Moving the AT completely out of the SNP

[moldy]

At some point the overcrowded zoo like conditions in the SNP will motivate the ATC to move the Appalachian Trail perhaps 50 miles to the west on the other side of the valley. The huge boom in the US population and increased trail use will require it. It's just a matter of time. 10 years from now or 50 years, it's gonna happen. The Park Service wants us out anyway. Some of the hikers are currently looking for ways to lessen the pain by hitching around it or by speed hiking. Some even skip this section by "aqua-blazing" in a canoe down the river all the way to Harpers Ferry from Rockfish Gap. I know that having the trail in the park is a real money maker for the trail club, so they will be the big political resistors to the move.

[Pedaling Fool]

First I've heard of that, but I'd be alright with the move. I remember, on many occasions, looking west over the valley and wondering if there were leprechauns in them there woods:)

[rhjanes]

Maybe not. I'm sure Congress will authorize the NPS to conduct a study on how much hikers are spending at the waysides, and other spending. This study will be funded with $2,500,000.00. After the study, a proposal will be made in congress to double the cost of all items at the waysides, thereby increasing the revenue. Our government at it's finest.

[d.o.c]

First I've heard of that, but I'd be alright with the move. I remember, on many occasions, looking west over the valley and wondering if there were leprechauns in them there woods:) there are..

[Spokes]

?...The Park Service wants us out anyway. ....

Speculation? Innuendo? Hearsay? The result of a comment by some disgruntled Park Service employee?

Provide proof please.

Hikers taking the easy way around to "lessen the pain"? Are these the same ones seen atop Mt. Katahdin proclaiming they "hiked the whole trail"? Don't get me started.

[WingedMonkey]

I've never found the trails in Shenandoah to be that crowded. And out of the main season down right empty. And there are plenty of other trails in the nearby National Forests. Of course the maintaining club you dislike so mush also has responsibility over most of them.
They will move the trail in Shenandoah about the same time they move the horses out of Great Smoky. Never

[ATsawyer]

Doubtful if ever. As one who spends a lot of time in that Park, I can attest to the LACK of crowds most days. In fact, if you remove all those pesky thru-hikers who want to tramp through Shen the first week of June, the trails become downright empty save for weekender day hikes to Mary's Rock, Stony Man, and a few other points of interest.

[burger]

Maybe not. I'm sure Congress will authorize the NPS to conduct a study on how much hikers are spending at the waysides, and other spending. This study will be funded with $2,500,000.00. After the study, a proposal will be made in congress to double the cost of all items at the waysides, thereby increasing the revenue. Our government at it's finest.
This is one of the dumber comments I've seen on WB. If you're not a fan of government, I would encourage you to stay off the government-owned AT (except for the handful of miles that are still privately owned). Fortunately, there are lots of great hiking opportunities on private property.

[ATsawyer]

Why yes. I'd say the AT is our government at it's finest. If anything, the NPS is underfunded.

[RevLee]

At some point the overcrowded zoo like conditions in the SNP...

The only part of the AT through SNP that would qualify for this is the VERY short section that merges with the Stony Man Trail. It would make much more sense in GSMNP than SNP. The lack of privies plus the volume of foot traffic through GSMNP made it far worse than SNP.

[hikerboy57]

might be a good idea to reroute it around the whites too, way too crowded in august(except when i get lonely).might want to shorten the trail, too. way too long.speringer to neels gap. LW says damascus hates thru hikers.
(please note liberal use of sarcasm w/o smileys

[Slo-go'en]

I'm no big fan of the trail through SNP, but it ain't gonna move, ever. Though moving it west through the George Washington National Forest might not be all that bad an idea.

[Miner]

Given that the federal agency that manages the AT is the NPS, why would the NPS want the AT out of an area they control? :confused: I don't get it.

Typically when a trail becomes excessively overused, whatever federal agency overseeing the area (USFS, NPS, BLM) starts putting trailhead quotas and requires permits even for day hikes. Due to their popularity, a couple of trailheads that I use requires me to stop at a ranger station to pick up a dayhike permit with a limited quota during the summer months. To day hike Mt. Whitney in Caifornia, you even have to participate in a lottery to use the trailhead there. You'll see something like this long before you see them moving the AT due to too much traffic.

[campingfever]

I heard the SMNP was installing ski lifts to carry the thru hikers across, and as long as the hiker doesn't fall out they will still be counted as a thru hiker.

[RWheeler]

I heard the SMNP was installing ski lifts to carry the thru hikers across, and as long as the hiker doesn't fall out they will still be counted as a thru hiker.

I vote for moving sidewalks, like in the airports. That way you can still hike on it ;)

[hikerboy57]

yogi berra quote"nobody goes there anymore- its too crowded!"

[WingedMonkey]

I'm no big fan of the trail through SNP, but it ain't gonna move, ever. Though moving it west through the George Washington National Forest might not be all that bad an idea.

Check out the route plan of the Great Eastern Trail. Nice alternative through George Washington.

[ki0eh]

Check out the route plan of the Great Eastern Trail. Nice alternative through George Washington.

And PATC sells you those maps too. ;)

[JAK]

It is a good thing to have multiple parallel trails, and criss-crossing trails.
Perhaps the future of the AT, and all trails, is an interconnected network of trails, including green connections into urban and suburban areas.
The best defence to the encroachment of people on trails, is the counter-insurgence of trails on people. Pardon the metaphor.

[Accorn]

This is one of the dumber comments I've seen on WB. If you're not a fan of government, I would encourage you to stay off the government-owned AT (except for the handful of miles that are still privately owned). Fortunately, there are lots of great hiking opportunities on private property.

This is one of the dumber comments I've seen of a comment on WB.

[rhjanes]

This is one of the dumber comments I've seen on WB. If you're not a fan of government, I would encourage you to stay off the government-owned AT (except for the handful of miles that are still privately owned). Fortunately, there are lots of great hiking opportunities on private property.


Why yes. I'd say the AT is our government at it's finest. If anything, the NPS is underfunded.Whoops, sorry, I forget, without a emoticon, my humor doesn't translate to written text. My comments were ALL meant in jest only. I agree, the NPS and my state park service do a great job on very little! And to the funding by congress, they seem to have a knack for funding studies that cost more than the proposed solution, and often more than the problem....

[Spokes]

I heard the SMNP was installing ski lifts to carry the thru hikers across, and as long as the hiker doesn't fall out they will still be counted as a thru hiker.

I missed that one. I took the spelunking trail option through there in 2009. Those extra headlamp batteries came in handy.

[Creek Dancer]

Speculation? Innuendo? Hearsay? The result of a comment by some disgruntled Park Service employee?

Provide proof please.

Hikers taking the easy way around to "lessen the pain"? Are these the same ones seen atop Mt. Katahdin proclaiming they "hiked the whole trail"? Don't get me started.

+1

I have hiked and backpacked in the SNP, including the AT, over the past 12 years and never found it to be overcrowded. The vast majority of visitors seem to never get out of their cars.

[hikerboy57]

if you dont like crowds, then there are plenty of alternatives to go backpacking in solitude. ive spent days in the whites without seeing a soul, even in the middle of summer.

[Old Hiker]

I missed that one. I took the spelunking trail option through there in 2009. Those extra headlamp batteries came in handy.

I'm 6'2" - isn't there a height limit?

[Sarcasm the elf]

It is a good thing to have multiple parallel trails, and criss-crossing trails.Perhaps the future of the AT, and all trails, is an interconnected network of trails, including green connections into urban and suburban areas.The best defence to the encroachment of people on trails, is the counter-insurgence of trails on people. Pardon the metaphor. This tactic is starting to be implemented in southwestern Connecticut. Haven't seen any plans for a connection to he A.T. yet, but we can always dream.

[Creek Dancer]

I think the moderators should move this to the "General" category. This isn't "Trail News". This isn't a "Trail Update". This is merely someone's speculation and opinion.

[brian039]

Whoops, sorry, I forget, without a emoticon, my humor doesn't translate to written text. My comments were ALL meant in jest only. I agree, the NPS and my state park service do a great job on very little! And to the funding by congress, they seem to have a knack for funding studies that cost more than the proposed solution, and often more than the problem....

Your post was clearly satirical, it's not your fault somebody didn't get it. And there is nothing wrong with supporting public ownership of lands and at the same time demanding your government do a better job with the money you give it.

[hikerboy57]

most of the "overcrowded" sections have many alternatives to the AT nearby, and its not that difficult to get away from the crowds, if thats what you're looking for. the "crtowds generally dont hike more than a half day in country, camp at sites that have easy access to roads, amenities, etc.but if you intend to go to a popular area that you know is crowded, how can you be surprised to find out when you get there, that its crowded?

[lemon b]

I won't even walk thru that toruist trap anymore. And on the horse comment, I kinda like it whren them there kids ride in with breakfast on horseback. Them there eggs. bacon and brown fried potatoes taste damn good.

[Don H]

SNP is only crowded on weekend within 100 feet of the parking areas. To reduce crowding on the trails near parking area I suggest posting signs that say "Beware of hungry thru-hikers". ;)

[Feral Bill]

I'm 6'2" - isn't there a height limit? More likely a width limit. Most caves require crawling.

[Blissful]

This is merely someone's speculation and opinion.

And means to go trolling....

[Odd Man Out]

But if there is a series of interconnected parallel trails, what are all the "purists" going to do? They will sit around the shelters arguing about which is the official trail and who is the "real" thru hiker and who isn't. I can only imagine the madness.

[Pedaling Fool]

What's worse, the trollers or the trollies;)

[restless]

I couldn't help but notice that the OP is from TN. He thinks SNP is too crowded? Has he ever been to the Smokies? So far as moving the trail outside of the PArk, ditto, it will never happen and I've never heard any Park Service employee state anything to the effect of thru-hikers not being welcome. Very few of them would know the difference between a thru and section hiker.

[bamboo bob]

With all the outdoor "management" going on this is what's inevitable. A permit to hike the AT with a designated start time and date. You'll have to sign in at the right time or lose your spot. Also every campsite and shelter will require a fee and there will be an attendant to enforce all regulations. Probably armed. No bongs, no nips, no unhealthy food, etc. Enjoy your hike. Federalizing the trail has consequences.

[hikerboy57]

if you want to avoid the crowds, do what blissful always says, go SOBO.or find another trail. you'd think the AT was the only trail to hike.theres a whole world out there.its funny , since i first started sectioning the AT, i learned about all the surrounding trails , couldnt believe all the opportunity out there and here i was limiting myself to the AT.

[Wise Old Owl]

I'm no big fan of the trail through SNP, but it ain't gonna move, ever. Though moving it west through the George Washington National Forest might not be all that bad an idea.

had a great time there - why not?

[Camping Dave]

Though moving it west through the George Washington National Forest might not be all that bad an idea.

Horrible idea.

[Leanthree]

Horrible idea.

It would be a horrible idea to move the AT, it would be beneficial to complete a thru-hikable great eastern trail to the west of SNP so that there are other great long trails to (thru)hike.

[BlackCloud]

At some point the overcrowded zoo like conditions in the SNP will motivate the ATC to move the Appalachian Trail perhaps 50 miles to the west on the other side of the valley. The huge boom in the US population and increased trail use will require it. It's just a matter of time. 10 years from now or 50 years, it's gonna happen. The Park Service wants us out anyway. Some of the hikers are currently looking for ways to lessen the pain by hitching around it or by speed hiking. Some even skip this section by "aqua-blazing" in a canoe down the river all the way to Harpers Ferry from Rockfish Gap. I know that having the trail in the park is a real money maker for the trail club, so they will be the big political resistors to the move.

Not sure a single sentence of this is based on a single, discernible fact.

[weary]

....Federalizing the trail has consequences.
It sure did. It kept the trail in existence after more and more private landowners blocked use of their lands year after year. There would be no continuous Appalachian Trail today had Congress not stepped in and bought the land.

[rocketsocks]

I missed that one. I took the spelunking trail option through there in 2009. Those extra headlamp batteries came in handy.Would that be called belly blaze.

[rocketsocks]

if you dont like crowds, then there are plenty of alternatives to go backpacking in solitude. ive spent days in the whites without seeing a soul, even in the middle of summer.Yes ,that can happen after a hard night of drinkin.I think that's called "sleep walking"

[rocketsocks]

oops....;)

[SwitchbackVT]

When I think of the SNP, I think of blueberry milkshakes, ice cold beer, hot dogs, bears, deer, a light backpack, rattlesnakes, and more blueberry milkshakes. It was terrible.

[Doc]

I think that they were blackberry, but I agree with you. SNP has some real attractions.

[Blue Jay]

When I think of the SNP, I think of blueberry milkshakes, ice cold beer, hot dogs, bears, deer, a light backpack, rattlesnakes, and more blueberry milkshakes. It was terrible.

You are correct. I most hated most the fine eating establishment in Skyland. I had to force myself to eat 3 dinners there. Also I hated mile after mile of beautiful views and tourists giving me stuff. It was truly terrible.

[SpecialK]

Given that the federal agency that manages the AT is the NPS, why would the NPS want the AT out of an area they control? :confused: I don't get it.

I have to agree with the above comment.,

[mikec]

If hiking NOBO you could pick up the Tuscarora Trail at Mathews Arm. That will eliminate about 14 miles of the AT in SNP. It will take you west, then north, then northeast about 180 miles and hook back up with the AT just south of the Darlington Shelter. I've thought about doing this myself. However, there are not many resupply points along the Tuscarora. Most of it is very remote. They have built 5 new shelters along it over the last decade or so. But, then again, a portion of it is on roads.

[Furlough]

At some point the overcrowded zoo like conditions in the SNP will motivate the ATC to move the Appalachian Trail perhaps 50 miles to the west on the other side of the valley. The huge boom in the US population and increased trail use will require it. It's just a matter of time. 10 years from now or 50 years, it's gonna happen. The Park Service wants us out anyway. Some of the hikers are currently looking for ways to lessen the pain by hitching around it or by speed hiking. Some even skip this section by "aqua-blazing" in a canoe down the river all the way to Harpers Ferry from Rockfish Gap. I know that having the trail in the park is a real money maker for the trail club, so they will be the big political resistors to the move.

QUOTE=BlackCloud;1239587]Not sure a single sentence of this is based on a single, discernible fact.[/QUOTE]

Agree with you BlackCloud. Just another of Physarum polycephalum (Moldies) railings against SNP and PATC.

Furlough

[johnnybgood]

Horrible idea. Ditto . Getting Blackberry Milkshakes at Big Meadows would be a long walk.

[Mike2012]

It is a good thing to have multiple parallel trails, and criss-crossing trails.
Perhaps the future of the AT, and all trails, is an interconnected network of trails, including green connections into urban and suburban areas.
The best defence to the encroachment of people on trails, is the counter-insurgence of trails on people. Pardon the metaphor.

:D good metaphor and happening already

[jlo]

I don't know why thru-hikers get so bent out of shape about SNP. It's a lovely park and even though there's more traffic than other parts of the trail, I wouldn't call it crowded. Plus, it's not a private trail, it's open to the public and the more folks that visit the park, the more income they have. I had a great time through SNP last summer hiking through. The tourists were friendly and the bacon cheeseburgers every 25 miles were awesome! :)
I went to college in the Harrisonburg and 50 miles west of the trail is Interstate 81 and nothing peaceful about that :)

[Cookerhiker]

I've been hiking in SNP for over 40 years. I don't believe it's any more crowded or popular now than it was in the 1970s, especially the back country. I did a 3 day 2 night section hike in the South District just last June when tourist season begins and didn't feel cramped by people at all. Met a few thruhikers but most thrus come through SNP before Memorial Day.

Re. the milkshakes and restaurants, you can easily avoid them. In fact at Loft Mountain, AT hikers have a substantial detour to reach the Wayside. At Skyland, you cross the access roads but can't even see the facilities. They're even easy to miss at Big Meadows.

The only deterioration I've seen in 40 years is the sprawl development in the Valley which is very noticable at night. And that's the Valley, not the Park. So exactly where would the re-route occur? GWNF - that only covers from Rt. 33 to Front Royal and then what - a pretty ugly valley crossing to rejoin the ridge.

If you want to hike a more remote Eastern trail in the Mid-Atlantic, hike the Allegheny Trail in WV.

[4eyedbuzzard]

If crowds are a reason to move the AT from a federal holding, then it's really long overdue from Franconia to Gorham. I've never seen more people anywhere in one section of trail than on warm weekend summer and early fall days in the Whites.

[Sly]

At some point the overcrowded zoo like conditions in the SNP will motivate the ATC to move the Appalachian Trail perhaps 50 miles to the west on the other side of the valley. The huge boom in the US population and increased trail use will require it. It's just a matter of time. 10 years from now or 50 years, it's gonna happen. The Park Service wants us out anyway.

LOL... They don't want us out, the AT is run by the NPS.

[Sly]

I think the moderators should move this to the "General" category. This isn't "Trail News". This isn't a "Trail Update". This is merely someone's speculation and opinion.

Great idea! Less hassle on my end. ;)

[veteran]

I have always thought that the original AT should have been routed in the higher elevations.



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