View Full Version : Skyscape X.....looks great, ultralight.....but...
EXPENSIVE!!
Has anyone seen this one or knew someone who did...wish I had the bucks!!
http://www.sixmoondesigns.com/tents/ssX.html (http://www.sixmoondesigns.com/tents/ssX.html)
moongoddess
02-20-2012, 10:57
I have one on order, which should be arriving today! I'll post an update after I've had some time to play with it (that may be a while, alas...).
Wow that's a lot of tent for 15oz. but with a price tag to match. SMD makes great gear, I have a Wild Oasis and Lunar Solo and like them both.
I've got 3-4 pieces of SMD gear and think all of them have been a good value for the money. I've also needed some repair work done a few times and it was done inexpensively, quickly and I got it back as good as new.
Resell value seems to be pretty good too.
I have one on order, which should be arriving today! I'll post an update after I've had some time to play with it (that may be a while, alas...).
of the tent. I am curious to see how easy to put up, and how roomy it may be for one plus pack.
moongoddess
02-21-2012, 10:54
I'll definitely post my thoughts on the tent (and perhaps a few photos as well) after I've had a chance to play with it a bit, nawlunz. The SMD Skyscape tents (all three models) have been out for a while now, but strangely there don't seem to be many reviews of them posted on the web. I'm not sure why that is, but it does make it harder for a prospective purchaser to decide whether the tent is right for him/her.
bamboo bob
02-21-2012, 11:14
Gotta love that set up. 15 oz. Why do they not include the stakes ? I mean, you need stakes. To be honest they should include the stakes and the weight of the stakes. Am I missing something? They include line and stuff sack, etc. They sell the stakes, and pole and footprint but don't include them in the weight.
Why don't they just play it straight? It's like batteries not included.
skinewmexico
02-21-2012, 12:02
They don't include stakes becasue most people have their own favorites, or so they told me a few years ago. Not like they're trying to hide it.
And cuben gets pricey.
moongoddess
02-21-2012, 12:47
Bamboo Bob, a lot of people don't use footprints with their tents, and they already own stakes. And while SMD does sell optional poles (both aluminum and carbon fiber versions) for the Skyscape, it's really intended to be used with trekking poles, and everyone's poles have different weights. So I can see why SMD lists only the tent weight sans options. It's easy enough to add the weight of the optional stake kit, tyvek ground cloth, and aluminum or carbon fiber poles to the tent weight to get a "complete" weight for the entire setup before you order, as SMD does list the weight for each of those components on their website.
moongoddess
02-23-2012, 09:36
Well, after some unavoidable delays the tent arrived, and I opened the box last night. I haven't even had a chance to take the tent out of it's stuff sack yet, but my first thought upon picking it up was "I paid $450 for a potato chip bag?!" Cuben fiber's amazingly light stuff! It's hard to believe something so seemingly insubstantial can actually protect a hiker from severe weather (although I know it can).
With any luck, I'll get the chance to set the tent up in my back yard this weekend and try some "camping at home". More updates (and pictures) to follow!
moongoddess
03-12-2012, 11:39
I finally got a chance to pitch my new Skyscape X in my backyard this weekend. Haven't had a chance to try it out yet in rough weather, but first impressions are definitely favorable.
The tent, pitched:
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The mat you see inside is a large, wide Exped Downmat 9: 77" long, 26" wide, and about 3" thick. It pretty much fills the tent. but there's a little room left on the foot end where I think a pack could be stowed, and a small space at the head end where a few personal items would fit. Using a standard-length mat, there's definitely room inside for a pack - which is a good thing, because the vestibules are on the small side. I think this tent would be a tight fit for anyone over 6' tall.
The tent has only one entrance. This limits the utility of the second vestibule, as you can't access it from inside the tent. It also means that if you have the rainfly rolled up on that side and the weather changes overnight, you have to get out of the tent to close the fly. It's really a pity that Six Moon Designs doesn't put a door on both sides of the tent (or at least a small zippered opening, like the one on the older version of the Big Agnes Copper spur tents) so both vestibules would be equally accessible from inside the tent.
The rear of the tent features an extra tie-out point, which you can use to raise the rear of the tent an inch or two if you're using a long, thick mat:
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The supplies spreader bar for the trekking poles is rather flimsy: a rod covered with a heavy synthetic leather fabric, with fabric pouches at either end for the trekking pole tips to slide into. It's a bit too flexible, and it's easy for the pole tips to come out during tent assembly if you're not careful. I fashioned a studier spreader bar out of Pex tubing, which works much better. This photo shows the Six Moon Designs spreader bar on the left, and my homemade bar on the right:
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A look at the trekking pole assembly. Note that the spreader bar goes inside a fabric sleeve, which holds it very securely:
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Inside the tent, looking toward the head end. For some reason, the floor up there wants to billow up:
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A look toward the foot end. As you can see, there's not a lot of extra space down there with this large mat in place, but the mat (and my sleeping quilt) did not hit the end of the tent:
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The door zipper seems sturdy, but the zipper pulls are small. I think I may tie some reflective line to them, to make them easier to locate at night:
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A snap tie holds the rainfly in place when it's rolled up:
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When the rainfly is closed, the flap over the zipper is secured in place with a small strip of velcro:
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The supplied guylines are yellow, but don't seem to be reflective. The tent requires five stakes (six if you want to use the optional rear tie-out point). Stake placement is a bit fiddly; if you don't position the stakes just right, either the front or the rear rainfly will flap a bit. Still, I had the tent up in under five minutes on my very first try. None of the guylines come with tensioners or linelocks, but since Cuben fiber doesn't stretch much, I don't think that's a big omission.
Overall, I'm pleased (although as I said, I haven't had a chance to test it in a blowing rain). A bit more interior space would be nice - but that would increase the weight and the footprint (which is small). So far it seems a very nice solo shelter.
MuddyWaters
03-12-2012, 19:03
Gotta love that set up. 15 oz. Why do they not include the stakes ? I mean, you need stakes. To be honest they should include the stakes and the weight of the stakes. Am I missing something? They include line and stuff sack, etc. They sell the stakes, and pole and footprint but don't include them in the weight.
Why don't they just play it straight? It's like batteries not included.
Some well know in demand cottage makers dont even include the weight of the guylines, and people are upset when their new $500-600 shelter weighs 2 oz more than it was supposed to.
moongoddess
04-09-2012, 11:06
FYI, John Abela recently posted a very detailed and informative review of the Skyscape X on his website. Here's the link to his review: http://hikelighter.com/2012/04/03/six-moon-designs-skyscape-x/
Cherokee Bill
05-17-2012, 19:47
Ahhhhhhhhhhhhh, you paid $450 for that? Your money!
moongoddess
05-17-2012, 23:23
Yep, my money - and I expect the tent to be worth every penny of it.
You know what's more expensive? Buying something less expensive and heavier, figuring out it's not right and too heavy, and then buying the expensive thing you should have bought the first time. Sometimes buying the most expensive item is the least expensive path.
Tom Murphy
05-18-2012, 09:23
You know what's more expensive? Buying something less expensive and heavier, figuring out it's not right and too heavy, and then buying the expensive thing you should have bought the first time. Sometimes buying the most expensive item is the least expensive path.
+1
Not to say I would pay over $200 to save a pound of tent weight
raoulglloq
07-25-2012, 09:08
I finally got a chance to pitch my new Skyscape X in my backyard this weekend. Haven't had a chance to try it out yet in rough weather, but first impressions are definitely favorable.
Thanks for this report :)
My trekking sticks are fix lenght (non ajustable) and about 120 cm (Black Diamond Ultra Distance (http://www.outdoorgearlab.com/Trekking-Poles-Reviews/Black-Diamond-Ultra-Distance))
What is your sticks lenght? Because if mines are too long or too short it will be impossible to build the tent.
My second remark is about the space betwwen the main cover and the ground. I am afraid in case of big rain to have somme water inside the tent.
I hesitate a lot between this one or the Vaude Tokee which is heavier but with a true double films.
moongoddess
07-27-2012, 09:24
Thanks for this report :)
My trekking sticks are fix lenght (non ajustable) and about 120 cm (Black Diamond Ultra Distance (http://www.outdoorgearlab.com/Trekking-Poles-Reviews/Black-Diamond-Ultra-Distance))
What is your sticks lenght? Because if mines are too long or too short it will be impossible to build the tent.
I can't help you much with that, as my poles are adjustable in length and I didn't really measure just how much I extended them when I set the tent up. I'd suggest emailing Ron Moak at Six Moon designs and asking him how well he thinks your fixed-length poles would work with the Skyscape.
My second remark is about the space betwwen the main cover and the ground. I am afraid in case of big rain to have somme water inside the tent.
I think that's a reasonable concern, but most people using the ten don't seem to be having an issue with that. (I can't say myself, as we're having a drought here, so I've no rain to test it in!). For what it's worth, the points where the attaches fly is farthest from the ground are also the points where the fly is farthest from the tent - I think it would take a very strong wind-driven rain to blow any significant water inside.
I hesitate a lot between this one or the Vaude Tokee which is heavier but with a true double films.
We're lucky that there are so many great choices available to backpackers these days!
raoulglloq
07-27-2012, 20:37
I just read it. The only big problem he mentioned is that when ther is a strng rain and the grund is wet, some water goes true the floor at the place of the pression points (poles, mat)
Not big problem for the pole place but it is anoying for the mat when it s cold. Did you experienced this problem?
For the pole lenght I looked at the website and the lenght is 45" which is 114cm. My pole are too long with 120 cm but I can put them at a position of 108cmm. Additionnog some clothes could perhaps let me having about 114cm but I am not sure it will be very tight. Did so experienced that?
Pioneer Spirit
07-27-2012, 21:05
The described design is very similar to the Hubba where there is little room under the vestibule and a rather useless smaller one on the other with no access from the interior.
I prefer a roomy tent.........am never going to get fired up over a few ounces.
Great gear is great gear................would rather spend / invest my hard earned money on this hobby that I love
Definitely makes a difference from my viewpoint................lighter gear costs more but to me is important. 53 years old, 36 years of almost daily back pain.
30lbs with food & water works for me.................plus some comfort.
cabbagehead
07-27-2012, 23:58
That would be too big for me.
New Lightheart SoLong is pretty killer..............going out in a few weeks with new gear.
i 1 of my best fiends on the trail used a skyscape trekker, and loved it. 24 oz, and pretty large. i do like my smd lunar soloas well, they seem to make some killer gear.
but, 450 for a tent that is bairly under a pound is not worth it in my mind. if you are dead set on a CF tent, zpacks has some that are sub 10 oz and cost about 300ish. i would invest in 1 of their tents if i wasnt putting money toward a UL hammock setup
Wmwood2001
09-12-2013, 18:02
Just ordered this tent! Cant wait to get it and when they start shipping the new batch. With this tent my big four including, Marmot Plasma 15 (30 oz), Zpack Arc Blast 52 (16.5 oz), SMD Sky Scape X (15 oz), Therma Rest Neo Air Xlite (12 oz) check in at 73.5 oz or 4.59 lbs. Not too bad. Cant wait to get my 2014 AT Thru hike underway. Total baseweight right now is 10 lbs.
capehiker
09-12-2013, 18:55
I recently bought a Skyscape X (I may have been one of the last people to buy it from a retailer in the U.S.- I scoured everywhere!). I have 3 nights with it and so far I feel really good about it. On the scale, out of the box, it came in at 15.5oz and with my Vargo Ti Stakes and fitted Tyvek ground cloth, my total weight all inclusive (stuff sacks, etc) is 19.1oz.
As for durability, it feels surprisingly hearty. No less than the TT Moment I have. I'm going to add a few strips of cuben fiber tape to a couple points mentioned in John Abela's article. I'm 6'2" and don't feel cramped in it. I'm using a Prolite 3 small pad with 1/8 GG pad under that. As for leaking or condensation, I haven't really been in an environment that would promote that. It was dry and cool the nights I slept in it with good ventilation. I did do a backyard hose test (not really scientific) with no leakage.
I'm doing a 3 day section in 2 weeks so hopefully I'll get some rain and nasty weather to give it a full workout. I'm considering doing a video review as there are very few videos of the X.
I'm going to add a few strips of cuben fiber tape to a couple points mentioned in John Abela's article.
Sweet to hear you are enjoying the SMDSX!!
I suppose if you are always going to have the shelter on top of a tyvek ground cloth you probably would not need to add the tape to the bathtub floor.
But, for under one gram of weight, worth the effort in my book.
You should consider going with something lighter weight than tyvek. I love that stuff, crazy tough, but its probably the heaviest type of ground sheet out there.
Wmwood2001
09-12-2013, 23:11
I recently bought a Skyscape X (I may have been one of the last people to buy it from a retailer in the U.S.- I scoured everywhere!). I have 3 nights with it and so far I feel really good about it. On the scale, out of the box, it came in at 15.5oz and with my Vargo Ti Stakes and fitted Tyvek ground cloth, my total weight all inclusive (stuff sacks, etc) is 19.1oz.
As for durability, it feels surprisingly hearty. No less than the TT Moment I have. I'm going to add a few strips of cuben fiber tape to a couple points mentioned in John Abela's article. I'm 6'2" and don't feel cramped in it. I'm using a Prolite 3 small pad with 1/8 GG pad under that. As for leaking or condensation, I haven't really been in an environment that would promote that. It was dry and cool the nights I slept in it with good ventilation. I did do a backyard hose test (not really scientific) with no leakage.
I'm doing a 3 day section in 2 weeks so hopefully I'll get some rain and nasty weather to give it a full workout. I'm considering doing a video review as there are very few videos of the X.
Most definetly do a review! Would love to see more video reviews of this tent. I think there's like one out there!
Very nicely researched and done spread sheet Abela! You got me looking closely at the different SUL shelter set ups you list. HARD for me to pull the trigger on a .34 cf shelter for a long distance hike though.
Thank you also Moongodess for all the beta and feisty inspiration.
capehiker
09-13-2013, 08:23
You should consider going with something lighter weight than tyvek. I love that stuff, crazy tough, but its probably the heaviest type of ground sheet out there.
I got a free sheet of Tyvek with my order but I will most likely shift to a polycro sheet. :)
Very nicely researched and done spread sheet Abela! You got me looking closely at the different SUL shelter set ups you list. HARD for me to pull the trigger on a .34 cf shelter for a long distance hike though.
Hey Dogwood,
Great to hear you enjoyed my Solo SUL/XUL Fully Enclosed Shelter Comparison (http://hikelighter.com/2011/12/29/sulxul-enclosed-shelter-comparisons/)! I also put together a Two-person sub 900 gram fully enclosed shelter comparison (http://hikelighter.com/2012/10/14/two-person-sub-900-gram-fully-enclosed-shelters-2/).
Suspect I will need to update both of them this winter season when I have a week or so at home with nothing to do... I know the pricing on some of the shelters have changed.
Not knowing your hiking experience, it would be hard to give a yeah or nay on a 0.34 cf shelter being used for a thru-hike. Last I asked around I had more miles than anybody else using a 0.34 cf shelter and I myself have often thought about whether I would be willing to give it a go.
What it really all comes down to is do you have enough experience with 0.34 cf shelters for the sake of 25 grams - the difference between a 0.34 hexamid and a 0.51 hexamid.
IF you have experience with 0.34 cf shelters and feel you have good skills at camp site selection, and are looking to do a SUL thru-hike, then yeah, it could be a nice way to save 25 grams of dead-weight.
It is one of those risk/rewards that I have often thought about, and so far I have not been willing to talk myself into it, even with the large amount of miles I have using a 0.34 cf tarp.
I have been giving the ZPacks Pocket (with netting) a go for a couple of months and I have to be honest and say I have been really (really) loving it. It might be the first 0.34 shelter that I would consider giving a go on a long distance trail. But even with that said, I would not do so until I have another 50+ nights of use with it, just to make sure I understand just how this shelter handles itself. I have used the hexamid a lot, the 0.51 version, but 0.34 is a whole other ball game.
Hard call on this one. I would absolutely not recommend it for anybody that has never spent a good 60+ days on the trail (non long distance, where shelter dependance is the highest) using a 0.34 cuben fiber tarp/shelter. The way it behaves is just so different from how 0.51 does... the attention you have to give it when it comes to high-pressure stress areas is vital to the survival of this fabric. I have seen guys with a lot of experience with 0.51 cf and very little experience with 0.34 destroy a 0.34 tarp on their very first time using it because they failed to understand how different it is from 0.74 or 0.51 cf when it comes to high pressure stress areas. There is a reason ZPacks markets the Pocket as an "emergency shelter".
Wise Old Owl
09-13-2013, 23:17
I don't care! Tent folk are going to buy - tis exciting!
I like the way you think Abela. I can see the Zpacks Pocket working for me on some shorter thrus with less abrasive less shelter stress fairer weather conditions. You sound more experienced with SUL CF minimalist sized shelters though. Not that I need justification based on anyone else's abilities but if you aren't willing to roll with a .34 CF on a thru that tells me something about what I'm willing and ready for. Damn right you are, pros/cons risks/rewards to most everything and when you get to being this much of a gram weenie that's not something to ignore.
That Solo SUL spread sheet saved me from doing much work doing the same thing. I'll check out the two man 900 gm fully enclosed shelter comparison. Thx for all the beta. Good stuff. I got you tabbed.
I have the scout version. Same tent just different material and weight I believe. My only beef about the tent is lack of vestibule space. I have to stand my pack up and lean against outside of pole to get it fully covered. It works, just not what I personally like. The vestibule is large enough to cook and whatnot.
Curious; No Bathtub Floor. How do you think this will work in blowing rain??????? Not being critical...
colorado_rob
05-10-2014, 10:25
Curious; No Bathtub Floor. How do you think this will work in blowing rain??????? Not being critical... I was concerned about this as well with my shiny new Zpacks Hexamid Solo+ tent, I just used it on this spring's AT section (400 miles from northern VA to mid-NJ). The hexamid sure looks a lot like that Skyscape... Anyway, for the roughly 15 or so nights I used it (other nights in shelters or towns), maybe 4-5 in decent or heavy rains with some winds, it performed very well, kept me perfectly dry and warm enough, even though you do feel some of the wind in the tent. I found myself using my empty pack to block the wind that came in through the well vented tent periphery. If you like this Skyscape, be sure to also check out the Zpacks Hexamid Solo+, 16.0 ounces total including a custom-cut gossamer gear ground sheet, guy lines and cuben stuff sack. $395. YEah, also expensive, but wow, taking 1.5 pounds off my back (vs. my old Big Agnes fly creek) was very welcome. I just pulled the trigger on the Zpacks 30 degree sleeping bag as well.
Tipi Walter
05-10-2014, 10:59
For a full discussion of cuben fiber, hydrostatic head and its other qualities, see---
http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=44516&disable_pagination=1
Just ordered the Skyscape Trekker today. Same design but comes in at 24oz. Would have loved to get the X but I'm really ecited to try out the Trekker.
Slo-go'en
07-04-2014, 21:03
I'm happy with the Trekker. I think it's a pretty good weight/price trade off.
I was concerned about this as well with my shiny new Zpacks Hexamid Solo+ tent, I just used it on this spring's AT section (400 miles from northern VA to mid-NJ). The hexamid sure looks a lot like that Skyscape... Anyway, for the roughly 15 or so nights I used it (other nights in shelters or towns), maybe 4-5 in decent or heavy rains with some winds, it performed very well, kept me perfectly dry and warm enough, even though you do feel some of the wind in the tent. I found myself using my empty pack to block the wind that came in through the well vented tent periphery. If you like this Skyscape, be sure to also check out the Zpacks Hexamid Solo+, 16.0 ounces total including a custom-cut gossamer gear ground sheet, guy lines and cuben stuff sack. $395. YEah, also expensive, but wow, taking 1.5 pounds off my back (vs. my old Big Agnes fly creek) was very welcome. I just pulled the trigger on the Zpacks 30 degree sleeping bag as well.
I think some considering a Zpacks Hexamid have to give some serious consideration and carefully balance ALL their priorities by comparing the Hexamid to Mountain Laurel Designs Solomid and now SoloMid XL too! Wmwood, how's the Six Moon Designs Skyscape X working for you? How many nights in it?
I had the skyscape scout which is basically same tent but different material. The vestibule space was way too small. I finally went with Zpacks duplex which in my opinion is the best single wall tent on the market. Big enough for 2 people with vestibule space for packs, shoes, and whatever else. For 1 person it is a palace. Everyone I met on the trail that had one love it and did not regret the money spent. No complaints and worth every penny. I slept in it 95% of my thru hike and it still has plenty of material life left.
I stay away from shelters requiring 2 trekking poles when hiking solo.
Odd Man Out
08-31-2015, 11:46
I used a Skyscape Trekker last year, but sold in for a Tarp Tent Notch. I wanted a bigger vestibule and two doors (making the second vestibule more useable. I didn't like the flap tie backs on the Trekker. The Notch uses one less tent stake. I found the horizontal panel on the Trekker sagged too much for my liking (maybe not so much a problem with the CF version or maybe I wasn't pitching well??). Vertical poles on the Notch give more headroom (I think). I found the bath tub floor too shallow on the Trekker. I never used it in the rain, but I worried the floor would not keep out water as well. I suppose mainly I like to buy and try new gear. The grass is always greener, you know?... If I sell after only lightly using it for a few nights I can recoup most of the cost. This makes gear swapping a relatively low-cost past time.
"I stay away from shelters requiring 2 trekking poles when hiking solo"
You can get substitute poles (same 8.5mm or something poles used on non trekking pole tents) at 2 to 3 oz.
Small weight penalty if you like the look/performance of a two pole shelter but obviously pointless if you are happy with the one pole solution.
Nevertheless the option is there.
left52side
03-05-2016, 07:31
You know what's more expensive? Buying something less expensive and heavier, figuring out it's not right and too heavy, and then buying the expensive thing you should have bought the first time. Sometimes buying the most expensive item is the least expensive path.
+1
I have made this mistake before,I actually have the scout version of this tent at 34 ounces weight.
I like the layout and it is nice but I opted to order the deshutes plus from SMD to save the weight with it coming in at only 16 ounces and almost double the floor space.
But ill keep the scout for now and use it on my over nighters and etc.
I recently got a Skyscape Trekker but have yet to use it. I have had no prior experience with Sil Nylon and was wondering if a footprint/ground cloth was required? Will water leak through a Sil Nylon floor like an old standard nylon tent? I was hoping to shave a little weight by not carrying a ground cloth. The Trekker specs indicate 40 D Sil Nylon for the floor. I am a section hiker so will not be out for months at a time, 13 day max section this year.
left52side
03-06-2016, 19:52
I recently got a Skyscape Trekker but have yet to use it. I have had no prior experience with Sil Nylon and was wondering if a footprint/ground cloth was required? Will water leak through a Sil Nylon floor like an old standard nylon tent? I was hoping to shave a little weight by not carrying a ground cloth. The Trekker specs indicate 40 D Sil Nylon for the floor. I am a section hiker so will not be out for months at a time, 13 day max section this year
According to reviews I have read and from SMD you do not need a ground sheet/floor cloth,but IMO I would/am still bringing A piece of tyvek or polycro to put down as a ground sheet.
I agree. I'm trying everywhere possible to cut weight, but giving up the the ground cloth may be going to far if the weather stays really bad. 1 mil. plastic painters is coming in a 2 oz cut to size for the Trekker. I've never used polycro but plan on getting some, as I'm sure it will be lighter/stronger than the 1 mil. plastic. FYI: I have always put the plastic/ground cloth in my tent. I really don't care about the tent, but I care about me. If water leaks through the bottom of a tent, it will not leak through the plastic ground cloth in the tent. I have found that sometimes water will flow, etc. in a heavy storm and could get between the groundcloth under the tent and the tent floor. As you lay on the tent floor, it could leak through the tent floor. I read about doing this in a Field and Stream article in the early 70's. I have never been wet in a tent using this method. However, I have never put Sil Nylon to the test for wear and tear long term using this method/no ground cloth under the tent. With a standard nylon tent I never had and issue with the floor wearing out on a tent. Time will tell with the Sil. Thanks
left52side
03-07-2016, 21:59
I am looking into the deshutes plus tarp set up now. it is only 16 ounces and just putting a cut piece of tyvek down for my ground