View Full Version : TYVEK ??? Crazy maybe?
jeepcj258
02-16-2005, 10:15
Well here is my question. I here every body talking about how great tyvek is for ground cloth and many other items. Have any of you used the lab coats or pants for rain gear. They are light weight and cheap? Like $2.20 for the pants. That said, will they last or will they rip and fall apart?
Thanks for the advice
God Bless
Seth
SGT Rock
02-16-2005, 10:17
Sweeper tried the painting clothes version and found that it didn't work so well. If you can get one, try wearing it in the shower and see what happens.
jeepcj258
02-16-2005, 11:17
I just have to find a good industrial work place that will donate a set for my testing. I will let you guys know what I come up with.
Thanks
God Bless
Seth
People have tried this. Tyvek doesn't work so well as rain gear because it is modestly water resistant, not waterproof. Using Tyvek lab coat would be very much like using a DWR wind shirt. In light rain it can work but you should expect some water to soak through, and in a heavy rain you are going to get wet. If you are in cool weather and have a modestly thick layer than doesn't soak up water like a light pile jacket it could be effective. I think you would find Porpore used in Rainshield O2 gear a better choice because it is is waterproof and fairly cheap ($22 for a rainshirt). If you want something a bit more durable try DryDucks or Frogg Toggs.
Tyvek is no good. It doesn't breathe at all. I do fire/hazmat work so I wear it a lot. It forms a vapor barrier so nothing gets in or out. All of your body heat will stay inside and your sweat will cause you to be more wet than the rain will.
jeepcj258
02-16-2005, 15:02
Well, I guess that just about sums it up. I am back to: "Thinking about purchasing frog togs"
God Bless
Seth
The Weasel
02-16-2005, 15:46
Ahhhh, Tyvek!
I'm about 3 weeks north of Springer, in '00, and along comes Tyvek. The hiker, as well as a couple dozen yards of the material. He's wearing Tyvek. His tarp/tent is Tyvek. I think his sleeping bag is Tyvek. Some of his clothes are Tyvek. Everything is Tyvek, except his boots. Which he doesn't have. He is hiking barefoot. I'm not kidding you here. He's come from Springer, barefoot. I say hello, and ask him - yes, I know, it was a stupid thing to do - "What's your name?"
A week or so later, I hear that he is still chugging along, although his wife and trail partner (whose name was hardly as remarkable, so hers is forgotten) has left the Trail. A little later, I learn that Tyvek is not on the trail.
This, and the posts about Tyvek above, leads me to some comments. Tyvek breathed, or at least appeared to. But unless you are his wife, I think Tyvek would be a poor ground pad, as being too heavy. While apparently waterproof, Tyvek would not have made a good raincoat, either, for similar reasons. I would not take Tyvek in the shower with me, although I am not judging those who would, even to save water. If you want to use Tyvek on the Trail, I'm not sure I can agree. Using Tyvek would seem very cruel, and very possibly would be illegal either as a form of assault or, worst case, slavery. And if Tyvek didn't work out, "getting rid of Tyvek" has some other regrettable consequences, probably.
I hope this helps.
The Weasel
I don't know what you guys are talking about. I have been wearing Tyvek for three years now and have had virtually no problems.
I bought the "disposable clothing" from a website a while back and I have been hooked ever since. Yes, it isn't completly waterproof. In a major hail strom in colorado, I did get wet. But I stayed VERY warm. I find the jacked to be extremly confortable and warm, and it vents well. I buy the full body suit, complete with front zipper and hood. Then I cut the legs off, so I have a pull-over. I buy the pants seperatly.
So, if you are one of those people that likes to stay completly dry in the rain, than no, this solution is probably not for you. But it you are like me and you are going to get wet from either the rain or sweat, then the Tyvek clothing is an excellent solution. I really like them, especially for the price.
Here are a couple of pics:
http://gallery.backcountry.net/chomp-coloradotrail03/adf
http://gallery.backcountry.net/chomp-coloradotrail03/adn
jeepcj258
02-16-2005, 17:32
Well maybe I will give it shot after all. It is very cheap so Y not?
Thanks
God Bless
Seth
Well here is my question. I here every body talking about how great tyvek is for ground cloth and many other items. Have any of you used the lab coats or pants for rain gear. They are light weight and cheap? Like $2.20 for the pants. That said, will they last or will they rip and fall apart?
Thanks for the advice
God Bless
Seth Seth,
Tyvek is not a desirable material for a rain suit. Here’s why:
Ideally, rain gear should allow the free passage of air (breathe), but not allow the passage of water (waterproof). By design, Tyvek does just the opposite.
An ideal housewrap must prevent air infiltration, but must allow moisture to escape from the wall cavity (water permeable). Air infiltrating from outside can create comfort-robbing cold or warm spots while increasing heating and cooling costs. Trapped moisture in the walls can lead to rot.
The properties of Tyvek that make it a good housewrap, make it a poor choice for a rain suit. It is, however, a great windbreaker.
Roland
Footslogger
02-16-2005, 21:02
Seth,
The properties of Tyvek that make it a good housewrap, make it a poor choice for a rain suit. It is, however, a great windbreaker.
Roland=====================================
Roland ...does it make sense then to use Tyvek as a moisture barrier/ground cloth under your tent, if what it really does is block the passage of air and allows water permeation ??
Thanks,
'Slogger
AT 2003
"This, and the posts about Tyvek above, leads me to some comments. Tyvek breathed, or at least appeared to. But unless you are his wife, I think Tyvek would be a poor ground pad, as being too heavy. While apparently waterproof, Tyvek would not have made a good raincoat, either, for similar reasons. I would not take Tyvek in the shower with me, although I am not judging those who would, even to save water. If you want to use Tyvek on the Trail, I'm not sure I can agree. Using Tyvek would seem very cruel, and very possibly would be illegal either as a form of assault or, worst case, slavery. And if Tyvek didn't work out, "getting rid of Tyvek" has some other regrettable consequences, probably.
The Weasel[/QUOTE] "
That was funny!
=====================================
Roland ...does it make sense then to use Tyvek as a moisture barrier/ground cloth under your tent, if what it really does is block the passage of air and allows water permeation ??
Thanks,
'Slogger
AT 2003 'Slogger,
I have to carefully tip-toe my way around this question, as I am sure there are many avid Tyvek users. I suppose the best answer to your question is, that it depends what one expects of a groundsheet.
A groundsheet, of any material, can help protect a tent floor from abrasion against the ground. For tarp users, a groundsheet provides a layer between one's sleeping pad and the ground. Because Tyvek is light and durable, it performs this task well. However, if one wants a waterproof groundsheet, Tyvek falls short. By design, Tyvek allows the passage of moisture. That's what makes it a great housewrap.
I was at Henry Shires website recently, looking at the weight of his tarptents. It is interesting to note that his floorless models, using a Tyvek groundsheet, weigh more than his "extended floor" models, with a sewn-in ripstop floor. Why aren't more people using ripstop for groundsheets?
Roland
Footslogger
02-16-2005, 21:51
'Slogger,
Why aren't more people using ripstop for groundsheets?
Roland=======================================
Probaby because a piece of Tyvek is free (if you know someone in the construction field).
Are you talking about ripstop silnylon ?? I've never priced the stuff in bulk ...but maybe you're onto something here !!
'Slogger
jeepcj258
02-16-2005, 21:58
:confused:
I now think that I do not know. Maybe if I can get a free set of clothes I might just give it a shot for a day or two.
God Bless
Seth
=======================================
Are you talking about ripstop silnylon ?? I've never priced the stuff in bulk ...but maybe you're onto something here !!
'Slogger 'Slogger,
I don't know what Henry Shires uses for his tarptent floors. The "Products" page on his site lists the optional floor material as "ripstop". I assume that is ripstop silnylon.
Is there a TarpTent owner here than can provide an answer to this question?
Roland
Well everybody's talking about tyvek and some of us can find it one way or another but not all of us can. Like me before my thru-hike last year. So this year I am making it available to those that need it and can't find it anywhere. I am selling it for $1.99 ft at 9ft wide. It is the homewrap version of Tyvek and is the best form of tyvek for ground clothes/sheet or tarps/tents. I have used it for a ground cloth and find it unbeatable.
Tyvek:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=5163947192&ssPageName=STRK:MESE:IT
Hope this helps someone.
Myst
AT Thru-Hiker
Ga->ME'04
orangebug
02-16-2005, 22:59
I used to use a Tyvek ground cloth with my Nomad. I decided against it, just checking carefully before staking the tent out to avoid rocks and other sharp objects. It works fine without it.
Like I said earlier, if your goal is to stay completly dry, Tyvek is not the best option. However, I am prone to sweating... so I get wet either way. I have actually used Tyvek backpacking for three years, and I find it an excellent alternative to rain jackets and frog togs. Yes, I have gotten wet in a storm.. but not soaking wet. And I have always been warm, even once in a hailstorm in Colorado. For 5 bucks, why not give it a shot and see if you have as much success as I have had?
The Weasel
02-17-2005, 12:29
Tyvek has so many drawbacks in terms of finding it, and the fact that it's not impermeable, that I've never understood it's attraction. If an impermeable, light, cheap groundsheet or equivalent is needed, try the very small "space blankets" made of Mylar film. They are surprisingly rugged if treated with some care; I had one which, with a few duct taple repairs, lasted as a groundsheet under my tent for over 400 miles of the AT. They usually cost 2-3 bucks and are available at almost any outfitter or even some (ugh) Walmarts. Total weight for 4x6 is about 2 oz.
The Weasel
If an impermeable, light, cheap groundsheet or equivalent is needed, try the very small "space blankets" made of Mylar film.
I have found that people use ground cloths for different purposes. I think the mylar space blankets are a great way to keep the bottom of a tent clean. I have found space blankets inadaquate when tarping. I know people who have had good luck tarping with space blankets.. but I always destroy mine within a few nights. On rocky ground I rip them. On soft ground I put holes in them by kneeling or pushing myself up on my elbow. I used Tyvek for a couple of seasons and found it very durable, and effective as a ground cloth. The downside is that it's not very compressible and heavier than I actually need. The last couple of trips I have used one of the ground cloths from Gossimar Gear. So far, I am happy because it's something like 1/3 the weight, much more compact, while still being adaquately durable. If I would have had a space blanket, I would have shreaded it.
RockyTrail
02-17-2005, 14:41
'Slogger,
I don't know what Henry Shires uses for his tarptent floors. The "Products" page on his site lists the optional floor material as "ripstop". I assume that is ripstop silnylon.
Is there a TarpTent owner here than can provide an answer to this question?
RolandFrom Henry's page the floor says "same material as roof" which is "high-tenacity 1.1 oz/sq.yd ripstop nylon impregnated with silicone, final wgt 1.4oz/sqyd."
I have a Squall w/floor and that's what it looks like to me. So far I haven't bothered to use a groundcloth yet, the floor seems fairly tough enough as-is. By the way the new Squall 2 design has more of a boat-like floor if you like to camp in puddles. A great tent and Henry is a super guy to deal with.
orangebug
02-17-2005, 15:19
I think one of the interests in Tyvek stems from the ease in prototyping tarps, tents and other gear. I have been in rain in a Tyvek tent prototype of the Nomad. Water came thru the floor, but the walls stayed dry.
From Henry's page the floor says "same material as roof" which is "high-tenacity 1.1 oz/sq.yd ripstop nylon impregnated with silicone, final wgt 1.4oz/sqyd."
I have a Squall w/floor and that's what it looks like to me. So far I haven't bothered to use a groundcloth yet, the floor seems fairly tough enough as-is. By the way the new Squall 2 design has more of a boat-like floor if you like to camp in puddles. A great tent and Henry is a super guy to deal with. RockyTrail,
Thanks for your reply confirming that TarpTent use a waterproof fabric in their floor-model tarps.
Given that Tyvek was designed to allow the passage of moisture, and that silnylon is similar in weight but is waterproof, I believe silnylon might be worthy candidate for groundsheet material.
Roland
Footslogger
02-17-2005, 16:00
Given that Tyvek was designed to allow the passage of moisture, and that silnylon is similar in weight but is waterproof, I believe silnylon might be worthy candidate for groundsheet material.Roland=================================== ===========
Only issue there is durability. Not sure silnylon would hold up to abrasion as well as Tyvek.
I actually have a Tarptent with the silnylon floor and that is the main reason I use a ground cloth.
'Slogger
FWIW, Keep in mind that there are many different variations of Tyvek. Some is engineered with micro holes to be breathable, some to have a soft hand, and others to best run through a press.
Rick B
In my experience silnylon makes a terrible ground sheet, simply too fragile and easily ripped and punctured, even my silnylon rain cover for my pack developed abrasion holes and tears very early into my hike. I also found that duck tape and for that matter any kind of tape does not stick well to silnylon for those trailside repairs.
I am sticking to my Tyvek ground sheet. I love it so much I have even bought a 150ft roll of tyvek homewrap (best for ground sheets) and sell it by the foot to those wanting small pieces for ground sheets and tarps. Free pieces can be had at construction sites but usually not big enough for your needs.
Tyvek by the foot:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=5163947192&ssPageName=STRK:MESE:IT
Ga->ME'04
superman
02-23-2005, 13:47
Over the years of hiking I have enjoyed the enthusiasm of those hikers who dare to try something new, different or home made. I met Tyvek Man in 2000 and was impressed with his effort. I didn't rush out and get tyvek though. The last time I saw him was at Trail Days. Another time, I hiked a while with an engineer who got as much satisfaction out of making his own stuff as he did trying it out. When someone comes up with something that works it is quickly tried by lots of hikers....like the alcohol soda can stoves. I use an open little sausage can in an esbit frame. A lot of hikers use trash bag raincoats. They are cheap and they work. I use trash bags to keep my stuff dry in my backpack but who doesn't. I don't use a ground cloth under my tent. I don't feel that the weight is worth what it provides. I use a garbage bag as a pack cover. I have a regular pack cover but the plastic bag is lighter. If there were a consensus about gear we'd all be carrying the same things. Pat from Maine and I have enough gear to be outfitters because we, like most hikers, try some of this and some of that. It's the never-ending gear quest. It's all good and all part of hiking. I have tyvek...it's under the shingles on the sides of my house.
Some fellow hikers found out about me selling leftover Tyvek on Ebay and asked if I could also sell their extra Tyvek for them. I now have over 300ft to sell.
Anybody interested in a piece of Tyvek sold by the Foot , It is available on Ebay at:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=5163947192&ssPageName=STRK:MESE:IT
Thanks ahead of time,
Myst
and members of Florida Trail Association
Lone Wolf
03-02-2005, 09:16
$2 per foot plus $6 shipping is kinda high, no? You can buy a 9' by 150' roll for $135.
As with everything, it's less expensive when you buy in large quanities.
The cheapest source is from construction sites, (free) but the pieces usually aren't big enough, (that is where I got my first piece), or you get several people to split the cost of a roll with. (wish I could have done that)
Home Depot won't sell sections of it , only the whole roll. You can do a search on Google for it and weed through all the sites for what you need/want. You'll find I am cheaper than most. Becareful though there is several types of Tyvek.
The Tyvek we have up for sale is the Dupont brand name Tyvek Homewrap ,supposed to be the best for ground sheet material. Link to ebay sale in a previous post.
hikerjohnd
03-02-2005, 13:17
$2 per foot plus $6 shipping is kinda high, no? You can buy a 9' by 150' roll for $135.
I thought about that before I purchased some from Myst. I almost bought a whole roll - but thankfully didn't. The $8 paid for the section I ordered is significantly cheaper than a whole roll - and I don't have to figure out what to do with the leftovers! So I guess the convenience outweighs the cost...:)