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View Full Version : Pack it out ethos



Mando12
03-20-2012, 18:32
When I started backpacking in 1976, I really bought into the "leave nothing but footprints" approach because it seemed necessary to preserve our wilderness areas. In all these years, I have packed out my trash. I even saved up my nickels and bought a Svea 123 stove--I've never even lighted a fire. I have the great fortune of living near the AT in East TN, so I get to hike the trail often. I have taken to carrying a bag to collect trash left on the trail--cans, bottles, wrappers. Today I hiked in to Moreland Gap shelter from Dennis Cove. I found 4 empty propane canisters. It bothers me to think that folks that are serious hikers on the AT feel free to leave garbage in the shelter, finding it so inconvenient to pack out the empty canister--but willing to leave it for a volunteer to pack it out. How could we instill the "pack it out" ethos?

Juice
03-20-2012, 18:38
cattle prods?

Rasty
03-20-2012, 19:08
Coat with honey and peanut butter and tie to a tree.:D

Hawkwind61
03-20-2012, 19:10
Great ideas. My hiking buddy and I carry extra bags for small trash items...but we cannot keep up with all the trash we find. Those that litter drive us nuts.

rocketsocks
03-20-2012, 19:21
Coat with honey and peanut butter and tie to a tree.:DDon't forget the low hanging branch complete w/hornets nest.;)Honestly,don't have that answer to that question,I think you either get...or you don't very sad indeed.I always visualize that indian with the tear running down his face.Perhaps another movment like what we had in the late 60's early 70's....like "give a hoot don't pollute".

Memphis Tim
03-20-2012, 19:51
Serious hikers aren't carrying propane.

Pedaling Fool
03-20-2012, 19:53
How could we instill the "pack it out" ethos?It's all Bill Bryson's fault. Ever since he wrote that book and included the description of Katz throwing all that crap off the side of the mountain -- gotta admit, it was funny as hell :) -- people don't seem to see the problem with leaving stuff; I bet some even tried to reenact the scene in the book.

It's an easy solution; all you gotta do is write a really funny book with a funny story of packing out.... :-? O.K., maybe not so easy...:D

Wise Old Owl
03-20-2012, 19:55
Is this serious? Or are you part of the dark side?


http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg275/MarkSwarbrick/yoda.jpg

rocketsocks
03-20-2012, 20:02
It's all Bill Bryson's fault. Ever since he wrote that book and included the description of Katz throwing all that crap off the side of the mountain -- gotta admit, it was funny as hell :) -- people don't seem to see the problem with leaving stuff; I bet some even tried to reenact the scene in the book.

It's an easy solution; all you gotta do is write a really funny book with a funny story of packing out.... :-? O.K., maybe not so easy...:DNow if that guy was Arrested for littering,and writing from a jail cell (sort of a autobiogrphy)....that might be funny!

Nooga
03-20-2012, 20:08
It's all Bill Bryson's fault. Ever since he wrote that book and included the description of Katz throwing all that crap off the side of the mountain -- gotta admit, it was funny as hell :) -- people don't seem to see the problem with leaving stuff; I bet some even tried to reenact the scene in the book.

It's an easy solution; all you gotta do is write a really funny book with a funny story of packing out.... :-? O.K., maybe not so easy...:D

Sorry, I don't agree. I think it is a cultural issue. Here in East Tennessee the roadsides would be filthy if if were not for the drunk drivers being assigned "public service" work.

Rasty
03-20-2012, 20:11
It's all Bill Bryson's fault. Ever since he wrote that book and included the description of Katz throwing all that crap off the side of the mountain -- gotta admit, it was funny as hell :) -- people don't seem to see the problem with leaving stuff; I bet some even tried to reenact the scene in the book.

It's an easy solution; all you gotta do is write a really funny book with a funny story of packing out.... :-? O.K., maybe not so easy...:D

Sorry, I don't agree. I think it is a cultural issue. Here in East Tennessee the roadsides would be filthy if if were not for the drunk drivers being assigned "public service" work.

I think Rocketsocks was making an Arlo Gutherie reference. I still think the pickle song was funnier.

rocketsocks
03-20-2012, 20:24
I think Rocketsocks was making an Arlo Guthrie reference. I still think the pickle song was funnier.
I don't believe I've ever heard the "Pickle song"But then thee old brain cells aint all there either.;)

Montana AT05
03-20-2012, 20:33
Based on the last few weeks of posting here at White Blaze I think what is needed is not lessons on leave no trace, giving back, proper hiking, etc, but rather, on basic logic with a specific focus on fallacies.

Wise Old Owl
03-20-2012, 20:39
Rs is funny -

Bucketfoot
03-20-2012, 20:46
Could it perhaps be that hiking the trail and even thru hiking have become so popular and the "hip" thing to do that its attracting some of the wrong people? The ones that just use it and show no regard for it's preservation or for the experience of those who come after them.

sheepdog
03-20-2012, 20:59
Might as well try for World Peace.

rocketsocks
03-20-2012, 21:19
Based on the last few weeks of posting here at White Blaze I think what is needed is not lessons on leave no trace, giving back, proper hiking, etc, but rather, on basic logic with a specific focus on fallacies.Ya mean like what dick's doing the dumping?

swjohnsey
03-20-2012, 21:24
I don't leave nothin' behind but poop and foot prints.

rocketsocks
03-20-2012, 21:30
Ya mean like what dick's doing the dumping?Or did you mean Deductive or inductive reasoning?;)

atmilkman
03-20-2012, 22:00
I don't leave nothin' behind but poop and foot prints.
I hope you don't mean your stepping in your poop.

cabbagehead
03-20-2012, 23:04
I hiked in to Moreland Gap shelter from Dennis Cove. I found 4 empty propane canisters.

When the shelter is abandoned, build a fire in the shelter's fire pit. Use rope to carefully drop the spent canisters in the fire while you hide behind a protective barrier. The canisters will explode. Use a metal detector to pick up the shrapnel. Small bits of shrapnel won't be as bulky to pack out as the canisters.

swjohnsey
03-20-2012, 23:09
I hope you don't mean your stepping in your poop.

Ever once in a while, but I try to avoid it. My foot slipped once while I was braced against a tree and I fell in it.

JAK
03-21-2012, 06:32
The best you can hope for is continuous improvement.
There are environmental issues beyond leave no trace, like sustainability.
For example we should be concerned less with how much gear weighs and more with life cycle costs and impacts.

Personally I think we will get there, eventually.

lemon b
03-21-2012, 07:54
Leading by example works.

The Cleaner
03-21-2012, 08:40
With the hiking (thru) season now under way,along with the wildflowers comes a new wave of litter.Sad but true.There are many hikers who do pack out other's trash but they are out numbered by those who seem not to care .....

The Cleaner
03-21-2012, 08:44
When the shelter is abandoned, build a fire in the shelter's fire pit. Use rope to carefully drop the spent canisters in the fire while you hide behind a protective barrier. The canisters will explode. Use a metal detector to pick up the shrapnel. Small bits of shrapnel won't be as bulky to pack out as the canisters. I've done this many times.Once the canisters are burned they start to rust if not packed out...anyway it's fun but dangerous....

turtle fast
03-21-2012, 12:26
Like said by others...the propane canisters are not experienced hikers..probably hunters, transients or kids with more gumption than brains. The annoying stuff is when the micro trash starts accumulating. I mean how hard is it to get your stuff together and put into a ziplock for disposal...or at least burn the stuff (which presents another problem).

TyTy
03-21-2012, 13:09
Something that ticks me off is cigarette butts and people that will just flick them onto the ground everywhere they go or even out of a car window. If I was a cop I would rack up on big litterig tickets. I have seen some states have $1,000 fine for littering, I would pull people over for flicking a cigarette butt and (if possible) write them a $1000 ticket. Just irks me. If you want to smoke, deal with your butts properly.

As far as on the trail, states should just pass big littering fines and let the park rangers rack up writing them. If you can't figure out how to carry out your trash your ticket will help fund someone else picking up after you. Big tickets too. Candy bar wrapper? Okay how about a $250 fine.

It's just so simple.

I was riding to my hunting lease a couple years ago with a friend of mine, he finished his energy drink and as we went over a wooden bridge over a creek he chucked it out the window! I said "DUDE! *** was that?" He said "What?" I said "You just throw your freakin can out the window? Whats wrong with you?" He said "What? It's in the creek, the current is going to take it the opposite direction from your land." I was flabergasted. Sorry behavior.

About_Time
03-21-2012, 13:12
On golf courses they ask that you repair your divot and one other. The pack it in/pack it out approach isn't working in all cases, so perhaps asking everyone to help out is the next step?