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View Full Version : 5 out of 14 Midshipmen can't hike 70 miles



Powder River
04-18-2012, 09:30
http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/education/for-midshipmen-teachable-moments-hiking-stonewall-jacksons-shenandoah-trail/2012/04/15/gIQAlI9jJT_story.html?tid=pm_local_pop

This is really sad. Stonewall Jackson would not be impressed at all. His men would have done this in two days and without modern shoes, good socks, load transferring backpacks all while carrying a 19 lb rifle. Is this really the best the Navy has?

Lone Wolf
04-18-2012, 09:34
Marines woulda done it in a day

coach lou
04-18-2012, 09:37
Squids are for ballast on landing craft so those flat bottoms get to shore so Marines can force march to the front lines...........in 1 day, with Tipi Walters Pack, and a SAW.

Lone Wolf
04-18-2012, 09:50
Marines are in the Department of the Navy. the mens department

sevensixtwo187
04-18-2012, 09:50
What do you expect from sailors? :p

Pedaling Fool
04-18-2012, 09:53
Midshipmen are both squids and jarhead wannabes (officers). They're kids, but it is sorry, only because back in the day those punk asses would have been forced marched, just another example how bleeding heart BS is infiltrating the military


P.S. to my jarhead buddies, yes we all know the ones that dropped out were squids:D

coach lou
04-18-2012, 09:56
Boy, I thought my squid comment was going to raise holy h*ll with some WBs, but I guess most Sailors don't hike.

Powder River
04-18-2012, 10:00
It seems the author of the piece is unaware that the kids are not hiking Stonewall's route of march, but merely the AT, like everyone else out on the trail for spring break. And that these are some of the easiest miles in Virginia.

Powder River
04-18-2012, 10:02
Midshipmen are both squids and jarhead wannabes (officers). They're kids, but it is sorry, only because back in the day those punk asses would have been forced marched, just another example how bleeding heart BS is infiltrating the military


P.S. to my jarhead buddies, yes we all know the ones that dropped out were squids:D

Agreed. They used to have a name for those who couldn't march 70 miles; deserters.

jersey joe
04-18-2012, 10:23
Sad indeed. Jackson would be disappointed in the current state of our military...

fredmugs
04-18-2012, 10:37
They should have blazed the trail with donuts.

Rasty
04-18-2012, 11:28
My eleven year old could do this in four days.

Blissful
04-18-2012, 11:29
I didn't even read the Post trash piece. What that newspaper says is not worth my time.
My daughter-in-law is in the Navy and serving. Please respect all branches of the military and the men and women who serve.


(This thread should be deleted)

yellowsirocco
04-18-2012, 11:49
They planning on making a 70 mile long battleship or something? I really don't care how far our sailors can hike as long as they can keep the ships and planes working and pointed in the right direction.

Whack-a-mole
04-18-2012, 11:53
I'm sorry, but I was in the Navy. 90% of people in the Navy are overweight and very out of shape. It was pretty bad. My unit was very different. 100% type A personalities, but Navy EOD has always been a different kind of place. "If it was easy, everyone could do it" . Don't delete this thread, if someone can't take a little joking, it's pretty sad.

Mags
04-18-2012, 11:58
I'd cut them some slack.

Even in-shape people who have never backpacked can run into problems. These are 19 or 20 yo kids who have little outdoor experience. According to the follow-up, many of them started with fresh boots that were not broken in. The photo made their packs look big, too. If they are like many people, they have not had a lot of outdoor experience.

I don't look at them as military people..just DACK (Dumb **s College Kids) without experience...yet. I, too, was a DACK at 19 or 20 and probably would not do much better on my first backpacking trip. Oh wait...I didn't either. (http://www.pmags.com/big-knife-too-much-food-out-of-shape-my-first-backpacking-trip) :) I assure you, at 19 or 20, I sure as hell didn't know what I was going either.

Look up these men and women when they are 25, trained, have experience and have served a bit. Different story.


As for deleting the thread? It is just smack talk people in the military do amongst themselves. I work with a former sailor and a Marine. They are ALWAYS giving each other crap. :) At the end of the day though, they both respect the service each other provided for their country.

WingedMonkey
04-18-2012, 12:01
Whenever I'm in the mountains around Shenandoah Valley, I try to imagene what it must have been like for my ancestors fighting in that area that came from the flat lands of Florida, Georgia and South Carolina who had never seen a mountain before. Of course they had some conditioning just from the long marches to even get to the mountains from home (on poor food and equipment). I would doubt the sailors of Jackson's time to be great at mountain crossing either.

I wouldn't expect a bunch of "college students" from the U.S. Naval Academy to be any more prepared for long distance hiking than I would any other students. I do expect them to be well educated in modern technological warfare and leadership.

Take a look at your average group of reenactors, most of them plump and out of shape that "play" Civil War. Do you think they could hike 70 miles in the mountains? Or try and find a group of 14 scoutmasters that can.

Hopefully the adventure was a learning experience for the "students".

Feral Bill
04-18-2012, 12:36
Perhaps they learned to research ahead of time and prepare for whatever task they take on. I hope so.

Alligator
04-18-2012, 12:42
First day was 17 miles, the second was 22 miles. Understandable it would tear up some feet in new boots. High mileage second day as well for an inexperienced backpacker.

Stepinwolfe
04-18-2012, 12:59
The "fall outs" are probably going into subs or aviation. Trust me, the future SEALS and Marine made it!

Odd Man Out
04-18-2012, 12:59
Sad indeed. Jackson would be disappointed in the current state of our military...

I remember the last time we went to SNP there were historical markers all over the place about how Jackson and his army marched from here to there, always going over the Blue Ridge Mountains en route. I would look over the edge of the mountain and think "no way".

Whack-a-mole
04-18-2012, 13:20
The "fall outs" are probably going into subs or aviation. Trust me, the future SEALS and Marine made it!
For sure...There are more Navy divers looking for pilots, than there are pilots looking for Navy divers!

cowpoke
04-18-2012, 13:39
ahhhh...what the heck.....GO NAVY....BEAT Army!

rocketsocks
04-18-2012, 15:12
Have a very good friend and neighbor that is a civil war reenacted,it amazes me what history has documented that these boys have done.I have had discussions about the length in mileage these fellas walked and under what conditions.42 miles was one conversations we had though I don't recall where that was.now I know there is hikers that can and have done that,but did you do it Mal nourished,14 lb. infield/spring field rifle,no shoes,woolens,tar impregnated haver sac.Lets face it most who are here today had some ancestor in there past that was in these wars,so take pride in knowing that you came from strong stock,and most of us will never know just how far the human body can be pushed and made to Indore.Respectfully RS

daddytwosticks
04-18-2012, 15:33
Former squid (1979-1985) here. All you ex-military who are badmouthing navy-type should be ashamed. NEVER denegrate ANYONE's military service, PERIOD. :(

coach lou
04-18-2012, 16:09
I'd cut them some slack.



As for deleting the thread? It is just smack talk people in the military do amongst themselves. I work with a former sailor and a Marine. They are ALWAYS giving each other crap. :) At the end of the day though, they both respect the service each other provided for their country.

Gomennasai...Sailors!

skippysjs
04-18-2012, 16:41
The "fall outs" are probably going into subs or aviation. Trust me, the future SEALS and Marine made it!

:D As a former submariner, we'll take the "fall outs" because being on a submarine, my life wasn't dependent on whether or not the person beside me could hike 70 miles, but rather that he knew every detail about that boat so that when faced with an emergency situation we were going to be OK. I know most of these military comments are being made in jest and I'm good with that. I'm just thankful and appreciative of all of our military men and women - those who have the ability to do the amazing physical things, those who have incredible minds and those that have both which in my mind are most of them.

chiefiepoo
04-18-2012, 19:40
Boy, I thought my squid comment was going to raise holy h*ll with some WBs, but I guess most Sailors don't hike.

I'll pick that up, shipmate. Lots of us squids and airdales out there pounding the trail, not our chests like harda$$ groundpounders. :sunAn AT shelter space makes my 4 stack bunk onboard ship look positively grand. Food was much better on ship though. The WaPo story is an anectotal narrative about academy kids. Make no mistake, those young'uns are motivated, bright, and willing to endure hardship. give them a few years in the fleet or USMC company and they will reach their potential. Of more concern should be a recent finding that nearly 75% of military age eligible Americans are unfit to serve for reasons related to physical, mental, emotional, education and criminal limitations. Read Redy, Willing and Unfit to Serve
http://d15h7vkr8e4okv.cloudfront.net/NATEE1109.pdf

Jim
USN 1967-1971

Powder River
04-18-2012, 21:12
I didn't even read the Post trash piece. What that newspaper says is not worth my time.
My daughter-in-law is in the Navy and serving. Please respect all branches of the military and the men and women who serve.


(This thread should be deleted)

Perhaps you should have read it.

coach lou
04-18-2012, 21:21
I'll pick that up, shipmate. Lots of us squids and airdales out there pounding the trail, not our chests like harda$$ groundpounders. :sunAn AT shelter space makes my 4 stack bunk onboard ship look positively grand. Food was much better on ship though. The WaPo story is an anectotal narrative about academy kids. Make no mistake, those young'uns are motivated, bright, and willing to endure hardship. give them a few years in the fleet or USMC company and they will reach their potential. Of more concern should be a recent finding that nearly 75% of military age eligible Americans are unfit to serve for reasons related to physical, mental, emotional, education and criminal limitations. Read Redy, Willing and Unfit to Serve
http://d15h7vkr8e4okv.cloudfront.net/NATEE1109.pdf

Jim
USN 1967-1971

Well Jim,if you served in the Pacific then you know what I said in my last post. You also will agree with MAGS post, it's the nature of the beast. Like Lone Wolf, myself, and afew others....We're not so green, and not so mean....but still Marines. You been around enough of us that you get an Idea what that first three months does to us.

Papa D
04-18-2012, 21:50
I was just getting ready to go on a rant about how pathetic Americans are and how I think that extends to the military -- my impression of the current military (yes, marines included) is that they sit around and eat Doritos, drive cars everywhere but I read MAGS' post and have decided to "cut them some slack" - - these guys were probably not properly prepared, were new to hiking, etc., etc. so, I'll cut the rant short and give them a break - - I still think it's sort of pitiful that (me) Papa D (a 45 year old, 150 pound vegetarian, pacifist, nature creep sort of guy) could likely get these 70 miles done in one 24 hour day (pushy, no doubt) - - it would be a pleasant 3 day weekend though - they had 5 DAYS!! really? - Maybe I should join the Marines (not likely).

Lone Wolf
04-18-2012, 21:58
I was just getting ready to go on a rant about how pathetic Americans are and how I think that extends to the military -- my impression of the current military (yes, marines included) is that they sit around and eat Doritos, drive cars everywhere but I read MAGS' post and have decided to "cut them some slack" - - these guys were probably not properly prepared, were new to hiking, etc., etc. so, I'll cut the rant short and give them a break - - I still think it's sort of pitiful that (me) Papa D (a 45 year old, 150 pound vegetarian, pacifist, nature creep sort of guy) could likely get these 70 miles done in one 24 hour day (pushy, no doubt) - - it would be a pleasant 3 day weekend though - they had 5 DAYS!! really? - Maybe I should join the Marines (not likely).
you wouldn't amount to a pimple on a Marine's butt

Papa D
04-18-2012, 22:29
you wouldn't amount to a pimple on a Marine's butt

Heck - I thought I was being kind - - whatever dude - - the ones in this article obviously couldn't come close to keeping up.

dale1627
04-18-2012, 22:46
OK. So I was going to jump on the bandwagon and bash on the Navy but decided against it. Wanted to tell a story instead. I joined the Marines not long after high school with a guarantee of communication electronics. The recruiter said "Boy, you'll go to the field in an air conditioned tech van and carry a 9mm. No humps for you after MCT. So guess what my first unit was after comm elect schools? 2nd Battalion 7th Marines. A freaking infantry unit. I had just spent two months of luxurious living at Keesler AFB beforehand.
I arrived in the dessert paradise of 29 Palms to report to my unit. Started checking in and ended up at supply for my gear. The guy says "Are you sure that you want your gear now?" I say " Yes Sergeant." He loads me down with everything including an Alice pack with a broken quick release buckle on the shoulder strap. I then make my way to the armory. The armorer says "Are you sure that you want your weapon issued today? You can come back tomorrow evening." I say "Yes Corporal." He issues me a SAW with spare barrel and presents me with the weapon card. I finish checking in and report to the comm shop. The crusty old Gunnery Sergeant says "Boy, you finished checking in?" "Yes Gunny." He smiles and says "Good. We have a 25 mile hump tomorrow." So much for air conditioning and carrying a 9mm. Turned out to be the best three years of my life. To this day I miss seeing the stars overhead in the California dessert, or sitting on Mt Fuji in the freezing rain, or stressing about the jungle rats on Tinian eating my grub, or trying to keep the Kuwaiti sand out of my beef stew MRE. I would do it all again given the opportunity and will be especially proud if any of my children decide to enlist in the military. While I have that special spot in my heart for the Corps, I thank the good Lord above for all of our military. Even the squids......

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk

coach lou
04-18-2012, 23:01
OK. So I was going to jump on the bandwagon and bash on the Navy but decided against it. Wanted to tell a story instead. I joined the Marines not long after high school with a guarantee of communication electronics. The recruiter said "Boy, you'll go to the field in an air conditioned tech van and carry a 9mm. No humps for you after MCT. So guess what my first unit was after comm elect schools? 2nd Battalion 7th Marines. A freaking infantry unit. I had just spent two months of luxurious living at Keesler AFB beforehand.
I arrived in the dessert paradise of 29 Palms to report to my unit. Started checking in and ended up at supply for my gear. The guy says "Are you sure that you want your gear now?" I say " Yes Sergeant." He loads me down with everything including an Alice pack with a broken quick release buckle on the shoulder strap. I then make my way to the armory. The armorer says "Are you sure that you want your weapon issued today? You can come back tomorrow evening." I say "Yes Corporal." He issues me a SAW with spare barrel and presents me with the weapon card. I finish checking in and report to the comm shop. The crusty old Gunnery Sergeant says "Boy, you finished checking in?" "Yes Gunny." He smiles and says "Good. We have a 25 mile hump tomorrow." So much for air conditioning and carrying a 9mm. Turned out to be the best three years of my life. To this day I miss seeing the stars overhead in the California dessert, or sitting on Mt Fuji in the freezing rain, or stressing about the jungle rats on Tinian eating my grub, or trying to keep the Kuwaiti sand out of my beef stew MRE. I would do it all again given the opportunity and will be especially proud if any of my children decide to enlist in the military. While I have that special spot in my heart for the Corps, I thank the good Lord above for all of our military. Even the squids......

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk

Ok Dale, I was a 3534, fueltruck driver. 5.0/5.0 pro& cons, maxed the PFT, 3 yrs expert rifleman, meritorius mast, meritorious Corporal...Dude I was Rock Marine. They gave me my dream sheet when I left Japan, I picked Yuma, Santa Ana, and Quantico....where do you think they sent me? My place of birth Camp Lejeune!!! Thank you Chesty Puller! Ha!

Papa D
04-18-2012, 23:04
good stories all - goodnight - you too LW

Majortrauma
04-18-2012, 23:07
Don't delete the thread! If they're Company Commander at Canoe U took them out there with no preparation and in typical boots, yeah, the drop rate would be high but I seriously doubt that was the case. Things truly are not as they used to be and failure is now an option and there is little to no shame for quitting. It's a disgrace.
I'll find out how many of the drops were Marine options and how many were Navy options and get back to everyone but I' have a very high degree of confidence that the drops were disproportionately Navy options. That's just how it typically goes folks and it's not a good sign.
To Lone Wolf, 762187, Coach Lou and John Gault...semper fi bros!!

dale1627
04-18-2012, 23:09
The last two years of my six year enlistment was at Cherry Point. The career planner tried to get me to reenlist. I said OK but only if I can go back to the ground side. He said nope, not as a Sergeant comm tech. I asked for a lateral move. He said nope but you'll get a bonus as a comm tech. I said what about MSG duty. He said nope, there's a shortage in your field. I said OK, I'm going home.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk

coach lou
04-18-2012, 23:12
Thank You Sir. To all my comrades in arms, and the citizens we have all protected.....good nite. God bless the United States of America.

Lone Wolf
04-18-2012, 23:27
good stories all - goodnight - you too LW

sleep well young man

Hikemor
04-19-2012, 09:21
Is the "teachable moment" a lesson on how NOT to lead? Granted Canoe U middies these days are coddled techno-geeks but retired jarhead Joe Thomas recieves an F for his leadership exercise. 17 and 22 mile hikes in brand new boots? Hike carrying a gallon jug of koolaid in your hand? I'm betting most of his troops had never been backpacking or been to SNP before. How many will go back? Good job, Joe!

coach lou
04-19-2012, 09:49
they are training to go to combat, it ain't summer camp........I feel this thread is on hold until The Major gets us the facts.

The Solemates
04-19-2012, 10:02
pathetic. some have blamed it out age but that is absurd.....I was hiking 70 miles in 3 days at the age of 14.

flemdawg1
04-19-2012, 10:21
I'm with mags, they're college kids, not soldiers/sialors yet. There's reason all NCOs tell the butter-bar Ensigns/2nd Lts to ****, its because they don't know squat. And these kids haven't even earned those commisions yet. Its no big deal. Plus these are Middies, not exactly the tip-top of physical specimens of our military.

Former navy MM.

Mags
04-19-2012, 11:04
pathetic. some have blamed it out age but that is absurd.....I was hiking 70 miles in 3 days at the age of 14.

I blamed it on their lack of experience which usually goes along with their age. Subtle, but important, difference.

At 14, I was washing dishes and not hiking. I definitely could not do 70 miles in 3 days. At 20, I had never backpacked and could not hike 70 miles in 3 days.

Glad all you guys are big an burly and hardcore. The typical 19 yr old with no backpacking experience is not going to hike 70 miles.

But I am a wimp....I would not go by me or my experience and defer to the Xtreme athletes among us instead.

Fiddleback
04-19-2012, 13:11
My daughter-in-law is in the Navy and serving. Please respect all branches of the military and the men and women who serve.


(This thread should be deleted)

I like it.

Or...limit the disrespectful posts to those who (choose any one); have served in the military with honor, hiked 70 miles, or qualified for a service academy.

FB

Miami Joe
04-19-2012, 15:32
Going to brag a bit about two of my best friends here ... I have plenty of friends who work in the military and the two toughest guys of the bunch serve in the Army and Navy. The guy in the Army is a triple-stacked SOCM and is pretty much one of the world's biggest badasses. He has worked on a JSOC team for the past eight years doing God knows what. He can't tell me. My friend in the Navy played soccer for the Academy and now is a high-ranking officer in SOUTHCOM. The point of this background info is the three of us used to backpack together in high school. On more than one occasion we cut trips short because of injuries, weather or whatever. I think you guys are making a big deal out of nothing. The people who serve in our military are just as tough and dedicated today (and perhaps a little more) than those who served before them. The leadership excursion during spring break detailed in this article should be commended. I don't think I need to go into detail about the rigors of attending a service academy. I think some of us are missing the big picture: These middies spent their spring break doing something constructive rather than getting drunk at the beach. That's called leadership, boys.

MyName1sMud
04-19-2012, 15:35
Sad indeed. Jackson would be disappointed in the current state of our military...


**** he should be sad at the current state of our country.

we've gotten soft.

daddytwosticks
04-19-2012, 15:36
A person's got to make many mistakes and face failure many times in order to learn life's lessons. I am a VERY learnered man, just can't spell for s**t. :)