food storage questions-- bear canisters

[DavidNH]

Hi guys,


Food storage is always an issue. Along the AT, most hikers hang their food. Other trails one is required to carry a bear canister. My question is, if I were to use an approved bear canister for food storage, then I don't have to hang the food in the canister right? can the filled bear canister just be left against a tree trunk somewhere? I'm assuming we want to place the bear canister a little ways off from the sleeping quarters right? Might the bears just roll the darn canister into some stream?

so to condense my question.. if I bring along an approved bear canister.. and I have it filled with food, garbage, and any other odiferous items, and It is properly shut.. where does the canister go and stay whilst I sleep? and yes I have never used a bear canister before so I honestly don't know the answer.

DavidNH

[lilricky]

There lies one of the problems with bear canisters. The idea behind the canisters is that the bears will give up trying to get at the food after a while and just leave it. The only problem is one that you pointed out, the bears love to play kick ball with it. Meaning your canister will not be in the same place you left it. The "solution" is that you're supposed to leave it somewhere away from cliffs/streams/ravines/etc, which is not always an option. Some people use Opsaks or other scent blocking bags inside their canisters and try hiding it as best they can. Others have tied it up and treated it as a bear bag. I knew one guy who sprinkled curry powder on his, to "discourage wildlife from approaching it", unluckily for him he found the only Indian food loving bear in the forest. I never did find my can ;).

[30 Large]

When hiking out west, where canisters are mostly mandatory, I hang my canister just as I would a bag.

[Iceaxe]

Place the can 50 feet from your sleeping area. Even if the bear decides to check it out it never rolls very far. Frankly i find stories of canister being rolled into oblivion by bears a lot of hyperbole. I am not saying it did'nt happen just the way you said.. just never happened to me in the past 15 years or any of the 300 people on the PCT that year or any one else i have ever met in real life.
I have used a bear resistant canister in Yosemite for 15 years. The bears don't even touch the thing anymore. Still, I usually find a depression to put it in so it wont roll too far should a critter disturb it.
You could hang a canister, if it was in a bag, but why?
The point of a bear canister is to protect the bears from getting your food. The disadvantage is the weight. The advantage is the great convenience for you to be able to access your food without hauling rope or chucking rocks over tree branches.
As an intersting side note:
When i began using a garcia canister way back when they were new, a mother and cub mauled it the first night out.
The second night the same pair of bears(i think they were the same!) came back into camp and totally ignored the canister.
Nothing ever disturbed my garcia bear can since. I set the canister upright and put a pebble on top before bed just to see if anything has messed with it overnight.
I switched to a Bearvault 500 for the Sierra on the PCT and not one critter knocked it over.
Everywhere else on the PCT (outside the mandated canister areas) I and every other thru hiker slept on or with our food.
For the CDT and AT I slept on top of my food having rolled it into a Nylofume bag. No problems, but i don't recommend anyone else do this.
A bear canister can be a huge relief in Man habituated bear country like Yosemite and Seki (where they are required).
No more waking up at 2AM to the sound of claws on bark and shooing away hungry bears!
13347

[chiefiepoo]

Thank you for puttting out your experience with the hard side canisters. I just ordered the BV450 for an Isle Royal and Glacier NP August backpacking adventure. Austin Canoe and Kayak had it for $59.95 with free shipping. My last three trips to Glacier had me using bear bags in the back country and steel lockers in front country camps. On the AT I'm usually sleeping with some freeze dry and hanging the rest. Never sleep with food out west though. Looking to go to Yosemite next year so this is a good investment for a solo hiker. Thanks.

[WMR]

We hiked NOC-Fontana May 2011 - camped first night at Locust Cove Gap with a large group - somebody hung their food bags waist high around the nearest tree, in the middle of several tents, with no regard to wildlife. We did our due diligence, but nothing stirred in the night. Next night we were solo at Bee Cove Lead, hung our all smellables in a cinch sack up the trail, out of reach, etc., with all water bottles hanging below. Some critter - bear? raccoon? - batted at it all night - and I mean all night: every 30 minutes or so there was a chorus of some animal knocking those bottles around and trying to get at that bag; it was a sleepless night, needless to say, Bottom line: creatures are out there after dark; sometimes they stay away from the tent, sometimes they come in close. ALWAYS hang all smellables, incl. food, scraps, trash, personal care items and any water bottles that has or ever had gatorade (or similar) in it; NEVER bring any smellable into your tent or in your clothes that go in your tent. 9999 out of 10,000 you will you not have an issue, but for 5 or 10 minutes effort you won't have to worry about the other 1/100th percent chance. Keep food and all other smellables out of your tent; hang your smellables away from your tent.

[Jack Tarlin]

Interesting thread, but I have to take issue with the original post, where it was stated that "Along the A.T., most hikers hang their food."

It would be more accurate to say that in many places on the A.T., most hikers will opt to hang their food. And there are certainly some hikers who will hang their food most, if not all of the time. But there are also many who very seldom hang their food, and more than a few who never do. Being cautious and prudent in bear country is indeed wise, but the bear threat in the East is very frequently exaggerated. The bald statement that most hikers on the A.T. hang their food is simply not, in fact, a fully accurate thing to say. Most A.T. hikers hang their food some of the time, but the practice is neither as widespread, nor in fact, is it as necessary, as some people may think.

[ChinMusic]

First, you do NOT hang a bear can or wedge it in some tight area. You want the bear to be able to move it fairly freely so they cannot get leverage on it. You place it 50-100 feet from your tent in an area where it can't (reasonably) be rolled into a stream or over a cliff. This is rarely a hard thing to do.

IMO if you use a can in an area where the bears are not used to them, they will inspect/roll/kick/explore it more. In a place like Yosemite they may smack it over and then leave it alone. I suspect they only spend the time to smack it over if they had previously been rewarded by someone not closing the lid properly. A bear used to cans won't waste much time on it. A bear NOT used to cans might stay with it longer, not understanding why they can't get to the food. I suspect AT bears to fall into the latter camp.

[Colter]

And I definitely wouldn't carry a bear canister on the AT, but that's just me.


Interesting thread, but I have to take issue with the original post, where it was stated that "Along the A.T., most hikers hang their food."

It would be more accurate to say that in many places on the A.T., most hikers will opt to hang their food. And there are certainly some hikers who will hang their food most, if not all of the time. But there are also many who very seldom hang their food, and more than a few who never do. Being cautious and prudent in bear country is indeed wise, but the bear threat in the East is very frequently exaggerated. The bald statement that most hikers on the A.T. hang their food is simply not, in fact, a fully accurate thing to say. Most A.T. hikers hang their food some of the time, but the practice is neither as widespread, nor in fact, is it as necessary, as some people may think.

[SawnieRobertson]

My daughter took two kids on their first backpack in Rocky Mountain National Park a week or so ago. Because the bears in Rocky have upon occasion in the past few years been obnoxious, they decided to rent a canister. She had never used one before, so this was a kind of experiment. In went the tortillas, peanut butter, etc. They hiked in, set up, and readied themselves for the goodies. It would not open. This was not good.

Okay. Finally! one of the 15-year-old first timers used his mighty strength and mind, and they got their dinner. Turns out that at least one of the humankind was smarter than a bear.

Do not ever tell her that I told you about this.

Kinnickinic

[dcmidnight]

One other thing that I have found helpful is wrapping 3 or 4 loops of a florescent colored tape around the bottom and lid. B/C the bear will knock that thing around and it will end up in the underbrush somewhere - guess what, a see-through bottom and black top canister can be a pain in the arse to find at 6a when you really want that coffee made :)

I've carried the BV500 a couple times on the AT/SNP and have gone back to hanging a bag. But if I go to Glacier in the spring I'll go back to the canister. I do like the convenience, I dont like the weight - its up to you. In SNP however there are hanging poles at each shelter so I dont find it worth the hassle when I stay local.

[wincheck]

What are the lightest canisters available? I'm heading up to the Adirondacks for the first time where canisters are required. Need something that would fit in a GG Vapor Trail or Nimbus Meridian.

[wcgornto]

I believe Bearikade is lightest.

http://wild-ideas.net/index2.html

[wincheck]

I believe Bearikade is lightest.

http://wild-ideas.net/index2.html

Wow - those cost more than my tent!

Thanks for the tip, though.

[Snowleopard]

Don't tie anything around your canister because the bear could snag it and haul it away. Where canisters are required the bears have figured how to get any bagged food, so they can haul it away with what you used to hang it. They can't get hold of the bare canister. Place it in a depression, not near a cliff or river, so if the bear bats it around it won't go far.

Bear Vaults (BV500, etc.) are no good in the Easter High Peaks of the Adirondacks because a bear has figured how to open them. The lightest affordable canister is the small Bare Boxer at 1.6 lb, but only holds 3 or 4 days of low volume food (http://www.bareboxer.com/ )
I have this and it's OK for short trips. I like my Garcia better for a full size canister because it's easier for me to open. The Bearikade is the lightest full size canister, but very pricey.

[snowsusie]

Most of us use the Garcia in the Eastern High Peaks because Yellow-Yellow has figured out how to open the others.

[ChinMusic]

Most of us use the Garcia in the Eastern High Peaks because Yellow-Yellow has figured out how to open the others.

FTR, Yellow-Yellow CANNOT open a Bearikade.

[ChinMusic]

Side note on the Bearikade (of any other that requires a coin to open): One of my buddies had his Bearikade ruined by TSA (or whoever reviews checked luggage) on his flight out west. Not sure what airport this happened at, but they wanted to look inside the Bearikade and I guess they couldn't figure out how to open it. They PRIED the lid open instead of using a coin ruining the lid. I'm thinking of adding "instructions" to my lid with marker just in case some airline troglodyte needs to look inside mine.

[Snowleopard]

... I'm thinking of adding "instructions" to my lid with marker just in case some airline troglodyte needs to look inside mine.
Be sure to remove the instructions on the trail, else you'll be teaching the bears. That's probably how yellow-yellow learned to open the Bear Vaults. :)

[ChinMusic]

Be sure to remove the instructions on the trail, else you'll be teaching the bears. That's probably how yellow-yellow learned to open the Bear Vaults. :)

I'll write the instructions for the luggage handlers in gorilla. Bears have yet to learn to read gorilla...........

I was serious about the directions. I just went and got my Bearikade out of my gear room and added the info:

http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b186/ChinMusicIHSS/Backpacking/can.jpg
http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b186/ChinMusicIHSS/Backpacking/can2.jpg

[Toolshed]

So, I have had the Bear Vault 400 for about 6 years now. I was one of the lucky individuals who got one of the test lids with the double bumps around 2006. When I used it, (to test the lid), I didn't have any problems with bears on those trips. I let the company know that nothing had occurred.... I never thought much about it afterward, but thanks for letting me know that the same bear has also figured out the new lids in the HP region.

[CMags]

What are the lightest canisters available? I'm heading up to the Adirondacks for the first time where canisters are required. Need something that would fit in a GG Vapor Trail or Nimbus Meridian.


In the Adirondacks you can rent bear canisters from the Adirondack Loj (http://www.adk.org/home-flash.aspx)

They do have DEC officers in the High Peaks that will check to be sure you have them.

[wincheck]

Anyone know if it's possible to rent a Bearikade in the Adirondacks area?

Allen from Wild-Ideas said an Aug. 8 order for Aug. 13 was not enough time, which I found surprising since they use USPS Priority Delivery (3 day shipping). Oh, well.

He said the DEC bought a bunch of Bearikades a few years ago but I can't seem to find any rental info. I know the Loj rents the Garcia Bear Cache but I'm trying to avoid the extra weight.

[CMags]

EMS in Lake Placid is the only other place I know of that rents them, don't know what kind they have as I've never asked.

[Feral Nature]

I am just shocked at the price! Dang!

[carpediemkath]

Have you considered a Ursack? I love mine! It's not nearly as heavy as a bear cansiter. The Ursack, when used with a Loksack that completely blocks odors, is really all you need on the AT (they are not approved for the bears out west). The Ursack is made of a completely puncture-proof woven material that prison guards wear to prevent stabbing wounds. The Ursack has a rope at the top, but not to hang the bag with. The idea is to tie the bag to the base of a tree so nothing can carry it off. Ursack gives good instructions for tying bear-proof knots. The interior Loksack prevents animals from finding it in the first place; the exterior Ursack material keeps animals from chewing their way into your food. It won't, however, prevent a bear from mauling your food and squishing it, so you have to make sure to use the Loksack properly so the bears don't find it in the first place. I've used mine from Springer to the NOC (135 miles) with no problems. I usually find a small tree, as far away from my tent as possible, and tie the Ursack to the base of the tree. I've never once had a mouse or other animal find it or chew through it. I hung it on the bear cables a few times and several people had their food sacks chewed through by mice but mine was untouched every time. http://ursack.com/ they even have a video of a bear trying to get into the Ursack--it finally gives up!

[hikingshoes]

I'm with carpediemkath on this one. I love my Usack and made a video when we was camping on the river.Hope this helps!! HS http://www.youtube.com/user/hikingshoes#p/u

[ROCKY RACOON]

Jack.. you're very foolish.