View Full Version : Comfort-Light Hikers
Is it just me or do others also go with light to ultralight equipment anywhere possible only so they can bring along comfort items comfortably?
With my gear, by have a sub-7 lb. base weight of my big 4, I can easily bring along an MP3 player, reading book, camera, musical instrument, extra fleece or socks, etc and still be no more than 30-35 lbs. with food and water.
I figure if I can get my "survival kit" as minimal in weight as possible, everything thereafter is a bonus and who doesn't like bonuses! 5 lbs. of strategically chosen comfort items would earn their keep a lot better than 5 lbs. of an overly heavy tent, bag, and pack, right? And if they don't, then it's easy to decide what needs to go.
Anyway, the actual numbers aren't important in my question, but you see what I mean. Do any of you cut weight everywhere just to add some of it back with comfort items only because you can spare the weight or is this completely preposterous and against all rational hike-light thinking? :eek:
The Solemates
03-03-2005, 14:50
Is it just me or do others also go with light to ultralight equipment anywhere possible only so they can bring along comfort items comfortably?
With my gear, by have a sub-7 lb. base weight of my big 4, I can easily bring along an MP3 player, reading book, camera, musical instrument, extra fleece or socks, etc and still be no more than 30-35 lbs. with food and water.
I figure if I can get my "survival kit" as minimal in weight as possible, everything thereafter is a bonus and who doesn't like bonuses! 5 lbs. of strategically chosen comfort items would earn their keep a lot better than 5 lbs. of an overly heavy tent, bag, and pack, right? And if they don't, then it's easy to decide what needs to go.
Anyway, the actual numbers aren't important in my question, but you see what I mean. Do any of you cut weight everywhere just to add some of it back with comfort items only because you can spare the weight or is this completely preposterous and against all rational hike-light thinking? :eek:
sounds feasible to me. but i view my book and my digital camera as survival items that are just as important as my sleeping bag.
hikerjohnd
03-03-2005, 16:27
I have thought about this very issue (give up the extra shorts for the luxurylite pillow) and on short trips I found that I did not have time to really enjoy the luxury of the luxury item. For example, my MP3 player went unused on my last trip, as I hit the sack at dusk and went right to sleep. I enjoy cooking but, I will probably start the AT with an alcohol stove. I have a simmerlite waiting in the wings in case I decide to upgrade enroute - the simmerlite would be a luxury item for me. I have started to look at light gear in a new fashion. An ounce or two here and there to add comfort is OK with me. I still carry 30-40 lbs w/food & water and that is very comfortable for me. In the summer that drops about 3 pounds as the wollens are left behind.
hungryhowie
03-03-2005, 16:34
My philosphy on how I pack has evolved constantly since I began thinking about it 5 years ago. The one thing that's held constant through the entire evolution has been the goal of efficiency. I usually go for the lightest weight alternative, but will (and have) decided against some because I am concerned that they will influence my efficiency negatively. An example of this is choosing to use an OR bug bivy over an A16 bug bivy. The A16 is lighter, but it's not fully enclosed, which means that I am still more vulnerable to the critters, which could result in a less restful night's sleep. Also, I gave up closed-cell foam pads in lieu of inflating ones to obtain more restful sleep.
That said, with photography, my most recent hobby, picking up steam (and weight) quickly, I've been more into cutting my weight back lately so that I can carry more photography equipment comfortably.
In 2001, I hiked the Long Trail with a sub 6-pound base weight (everything except for consumables). Even after a successful AT thruhike, however, I didn't have enough experience to choose my equipment correctly, and I spent several very uncomfortably cool nights shivering and wishing I'd carried more. After that hike, I bumped my base weight up to about 8 pounds, which was quite comfortable, resulting in a total weight for a week, including 3L of water, at less than 20 pounds. Now that I'm carrying 10 pounds of photography gear, I'm trying to get it back down as close as I can to 5 pounds again...but this time I"ve gpt to do it right.
-howie
I don't go to the wilds to be comfortable, so I leave all that behind. I enjoy just being there. The only comfort item I suppose I bring is a digital camera, but that is for memories. So technically the only comfort I get from the camera is at home.
My encounter with a hiker who made such a choice was several years ago on top of Bromley. Fellow comes in, apparently a thru-hiker, and starts setting up his gear in the warming hut at the top. He had no tent and even omitted a sleeping bag to save weight. He shoved his feet into his pack at night and used his poly jacket for the top. All well and good. In fact I was very impressed with his attention to minimizing weight in his pack. He then pulled out a cast iron fry pan about eight inches in diameter. Claimed he brought it all the way from Georgia because he liked the way it cooked food.
Doc
My encounter with a hiker who made such a choice was several years ago on top of Bromley. Fellow comes in, apparently a thru-hiker, and starts setting up his gear in the warming hut at the top. He had no tent and even omitted a sleeping bag to save weight. He shoved his feet into his pack at night and used his poly jacket for the top. All well and good. In fact I was very impressed with his attention to minimizing weight in his pack. He then pulled out a cast iron fry pan about eight inches in diameter. Claimed he brought it all the way from Georgia because he liked the way it cooked food. LOL lol lol.
SGT Rock
03-03-2005, 21:57
Lets see, my luxury items....
Warm clothing (I don't want to snivel about the weather), bourbon, fresh ground coffee, a comfy and warm hammock, an FM radio, a camera and journal to record everything as I go, and occasionally a book. I enjoy where I go :D
....still be no more than 30-35 lbs. with food and water.
It seems that 30 lbs is a magic number for most hikers. At or below 30 almost no one complains. Dropping to 20 or even 15 doesn't seem to make the hike much better. And the goodies you can carry at 30 lbs are a big bonus (like FOOD and lots of WATER). For me, anything that helps me sleep all night is the most important place to add weight... warmer bag, bigger tent, down booties, pillow...)
Right. I think there is a point of negative return in regards to how much an average person can carry comfortably and how little they can get away with carrying. I may be able to complete a thru with only 20 lbs. of gear but how much more taxing would the hike be at 25 or 30 lbs.? (Especially if that weight was for making the hike more enjoyable)
Is going from 20 to 30 lbs felt the same as going from 30 to 40 lbs? I think if I went from 0-10 lbs versus 30-40 lbs there would be a much bigger work load with the heavier base weight. (Physics has been a few years but from the way some of you jumped on that alcohol vs jetboil problem perhaps we'll soon know)
I'm thinking there is a sliding scale, according to personal body style, of a negligible weight zone. Say for me, a 6'1 180 lb. male, the difference between 25 lbs. and 30 lbs is felt less than if I were going from 35 to 40 lbs. Maybe, maybe not. Just thinking out loud.
If that's so, then it gets even more tempting to fill that negligible weight zone with some items which can only add to your trip's enjoyment.
What do you think? Is the 1st pound just as heavy as the 30th pound on your back or have you found a negligible weight zone?
hungryhowie
03-04-2005, 10:06
It seems that 30 lbs is a magic number for most hikers. At or below 30 almost no one complains. Dropping to 20 or even 15 doesn't seem to make the hike much better. And the goodies you can carry at 30 lbs are a big bonus (like FOOD and lots of WATER). For me, anything that helps me sleep all night is the most important place to add weight... warmer bag, bigger tent, down booties, pillow...)
Well, for me the number is 20 pounds :)
If I'm carrying less than 20 pounds you won't hear a peep. 30 pounds?!? What are you carrying that weighs ThAT much? :-?
-howie
When one carries 30 lbs compared to 20 lbs one will end up needing much more food, and therefore ends up carying abit more in food weight. Not that, that is too big of a deal. All I mean is that if one has a 20# FSO weight, one will not actually be able to carry 10# more of comfort items, since one will need more food.
Well, for me the number is 20 pounds :)
If I'm carrying less than 20 pounds you won't hear a peep. 30 pounds?!? What are you carrying that weighs ThAT much? :-?
-howie
2 gallons of water = 16 lbs. Hiking for two days and two nights and never having to search for water or purify water is wonderful. Try it sometime.
SGT Rock
03-07-2005, 00:08
2 gallons of water = 16 lbs. Hiking for two days and two nights and never having to search for water or purify water is wonderful. Try it sometime.
Actually it would be 17.9 pounds right?
RagingHampster
03-07-2005, 00:44
I definetly think there is a point of diminishing return, which then becomes a negative return as I cut my packweight. I'd say the three most important items in this category would be my pack, boots, and sleeping pad. I don't turn a blind-eye to their weight, but I am much more lenient than with my other items. Having comfortable feet, shoulders, back, hips, and a good nights sleep are essential to me. My pack and sleeping pad are about 40% of my dry packweight (16lbs).
I definetly think there is a point of diminishing return, which then becomes a negative return as I cut my packweight. I'd say the three most important items in this category would be my pack, boots, and sleeping pad. I don't turn a blind-eye to their weight, but I am much more lenient than with my other items. Having comfortable feet, shoulders, back, hips, and a good nights sleep are essential to me. My pack and sleeping pad are about 40% of my dry packweight (16lbs).
Welcome back Hampster...missed you a long time!!! Hope things are going well!!! :welcome :clap
bearbag hanger
03-07-2005, 09:06
I think each of us finds a weight we are comfortable with. My comfort zone is about 30 lbs, which I have a hard time getting down to coming out of town. When I'm at or below about 30 lbs, I rarely take my pack off for breaks, etc. Above that and I have to stop more frequently, which, of course, slows me down.
I have a friend who is comfortable with about 37 - 38 pounds. Whenever he gets below that, he starts packing in hot dogs, beer, etc. to share with his hiking buddies. But he's a lot bigger than I am and often teases me for not carring more comfort items and hiking too slow.
Anyway, I thought water weighed 8.3 lbs per gallon, 2 X 8.3 = 16.6? I guess I could find my scale and weigh some.
squirrel bait
03-07-2005, 09:21
My guess is water comes in at 8.48 lbs per gallon. Carrying that much water opens up endless possibilities on where/when to stop for the day. Camping on some of the dry ridges is an example. Or the best spot of all......right where you are when you want to. I like the idea.
bulldog49
03-07-2005, 10:03
I definetly think there is a point of diminishing return, which then becomes a negative return as I cut my packweight. I'd say the three most important items in this category would be my pack, boots, and sleeping pad. I don't turn a blind-eye to their weight, but I am much more lenient than with my other items. Having comfortable feet, shoulders, back, hips, and a good nights sleep are essential to me. My pack and sleeping pad are about 40% of my dry packweight (16lbs).
Best advice I've read on WB.
peter_pan
03-07-2005, 10:04
Base weights under 12 lb are pretty achievable which will let a seasoned hiker cover 60-80 miles in 3.5-4 days with 7 lbs of food to start and and 2 lbs of water...for a start weight of approx 20 lbs and a flying last day or two weight of 14-15, sling into resupply with 12-13 lbs.
That said, I had base weigt below 10, but bulked up with a few luxury items.
Python skins, less than 2 oz, because convience of the camp self contained on the stored hammock is tooo darn nice.
Pack back and butt pad, 12x20 piece of 3/8 closed cell, 2 oz, is too comfortable a rest stops.
3-4 oz extra in the first aid fit...because it makes sense to me. My Ambusol has saved the day for another hiker with a bad tooth ache.
4 oz for my umbrella hat....it works...gets used daily as a bowl when rooting thru the food bag because what I want is on the bottom...lets me hike comfortably in most rain without other gear, allow use of hiking poles...enables me to leave sunglasses home as it provides shade on occasional balds and the Va and Pa open areas.
Rain pants, 4 oz, not necessary, but so much nicer when condition really are sh**y
Waldies 12 oz...actually 11.5 now that two year of near daily wear have worn them down...Again, not necessary but soooo much convience and comfort and no wrestling with foot gear to get up at night...stick legs out of hammock into waldies and take a walk....it is so easy with the quilt system that some time I don't think I even wake up...least I frequenly don't remember taking the walk by the morning.
3 oz for a small camera....thanks for the memories.
0.4 oz for a couple pieces of note paper and pencil....thanks for the memories.
This really is a lot of luxury....now that I thnk about it... but at 11.4 lbs who cares, right ?
SGT Rock
03-07-2005, 10:12
I am in the same trend, every time I get my pack weight base very low, I think of something I want to make it more fun or more comfortable. My total pack weight stays around 25-30 depending on the trip.
Good topic. After 6 years of obsessing, I got my base weight down to slightly less than 6lbs this past fall. Homemade pack (6.5oz), tarp, quilt, etc. My basement looks like Dr. Frankenstein's laboratory with my poor sewing maching begging for mercy in the middle of it all.
5 months later, I'm up to 16lbs base (total about 25-30lbs). I figured if I added 10lbs of "comfort items" (hammock, GG Latitute, single malt scotch, catenary tarp, Jetboil, etc.) to my base and lost 10lbs off my gut, I'd be even, right? :rolleyes: Let's just say that achieving superultralight was fun and maybe even an ego thing, but "comfort light" works much better for me now.
Eric
johnny quest
05-02-2005, 09:52
i know others have said this before but rather than agonizing over how much this sleeping pad weighs or if i can get 6 uses out of my hankerchief...why not just lose some weight??? few of us couldnt afford to. i tell you why...we love tinkering with gear and we hate dieting. afterall, one of the great pleasures of a long hike is stopping at that first convenience store and scaring the begesus out of the clerk with our animal-like manners and odors, as we devour everything on the candy and chip aisle.
My summer weight with five days food and two quarts water is about 37 lbs. Winter weight goes up by at least 5 lbs. Different stove, minus-five-degree sleeping bag, more clothes, different clothes. The extra carry-weight is definitely noticeable. Add packing up wet or damp gear in cold weather and it becomes at least 10 lbs. extra vs. summer weight. A real negative in the Comfort Dept. that I can't help but notice.
And to think when I first started backpacking I was convinced lugging around 65 lbs. was normal and acceptable, and rarely brought a complaint?
kdholmwood
05-02-2005, 13:47
In Britain, gear can get wet and stay wet for a week or more. Has anyone calculated how many extra pounds we carry when our tent or tarp, pack, groundsheet, rain gear, and perhaps some spare clothing get soaked?
I used some Montrail shoes with goretex linings last year. The lining membrane failed after a few days and I am sure the extra weight of thick, wet socks must have nullified any ounces saved through not wearing boots. These saturated lightweight shoes also tenderized my feet and gave me my first blisters in fifteen years.
Comfort for me includes gaiters, a pack cover and a tough rubble sack to keep things dry. I love my Squall, by the way, but it often necessitates a warmer and heavier sleeping bag than would a tent. A sil-nylon Packa or pack cover is much more likely to be lacerated by a thorn than heavier materials.
There are also situations in which my 5lb Macpac is more comfortable than my P2, which weighs 3lb 4oz with all the extra options, particularly inclement conditions.
Keith
tlbj6142
05-02-2005, 13:59
why not just lose some weight???Because body weight isn't shown on my spreadsheet.:D