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Slo-go'en
01-23-2012, 18:00
I just got Yogi's CDT guide bundle in the mail - went all out and bought the whole package deal with the bandana, spoon and postcards. "Embrace the Brutality". A great mantra.

Next step is to order the Jonathan Ley's map CD. Then I can start some serious planning. I'm only hopeing to do as much of Montana as I can in about 6 weeks. This is going to take lot more pre-hike planning then a simple stroll on the AT, that's for sure! Just can't wing it like on the AT without much fore thought.

ChinMusic
01-23-2012, 18:27
Just can't wing it like on the AT without much fore thought.

I thought you could think out the next 10 days and repeat (not counting maildrops).

Slo-go'en
01-23-2012, 22:13
I thought you could think out the next 10 days and repeat (not counting maildrops).

That's the tricky part, mail drops. These need to be thought out carefully as they often don't go to Post offices.

Spirit Walker
01-23-2012, 22:27
You don't actually need all that many maildrops, especially if you're not picky. It's possible to buy as you go most, if not all, the way, especially if you're a strong hiker. There are a couple of places where you can send maildrops to backcountry lodges, but some hikers just do a long carry and skip the resupply in the Bob Marshall or the Winds. Then there are a couple of places where maildrops are nice if you don't want to hitch to the next town. i.e. Pie Town has nothing in the way of a grocery - but you can get enough in Reserve to skip a resupply there, you can go to Leadville instead of mailing food to Twin Lakes, you can hitch to Lander instead of doing a maildrop at South Pass or Atlantic City.

Sly
01-23-2012, 22:36
For all of Montana/Idaho you only need mail drops at Benchmark Ranch and Macks Inn. Macks Inn had just a small PO but really organized for CDT hiker packages. However, since it's the beginning or end of MT/ID you may not even need it.

ChinMusic
01-23-2012, 22:38
If someone had done the AT and PCT, how much preparation is really needed if one is not picky regarding food?

Sly
01-23-2012, 22:46
Hmmm.., six weeks is going to leave you in the middle of nowhere. Most of the CDT leaves you in the middle of nowhere!

From Canada, it's somewhat less than 500 miles to Anaconda/Butte, a little more from Old Faithful to Helena going north.

I highly suggest you buy the Wolf Guidebooks for Montana/Idaho. They'll cost you $50 but well worth it.

Mags
01-23-2012, 23:23
If someone had done the AT and PCT, how much preparation is really needed if one is not picky regarding food? Not much IMO. A hiker can also do a hybrid strategy: buy food in a larger town and mail ahead. I would just research ahead of time what towns are ahead based on your MPD and plan accordingly.

Iceaxe
01-23-2012, 23:40
I used a buy as you go strategy for the whole CDT.
I only sent 5 boxes from California each with maps, fresh socks, and shoes.
I chose Chama NM, Silverthorne CO, Rawlins WY, Lima MT, and Helena MT for my "maps, socks, shoes" boxes.
While on the trail i sent boxes of food to myself from some towns.
I sent a food box from Demming NM to Pie Town NM (adressed to Nita's place).
Sent a food box from Rawlins WY to Atlantic city WY and to Brooks Lake Lodge WY.
Sent a food box from Helena MT to Benchmark ranch MT.
As for the Benchmark ranch, make sure you use the smallest box you can here.
They are very limited on space in the steel bear proof lockers on their front porch.
Also make sure you put an accurate ETA on the box so they know to put your package out in the bear proof lockers otherwise they might store them inside their locked cabin if they have to go into Augusta.
As for Macks Inn, i hitched in to West Yellowstone for a zero and resupply instead sending a box.

My whole main CDT resupply setup; maps(6lbs of jonathan Ley maps in tyvek envelopes), shoes and socks minus the stuff i mailed from the trail, to myself, on the trail looked like this:
14988

By the way Mags, I really like your "Dirt Bagging" article in Yogi's updated guidebooks. :D

Sly
01-24-2012, 00:30
If someone had done the AT and PCT, how much preparation is really needed if one is not picky regarding food?

Yogi's guide will save you hours upon hours in planning. Spelled out are which maps you'll need for each town stop (going either direction), town maps, town info, resupply options, GPS info, addresses, phone numbers. Basically everything you'll need short of trail maps and guides.

ChinMusic
01-24-2012, 00:51
Yogi's guide will save you hours upon hours in planning. Spelled out are which maps you'll need for each town stop (going either direction), town maps, town info, resupply options, GPS info, addresses, phone numbers. Basically everything you'll need short of trail maps and guides.

The CDT is a distant dream at this time. I would certainly get Yogi's guide (for the PCT as well) and the maps as well. Even though I haven't looked into the CDT closely, I do understand it's not the same as a novice showing up at Springer with 3 days worth of food.

What I was guessing is that if someone had two thrus under their belt, a few food drops would be all the advanced planning one would need. The maps and guides would then be used on the fly.

My only hiking on the CDT was in Glacier and that was totally by accident.......

fiddlehead
01-24-2012, 01:08
Sounds like the OP is only doing MT.
The "Bob" (Bob Marshall wilderness) is the biggest stretch without resupply.
I believe it's over 120 miles so, that's why you'll see most people recommending Benchmark ranch as a food drop.

This section can be really tough if depending on season and horse pack trains ahead of you.
The trail here can get so muddy (think shin deep), that you just can't do the mileage you could somewhere else.

There are a few fords in here also. But, it's spectacular scenery and one of my favorite parts.
You will see backcountry rangers (who I found to be the most friendly of any wilderness area I have been to), and pack trains (which could possibly help out if you run out of food) .

Benchmark is only 1 1/2 to 2 days from the southern end but, still a big help.

The rest of Montana is also like a chain of 100 mile wilderness' put together.

I was NOBO and only saw 2 other hikers in that whole state. (Saw a few hunters getting ready for elk season though)

Have fun. It's a great state. (especially the northern end) Try to finish your hike at the lake and not at the border (hiway) station. It's the most spectacular finish to a thru-hike in the northern hemisphere. IMO.

Slo-go'en
01-24-2012, 01:34
Hmmm.., six weeks is going to leave you in the middle of nowhere. Most of the CDT leaves you in the middle of nowhere!

Yep. The plan I'm working on is to head south from E.Glacier and skipping the park, except for maybe a day hike or two to streach the legs after a long train ride. Departure time: mid July. Hike south for about 6 weeks and then find a way to somewhere with a bus station at the first oppertunity. I'll be with a partner who has to get home by the 1st week of September give or take a little. Knowing our relative abilities, I figure we can do at least 700 and maybe 800 miles in that time frame. Who knows, maybe I'll continue alone after my friend has to leave.

It's been a long time since I've spent time in that neck of the woods. It will be exciting to camp in Griz country again:cool:

Slo-go'en
01-24-2012, 01:41
This section can be really tough if depending on season and horse pack trains ahead of you.
The trail here can get so muddy (think shin deep), that you just can't do the mileage you could somewhere else.

Oh boy, at least the trail will be easy to find. We hit a lot of muddy, horse churned trail up the Canadian Rockies. It rained on and off for most of the month we were up there and at times I was covered head to toe in mud.

Mags
01-24-2012, 10:32
I
By the way Mags, I really like your "Dirt Bagging" article in Yogi's updated guidebooks. :D

Thanks! :D

Yogi was saying more and more people are doing the CDT as their first long hike (if with more backpacking overall experience than the typical first time AT hiker) so a bit more gear oriented writing.

Interesting!

Here's a form of the article if anyone is curious...
http://www.pmags.com/dirt-bagging

BrianLe
01-24-2012, 10:35
"I figure we can do at least 700 and maybe 800 miles in that time frame. Who knows, maybe I'll continue alone after my friend has to leave."

Going SOBO last year my trail partner had to quit after 600+ miles, so in southern MT. I hiked alone from there until I teamed up with another guy in northern New Mexico to finish the trail with. So it's certainly do-able to hike alone, and in a way quite a treat --- you don't get nearly the same quality of "alone time" on the AT or PCT.

In terms of prep, indeed I think it deserves more than the other two trails but with a mid-July departure you eliminate the toughest aspects of Montana for me (with a mid-June departure in a high snow year). The only resupply box I had in MT was at Benchmark ranch; the next was in Leadore, ID and that one wasn't strictly necessary --- just a good place to replace my shoes.
Rather than a resupply box at Mack's Inn, stop at the convenience store at the Chevron close to Sawtelle Resort --- this is much bigger than a typical gas station mini-mart, easy to resupply there.

Sly
01-24-2012, 11:12
Knowing our relative abilities, I figure we can do at least 700 and maybe 800 miles in that time frame. Who knows, maybe I'll continue alone after my friend has to leave.

It's been a long time since I've spent time in that neck of the woods. It will be exciting to camp in Griz country again:cool:

700 to Leadore ID and nowhere, 800 to Lima, and the people at the motel will shuttle you to Dillion MT, which should get you back to civilization.

Craters of the Moon was one of the scariest places I camped. Nice spot, but only water for miles, kind of dark, threatening, with good places/trees to hang your food. I recommend the PCT method. Water has little, red swimming critters but they're tasteless and go down well.

Oops, if you're skipping the park which is by far the most scenic in all of Montana (I assume you've hiked it before), you may be able to make Macks Inn or Old Faithful.

Spirit Walker
01-24-2012, 13:24
Re: Planning
One of the joys of the CDT is that it gives you so much freedom to pick your own route out of a number of possibilities. Some routes are longer/shorter, some are higher/lower, some better watered, some more scenic, some provide different access to towns, some take you to Anasazi ruins (Gila and Dittert site), etc. The advantage of advance planning is you have some idea of what the options are. In some cases you end up making your route decision on the spot (i.e. high winds that force you off the divide, fires, snow, dry springs) but it really helps if you have an idea of the greater picture before you go. I read the guidebooks and marked the route options on my maps so I knew in advance approximately where I wanted to go. I think it made for an easier hike, especially when the time came to make the unexpected route changes.

One of the best bits of advice I received before I did my first CDT hike was from Fiddlehead. He told us the most important thing for the CDT is to be flexible. You don't know what kind of conditions you'll run into until you're there. You have to be able to roll with whatever comes. For me, doing research before I went helped because I knew, at least a little, what the possibilities were. The trail still managed to surprise us, but I felt a bit more in control because I knew the maps, the towns, etc. So we were able to change our plans when necessary without getting upset because the hike wasn't going the way we expected.

Sly
01-24-2012, 14:51
Ditto with what Ginny said. I gave Yogi the same advice prior to her hike and she wasn't sure what I meant until she got out there. It's good to have contingency plans, especially for flip-flopping in case of high snowpack.

For example, I had a plan to hike NM northbound, flipping to Canada to hike south avoiding snowpack in southern Colorado. However, 2002 had a low snowpack year, northern NM forest were closed due to super dry conditions. We were able to find a ride to Cumbres Pass (starting point for CO) from Grants, NM hike north to Canada (with only three days of postholing) and caught a bus back from Shelby, MT to Alamosa, CO (taking the train from Glacier-hitching to Cumbres Pass) to finish up NM southbound. All in all it was still a fantastic hike!

handlebar
01-24-2012, 22:04
700 to Leadore ID and nowhere, 800 to Lima, and the people at the motel will shuttle you to Dillion MT, which should get you back to civilization.



You can get a bus from Lima to Salt Lake City and fly or train from there.

garlic08
01-25-2012, 00:13
One thing you might want to do is buy the DeLorme Atlases for MT and ID, cut out the appropriate pages and carry them with you. They're helpful for making the "as you go" decisions based on fire closures, etc. They have GPS grids in case you really get lost, have a GPS, and get off the Ley maps (not all that hard to do in places). It's a good exercise to pencil in the route(s) from the Ley maps onto the DeLorme pages. State road maps might help with bailouts and end-of-hike decisions.

The only mail drop I did in MT was Benchmark. Ditto the ETA info, and call from East Glacier when you have an exact day. I did another at Brooks Lake Lodge in WY.

Slo-go'en
01-25-2012, 00:49
One thing you might want to do is buy the DeLorme Atlases for MT and ID, cut out the appropriate pages and carry them with you.

Yes, I've read that advice in a couple of places today. Will do that. I down loaded the Ley maps for MT from http://francistapon.com today (and bought his ebook "Hike Your Own Hike: 7 life lessons from the trail", which looks like it will be an entertaining read) and after browsing a few of these maps, I can see where a larger overview will be handy. I can also see where a GPS will be handy to decide which way to go at a trail junction. Pick the wrong one and you end up at a dead end.