View Full Version : 2 years and still hurt
2 years ago I had only a few more miles to go to reach the Canadian border on my PCT hike. My feet still hurt every morning when I get out of bed. Also, down on the outside-back part of my heel it still hurts a lot. What should I do? Just suck it up and live with it?
2 years ago I had only a few more miles to go to reach the Canadian border on my PCT hike. My feet still hurt every morning when I get out of bed. Also, down on the outside-back part of my heel it still hurts a lot. What should I do? Just suck it up and live with it?I know for those who have suffered with plantar fasciitis, a lot of times it gets much better eventually, but never completely goes away. I don't know if this is what you have. Make sure you wear good quality shoes. Many of the choices for footwear today are rediculous. Some of the junk that is out there for sale is utterly horrible to put on ones feet. Also maybe foot massages or baths may help:-?.
I hate going to the doctors, but maybe thats what you should do? Two years is a long time to let something hurt like that. Sorry, just my .02 cents.
Bite the bullet and go to the doctor.
halftime
08-29-2011, 22:52
Try this (http://www.footsourcemd.com/products/detail.dT/97?gclid=COzO16mB9qoCFeoEQAodOFp1GA)...worked for me.
Not plantar faciitis. My doctor is a dweeb. He just says take it easy you are getting old. :(
Not plantar faciitis. My doctor is a dweeb. He just says take it easy you are getting old. :(
get a referral to a podiatrist. GP's really don't know much. They're pretty much just paper pushers and gateways to basic drugs or specialists.
Doc Mike
08-30-2011, 13:51
get a referral to a podiatrist. GP's really don't know much. They're pretty much just paper pushers and gateways to basic drugs or specialists.
Don't you think that is a very generic statement? Do you even know what a GP is, or the difference between them and family medicine or internal medicine?
I'm sure at 27 you are an expert on medicine and who is more qualified to treat certain disorders..
Snowleopard
08-30-2011, 14:38
sbhikes, I second the suggestion to get a referral to a podiatrist. Even better, find a podiatrist that sees lots of runners or a sports podiatrist; some of these are more focused on getting you back on the trail. I found someone here who does triathlons and has good recommendations from runners. I'm not sure how old you are, but you're surely younger than me. Having feet hurt everyday is not OK and shouldn't be accepted just on the basis of 'you're getting old'.
I have several great doctors, including my primary care; he generally diagnoses me but often sends me to a specialist. I've also had the occasional bad doctor. Finding a really good primary care doctor is the key to good medical care nowadays.
ChinMusic
08-30-2011, 15:15
sbhikes, I second the suggestion to get a referral to a podiatrist. Even better, find a podiatrist that sees lots of runners or a sports podiatrist; some of these are more focused on getting you back on the trail.
I agree with this a lot. Your foot issue might be just run-of-the-mill stuff or it might be something related to the extremes of long-distance hiking. I would seek council from someone who has more experience treating runners, etc.
+1 on seeing a podiatrist. You might also consider a sports medicine doctor. A good doctor will NEVER tell you you're getting old--they will try to figure out what is wrong with you and how to fix it.
That said, I hope you have good insurance. If your diagnosis is difficult, you might need an MRI, which runs into 4-figure territory.
BobTheBuilder
08-30-2011, 17:41
-1 on the podiatrist. I don't like them, they are not real medical doctors, but they let people think they are. Sneaky sneaky.
Have you considered that it could be tendonitis? Whoops, I'm not a medical doctor, either.
ChinMusic
08-30-2011, 18:00
A good doctor will NEVER tell you you're getting old--they will try to figure out what is wrong with you and how to fix it.
Disagree. With aging comes dings and dents that do NOT always require treatment. My fastball does not scare a 10-yr-old anymore....:(
Been there, done that.......
Saint Alfonzo
08-30-2011, 19:28
Hello SBhikes, how are YOU???? I feel Your pain. It sounds like Osteoarthrits to me..The reason I say that is, I have the same problem in both feet. Both feet have been x-rayed and M.R.I.
Thats my 2 cents worth.. You take care....MIKE....
I know it's from the hike. It's not debilitating. I can still hike a 30 mile day. But it's annoying. I guess I'm the only one whose feet still hurt 2 years later. It's the only remaining pain, too. I came home hobbling all the time and all the little pains above the ankles are long gone and only the ones below remain.
Disagree. With aging comes dings and dents that do NOT always require treatment. My fastball does not scare a 10-yr-old anymore....:(
Been there, done that.......
Humans lose muscle mass with age. So your fastball being slow is to be expected. But constant pain in your feet is not normal and should at least be investigated. Even if it's not treatable, a doctor can help with pain management.
ChinMusic
08-30-2011, 21:21
Humans lose muscle mass with age. So your fastball being slow is to be expected.
I am MUCH stronger than I was at age 25. That creeking, groaning, and poping ain't muscle. It's the accumulation of dings and dents collected through the years. Some of it may be "fixable" but most of it is not.
Snowleopard
08-30-2011, 21:26
Disagree. With aging comes dings and dents that do NOT always require treatment. My fastball does not scare a 10-yr-old anymore....:(
Been there, done that.......
I partly disagree with ChinMusic. You usually need to get those dings and dents diagnosed. Sometimes it should be treated and sometimes there's no cure. There's also a large gray area, there's no cure but there are treatments/exercises/changes that make it somewhat better. For me, there's a bunch of exercises and stretches that make my injuries 80 to 90% better. And my fastball was always slow anyway.
Diane,
Think about perusing medical supply outlets online, you can get a small portable ultrasonic device that will cut down on inflammation. My SO had chronic inflammation in the arch of his foot for 1+ years and this worked, along with rest, and massage w/a tennis ball. Good luck.
ChinMusic
08-30-2011, 21:42
I partly disagree with ChinMusic. You usually need to get those dings and dents diagnosed. Sometimes it should be treated and sometimes there's no cure. There's also a large gray area, there's no cure but there are treatments/exercises/changes that make it somewhat better. For me, there's a bunch of exercises and stretches that make my injuries 80 to 90% better. And my fastball was always slow anyway.
If I were 25 again and made my living from that fastball, I would do everything I could to correct that shoulder. At age 53 I accept it. Not everything can (or should) be cured. There ARE certain aches and pains that one has to learn to accept as they age or life will be very frustrating. I am NOT saying that SB's situation is aging, far from it. I suggested her having it checked out. I AM countering the point of "A good doctor will NEVER tell you you're getting old--they will try to figure out what is wrong with you and how to fix it." The very definition of getting old is that things start to break down. There is no fountain of youth.
rgarling
08-31-2011, 09:35
Try rolling your foot over something like a lacrosse ball. If you find a tender area, work that area. Try adding pressure to pin the tissue, and then flexing the foot over & around the pinned area. Stretch the calves and roll the muscles of the lower leg. Explore the range of motion of the foot using point/flex, side/side flex and circles. Work the tender areas.
Jim Adams
08-31-2011, 10:17
Try a "sports" savy chiropractor. On my thru in 2002 I was carried off the trail to a truck and driven out of the woods because my left knee was in so much pain I could no longer walk. I tried to take 2 weeks off to let it heal but nothing changed. I went to a chiropractor who took care of all the running sports atheletes at a major university. I literally hobbled into his office and 20 minutes later walked out normally and finished my thru without further problems. Hope it works for you!
geek
I really do not want any pain meds. They are always recalling them. No surgery either. I really question whether a doctor could do anything anyway. There is nothing to see. There is no manipulation of my feet that he could do that would pinpoint a site of injury. I'm sure nothing would show on an x-ray. He did give me x-rays right after the hike when I complained of the pain but they saw no osteoarthritis. Maybe I could get a prescription for massage therapy. That would be nice! Or maybe nightly golf ball rubs would help, although my arches don't hurt. Anyway, I'm 46. Not old, but old enough to start wearing drugstore reading glasses and young enough I can still out-hike most 22 year olds.
4eyedbuzzard
08-31-2011, 13:29
Well, let's look at it this way. The oldest NBA player is 39. There are maybe 6 NFL players over 40, and they are pretty much all kickers. In baseball, there are perhaps a dozen guys over 40, and they are with a couple of exceptions pinch hitters or relief pitchers. And they are the exceptions. Most athletes are done by 35. Over the hill. There is nobody 46 doing anything in competitive sports (other than golf and even then it's a downhill spiral), because, well, from a physical perspective as applied to competitive athletes, they're old and worn even if they are in great condition FOR THEIR AGE. They can't play with the 20 and 30 year olds because the body just ain't what it used to be - even with the best training, conditioning, and medical care in the world. And the tune is comparatively the same for EVERYONE else. The body slowly but surely wears out as we age, even if we do get in better aerobic or physical condition. The joints, the skeleton, the structure, simply can't repair the physical damage incurred in daily living as fast as that damage occurs. Just can't keep up. Just a fact of life.
But the mind doesn't really know time or age. It is arrogant and egotistical. The mind will push the body to do what it has always done before - until the body responds by saying to the brain, "ouch" - you aren't doing that to me any more. No matter what command you give me, I simply can't do that (at least not without telling you I'm hurt). The brain gains, or should gain, wisdom from this painful communication. Wisdom to see doctors and find out what is wrong. Or wisdom to slow down if medical care cannot repair the problem. Sometimes, the brain, like the child it is, needs to get the message repeated over and over before it sinks in. In children it's called being unruly - in adults it's called stubborness or, pathologically speaking, denial.;)
The mind should see an orthopaedist, particularly one who specializes in feet. The foot could have an injured ligament, tendon, cartilage, or scar tissue, bone spurs, osteo-arthritis, etc. But if the mind dismisses the proper modern medical care (and massages aren't medical care, nor are those providers who can't prescribe meds or order diagnostic imaging like MRI's), well, it will never know what is causing it, what treatment options are available, won't have a recovery plan, and will likely continue to suffer.
Massage would improve blood-flow to the feet which might help with the body's own healing.
As for being over the hill, pro sports are different than things like running or walking and hiking. It seems that for slow endurance exercises, the older you get the better you get to the point where the geezer who has kept up his endurance all his life will out-do the young buck over the long haul. They've proven this with distance runners. People peak in their 20s but in the end, someone at age 64 has the same ability as someone who is 17. The longer the course, the more equal the ability. And the difference between men and women also evens out. That's why you see so many older women winning excruciating ultramarathon races.
mmais68569
08-31-2011, 17:17
Question: Do you take any kind of Cholesterol Medicine????????
If so that may be your problem. I had the same symptoms Dr. said it was age & arthritis so I changed Drs & meds & guess what symptoms went away.
Mike ( Mr. Mean)
hikerboy57
08-31-2011, 18:19
I agree with seeing a podiatrist. Long distance hiking does strange things to your feet. they get bigger, they spread, and sometimes arches fall somewhat. a podiatrist may be able to correct your issue with nothing more than orthotic inserts.
I use to suffer from plantar-fasciitis-like pain (not diagnosed) for just over a year, but no more. Have been symptom free since early February. The only think I can attribute it to (that I did differently) is that I started barefoot-style running the end of last year (i.e. forefoot strike with minimalist shoes). No plantar pain for me while running like that, but it wipes out the calves so had to work up slowly. After a couple weeks of doing that, I could feel the symptoms diminish until it was completely gone a few weeks later. Before that I had to wear shoes with inserts just to walk around the house... also, around the same time, while in the house, I started going barefoot and making sure to do forefoot strikes rather than heel. The rest of the time, while walking around town, I tried to engage my calf muscles more and take it easy on the heels. I'm no doctor, but it seemed to work for me.
Is this the humor section? Suck it up pussy.
Wise Old Owl
08-31-2011, 21:48
SB I agree get to a podiatrist - really motivated me to get help and I wrote a thread at the beginning of the year.
Go for it.
I wish I could offer you good advice. I know you've already tried a bunch of different things with varying levels of success. I agree with you about not getting surgery and fancy new drugs. If you see any sort of medical practitioner again, I recommend a sports therapist that has good experience with long distance runners. I've been trying to find books and such lately on sports induced foot injuries and I've come to the conclusion that this is still a field very much in its infancy. So even though you might see someone, it'd still be a really good idea to keep doing your own research and to keep experimenting on your own.
find a sports doc with a good reputation.
Hi SB, sorry about your pain. I'm a tenderfoot too. When I was your age my feet were sore and the doc looked at my feet. He said I seemed to have LESS natural padding than the average.
Opposite of traditional wisdom on this site (Superfeet) I had to go for the softest insoles available. Spenco, whatever feels soft. Fot carrying backpack weight, "Soles" in the blue version, most padded one but support too.
Good luck, you want to be whistling out there, not wincing.
Different Socks
09-01-2011, 21:26
Sounds like it could be bone spurs. Have it checked out.
SassyWindsor
09-01-2011, 23:18
Find the best doctor of the feet, travel far if you must, and have this problem fixed. Check with running pros, etc to find the best. Without good wheels you might skid off the trail.
Well, let's look at it this way. The oldest NBA player is 39. There are maybe 6 NFL players over 40, and they are pretty much all kickers. In baseball, there are perhaps a dozen guys over 40, and they are with a couple of exceptions pinch hitters or relief pitchers. And they are the exceptions. Most athletes are done by 35. Over the hill. There is nobody 46 doing anything in competitive sports (other than golf and even then it's a downhill spiral), because, well, from a physical perspective as applied to competitive athletes, they're old and worn even if they are in great condition FOR THEIR AGE. They can't play with the 20 and 30 year olds because the body just ain't what it used to be - even with the best training, conditioning, and medical care in the world. And the tune is comparatively the same for EVERYONE else. The body slowly but surely wears out as we age, even if we do get in better aerobic or physical condition. The joints, the skeleton, the structure, simply can't repair the physical damage incurred in daily living as fast as that damage occurs. Just can't keep up. Just a fact of life.
But the mind doesn't really know time or age. It is arrogant and egotistical. The mind will push the body to do what it has always done before - until the body responds by saying to the brain, "ouch" - you aren't doing that to me any more. No matter what command you give me, I simply can't do that (at least not without telling you I'm hurt). The brain gains, or should gain, wisdom from this painful communication. Wisdom to see doctors and find out what is wrong. Or wisdom to slow down if medical care cannot repair the problem. Sometimes, the brain, like the child it is, needs to get the message repeated over and over before it sinks in. In children it's called being unruly - in adults it's called stubborness or, pathologically speaking, denial.;)
The mind should see an orthopaedist, particularly one who specializes in feet. The foot could have an injured ligament, tendon, cartilage, or scar tissue, bone spurs, osteo-arthritis, etc. But if the mind dismisses the proper modern medical care (and massages aren't medical care, nor are those providers who can't prescribe meds or order diagnostic imaging like MRI's), well, it will never know what is causing it, what treatment options are available, won't have a recovery plan, and will likely continue to suffer.
http://www.olympia-greece.org/yianniskouros.html
? (http://www.olympia-greece.org/yianniskouros.html)???
SassyWindsor
09-01-2011, 23:51
I constantly care for my feet and footwear. About once a month I use a callus shaver, clipper, and a sanding pad on my feet. I keep my footwear clean and treated, laces and footpads clean and in good shape.
Blissful
09-02-2011, 11:46
Not plantar faciitis. My doctor is a dweeb. He just says take it easy you are getting old. :(
Get a good sports dr to evaluate. Even if you had to go to several. Took me two different ones to find the one to help me, and he's been great.
Snowleopard
09-02-2011, 14:04
I saw my podiatrist today for a bunion for the first time and I'm impressed. He told me how to minimize the blisters that the bunion was causing, but my main problem seems to be that my foot is not stable enough which then leads to other problems. He diagnosed this by watching me walk barefoot. Much of what he told me fits with things I already knew, and it all makes sense to me. I'll need orthotics which my insurance will pay for ($500). I have to wonder if they'll help with my bad knees and hips by providing more stability. They may save me money in the long run because my hiking boots wear out at the rear outside corner of the heel. If I wear shoes past the point where this wear is noticeable, my hips start hurting.
My foot problems are different from yours, but I'd say a good podiatrist can be pretty helpful. This one is a triathlete and had recommendations from runners. A good starting point might be to find a local running club and ask if their members know a good podiatrist who helps them keep running.
4eyedbuzzard
09-02-2011, 14:43
http://www.olympia-greece.org/yianniskouros.html
? (http://www.olympia-greece.org/yianniskouros.html)???
http://www.olympia-greece.org/yianniskouros.html
? (http://www.olympia-greece.org/yianniskouros.html)???
There are always exceptions. But we aren't talking about the one or two exceptions here. Most of us, including the OP, aren't world class athletes.
You're 27. Get back to me to 25 years and tell me all about how your feet and other joints are as good or better than they are right now.
ChinMusic
09-02-2011, 15:04
You're 27. Get back to me to 25 years....
My aren't you optimistic............:D
4eyedbuzzard
09-02-2011, 15:26
My aren't you optimistic............:D
I'll be a spry 80. [Trying not to be a pestimist about lasting that long]
ChinMusic
09-02-2011, 15:37
I'll be a spry 80. [Trying not to be a pestimist about lasting that long]
And planning on taking on Cimarron's record in another 10.....
modiyooch
09-02-2011, 20:07
sbhikes, I think we probably compared notes two years ago. I went to a great podiatrist who is a runner. He told me what was going on and my options. I did buy the orthodics and did everything he told me to do, but two years later the problem is exactly the same. Since it doesn't stop me from running or hiking, I have decided to just live with it. Mine is not P F . I acquired the condition while hiking in the Whites.
Pedaling Fool
09-02-2011, 20:13
I have some advice in this area, but I've been told I'm too macho for these type of threads -- Sorry.
modiyooch
09-03-2011, 14:16
One thing my doctor told me was to never walk barefoot. I placed crocks beside my bed and slipped into them first thing in the morning, and in the middle of the night. For running, I'm fine as long as I am in a certain style of running shoes. The arch has to be a certain angle, and no ristriction in the toe box. Also, I am fine in heels, it's the flats that hurt.
I don't buy into that never go barefoot you need orthotics BS. At the 800 mile mark, I bought some motion control shoes and they drove me off the trail. I was in agony after only 100 miles and after about 250 miles I was done and had to go home. I healed my broken feet by walking my neighborhood in bare feet. Never again will I wear over-built things on my feet. What worked for me for the first 800 miles were cushy, generously-sized running shoes with extra cushioning insoles, sometimes in two layers. That's what I went with for my 2nd attempt and they worked well.
I still ended up with lingering pain after the hike, but at least I walked happily all the way to the end of the trail. I think some of my lingering pain is from the first attempt that hurt me so bad. The other pains I have are from the 2nd attempt because I went too fast up hills and strained some tendons in my heel. I'm just really surprised after all this time the pain is still with me.
I don't buy into that never go barefoot you need orthotics BS. At the 800 mile mark, I bought some motion control shoes and they drove me off the trail. I was in agony after only 100 miles and after about 250 miles I was done and had to go home. I healed my broken feet by walking my neighborhood in bare feet. Never again will I wear over-built things on my feet. What worked for me for the first 800 miles were cushy, generously-sized running shoes with extra cushioning insoles, sometimes in two layers. That's what I went with for my 2nd attempt and they worked well.
I still ended up with lingering pain after the hike, but at least I walked happily all the way to the end of the trail. I think some of my lingering pain is from the first attempt that hurt me so bad. The other pains I have are from the 2nd attempt because I went too fast up hills and strained some tendons in my heel. I'm just really surprised after all this time the pain is still with me.Yeah it sounds as if the replacement shoes you started using while well into your journey your first time simply did not agree with your feet. This can easily happen, and unfortunately they went on to hurt/disable your feet to the point you were actually driven off of the trail. Most likely the pain you still suffer with today was caused by those very shoes. Once a long distance hike gets underway, and someones been out there for a long time, from what I have learned one has to be extra careful about changing their footwear in mid hike. Sometimes one has no other choice but to replace worn out shoes or boots, but I think the feet become accostomed to the fit and feel of a boot or shoe, and an abrupt change can sometimes bring on foot trouble.
LisaJ5227
09-07-2011, 14:46
I too suffered with PF had the shots then podistrist wanted to do the surgery NO WAY. So I researched some different avenues many years ago I was rolfed to take care of a muscular back injury that became chronic and was completely cured of the problem so I knew that many times trigger points would cause pain in areas that seem completely unrelated ex. Pain in shoulder but trigger point causing problem is in shoulder. Found out trigger point for PF is in the calf area( you need to look it up) just find that very tender area and you will feel a small hard knot about the size of a pea and focus on putting pressure and daily working that knot out and PRESTO no more foot pain. It is a mercy and I had PF in both my feet!
LisaJ5227
09-07-2011, 14:53
I wear five fingers alot it makes my feet stronger and go barefoot as much as possible. I have noticed more PF since people are cushioning their feet more with gels and orthotics. I even have five fingers made for hiking but only wear them on certain trails. I hope this helps and I am certain it will if you try it.
skinewmexico
09-07-2011, 15:36
Go see this guy - http://sock-doc.com/
I don't buy into that never go barefoot you need orthotics BS.
I've been reading a book about orthotics that focuses mostly on foot orthotics. It's hilarious how they recommend orthotics for almost everything, even for perfectly functioning feet. The one exception is that it says that if you use orthotics for performance activities and don't feel pain in daily life, don't wear the custom orthotics in daily life. That tied into another quote that basically says that what you support will become weaker.
As far as pain goes, I've been increasing my training, but I still can't see the day that I can walk thru hiker miles and not feel any tightness or pain at the end of the day. I'd love to get to the end of the trail and feel like I merely went for a leisurely stroll around the block.
Blissful
09-07-2011, 19:15
I don't buy into that never go barefoot you need orthotics BS. At the 800 mile mark, I bought some motion control shoes and they drove me off the trail. I was in agony after only 100 miles and after about 250 miles I was done and had to go home. I healed my broken feet by walking my neighborhood in bare feet. Never again will I wear over-built things on my feet. What worked for me for the first 800 miles were cushy, generously-sized running shoes with extra cushioning insoles, sometimes in two layers. That's what I went with for my 2nd attempt and they worked well.
I still ended up with lingering pain after the hike, but at least I walked happily all the way to the end of the trail. I think some of my lingering pain is from the first attempt that hurt me so bad. The other pains I have are from the 2nd attempt because I went too fast up hills and strained some tendons in my heel. I'm just really surprised after all this time the pain is still with me.
Totally depends on your foot type. If you have a higher arch, cushy shoes work great (my hubby wears them). If you are flat and pronate, like me, without motion control and stiffer insoles (I wear blue superfeet), I get terrible shin splints.
Maybe you're gonna be a vibram five finger kind of gal. :)
Sure hope you get a solution.
Shutterbug
09-07-2011, 20:16
2 years ago I had only a few more miles to go to reach the Canadian border on my PCT hike. My feet still hurt every morning when I get out of bed. Also, down on the outside-back part of my heel it still hurts a lot. What should I do? Just suck it up and live with it?
I lived with foot pain for several years. My doctor recommended an orthopedic surgeon, but I consider surgery as a last resort. I went to a physical therapist and he recommended Superfeet. The Superfeet helped, but didn't complete resolve the pain. I tried Vibram 5 finger shoes and the pain is gone. I wear them almost exclusively. I still suffer with "normal" shoes on Sunday mornings when I go to church.
I still wear boots when I am doing work where there is a risk of dropping something heavy on my foot and when there is snow or ice on the ground.