View Full Version : Handgun for the hiking, your choice?
IsNotAHome
10-29-2010, 23:00
What handgun(s) do you like for hiking? Let's keep it eastern USA specific.
I'm in the 9 is fine camp and I like the PM9. Others I'd carry are the PF-9, and PPS. The new SIG looks interesting, that is once the "beta testers" get through with it.
I load alternating JHP (124g +P) and FMJ (NATO spec).
What do you carry while hiking, or what are you looking at? What loads do you prefer?
Rocket Jones
10-29-2010, 23:13
I think this is probably the wrong forum for this discussion. I'm fine with you carrying legally, but why advertise? Keep quiet about it and avoid the fuss and handwringing.
Llama Legs
10-29-2010, 23:22
12mm Gyrojet.
IsNotAHome
10-29-2010, 23:25
You can get a Florida non-resident permit and carry on the entire southern half of the trail.
Mountain Wildman
10-29-2010, 23:42
I like the Taurus Millenium PT145 PRO for every day carry, 10 + 1, 45 Auto PMC Starfire 230 grain SFHP, Fully loaded with 11 rounds weighs 28 ounces. Only $400
For hiking I think the Kahr Arms PM9 9mm 7 + 1 weighs 15.9 ounces unloaded would be perfect.
If hiking in Grizzly country, I would go with a revolver in either 44 Mag. or larger.
Heavy, But effective.
Anyway, FWIW, I carry regardless. Concealed means concealed, period.
I like my S&W M&P .40C
As a bear minimum, I may carry my Berreta 950 (.25acp)
Yes, it's a heavy option regardless. Just be sure you train on a regular basis and are proficient with this tool. Yeah, I said tool, because that's how I see it, as a part of my gear.
SMSP
Smith & Wesson .357 Airweight. Keep a couple of .38s in the first chambers just to make noise without the kick you will feel for a while (like a day). Sits in my front pocket - never know it is there.
As a bear minimum, I may carry my Berreta 950 (.25acp)
SMSP
:eek: You pull that on a Bear, he'll laugh as he eats you. :rolleyes:
Feral Bill
10-30-2010, 00:18
Search for any of several threads on this topic, each of which degenerates into into a shouting match.
What handgun(s) do you like for hiking?
... none of them...:cool:
Today, early though it may be, I agree with our self-proclaimed registered abuser, not to make nice, but because he makes good sense.
skinewmexico
10-30-2010, 01:32
Too heavy, not needed. And I have a CHL.
Tuckahoe
10-30-2010, 07:21
If carrying isnt your thing, then why not skip this thread and leave it to those that do? No one gets in a pissing match and there is no reason to lock a legit thread.
StorminMormon
10-30-2010, 07:48
Agreed, if you don't carry or you are (for whatever reason) against it - then go find another thread. The fact is that a lot of people carry. It's legal. It's our gosh darn right under the Second Amendment so deal with it.
http://www.carl-walther.de/images/products/small3/2689448.jpg
Personally, I carry a Walther P99 Subcompact (10 + 1). But I'm looking to "upgrade" to something a little lighter like a S&W Airweight .357 and I'll carry some extra ammo.
LockJaww
10-30-2010, 08:59
Smith & Wesson Mountain Gun 44 Mag....
StorminMormon
10-30-2010, 09:04
Smith & Wesson Mountain Gun 44 Mag....
I have a Ruger Super BlackHawk .44 Mag with a 10" barrel. I wish I could carry that because it's DEFINITELY an anti-bear gun. However, it's too large to qualify as a concealed gun so I would have to get a hunting permit in each state and carry it open (where permitted, of course).
burntoutphilosopher
10-30-2010, 12:10
i didn't carry on the AT,
but in a lot of my hikes i do,
i carry a Beretta PX 4 storm in a shoulder harness and it's an excellent tool. dependable, feel good, and relatively lightweight.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dMbImbbkd1I
a good universal shouldr rig works well for hiking, as you can use the side straps around you pack's waistbelt and move universally. i have done countless 10 to 12 miles hikes with this on and no discomfort whatsoever.
I don't like carrying a gun hiking due to the weight, however, I was interested in this thread thinking I would learn about few lightweight models that are out there that might change my mind. Instead of seeing something like a Walter 22 (.22 at 15oz), I'm seeing magnums!? Too many of the guns listed are far too heavy for any sane person to want to carry on a 2000miles thru-hike. Added such a huge weight goes against my personal trend of the last several years of carrying less weight. I bought a glock 23 years ago with the idea of taking it backpacking put after feeling the added weight of 10rounds of .40 in it, I gave up the idea. Obviously a 26 or 27 would have been better, but the issue of ammo weight remains. The only guns likely to be light enough for most long distance hikers to consider in this age of UL backpacking would be a small caliber like a .22. How about some REALISTIC options instead of these bricks?
Secret Squirrel
10-30-2010, 16:39
Ruger .380 ACP
Also, KAHR carries specializes in lightweight handguns. I have a .45 ACP single stack that has a polymer frame and weighs 28 oz loaded.
burntoutphilosopher
10-30-2010, 16:48
a lightweight .22LR that i keep in my truck is a Pheonix Arms .22
hardly a reliabe piece of at like the PX4 i recommended above. but it is very lightweight and makes quite the BANG.
you can see it on my channel showing my EDC bag in my truck.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2y0BRAza5Os
very small and lightweight. but the performance of the PX4 is much better. and the PX4 is polymer, relatively lightweight compared to other 9mm's
LockJaww
10-30-2010, 16:50
Miner...research the S & W Mountain Gun. It was designed for hikers/fishermen/outdoorsy types who might be in a situation in the boonies where light weight is as important of a factor as shooting a hard hitting bullet is.
Im not sure its ideal for carry back East on the AT, however I carry mine all the time with me in the " wilds" of Arizona. It truely isnt that heavy to carry.
couscous
10-30-2010, 17:15
How about some REALISTIC options instead of these bricks?
Kel-Tec P3AT (http://www.keltecweapons.com/our-guns/pistols/p-3at/)
Mountain Wildman
10-30-2010, 17:32
I don't like carrying a gun hiking due to the weight, however, I was interested in this thread thinking I would learn about few lightweight models that are out there that might change my mind. Instead of seeing something like a Walter 22 (.22 at 15oz), I'm seeing magnums!? Too many of the guns listed are far too heavy for any sane person to want to carry on a 2000miles thru-hike. Added such a huge weight goes against my personal trend of the last several years of carrying less weight. I bought a glock 23 years ago with the idea of taking it backpacking put after feeling the added weight of 10rounds of .40 in it, I gave up the idea. Obviously a 26 or 27 would have been better, but the issue of ammo weight remains. The only guns likely to be light enough for most long distance hikers to consider in this age of UL backpacking would be a small caliber like a .22. How about some REALISTIC options instead of these bricks?
Kel-Tec P-3AT .380 Caliber - Weighs 11 ounces fully loaded. About $255.00
Mountain Wildman
10-30-2010, 17:33
Kel-Tec P3AT (http://www.keltecweapons.com/our-guns/pistols/p-3at/)
Great minds think alike!!!:sun
swjohnsey
10-30-2010, 18:19
Must be stainless or titanuum. Seacamp .32 or one of the clones.
Surplusman
10-30-2010, 19:34
12mm Gyrojet.
Wow..that's some serious rocket power.
Personally, I prefer an MG42. Ammo's cheaper. :D
sheepdog
10-30-2010, 19:49
Ruger .380 ACP
Also, KAHR carries specializes in lightweight handguns. I have a .45 ACP single stack that has a polymer frame and weighs 28 oz loaded.
the ruger is a nice little pistol
Trailbender
10-30-2010, 19:52
the ruger is a nice little pistol
Yeah, it is a direct rip off of the Keltec P3AT.
sheepdog
10-30-2010, 19:54
Yeah, it is a direct rip off of the Keltec P3AT.
how do they compare???
Kel-Tec P-3AT .380 Caliber - Weighs 11 ounces fully loaded. About $255.00
Now thats a bit more reasonable.
sheepdog
10-30-2010, 19:57
I like the 380 and carry it often because it is light and compact. Not a lot of hitting power in it though.
Trailbender
10-30-2010, 20:05
how do they compare???
The Ruger LCP is the exact same gun with some cosmetic differences. Many of the parts are interchangeable.
I like the 380 and carry it often because it is light and compact. Not a lot of hitting power in it though.
Where you hit matters more than caliber. A headshot from a .380 is gonna have the same results as a .45, a dead bad guy. All handgun rounds are weak, in comparison to rifle rounds. I train constantly, and everyone I have ever talked to says the same thing. Expect to have to shoot several times. You shoot until the threat is stopped, whether it is one bullet, two, or the entire magazine.
sheepdog
10-30-2010, 20:14
minnie
we all got choices
glad you're comfortable with yours
Feral Bill
10-30-2010, 20:18
Search for any of several threads on this topic, each of which degenerates into into a shouting match.
I told you so.
Wise Old Owl
10-30-2010, 20:48
Kel-Tec P32
I have seen this over and over again on gun threads. Everyone wants to recommend this gun. Yet when I talk to people that use guns, officers, prison employees, etc they talk about the reasonable unreliability of this weapon... one doesn't need to look hard to find paragraphs on the internet like this......
Reliability – I shot 100 rounds, a box of Winchester SilverTips and a box of Fiocchi hardball. In that 100 rounds, I had four extraction failures and one light primer strike. This was not a performance which inspired confidence. At first, the gun was fine. It was only after I had run five or six magazines of ammo through it and it was getting warm and dirty that it began to act up. I shot 50 rounds or so slow fire, aiming carefully to test the accuracy and get used to the trigger. During this period of slow fire, the gun had no problems. Then I decided to "stress" it by firing fast strings, and using one-handed holds with odd angles of grip to try to make the gun act up. This is when I began to experience problems.
Wise Old Owl
10-30-2010, 20:51
and Trailbender - that little ripoff Ruger doesn't have those problems... Ruger is a better made product.
Alligator
10-30-2010, 21:14
This is in General Gear Talk. If you are not interested in the discussion about handguns as gear, don't post to this thread. Those of you that continue to hijack these threads are going to start spending time in the penalty box. There are places along the AT where it is legal to carry so it is a legitimate conversation and not every thread has to degenerate into pro and anti arguments.
burntoutphilosopher
10-30-2010, 21:21
wise old owl:
the dependability issue is why i initially did not suggest my pheonix arms .22
great little gun ... fun for shooting (and eating) turtles, etc.
but if your using your gun as a tool to save your life it HAS to work.
obviously there is a clear case for a small glock, but i again encourage people to spend some time researching the Beretta PX4 storm. There's just some places that saving 5 ounces isn't worth it.
remember a heavier gun is going to be more accurate due to less recoil. and when worn on a shoulder rig you'll never feel it regardless of weight. in the end, if you really believe it could come down to your life, and that's the reason you carry (not jsut carry because it's your right) ... then a good quality 9mm is a great choice.
as for bears ... i've seen many bears up here (black bear) go running at the sound of a .22 the sound of a 9mm handgun is going to send any bear running (not suggesting the impact is enough, rather they don't know how to react so they run).
on a side note, i had no idea the AT had such bear problems like the PCT does. up here in British Columbia they are a daily nuisance.
burntoutphilosopher
10-30-2010, 21:23
oh, additionally,
i have 17 round magazines, but obviously you don't need to carry 3 17 round mags like a tactical situation.
5 rounds in your magazine would be enough . . . to save some weight. and buy the absolute best ammunition. don't feed a great gun bad food ; ) people will end uo blaming the gun for the jams when often it's dents in the bell nosed heads.
Wise Old Owl
10-30-2010, 21:29
http://www.bing.com/videos/watch/video/ruger-lcp-crimson-trace/57a42a81bfd0080fd11457a42a81bfd0080fd114-281448940409?q=ruger%20lcp%20lazer%20video&FROM=LKVR5>1=LKVR5&FORM=LKVR4
Old Hiker
10-30-2010, 22:03
I have the P3AT and I have had a LOT of jamming and failure to extract problems. I have not been able to empty a magazine without those problems to date. I like the size, but I got the green camo and I've had further problems with the left side of the weapon rusting because of carrying it in my right, front pants pocket.
I have had a Ruger standard Mark I, 6" barrel .22 for decades. After many practice sessions, I knew where the rounds were going and I could empty several magazines without any jamming or extraction problems. I must have sent 1000's of rounds downrange. It's too long and bulky for a concealed, though. I think a small .22 would be ideal IF and only IF you practiced with it a lot and knew where the rounds were going to go. 3 or 4 rounds through some bad guy's eye(s) will stop them.
Tuckahoe
10-30-2010, 22:35
I have seen this over and over again on gun threads. Everyone wants to recommend this gun. Yet when I talk to people that use guns, officers, prison employees, etc they talk about the reasonable unreliability of this weapon... one doesn't need to look hard to find paragraphs on the internet like this......
Reliability – I shot 100 rounds, a box of Winchester SilverTips and a box of Fiocchi hardball. In that 100 rounds, I had four extraction failures and one light primer strike. This was not a performance which inspired confidence. At first, the gun was fine. It was only after I had run five or six magazines of ammo through it and it was getting warm and dirty that it began to act up. I shot 50 rounds or so slow fire, aiming carefully to test the accuracy and get used to the trigger. During this period of slow fire, the gun had no problems. Then I decided to "stress" it by firing fast strings, and using one-handed holds with odd angles of grip to try to make the gun act up. This is when I began to experience problems.
My normal daily carry is a Kimber 1911 and I normally carry in an inside the waistband holster. For backpacking and those few times that my normal carry piece is not practical I wanted to pick up a pocket pistol.
I ended up buying a kel-tec P32 from my dad. I have not had any issues with it except for two failures to feed, which were the result of a worn magazine (now replaced). The main issue that I had was simply getting use to the very long trigger pull.
I agree with Wise Old owl, Kel-tec does have a reputation for putting out some stinkers though. And that is where Ruger has Kel-tec beat. They just have not had the issues that Kel-teck has had, especially with the P3AT. So I wouldnt be knocking the LCP. I'll probably pick one up myself.
This is in General Gear Talk. If you are not interested in the discussion about handguns as gear, don't post to this thread. Those of you that continue to hijack these threads are going to start spending time in the penalty box. There are places along the AT where it is legal to carry so is a legitimate conversation and not every thread has to degenerate into pro and anti arguments.
I agree 100%
Thanks for letting this discussion continue. Let's all respect each other's opinions and continue to be civil.
SMSP
Wise Old Owl
10-30-2010, 22:56
Tuck - it has to be hard to make a reliable weapon at 8 oz - the parts, the machining. I just had a failure with a expandable night stick also in steel.
le loupe
10-30-2010, 23:57
Agreed, if you don't carry or you are (for whatever reason) against it - then go find another thread. The fact is that a lot of people carry. It's legal. It's our gosh darn right under the Second Amendment so deal with it.
.
Lets begin to talk about this is the property context. I think its important to the concept - The constitution does not grant or enumerate rights!
Human beings have a god-given right to self defense, whether your god is Jehovah or Darwin. The framers recognized this. No one can abridge the right to self-defense, including goverment or other zealotry.
le loupe
10-30-2010, 23:58
That said- I like the Bersa .380
skinewmexico
10-31-2010, 00:59
I agree with Wise Old owl, Kel-tec does have a reputation for putting out some stinkers though. And that is where Ruger has Kel-tec beat. They just have not had the issues that Kel-teck has had, especially with the P3AT. So I wouldnt be knocking the LCP. I'll probably pick one up myself.
Yeah..........that's why Ruger had to recall the first gen of the LCP. Early P3ATs had problems, but most of the later models ran fine. My wife's runs like a clock, and is very unpleasant to shoot. Kel-tec was usually very good about fixing pistols with problems.
Wise Old Owl
10-31-2010, 01:01
Unpleasent - because its small and has a kick right?
Tuckahoe
10-31-2010, 05:45
Yeah..........that's why Ruger had to recall the first gen of the LCP. Early P3ATs had problems, but most of the later models ran fine. My wife's runs like a clock, and is very unpleasant to shoot. Kel-tec was usually very good about fixing pistols with problems.
Rugers recall of their LCP was based on an issue with the weapon discharging a round in the chamber when dropped onto a hard surface. Little to do with reliability. Happens to have been an issue with the 1911, which Kimber added a firing pin block to the pistol.
I have no issue with Kel-tec and as I said I am happy with my P32. But there is a need to tighten up their QC on their pistols going out the door rather than relying on their fine customer service to fix those pistols once sold. One dealer's experience -- http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=5&f=38&t=99376.
Ruger lcr is a nice carry.
burntoutphilosopher
10-31-2010, 09:24
torch09,
a .22lr to the lower body won't kill them ... but will sure make them think twice.
the .22LR is also the smallest and lightest and cheapest option, both in ammunition and the gun itself.
the bullet on a .22LR round is literally the size of a pinhead.
My P32 has been reliable. I have no issue with it other than coworkers ragging on me for my "girl gun", but when I ask if I can shoot them with it I get no takers. Gee not so girly after all.
torch09,
the bullet on a .22LR round is literally the size of a pinhead.
You folks have some bigazz pins in Canada, eh?
vamelungeon
10-31-2010, 10:39
My P32 has run like a Swiss watch, no problems at all.
BlackCloud
10-31-2010, 18:45
I carry a 5 shot S&W .357 revolver. The 11.5 oz. of scandium is small and virtually featherweight piece of insurance against both man & beast.
Unfortunately it is ridiculously priced at over $1000.
I also carry 2 speedloaders so total weight is probably over 30 oz.; but that is way better then a full auto.
IsNotAHome
10-31-2010, 21:34
Any gun you carry you should run 100-200 rounds through as a test, if you have a stoppage start over.
Any manufacturer can put out a bad gun or two and yeah, kel-tec has put out a few. But they have what is arguably the best warranty in the industry (even upgrading your gun for free as they revise their products). Combine that with their light weight, reasonable pricing, and the fact that they don't just put out the same crud everyone else does and you have what is probably my favourite manufacturer.
I find it both funny and sad that Ruger straight up copied the p3at (side note: phonetically p380 ;) ) and their product the LCP is more popular.
IsNotAHome
10-31-2010, 21:46
New Sig, bit heavy though:
http://www.sigsauer.com/Products/ShowCatalogProductDetails.aspx?categoryid=70&productid=307
SassyWindsor
11-01-2010, 01:07
Walther PPK with .380 HP on the trail
Glock 22 with .40 Winchester SXT 165 grain ammo rated 1130 FPS for home and short hikes.
Rocket Jones
11-01-2010, 06:48
Walther PPK with .380 HP on the trail
Glock 22 with .40 Winchester SXT 165 grain ammo rated 1130 FPS for home and short hikes.
What kind of hassle do you have to go through to carry in the UK?
Gray Blazer
11-01-2010, 07:20
Public Defender
Harrison Bergeron
11-01-2010, 08:59
In my opinion, the Taurus 380 TCP is superior to either the Kel-tec or Ruger, for the same money. It's 11oz loaded and comes with two mags and a concealed carry belt case that looks like a PDA case. I've NEVER had a misfire, and it's amazingly accurate for a pistol that smaller than your hand. I'm a lousy shot with a pistol and I still get 3" groups at 20 ft.
I always carry it on the lonely trails in Texas, but for the AT, there's a lot of things I'd rather spend that 11oz on. I'm taking 3oz of pepper spray instead.
Good to know that other good people on the trail will be armed, though.
randyg45
11-01-2010, 10:37
I carry a Black Widow. Nothing to rust, very little chance of getting it wet/muddy/dirty enough to jam, easily concealed, lightweight. .22WRM carries more energy than a standard .38 special.
http://www.galleryofguns.com/genie/default.aspx?item=NAA%2DBW%2DM
StorminMormon
11-01-2010, 10:49
Lets begin to talk about this is the property context. I think its important to the concept - The constitution does not grant or enumerate rights!
Human beings have a god-given right to self defense, whether your god is Jehovah or Darwin. The framers recognized this. No one can abridge the right to self-defense, including goverment or other zealotry.
You're right. I totally agree. And since some of the antagonistic comments have been removed from this thread (thank you very much, Mr. Moderator) - there's really no reason to push this aspect any further.
I'm really glad to see so many people posting their choice for carry. I really thought I was in a VAST minority on this. And maybe we still are, that's fine. But it's good to see that there's at least a few others besides myself.
StubbleJumper
11-01-2010, 16:02
I carry a Black Widow. Nothing to rust, very little chance of getting it wet/muddy/dirty enough to jam, easily concealed, lightweight. .22WRM carries more energy than a standard .38 special.
http://www.galleryofguns.com/genie/default.aspx?item=NAA%2DBW%2DM
That looks like a sensible choice for a long hike. I must say that I'm a little surprised to see so few people indicating that they carry a revolver. ISTM that it would be the ideal choice for an environment that is wet, dirty and one where people might not feel completely at ease to field service the weapon (ie, do you really want to break it down and clean it in a shelter :-?).
I understand that there are fewer rounds available with a revolver (although, one fella mentioned that he carries a speed-loader too :eek::eek:), but how many rounds does it take to scare a bear or discourage an attacker?
I like the S&W Bodyguard .380 http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product4_750001_750051_765772_-1_757892_757752_757751_ProductDisplayErrorView_Y. It is lightweight and has proven dependable over the 2 months I have had it. I especially like the very thin profile, which makes concealment easy - and the integral laser sight is a bonus. Prior to the Bodyguard, I had carried the Bersa Thunder .380 for a number of years. It is a very fine handgun for the price.
I must say that I'm a little surprised to see so few people indicating that they carry a revolver. ISTM that it would be the ideal choice for an environment that is wet, dirty and one where people might not feel completely at ease to field service the weapon (ie, do you really want to break it down and clean it in a shelter :-?).
Yup. With a covered hammer.
BitBucket
11-01-2010, 21:12
Springfield XDM 3.8 9mm with 147g LEO load (19 round mag)
Wise Old Owl
11-01-2010, 21:42
http://www.gunblast.com/Taurus-PT738.htm
The Taurus looks great, does it have a lazer adaptation?
Yup. With a covered hammer.
Thats why I love a Glock.
SMSP
kayak karl
11-02-2010, 00:33
Thats why I love a Glock.
SMSP
GLOCK makes a revolver??
I carry a Black Widow. Nothing to rust, very little chance of getting it wet/muddy/dirty enough to jam, easily concealed, lightweight. .22WRM carries more energy than a standard .38 special.
http://www.galleryofguns.com/genie/default.aspx?item=NAA%2DBW%2DM
Ooops, now that doesn't make sense now does it. I meant to quote the statement above, thats what I was referring to. The fact that a Glock will function when it's wet, muddy, dirty, etc...
SMSP
Tuckahoe
11-02-2010, 07:14
I'll just leave this here, ha ha...
kayak karl
11-02-2010, 08:23
Ooops, now that doesn't make sense now does it. I meant to quote the statement above, thats what I was referring to. The fact that a Glock will function when it's wet, muddy, dirty, etc...
SMSP
i have a military 45. when in compition it had a habit to stovepipe (not completely eject shell) every now and then. do the newer semi's do this?
sheepdog
11-02-2010, 15:56
i have a military 45. when in compition it had a habit to stovepipe (not completely eject shell) every now and then. do the newer semi's do this?
Not often, they just keep getting better and better
Usually a stove pipe jam now comes from "limp wristing" the wrist obsorbs the recoil and doesn't let the gun mechanism do its job. Keep a strong wrist when firing an auto and you will have a lot less or no, stove pipe jams.
StubbleJumper
11-02-2010, 16:26
Thats why I love a Glock.
SMSP
Does your Glock have a safety? :eek::eek:
Tuckahoe
11-02-2010, 18:17
Not often, they just keep getting better and better
Usually a stove pipe jam now comes from "limp wristing" the wrist obsorbs the recoil and doesn't let the gun mechanism do its job. Keep a strong wrist when firing an auto and you will have a lot less or no, stove pipe jams.
Only to echo Sheepdog, stove pipping usually results from "limp wristing." Semi autos are recoil operated pistols and require the shooter to firmly grip the pistol (the frame) so that only the slide recoils. If the slide does not fully recoil, it will fail to fully eject the spent case. Basic application of Newton's laws of motion.
Weak or underpowered ammunition can also cause failure to eject issues. Other than limp wristing, most FTF or FTE issues are either caused by magazines or ammunition.
i have a military 45. when in compition it had a habit to stovepipe (not completely eject shell) every now and then. do the newer semi's do this?
Glocks will FTE when limp wristing.
SMSP
Does your Glock have a safety? :eek::eek:
Ok, either a person loves Glocks or hate them. I am not goona try to convince anyone either way.
So, to answer your question, all Glocks have 3 safeties.
From Glock's website:
ACTION
Safe and ingeniously simple: Contrary to conventional, the trigger is the only operating element. All three pistol safeties are deactivated when the trigger is pulled -and automatically activated when it is released.
Additionally, one's index finger is the final safety IMO.
SMSP
sheepdog
11-03-2010, 10:19
I own many pistols. I like the Glock the best of them all. I shot mine for two days straight when qualifying this year. Nearly 500 rounds doing tactical reloads(dropping my clips into the sand). No mis-fires. No jams. It is a sweet weapon.
earlyriser26
11-03-2010, 10:53
Glock 26, but I never take it
StubbleJumper
11-03-2010, 17:40
Ok, either a person loves Glocks or hate them. I am not goona try to convince anyone either way.
So, to answer your question, all Glocks have 3 safeties.
From Glock's website:
ACTION
Safe and ingeniously simple: Contrary to conventional, the trigger is the only operating element. All three pistol safeties are deactivated when the trigger is pulled -and automatically activated when it is released.
Additionally, one's index finger is the final safety IMO.
SMSP
No, don't get me wrong. Glocks are among the most reliable and resistant weapons that you can get, which is why they are standard issue for law enforcement agencies. However, when I hike, I end up slipping, sliding, falling and getting snagged on bush and rocks. I'd be scared spitless to not have a safety. A revolver with one empty chamber seems safer...
Skidsteer
11-03-2010, 18:17
I'd be scared spitless to not have a safety. A revolver with one empty chamber seems safer...
It's a lot safer until you really need it.
TallShark
11-03-2010, 19:31
Taurus .44 mag with 300 grain dearstoppers. It's heavy but it does the trick.
TallShark
11-03-2010, 19:32
^^ oh and its a snubnose
Me and my girlffriend when we are on the trail both carry KELTEC P3AT .380 with hydrashock. But we both are lawenforcement officers
No, don't get me wrong. Glocks are among the most reliable and resistant weapons that you can get, which is why they are standard issue for law enforcement agencies. However, when I hike, I end up slipping, sliding, falling and getting snagged on bush and rocks. I'd be scared spitless to not have a safety. A revolver with one empty chamber seems safer...
Everybody has their own preferences and rationale and thats cool.
The method of carry I prefer while in the woods is with a fanny pack designed for conceal carry, plus it has room for my camera, wallet, keys, flashlight, and other things. The one I have is made by Hafner, http://www.hafnerworldwide.com/cart/cgi/database.cgi?command=listitems&pos=0&type=group&group=consealment (http://www.hafnerworldwide.com/cart/cgi/database.cgi?command=listitems&pos=0&type=group&group=consealment).
The handgun pocket has a heavy duty strap swen in it and it wraps around the entire trigger guard. A very well made fanny pack. It doesnt look like a 'handgun' type fanny pack. They are a bit pricey and heavy. It weighs around 16-17 ounces. I have had mine for at least 10 years and it's been through different environments. It's also multi use for things like theme parks and Disney (no handgun of course).
SMSP
If you feel the need to carry, then may I suggest a Smith and Wesson "Ladysmith" .38 special, compact enough for any pocket and since it is a wheel gun it is virtually fool proof, except in the hands of fools.
In the hands of a fool, any backpacking gear could be dangerous.
It is good to see that this discussion has been civil and kept open, thanks.
SMSP
SassyWindsor
11-04-2010, 14:19
What kind of hassle do you have to go through to carry in the UK?
Handguns are banned in England. This applies to any firearm with an overall length of less than 30 cm. However muzzle-loading handguns are permitted.
Do you think because they are banned they aren't around? Permits are also very hard to get for long guns and ammo.
4eyedbuzzard
11-04-2010, 21:06
For those that carry .380's and want a bit more power than standard loads, Buffalo Bore makes some ammo right at SAMMI pressure limits for .380's, marketed as .380 +P (there really isn't a spec for +P in .380). Keltec gives them an okay for "limited use". It's a very hot load in the P3AT (and the LCP and S&W .380's). I've only fired the hard cast 100gr loads which I now use as my carry rounds. They replaced Golden Sabers as my carry rounds as I felt the added power and penetration outweighed any overpenetration risk in this caliber should I ever be unfortunate enough to have to rely on it to save my butt. You can definitely feel and hear the difference from standard preesure rounds.
Single shot, 32 caliber
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/obijiwa/New%20Website/th_32caliber.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v228/obijiwa/New%20Website/?action=view¤t=32caliber.jpg)
sheepdog
11-05-2010, 03:52
Single shot, 32 caliber
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/obijiwa/New%20Website/th_32caliber.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v228/obijiwa/New%20Website/?action=view¤t=32caliber.jpg)
how quick does it boil two cups of water :D
how quick does it boil two cups of water :D
:p It empties 2 cups really fast. :D
Only weighs 2 ounces and fits in my Kmart grease pot
I carry a M&P 40. I will leave the chamber empty when I have it in my back pack if it is on my belt then it has a round in the chamber. Normally it goes in my back pack. You will wish you have it one day when you need it and you do not have it with you.
burntoutphilosopher
11-07-2010, 09:26
^^ i'm not sure i agree with that.
again i carry in the bush, but the sections of the AT i've hiked, i did not.
that said, to me if you are going to carry it, it should be holstered. what good does it do you in the backpack if someone causes trouble?
unless you have it in the back while hiking, and holster it for town stops. that is a decent plan.
4eyedbuzzard
11-07-2010, 11:11
^^ i'm not sure i agree with that.
again i carry in the bush, but the sections of the AT i've hiked, i did not.
that said, to me if you are going to carry it, it should be holstered. what good does it do you in the backpack if someone causes trouble?
unless you have it in the back while hiking, and holster it for town stops. that is a decent plan.
Why holster it only in town? Just IMO, you are actually probably safer in towns as you have the added benefit of police presence and them being able to be contacted and quickly respond plus other civilians to assist. On the trail is where you are decidedly more "on your own". Add that recent assaults as posted by LW were "on the trail", as was the Emerson murder and countless others. I carry holstered everywhere.
http://whiteblaze.net/forum/vbg/files/1/6/1/9/5/imagescao9si38_thumb.jpg (http://whiteblaze.net/forum/vbg/showimage.php?i=43903&c=703)
obviously the minigun is the weapon of choice...
Wise Old Owl
11-07-2010, 11:36
In the hands of a fool, any backpacking gear could be dangerous.
It is good to see that this discussion has been civil and kept open, thanks.
SMSP
Then the fool writes a book about it....
A Bear in the Woods.:D
burntoutphilosopher
11-07-2010, 13:39
4eyedbuzzard
that was kind of my point, the tool does you no good if you only holster it sometimes.
... a gun is the same as a rock if it's burried in your pack.
I normally carry my 5 shot NA .22 LR revolver, it is very light, reliable, and can be carried in the front or side pocket of my zip off pants. It is a small caliber, but will handle dogs, and scare off most animals if needed.
Which is better to carry a light weight gun or nothing at all?
Better to have something with you than have the biggest gun at home.
I also have a Kel-tec .380 that I carry if I am really concerned on my trips.
Just like all gear, each person has different things that work for them.
I am glad to share my thoughts and hear of yours
The_Saint
11-07-2010, 14:53
Anyway, FWIW, I carry regardless. Concealed means concealed, period.
I like my S&W M&P .40C
As a bear minimum, I may carry my Berreta 950 (.25acp)
Yes, it's a heavy option regardless. Just be sure you train on a regular basis and are proficient with this tool. Yeah, I said tool, because that's how I see it, as a part of my gear.
SMSP
Really, a .25 ACP against a bear? I wouldn't even recommend that for defending against a person.
StubbleJumper
11-07-2010, 15:14
Really, a .25 ACP against a bear? I wouldn't even recommend that for defending against a person.
It would probably be lots for a black bear. Really what you need is something that will make a loud bang to scare him into the woods (there are bear-bangers designed for this exact purpose). I agree that you'd want something a little more robust if you actually wanted to kill a bear.....probably 9mm would be preferable if you thought that there was meaningful risk of a grizzly attack.
Even against a human, a .25 might do the job. Is the goal to actually kill an assailant (in self-defense) or is it enough to just wing him and then flee? ISTM that you'd probably be ok if you just wounded your assailant and then hike away....if the other guy can still hike 2.5 miles per hour with a hole in his abdomen then he's a better man than me!
i think he meant "bare" not "bear"
I carry the M134 Minigun. I find it a useful deterrent against wildlife, axe murderers, and aliens who are hunting me for sport.
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_BsuY6v3L9ao/TD_ovqls8II/AAAAAAAAABY/fKOgVPX0qzY/s1600/wrestlerjesse.jpg
Mizirlou
11-08-2010, 07:47
...Let's keep it eastern USA specific...
Not saying what I carry but lethal force is in my vocabulary. Eastern USA specific? Target specific.
sheepdog
11-08-2010, 13:26
It would probably be lots for a black bear. Really what you need is something that will make a loud bang to scare him into the woods (there are bear-bangers designed for this exact purpose). I agree that you'd want something a little more robust if you actually wanted to kill a bear.....probably 9mm would be preferable if you thought that there was meaningful risk of a grizzly attack.
Even against a human, a .25 might do the job. Is the goal to actually kill an assailant (in self-defense) or is it enough to just wing him and then flee? ISTM that you'd probably be ok if you just wounded your assailant and then hike away....if the other guy can still hike 2.5 miles per hour with a hole in his abdomen then he's a better man than me!
I'd rather shoot a black bear with a .25 than a griz with a nine.
Of course I'd gladly pay you tomorrow for a hamburger today.
StubbleJumper
11-08-2010, 19:22
I'd rather shoot a black bear with a .25 than a griz with a nine.
Of course I'd gladly pay you tomorrow for a hamburger today.
I'd rather shoot a griz with a 9mm than a .25. ;);) But, I'm a lover, not a fighter, so prefer to not shoot any bear.
I'd rather shoot a griz with a 9mm than a .25. ;);) But, I'm a lover, not a fighter, so prefer to not shoot any bear.
http://www.uzi.com/
sheepdog
11-08-2010, 20:46
I'd rather shoot a griz with a 9mm than a .25. ;);) But, I'm a lover, not a fighter, so prefer to not shoot any bear.
I prefer bears that run away after a nice photo op!!
i think he meant "bare" not "bear"
Even with the wrong word, there is no context about it being specifically for a 'bear'. But yes, I meant 'bare' as in at the very least.
SMSP