View Full Version : Smoky Mnt Trail Magic
wounded_knee
03-01-2011, 11:33
Hi all,
I am taking 3 scouts through the entire AT in the Smokies. We are going to be there March 20 through the 26th. We would like to spread some trail magic along the way and improve the trail in spots as part of a service project.
What items and or improvements would be appreciated by through hikers such as yourselves? We have an eager group who is looking forward to the trip.
Hope to see a few of you out there.
Phil
Lone Wolf
03-01-2011, 11:42
hikers don't need "trail magic" especially that early in the trip. if you want the boys to do a servive project have them bring large trash bags for hauling out junk left in the shelters
Tennessee Viking
03-01-2011, 12:03
You will need to contact the Smoky Mountain Hiking Club (local AT maintenance club; http://www.smhclub.org) or the Park office to inquire on any maintenance projects.
For trail magic. Contact SMHC and any hostels/services to see if your group can help with any opportunities.
Yamagame
03-01-2011, 13:39
Hi Phil,
That sounds very nice. Although hikers don't "need" trail magic, I can't think of many who would say "no" to hot cocoa and donuts or hotdogs/burgers on Clingman's Dome or Newfound Gap :D
With the proper cooperation with all the hiking clubs/NPS, hauling trash sounds like a useful, if slightly less glamorous, project. They might have some others they have in mind.
wounded_knee
03-01-2011, 14:40
Hi Phil,
That sounds very nice. Although hikers don't "need" trail magic, I can't think of many who would say "no" to hot cocoa and donuts or hotdogs/burgers on Clingman's Dome or Newfound Gap :D
With the proper cooperation with all the hiking clubs/NPS, hauling trash sounds like a useful, if slightly less glamorous, project. They might have some others they have in mind.
In the past in my earlier days, I would hike the Cades cove to Fontana quite often and did attempt to do the AT in the park once, but the smokies weather of 60's to thunderstorms to hail to 3 inches of snow made me turn tail in one day. Anyway, I would leave all uneaten food at the last shelter or other trinkets for you thru hikers in the past. Is this discouraged? I was planning the same thing this time around as well as trash pickup.
Tennessee Viking, thanks for the info. We already have a task from George!
A few years ago, the Great Smoky Mountains National Park was requiring permits for pre-planned trail magic events on the A.T. when food preparation was involved. I'd recommend calling the backcountry office at (865) 436-1231 to find out what the policy is and what their recommendations would be. Contacting the Smoky Mountains Hiking Club (the official A.T.-maintaining club in the Smokies) for suggestions on volunteer projects is a great idea, too (what Tennessee Viking said).
Laurie Potteiger
Appalachian Trail Conservancy
Lone Wolf
03-01-2011, 14:49
In the past in my earlier days, I would hike the Cades cove to Fontana quite often and did attempt to do the AT in the park once, but the smokies weather of 60's to thunderstorms to hail to 3 inches of snow made me turn tail in one day. Anyway, I would leave all uneaten food at the last shelter or other trinkets for you thru hikers in the past. Is this discouraged? I was planning the same thing this time around as well as trash pickup.
Tennessee Viking, thanks for the info. We already have a task from George!
leaving anything behind, food included, is a no-no. hikers are on vacation. they don't need to be fed.
leaving anything behind, food included, is a no-no. hikers are on vacation. they don't need to be fed.
I'm new here, and probably speaking out of place. But please don't speak for all thru hikers when you say things like this.
I know of several people that not only loved food left behind for other hikers, it helped them out.
I also look forward to any trail magic, at any point.
I'm not pulling a thru hike for a vacation either.
Thank you,
Brad
Right on Fats... I leave it when I can, And have DEFF enjoyed it when someone else leaves it...
max patch
03-01-2011, 17:34
If a hiker can take a 6 month vacation then he can afford to feed himself.
Give food/money to a homeless shelter if you want to help someone who really needs help.
Lone Wolf
03-01-2011, 17:41
I'm new here, and probably speaking out of place. But please don't speak for all thru hikers when you say things like this.
I know of several people that not only loved food left behind for other hikers, it helped them out.
I also look forward to any trail magic, at any point.
I'm not pulling a thru hike for a vacation either.
Thank you,
Brad
Right on Fats... I leave it when I can, And have DEFF enjoyed it when someone else leaves it...
it's your opinions but food should NEVER be left at shelters or road sides unattended. no exceptions
WingedMonkey
03-01-2011, 17:54
Hi all,
I am taking 3 scouts through the entire AT in the Smokies.
In the GSMNP everything is regulated. Where you sleep, where you take a dump, and what you do with your food. It is unlikely you will not meet a ranger on your hike, either counting heads or checking for permits. They will find your act of kindness as a park violation.
HoneyBear
03-01-2011, 18:04
I'm new here, and probably speaking out of place. But please don't speak for all thru hikers when you say things like this.
I know of several people that not only loved food left behind for other hikers, it helped them out.
I also look forward to any trail magic, at any point.
I'm not pulling a thru hike for a vacation either.
Thank you,
BradI think you may be missing the point. At every shelter throughout the Smokies there are signs saying "pack it in, pack it out", "food odors attract bears" "hang all food and odorous items" etc....Trail Magic is no exception. If the scouts want to provide hot chocolate or hotdogs that's all well and good but leaving anything behind in shelters (especially food) is wrong.
Mr Wounded Knee, thanks for your kind offer, its a great idea to get Scouts involved at an early age in helping out the trail community. A couple things touched on here already:
a. don't leave food in shelters or along the trail, especially in GSMNP. It's a definite no-no due to black bear activity and wildlife management practices being enforced by the Park Service. Newfound Gap road crossing is an excellent place to locate an AT hiker trail magic station with snacks or drinks.
b. while you are hiking the trail, you could consider bringing extra trash bags and removing any litter at shelters left by hikers.
c. Trail maintenance ideas should be discussed with the Park Service and the AT Trail Chapter that works in the Park.
best of luck to you!
Blissful
03-01-2011, 20:40
If you are thru hiking, leave your excess food at hiker boxes setup at hostels and other places. I've also seen hiker boxes at post offices and motels / hotels frequented by hikers. Sure they will like that
Blissful
03-01-2011, 20:46
It is unlikely you will not meet a ranger on your hike, either counting heads or checking for permits. They will find your act of kindness as a park violation.
Yes you will definitely meet the ridge runners then. They are out in full force from March on.
Though if you stop a hiker on the trail and offer them a candy bar, heaven sakes they aren't gonna arrest you for that. Even those on "vacation" could use some random acts of kindness. Because the reason some are on a supposed "vacation" might mean they are searching for something...or someone...or an act of kindness to show them they are loved :)
We have done our hiker picnic now for 2 years and look forward to it this year. It has been the greatest thing meeting the hikers. And at least five hikers I met in New England who came to our picnic last year. They talked about it. Took pictures of me, ha ha :) But I know they will spread what they receive to other strangers they meet in life.
WingedMonkey
03-01-2011, 21:10
Ridgerunners are not law enforcement and are not going to arrest you for anything. There are no hiker boxes inside SMNP. If your Boy Scouts want to pass out free candy bars more power to them. If they want to leave food in shelters then a ridgerunner may "educate" them on what the ATC trains them in "effective food storage in bear country".
aaronthebugbuffet
03-01-2011, 21:33
Haul out trash.
Don't leave stuff at shelters.
Pick up the toilet paper rosettes if your hardcore.
wounded_knee
03-05-2011, 18:00
Thanks for all of your input. I think we are going to either grill hotdogs or hand out cookies around clingmans dome or Mnt Collins Shelter. We are being resupplied at Clinman's Dome on Wednesday the 23rd, so we can put that into our resupply boxes.
Which would be more appreciated?
leaving anything behind, food included, is a no-no. hikers are on vacation. they don't need to be fed.
it's your opinions but food should NEVER be left at shelters or road sides unattended. no exceptions
You're right that you shouldn't leave food behind ever, especially in bear country, but you can't really talk for "hikers" with your opinion. I haven't met a single hiker that would agree with the statement you just made. They might be on vacation, and they probably don't need to be fed, but sometimes trail magic is exactly what they need to keep them going. It's not the hotdog, its the gesture.
Also, when I go on vacation, I go somewhere like the Bahamas. While I enjoy my hikes, I don't think I would call them a "vacation".
Thanks for all of your input. I think we are going to either grill hotdogs or hand out cookies around clingmans dome or Mnt Collins Shelter. We are being resupplied at Clinman's Dome on Wednesday the 23rd, so we can put that into our resupply boxes.
Which would be more appreciated?
Personally I think I'd prefer a grilled hotdog or 2, and I think that'd be better hiking food, but I can't speak for others and I certainly wouldn't be any less grateful for a cookie to munch on!
Like I mentioned in my last post, the gesture means more than the actual food, whichever you feel like bringing I'm sure every hiker you meet will be very grateful!
Old Hiker
03-09-2011, 08:16
If you pick up and pack the trash out, it will count towards the 50 miler patch as well!
Post your experiences, please. My Troop section hikes every year and 2012 may be the year for our Smoky Mt section. Good luck!
Lone Wolf
03-09-2011, 08:23
You're right that you shouldn't leave food behind ever, especially in bear country, but you can't really talk for "hikers" with your opinion. I haven't met a single hiker that would agree with the statement you just made. They might be on vacation, and they probably don't need to be fed, but sometimes trail magic is exactly what they need to keep them going. It's not the hotdog, its the gesture.
Also, when I go on vacation, I go somewhere like the Bahamas. While I enjoy my hikes, I don't think I would call them a "vacation".
whatever. it's still just a walkin' vacation. nothin' more.
The Cleaner
03-09-2011, 08:24
it's your opinions but food should NEVER be left at shelters or road sides unattended. no exceptions
Anything left at a shelter will turn into trash after the mice chew on it&nobody will use it.Used and dirty clothing items seem to be left behihd more these days,which makes great mouse nest building material.PACK IT IN,PACK IT OUT.....NO EXCEPTIONS....:eek:
Camping Dave
03-09-2011, 14:59
Hi all,
I am taking 3 scouts through the entire AT in the Smokies. We are going to be there March 20 through the 26th. We would like to spread some trail magic along the way and improve the trail in spots as part of a service project.
What items and or improvements would be appreciated by through hikers such as yourselves? We have an eager group who is looking forward to the trip.
Hope to see a few of you out there.
Phil
Knee, I'm a long time scouter too and suggest you ask park officials about service projects. Service projects are worthy scout activities with lasting value for the entire community.
Handing out food is temporary, benefits only a few, and (like it or not, like LW said) most of these folks are adults on vacation with their own money. Don't let 12 and 13 year old boys be pack mules for adults. Did the "trail magic" idea originate with the scouts themselves or is it something you got excited about and passed along to them? Hikers like Bugz who think making children hump gear so they can get a free dog are jack-a-double-dollar-signs. No offense Bugz.
Stick with a service project. If the scouts want to hand out food take them to a homeless shelter where they can help people in real need.
Hikers like Bugz who think making children hump gear so they can get a free dog are jack-a-double-dollar-signs. No offense Bugz.
Ha! None taken. You make a fair point.
Ox97GaMe
03-10-2011, 10:00
Follow up on a couple items.....
Never leave food behind for hikers. The maintainers and ridgerunners are required to remove any items left. hikers will also be reluctant to just grab any food items left behind, as they dont know how long it has been there or who might have left it or and why. It also attributes to the increase in creatures in and around the shelter space.
The park does requre permits for 'organized' events in the park, and trail magic often falls in that category, especially if you 'set up' an area for feeding. They had a major incident a few years ago that has caused them to become much more strict about such thing. I dont know if there is a fine if you dont have a permit, but you probably dont want to find out the hard way.
If you know the days that you will be in the Clingman's - Newfound Gap area or Fontana area, there are some projects that the SMHC could utilize some extra volunteers. We can coordinate getting tools and supervisors there to assist. It may be easier to plan for on the weekend, but the club can sometimes accomodate mid-week trips too. Drop me a note and we can try to make that happen.
Have a nice trip in the park. Maybe I will see you out there. :)
wornoutboots
03-10-2011, 10:23
We always carry premade packets of reese cup, butterfingers & other chocolate treats & carry them with us just in case we ran into a thru who we could offer it to. + you can set up on New Found Gap prior to or after your hike with a large tent (to get out of the weather, some chair with backs : o ) & have a cookout, I think you can grill there? & have a rotating schedule of the adults offering shuttle the hikers as the come out of the woods. It would teach the scout charity & the act of giving.
You will need to contact the Smoky Mountain Hiking Club (local AT maintenance club; http://www.smhclub.org) or the Park office to inquire on any maintenance projects. ......
Lone Wolf's suggestion does not require approval. Just do it. Burn any burnables. Carry out the light stuff. I usually dig a hole away from the campsites to bury the stuff that I can't carry.
The latter is more iffy. But no one has complained in the 60 years I've been doing it.
I'm new here, and probably speaking out of place. But please don't speak for all thru hikers when you say things like this.
I know of several people that not only loved food left behind for other hikers, it helped them out.
I also look forward to any trail magic, at any point.
I'm not pulling a thru hike for a vacation either.
Thank you,
Brad
A vacation is the only logical reason for doing a thru hike. If it aint fun, don't do it. Those who dream of some magical results from a hike, quickly discover there is no such bonus. I hear them complaining all the way to Katahdin -- well those that don't find an excuse to quit, or to yellow blaze complain, anyway.
wounded_knee
03-10-2011, 11:34
I have couple of tasks from the SMHC. We will be cleaning fire rings along the trail at shelters, destroying rouge fire rings, and making exact locations of blowdowns for thier clean up with chainsaws a few weeks after we get off the trail.
As for magic, we will be handing out cookies and homemade granola bars at newfound gap.
The scouts took to the idea as presented. I feel that person asking the question about that takes to the boy led troop. We do as well. They chose the food and wanted to do something to give back. These boys are also excited to hear stories and look at gear .
I just got off the phone with the NPS backcountry office. They have no problems with us doing what we planned. Also while we are out there, if there isn't a budget extension, we may not have rangers. The advice from the park service on that was we could still go out, but be safe.
Thanls for your input on this. See you out there.
WingedMonkey
03-10-2011, 15:35
I have couple of tasks from the SMHC. We will be cleaning fire rings along the trail at shelters, destroying rouge fire rings, and making exact locations of blowdowns for thier clean up with chainsaws a few weeks after we get off the trail.
That's a GREAT idea, give the scouts a chance to see what unburned and buried garbage does to a place as busy as the Smokies, and how rouge fire rings turn into mud holes not even suitable for camping. Maybe by the time they are long distance hikers they will have it down.
:sun
I've never seen a hiker refuse a candy bar or some other goodie. As to giving to a homeless shelter , no problem with that, but this is out hiking, so lighten up a bit. SOme hikers are on a tight budget and do appreciate the extra food. But do give it to them, don't leave it laying around a shelter.
Just out of curiosity, have any thru hikers experienced too much Trail Magic where it made them feel less like they were hiking in the wilderness and more so through a touristy nat. park?
A vacation is the only logical reason for doing a thru hike. If it aint fun, don't do it. Those who dream of some magical results from a hike, quickly discover there is no such bonus. I hear them complaining all the way to Katahdin -- well those that don't find an excuse to quit, or to yellow blaze complain, anyway.
We're not all logical :p.
I'm sure I will have fun, but that's not the reason for my hike.
I don't complain, and I don't dream of "magical results".
I also don't quit.;)
I think that my hike, and your hike are two different things. That's great! But remember that we are not all the same people. We all do things for different reasons, and we all have different goals. And, just because my goals don't make sense to you, doesn't mean they are not valid to me.
Brad
wounded_knee
03-31-2011, 01:43
Hi all,
We made it out. Weather in Smokies was a gift of everything. Sunburn, to rain to tthunderstorms to an inch of snow in a matter of 5 days.
We also ran into some great thru hikers who tagged our kids with trail names.
As for the cleanup, destroyed 3 rouge fire rings, cleaned out 4. Packed out about 4 pounds of garbage. Geolocated 3 significant blowdowns to the hiking club and cleared 3 more smaller ones.
Provided trail magic at Newfound gap. Cookies, granola bars and fried chicken.
All in all a great trip. Thanks for your input.
And for the trail magic discussion needed versus not, every hiker we ran across not only appreciated it, but more that not said that it helps them stretch food and a few hinted that they were on such a tight budget, it effects thier resupply to the point it saves them money.
:D.
I hope next year to run into people such as you.
Great job on the clean up. 4 pounds, wow.
Brad
WingedMonkey
03-31-2011, 10:03
Hi all,
We made it out. Weather in Smokies was a gift of everything. Sunburn, to rain to tthunderstorms to an inch of snow in a matter of 5 days.
We also ran into some great thru hikers who tagged our kids with trail names.
As for the cleanup, destroyed 3 rouge fire rings, cleaned out 4. Packed out about 4 pounds of garbage. Geolocated 3 significant blowdowns to the hiking club and cleared 3 more smaller ones.
Provided trail magic at Newfound gap. Cookies, granola bars and fried chicken.
All in all a great trip. Thanks for your input.
And for the trail magic discussion needed versus not, every hiker we ran across not only appreciated it, but more that not said that it helps them stretch food and a few hinted that they were on such a tight budget, it effects thier resupply to the point it saves them money.
Love all the work your Scouts did, hope they learned a lot.
This hiker LOVES fried chicken, but if I'm broke or hungry by Newfound Gap, somethings wrong.
:sun
Love all the work your Scouts did, hope they learned a lot.
This hiker LOVES fried chicken, but if I'm broke or hungry by Newfound Gap, somethings wrong.
:sun
Um, we walk thousands of miles simply because we like it. money is the least of our problems. :rolleyes:
Brad
Hi all,
We made it out. Weather in Smokies was a gift of everything. Sunburn, to rain to tthunderstorms to an inch of snow in a matter of 5 days.
We also ran into some great thru hikers who tagged our kids with trail names.
As for the cleanup, destroyed 3 rouge fire rings, cleaned out 4. Packed out about 4 pounds of garbage. Geolocated 3 significant blowdowns to the hiking club and cleared 3 more smaller ones.
Provided trail magic at Newfound gap. Cookies, granola bars and fried chicken.
All in all a great trip. Thanks for your input.
And for the trail magic discussion needed versus not, every hiker we ran across not only appreciated it, but more that not said that it helps them stretch food and a few hinted that they were on such a tight budget, it effects thier resupply to the point it saves them money.
AWESOME!!! Thanks...Whats the trail names for the kids???... Any hikers with man's best friend??? If so, what did they eat??? My hound luvs him some fried chicken...lol...
WingedMonkey
04-01-2011, 11:18
Um, we walk thousands of miles simply because we like it. money is the least of our problems. :rolleyes:
Brad
If they are broke at the Smokies they are not going to Maine. I hike cheap but not broke.
wounded_knee
04-01-2011, 22:00
Happy Meal
Spike
Halftime
As for dogs, no dogs seen. I wasn't trying to say anyone was broke. But we did meet a couple of hikers on a strict budget.
If they are broke at the Smokies they are not going to Maine. I hike cheap but not broke.
I'm sorry, that didn't come out like it read I think.
I'm not sure how to say it lol.
I know that having funds is important.
I'll most likely be hiking broke lol. My drive outweighs my wallet. Always has. I wish I could afford to hike cheap. :p
Brad
AWESOME!!! Thanks...Whats the trail names for the kids???... Any hikers with man's best friend??? If so, what did they eat??? My hound luvs him some fried chicken...lol...
Perhaps a silly question, do dogs get trail names?
Brad
white_fang
04-04-2011, 12:17
I'm stuck on a trail name. Can't think of anything!!! I thought something with wolves involved being theyre my favorite animal...but I can't conjure up anything!! If anyone has any ideas it would be greatly appreciated.....also thought of bones...since I like to collect bones...I don't know!! help please :)
white_fang
04-04-2011, 12:18
Forgot...I'm not on here as much as i'd like to be..training and all, so if anyone does stumble upon this and has any ideas feel free to email it to me...I check that everday.
[email protected]
I think that my hike, and your hike are two different things. That's great! But remember that we are not all the same people. We all do things for different reasons, and we all have different goals. And, just because my goals don't make sense to you, doesn't mean they are not valid to me. Brad
3 snaps up and a Z formation on this my friend!