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WIAPilot
05-01-2012, 05:49
I have been reading on several sites that the cost of hiking the AT can be estimated at $1 per mile - so approximately $2200. With a 6 month hike = roughly $12 a day. This seems absolutely incredibly low to me unless you are not factoring in a lot of drop boxes filled with supplies.

If you think of supplies, laundry, showers, and the weekly pizza & beer not to mention the hostels every so often - I'm thinking at least $3 per miles. Otherwise, you're going to need a heck of a lot of trail magic....

Now if someone wants to eat Ramen the entire trip, it could probably be done but this does seem to be low to me.

GritsNgreens
05-01-2012, 08:50
Someone had posted in the "Trail Moochers thread" (Where you and I met) :) that the $1 a mile was figured up some 20 years ago so factor in inflation, and changing of the times etc. your probably spot on with 3-4 $$ a day

GritsNgreens
05-01-2012, 08:50
Correction $3-$4/ mile, not day....my bad

Lone Wolf
05-01-2012, 08:51
$5000 for a comfortable 5 month walk

WIAPilot
05-01-2012, 09:05
But it's sad that this "$1 per mile myth" is still being perpetuated on several other sites. I think I can understand more about the mooching now. It doesn't make it right in my opinion, but it does help to explain it a little more.

max patch
05-01-2012, 09:26
But it's sad that this "$1 per mile myth" is still being perpetuated on several other sites.

What sites?

Even this site has an article somewhere which states how you can thru for $1,000. But most people here would disagree with that.

By the way, I thru'd for a dollar a mile. Twenty four years ago.

Mags
05-01-2012, 09:26
But it's sad that this "$1 per mile myth" is still being perpetuated on several other sites. I think I can understand more about the mooching now. It doesn't make it right in my opinion, but it does help to explain it a little more.

I don't think it is so much a myth as something that was true in ca. 1995 and not true today. People who quote that figure just don't realize how out of date it is.

A rough equivalent in today's dollars would be ~$3500 for a modest in terms of luxury, but not bare bones, traditional thru-hike.

Of course if you hike in a 4 month time span, spend little time in towns and so on, $3500 is a very nice chunk of change. :)

Live_for_hiking
05-01-2012, 11:24
Most of the costs people estimate is around 5K.

I plan on auditing my expenditures when I'm done and posting my real cost to thru-hike in 2013. I will include travel to and from the trail.

I don't really have a budget set for my hike. I've got more than enough saved to not worry about it. I should note that while I my budget for the thru is pretty open-ended, I'm frugal when it comes to motels, food, etc. I simply don't want to think about money while hiking. It would diminish my experience :b.

John B
05-01-2012, 11:51
Assuming that a thruhiker is employed rather than unemployed, retired, or on some form of disability, I would add to the "real cost" the salary that you won't earn during the X-month vacation.

Moose2001
05-01-2012, 11:58
.

A rough equivalent in today's dollars would be ~$3500 for a modest in terms of luxury, but not bare bones, traditional thru-hike.


I'd second that number. That would give you town options, rest days and the ability to eat well. You can't spend money on the trail, only in town! The more town days you have, the more you'll spend.

Grampie
05-01-2012, 14:01
$5000 for a comfortable 5 month walk

Wolf..That sounds kind of high. I would find it hard to spend $250.00 a week while hiking the AT.

Jeff
05-01-2012, 14:15
Years ago hikers went into town every 7 to 10 days. Now it's more like every 3 days...making it way more expensive to hike.

kayak karl
05-01-2012, 14:42
Assuming that a thruhiker is employed rather than unemployed, retired, or on some form of disability, I would add to the "real cost" the salary that you won't earn during the X-month vacation.
wouldn't the "real cost" destort the numbers even more. now we're above 25K for a 4 month hike???

OldFeet
05-01-2012, 15:36
Of course if you don't thru hike you still have to feed yourself so at least part of the cost will be spent anyway. The cost will also be offset by the fact that for four to five months no money will be spent on gas and probably a few other things.

Moose2001
05-01-2012, 15:44
Wolf..That sounds kind of high. I would find it hard to spend $250.00 a week while hiking the AT.

Hah! Not hard to do at all! I've done it a couple of times. Pure luxury all the way.

Rain Man
05-01-2012, 15:59
Assuming that a thruhiker is employed rather than unemployed, retired, or on some form of disability, I would add to the "real cost" the salary that you won't earn during the X-month vacation.

You are correct. The OP titled his post the "REAL" cost,... then said NOTHING about the "opportunity lost" cost, but only mentioned out-of-pocket cost. Which is very deceiving (I don't mean the OP, just calling it one thing, but it really being another thing altogether). He's not talking about the "REAL" cost at all, so should not call it that.

Can you tell I took economics in college?

Rain Man

.

Monkeywrench
05-01-2012, 16:31
For some people hiking the trail has cost them a spouse or other significant relationship. Compared to that, money ain't nothin'!

Magua
05-01-2012, 16:48
For some people hiking the trail has cost them a spouse or other significant relationship. Compared to that, money ain't nothin'!

Did they lose the spouse/ significant other because they left them at home when they thru-hiked OR because they thru-hiked with them and it was just too much?...

Monkeywrench
05-01-2012, 17:04
Did they lose the spouse/ significant other because they left them at home when they thru-hiked OR because they thru-hiked with them and it was just too much?...

It's probably happened both ways.

JAK
05-01-2012, 17:20
The hike itself still costs about $1 per mile, but this would be no-frills, just basic supplies, no overnight stays, no shuttles, no beer, no restraunts, no laundromats, and doesn't include transportation to and from the trail. Within this $1 per mile there is ample room for good food and good nutrition, at grocery store prices. Of course many people make a fair and modest living from hikers, and would like to see hikers spend more, but at the end of the day its your money, and it's your hike, and "it's just walking".

Slo-go'en
05-01-2012, 17:43
It was back in the '80's when I first heard the "$1 per mile" figure quoted. The cost has gone up significantly since then. Heck, just a pair of good socks cost $22 these days...

blackbird04217
05-01-2012, 17:56
I have been reading on several sites that the cost of hiking the AT can be estimated at $1 per mile - so approximately $2200. With a 6 month hike = roughly $12 a day. This seems absolutely incredibly low to me unless you are not factoring in a lot of drop boxes filled with supplies.

Minus gear, I spent $1150 on food, supplies, mail drops (one from Family, so add $30-40 if you want), camera replacement, and the three or four times I stayed at a hostel. My parents put me in a hotel once, (so add $60?) and a couple hikers put me in a hotel once - magic in return for magic sort of thing. This was in 2009. I was off the trail for ~9 days at one point, where my family fed me well- but I am not sure that changes much. If you add in all the gear, it is over $2500, though some was not used... Silly newbie. If you add in additional life costs to be able to stay on the trail, +$2500 to move back home, +$3600 to keep paying loans/bills for the minimum amount of time.

I did _NOT_ set out to hike for so close to $1000, but the financial situation turned on me and I just made it work. I didn't get real food at each town, which may have been nice? I didn't pamper myself, but I wasn't out there to be pampered. So $2200? Completely doable, comfortable for me even. (If you are excluding the additional life costs and gear).

WIAPilot
05-01-2012, 18:29
You are correct. The OP titled his post the "REAL" cost,... then said NOTHING about the "opportunity lost" cost, but only mentioned out-of-pocket cost. Which is very deceiving (I don't mean the OP, just calling it one thing, but it really being another thing altogether). He's not talking about the "REAL" cost at all, so should not call it that.

Can you tell I took economics in college?

Rain Man

.

This "he" is a "she." Yes, Rain Man, women now fly and own aviation companies. :eek: And if you want to get "real" anal, let's factor in the health benefits such as lost weight and increased overall health vs. potential hiking accidents, etc. My whole point is that the $1 per mile is still being touted as current on numerous websites.

The fact is that you do need to wash your clothes occasionally and as anyone who frequently goes to the grocery store knows = prices since 1990 have increased by about 40%-50%. Heck, even in the last 2 yrs since the gas crunch, they have increased about 15%.

And who doesn't factor in cost to get to the trail? Like Beam me up, Scotty! Likewise, Trail Magic is nice, but new hikers need to realize that, legalisms aside, they had better plan on at least close to $2-$3 per mile instead of relying upon the kindness of other hikers.

Sassafras Lass
05-01-2012, 18:35
I have been reading on several sites that the cost of hiking the AT can be estimated at $1 per mile

Sure, about 10 years ago. Today, figure about $1.60-$2.00/mile.

But you're correct, because it depends on your style.

If you like hotels/motels/hostels every week; if you like restaurants and beer at every town; if you smoke; then your hike will certainly be more expensive than someone who uses paid lodging sparingly and doesn't indulge in many restaurants or spirits.

lowkeywanderer
05-01-2012, 18:41
I spent 7K+ on a six month thru last year only going into town every 10-14 days but living it up in town number may be slightly HIGHER than others cost due to unnamed expense. it seemed to me that you could do it pretty cheaply if you never stayed in towns but im not sure how many would make it the whole way with out a few nights off trail.

Mags
05-01-2012, 19:45
I did not take economics in college like some of more the learned posters, but I do know what the word pedantic means. I, of course, have a dictionary. :D

In any case. I'll keep it simple: I still feel pretty sure in saying that a comfortable (again, not overly luxurious) thru-hike can be had for $3500. The means mainly hostels vs motel rooms, modest restaurant meals and out every 5 days vs 3 days. Town time kept to a minimum. Transportation costs usually aren't factored in, but would make sense. I took a Greyhound bus for under $100 for both the AT...and the CDT. If you want a hike on the the higher side of luxury (more rooms to yourself, frequent town stops and restaurant meals) and take closer to 6 months, $4500 is more on par.

Longer hikes (over 6 months) are more expensive of course. And if you are comfortable walking all day and not spending a lot of time in towns, a 4 month hike can be very inexpensive. Garlic has some good thoughts on that subject.

Papa D
05-01-2012, 20:10
I hiked on $1 per mile with $ to spare in '85 - - I also didn't drink much and pretty much thought of it as a wilderness experience (which it was) - - I remember getting quarters for pay phones, shopping with ten bucks for a week, no problem - - inflation obviously has to be figured in, but it really depends on your style - - if you want to pay for shuttles, stay in lots of hostels, party in towns, get a shower every couple of days, never yogi, etc. - - it might cost you $10K to hike the AT - - I maintain that if you hike the trail in a woods-person's style (but still have a little fun) a normal budget is now just under $2.00 per mile - - $5000 - that should get it done - - - of course the next time I hike the AT, I might drink a $1,000 bottle of wine on Mt. K and blow the budget right then and there.:eek:

Biggie Master
05-01-2012, 20:21
To me this is a relative question (ask your brother :) ) -- like asking "How much does it cost to maintain a house?", or "How much does it cost to eat in a restaurant?". Well it all depends. Are you Bill Gates or Joe Plumber? It's all relative, and will be different for every individual. I'm sure someone out there can hike the entire trail on nothing but what nature provides, and others will want/need every luxury and convenience they can afford. It's going to cost you something, but only you know your tastes and propensity to spend. I think every poster here has been correct - for their tastes and their budget. I've not done a thru hike, but my personal budget technique (for anything in life) is to plan for the higher cost and manage under that budget.

wolf
05-01-2012, 20:27
you can do it with out spending alot of $ ,just stay on trail and not go nuts in town

greywolf1974
05-01-2012, 20:33
i spend avg of 150$ per week - thats food and the occasional hostel laundry ect..

BlizzardChord
05-01-2012, 20:34
I think this is another thing I'm gonna calculate before I go. I'm a college student and how much things cost is kind of a big deal to all of us. Since I won't be working during this time, I'll also be figuring in how much money I will be losing from it all too.

AndyB
05-01-2012, 21:00
in 1995 I spent 3k including paying shipping for my own food drops. If I were to hike it again I'd skip the food drops and have 3500 budgeted at least. I think it would take me less time and now town doesn't have all the appeal it did for me when I was younger. I don't consider the time I spent away from work as anything "lost" time, money or otherwise. Mooching hikers should be shunned, if you can't afford it, you're doing it wrong. Just like in "the real world".

Andy
counting dimes to head to the Long Trail in August

Datto
05-01-2012, 21:15
You gain knowledge. After completing a thru-hike of the AT you have a good idea what little it takes to make you happy. Invaluable. You know, whatever the case, you could always survive no matter what the situation. You come back from a thru-hike with an immense confidence that there aren't any obstacles that can't be overcome. You learn first hand about incrementalism (how very small actions, done continuously over a long period of time, can add up to great achievements). You learn to value experiences. You gain lifelong friends. You learn to like being with yourself.

I don't know how you calculate that into the economics of an AT thru-hike but it's certainly value you can't go down to the local Best Buy and pick up on a whim when you're bored.


Datto

WIAPilot
05-01-2012, 21:47
You gain knowledge. After completing a thru-hike of the AT you have a good idea what little it takes to make you happy. Invaluable. You know, whatever the case, you could always survive no matter what the situation. You come back from a thru-hike with an immense confidence that there aren't any obstacles that can't be overcome. You learn first hand about incrementalism (how very small actions, done continuously over a long period of time, can add up to great achievements). You learn to value experiences. You gain lifelong friends. You learn to like being with yourself.

I don't know how you calculate that into the economics of an AT thru-hike but it's certainly value you can't go down to the local Best Buy and pick up on a whim when you're bored.


Datto


Beautifully put and so inspiring!

And Blizzard, so encouraged that you intend to calculate the costs prior to your trip. Makes this discussion worthwhile!

RichardD
05-01-2012, 22:04
I like Datto's post
The true cost of a thru depends so much on factors outside the trail. Do you have to forego an income while you hike yet continue to have to pay mortgage, car payments, student loans, medical insurance etc etc. The ages of hikers are quite bimodal, a large group who have not yet got their careers and commitments started and a group of retirees. Its too financially daunting for most folks in the middle.
I hiked as a retiree, on a modest teacher pension and my savings grew while I hiked. I spent less on my six months adventure than I would have with six months at home. No gas for the car, no electricity for the house, base water charge, cable on standby, no phone. no payments. On the trail I made great friends and we shared hotel costs making them comparable with hostels, we shared ride cost when hitching seemed unlikely and we ate town food whenever it was nearby. We also enjoyed a few beers in town. In all we enjoyed our hike, rested up when we wanted and did not go overboard while in town and in total spent less than staying home.
I dont know if my post helps anyone but my point is that there are so many ways to calculate what the hike costs and there are so many things that could or could not be included in that cost.. In my case it was a good savings strategy!!!

Odd Man Out
05-01-2012, 22:05
As a hypothetical exercise, how would you plan the least expensive possible hike?

One strategy would be mail ahead to yourself boxes of all your supplies and equipment, pre-packaged and pre-planned. It would take a lot of skill to know exactly what you need and when. But if you had that skill and experience, the ability to buy equipment on-sale and on-line and groceries in bulk from discount stores might off set the cost of postage. By pre-planning your meals you could eat bulk, non-processed foods which also saves. Plus there is the added bonus of being able to hike lighter (carry only what you need) and thus faster. Cutting days on the trail would also go a long way to saving money.

But then there is the opposite strategy of planning nothing and living out of the hiker boxes. If successful, then time on the trail wouldn't be an issue.

A third possibility would be to pack as much as possible so you can stay on the trail as long as possible and out of towns.

Again, I'm not suggesting any of these would be desirable or fun. But as a hypothetical exercise, how would you do it?

LDog
05-01-2012, 22:38
Here's a fairly recent thread on this topic:
http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php?79898-Costs-of-a-thru-hike

And a spreadsheet I built based on input from that thread:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0ApOKl2Ya2LXmdG96c2hXUU1QNU1sVEZybTZtZV9SO EE

Disclaimer: This spreadsheet is strictly cyber-hiking, and does *not* reflect any real-life experience...

Lone Wolf
05-01-2012, 22:39
$5000...............

WIAPilot
05-01-2012, 22:49
LOL LDog, I love your spreadsheets.

DaSchwartz
05-01-2012, 23:20
I rode a bicycle 2,000 miles over 30 days and ended up spending only $300, not including the cost of the bike. I did not stay in a hotel one time. That's 10 bucks a day. SO I fugure 10 bucks a day x 210 days = length of AT> I've only section hiked, but I bet you can do a hike for a $1 a mile IF you stay at zero hostels, get out of town as quickly as you can with resupply, and perhaps pig out on McDonald's dollar menu.. and of course, avoid alcohol.

Now of course, if one includes stuff as lost job revenue, time with family, etc... then the cost of a true thru-hike can be very expensive.

I would like to see some journals where people are cheap-skates trying to do a $1 a mile thinig.... Can anyone point me to some?

WIAPilot
05-02-2012, 00:25
I think that something else that should be considered is that for many of us, we will probably only be able to do this once. I think, especially for the younger hikers, that the occasional hostel and weekly pizza (if not the beer) might make a lot of difference in " the journey. " Can you probably hike for $1 per mile without relying on the generosity of others? Possibly. Can you really make the most of the AT on that amount? Not in my opinion....

Slacks
05-02-2012, 02:04
You gain knowledge. After completing a thru-hike of the AT you have a good idea what little it takes to make you happy. Invaluable. You know, whatever the case, you could always survive no matter what the situation. You come back from a thru-hike with an immense confidence that there aren't any obstacles that can't be overcome. You learn first hand about incrementalism (how very small actions, done continuously over a long period of time, can add up to great achievements). You learn to value experiences. You gain lifelong friends. You learn to like being with yourself.

I don't know how you calculate that into the economics of an AT thru-hike but it's certainly value you can't go down to the local Best Buy and pick up on a whim when you're bored.


Datto

...thank you

Blissful
05-02-2012, 09:26
My hike cost 4,000 not including gear.

Astro
05-02-2012, 10:52
You are correct. The OP titled his post the "REAL" cost,... then said NOTHING about the "opportunity lost" cost, but only mentioned out-of-pocket cost. Which is very deceiving (I don't mean the OP, just calling it one thing, but it really being another thing altogether). He's not talking about the "REAL" cost at all, so should not call it that.

Can you tell I took economics in college?

Rain Man

.

Rain Man aren't you a lawyer also?

WIAPilot
05-02-2012, 23:47
A hiker just mentioned that he would be budgeting $2200 for his 2013 AT thru. I think we really need to get the word out that a fair amount to budget is $5000....

LDog
05-03-2012, 07:55
A hiker just mentioned that he would be budgeting $2200 for his 2013 AT thru. I think we really need to get the word out that a fair amount to budget is $5000....

Did you just volunteer to write an article?

[snerk]

WIAPilot
05-03-2012, 08:13
LOL I'll leave the writing to you, LDog. Really enjoy your blog.

LDog
05-03-2012, 09:36
LOL I'll leave the writing to you, LDog. Really enjoy your blog.

Flattery, however nice, will get you nowhere! The article is all yours!

RED-DOG
05-03-2012, 10:45
When i fliped-floped in 96 i spent 2500 that's gear, town visits the entire thing but when i thru-hiked in 2006 i spent about 4500 on every thing this year i have spent close to 5000 and i just know made a pit stop in palmerton PA roughly half way i am looking at about 7-8000 for this years thru. whom ever said they got a budget of 2200 for a 2013 thru has got a rude awakening coming to them he probably want even make it to damascus VA on that amount good luck and happy hiking to all. RED-DOG

JAK
05-03-2012, 19:50
Trying to be frugal and focus on nature rather than towns doesn't automatically make you a moocher.
That said, best way to train for a frugal hike is by being frugal at home, which will also save money for your hike.

GritsNgreens
05-03-2012, 21:49
I budgeted for $5,000 but I got coupon in the mail for 1/2 off so I'm good....Ha-Ha j/k what ever happened to Hike your own Hike?

WIAPilot
05-03-2012, 22:11
I budgeted for $5,000 but I got coupon in the mail for 1/2 off so I'm good....Ha-Ha j/k what ever happened to Hike your own Hike?

Whatever happened to "BE PREPARED?" If a young hiker was planning on using equipment that wouldn't last the whole trip, we would be just as diligent about informing them of this.

GritsNgreens
05-03-2012, 22:19
I agree however, if someone came to this thread searching an answer it seems to me they'd be more confused than when they started, it has ranged from $1000- $7500. All I'm saying is each individual should know what comfort zone they'd be in, and how much "roughing it" they want to do then plan accordingly to what they want to achieve. Besides it's always better to budget too much $$ than not enough

DavidNH
05-03-2012, 22:20
a thru hike is so much more than "just walking." It's supposed to be a fun and memorable adventure. The idea that one can hike at a dollar per mile is crazy. It's as nuts as saying you can hike 2000 miles and not stop at a single restaurant. you will go to town and you will go to restaurants. I would budget 5,000 dollars for the hike. That's not even being extravagant.

If one really wants to come up with the REAL COST of an AT thru hike, you'd need to add in cost of gear, transportation from home to trail head, cost of quitting your job (no one gives 5-6 months vacation).

Maybe all this trail magic isn't such a good thing. It gives folks a false sense of security.

davidNH

WIAPilot
05-04-2012, 00:13
I agree however, if someone came to this thread searching an answer it seems to me they'd be more confused than when they started, it has ranged from $1000- $7500. All I'm saying is each individual should know what comfort zone they'd be in, and how much "roughing it" they want to do then plan accordingly to what they want to achieve. Besides it's always better to budget too much $$ than not enough

I'm not trying to give you a hard time, Grits, but folks can write pretty much what they want to on this site and it doesn't make it so. Anyone who posts that you can realistically do the hike on $1000-$2200 is living in LaLa Land. It's like saying that you can start hiking in Feb without a cold weather sleeping bag.

I think with budgeting - you just have to look at it like SPECS and simply DO THE MATH. Figure at least $30 for each hostel night with laundry and a trip to the buffet and a beer or ice cream or two. Then plan on having to stay in a hostel at least 3-4 times a month due to weather and to simply recharge your body with the extra calories. Estimate the weeks you will be on the trail and add 2 more weeks to that. Then divide days into what is left to give you your per diem allowance for all food, laundry, showers, fuel, gear replacement, and emergencies.

$630 = Hostels, restaurants. (7 x every 2 months)
180 = Estmated days on trail
$5000 = $25 per day for all food, laundry, showers, fuel, gear, and emergencies.
$4000 = close to $19 per day.
$3000 = barely $13 per day.
$2200 = about $8.75 per day for all food, laundry, showers, fuel, gear, and emergencies.
$1000 = $2 per day

I'm not trying to discourage young hikers; I'm trying to help them realize their dream by preparing them to be successful. Yes, there are different hikes and different levels of comfort - but you have to be realistic too. And this doesn't include what it will cost you to get to GA/Maine and your return trip as well....

perrymk
05-04-2012, 04:21
$2200 = about $8.75 per day for all food, laundry, showers, fuel, gear, and emergencies.

My daily food budget at home comes close to that, but I like decent quality food. Eat out one meal and my daily food budget exceeds that. That's with a daily calorie allotment of 2000-2500. The trail would be more.

camperjames64
05-04-2012, 10:36
So what I'm hearing is that even with food drops,if you don't go into town and get back on"grid",one can't enjoy the last true nature event.I thought going camping and hike in woods was to getaway from town!am going to get away not go to other towns.I'm going to stay on trail.except to pick up food drops.why can't I make it south to north almost free?

flemdawg1
05-04-2012, 11:14
So what I'm hearing is that even with food drops,if you don't go into town and get back on"grid",one can't enjoy the last true nature event.I thought going camping and hike in woods was to getaway from town!am going to get away not go to other towns.I'm going to stay on trail.except to pick up food drops.why can't I make it south to north almost free?

Sure, sure. Report back when you're done with your thru hike and tell us how that worked out for ya.
IS it impossible? no. But we live in a world of cushy comforts, soft beds, air conditioning, 24hr cable TV and internet, cold sweet tasting drinks, fat laden fast foods, clean clothes, and hot showers. We've conditioned our bodies to seek these things from birth. Giving them all of it up (much less just one of them) for extended periods is not in most people's nature or self interest (not alot of benefit for the self discpline). Almost noone spends the entire 2200 miles out in the woods, its just a fact. You'll not be able to carry enough calories in ramen noodles, honey buns, peanut butter or jerky and you'll get massive cravings for a pizza and a coke, but you smell like week old road kill, so you check into a hotel/hostel for shower and laundry, and screw it you just spend the night because you hiked 15 miles then took a hour to hitch a ride into town.. and its about to rain, and you need to call your mom/wife/girlfriend...etc. It doesn't mean you're weak, its just that you're human and stuff happens.

camperjames64
05-04-2012, 11:26
Isn't that what going off "grid" is all about?getting away from aforementioned comforts?this sounds like modern day amusement park verse getting to know ones self.that's what my 47 years have given.this?will do it cheeap.I guess my 60s hippie mentality didn't get trampled in the mix.it will be about getting back to nature and understanding "wants and needs".isn't that the founding spirit of trail.off the grid.

camperjames64
05-04-2012, 12:03
Did not mean that to sound like an attack on anybody.just trying to have solid dialogue.have gear.I phone.food drops.should be able to survive with anewed mental vigor.again apologies to any offended parties.

flemdawg1
05-04-2012, 12:04
Isn't that what going off "grid" is all about?getting away from aforementioned comforts?this sounds like modern day amusement park verse getting to know ones self.that's what my 47 years have given.this?will do it cheeap.I guess my 60s hippie mentality didn't get trampled in the mix.it will be about getting back to nature and understanding "wants and needs".isn't that the founding spirit of trail.off the grid.

But there is nothing "wrong" with comforts. There's no nirvana for those who forego showers for a month, they just end up smelling really bad. And the 2 things don't have to be mutually exclusive, you can enjoy being in the "wildrness" for a couple of weeks, getting in touch with nature/God, then go have a beer and pizza. And the vast majority of hikers do also. You can turn this into an execise of self-deprication if you want, living like a monk and all. But most folks are out there to have a good time. The trees and peaks all start to look alike after awhile.

Monkeywrench
05-04-2012, 12:23
When you've been hiking in the rain for five days straight and everything you own falls somewhere on the continuum between damp and wet, and it's so cold you can't get the Nutella out of the jar, and your feet are wrinkled and pruny and ache all day, and you come out of the woods and Ron Haven's hiker shuttle bus is waiting to take you into town for a warm dry motel room, a hot shower, and a steak and a beer at the local watering hole, it's awfully hard to say "No thanks, I'll keep walking and sleep in my smelly damp sleeping bag again tonight, after eating another pot of Lipton sides with a slice of Spam. Y'all enjoy your time in town."

But that doesn't mean it CAN'T be done.

LDog
05-04-2012, 12:27
"Off-Grid" sounds like an absolute term, but I suspect most are less absolute and more like, "kinda-off-grid." And then it just becomes a matter of degree. If one picks up mail drops at the post office, they are certainly not "off-grid" in the absolute sense. Nor would be hitching into town, showering in a hostel, using an iPhone, eating at Pizza Hut ...

I suspect I'll be more off-grid than normal for the length of the hike. Call it "reduced grid." Cause, I'll be taking overnights in town every 4 days or so to recharge batteries, take a shower, eat a big meal or three, do laundry, dry out gear, go shopping ...

I plan to go for more days between resupplies to minimize time off trail. I'm thinking of hiking thru Shenandoah and GSMNP, as well as the 100 Mile Widerness. I like to hike a good chunk of the day to get to a road crossing in time to get into town in the afternoon. Then shower, eat, do laundry, shop for food, get some sleep, eat a big breakfast, and get back on the trail as early as possible the next morning to make more miles. I like taking zeros in the woods.

Slo-go'en
05-04-2012, 12:44
and get back on the trail as early as possible the next morning to make more miles.

That is the classic "Nero" and is the usual town stop. However, if you wake up and it's 40 degrees and raining cats and dogs, leaving town can be a very, very difficult thing to do. It's much easier to say "one more day won't hurt and I need the rest".

The REAL cost of any hike, section or thru is a lot more then you think it will be...

camperjames64
05-04-2012, 12:59
No there is nothing wrong with said comforts.I dont remember such comforts as a kid camping with dad in northern cali.I hope to leave the comforts that I also have become to used to behind for awile.jump in lake once in a while.have been 7countries and the level of needs are quite different.thank y'all for the convo.does help.peace love dove.

WIAPilot
05-04-2012, 13:55
So what I'm hearing is that even with food drops,if you don't go into town and get back on"grid",one can't enjoy the last true nature event.I thought going camping and hike in woods was to getaway from town!am going to get away not go to other towns.I'm going to stay on trail.except to pick up food drops.why can't I make it south to north almost free?

OK - I'm teasing ya here, but I hope that you are doing this in 2013 so that I can laugh my (soakin' wet) socks off when you eat these words.

You are going to NEED to take showers, you are going to NEED to do your laundry, you are going to NEED to have your tent and other things dry out because they won't dry out in the shelters. Now when you are so sick of trail food that you're ready to kill a black bear and trade him for a cheeseburger - I just hope you remember this and hold up your sign. I'll buy you dinner.

camperjames64
05-04-2012, 22:59
Wow kinda harsh bro! Was entertaining idea of taking this months worth of supply and go.not to town.to be alone.its sounding like there wont be peaceful alone with people all around at every turn.not cool dude.

kayak karl
05-04-2012, 23:18
Wow kinda harsh bro! Was entertaining idea of taking this months worth of supply and go.not to town.to be alone.its sounding like there wont be peaceful alone with people all around at every turn.not cool dude.
if you want to be alone the AT isn't the place to do it, but if you leave SOBO end of Sept there will be less people.
many plan their hike, but end up not hiking their plan :rolleyes:

GritsNgreens
05-05-2012, 07:43
Ran out of food??? CANABALISM!!!! Yea it's free!!! (it's a joke and spoof on where this thread has gone)

MuddyWaters
05-05-2012, 08:16
REAL cost of hiking the AT?

Everyone looks at it WRONG.

What is most commonly meant is "HOW MUCH MONEY DO I HAVE TO HAVE SAVED TO SPEND WHILE HIKING THE AT"

That is much different from the real cost.

It doesnt cost anything significant to actually hike. You have to eat every day anyway, whether hiking or not, so food costs really dont even count.

What other expenses do you have that still have to be covered? Lost income is a very significant real cost if you have expenses of maintaining a household, etc. Not working while still paying out bills is cost prohibitive for most, easily putting the cost into the $20,000-$50,000, which is why those persons dont thru hike.


But , another thing to consider is retirement savings. When you first get out of school, the money you save for retirement is the most important you will ever save because it has the longest to compound with interest. You need to start saving aggressively the day you get out of school and begin working.

So, instead of working and saving , you go play and hike the AT. Instead of saving $8000 toward retirement your first year out of school, you save $2000. Assuming a real return only 3% above inflation, what is the difference after 40 yrs? your AT hike cost you $19,500 in retirement savings

perrymk
05-05-2012, 08:59
You have to eat every day anyway, whether hiking or not, so food costs really dont even count.

I agree with much of what you say, except the quoted part above. Even if we were to assume one eats the same type of food on the trail as off, one likely requires twice as many calories to sustain a hike of any distance. That means spending double on food. Factor in that one might end up getting at least some pre-packaged (expensive) hiker food and the cost increases yet again.

camperjames64
05-05-2012, 09:10
I understand the doubts.about the previous entries.I take the cost.of drops.the food being shippded. The phone service.the gear.yes the trip will cost money.I oversimplified the whole thing.the need to be "alone"also isn't totally true.love meeting new people.just tired of meeting them in current forms.am looking forward to taking a walk every day.set up tent rest.up and off for another day.for the summer. But not like homeless in street.hope to see one of natures last stands.I will start a journal.as far as showers go I remember the south having hot humid summers,and the said rain will.work at.times.its not "endless summer"any more but can be as close as I make it.thank y'all for the.info and food for.thought.I promise there's not a kookooburry loose on the trail.lol?ps.apologies for harsh words you know who.I would feel as if I owed dinner.before I knew you were a woman.that had no bearing on convo..thank you for your kind words.put me.back on trail so to speak.welcome any convos about starting in late may early june?any convos at all will.be more.rewarding. shakabra

Odd Man Out
05-05-2012, 09:28
So, instead of working and saving , you go play and hike the AT. Instead of saving $8000 toward retirement your first year out of school, you save $2000. Assuming a real return only 3% above inflation, what is the difference after 40 yrs? your AT hike cost you $19,500 in retirement savings

But if you are retired, you might spend less when hiking than at home (no utility bills, no auto insurance, rent your house, etc). So some might make a profit.

GritsNgreens
05-05-2012, 14:59
But if you are retired, you might spend less when hiking than at home (no utility bills, no auto insurance, rent your house, etc). So some might make a profit.
-There was a retired Major (O-4) in the Army down at Ft. Bragg who was homeless I think he just backpacked everywhere you saw him....had to have banked mucho dinero

Datto
05-05-2012, 15:18
I guess I'll be the one to contend the experience of thru-hiking the AT will allow a person to determine what is the minimal amount of money necessary to be happy. That, alone will be worth WAY more money and savings than $19,500 over the course of a lifetime.


Datto

Datto
05-05-2012, 15:25
Example: Shortly after finishing my thru-hike of the Appalachian Trail, I paid off the remaining loan amount on my car (the Datmobile). Since that time I haven't had a car payment and I still drive the 15 year old Datmobile today.

Contrast that with what I might have done for the economic class I'm in -- I might have bought or leased a Beemer at say $40,000 at the time when I thru-hiked the AT. Imagine the cost of buying or leasing a new BMW every five years since the time of my AT thru-hike.

Same thing for televisions, stereos, fancy cell phones.

They don't make me happy so I don't spend any money on them (although I finally got a fancy television just recently).

All that "keeping up with the Jones" cost is either gone or significantly diminished after completing a thru-hike of the Appalachian Trail.

Datto

John B
05-05-2012, 15:35
Example: Shortly after finishing my thru-hike of the Appalachian Trail, I paid off the remaining loan amount on my car (the Datmobile). Since that time I haven't had a car payment and I still drive the 15 year old Datmobile today.

Contrast that with what I might have done for the economic class I'm in -- I might have bought or leased a Beemer at say $40,000 at the time when I thru-hiked the AT. Imagine the cost of buying or leasing a new BMW every five years since the time of my AT thru-hike.

Same thing for televisions, stereos, fancy cell phones.

They don't make me happy so I don't spend any money on them (although I finally got a fancy television just recently).

All that "keeping up with the Jones" cost is either gone or significantly diminished after completing a thru-hike of the Appalachian Trail.

Datto

Of course some were able to learn such things without having to spend 4 mths hiking the AT.

camperjames64
05-05-2012, 15:52
I concur.who has It worse the wall street tycoon,the village that they just now found?

Datto
05-05-2012, 15:59
Another example of the value of thru-hiking the AT: Personal experience and acceptance of diversity. Most with a daily life back in civilization won't ever intentionally divert away from their comfort zone in dealing with people of different types than themselves. There is a distinct value in learning to appreciate different ways of thinking, different backgrounds, different means of accomplishing the same thing, different outlooks.

On the AT most will be outside their comfort zone -- dealing face to face with people of different age groups on a daily basis (some of wildly different ages may actually become close friends on the AT). A thru-hiker from say a very confined and rigid background may have daily and direct contact with those who have a let-be-what-will-be attitude. Each might learn from the strengths of the other. Men who have always thought of women as the weaker/fairer sex, ha, may be in for one rude awakening to their ego when thru-hiking the Appalachian Trail.

I guess the point to be made is the value of completing an AT thru-hike is not measured in dollars.

I've just touched on the surface of the value from thru-hiking the Appalachian -- maybe some other past thru-hikers will chime in.

Oh...one more thing (that's my Columbo impersonation by the way) -- it would not be uncommon for someone who has thru-hiked the AT to get it in their head that they're going to hike another long-distance trail. Either to recapture the astounding sense and feeling they had from being on the AT or possibly to find out if the AT thru-hike experience was just a fluke and people of this world are only that way -- friendly, compassionate, giving, kind -- when they're on or near the AT. I suppose those who are accountants looking at this picture better be figuring on the cost of doing a 2nd or a 3rd long-distance hike in a thru-hikers life and well, you know how that kind of expense can really add up over time.


Datto

camperjames64
05-05-2012, 16:19
If one had unlimited resources one could just hike till didn't want to?

Datto
05-05-2012, 17:14
If one had unlimited resources one could just hike till didn't want to?

Yeah, hike the long-distance trails in the USA and/or head to New Zealand and hike there for six months and see spectacular scenery while meeting some of the nicest people on the planet. Head on over to Australia and hike The Bibbulmun Track southward toward the ocean from Perth. Then possibly head to Spain and hike The Camino or hike the GR5 in the French Alps or some of the trails in southwestern France. Do a Run With The Bulls while you're in the neighborhood. Visit the Dolomites in northern Italy for a while and do some hiking there. Then off to England to do the Coast to Coast Path followed by the Pembrokeshire Coast Path in Wales. Finish up heading northbound on the West Highland Way in Scotland before lollygagging your way back to the good ol' USA and attending Trail Days.

Or a person could just drive to work everyday.


Datto

camperjames64
05-05-2012, 21:33
I kinda meant that one could go north then south then north.I am not planning to do that.just till I'm tired of this adventure.and all the "crappy"times.thank you.

camperjames64
05-05-2012, 21:38
I see how.I.sound stupid.but.the.only stupid questions are the unasked ones.sorry to show my naivety.weren't we all rooks at something once.

Monkeywrench
05-06-2012, 06:30
I see how.I.sound stupid.but.the.only stupid questions are the unasked ones.sorry to show my naivety.weren't we all rooks at something once.

Personally it's your innovative punctuation and capitalization I find annoying, not your questions. It is sometimes hard to even know what your question is.

flemdawg1
05-06-2012, 08:43
I kinda meant that one could go north then south then north.I am not planning to do that.just till I'm tired of this adventure.and all the "crappy"times.thank you.

That's called a Yo-yo.

camperjames64
05-06-2012, 09:23
It is this phone. It puts things anywhere.I'm trying to fix me.yoyo,ok its a term.I was.trying to get all info I can.never done this.not bucket but still A list! Will be leaving y'all alone as I seem to bother most peeps

bigcranky
05-06-2012, 15:09
No there is nothing wrong with said comforts.I dont remember such comforts as a kid camping with dad in northern cali.

I doubt you were out on the trail for six months on these trips. It's really easy to go without any human comforts on a weekend hike.


and it's so cold you can't get the Nutella out of the jar,

You had me at "Nutella." Man I love that stuff.

bigcranky
05-06-2012, 15:18
Will be leaving y'all alone as I seem to bother most peeps


Here's the deal: you are asking good questions, and getting excellent answers from experienced long distance hikers. Then you are pushing back hard against those answers, with comments that tend to belittle the people who took the time to answer your questions. Can you blame them for getting a trifle annoyed?

Look, if you really want a true wilderness experience, the A.T. is not for you. Try the Continental Divide Trail. There are only a handful of thru-hikers each year, you'll spend much more time between resupply locations, and you'll need far better wilderness skills to complete it.

The A.T. is what it is, and nothing more. There's a reason why most (not all, certainly) people hike it a certain way. It's a beautiful trail, with some wonderful views and sublime moments, but it's not a challenging wilderness experience.

Sassafras Lass
05-06-2012, 15:40
Yeah, hike the long-distance trails in the USA and/or head to New Zealand and hike there for six months and see spectacular scenery while meeting some of the nicest people on the planet. Head on over to Australia and hike The Bibbulmun Track southward toward the ocean from Perth. Then possibly head to Spain and hike The Camino or hike the GR5 in the French Alps or some of the trails in southwestern France. Do a Run With The Bulls while you're in the neighborhood. Visit the Dolomites in northern Italy for a while and do some hiking there. Then off to England to do the Coast to Coast Path followed by the Pembrokeshire Coast Path in Wales. Finish up heading northbound on the West Highland Way in Scotland before lollygagging your way back to the good ol' USA and attending Trail Days.

Or a person could just drive to work everyday.


Datto


Excellently put. You've described pretty near my Nirvana, and between hikes just working piddly jobs that allow you to save enough for the next part of your adventure.

Unfortunately, there are those (parents and other well-meaning relatives and friends) who think that exploring and learning in the real world is absolute bunk compared to 'The American Dream' of mortgages, new-er cars, possessions, insurance, etc. Which is really all just a ton of debt.

Don H
05-06-2012, 15:54
For some people hiking the trail has cost them a spouse or other significant relationship. Compared to that, money ain't nothin'!
That could be considered an asset;)

CrumbSnatcher
05-06-2012, 17:47
i hiked on basically 2 grand in 99' always had enough for a burger in town and a full pack of food heading out, but always felt like i was on the broke side and wish i had more
02 and 03 i spent more like 4500 both years, occasional hostel and a couple motels when i wanted. it was just better times, not always worrying about my funds. didn't town stay much, but enjoyed a town meal anytime and everytime i saw fit! :-) its not wasting money if its going in the belly :-)
i also hiked with a dog, so that was a few extra burgers and spending! :-)

Datto
05-06-2012, 20:33
who think that exploring and learning in the real world is absolute bunk compared to 'The American Dream' of mortgages, new-er cars, possessions, insurance, etc. Which is really all just a ton of debt.

It seems we may be of a similar cut -- my Dad would tell me life was about his way of living, having enough money to buy a car every three years, having two kids, buying a house and paying it off in 20 years, saving every cent out of life for retirement. My Mom would tell me to live it up. Ha, when I started to live it up she was sure I would die -- couldn't understand why someone would want to carry a backpack into the woods. It wasn't her way of living it up I guess.

The more I thought about the situation (well, after living in subdivision life for a while so I had something to compare it to) the more I came to believe happiness and the secret to life boils down to a personal interpretation of three three things:

* Have fun.
* Live fully.
* Peace.

It's quite challenging to pull all of those elements together, concurrently heading in the same direction. I'm giving it my best shot.


Datto

Datto
05-06-2012, 20:57
Also, I am one of the fortunate ones to have a career I enjoy immensely. In fact, sleep keeps getting in the way of getting enough of it.

A dozen or so years ago I had to figure out how I was going to make adventuring a major part of my life. It just so happened I'd focused on just those types of assignments in companies -- the kinds of assignments such as, "We want to do this as the end result. Please figure out how to make this happen and get it done."

So that's how it came to be that I developed a means to make adventuring happen on a regular basis in my life. I am quite sure my methods would not work well for the vast majority of folks in the world but for me, it has proven to work fabulously. Since the moment where I sat down and took the time to think through the idea, I'd begun the very richest, most exciting, most profitable, full-living part of my life. Well beyond what had been my expectations.


Datto

et_afig
05-06-2012, 21:07
Most of the costs people estimate is around 5K.

I plan on auditing my expenditures when I'm done and posting my real cost to thru-hike in 2013. I will include travel to and from the trail.

I don't really have a budget set for my hike. I've got more than enough saved to not worry about it. I should note that while I my budget for the thru is pretty open-ended, I'm frugal when it comes to motels, food, etc. I simply don't want to think about money while hiking. It would diminish my experience :b.

I'm frugal as well, which is why i've been trying to piece together figures as much as possible. however i think a big part of this is what food you're into and willing to pay for. in the military i'm a fan of pb+j sammiches or tuna from the packet with a lil mayo and mustard however i expect on the trail to eat much worse things (although downing a few ounces of peanut butter and nutella sounds angellic). i don't want to spend every other night in a damned hostel, especially if i don't have to. whats the point? you might as well not carry a tent in that case, especially the people on trailjournals that i read who sleep in a hotel every night. but again, hyoh

i expect my trip, gear/travel/food and all to be around $3000. but i'm a cheap ass too

camperjames64
05-06-2012, 22:30
Sorry to have been interpreted in the bad light.I truly appreciate the info.did not mean any disrespect to anyone who answered my queries most satisfactory.again sorry for misunderstanding.amgoing to hike this year.was meaning by free was do I have to pay for hiking thru parks or other areas that require fees.kinda got of topic.have spent 1200 on gear and food drops so far so I know its not free.just want to get on trail and hike.

bigcranky
05-07-2012, 08:03
Hey, camperjames, have a great hike. No worries. If I see you on the trail I'll buy you a beer.

bigcranky
05-07-2012, 08:09
Followup to camperjames64: I just went back and re-read the whole thread, and I see that I got you confused with another thread (it happens when one gets old.) I'm sorry that I came down overly hard on you, it was unwarranted. Please have an excellent hike, hope to see you out there.