View Full Version : All those thru hikers and that thru hiker mentality.
So, this weekend I hiked Allen's Gap to Devil's Fork Gap and back and saw over 20 thru hikers.
I spent some time at Little Laurel shelter eating lunch with a few and I couldn't help but reflect on this being the 4th year of thru hikers I've seen on the AT.
As an observation, I couldn't help but notice how caught up in it they were, about all the trail magic they had received, who was ahead of them, who was behind them, how many miles they were doing, etc. etc, etc, etc., etc.
This time last year there was a completely different bunch out there doing the same thing, thinking the same things, talking about the same things - and now they're all back in their regular lives and many of them may never hike again.
And the cycle will repeat again this year.... For now and for them, it's "All about me." and I guess that's the way it's supposed to be.
Also, it's good to see that the role of "Control Person" is still in effect. Ever notice how there is always one person in a group hiking together that needs to be in charge of "Central Planning and Control"? :-)
It is great to see a whole new group excited about the prospects of thruhiking the AT.
But, for section hikers that excitement continues year after year !!!!!
WingedMonkey
04-02-2011, 14:49
After reading Pirate's Facebook page about this year's crop passing through Neel's Gap, I'm glad I hermit hike and don't need a " Control Person".
After reading Pirate's Facebook page about this year's crop passing through Neel's Gap, I'm glad I hermit hike and don't need a " Control Person".
Pirate must be a saint for putting up with what he does at Mountain Crossings. Someone at the hostel needed to let everyone know that what Pirate prepared for breakfast and dinner was not trail magic.
Pirate must be a saint for putting up with what he does at Mountain Crossings. Someone at the hostel needed to let everyone know that what Pirate prepared for breakfast and dinner is not trail magic.
Makes me glad I'm leaving late.
Grr another reason for edit button. Was supposed to be quoting wingedmonkey.
After reading Pirate's Facebook page about this year's crop passing through Neel's Gap, I'm glad I hermit hike and don't need a " Control Person".
You can always pick out the Control Person. He/She's the one standing over a map with a guidebook and sometimes a pen and paper doing math while everyone else is just sitting around having fun.
Haven't heard the term control person before. Now that you mention it I've seen a few over the years and they weren't all on the trail. Guess that's when the HYOY needs to be employed. Don't think it would be much fun having someone else telling you when to hike and how far. Just hoping I can get into shape again for next year. If I make it I would like to look back and say " I did it my way". Sorry Frank.
Trailbender
04-02-2011, 15:16
This time last year there was a completely different bunch out there doing the same thing, thinking the same things, talking about the same things - and now they're all back in their regular lives and many of them may never hike again.
Not me, I did my thru last year, and have not been able to get the AT out of my mind. Every time I cracked a book to study for classes, I thought about what it was like walking across Max Patch, a perfect spring breeze with the smell of grass, and coming over a mountain early in the morning and watching the sun peek over the horizon, and seeing small towns nestled in the green valleys on a warm summer morning.
I have been hiking at small local trails since then, and it is nice, but not the AT. So I finally decided, after months of thinking about it, to just get on the AT again. Leave college for now, and see where my wandering will take me over the years. I have sold or gotten rid of my stuff, which wasn't much at all, and am giving this comp to a friend when I leave. Everything I own will be in my pack.
This took a lot of thought, but I knew I would never be truly happy until I follow this tangent to its conclusion. I am not happy with the "prizes" society offers, I have to do what makes me happy.
Blackbird
04-02-2011, 16:22
... And the cycle will repeat again this year.... For now and for them, it's "All about me." and I guess that's the way it's supposed to be. ...
The cycle they're caught in is a wash cycle and they're guaranteed to get washed.
I'm about to go out for a week down south where I might meet some and I'm fairly certain the thru hikers likely won't say much to me once they find out I'm "just" a section hiker. Even though I've hiked GA to CT (plus VT and NH). I don't mind; it's just where their heads are at. Not their fault, really. I was like that once.
Respect experience. All kinds of people can teach us all kinds of things if we're just open to it.
The Counselor
04-02-2011, 16:58
Haven't heard the term control person before. Now that you mention it I've seen a few over the years and they weren't all on the trail. Guess that's when the HYOY needs to be employed. Don't think it would be much fun having someone else telling you when to hike and how far. Just hoping I can get into shape again for next year. If I make it I would like to look back and say " I did it my way". Sorry Frank.
Nobody much likes controlling types. Lots appreciate somebody taking the lead when it comes to planning or other aspects of a trip though - particularly small groups who hike together. Everybody brings a little something to the table. You have your Lewises and your Clarks. Between the two of them, they pulled off a pretty decent hike.
Dangit!!! I can't wait till I am there....
The Cleaner
04-02-2011, 17:39
So, this weekend I hiked Allen's Gap to Devil's Fork Gap and back and saw over 20 thru hikers.
I spent some time at Little Laurel shelter eating lunch with a few and I couldn't help but reflect on this being the 4th year of thru hikers I've seen on the AT.
As an observation, I couldn't help but notice how caught up in it they were, about all the trail magic they had received, who was ahead of them, who was behind them, how many miles they were doing, etc. etc, etc, etc., etc.
This time last year there was a completely different bunch out there doing the same thing, thinking the same things, talking about the same things - and now they're all back in their regular lives and many of them may never hike again.
And the cycle will repeat again this year.... For now and for them, it's "All about me." and I guess that's the way it's supposed to be.
Also, it's good to see that the role of "Control Person" is still in effect. Ever notice how there is always one person in a group hiking together that needs to be in charge of "Central Planning and Control"? :-)
I've been going out and meeting thru hikers for over 25 years as I try to help out with cleaning up after them.Seems like when I first started thru hikers were a lot different than some on the trail these days.It's kinda like if your not thru hiking some hikers don't have much to say to section hikers.What they don't know is that it's still a long way to go and quite a few thru hikers get off the trail for various reasons before the halfway point.:eek:......thru hiking today....through hiking days later....
Blissful
04-02-2011, 17:45
You can always pick out the Control Person. He/She's the one standing over a map with a guidebook and sometimes a pen and paper doing math while everyone else is just sitting around having fun.
That's me. :D
Blissful
04-02-2011, 17:49
The cycle they're caught in is a wash cycle and they're guaranteed to get washed.
I'm about to go out for a week down south where I might meet some and I'm fairly certain the thru hikers likely won't say much to me once they find out I'm "just" a section hiker. Even though I've hiked GA to CT (plus VT and NH). I don't mind; it's just where their heads are at. Not their fault, really. I was like that once.
Respect experience. All kinds of people can teach us all kinds of things if we're just open to it.
I think when you see thru hikers farther south they are not as conceited as up north. You should see the I am god thru hiker NOBO mentality to the SOBOS esp. in Maine. Made me want to bite them with the attitude. Big difference though from the Whites south. They hadn't been through the tough stuff and SOBOs have
Nearly Normal
04-02-2011, 20:36
Why are they labeled thru hikers? Most don't.
The Cleaner
04-02-2011, 21:46
Why are they labeled thru hikers? Most don't. A lot of them do finish but there are many reasons some don't make it .I have actually asked some and they replied that they were trying their best to finish but it was fine with them if they didn't make it all the way.They were just glad to on the trail doing their best.Seems like every year there are reports of some hikers quitting in GA.Like they get to a road crossing leave their pack at the gap and stick out their thumb.:eek:.I've heard this several times since I first started hiking in '79...Has anyone else heard or seen something like this?
Nearly Normal
04-02-2011, 22:52
Why not just go hiking?
If you do it all I think that's wonderful.
Just a section hilking blue blazing ******* hiker. I don't have the time....yet........but when I do...........I'm only gonna be a hiker.
No one will ever call me a thru hiker. Not if I can help it.
Trail Bug
04-03-2011, 06:42
I think when you see thru hikers farther south they are not as conceited as up north. You should see the I am god thru hiker NOBO mentality to the SOBOS esp. in Maine. Made me want to bite them with the attitude. Big difference though from the Whites south. They hadn't been through the tough stuff and SOBOs haveYou are so right. The ones I met in NC and TN were friendly and outgoing. Most of those I met in NH and ME we called them Trains as they came through in groups and thought the rest of us were trash. Some would come to the shelters and never speak to you as you were not a thru hiker. I too had a lot of respect for the SoBo as they were friendly and were hitting all the hard stuff right at the beginning. The board here warned me of the difficulty last year and they were so right.
kayak karl
04-03-2011, 06:58
there is always that idiot that wakes up first and decides the NOBO's should hike north LOL. i hate these people with their books and maps. i try to fall behind or hike ahead of them. i deal with controlling people every day in the real world. don't need these know-it-alls on the trail.
You are so right. The ones I met in NC and TN were friendly and outgoing. Most of those I met in NH and ME we called them Trains as they came through in groups and thought the rest of us were trash. Some would come to the shelters and never speak to you as you were not a thru hiker. I too had a lot of respect for the SoBo as they were friendly and were hitting all the hard stuff right at the beginning. The board here warned me of the difficulty last year and they were so right.
I didn't pickup any conceit from anybody I talked to - just normal social interaction stuff like people in a group showing exclusivity to the people in their group - about what you'd expect.
The hikers I almost always enjoy talking with the most are the ones who are hiking alone or with 1 other person and typically over 45 years old. You can even tell if they want to talk by the way they're hiking when they get within 50' of you. Sometimes it's obvious their not in a mood to stop and chat and other times it's almost like they've been waiting on somebody to chat with for a minute to have a little human interaction. I do that myself from time to time.
The thing that I wish these hikers could see is that even though it feels like they're going to be out there forever, the hike is going to be over pretty quick and all their "stuff" will be history and they'll more or less be forgotten within a few days of wherever they are at that moment. The whole concept of "I am a thru hiker on a great adventure" is pretty much just in your own head and nobody elses - except maybe the hikers you're with....
There must be a special bond between "thru-hikers" that transcends the label of "hiker". It must be harder to relax and enjoy, knowing that at anytime you may need to leave the trail and give up your dream of finishing in one season. There is an underlying fear in the beginning that may very well be translated as conceit or an "above everyone else" attitude. I'm sure in time they are humbled by the trail.
As far as following the leader? That's one of the reasons I want to go alone. Freedom to move on or decide when to rest or go to town. Freedom to make new friends. To walk alone or partner up for a while. Freedom from people who control :)
jersey joe
04-03-2011, 08:51
Being a NOBO thru hiker in the south, such a great feeling, so much trail ahead of you, so much unknown, lots of excitement, surrounded by others going through the same thing, a great place to be.
After reading Pirate's Facebook page about this year's crop passing through Neel's Gap, I'm glad I hermit hike and don't need a " Control Person".
could you share this link? I'll be starting my NoBo thru the week after next, and am curious. I've only ever section hiked before, met lots of Thruhikers and always enjoyed their company and spirit, at least briefly.
Trailbender
04-03-2011, 10:07
I hiked alone most of the way, and would hang out for a bit at night with people at the shelter. I preferred it that way. If I was hiking behind someone, I felt they were slowing me down a bit, and if I hiked in front of someone, I felt I had to keep a certain pace up. I learned all this on my monthlong section in 2009, so on my thru, I pretty much hiked alone the whole way. I did see people, of course, and would stop and chat, but overall, I wanted to hike alone.
I felt privileged to be out there, I did consider it a wonderful adventure and an amazing experience, and overall, it was. I met many great people, and ate a lot of great food. I talked with section hikers many times at shelters, and I never got the feeling that they thought I was better than them. People have different lives, some have houses, and cars, I choose not to have all that stuff so I can leave whenever I want, and go wherever.
kayak karl
04-03-2011, 10:19
could you share this link? I'll be starting my NoBo thru the week after next, and am curious. I've only ever section hiked before, met lots of Thruhikers and always enjoyed their company and spirit, at least briefly.
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100001868827175
The Counselor
04-03-2011, 10:22
"Great adventures" are totally self-defined except for the vain. Not sure by what standard an AT thru hike is not a great adventure. But lording it over folks is a bit much. Four of us leave for our small section hike in a month, and though it is child's play to many, for us 40 something newbs with careers and families, I can assure you it is a great adventure. Most likely, as with most endeavors, after we do it we'll want more. One day we too may consider a week long hike child's play and want more. I don't care what the label is, it promises to be a milestone for us. It's all where you are experience-wise.
I'm about to go out for a week down south where I might meet some and I'm fairly certain the thru hikers likely won't say much to me once they find out I'm "just" a section hiker. Even though I've hiked GA to CT (plus VT and NH). I don't mind; it's just where their heads are at. Not their fault, really. I was like that once.
Respect experience. All kinds of people can teach us all kinds of things if we're just open to it.
not aimed at you, but I was uncomfortable when other hikers I met last year identified themselves by saying "I'm just a section hiker".I heard that alot. I wish people wouldn't label themselves as section hikers or thru-hikers out there. as someone else said, most of the ones identifying themselves as thru-hikers are going to be section hikers at the end of the day. i always told others who asked that I was attempting a thru-hike and was comfortable with that. in retrospect, most of the people that did finish were not the pompous, boastful type anyhow. That crowd gets weeded out most of the time before Harper's Ferry.
10-K's observations are similar to mine from last year on the trail. When I was in Vermont in late August, I encountered some NOBO thrus with various attitudes toward section hikers. Some were very immature, wouldn't even speak to you if you were a section hiker, kind of had a big chip on their shoulder. Others were really nice and talked a lot with us section hikers.
Majority of the hikers I met last year were cool, but I did see a race mentality that exists, too much emphasis on how many miles a day, how much are you beating so and so on the trail. I would definitely go slower and enjoy each day for what it is.
Tipi Walter
04-03-2011, 10:44
While I like to socialize on long backpacking trips, especially during winter trips when backpackers are sparse, it doesn't take long before I'm burned out with the endless banter and chitchat and senseless harping and yakking and jabbering.
Most thruhikers are backpacking newbs at heart but often use a five month thruhike with 15 to 20 mile days as a justification to sound like salty experts and trail weary gurus. Five months backpacking on a trail does not a lifetime make, and most AT thruhikers are just scratching the bag night/outdoor surface, even though they hold tight to their chests the show-off notion that they are "thruhikers" by god, and a cut above all others (dayhikers, section hikers, etc). The proof of a thruhiker's expertise must come after the trail when a lifetime of bag nights await him. There's nothing much more distasteful than a thruhiker who thinks and acts like he's an Expert Trailsman and a Philosopher King of all things related to hiking and backpacking, and the longer and further his trip, the worse he gets.
Starting a thruhike on the AT could and maybe should be done in the winter, like December or January, as then you will see few if any thruhikers, and the backpackers who attempt it usually bail and cancel out.
Tipi Walter
04-03-2011, 10:56
10-K's observations are similar to mine from last year on the trail. When I was in Vermont in late August, I encountered some NOBO thrus with various attitudes toward section hikers. Some were very immature, wouldn't even speak to you if you were a section hiker, kind of had a big chip on their shoulder. Others were really nice and talked a lot with us section hikers.
Majority of the hikers I met last year were cool, but I did see a race mentality that exists, too much emphasis on how many miles a day, how much are you beating so and so on the trail. I would definitely go slower and enjoy each day for what it is.
You can see this race and mileage mentality here on Whiteblaze, too. The ultralight mindset is fairly dominant here due in part to the unique aspects of AT backpacking: Frequent resupply, town visits, road crossings, motel rooms, and a heavy flow of fellow backpackers on the trail. Other backpacking forums deal more with actual wilderness backpacking and long winter treks whereas WB devolves into specific but boring topics such as localized parking opportunities at a thousand different trailheads, debilitating newbie gear lists, AT shelter minutiae, speed hiking in-awement, in-depth hammock and ultralight debates, and general non-wilderness backpacking discussions. But I like Whiteblaze as it's fast moving with many daily new posts. Generally speaking, WB.com (and the Appalachian Trail) reflects the current faddish interest in these aspects:
** A fascination with ultralight packs.
** A focus on tiny tents such as solo seedhouses, bivy tents and tarptents.
** Short snippet town-to-town backpacking where food loads rarely exceed five days.
** A raw enticement with moderately high daily miles walked.
** A lack of real hands-on winter backpacking expertise or in-depth long wilderness trips (it is the AT after all).
** Left field newbie/wannabe comments confusing issues with their imagined advice or solutions. And then to be true they vehemently argue their position with no real long term experience to back it up. This is a thruhiker's affliction too. Like in everything else, some people with minimal experience suddenly feel they are qualified experts since they touched the holy hem of the sacred field of study once and then quickly ran away. When they get to a computer it's easy for them to take their tiny worm of knowledge and create a misread and misinterpreted conclusion which they share with the world.
An excellent example of this is with gear reviews. How many times have we read this: "I love my new tent, and it's the best piece of gear I've gotten this year. It will hold up to anything nature has to offer and though it still sits unused in its stuff sack here in my apartment, I feel it's gonna be great!"
While I like to socialize on long backpacking trips, especially during winter trips when backpackers are sparse, it doesn't take long before I'm burned out with the endless banter and chitchat and senseless harping and yakking and jabbering.
Most thruhikers are backpacking newbs at heart but often use a five month thruhike with 15 to 20 mile days as a justification to sound like salty experts and trail weary gurus. Five months backpacking on a trail does not a lifetime make, and most AT thruhikers are just scratching the bag night/outdoor surface, even though they hold tight to their chests the show-off notion that they are "thruhikers" by god, and a cut above all others (dayhikers, section hikers, etc). The proof of a thruhiker's expertise must come after the trail when a lifetime of bag nights await him. There's nothing much more distasteful than a thruhiker who thinks and acts like he's an Expert Trailsman and a Philosopher King of all things related to hiking and backpacking, and the longer and further his trip, the worse he gets.
Starting a thruhike on the AT could and maybe should be done in the winter, like December or January, as then you will see few if any thruhikers, and the backpackers who attempt it usually bail and cancel out.
You can see this race and mileage mentality here on Whiteblaze, too. The ultralight mindset is fairly dominant here due in part to the unique aspects of AT backpacking: Frequent resupply, town visits, road crossings, motel rooms, and a heavy flow of fellow backpackers on the trail. Other backpacking forums deal more with actual wilderness backpacking and long winter treks whereas WB devolves into specific but boring topics such as localized parking opportunities at a thousand different trailheads, debilitating newbie gear lists, AT shelter minutiae, speed hiking in-awement, in-depth hammock and ultralight debates, and general non-wilderness backpacking discussions. But I like Whiteblaze as it's fast moving with many daily new posts. Generally speaking, WB.com (and the Appalachian Trail) reflects the current faddish interest in these aspects:
** A fascination with ultralight packs.
** A focus on tiny tents such as tarps and tarptents.
** Short snippet town-to-town backpacking where food loads rarely exceed five days.
** A raw enticement with moderately high daily miles walked.
** A lack of real hands-on winter backpacking expertise or in-depth long wilderness trips (it is the AT after all).
** Left field newbie/wannabe comments confusing issues with their imagined advice or solutions. And then to be true they vehemently argue their position with no real long term experience to back it up. This is a thruhiker's affliction too. Like in everything else, some people with minimal experience suddenly feel they are qualified experts since they touched the holy hem of the sacred field of study once and then quickly ran away. When they get to a computer it's easy for them to take their tiny worm of knowledge and create a misread and misinterpreted conclusion which they share with the world.
An excellent example of this is with gear reviews. How many times have we read this: "I love my new tent, and it's the best piece of gear I've gotten this year. It will hold up to anything nature has to offer and though it still sits unused in its stuff sack here in my apartment, I feel it's gonna be great!"Of course, there are thos out there who believe that their way is better than everyone else's and that if you spend 3/4 of a year in a sleeping bag on the trail your better than other hikers. To each their own, Tipi.
http://www.myinvestmentanalysis.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/aussie-haterade.gif
The whole concept of "I am [special]" is pretty much in their own heads ...
I don't care to have anything to do with through hikers who are full of themselves. What they are doing is not as big a deal as some of them imagine. Thousands have done it before them and thousands will after them when they go home and move on to other things.
The way many today hike in groups with cell phones and directories of hiker services makes it possible for them to avoid interaction with locals to a greater extent than was once possible and contributes to a sense of entitlement.
Many would benefit from taking time to talk with local people to learn more about communities near the A.T. and how it fits into the local landscape. Often, these local people know far more about the A.T. than other through hikers considered to be repositories of superior information and can help put the experience into its proper perspective.
Tipi Walter
04-03-2011, 11:44
HOOCH: No Haterade here and I don't gotta be hatin'. Just pointing out thoughts referenced by 10-K: "All about me." Or The Cleaner: "It's . . . . like if you're not thruhiking some hikers don't have much to say to section hikers."
Or this from Blissful: "I think when you see thruhikers further south they are not as conceited as up north. You should see the "I am god" thruhiker NOBO mentality to the SOBOs, especially in Maine."
Trail Bug: "Most of those I meet in NH and ME we called them Trains as they came thru in groups and thought the rest of us were trash."
Or Praha 4: " . . . I did see a race mentality that exists, too much emphasis on how many miles a day, how much are you beating so and so on the trail."
Are all these Haters too? But forget about thruhikers, the worst are SLACKPACKERS!!
While I like to socialize on long backpacking trips, especially during winter trips when backpackers are sparse, it doesn't take long before I'm burned out with the endless banter and chitchat and senseless harping and yakking and jabbering.
Most thruhikers are backpacking newbs at heart but often use a five month thruhike with 15 to 20 mile days as a justification to sound like salty experts and trail weary gurus. Five months backpacking on a trail does not a lifetime make, and most AT thruhikers are just scratching the bag night/outdoor surface, even though they hold tight to their chests the show-off notion that they are "thruhikers" by god, and a cut above all others (dayhikers, section hikers, etc). The proof of a thruhiker's expertise must come after the trail when a lifetime of bag nights await him. There's nothing much more distasteful than a thruhiker who thinks and acts like he's an Expert Trailsman and a Philosopher King of all things related to hiking and backpacking, and the longer and further his trip, the worse he gets.
Starting a thruhike on the AT could and maybe should be done in the winter, like December or January, as then you will see few if any thruhikers, and the backpackers who attempt it usually bail and cancel out.
The problem with your tirade is that an overwhelming number of hikers (whether they've completed the AT or not) do not define themselves in terms of "bag nights". They do their hikes and go home to their lives, where they are sometimes seen as hiking experts, rightly or wrongly. Stick men like you may teach us a bit of winter hiking trivia, but you have very little else to offer, except your distaste for newbs.
I think it's probably true wannabe thru-hikers are an enthusiastic bunch who tend to form groups on the trail and may even exclude others who are not pursuing the same goals. Seems natural to me to seek out like minded people, so I wouldn't take it personally.
Also, many times the "control" guy is not really self-appointed. A lot of groups of two or more hikers are thrilled to let the other guy do it.
Tipi Walter
04-03-2011, 12:00
Stick men like you may teach us a bit of winter hiking trivia, but you have very little else to offer, except your distaste for newbs.
it.
Here is another example of Whiteblaze-In-Action: Taking an impersonal discussion on hiking foibles and turning it personal. BTW, what's Stick Men?
I have to admit, the actions of someof the so-called "thru-hikers" was an embarrasment. I have seen the treatment afforded to section hikers at the shelters and some poor behavior in towns, hostels, etc. Two points I would encourage everyone to consider - most of the people on the trail referring to themselves as thru-hikers aren't (unless they have done it before) and probably won't be. as with most segments of the population, the "thru hiker" community shouldn't be viewed based on the actions a the vocal minority. 95% of the actual thru-hikers I have met were normal, socially adept people who were pursuing a life goal and weren't out to impress anyone.as the saying goes, it was just walking after all.
...Many would benefit from taking time to talk with local people to learn more about communities near the A.T. and how it fits into the local landscape. Often, these local people know far more about the A.T. than others through hiking believed to be repositories of superior information.
I've found that when I'm out for a day hike near where I summer in MA, the thrus are all but falling over me to get the local weather forecast. It's to the point that I'm tempted to print out the 3-day forecast before leaving the house. I've not found many to be curious about town info--they know about the hostels and don't look any further than that.
Tipi Walter
04-03-2011, 12:24
I have to admit, the actions of someof the so-called "thru-hikers" was an embarrasment. I have seen the treatment afforded to section hikers at the shelters and some poor behavior in towns, hostels, etc. Two points I would encourage everyone to consider - most of the people on the trail referring to themselves as thru-hikers aren't (unless they have done it before) and probably won't be. as with most segments of the population, the "thru hiker" community shouldn't be viewed based on the actions a the vocal minority. 95% of the actual thru-hikers I have met were normal, socially adept people who were pursuing a life goal and weren't out to impress anyone.as the saying goes, it was just walking after all.
In this vein, I'd say it's normal human ego to flaunt and puff up over certain "qualifications", whether they be in the high-mileage category or weight-carried category (or lack thereof) or days-out category or "I'm a thruhiker" category. We all get puffed up and proud over our accomplishments, just look at professional classical musicians or college professors or trail-loving backpackers. Backpackers are not immune to ego and ambition. God knows I go on and on with my trail journals with more and more fotogs and trip reports.
Jim Adams
04-03-2011, 12:30
These 2 entries sum it up pretty good....no matter what your thoughts are at the start, the woods changes you in time. Very good posts!
As far as the race mentality...it just happens. Some need to finish by a certain date, others just want to finish but either way, when you get close to the end of your journey almost everyone speeds up.
geek
Jim Adams
04-03-2011, 12:31
I hiked alone most of the way, and would hang out for a bit at night with people at the shelter. I preferred it that way. If I was hiking behind someone, I felt they were slowing me down a bit, and if I hiked in front of someone, I felt I had to keep a certain pace up. I learned all this on my monthlong section in 2009, so on my thru, I pretty much hiked alone the whole way. I did see people, of course, and would stop and chat, but overall, I wanted to hike alone.
I felt privileged to be out there, I did consider it a wonderful adventure and an amazing experience, and overall, it was. I met many great people, and ate a lot of great food. I talked with section hikers many times at shelters, and I never got the feeling that they thought I was better than them. People have different lives, some have houses, and cars, I choose not to have all that stuff so I can leave whenever I want, and go wherever.
#25 and #27 were the 2 entries that I thought I multi quoted. Sorry
geek
"Great adventures" are totally self-defined except for the vain. Not sure by what standard an AT thru hike is not a great adventure. But lording it over folks is a bit much. Four of us leave for our small section hike in a month, and though it is child's play to many, for us 40 something newbs with careers and families, I can assure you it is a great adventure. Most likely, as with most endeavors, after we do it we'll want more. One day we too may consider a week long hike child's play and want more. I don't care what the label is, it promises to be a milestone for us. It's all where you are experience-wise.
These 2 entries sum it up pretty good....no matter what your thoughts are at the start, the woods changes you in time. Very good posts!
As far as the race mentality...it just happens. Some need to finish by a certain date, others just want to finish but either way, when you get close to the end of your journey almost everyone speeds up.
geek
I don't remember where I saw it but I do recall seeing this scrawled on an AT shelter wall: "I hike, therefore I am".
I have to admit, the actions of someof the so-called "thru-hikers" was an embarrasment. I have seen the treatment afforded to section hikers at the shelters and some poor behavior in towns, hostels, etc. .
The worse thing I've ever seen a hiker do is get into a shouting match with a postal worker at the post office because the postal worker couldn't answer specific questions about post offices further up the trail.
There was a line of 5-6 other hikers and local residents and you could just see the way people were cringing watching it happen.
But, more to the point of my starter post - I didn't mean to start hating on thru-hikers (or each other!). I was just reflecting on how each year's crop of hikers are so caught up in their own journey/drama that they don't realize nobody real cares but them.
When you leave town, you're forgotten almost immediately when you leave. Next year it'll be someone else and every year it repeats.
I've found that when I'm out for a day hike near where I summer in MA, the thrus are all but falling over me to get the local weather forecast. It's to the point that I'm tempted to print out the 3-day forecast before leaving the house.
I once got an earful for not posting the local weather forecast at 501 Shelter from a through hiker who wasn't travelling in a pack with multiple cell phones.:D
One day we too may consider a week long hike child's play and want more. I don't care what the label is, it promises to be a milestone for us. It's all where you are experience-wise.
In more than one way I think a week is about perfect for a backpacking trip.
I would 100x rather take 6 one week trips a year than 1 six week trip.
SassyWindsor
04-03-2011, 15:22
Check back with them when(or if) they get to New Hampshire or Maine.
You can always pick out the Control Person. He/She's the one standing over a map with a guidebook and sometimes a pen and paper doing math while everyone else is just sitting around having fun.
That is the fun for some people. (Control People that is)
A number of years ago there were partiers among the hikers, lately I've been seeing a few hikers among the partiers.
If there weren't any shelters and a lot less "trail magic" I think things would soon revert to the way they once were.
Of course, I did my growing up during the 1960s and '70s, and I was a "woods hippie" in love with nature. :D
Blue Jay
04-07-2011, 18:48
There's nothing much more distasteful than a thruhiker who thinks and acts like he's an Expert Trailsman and a Philosopher King of all things related to hiking and backpacking, and the longer and further his trip, the worse he gets.
I section hike the AT around a 1000 miles almost every year for the past 10. I can honestly say I've never run into a thru like this description. Cyberhikers yes, thrus never. There was one who pissed everyone off with specific ultalight BS but even that is very rare.
I loved my thru-hike. It was all about me. Absolutely all about me, after a decade of the Marine Corps. I loved the Corps, but it was an awesome experience to hike at my own pace, carry what I wanted, walk when I wanted, enjoy perfect personal freedom. Even so, by the time I reached Maine, I was ready to be done, and I plowed through that last 200 miles as quickly as I could. I guess it's the nature of the beast.
But hiking the AT is unlike any other walk I've done, whether it be weekend trips, week-long trips, shorter thru-hikes like the Colorado Trail, or a month spent covering no more than 150 miles on a NOLS course where I busted snow, fly-fished, bushwhacked, and enjoyed more intense "wilderness" skills. It's a different monster, and I'm OK with that.
All this discussion about "Control People" has me thinking about seeing that role in regular life. There are different types of Control People, and I imagine it's the same on the trail. Sometimes one person (or worse, when there are two in one group) just needs to have a plan, a schedule, and everything all worked out, and then tries to make the group follow.
Sometimes the group just NEEDS someone to step up and set at least a mild goal, or it'll just sit around and do nothing. Having no control person can be a drag, because everyone's waiting for someone else to take the first step. Having an overcontroller is bad too, because they get frustrated about the group not making enough progress, or they try to micromanage.
I've been Control Person in both school/work and casual environments. If a group has a leader/cohesion without me stepping up, then I'm happy to just go with the flow. Being control person sucks if you take it too seriously. But sometimes you need someone who will get up early, read the map, and say "come on guys, let's get going." And as long as you've got a smile and a laugh, I don't see what's wrong with being that guy (girl). :)
I finally decided, after months of thinking about it, to just get on the AT again. Leave college for now, and see where my wandering will take me over the years. I have sold or gotten rid of my stuff, which wasn't much at all, and am giving this comp to a friend when I leave. Everything I own will be in my pack.
This took a lot of thought, but I knew I would never be truly happy until I follow this tangent to its conclusion. I am not happy with the "prizes" society offers, I have to do what makes me happy.
Wow! You have courage! I wish you all the best and secretly envy you like you would not believe.
I hiked in 2008 and 2009. I was never really a thru-hiker exactly, but I was part of the whole community. I got really into it in 2008. In 2009, I hiked in front of the herd and met mostly section hikers. I actually really enjoyed the section hikers. They had a different way about them that I just enjoyed. I went back for another small section in 2010. I found the thru-hiker community almost annoying in a way. I had had such a profound experience hiking alone in 2009 that all that who's ahead/who's behind yakking about trail magic and whatever kind of bored me. In 2010 I found myself standing on the porch of the hotel in Mt. Laguna listening to all this yakking, looking at the trail and it suddenly hit me: It's the trail I love, not the thru-hiker culture. I said see-ya and hit the trail.
That's not to say I don't like thru-hikers or thru-hiker culture. I do. I really get into it sometimes, but what I really like is the trail and the solitude and I will choose the trail over the hiker culture any day.
By the way, 10-K, I think I know what you are really trying to say which has little to do with what anybody here is talking about, including me. For each year's thrus, the year is all about them. Next year it'll be all about a new batch. It's all so fleeting. It seems so huge and real and important the year you are doing it and then it's gone, over, ephemeral, and you are replaced with all new people doing exactly what you were doing thinking exactly what you were thinking. Both all about you and not about you at all.
By the way, 10-K, I think I know what you are really trying to say which has little to do with what anybody here is talking about, including me. For each year's thrus, the year is all about them. Next year it'll be all about a new batch. It's all so fleeting. It seems so huge and real and important the year you are doing it and then it's gone, over, ephemeral, and you are replaced with all new people doing exactly what you were doing thinking exactly what you were thinking. Both all about you and not about you at all.
Thank you Diane.. :)
none of the hikers in Georgia would believe you if you told them now, that thru hiking and completeing the AT isn't that big of deal in the big picture. I thought it was for a while, but it wore off after a few years,lol. I'm with you sbhikes, i love THE TRAILS, i burned out or out grew the sub culture part of it. Our first or second night in 1995 a guy from Alaska came into the shelter, ate dinner looked at our map, offered us any of his gear and walked out to the road. Came all the way from Alaska to hike for 8 hours, mindblowing
none of the hikers in Georgia would believe you if you told them now, that thru hiking and completeing the AT isn't that big of deal in the big picture. I thought it was for a while, but it wore off after a few years,lol. I'm with you sbhikes, i love THE TRAILS, i burned out or out grew the sub culture part of it. Our first or second night in 1995 a guy from Alaska came into the shelter, ate dinner looked at our map, offered us any of his gear and walked out to the road. Came all the way from Alaska to hike for 8 hours, mindblowing
Ah, you reminded me of something I had completely forgotten! There was a SOBO at the AT Lodge in Millinocket who came all the way from Utah to hike the trail.
He spent the night at Kathadin Stream CG in BSP, climbed Kathadin, came down and hitched right back out to Millinocket and went back home.
He said that he might try again one day but not now...
tjforrester
04-08-2011, 23:49
So, this weekend I hiked Allen's Gap to Devil's Fork Gap and back and saw over 20 thru hikers.
I spent some time at Little Laurel shelter eating lunch with a few and I couldn't help but reflect on this being the 4th year of thru hikers I've seen on the AT.
As an observation, I couldn't help but notice how caught up in it they were, about all the trail magic they had received, who was ahead of them, who was behind them, how many miles they were doing, etc. etc, etc, etc., etc.
This time last year there was a completely different bunch out there doing the same thing, thinking the same things, talking about the same things - and now they're all back in their regular lives and many of them may never hike again.
And the cycle will repeat again this year.... For now and for them, it's "All about me." and I guess that's the way it's supposed to be.
Also, it's good to see that the role of "Control Person" is still in effect. Ever notice how there is always one person in a group hiking together that needs to be in charge of "Central Planning and Control"? :-)
Thru-hiker mentality, that focus that keeps a hiker on the trail, is a wonderful thing. It keeps you out there, doing what you love, for months at a time. That's not to suggest a thru-hike is better than a section hike. Section hiking is cool, too. The hiking mentalities are different, that's all.
I thru-hike in a group of one, and there is no such thing as central planning and control. I get up when I want, hike as long as I want, and camp when I want. It's a freeing experience.
Trailbender
04-09-2011, 00:06
none of the hikers in Georgia would believe you if you told them now, that thru hiking and completeing the AT isn't that big of deal in the big picture.
It is a huge deal, actually. Not many people in America can walk 2200 miles. It isn't just that, it is more fulfilling than anything society offers, a house, car, ect. I don't want anything that is going to keep me in one spot, like a home.
Mountain Mike
04-09-2011, 03:47
It is a huge deal, actually. Not many people in America can walk 2200 miles. It isn't just that, it is more fulfilling than anything society offers, a house, car, ect. I don't want anything that is going to keep me in one spot, like a home.
I agree it is a huge deal. I never belittle section hikers. I feel doing it their way is much harder. To hike for a week or two, you just start getting your hiking legs in shape when you have to quit. But you do get to meet a whole lot more people.
Thru hiking the AT for me was being a part of a comunity hikin north.Some would surge ahead or drop behind at times. It was like mined people with a common quest. Friendships came quickly & some last to this day. Giving help when needed. There was always room to fit another person in the shelter or we could figure out some way to make it work. Section hikers were just another hiker. Someone else out to enjoy the wilderness.
I think that is the way most of us hike. I was really offened a couple of year ago in VA when shelter was full when a few hikers came in and asked if any of us had tents because they were thru hikers. If you are a real thru-hiker you can do it on your own. No special rights or privilages.
It is a huge deal, actually. Not many people in America can walk 2200 miles. It isn't just that, it is more fulfilling than anything society offers, a house, car, ect. I don't want anything that is going to keep me in one spot, like a home.
It isn't the highlite of your life and if it is, it's over then what? It takes that singleminded mentality to complete a thru and it may take a while for that to wear off. But life goes on
I agree doing a thru is a huge deal, otherwise why would we all be so fixated on it? But it's really a personal thing, for the hiker themselves. I think what AndyB meant is the a thru-hiker shouldn't expect the rest of society to give a damn, or to make special accommodations for them. I totally agree it's offensive and repugnant to have a thru asking people to move out of a shelter so they can sleep inside. But to do a thru is a huge deal to me. I've section hiked all over, and love it, would happily do it the rest of my life, but I always kind of wanted to do a thru. Now the timing in my life suddenly works out that I can, and I'm jumping on it. The last weeks as I've been planning for the trip have been energizing for me in a way that planning a section hike never was (and I LOVE planning section hikes!). For me, it's huge. For my friends and family, I don't really expect them to make it a big deal or anything. For the people I meet along the way I'd be a little embarrassed if they made a big deal of it. I'll happily accept trail magic with gratitude, but I sure don't expect it or think I'm entitled to it any more than a section hiker is. YMMV
Mountain Mike
04-09-2011, 05:29
It isn't the highlite of your life and if it is, it's over then what? It takes that singleminded mentality to complete a thru and it may take a while for that to wear off. But life goes on
It is a highlite of my life & yes my life did go on. Still keep in touch with frinds I made on the trail. Many more than I would have made in such a short time off it. Things I learned on the trail: Not to judge people by their looks. Cheish each and every momonent. When things are bad, make the best of it. If things get really bad- they will get better. It take a lot of different mentalities to finish a thru hike. You have to plan then overcome for unplanned & adapt to it. It's life expierince & knowledge.
yes, what I was trying to say is, it's a great personal goal and life experience, but the rest of the world doesn't care or doesn't get it. I too cherish a the time I had on the Trail and the friends I met. Maybe my view is from a bad rentry or seeing too much entitlement and attitude as a RidgeRunner in the subsequent years after I thrued. I hiked, i liked, and now I'm working on putting together an E2E for 2012.
Either way the trail is there for everyone from ,Boy Scouts, Day hikers, Bridwatchers, section hikers and Thru hikers.
Enjoy
Andy
Trailbender
04-09-2011, 08:42
I agree doing a thru is a huge deal, otherwise why would we all be so fixated on it? But it's really a personal thing, for the hiker themselves. I think what AndyB meant is the a thru-hiker shouldn't expect the rest of society to give a damn, or to make special accommodations for them. I totally agree it's offensive and repugnant to have a thru asking people to move out of a shelter so they can sleep inside. But to do a thru is a huge deal to me. I've section hiked all over, and love it, would happily do it the rest of my life, but I always kind of wanted to do a thru. Now the timing in my life suddenly works out that I can, and I'm jumping on it. The last weeks as I've been planning for the trip have been energizing for me in a way that planning a section hike never was (and I LOVE planning section hikes!). For me, it's huge. For my friends and family, I don't really expect them to make it a big deal or anything. For the people I meet along the way I'd be a little embarrassed if they made a big deal of it. I'll happily accept trail magic with gratitude, but I sure don't expect it or think I'm entitled to it any more than a section hiker is. YMMV
I'll be on the trail at the beginning of May, might see you out there. I actually preferred my tent over a shelter, honestly. I met several section hikers I hung out with at the shelter for a couple hundred miles, I never looked down on them, and didn't see any thrus I was around doing anything to them either. We are all out there to enjoy being in the woods and seeing nature.
It is a huge deal, actually. Not many people in America can walk 2200 miles. It isn't just that, it is more fulfilling than anything society offers, a house, car, ect. I don't want anything that is going to keep me in one spot, like a home.
Actually, I think most people could walk 2200 miles. It doesn't take anything extraordinary to be capable of it. It's just that people don't do it for whatever reasons.
It is true that it's more fulfilling than most of what society offers. Our society has become rather exhausting. I find it nearly unbearable. A thru-hike or long distance hike is a real respite. I can see the allure of dropping out.
A thru hike/2000 miler is a wonderful acomplishment, requires a special commitment and is brutally self indulgent but it is just the pebble tossed in the pond, A highlight of your life not THE highlight of your life.
Big Dawg
04-09-2011, 15:08
A friend and I started section hiking the trail years ago, and then he decided to leave the corporate world and thru'd in 07. It was great to be a part of his hike, as I joined him for the first 30 starting at Amicalola, 50 into Damascus, picked him up in Duncannon for a drive back & good times at Trail Days, and finally summited Katahdin!
During our previous section hikes, we would discuss the interactions of various thru hikers, some casual, cool, & carefree, and some snobbish. It was always annoying to meet the conceited know it all's. What was extremely surprising was when my friend thru'd, he became the conceited thru hiker. He would talk about he and his thru friends having to share shelters w/ lowly section hikers. I was floored, especially considering I was and still am a section hiker. He would always laugh and say I was an honorary thru in his eyes, and his thru friends, saying they didn't look at me in the same way as a regular sectioner. I gave him a hard time, letting him know how shallow that thinking was. Ultimately we didn't make it into a bigger deal, and just let it roll off our backs, agreeing to disagree. I'm still surprised how quick his thinking changed upon becoming a thru. I vow to stay my same humble hiking self when I thru in 2028.
Anyone who even attempts a hike is a winner in my book. :)
Trailbender
04-09-2011, 18:52
A thru hike/2000 miler is a wonderful acomplishment, requires a special commitment and is brutally self indulgent but it is just the pebble tossed in the pond, A highlight of your life not THE highlight of your life.
So, what would THE highlight of someone's life be, then? Buying a house, getting married, having kids? Those things are great for most people, but not my thing. Hiking all the time is a huge part of who I am. I love being in the woods, and outdoors in general.
To be honest, a thru hike is a lot more than most people will ever accomplish. High school, college, stuck in a gray box for 20-30 years, retire, enjoy a few years of life, then die. Not for me, I knew that a long time ago.
A thru hike/2000 miler is a wonderful acomplishment, requires a special commitment and is brutally self indulgent but it is just the pebble tossed in the pond, A highlight of your life not THE highlight of your life.
Well said. Life after hiking isn't necessarily all downhill from there. If I thought like that I'd be depressed all the time.
buff_jeff
04-09-2011, 20:17
So, what would THE highlight of someone's life be, then? Buying a house, getting married, having kids? Those things are great for most people, but not my thing. Hiking all the time is a huge part of who I am. I love being in the woods, and outdoors in general.
To be honest, a thru hike is a lot more than most people will ever accomplish. High school, college, stuck in a gray box for 20-30 years, retire, enjoy a few years of life, then die. Not for me, I knew that a long time ago.
I think it's always a good thing to find the right balance between the two. Is living on the trail your whole life really so desirable? Seems pretty lame to me. Hiking and being outdoors is also important to me, but If I can get a solid 2-3 week trip augmented by some weekend and maybe week-long trips in every year, I'm happy. That's why I'm trying to be a teacher. I want to have a career and be able to hike, not be a loser absolutely attached to the trail.
There are challenging and rewarding things to do in the "real world," too. To me, hiking is only fun if I have worked for it. Just like you don't truly appreciate spring without the winter, I don't appreciate the freedom of the trail without having some other attachment to escape from.
I haven't thru-hiked (I sectioned the trail 2007-2010), but hiking it was probably the most fun and rewarding thing I have ever done. Does my life stop there? No. I am going to thru-hike one of the "other two" eventually, and I'm going to make the outdoors a huge part of my life, but it isn't the only part.
The Counselor
04-09-2011, 20:49
^^^^^Wise. (outside of the judgment of others aspect)
Trailbender
04-09-2011, 21:26
I want to have a career and be able to hike, not be a loser absolutely attached to the trail.
Not a loser, thanks. I don't see how following my dreams would make that the case. I really don't care for a career, honestly, money doesn't mean all that much to me. I also don't want to be chained down by a house and a ton of other possessions.
Section hiker or thru hiker. I didn't want to be pigeoon-holed, so I created a new category.
I am a relay hiker, see here- http://www.homesforourtroops.org/goto/americanhero.hikers
There were more than a few thru hikers who didn't have much to say to me until they understood what I meant by relay-hiker. That really helped break the ice. I got a LOT of positive response after that.
I think it's always a good thing to find the right balance between the two. Is living on the trail your whole life really so desirable? Seems pretty lame to me. Hiking and being outdoors is also important to me, but If I can get a solid 2-3 week trip augmented by some weekend and maybe week-long trips in every year, I'm happy.
That about sums it up for me too. I enjoy running my business and learning about things besides hiking.
I like spending time with my family and puttering around the house.
I enjoy, in what I think is a healthy way, a certain amount of materialism - I like my toys.
I like to have more money than I need to just survive and I like to have extra money to donate to various causes that are important to me.
For me, and just speaking for myself, living on the trail would be the ultimate one dimensional experience and I'd be pretty unhappy in short order.
Trailbender
04-09-2011, 22:52
That about sums it up for me too. I enjoy running my business and learning about things besides hiking.
I like spending time with my family and puttering around the house.
I enjoy, in what I think is a healthy way, a certain amount of materialism - I like my toys.
I like to have more money than I need to just survive and I like to have extra money to donate to various causes that are important to me.
For me, and just speaking for myself, living on the trail would be the ultimate one dimensional experience and I'd be pretty unhappy in short order.
Like I said, everyone is different. I don't know how long I will be out there, maybe a year, maybe 10, who knows? For me, being on the trail is fulfilling enough by itself. I have been hiking for years, but other than that, I have lived in society, paid rent, had a car, ect. It just feels fake and hollow. I have seen what "normal" life has to offer, and I am just not interested. That does not make it wrong, or incorrect, or anything else. It is just not for me.
buff_jeff
04-09-2011, 22:55
Not a loser, thanks. I don't see how following my dreams would make that the case. I really don't care for a career, honestly, money doesn't mean all that much to me. I also don't want to be chained down by a house and a ton of other possessions.
Loser was a terrible word choice and it wasn't directed at you. For that, I'm sorry. I agree that the materialism that pervades our society is pretty sickening but, hey, we're both on computers right now, so...
Honestly, there is absolutely nothing wrong with following your dreams. I just find it funny that people hike the AT, PCT, or CDT and then all of a sudden they think they're John Muir. The thing is, these trails are inherently "artificial." They exist by government fiat, are maintained by hundreds of volunteers, and pass in close proximity to "society." All the equipment you use, the money necessary to hike the trail in the first place, and the towns along the way are the product of an industrialized society. The AT doesn't exist if not for the millions of working Americans. Something like it is only feasible in an industrialized society. I mean, you don't see well-maintained hiking trails in third world countries.
After reading Pirate's Facebook page about this year's crop passing through Neel's Gap, I'm glad I hermit hike and don't need a " Control Person".
For real me too
buff_jeff
04-09-2011, 23:01
That about sums it up for me too. I enjoy running my business and learning about things besides hiking.
I like spending time with my family and puttering around the house.
I enjoy, in what I think is a healthy way, a certain amount of materialism - I like my toys.
I like to have more money than I need to just survive and I like to have extra money to donate to various causes that are important to me.
For me, and just speaking for myself, living on the trail would be the ultimate one dimensional experience and I'd be pretty unhappy in short order.
I absolutely agree. I feel that life is ultimately just a series of experiences (deep, man). I want to be a part of as many as I possibly can. College was a great time; section hiking the AT was awesome; traveling to Israel and Jordan was an interesting experience...there are many things that I want to do in the future. I think it'd be great to have a rewarding career and family life on top of some awesome adventures.
I experienced the "society sucks, man!" attitude after doing a long 2+ month section hike of the AT about three years ago. I grew out of it, fortunately.
Trailbender
04-09-2011, 23:09
I experienced the "society sucks, man!" attitude after doing a long 2+ month section hike of the AT about three years ago. I grew out of it, fortunately.
I have felt this way my whole life, pretty much, it is not a sudden thing I just thought of after my thru. If I felt that working at McDonald's was personally fulfilling, I would do it the rest of my life. That is just an example, but you got to follow what makes you happy. I am not locking myself into this for life, I will see how things go, and see what happens. I am not against capitalism, but I think people take things way to excess, that is the issue, not money in itself.
buff_jeff
04-09-2011, 23:18
I have felt this way my whole life, pretty much, it is not a sudden thing I just thought of after my thru. If I felt that working at McDonald's was personally fulfilling, I would do it the rest of my life. That is just an example, but you got to follow what makes you happy. I am not locking myself into this for life, I will see how things go, and see what happens. I am not against capitalism, but I think people take things way to excess, that is the issue, not money in itself.
Go for it, man. I wish I was at a point where I could realistically do a thru-hike, but the Reserves gets in the way of that. I'm thankful to be heading out on Wednesday to hike the Loyalsock Trail.
I didn't mean to be a dick in my previous posts, if I came across that way. :D
ScrapIron
04-09-2011, 23:33
Different strokes for different folks, folks.
Actually, I think most people could walk 2200 miles. It doesn't take anything extraordinary to be capable of it.
be a bit perplexing. The data says that 75 - 80% of the people who even attempt to do so can't finish (for whatever reason). A far greater number of people would never even make the attempt . Your statement is contrary to available data.
be a bit perplexing. The data says that 75 - 80% of the people who even attempt to do so can't finish (for whatever reason). A far greater number of people would never even make the attempt . Your statement is contrary to available data.
I took it to mean that most people are probably physically capable of walking 2200 miles - contrasted to something like say... most people are NOT capable of writing a hit song or a best selling novel.
I think most people of hiking age probably will manage to walk 2200 miles over their lifetime - around the house, mall, mowing the grass, etc....
Trailbender
04-10-2011, 10:38
most people are NOT capable of writing a hit song or a best selling novel.
I would say with the hit song thing today, with what passes as good music, anyone could do it. Most of the mainstream music that sells millions is crappy and sucks, rap is a great example.
Entropy2012
04-10-2011, 11:16
I would say with the hit song thing today, with what passes as good music, anyone could do it. Most of the mainstream music that sells millions is crappy and sucks, rap is a great example.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CD2LRROpph0
I think this pretty much concludes that point. :p
And hey, I've got a lot of respect for what you're doing. Frankly, I'm a little sick of the whole 9-5 career routine that gets imposed on everyone with any deviation from that 'norm' being regarded as idiocy. Hell, out here when I tell people I'm planning a thru-hike they flip out like I've just told them I was going to jump under a bus! If it's what makes you happy, why not go for it? You only live once after all.
I took it to mean that most people are probably physically capable of walking 2200 miles - contrasted to something like say... most people are NOT capable of writing a hit song or a best selling novel.
I think most people of hiking age probably will manage to walk 2200 miles over their lifetime - around the house, mall, mowing the grass, etc....
If that is what was intended, then yes I agree with point. If it was meant that most people could do 2200 miles in one stretch, then the data says otherwise and it is a fairly large sample size.
People with physical infirmities of all kinds have overcome them to become 2000 milers. Bob Barker is but one example. There are plenty of others.
For one reason or another, 70-80 percent don't complete the through hike they set out to complete. Some of them realize it's not what they expected. Others return to finish at a later time.
Powder River
04-10-2011, 20:02
not aimed at you, but I was uncomfortable when other hikers I met last year identified themselves by saying "I'm just a section hiker".I heard that alot. I wish people wouldn't label themselves as section hikers or thru-hikers out there. as someone else said, most of the ones identifying themselves as thru-hikers are going to be section hikers at the end of the day. i always told others who asked that I was attempting a thru-hike and was comfortable with that. in retrospect, most of the people that did finish were not the pompous, boastful type anyhow. That crowd gets weeded out most of the time before Harper's Ferry.
It bothered me too that people refered to themselves as "just" section hikers. However it also struck me as odd when a thru hiker would say he was "going as far as he can," or something similar. A thru hiker has to be humble and ready to accept failure. But that is different than ones determination to finish. I would always confidently reply that I was going to Maine, because I believed it. I know more than one hiker who never sounded too confident about finishing, who also dropped off the trail.
. A thru hiker has to be humble and ready to accept failure. But that is different than ones determination to finish. I would always confidently reply that I was going to Maine, because I believed it. I know more than one hiker who never sounded too confident about finishing, who also dropped off the trail.
In my innermost thoughts, I knew I would not quit. however, I was a bit leery of some unforeseen illness, injury or some other event outside of my control causing me to get off trail (saw this happen to other hikers attempting a thru). So I never said with certainty that I was a thru-hiker while on the trail and don't see how anyone can or could.
Jerryatric
04-11-2011, 11:25
I had planned a thru hike in 2005, but a job opportunity put an end to those plans, and I was really disappointed. My wife kept telling me that I could still go ahead and do the trail in sections, but I told her that it "wouldn't be the same". As is almost always the case, she was right and I was wrong. I've been hiking the trail since 2006, aiming for about 500 miles each trip (summer) but sometimes only making it 200-300 miles due to injury, etc. I've had a great time, and look forward to my annual six or seven week adventure all year. I also get really tired of freeze-dried food, sleeping on the floor, etc. after about six weeks, and am always ready to go home. I'll return to Hanover in August, where I got off last October, and hopefully complete the trail this autumn. I'm now 64 years old, and my hike isn't about "pushing on" to "make the miles"......it's about enjoying the journey. I generally average about 13 miles per day, and have only seldom done 20+.I take a zero day about once each week. I've slack packed a few times, but I've passed every white blaze on the trail....I really believe in hiking the trail "your way". I agree that a some of the thru hikers seem to have a bit of disdain for section hikers, but I wouldn't trade my experiences for any of theirs.....I'm having a blast, and it's lasted six years now (counting this year) and 48 years if you count the first time I hiked the AT from Davenport Gap to Fontana Dam.
sherrill
04-11-2011, 12:44
Three years ago I had a thru hiker tell me my 83 hike no longer counted.
Three years ago I had a thru hiker tell me my 83 hike no longer counted.
where you are from. The statue of limitations for thru-hikes varies by state. that idiot probably assumed that just because his state had a 10 year limitation or whatever that it was the same everywhere. ignorance of the law is no excuse for people like that.;)
sheepdog
04-11-2011, 13:04
People with physical infirmities of all kinds have overcome them to become 2000 milers. Bob Barker is but one example. There are plenty of others.
For one reason or another, 70-80 percent don't complete the through hike they set out to complete. Some of them realize it's not what they expected. Others return to finish at a later time.
He had to do something after the "Price is Right" ;)
Blue Jay
04-13-2011, 06:41
Three years ago I had a thru hiker tell me my 83 hike no longer counted.
Actually that is true, cell phones were not yet invented.:banana
Three years ago I had a thru hiker tell me my 83 hike no longer counted.
That's a new one.
How much longer do I have before my thru-hike expires? :)
Acting rude and self-important is, simply put, bad. But there is something special about thru-hiking it: spending 6-7 months walking. Especially those thru-hikers that decide to sleep in tents instead of bugging some local to drive them to a motel. The main aspect of hiking is hiking, and going home to bath salts and starbucks and 5-lane highways takes something from the experience, something very basic and simple that fundamentally changes the hike.
be a bit perplexing. The data says that 75 - 80% of the people who even attempt to do so can't finish (for whatever reason). A far greater number of people would never even make the attempt . Your statement is contrary to available data.
I simply meant that hiking a long distance is not a super-human feat and it certainly doesn't make anyone special.
88BlueGT
04-28-2011, 13:59
How many times have we read this: "I love my new tent, and it's the best piece of gear I've gotten this year. It will hold up to anything nature has to offer and though it still sits unused in its stuff sack here in my apartment, I feel it's gonna be great!"
bwuahaha :D sounds like.............................................. .................................................. ................................
As an observation, I couldn't help but notice how caught up in it they were, about all the trail magic they had received, who was ahead of them, who was behind them, how many miles they were doing, etc. etc, etc, etc., etc.
.... For now and for them, it's "All about me." and I guess that's the way it's supposed to be. - 10-k
Maybe not! Hiking doesn't have to be that way - It's ALL about me.
Indeed, in some ways thru-hiking has to involve a greater self-awareness, personal responsibility, and independence. As in life, hiking, rarely entails someone else always holding your hand and directing all your steps. BUT, it doesn't have to be a totally selfish endeavor either!
Hiking leads me to believe that life is more connected than I initially realized. For me, when hiking I feel more connected and aware of other species and the universe, not just aware of/focused on myself or the human species or condition. Hiking helps me to be aware of and remember that it's not just about me and that I'm part of someting larger. It also has come full circle. Hiking has been a vehicle for me to not only gain a greater appreciation of other species and the universe, but also the human race and condition too. As a result, I feel more humbled and connected than ever, not more selfish!
I think what 10-K really meant by "all about me" was that it's like being seniors in high school. They are having that kind of experience. This is their year. They are writing the history of the trail for this year, becoming part of the legend of the trail. Their names will be in the trail registers and memories for all eternity. And it's all-consuming for their lives right now. Nothing else exists for them in the world than who they are and what they're doing right now.
Cookerhiker
04-28-2011, 18:03
Just wanted to say that when I finished the AT by section-hiking all of Maine in '05 (http://www.trailjournals.com/cookerhiker2005), I was with thruhikers - all of them young - the whole time. I detected hardly any trace of snobbery or condescension towards a "mere section hiker" and within 2-3 days, it was as if I was part of the "class." Of course most of them got ahead of me although remarkably as some of them slowed down - probably out of reluctance that their journey was almost ending - I actually summited with 5-6 of the thrus that I had met in the first week.
I had done hundreds of miles section-hiking that year and knew some of their other trail buddies which may have helped somewhat but in any case, I almost felt like an insider.
And BTW, 2 weeks ago I met 2 NOBO thruhikers on my SOBO section hike from Duncannon to Harpers Ferry. Both were striding rapidly but when I initiated conversation, both took the time for a chat, posed for a photo, and didn't at all appear impatient or standoffish.
I simply meant that hiking a long distance is not a super-human feat and it certainly doesn't make anyone special.
walk 2200 miles. I pointed out that there is data to the contrary - i.e. 75 to 80% of those who even attempt to do so do not finish (to say nothing about those who would not even make the attempt). I did not say anything about "super human" or doing so "made one special" if you read my post accurately. How do you reconcile your statement which flies in the face of available data? I'm curious.
walk 2200 miles. I pointed out that there is data to the contrary - i.e. 75 to 80% of those who even attempt to do so do not finish (to say nothing about those who would not even make the attempt). I did not say anything about "super human" or doing so "made one special" if you read my post accurately. How do you reconcile your statement which flies in the face of available data? I'm curious.
I wonder what would happen to the percentages if $100,000 cash prizes were awarded to anyone who finished?
IMO, the reason most people who start don't finish isn't because of a physical limitation but rather "the bloom comes off the rose" mentally and people just get sick of it on some level.
One thing to remember is that human beings are masters of self-deception - we can come up with some very plausible reasons to justify almost anything given enough time to think about it.
I wonder what would happen to the percentages if $100,000 cash prizes were awarded to anyone who finished?
IMO, the reason most people who start don't finish isn't because of a physical limitation but rather "the bloom comes off the rose" mentally and people just get sick of it on some level.
One thing to remember is that human beings are masters of self-deception - we can come up with some very plausible reasons to justify almost anything given enough time to think about it.
if there was a cash prize. The vast majority of the people who get off (that I saw) are physically capable to do a thru (unless of illness/injury). as is said here often, it's the mental aspect that's the deal breaker for most.For the poster who claimed most anybody could do it (when the overwhelming evidence says otherwise) I don't think he or she is taking that aspect of a 2200 mile hike into account and I remain curious as the rationale behind her comment.
njordan2
04-29-2011, 08:10
I have never thru hiked the A.T. and probably never will.
I do consider those that hike over 2,000 miles in one season to approach super human status. It certainly makes them special.
During my section hikes over the years, I have met many thru hikers. Yes, there is a certain mentality that one must have to be successful at a one season thru hike of the A.T. and one can not hide that mentallity. It is really neither good nor bad, just necessary for the task at hand.
I see the same mentality in many other places that require the one performing the task to be almost 100% responsible for the outcome, regardless of the actions of those around him. For example, stop by a college campus on a Saturday night and go into the library. You would think everyone in there was an A.T. through hiker.
If you have ever worked with tool makers/machinists, the same mind set is displayed. Watch some one driving to work when they are running a little bit late, not so late that they will necessarily be late for work - just late enough that if they do everything right, go just a little bit faster and nobody messes with them, they just might make it on time. They look the same as a thru hiker.
I think one just wears their game face for 6 months.
sherrill
04-29-2011, 09:03
It just takes one wrong step or a fall to turn a thru hiker into just a long section hiker.
Just wanted to say that when I finished the AT by section-hiking all of Maine in '05 (http://www.trailjournals.com/cookerhiker2005), I was with thruhikers - all of them young - the whole time. I detected hardly any trace of snobbery or condescension towards a "mere section hiker" and within 2-3 days, it was as if I was part of the "class." Of course most of them got ahead of me although remarkably as some of them slowed down - probably out of reluctance that their journey was almost ending - I actually summited with 5-6 of the thrus that I had met in the first week.
I had done hundreds of miles section-hiking that year and knew some of their other trail buddies which may have helped somewhat but in any case, I almost felt like an insider.
And BTW, 2 weeks ago I met 2 NOBO thruhikers on my SOBO section hike from Duncannon to Harpers Ferry. Both were striding rapidly but when I initiated conversation, both took the time for a chat, posed for a photo, and didn't at all appear impatient or standoffish.
I find your experience to be the norm. At our hostel over 90% of thruhikers are open and encouraging to those doing sections.
I find your experience to be the norm. At our hostel over 90% of thruhikers are open and encouraging to those doing sections.
Yeah, but I think the reason is that Manchester Center puts a "Be Nice" spell on people.
p.s. Next year I plan to hike the Long Trail and spend at least a few days in your wonderful community.
Southern Skies
04-29-2011, 23:29
I just finished a 90 mile section hike from GA to NOC a few weeks ago. Everyone but one person was super cool to me as a "mere section hiker." But the one bad apple in the bunch was enough to leave a bad taste in my mouth. She made it fairly clear that she thought section hikers took up valuable space in shelters that should be reserved for thru hikers. She also refused to call me by my trail name which was just a weird insult. Can section hikers not have trail names I wondered?
I described her later to a friend of mine who's thru hiking as "a girl who thinks thru hiking the AT will make her special" and add another line to list on her resume after grad school...but I don't think it does make you special just to finish it. The trail does pull out, or show you what is special in you as you travel it I think, left alone to your thoughts and as you find your inner strength and voice as you hike... There's a difference. I might not be expressing it well. Either way, I was totally unaware of this weird section hiker/vs. thru hiker mentality that she showed. I've done other sections later in the season and never had a bad experience with anyone. I've thought a lot about her attitude towards me since I returned and though I've chalked it up to "one bad apple in the bunch" it has still been good to read through everyone's words and see that others have sensed some snobbery before on the trail. I do agree with the sentiment that we should all just be "hikers" and drop the thru and section bits. That'd be nice :)
budforester
04-29-2011, 23:52
Grr another reason for edit button. Was supposed to be quoting wingedmonkey.
Yeah, I get in enough trouble even with an edit button. Wish I could get one for my facebook!
Hey, if completing a thru wasn't hard everyone would do it!
I'm now so jaded and accustomed to thru-hiking it's not that hard to me anymore though. I keep smiling with a genuinely good attitude and keep pushing on enjoying the wonders of the journey. Before long, I know I will find the journey to be physically over. At least that's what I tell myself and have convinced myself of when climbing 7000 ft in 5 miles or when being battered by driving snow and rain on an exposed ridge or when I haven't had water in 25 miles. It's great! Bring it on!
Hey, I'm a special super human! Don't tell me I'm not!
I wonder what would happen to the percentages if $100,000 cash prizes were awarded to anyone who finished? - 10-k
Can we collect more than once? Like everytime we pass Go and head to Boardwalk! If so I know what I'm doing the next 5 years!
gonesolong
04-30-2011, 00:20
After reading Pirate's Facebook page about this year's crop passing through Neel's Gap, I'm glad I hermit hike and don't need a " Control Person".
What exactly is "Hermit Hiking"?
just got back from doing atkins-damascus and met a bunch of thru's.i'll put it this way for every 20 people you meet 2 are a-holes just like everywhere else in the world.had a great time and met a great bunch of hikers
What exactly is "Hermit Hiking"?
You hike solo and camp away from others. I do it a lot.
rambunny
04-30-2011, 10:51
I overheard a hiker that had come 500 miles tell everyone around How To Do It,including some sectioners that had 3 times the miles he did. His girlfriend looked miserable.His reason for hiking the AT was it would look great on his resume. I wanted to tell him #1 Good luck interviewing with someone who actually knows what it is and #2 if they do-he will be considered a flight risk.
WingedMonkey
04-30-2011, 13:36
What exactly is "Hermit Hiking"?
For me it means I don't have a "group leader" barking about the next move. It means going my miles and my stops and not slowing down or speeding up just to have company. It means not going to town to have pizza with friends when I've got food in my pack. I might travel with a group, but only because we happen to be in the same place at the same time.
:)
The_Truth
04-30-2011, 14:38
I don't know anything about anything.
But I don't think hiking 2000 miles in a season makes you anymore special than someone who works 60 hours a week in construction or someone who stares at spreadsheets 8 hours a day.
If hiking to you is routine then neither you or it is special.
Special is when the cubicle dweller chucks their job to thru hike the AT. Special is when the ditch walks away and spends a year bike riding around Australia. Special can even be when the chronic hiker puts away their wanderlust so they can be a father and husband.
Being routine isn't special. Breaking free from it is.
Beachcomber
04-30-2011, 15:36
Being routine isn't special. Breaking free from it is.
As a one-time regular in the woods, who's trying to break free of some routines of my own, I appreciate what you're saying. And, as a brand-new member of this forum, I wonder if you're not in the early stages of your own break-away, too.
In any case, you make a common-sense point very eloquently.
mweinstone
04-30-2011, 15:51
i belive 10k may be more than he appears. anyone else get the feeling were entertaining angels unawares? just sayin. the hikers never posted any single negative sylable. what we got here is our best posterhikerangel dude thinggy. just sayin.
10k...on the morrow we hike!
Hey, I'm a special super human! Don't tell me I'm not! - Dogwood
Don't know if you were referring to this(my) post, The Truth, but you need to take that comment in context with what I said in post #100. Even though I made my "special super human" comment largely tough-in-cheek, I belive there is an element of truth in it too. You even said this in an around about way seemingly contradicting yourself, when you stated, - "Being routine isn't special. Breaking free from it is."
Isn't that what thru-hiking is?, breaking free from routine? breaking free from the customary way of living? perhaps, establishing a different temporary routine in the process? It's not typical or "routine" for the overwhelming majority of human beings to embark on a 2000 mile walking journey! It's not typical or "routine" for the majority of those intending to complete an AT thru-hike to actually reach that goal. So, it seems, based on what you said, thru-hiking can be viewed as being "special?" and perhaps those that complete a thru-hike as being "special?"
Would it also offend others to say someone is special because they became a mother of five children in China, were a starting NFL quarteback, were a follower of Islam, were inducted into the Baseball Hall Of Fame, had a different sexual orientation, spoke a different language, had a different skin color, thru-hiked the AT as a blind person, lived under a different political or economic system?
As all these scenarios/things can be "special", it doesn't offend me to say: "Special is when the cubicle dweller chucks their job to thru hike the AT. Special is when the ditch(worker?) walks away and spends a year bike riding around Australia. Special can even be when the chronic hiker puts away their wanderlust so they can be a father and husband."
OR, it can be special, according to your definition, when someone opts to not be a father and husband and wanders!
The_Truth
04-30-2011, 19:12
Hey, I'm a special super human! Don't tell me I'm not! - Dogwood
I agree!
I didn't mean to offend anyone by my post. I just wanted to say that to me sometimes it's getting out of your comfort zone that is the special thing. For one person leaving the trail and 'settling' down might be a big step. For someone else it might be going one day without a drink. Heck, thru-hiking might be the easiest part of the ride for some.
In the movie Touching the Void I think it's Joe Simpson who said, "There's not a lot of risk in our lives normally now." I think those who take a risk are special.
A valid point
So when does a thru hiker become a valid thru hiker????
Till the completion they are still just section hikers right???
That would be a fun debate to have with a snobby current year thru.
The Truth, said so well! ....sometimes it's getting out of your comfort zone that is the special thing.... I get where you are coming from!
I just didn't want my comment mis-interpreted as being over the top egotistical and prideful. It wasn't meant that way.
Welcome to WB!
Not tough-in-cheek. Tongue-in cheek.