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Hi. i just bought some VB socks (climb High) from campmor.They are coated ripstop nylon with taped seam. Not knowing any better way to test them out prior to use, I filled them with water and found mumerous pin-hole leaks at the seams. Does anyone know how big a deal this is? I'm new to VB use but I wonder just how completely impermeable the VB has to be to be effective? My planned use is winter trekking with a liner sock, the Vb sock, and an outersock. thanks Caleb
orangebug
01-19-2005, 20:40
Send them back. These should have been sealed to be _vapor_proof_. Water proof would be much less a chore to create.
You can try out VB socks real easily and cheaply by putting on a pair of liners, cover with bread sacks over each foot, a covering sock or a rubber band around your ankle and then put on a pair of shoes.
Your feet will get very warm very quickly. It is best to do this outdoors in weather below 20F, preferably with snow.
VB works by preventing any cold wetness from outside getting to your feet. It prevents your cooling your feet by evaporating sweat. At some point, your feet will quit sweating and the dampness inside the VB sock will equilibrate.
thanks OB
Today I asked Integral Designs if their VB sock passes the 'waterproof' test
...their response: The challenge with VB socks is that they have a relatively short lifespan due to constant abrasion and contact with moisture. We do get a small number of returns and failures on this product. Nothing that overly concerns us, but at a higher percentage than on any of our other products.
I'm thinking maybe I should go back to plastic bags. C
Well, after more researching, i am finding it is commonplace for VB socks to fail the 'faucet' test. Even the very high-end maker RBH Designs does not warrant their socks will pass this test. RBH VB socks are not even seam sealed. They contend no ill-effect from this lack of waterproofness.
All of this leaves much doubt about the value of purchased VB socks. Plastic bags are possibly even superior. Or maybe, the VB threshold for effective warmth is so forgivingly low that is doesn't really made any difference and that it comes down to a question of convenience and/or hassle. Caleb
orangebug
01-21-2005, 21:36
Or yet another thought from an observation.
Back at Thanksgiving in NE TN, I enjoyed a snowstorm with some wind, but nothing like a blizzard. I wore glove liners that began to fray and covered them with mittens - the type that the cover for the four fingers can flip out and allow four fingers to write and manipulate small objects.
The mittens initially did little to keep my hands warm, as the velcro would fail and my fingers often were exposed. First, I used safety pins to hold the cover shut, which helped a lot. Then, the blowing snow froze the mitten covers, making them hard as a rock and did not touch my liners or my fingers.
My hands stayed warm, protected under this icy shell of the mitten cover.
Perhaps, and I've used fairly cheap VB socks, freezing of the shoe cover provides more protection than the VB sock. I am not sure how you would test this theory, but I've observed frozen boots and trail runners whenever I've engaged my VB socks.
There is no reason that a set of silnylon stuff sacks/socks couldn't work for VB socks. I'd try the cheapest method - bread or newspaper sacks - to test VB for yourself. I think that water proof is a reasonable minimal standard for VB clothing. Maybe, I'm wrong.
I think that water proof is a reasonable minimal standard for VB clothing. Maybe, I'm wrong.
I would think so too. Seems though that makers apply the term 'vapor barrier' very loosly: If they're not waterproof they're sure as heck not vapor proof.
OTOH, it could be there are degrees of 'vapor barrier' and that heat retention doesn't require 100% vapor PROOF. Even though it seemingly contradicts the VB concept, given that most of seam is under the foot, and that the "vb" sock is designed to work in the very confined area of the booted foot, maybe a 80-90% vapor barrier works just fine.
At any rate, I've decided to keep the socks. I'll let you know if I lose any toes. Speaking of which, at -10f currently in NH, it's getting almost nippy out. :) C