Winter Hiking for the first time

[tucker0104]

I have done plenty of spring and fall hiking, I limit my summer hikes to day trips because for me 85 to 90 degrees is just too hot to be out there. I would rather be mountain biking or on my boat wakeboarding. I am really interested in getting into winter backpacking. I have enough clothes to layer so clothes aren't a problem. I am just wondering about stuff I have never dealt with before, such as... do I need a 4 season tent, spikes, throat insulation? I currently have a hubba hubba and a 0 degree bag. I am not going to be getting out in blizzards but I want to be prepared for one. I also have a springer spaniel dog. He has long hair and I don't think he will have a problem with the cold but does anyone use a jacket for their dog? Does anyone out there use the dog shoes? What conditions would you recommend using those? Thanks for all the help in advance.

[Raul Perez]

I know many who use a 3 season tent in winter conditions. Heck I hammock in close to 0*F weather.

I can't answer the dog questions but I will say the following:

- Hydrate often. Even when you are not thirsty

- Eat often to maintain warmth

- Eat a high fat content food close to bed time to keep your furnace burning over night

- have snacks avail during the night to feed the furnace

Tipi does a lot of winter camping hoping he will chime in on this one. This will be my 3rd season winter hiking/camping

[Mags]

Where are you winter camping and when?

10F at night with some frost on the ground in November in the Southern Apps is a a lot different than the middle 0f February in New Hampshire above tree line. :)

In the first example, a regular tent is fine along with the gear you described. In the latter example, not so much....

[sly dog]

I did some winter backpacking in feb this year and did not need much more than my regular gear. My tent is 3 season and was fine in the teen temps. The only extra stuff I added was extra alcohol because in those temps it takes longer to vaporize and to boil water. In winter it seems shelters are empty so need be, you can set tent inside. I like that you barely go thru much water due to lack of sweating. Also I switched out my coffee cup for a mini insulated thermos. All day you will be warm from hiking until you stop for a break, when you get to camp and start setting up and collecting firewood you are warm. The only time ya get chilly is rolling out of the sleeping bag in the morning but coffee helps. I can't wait to get back out for more winter trips, the woods are so clean, quiet, and empty. Enjoy!

[tucker0104]

Thanks for the advice. I love when there is no one except for me. I am mostly going to be camping in north carolina and virginia. Nothing too far north.

[trainhopper]

Hike in light clothes as you will be sweating despite the low temps. Bring the layers for after you set up camp and everything you need to do is done. Also, boil water at night and sleep with your water bottle and gas. This will keep you warm and prevent both from freezing. When I winter hiked last year we stayed at a Shelter on the A.T. and only used our tent as a makeshift tarp. We were plenty warm at night and waking up is definitely the worst part.

[Brewerbob]

sleep with your water bottle and gas. This will keep you warm and prevent both from freezing. What are you using for gas????

[tucker0104]

What are you using for gas????


Gas Canisters

[ScottP]

4 season tent?

Not needed

Good 0 degree bag? more than enough. Crappy 0 degree bag? might get cold.

4 season mix for canister stove? Might as well

spikes--can come in handy. Kahtoola microspikes. real crampons would be a silly waste and uncomfortable


throat insulation: probably would be comfortable. balclava+the collars on microfleece winter base layers should give you 3 thin layers of neck insulation.

I'd bring a jacket for the springer spainiel. Long hair, but only single-coated, correct?

Lots more to pick up about winter backpacking than you'll get in a single post, but enjoy the season.


If you're up for a week long smokies trip this winter PM me.

[Brewerbob]

Gas CanistersAnd what gas are you putting in a gas canister that is freezing? Alcohol has to be good for what -40*. Gasoline ... gotta be below -100*.


4 season tent?

Not needed
Isn't a 4 season tent built for snow loads? I know my cabin tent wouldn't survive more than a 6 inch snowing without someone keeping it cleared. I've no idea what my two man tent would take before it folds.

[Tom Murphy]

Isn't a 4 season tent built for snow loads? I know my cabin tent wouldn't survive more than a 6 inch snowing without someone keeping it cleared. I've no idea what my two man tent would take before it folds.

I use my 3 season tent for below treeline winter camping all the time.

I needed to go out brush off all the snow during a snow storm once, bow often are you camping in a snow storm? And if you keep the snow off it is fine.

IMO 4 season tents are required to camp above the treeline in the winter, the wind loads can really mess up a tent.

One issue I have is snow blowing under the fly and through the netting.

Also don't expect a warm tent if you are using a 3 season tent, 4 season tent do trap some heat.

[bigcranky]

If you have a good zero degree bag you'll be fine in the South for most of the winter. You'll also want a serious puffy down jacket, and some "big dumb mitts" to make sure you come home with all your fingers. A three-season tent is almost certainly fine, unless you find yourself in a blizzard, and even then you will probably survive. (I survived a blizzard in a 5x8 tarp. The bag is in many ways more important than the shelter.)

Plan carefully. Take into account the day length - mid December is awfully dark, but that can be fun too. Late February has many more hours of daylight. Plan a short trip the first couple of times so you can bail if you need to. Have fun.

[ChinMusic]

I don't think he will have a problem with the cold but does anyone use a jacket for their dog? Does anyone out there use the dog shoes? What conditions would you recommend using those?
During the day your dog shouldn't need a coat. At night that is a different story. If it gets below 25° I usu wrap my dog in one of my coats or pull him into my sleeping bag (he weighs 31 pounds). Re boots: Yep. Some dogs will ice up REAL BAD in snow. You gotta watch em closely to see if they are struggling with ice in their pads. For winter I always bring his booties. Sometimes the snow sticks to him and sometimes it doesn't.

[tucker0104]

I made him his own sleeping bag last year. Just got a 9.95 walmart sleeping bag and cut it down to fit him. He slides right in that thing at night. All I see is his nose sticking out.

[ChinMusic]

i made him his own sleeping bag last year. Just got a 9.95 walmart sleeping bag and cut it down to fit him. He slides right in that thing at night. All i see is his nose sticking out.

sweet.....

[shelterbuilder]

I'm always telling my friends that in the wintertime, you need to keep sweat to a minimum. If you are sweating heavily, then you are either: Hiking too fast (slow down); Too well insulated (unbutton, unzip, or remove clothes); Carrying too much weight; or any combination of these three. It's better to be "comfortably cool" when hiking than to be "warm". (Of course, when you stop for a break or to make camp, THEN put on your extra layers.) As for the dog, a CCF pad will help keep the dog from losing too much heat through ground contact.

[Ironbelly]

I live in the Northeast and do quite a bit of winter backpacking. I always have my siberian husky, Juno, with me. A 4 season tent is only required if knowingly going out into a bad storm, or going above treeline. You can easily put up most 3 season tents in winter and use the terrain as shelter from severe wind etc if needed. The best 3 season tents to use in winter are the freestanding variety. I have found non freestanding tents are a real pita to get up in winter, though it is possible. If your dog is not double coated, and not a northern breed , I would most definitely get them a jacket. Just be sure to get your dog used to the jacket before a trip. I always bring a small ccf pad and a poncho liner for my sibe to sleep on.
I also suggest having along a traction aid, i recommend kahtoola microspikes. A white gas stove for melting snow is also very handy, alcohol and canister stoves can be a hassle in winter. If out in really cold weather make sure to have matches. Sometimes lighters wont work unless you prewarm them in your pocket. Take a few snow stakes for your tent, and alson read about how to make a deadman. Bury your water in the snow at night to keep it from freezing, or sleep with it.

If you have any more specific questions feel free to ask! And welcome to the real season!

[Ironbelly]

If your dog does not have hair that grows between his toes, you definitely need booties. Juno doesn't need them very often, but I always carry them. If you google a few dog sledding suppliers you can find cheap sets of canvas booties for like $3 or $4. You don't need to drop $50 on some fancy goretex model, canvas works the best in winter handsdown.

[Jim Adams]

i learned to winter camp at and below 0* by initially car camping in a state park campground with heated rest rooms...gives you a solid place to bail out if you aren't prepared and teaches you quickly what works and what doesn't. after you get the overnight thing down then add in the backpacking knowing that as you learn, if conditions get bad...you are ready to set up camp and survive until morning.

geek

[tucker0104]

He has plenty of hair. Just got through giving him his last summer cut and trimmed back the hair in between his paws. He was sliding around everywhere on the floor

[Brewerbob]

I made him his own sleeping bag last year. Just got a 9.95 walmart sleeping bag and cut it down to fit him. He slides right in that thing at night. All I see is his nose sticking out.You sure he isn't part cat?:D

[Ironbelly]

Just found out the springer spaniel is a double coat breed, which is good. Undercoat growth can largely depend on what the dog has been exposed to. So I highly recommend letting the dog spend alot of time outside as it gets colder so that it stimulates a thicker undercoat to grow.

[Tom Murphy]

i learned to winter camp at and below 0* by initially car camping in a state park campground with heated rest rooms...gives you a solid place to bail out if you aren't prepared and teaches you quickly what works and what doesn't. after you get the overnight thing down then add in the backpacking knowing that as you learn, if conditions get bad...you are ready to set up camp and survive until morning.

geek

+1

This is excellent advice. You do not want to be trying out a new sleep system or learning how to light that stove for the first time on a cold winter night miles from the trailhead.

[Bear Cables]

13617 Winter hiking this winter, I added the following to my regular gear, or in some cases replaced my Spring Summer items:
Double walled tent in place of tarp tent, 15 degree down bag packed in waterproof bag, capiline thermals, polar fleece, thermawrap parka, gortex rain shell,gortex pants, gortex mittens plus a spare pair of gloves for in camp, chemical hand warmers and Khatoola microspikes ( which really got good use in the Olympic national park) The picture is our campsite in the Olympic NP. 8 inches of snow that day.

[GlitterHiker]

i learned to winter camp at and below 0* by initially car camping in a state park campground with heated rest rooms...gives you a solid place to bail out if you aren't prepared and teaches you quickly what works and what doesn't. after you get the overnight thing down then add in the backpacking knowing that as you learn, if conditions get bad...you are ready to set up camp and survive until morning.

geek
That's how I started last year. Very helpful way to learn.

Besides what others have mentioned: allow more time to get started each day, you'll move slower in the morning in the cold. Also I learned the wind affects you more - without the leaves on the trees or underbrush, there's less foliage to buffer the wind.

[Lyle]

Haven't read all of this thread, so if I'm repeating, my apologies.
Just some quick suggestions that I find very useful. This assumes you already have additional warm clothing and wicking layers. Not intended to be all-inclusive:

- Three season bag can work, but a good 0* (like you have, if it's a good one) is much better
- Down booties worth their weight in gold for camp comfort and extending a bag's comfort zone
- Extra, full length ground insulation is essential!!
- Balaclava is a very useful addition for winter - very versatile
- White gas stove is better suited than alcohol or canister for real cold

Some useful techniques:

- Do not wear your insulating layers while hiking - you will degrade the effectiveness by adding too much moisture
- Keep your dry camp clothes DRY at all costs. I have, on occasion, even changed back into my damp hiking clothes when venturing out during rain or wet snow while in camp. PITA to do, but better than damp camp clothes.
- Stuff your down gear immediately after getting out, before you go to pee. This prevents the warm moist air inside the down from condensing on the insulation as the bag cools. Squeeze the air out before it has a chance. Take every opportunity to air out your down gear on dry, sunny days.

As others have said, practice where you can bail if necessary. Don't make it too easy to bail though, or you won't really test yourself. I have no suggestions for your dog, other than to make sure he/she has ground insulation as well.

I love winter camping. Nothing is as cozy as lying in your bag, toasty warm except for the tip of your nose that is left out to prevent excessive moisture in your bag and to remind you that it's -10* outside. The most beautiful hike I've ever taken was a hike out from Shenendoah after a two day blizzard buried the trail under three feet of snow with 12 foot drifts, and ice had coated all the branches. Hiking out the following day in the bright sunshine, the trees all glittering, was amazing. You don't get that experience in summer.

Good luck and HAVE FUN!!!!

[4eyedbuzzard]

As a couple others mentioned, don't forget the available light factor. Even down south you'll have maybe 9 hours of usable daylight in Dec and Jan, which is further reduced by forest cover and which side of the ridge you are on. (Up here in NE we get around 8 hours - pretty short day, long time in camp) Learn to make and break camp quickly, cook using headlamp, etc in order to maximize daylight hiking hours available. Bring a book.