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stonedflea
01-22-2011, 13:03
hey y'all... i just have a quick question. a friend of mine and i did the foothills trail in sc/nc last month and used his SD clip flashlight. on our five days out, all but one morning we woke up with condensation inside the tent. ( http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=512862583344&set=a.512860367784.2014346.123300603 ) it was enough to make our things uncomfortably wet come morning. we used the rainfly every night.

to the best of my memory, i've never had a problem with condensation in a tent. granted, this was the smallest tent i've slept in (this was my first time out backpacking... other experiences are limited to day hikes and just camping with 4-5 man tents), so i don't know if it has to do with the smaller area, or...?

i guess my main question is what causes condensation in a tent, what can be done to prevent it, and are there any tents that you recommend that you've not had a condensation problem with? i'm looking to get a 2-man tent for my thru-hike so that i'll have enough room for myself, my pack, and possibly my dog if i have to take her.

thanks so much. :)

Bags4266
01-22-2011, 13:23
Unusual for a double walled tent. I have the same tent and used it with my daughter in the summer with no condensation problems. And one night was 10 hours of rain, and a few nights of high humidity. :-?

bigcranky
01-22-2011, 13:25
Breathing is what causes condensation. You could stop doing that, which would solve the problem, but is not the best solution.

In any tent, the more ventilation you have, the better. Leaving the rain fly door open will help a lot. The Clip Flashlight design makes it hard to do that in the rain, of course, but that's true of a lot of tent designs. But if the weather is decent, leaving the fly open is the first step. Open any peak vents all the way. Don't bring wet gear inside the tent. Do bring a small pack towel to wipe down the inside in the morning.

Another issue is tent size -- have two people in a Clip Flashlight is tight, and doubles the amount of moisture in the air. If it were me, I'd consider that a 1-person tent, but then I'm pretty big.

Plenty of tent suggestions on Whiteblaze, along with a long-running argument between the single wall Tarptent lovers and the double wall Hubba-ites. I'm firmly in the Tarptent camp, and very much like my Moment tarptent for solo hiking.

Iceaxe
01-22-2011, 13:29
Condesation will occur on a tent wall or any other surface that has a temperature at or below the dew point.
It is the same as breathing on a window pane when it's cold outside.
It can be a problem in a single wall tent if you tend to brush the walls or roof or if it runs down the sides and collects on the floor.
A lot of folks I kmow use single wall tents and just accept the occaasional condensation and mop it up off floor and walls with a bandana or shake it off when it's frozen in the AM.
Double wall tents, where the inner wall is mesh, have the advantage of keeping and condensation that accumulates on the fly a few inches away and you are less likely to brush against it and it wont end up on your bathtub floor etc.
Also the air space between the mesh and the fly can provided enough ventilation to reduce condensation on the fly as well.
It is really a personal choice, whether you go single or double wall, and dependant on the conditions you will face and how you deal with them.
there is not always a huge weight penalty to useing a double wall tent though.. Light heart gear tents come to mind. Also my Gossamer gear One tent was single wall tent but one whole side was mesh under the vestibule.
The worst condensation problem i ever had was when it was 32 degrees and snowing in Washington. The humidity was super high and it would not freeze. Every breath visibly condensed inside my tent and soaked my gear. That was the extreme though. Most of the time condensation is manageble if you have a strategy. :D

TheChop
01-22-2011, 13:56
I was also on the Foothills Trail not a month ago but the first week of January and my single walled tarptent was soaked in the morning. I tried giving more ventilation by opening the sides more but it didn't help much. I believe the cause of the crazy condensation was due to the location of the trail. It borders the lake and in general it seemed extremely humid much more so than my time on the Bartrum or even sections on and around the AT. I made a point that I'll have to have a designated tent towel to wipe things down for the AT. Even my Hubba Hubba a friend was using got significant condensation which has never happened before.

Also seems like the amount of wet hot air you're putting into the tent by breathing has something to do with it. I'm a big guy and if you had two people with you and or a dog you would have more condensation.

10-K
01-22-2011, 14:17
The only problem with the towel idea in winter is that it'll freeze into a towel-brick and be pretty useless,

A small sponge is easier to manage and thaw when if freezes because it holds its shape - just stick it in a ziplock.

TheChop
01-22-2011, 14:21
Good idea 10-K. The only thing I would say is the condensation didn't seem to be nearly the problem on the first night because it froze on the tent and that made it very manageable with just a handkerchief. If something fell to the floor you could pick up the ice and toss it.

10-K
01-22-2011, 14:28
Good idea 10-K. The only thing I would say is the condensation didn't seem to be nearly the problem on the first night because it froze on the tent and that made it very manageable with just a handkerchief. If something fell to the floor you could pick up the ice and toss it.

Yeah... When it's not going to freeze I bring one these towels that I can only find at Sam's Club - I don't know what they are - maybe a Shamwow knock off? Anyway, you can soak up several times the weight of the towel and wring it nearly dry and it's a lot more useful than a sponge.

I made the mistake of using one of those towels below freezing once - that's how I learned the sponge trick. :)

Wise Old Owl
01-22-2011, 14:43
The previous posts covered it, The Clip Flashlight does not have a vent at the top of the outer wall, it was removed to save weight. Condensation doesn't happen enough to make life uncomfortable, but if you are camping in the same place a lot why not add or sew in a vent and fly? just copy a well known tent design; Its a well worth it afternoon winter project.

Reid
01-22-2011, 14:50
I couldn't pull the picture up. Were you camping on the Chatooga when it happened? I don't think I've had any problems with condensation and I am ok sleeping in a tent without the fly If I know it's going to be above freezing and not raining.

Rick500
01-22-2011, 14:53
I use a square of Shamwow about 6"x6" to wipe down my TarpTent in the morning if there's condensation. Never had it out in freezing weather, so I don't know how easy it is to thaw if it freezes (the Shamwow, I mean), but it's very easy to wring it dry once it's wet, so it shouldn't freeze.

garlic08
01-22-2011, 16:20
Ditto everything said above, with this added--geography affects condensation, too. How often have you walked off a warm dry ridge in the morning into a dew-soaked grassy valley? Or seen clouds in the valley below you in the morning? During a calm night, cold air naturally sinks due to convection and may reach the dew point or even frost, whereas a higher ridge or hill will stay warmer and will have a lower relative humidity.

If you seek the higher ground for your campsites, you'll have less problem with condensation. Even a few feet above a lake or creek can make a difference.

garlic08
01-22-2011, 16:28
The most condensation I've ever had was my first night on the AT in early April, a cold and rainy day. I took off my rainjacket inside my single-wall tent and a cloud formed in there. My body warmth and wet clothes added enough moisture to the cool air to reach the dew point--100% humidity--and it didn't get much better for a couple of days. I kept my bandanna handy and wiped and wrung often, and was able to keep all my insulation dry until the sun came out on the third day.

Tinker
01-22-2011, 23:40
The previous posts covered it, The Clip Flashlight does not have a vent at the top of the outer wall, it was removed to save weight. Condensation doesn't happen enough to make life uncomfortable, but if you are camping in the same place a lot why not add or sew in a vent and fly? just copy a well known tent design; Its a well worth it afternoon winter project.

As far as I know the SD Clip Flashlight never had a fly vent. When I asked the SD rep way back in 1987 at REI, he said cost (extra sewing time due to more seams) was the reason for the lack of a vent). That is most likely the reason that the tent is essentially (except for more mesh in the canopy) unchanged to this day (besides the fact that it is inexpensive, light, durable, and marketed by a reputable company.
You were absolutely spot-on in your observation regarding the lack of upper venting being a major cause of condensation, warm moist air from body and breath rises upwards. If it cannot exit the tent (at the highest point possible) it will condense on the underside of the fly if the outside air is colder than the inside air.
Lack of air movement (wind) also helps condensation form.
The best peak vent design I've ever seen is on Stephenson Warmlite tents www.warmlite.com (http://www.warmlite.com).

LoneRidgeRunner
01-22-2011, 23:58
Opening up as much as possible for ventilation seems to help but, as a few have said already..it's gonna happen at times regardless of what you do... I've had my breath freeze on the inside walls of my Mountain Hardwear Trango 2 when it was VERY cold (below 0 I think) Then it warmed up pretty quickly next day and I slept late and it melted and started raining on me in there. Water dripping on my face was what woke me up. I knew it had frozen because I had woke up in the night to use my "pee" bottle and saw the ice there. After it's frozen it's sorta hard to wipe off. I think I had closed off my ventilation that night though because it was so cold.. Maybe a mistake. I have never closed off my ventilation after that.
The Trango 2 is sort of heavy to carry unless you split it up between 2 people but I carry it anyway because it's bomb proof and I like the winter time. I like a tent that won't fall down if the wind blows or it snows on me. The Trango fills that bill.

LoneRidgeRunner
01-23-2011, 00:10
I saw your facebook pic and that's a LOT of condensation for sure..

TOMP
01-13-2012, 21:10
Old thread but I had a new idea that helped me. I have a MSR skinny one and it has alot of condensation especially in colder temps. Its basically a bivy shape with alot more room inside and one openning at your feet to enter. So I started sleeping with my face at the door side rather then the far side and that allowed alot more of my breath to exit the tent rather then collect on the walls. Still condensation but a lot less this way. Also the vent that is built into the tent is now above my head so I think this is what made the difference.