path, but examining the map confirmed this for me.
Also, side trails aren't as well marked if you want to use any of them.
Emergency exit strategy is much more precise if you have a map that shows where a side trail or road leads.
All in all it's a personal choice. I like to be able to name some of the mountains and ridges that I'm looking at.
One thing most people agree on. If you choose not to carry maps, DO NOT make a pest of yourself at every break and shelter wanting to "borrow" a map from someone who has carried one. :-)
jersey joe
10-20-2010, 08:17
You can get the whole AT map set from the ATC for a decent price...cheaper if you are a member.
https://www.atctrailstore.org/catalog/itemlist.cfm?catid=150&submit.x=6&submit.y=11 (https://www.atctrailstore.org/catalog/iteminfo.cfm?itemid=190&compid=1)
Maps for all 14 states; only the Maine book (at a discount)
Item No.: #144
Price: $230.75, $184.60 for members
StorminMormon
10-20-2010, 08:37
Ooops...sorry, I didn't see that this was in the "Thru Hike" section of the forum. Sorry for the oversight.
garlic08
10-20-2010, 08:41
I agree that the maps are relatively expensive, for such a well-marked trail. A map set would have added nearly 10% to my hiking expenses. Maps for the other major US trails are not nearly so expensive per mile.
I carried free (a gift from a friend) AAA road map sections for each state to help with identifying major roads, summits, town locations, and for exit strategies. Otherwise, it was easy enough find one of the 82,000+ (actual count, no exaggeration) northbound blazes.
As to the first question, do you need them, there are several threads every year that exhaust that topic. The best advice I've seen in all those posts is that if you're not sure if you need maps or not, you should carry them.
http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php?t=40042 (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php?t=40042)
flatfeet
10-20-2010, 09:53
Any one have a good set they can email me?
In Pennsylvania especially land ownership is complex and policies vary from one place to another. Without KTA's maps, it will often be unclear who owns and manages the land and therefore what policies apply.
Since someone surely will post in reply indicating what I just posted doesn't matter, I'll preemptively disagree. Conservation of the Appalachian Trail's core values in Pennsylvania depends upon informed users respecting policies adopted by land managers to protect resources shared by many groups sometimes with conflicting interests.
These recurring threads don't help to improve the economies of scale involved with producing the official guides, the supply of used ATC maps or the market for either.
I was (a very very small) part of that huge thread that Emerald kindly posted. I stated the intention there of going with digital-only maps, i.e., maps on my GPS (which for this trip was also my cell phone).
This worked perfectly, very rarely wanted and essentially never needed, but (with prior experience at using this tool) available for the few times when, for example, snow covered the trail to the extend that it wasn't at all clear where it went. Experience and a bit of poking around and thinking usually will solve that sort of thing too, but a couple of times it was nice to turn on the phone and find whether the trail went left around, right around, or (hey, it's the AT ...) straight up the hill in front of me. Even less of an issue for folks starting late enough that there's little snow left.
IMO this sort of thing is situational. There are very few and no other long trails where I would even think of going without paper maps. On the CDT next year I'll be carrying at least two different kinds of paper maps in addition to guide book pages (also with maps) and town guide info, probably a couple of friggin' pounds of paper out of each resupply point. Plus maps on a standalone GPS and on my cell phone. It's a very different proposition from the AT.
Each to their own, but I think that if a person wants to do a little work up front for an AT trip they can get digital maps on a device they might already be carrying, and possibly save some expense (depending on map source, USGS topos can be free or quite cheap), and of course at no added no weight.
emerald, NOT meaning to argue (!), but w.r.t. PA land ownership I don't particularly recall any issues there --- it seemed to me that I just followed white blazes and slept in shelters as usual. Maybe there were issues there that I've already forgotten (all too possible) or that I was just flat ignorant of. It seemed that on the AT there were often signs telling a person that it's private property around, stay on the trail for the next X miles, that sort of thing.
Uninformed hikers aren't aware of issues. I believe improvements to the Appalachian Trail in Pennsylvania require an increase in user levels, but it cannot support more users without greater awareness and more cooperation.
PA land issues are mostly political issues, not actual environmental issues from what I have observed while living and working there. Local entities playing "turf" games.
Most folks will be just fine if they hike on the trail, sleep in/at the shelters, and observe all the regular LNT standards.
jersey joe
10-20-2010, 11:08
Carrying maps doesn't mean a hiker will know or be aware of these regulations. Best to make use of signs to make regulations known on the trail.
Bags4266
10-20-2010, 11:12
http://www.amazon.com/Appalachian-Trail-Thru-Hikers-Handbook-2010/dp/0970791666
Much better guide here if you can find it. Has small topo maps which are helpful. Thats all you need.
You can get the whole AT map set from the ATC for a decent price...cheaper if you are a member.
https://www.atctrailstore.org/catalog/itemlist.cfm?catid=150&submit.x=6&submit.y=11 (https://www.atctrailstore.org/catalog/iteminfo.cfm?itemid=190&compid=1)
Maps for all 14 states; only the Maine book (at a discount)
Item No.: #144
Price: $230.75, $184.60 for members
They usually go on sale in late November. Keep checking the ATC website.
Yes, maps are important, both for the occasional time you get confused on the trail, but everyday for those of us who are curious about what one is seeing on the trail -- names of adjacent mountains, intersecting roads and trails, distances to the next shelter .... all kinds of things.
Weary
Carrying maps doesn't mean a hiker will know or be aware of these regulations. Best to make use of signs to make regulations known on the trail.
Hikers cannot know what regulations apply until they establish where they are located. ATC's guides are intended to accomplish precisely what you claim maps cannot.
People destroy and vandalize signs. They constantly need to be replaced and someone needs to pay for their replacement. Is it not true an excess of signage detracts from the experience?
Why is it hikers think it's someone else's responsibility to inform them and they should not also be expected to expend their resources?
Most folks will be just fine if they hike on the trail, sleep in/at the shelters, and observe all the regular LNT standards.
What exactly is the first LNT principle? I will quote it since some never take the time to learn LNT guidelines or invent their own.
Respecting regulations and/or adopted policies isn't some higher, optional standard of behavior. In fact, in some instances, regulations codify portions of LNT which then become the law of the land.
Plan Ahead and Prepare
Know the regulations and special concerns for the area you'll visit.
Prepare for extreme weather, hazards, and emergencies.
Schedule your trip to avoid times of high use.
Visit in small groups when possible. Consider splitting larger groups into smaller groups.
Repackage food to minimize waste.
Use a map and compass to reduce the need for marking paint, rock cairns or flagging
jersey joe
10-20-2010, 12:44
Hikers cannot know what regulations apply until they establish where they are located.
People destroy and vandalize signs. They constantly need to be replaced and someone needs to pay for their replacement. Is it not true an excess of signs detracts from the experience?
Why is it hikers think it's someone else's responsibility to inform them and they should not also be expected to expend their resources?
I'm not saying signs don't have their flaws. But they may be your best bet for getting hikers to observe land regulations. Many don't carry maps, and those that do might not have an old map that doesn't reflect a recent land regulation?!? I always found signs saying something like "no camping, private property for the next 3 miles" very helpful, even when carrying a map.
For a trail like the Appalachian Trail, I sort of expect that it is ok to hike on the trail and that it's location has been worked out already, however, I never expect it is legal to camp anywhere along the trail.
Signage is an important part of information transfer on the A.T., but hikers need to take the time to read them and often not everything printed on signs at points of entry applies to hikers.
When hikers carry and refer to the current, official guide or a handbook and maps beforehand, it's much like doing one's homework before attending a class and serves much the same purpose. Signs then serve as a reminder and to indicate new conditions of use may apply.
The best advice I've seen in all those posts is that if you're not sure if you need maps or not, you should carry them.
I was just going to post this advice.
If you have to ask, you probably should carry them.
4eyedbuzzard
10-20-2010, 15:19
Nah, you don't need no stinkin' maps. Just beg and borrow to use the ones all the other hikers spent their money on. :rolleyes:
I carried maps and as 4eyedbuzzard said, those that didn't "need" maps sure liked to look at mine. Found them to be very useful, and at times necessary,especially in finding water (once in Pa., once believe it or not in Maine in the Bigelows). Sure you can stay on the white blazes and you won't get lost but in the case of an emergency or even bad weather the white blazed trail isn't always the most expedient or safest way to water, the nearest town or shelter, etc. For me the benefits far outweighed the cost/weight aspect but as you can surely see on this site there are differing opinions on this.
I thru'd last year using nothing but the Thru-Hiker's Handbook and never had a problem. If I did it over again maps for Maine and New Hampshire would be nice to have.
The official maps are soooo expensive. Much more than I thought they would be.
I've heard people say you won't need/use them. But the idea of heading into the
woods with no map sounds crazy to say they least.
Is there perhaps a place to get some other maps that are just as good but not as expensive?
Cheers.
You might be having the idea that you will be wandering off trail alone into the woods on the AT. If you stay on the OBVIOUS WELL BEATEN WELL BLAZED WELL DOCUMENTED WELL TRAVELED WELL USED VERY VERY VERY POPULAR AT(get the Data BOOK!) THAT WILL NOT BE THE CASE!!! The AT IS NOT like wandering around off trail alone in the U P!!! I will guess that MOST AT thru-hikers don't carry maps and certainly MOST DO NOT have a FULL set of AT maps! IF you are hiking in winter, when the trail/trail signage might be obscured and you might not encounter many other hikers, IF you like taking alternates/blue blazes or impromptu routes into/out of town, IF you are one of those hikers who think they might need AT maps should an emergency arise, IF you are a map person who has to know exactly where you at all the time, OR IF you like identifying features on your hike like mountains, rivers, roads, etc than carry, and buy, AT maps!
By Data Book I meant to say Thru-Hikers Handbook.
Jack Tarlin
10-21-2010, 14:46
In regards to the belief that maps are incredibly expensive:
If you're an ATC member (which one should be), you can get your maps in the fall for less than $185.00.
Assuming you have a normal thru-hike of approximately six months, this means that your maps will cost you perhaps a dollar a day (and of course you can get a recently "used" set for much less).
Most folks look at their maps five or six times a day, i.e. it'll cost you around 15 cents every time you look at your map.
In that most folks eat three or four candy or energy bars a day, it wouyld appear that your maps are a pretty good deal.
It should also be pointed out that many folks use their maps for years after their thru-hikes. Maps don't go bad, after all. And many folks choose to sell their maps after their hike, thus recouping much if not mopst of their initial cost.
But let's get back to you candy bars: A Snickers will not help you plan your hiking day; it will not tell you when it's wise to go for a big-mile day and when it would be foolish to do so; it will not help you get off the Trail in an emergency; it will not tell you about alternate water sources; and most of all, it won't tell you anything about all the Trails and paths you'll cross every day while hiking the A.T., and where they go and where they end up.
Maps can save lives, including your own, and at less than a buck a day, they're a damned good deal. The fact that one can hike the A.T. without them is a pretty meaningless statement: One can hike the A.T. without a tent; one can hike without a sleeping pad; one can hike without a stove. One can hike the A.T. without shoes (yeah, it's been done).
But merely because something CAN be done does not necessarily mean that it's something that SHOULD be done.
Therre are two reasons people don't carry their own maps. (These folks, of course, rely on other people's maps at every opportunity, but I don't wanna go there).
People don't obtain and carry their own maps in order to save money and to save a few grams.
These are both lousy reasons.
Unfortunately, do I really need maps is one of the most persistent of the perennial trolls on WhiteBlaze whether intentional or not.
It doesn't matter how someone titles a related thread, it invariably morphs into an argument about whether it's possible or not to hike from one end of the A.T. to the other without them.
As a result of these perennial threads, more are tempted to do without maps every year. When they succeed, many feel compelled to offer up their own experience as proof one does not need maps.
Granted, there are many legitimate reasons to hike the A.T., but I think by having this same kind of discussion annually, we contribute to many not having the richer experience they might by convincing them to not purchase and carry the official guides and/or maps.
Rather than attacking me personally or everyone posting whether they carried maps or not, we might instead have an actual discussion about why hikers opted not to carry maps or how those who did benefited from carrying them.
I believe we could serve those grappling with this decision better.
maps would be nice, but not necessary.
TheYoungOne
10-21-2010, 15:40
I have been section hiking PA and I bought the "Official" PA map and book kit for $40.
Yea it was expensive, but it really helps in the planning stages. Where to hike, what to expect, were to park, what to see nearby. For a dayhike, an overnight or a few day trip It doesn't hurt to take one of the maps of the section your hiking. It came handy twice. One was an underestimation of the time I had versus the distance I had to the shelter. I was standing at a known spring, I whipped ot the map, and figured I had a 2 more miles to cover and it was an Less than hour before sunset. Another time I pulled up on my vehicle 4 hours sooner than I thought, whipped out the map again and I planed out a mini hike of another section of the AT that was on the way home. 99% of the time, you don't need a map, but its nice to have if you can spare the space and wieght.
With Thru hikers it would take up way too much space and weight. Call me crazy, but the AT should make an iphone app. That would be helpful for thruhikers.
I have been section hiking PA and I bought the "Official" PA map and book kit for $40.
Yea it was expensive, but it really helps in the planning stages. Where to hike, what to expect, were to park, what to see nearby. For a dayhike, an overnight or a few day trip It doesn't hurt to take one of the maps of the section your hiking. It came handy twice. One was an underestimation of the time I had versus the distance I had to the shelter. I was standing at a known spring, I whipped ot the map, and figured I had a 2 more miles to cover and it was an Less than hour before sunset. Another time I pulled up on my vehicle 4 hours sooner than I thought, whipped out the map again and I planed out a mini hike of another section of the AT that was on the way home. 99% of the time, you don't need a map, but its nice to have if you can spare the space and wieght.
With Thru hikers it would take up way too much space and weight. Call me crazy, but the AT should make an iphone app. That would be helpful for thruhikers. there is a decent AT iphone app.
I used the thru hiker's handbook when I hiked. I never felt that I needed maps. I was with a pair of guys for about two weeks who carried maps and a guide book. They used their maps once that I saw, and that was only to check something in their book. It just seems like overkill to have both, and since the book has more information than just locations, I would definately opt for the guidebook. Peronal opinion. As always, HYOH.
StormBird
10-21-2010, 18:38
You don't need the maps, just carry pages from the AT companion, Awol's or the 501 book. Save your money. I thought the same thing as you about the maps, but the trail is EXTREMELY easy to follow.
I'll sell you my maps for cheap, minus the Smokies and one of the NY maps. PM me if you're interested.
restless
10-21-2010, 21:01
Do you need maps? Probably not. Read: White blazes every 2'-.5mile depending on location:D. Should you carry maps? Depends. If you know how to read them,
yes. If you plan on locating other landmarks(ie-mountain peaks, unmarked water sources, side trails that are short cuts into town), yes. Otherwise, they just become heavy fire starters.
In other words, carry maps and learn to use them.:D
Grasshopper2011
10-21-2010, 23:35
there is a decent AT iphone app.
What app is this and does AT&T have good enough coverage to make it useful along the trail?
4eyedbuzzard
10-21-2010, 23:58
As noted previously, you can hike the AT without pretty much anything of your choosing - short of food - though I suppose 2000 miles of Yogi-ing is possible. But would you hike without some minimal first aid stuff? You'll probably never need it, and likely you could beg or borrow from other hikers if you did. Would you hike without any form of shelter, relying only on the shelter system? Because there's always room for one more in the shelter in a storm, right?
You can hike without that map and compass. You'll likely never truly need them for survival purposes, and maybe you'll even never need them to make your hike more enjoyable. Likewise with a first aid kit and shelter. But if you ever do need any of these, don't count on anyone else to be there with what you need and chose not to purchase and carry. Usually when Murphy throws the $#!t into the fan, you're alone and on your own.
Fair warning.
Odd Man Out
10-22-2010, 00:09
If you wanted maps but wanted to save money, couldn't you buy a topographic map software that would allow you to print your own maps of the whole trail (or any part you want). Then when you have finished a section, use that map for a firestarter and your load gets lighter as you hike. DeLorme's software is less than 1/2 of the ATC map collection, and you get the whole country at a higher resolution.
Jester2000
10-22-2010, 01:13
What app is this and does AT&T have good enough coverage to make it useful along the trail?
AT&T is notoriously bad on the AT.
As for maps, as noted, you might not need them. On the other hand, it often takes being on the trail to not only know the difference between want and need, but also to recognize that sometimes the things you just want are nice things to have.
Looking into the cost of maps for the CDT (which you definitely need) has made me appreciate the inexpensiveness of AT maps. And I did carry AT maps, which I enjoyed looking at every morning, planning my day and drinking coffee.
People who asked to take a look at them "for just a minute" were told that I wasn't their map sherpa. Which maybe made me a jerk. But not nearly as much of a jerk as the people who expected me to carry their weight for them. If you decide not to carry maps, plan on never looking at maps.
4eyedbuzzard
10-22-2010, 08:31
I'll bet you didn't share your coffee either. Some people...:rolleyes:
WalkinHome
10-22-2010, 10:27
Per Emerald's suggestion here are my thoughts - I bought the whole package, but left the books home. Carried the Thru Hikers Handbook and pages of the Data Book. I now have wonderful souvenirs of my hike, markings indicate where I stayed every evening (in context of the hike) and a nice display when I speak to groups about my hike or the A.T. I have also taken them with me when I am trying to connect (pick them up, drop them off or just visit) with someone along the A.T. on the way to Trail Days etc. Last but not least you are contributing to the welfare of the AT maintaining clubs when you purchase the materials which goes back into the Trail. HYOH and Be Safe.
Jester2000
10-22-2010, 12:54
I'll bet you didn't share your coffee either. Some people...:rolleyes:
Haha! My general rule is that I will share what I have until the person reaches the next town. Because sometimes people only realize what they want when they get out there, or sometimes people run out of things. After that they're on their own, because after they're somewhere they could get what I'm carrying, they're presuming that I'm their sherpa.
Per Emerald's suggestion here are my thoughts - I bought the whole package, but left the books home. Carried the Thru Hikers Handbook and pages of the Data Book. I now have wonderful souvenirs of my hike, markings indicate where I stayed every evening (in context of the hike) and a nice display when I speak to groups about my hike or the A.T. I have also taken them with me when I am trying to connect (pick them up, drop them off or just visit) with someone along the A.T. on the way to Trail Days etc. Last but not least you are contributing to the welfare of the AT maintaining clubs when you purchase the materials which goes back into the Trail. HYOH and Be Safe.
I did the same. All excellent reasons. Plus, having the maps now helps me when I'm driving near the trail doing trail magic, slacking hikers, or going on dayhikes or weekend trips.
With maps you're not limited to the official white blazed trail. There's tons of good blue blaze trails and alternate routes if you need some adventure, or to get away.
Blissful
10-22-2010, 20:10
Maps saved my butt this year with the drought up north and finding water sources. For tenting spots. And for trail crossings at many of the roads, etc. Enough said.
It would be helpful were people posting to get beyond the notion of the offical guides and/or their maps as nothing more than navigational tools.
We should not be surprised when individuals who did not purchase or carry them do not to offer up suggestions as to how one might benefit.
In order to weigh the costs and benefits, it is first necessary to consider all the potential benefits and ways costs might be reduced. Only then is it possible for someone to make an informed decision.
jersey joe
10-23-2010, 13:51
With maps you're not limited to the official white blazed trail. There's tons of good blue blaze trails and alternate routes if you need some adventure, or to get away.
Funny, the AT was what I did when i needed some adventure and to get away. Some people get a great deal out of maps, some don't. HYOH and carry what you want to carry.
Funny, the AT was what I did when i needed some adventure and to get away. Some people get a great deal out of maps, some don't. HYOH and carry what you want to carry.
Well, we are just responding to the original post. The guy asked a question. Should we ignore his request for advice?
Weary
I always carried them, and I always used them every day.
Some of my lowest moments were when I thought that I had lost my map (once on the last day of the HMW just before entering BSP). But it was just misplaced in my pack and I happily found it few hours later.
TheYoungOne
10-23-2010, 23:25
there is a decent AT iphone app.
The only app I saw was AT World Traveler, and it only gets one star. Apparently it has no mileage or shelter info, and overall is extremely disappointing.
jersey joe
10-25-2010, 13:55
Well, we are just responding to the original post. The guy asked a question. Should we ignore his request for advice?
Weary
Nope, I think we both offer a prespective that can help the original poster. You are right, if someone wants to hike the blue blazes, a map will certainly help. If someone finds that 2200 miles of white blazes are adequate, a map is less useful.
If there are only two perspectives represented by everyone who has contributed and I don't accept that notion, then one side continues to encourage posts that offer something new while the other does little more than recite its mantra.
It's kind when the other camp shows a willingness to concede maps aren't useless. Maybe we are making progress.:)
If someone finds that 2200 miles of white blazes are adequate, a map is less useful.
this line of reasoning is potentially very dangerous because it assumes that "all is well". Yes you can follow the white blazes and not get lost but what if an injury occurs? springs are dry? As I said earlier, I used my maps twice to locate water, in one case the situation was very near critical status because the springs on or near the trail had dried up and I saw no other hikers that particular day. I was able to take a blue blazed trail with confidence of finding water (a pond at the base of the ridge that was not visible from the trail) and then found a route back to the trail without backtracking. I know most people don't carry 'em but I rank them up there with a first aid kit - no way would I want one of my family members hiking without either one and I cannot advocate in good faith for others to hike without them.
jersey joe
10-25-2010, 17:13
this line of reasoning is potentially very dangerous because it assumes that "all is well". Yes you can follow the white blazes and not get lost but what if an injury occurs? springs are dry? As I said earlier, I used my maps twice to locate water, in one case the situation was very near critical status because the springs on or near the trail had dried up and I saw no other hikers that particular day. I was able to take a blue blazed trail with confidence of finding water (a pond at the base of the ridge that was not visible from the trail) and then found a route back to the trail without backtracking. I know most people don't carry 'em but I rank them up there with a first aid kit - no way would I want one of my family members hiking without either one and I cannot advocate in good faith for others to hike without them.
I agree with you that IF you run into some trouble, having maps can help you. But with that line of reasoning, you would also be better of not hiking solo, carrying a spot device, and 2 gallons of water at all times. At some point each individual must make choices as to how much risk they are willing to take to prepare for "all not being well". For you it is maps and a first aid kid, for others it might be an extra 20 degree rated bag...I'm not saying people shouldn't bring maps, i'm saying they don't need to, and many don't.
Maps are fun to have and can be useful in some situation, but you really do not need them for hiking the AT. Carry the guide (thru hikers handbook). It has all the info you need. As for the trail it self it's so well marked very hard to get lost.
DavidNH
restless
10-25-2010, 18:21
Maps are fun to have and can be useful in some situation, but you really do not need them for hiking the AT. Carry the guide (thru hikers handbook). It has all the info you need. As for the trail it self it's so well marked very hard to get lost.
DavidNH
However the guides don't necessarily direct you to some water sources, or where a side trail ultimately winds up at ( can someone tell from a guide book where the Martins Creek Trail N of Curly Maple Gap comes out at?) Carry the guide book, but carry some sort of map other than Rand McNally. The trail is well marked but people do get lost!!! Neither the guide books nor the maps are by themselves a complete source of info on the trail.
Chaco Taco
10-25-2010, 22:53
My opinion, pick up one of the guidebooks. You dont need maps. The only time I would use maps would be in Maine
mweinstone
10-26-2010, 00:04
hikers get mad at maps. they curse them. and they get lost on them. and they claim to have lost or gained time useing them. they loose them. search for them, find them. make things on them, pay for them, give them away and send them home for memories. they mark them and they matthew mark luke and john them. they wipe with them and they eat off them. they make notes from bits of them saying stuff like, "lost my map but found it will catch up".they smell them sometimes i dont know why. they use flashlights and fires and streetlights to see them. they lend them or they dont. they put them in bags, laminate them and leave them out in the rain. they roll ciggs in them and filter cofie thru them. they fold and place them under facy resturants crooked tables to stop water from spilling,...and so on.
but the number one thing folks are allways trying to do with maps is,..look intelegent looking at them. and their really good at it. they turn simple paper and ink int deitys that either are good or bad to them. map gods are cursed and praised in the same fog. all in all i have no bones with the children of the maps. but when your lost and im found, remember my strength,....i cant be lost,...im not really following any path other than my pathalogical desire to move. in any direction, away from non movement. hence, i hike with no map and yogi the crap out of others when i must. haha!suckas!
WalkinHome
10-26-2010, 10:11
"hence, i hike with no map and yogi the crap out of others when i must. haha!suckas!"
Matt, you are the bomb! LOL
Neither the guide books nor the maps are by themselves a complete source of info on the trail.
The guides sold by ATC include maps, all the essential information required and more, but since they do not include specific details about hiker services, they do not require continuous updating. Since many long-distance hikers desire detailed information about hiker services to assist with planning their lodgings and resupply, they frequently opt to carry a current handbook and ATC's maps instead.
Because long-distance, handbook-toting hikers carry much information that is not useful to them at any given time and information about local services may be obtained simply by asking locals, some hikers could stand to benefit by swapping out complete guides and gaining access to the additional details they offer compared to handbooks.
Other hikers obsessive about minimizing pack weight choose to carry individual handbook pages or an A.T. Data Book and ATC's maps. A compromise might be to transfer selected information from ATC's guides and/or a handbook into a data book to carry with ATC's maps.
Little, poo(r) peeps who've lost their sheep and don't know where to find them should leave them alone, they'll often come home dragging their tails behind them.:D