View Full Version : 100% Propane For Backpacking
hikin_jim
01-13-2012, 03:29
Yes, you read that correctly, 100% propane for backpacking.
The ideal set up is the 226g/8oz 100% propane Bernzomatic PowerCell (http://adventuresinstoving.blogspot.com/2011/12/100-propane-for-backpacking-yes.html) -- if you can find them. They're out there, but they're tough to find.
Absent a PowerCell, you can use an adapter like the Kovea LPG (propane) adapter (http://adventuresinstoving.blogspot.com/2012/01/100-propane-for-backpacking-ii.html) with common 16.4oz/465g propane cylinders, the kind everyone uses for car camping.
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-9_FllpOmkDw/Tw1GHeA4FqI/AAAAAAAAB6U/0DSGwX2xLEY/s500/P1090507.JPG
What are the considerations involved with the use of such an adapter and 100% propane for backpacking stoves? I address these and other practical matters of propane for backpacking in my latest blog post: 100% Propane For Backpacking (http://adventuresinstoving.blogspot.com/2012/01/100-propane-for-backpacking-ii.html).
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-nRj34KzqztA/Tw1FsIGuI_I/AAAAAAAAB44/1HjBbbAELcQ/s500/P1090499.JPG
HJ
Very cool, so if I used this adapter with the soto microregulator as in picture would it be safer? The regulator on a barbaque is what makes the propane safer to use. So would the regulator on the soto do the same job or should I attach a separate propane regulator? I know there are still risks, I guess, so I relieve you of any responsibility if I catch fire while doing this. Let me know what you think.
hikin_jim
01-13-2012, 12:42
Hi Tomp,
That's a good question. I think the regulator would make it safer, but I don't know what pressure settings the Soto's regulator is optimized for. I actually have a Soto in my stove collection. Maybe I'll take it out and try it.
The first thing is always to try it on low and test things well before committing to a long trail with the set up!
HJ
yeah, I think it would be safe or safer than nothing. But in general I think the best idea is to stay close to the stove when in use and turn off immediately if it blows out. I ordered a kovea lpg adapter so I will let you know how it goes.
hikin_jim
01-13-2012, 14:43
Hi, Tomp,
The thing I noticed is that if I keep it turned down low is that things work fine. I haven't tried to open the valve fully, but there's no need to. The pressure with propane is higher, so even with the valve turned down a bit, the flame size is similar to fully open. Plenty of power in other words.
HJ
Feral Bill
01-13-2012, 14:44
As it's a discontinued product, does it really matter?
propane cylinder is not a distcontinued product just the 8 oz variety. Propane is widely used and more available then the isobutane propane mixes which are typical only in outfitter stores. I can get propane at home depot, outfitters, and walmart (about half the price too). The coleman 2 burner, lanterns, space heaters, and similar products are designed to work on propane cylinders, 16 oz instead of 8 oz. I wonder how long a 16 oz cyclinder would last backpacking. Im guessing about 5 times longer then the isobutanes so possibly up to a month maybe a week more. 2 times the weight but alot more use.
You're playing with fire (pun intended) by attempting to use propane without a regulator. Your local hardware store should carry small low pressure regulators (mine does). Get the smallest available or better yet, rob one off a Coleman camp stove. Either way you'll have to find/make an adapter.
Personally, for really cold weather I'd go with liquid fuel.
hikin_jim
01-13-2012, 15:16
You're playing with fire (pun intended) by attempting to use propane without a regulator. Your local hardware store should carry small low pressure regulators (mine does). Get the smallest available or better yet, rob one off a Coleman camp stove. Either way you'll have to find/make an adapter.
Personally, for really cold weather I'd go with liquid fuel. Chief,
Yes, you're right. However, there is valve built into the adapter, there's a valve on the proximal end of the stove stand, and there's a valve at the distal end of the stove stand. At each valve there is a pressure drop. With care, it works, but you could get into trouble if you opened up all the valves. You could get flame lift off which could be dangerous. This is a bicycle with the training wheels off. Safety is now up to you. Yipes.
One might do better with liquid fuel. Certainly below -30F, I'd go with liquid fuel over propane, but even at temps warmer than -30F, many will go with liquid fuel. In a way, I can't say what is going to be worthwhile to whom. I'm just showing what's possible. It's up to the individual to decide if the technique is useful and also up to the individual to assess the risk.
HJ
I wonder how long a 16 oz cyclinder would last backpacking. Im guessing about 5 times longer then the isobutanes so possibly up to a month maybe a week more. 2 times the weight but alot more use.Hmm, I wonder how you guess "5 times longer" when propane and butane have nearly identical BTU ratings. Since propane cylinders are necessarily heavier, I would guess 3 times the weight - twice the use. Not a very good ratio.
Hmm, I wonder how you guess "5 times longer" when propane and butane have nearly identical BTU ratings. Since propane cylinders are necessarily heavier, I would guess 3 times the weight - twice the use. Not a very good ratio.
8oz isobutane/propane canister weighs in at 16 oz. giving 8 oz of dead weight. Propane 16.4 oz container weighs in at 29 oz. 12.6 oz dead weight. Even at 2 times efficiency it is less dead weight then carrying the equivalent (2 canisters) of 8oz isobutane fuel. Maybe not necessary to carry this much fuel but I like options and this gives me the option to buy whatever is available or cheaper. I have heard people say that fuel can be few and far between on a thru hike so if I find that is true I can get one of these to last a long way. Also I see using this on short hikes because the cost savings will be worth extra weight on short trips and since I dont carry much on short trips it wont phase me. Also most people dont bother with a regulator on a isobutane mix fuel so even though the btu are similar I will get more efficiency out of both fuels than most people do on isobutane. 5 times is a wild guess as I dont really know though.
hikin_jim
01-13-2012, 18:55
A couple of things:
1. There are some brands of 16oz/450g backpacking gas canisters out there. Primus, Camping Gas, and Jetboil are what I've seen locally. They're hard to find though.
2. The real advantage of 100% propane is for cold weather. Propane will continue to provide gas long after butane and isobutane sit uselessly in the bottom of a full but non-functional canister.
3. Propane would also be good for trail head camps so you can a) save money and b) start on the trail with your backpacking type canisters full.
Most people won't carry a big, heavy duty propane canister for just normal weather hiking, although I suppose you could. It's $2.56 for 465g if you buy a two pack of propane at Wal-Mart whereas a backpacking canister costs $9.00 for 450g -- if you can even find the 450g size.
HJ
hikin_jim
01-13-2012, 22:12
propane cylinder is not a distcontinued product just the 8 oz variety.Exactly right.
Propane is widely used and more available then the isobutane propane mixes which are typical only in outfitter stores.The thing that sparked my interest was that a guy I know backpacks in rural New Mexico. He flys in, so he can't bring fuel. The fuel that's most regularly available? The 16.4oz/465g cyliders of 100% propane. The stoves that are built for them are bulky and heavy. He wanted a way to use his regular backpacking canister stove with propane cylinders. The adapter I have on my blog is that way.
HJ
Feral Bill
01-14-2012, 01:01
The light weight propane cylinders that would be suitable for backpackiing are discontinued. Using the heavy ones as a solution to the flying in issue makes some sense, at least for shorter trips.
hikin_jim
01-14-2012, 02:26
The light weight propane cylinders that would be suitable for backpackiing are discontinued. Yeah. Just my luck. I find the perfect canister... after it's been discontinued. lol.
Using the heavy ones as a solution to the flying in issue makes some sense, at least for shorter trips. I've got some more ideas up my sleeve on this, but nothing as nice as the now discontinued 8oz PowerCells.
HJ
So I looked around for more regulator advice and it seems that no regulator is necessary. The same fuel cylinder is used for propane sodering torches with no regulator. So it seems that this would be no different than that application. The pressure on these small canisters is small so a regulator is not as critical as in the large bbq tanks. I am just gonna go with my soto with micro regulator and be careful.
hikin_jim
01-14-2012, 03:44
Ah. Good to know. Thanks for checking into that.
HJ