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rickb
05-14-2012, 19:42
This poll ask how you react when you come upon a shelter only to find someone cooking a meal sleeping platform.

hikerboy57
05-14-2012, 19:57
forget bears, mice. just outside the shelter is fine. the bears have to fight off a dozen well fed hikers. the mice dont, they just end up scurrying around your head all night. (another reason i prefer to tent, although ive witnessed some crazy mouse acrobatics at shelters in NH and ME.)

1234
05-14-2012, 20:05
it rains, cannot cook in tent, if there is a table it is not covered or level. the shelter is level, does not rock, and is out of the rain. Kind of make sense to cook there, what are your options, I never heard anyone complain or even question the practice.

moldy
05-14-2012, 20:10
True story, Last year at Lamberts Meadow Shelter in central Virginia. This young thru-hikershows up at dark. He has been frieghtend by a bear. He decides to cook in the shelter as opposed to the picnic table 5 yards away. He has one of those little alcohol stoves and while lighting it, he dumps it over and starts a fire on the floor of the shelter between 2 sleeping hikers. Everyone scrambles up and I throw the kid a water bottle and tell him to dump it on the fire. He does not want to make a mess and holds off a few seconds. Thats when the fire burns thru his un-noticed bic lighter and it explodes in 3 directions and his hair briefly catches on fire. He ended up with a few minor burns and some burn spots on some equipment. We were all lucky that he had put his plastic fuel bottle behind him before lighting the stove. I guess there are a few lessons here, like "don't cook in the shelter" or "when you have a chance to put out the fire, do it now".

fehchet
05-14-2012, 20:11
Exactly, I've witnessed cooking in shelters for 50 years. Doesn't bother me.

Montana Mac
05-14-2012, 20:27
The only thing I worry about is the over flowing alky stove catching the place on fire - if it is pouring rain and there is room I have no problem if someone cooks in shelter.

Sarcasm the elf
05-14-2012, 20:44
True story, Last year at Lamberts Meadow Shelter in central Virginia. This young thru-hikershows up at dark. He has been frieghtend by a bear. He decides to cook in the shelter as opposed to the picnic table 5 yards away. He has one of those little alcohol stoves and while lighting it, he dumps it over and starts a fire on the floor of the shelter between 2 sleeping hikers. Everyone scrambles up and I throw the kid a water bottle and tell him to dump it on the fire. He does not want to make a mess and holds off a few seconds. Thats when the fire burns thru his un-noticed bic lighter and it explodes in 3 directions and his hair briefly catches on fire. He ended up with a few minor burns and some burn spots on some equipment. We were all lucky that he had put his plastic fuel bottle behind him before lighting the stove. I guess there are a few lessons here, like "don't cook in the shelter" or "when you have a chance to put out the fire, do it now".


Oddly I remember hearing about that a while ago. I think the real moral is "Don't be an idiot and play with a flammable liquids fire next to people that are sleeping."

ChinMusic
05-14-2012, 20:50
Other: I don't care and wouldn't even notice.

Wise Old Owl
05-14-2012, 21:00
Alke is silent no pop or crack.. if it catches - oops - I lost a shirt during a test of a new stove. My skin was burning and the shirt on my shoulder. As hikers as a group you are constantly looking for Etiquette on WB - clearly it is a lost cause... Sort of like expecting others to bath in a stream before showing up....Something that I would considered - as an old fart,

johnnybgood
05-14-2012, 21:31
Explain the proper etiquette in a polite manner and I'f you do meet resistance ; well what's the saying, " you can't fix stupid".
It's always a few knuckle heads that think that no one tells them what to do.

I'd then pitch my tent far away from the shelter and be done with it.

Ender
05-14-2012, 22:16
Other: Never even thought about this before. Didn't bother me then when people did it, won't bother me now. Cook away.

Lone Wolf
05-14-2012, 22:44
This poll ask how you react when you come upon a shelter only to find someone cooking a meal sleeping platform.

don't bother me none. i don't stay in the dumps

rocketsocks
05-14-2012, 22:51
Other,So what are having for diner tonight?

rocketsocks
05-14-2012, 23:04
True story, Last year at Lamberts Meadow Shelter in central Virginia. This young thru-hikershows up at dark. He has been frieghtend by a bear. He decides to cook in the shelter as opposed to the picnic table 5 yards away. He has one of those little alcohol stoves and while lighting it, he dumps it over and starts a fire on the floor of the shelter between 2 sleeping hikers. Everyone scrambles up and I throw the kid a water bottle and tell him to dump it on the fire. He does not want to make a mess and holds off a few seconds. Thats when the fire burns thru his un-noticed bic lighter and it explodes in 3 directions and his hair briefly catches on fire. He ended up with a few minor burns and some burn spots on some equipment. We were all lucky that he had put his plastic fuel bottle behind him before lighting the stove. I guess there are a few lessons here, like "don't cook in the shelter" or "when you have a chance to put out the fire, do it now".Now I could be wrong about this,but I'm thinking that an Alcohol fire is best extinguish by smothering,instead of throwing water on it,?Anybody?

Slo-go'en
05-15-2012, 00:30
Now I could be wrong about this,but I'm thinking that an Alcohol fire is best extinguish by smothering,instead of throwing water on it,?Anybody?

Correct - NEVER throw water on an liquid fuel (or grease) fire! It just speads it farther.

rocketsocks
05-15-2012, 01:38
Correct - NEVER throw water on an liquid fuel (or grease) fire! It just speads it farther.Thanks,yep folks,don't do that,but try not to use your bag either..it'll melt.if your cooking keep a bandana on hand.Sorry for the drift,little latatitude on this one please.

Siestita
05-15-2012, 01:46
Apparently there is good reason that the alcohol for backpacking that I buy in the paint department of the hardware store alcohol is marked "marine stove fuel". Fires are especially dangerous when they break out on small boats. Water will not extinguish burning petroleum products, but can put out alcohol fires. If you doubt this, pour lots of water into some alcohol and then try to light it. Please, however, don't try the same experiment with gasoline.

rocketsocks
05-15-2012, 02:05
Apparently there is good reason that the alcohol for backpacking that I buy in the paint department of the hardware store alcohol is marked "marine stove fuel". Fires are especially dangerous when they break out on small boats. Water will not extinguish burning petroleum products, but can put out alcohol fires. If you doubt this, pour lots of water into some alcohol and then try to light it. Please, however, don't try the same experiment with gasoline.Wow,I had no idea.Ok,I will try this.....but not tonight.Although testing at night would be the way I would test it,as the flame is hard to see.Thanks so much for bringing to everyones attention.I would like to hear from others that have some experience with this.

perrymk
05-15-2012, 06:14
I would like to hear from others that have some experience with this.

I have the good fortune to be employed as a chemist for the State Fire Marshal so I have a little experience with ignitable liquids and fires.

The first thing to understand is that a fire requires 4 things. Fuel, oxygen (air), heat, and a chemical reaction. Remove one and the fire is extinguished.

Petroleum products typically float on water. That's why using water to douse them can (not will) spread them. If it is a small petroleum fire (an ounce or two of fuel), sufficient water may remove enough heat to extinguish the fire. I would suggest that the volume of water exceed the volume of petroleum. If in doubt, skip the water. Smothering (eliminating oxygen) is a better choice.

Alcohol mixes with water; it doesn't float. So the fuel is diluted to the point it won't light (more or less a disrupted chemical reaction) and also the heat is removed. Again, use sufficient water, a volume at least double to the volume of alcohol involved. Someone reading this is thinking, equal volumes would work. Probably true in an ideal world but the real world is seldom ideal. More water is always better. Again, smothering is still a better choice.

rocketsocks
05-15-2012, 06:27
I have the good fortune to be employed as a chemist for the State Fire Marshal so I have a little experience with ignitable liquids and fires.

The first thing to understand is that a fire requires 4 things. Fuel, oxygen (air), heat, and a chemical reaction. Remove one and the fire is extinguished.

Petroleum products typically float on water. That's why using water to douse them can (not will) spread them. If it is a small petroleum fire (an ounce or two of fuel), sufficient water may remove enough heat to extinguish the fire. I would suggest that the volume of water exceed the volume of petroleum. If in doubt, skip the water. Smothering (eliminating oxygen) is a better choice.

Alcohol mixes with water; it doesn't float. So the fuel is diluted to the point it won't light (disrupted chemical reaction) and also the heat is removed. Again, use sufficient water, a volume at least double to the volume of alcohol involved. Someone reading this is thinking, equal volumes would work. Probably true in an ideal world but the real world is seldom ideal. More water is always better. Again, smothering is still a better choice.Well thank you very much,that there question kept me up late,and woke me up in the end.I kinda had a feeling it was not so cut and dry,but then I guess it was.certainly would not want to leave the folks hanging on such an important subject as fire.Thanks again Perrymk you were the right person to answer that question and I'm glad that it was an easy one for you.Now do you come in a travel size?and how much do you weigh?:D:)

Cherokee Bill
05-15-2012, 06:34
Typically, shelters are located near WATER. SO I stop at shelters long enough to fill up on water and move on to find an established tenting spot! Therefore, none of the problems, concerns of the crowded shelters.....................................

rocketsocks
05-15-2012, 06:38
Well thank you very much,that there question kept me up late,and woke me up in the end.I kinda had a feeling it was not so cut and dry,but then I guess it was.certainly would not want to leave the folks hanging on such an important subject as fire.Thanks again Perrymk you were the right person to answer that question and I'm glad that it was an easy one for you.Now do you come in a travel size?and how much do you weigh?:D:)Perrymk,could you link your reply to the (fire,how do you put out an alcohol fire) thread,if not maybe one of the moderators would do tha?And thank you again for that very concise and informative answer.

rocketsocks
05-15-2012, 06:41
Typically, shelters are located near WATER. SO I stop at shelters long enough to fill up on water and move on to find an established tenting spot! Therefore, none of the problems, concerns of the crowded shelters.....................................So then you didn't actually see who started the fire,did ya?;)

aaronthebugbuffet
05-15-2012, 07:34
don't bother me none. i don't stay in the dumps

I thought they were a place for cooking a meal when rains. People sleep in those???

WingedMonkey
05-15-2012, 09:21
If folks didn't have manners before they went hiking they won't have them on them while at shelters.

weary
05-15-2012, 10:29
There's nothing like a nice flat sleeping platform for perching a cook stove -- especially in Maine where we don't have those sissy picnic tables.

rickb
05-15-2012, 11:44
There's nothing like a nice flat sleeping platform for perching a cook stove -- especially in Maine where we don't have those sissy picnic tables.

You have that right.

Would you join my campaign to bring back the baseball bat floors?

Real men could get a good night's sleep on them without a pad, and the weenies moved on.

I miss Maine.

Del Q
05-15-2012, 20:10
This is one of my concerns about sleeping in shelters and why I tent 95% of the time.................you have NO IDEA what went on last night, past few days...........no wonder there are mice and critters around, they are not stupid. Food, food smells, etc.

I prefer no-cook mode and tenting, personally.

Nutbrown
05-16-2012, 09:26
other....don't care. I don't sleep in them, but also don't cook in them.

beaudetious
05-16-2012, 10:46
I get the feeling that most of "other" or "don't care" folks actually don't sleep in the shelters. So, sure cook it up. They don't have to deal with the results of their actions.

I, personally, think food prep and eating needs to be done outside the shelter and away from sleeping areas. It's hard to sleep when mice are out looking for left overs.

Cadenza
05-16-2012, 11:13
Many years ago I was on a weekend backpacking trip in the Smokies with a reservation for a shelter. (I think it may have been Mollies Ridge, but not certain.)
After hiking most of the day in the rain we finally reached the still vacant shelter, settled in, and started trying to get dried out.
It was one of those shelters with chicken wire bed spaces, stone walls on three sides, and chain link fence front to keep bears out.

Just before dark a solo thru-hiker showed up. He was kinda the hippy type, and at first pretended to be a purist.
He turned up his nose because I was cooking with a gas stove (on the ground).

He started trying to build a fire on the dirt floor inside the shelter. The wood was wet, his fingers were cold and numb.
He tried several times, would get a small flame that would go out before he could ever get any bigger sticks going.

Finally, he asked for a little gas, and like a dumbass tried to pour it directly into his little flame.
The flame flared up, he dropped the fuel bottle, splashed white gas on his pants, and set himself on fire.
And to PROVE that he was a dumbass, started dancing and fanning the flames.

Visions flashed through my head that he was going to ruin my trip as I would be hiking alone to get help while leaving my wife there to nurse him.
I grabbed him by the collar, threw him to the ground, and started using my boot to kick dirt on him. :D
Will never forget the look on his face. He looked up at me like I had insulted his Mamma,....until he realized he was no longer on fire.

It turned out that for the most part, only the fuel had been on fire. He had minor burns, mostly 1st degree, but was not seriously hurt.
He thanked me for his rough treatment. ;) And then agreed to use my stove to boil water for his disgusting Mountain House foil pouch fart producing concoction.

turtle fast
05-16-2012, 11:20
Another vote for please cook outside the shelter whenever possible. Ive seen white gas stoves turn into a fireball...yes I did it too many years ago. I was testing a Coleman Feather 442 and in all places a tiled bathroom when it was raining out one day. The darn thing fireballed on me, spilling fluid on the floor...luckily I was able to quickly smother the fire with a damp towel. Lesson learned. Alcohol is harder to detect when spilled and flaming. But the biggest reason to cook away from the shelter is the mess that some leave when food spills over and that just promotes mouse buffets.

peakbagger
05-16-2012, 13:22
The "deacons bench" in the Maine shelters are really handy to cook on especially when its raining. I really liked the picnic pavilions that PATC built in Northern Virginia at some shelter sites. Of course even at those places I saw sorch marks from stoves at the shelter. If I have my choice I usually find a nearby flat rock of log to cook on.

johnnybgood
05-16-2012, 16:11
Some of the nicer shelters in southern PA also have picnic pavilions like those northern Virginia.
I rarely sleep in shelters anyway so it shouldn't bother me but it kinda does...

Lemni Skate
05-16-2012, 18:57
I prefer to cook in the shelter and then go get in my tent and let the shelter users deal with the results. J

Just joking of course.

Wise Old Owl
05-16-2012, 19:39
Cadenza - So the lesson here is - Never toss fuel to a purist danc'in wet hippie?....:rolleyes:

rocketsocks
05-16-2012, 19:50
Another vote for please cook outside the shelter whenever possible. Ive seen white gas stoves turn into a fireball...yes I did it too many years ago. I was testing a Coleman Feather 442 and in all places a tiled bathroom when it was raining out one day. The darn thing fireballed on me, spilling fluid on the floor...luckily I was able to quickly smother the fire with a damp towel. Lesson learned. Alcohol is harder to detect when spilled and flaming. But the biggest reason to cook away from the shelter is the mess that some leave when food spills over and that just promotes mouse buffets.I too have one of these stoves,well the "Featherlight"anyway,but basically the same stove,but does not run on gasoline,It to at times has shook me with the flare-up,and is one of the reasons the Boy Scouts (BSA)does not allow White gas stoves or lanterns anymore.Great stove though,used it a lot before I learned of the alcohol stove.

Spoppy
05-16-2012, 20:05
"Cadenza - So the lesson here is - Never toss fuel to a purist danc'in wet hippie?"

Too funny - just spewed Dr Pepper all over my iPad and across the room!

MyName1sMud
05-18-2012, 14:00
Looks pretty split

mudhead
05-19-2012, 04:21
Poll is lame.

Lacks option involving Hooch.

rickb
01-10-2013, 19:52
I just pulled this up to see what L. Wolf posted.

Malto
01-10-2013, 20:11
Other.... I wouldn't stay at a shelter if other folks are there. My 5am departures would not be appreciated.

Nasty Dog Virus
01-10-2013, 20:21
Common practice. Just like hangin food in shelters ;)

aficion
01-10-2013, 20:39
I say a little prayer.
Thank God he is there,
Instead of in my tarping spot
Thank you Lordy, thanks a lot!

atmilkman
01-10-2013, 20:50
Only rocketsocks would post 8 times on a poll thread.

Lone Wolf
01-10-2013, 20:55
Common practice. Just like hangin food in shelters ;)

exactly. been happenin' since they were built. a non-issue really

Lyle
01-10-2013, 22:03
Doesn't bother me in the least. Most shelters have had thousands of meals cooked in them. Used to be the norm on a rainy day.

Now, if there is a covered cooking surface, I use that and prefer that others do as well. I have had boiling water spilled on my sleeping bag a few decades ago - wasn't pleasant. If there is no covered area during a storm, it's in the shelter - multi-use, isn't that what everyone preaches?

bear bag hanger
01-11-2013, 08:55
I'd pack up and move out of the shelter. I've seen enough fires to know I don't want to be in the middle of one.

Littlest Hobo
01-11-2013, 10:58
Depends – if there’s a picnic table available, I’ll use that (on my recent hike of the NPT, there were none). Otherwise, I’ll cook on the lip of the shelter - but I won’t cook at one late in the evening if others are trying to sleep (common courtesy). I also usually use my canister stove (thereby lowering the chance of setting the place on fire).

At the same time, when I’m backpacking on a trail with shelters, my usual practice is to have a late cooked lunch at a shelter then move on and hike for another two hours and dry camp at a spot that catches my eye. I never thought I was doing anything wrong by not sleeping where I ate…

Lemni Skate
01-11-2013, 11:35
I really don't care what people do in shelters. I only get in them in emergency situations or if no one else shows up. Just don't come cook in my tent.

CarlZ993
01-11-2013, 23:33
I too have one of these stoves,well the "Featherlight"anyway,but basically the same stove,but does not run on gasoline,It to at times has shook me with the flare-up,and is one of the reasons the Boy Scouts (BSA)does not allow White gas stoves or lanterns anymore.Great stove though,used it a lot before I learned of the alcohol stove.
Are you sure about the no White Gas Stoves in the Boy Scouts? I used one last summer on a Northern Tier canoe trip. Used on summer treks at Philmont in 2007, 2008, & 2010.

CarlZ993
01-11-2013, 23:45
The sleeping platform shouldn't be the cooking platform. I'd politely ask them to cook elsewhere. After about the umpteenth time of being ignored, I'd probably quit asking. Hard to fix years of bad habits and traditions.

When trying to book a hike in SMNP in 2010, I learned that one shelter along the AT (forget which one) had been closed due to aggressive bear activity. I can only surmise that the bear got food or food trash at the shelter and kept coming back for more.

Another Kevin
01-12-2013, 11:57
I'd react quite violently, I think, so someone making a campfire on the sleeping platform.

I wouldn't much care about someone popping an MRE heater there, as long as they got their trash hung before going to sleep.

Everyone else has discussed most of the spectrum in between.

WingedMonkey
01-12-2013, 12:27
Are you sure about the no White Gas Stoves in the Boy Scouts? I used one last summer on a Northern Tier canoe trip. Used on summer treks at Philmont in 2007, 2008, & 2010.

Correct:
Purpose This policy directs Boy Scouts of America members how to safely store, handle, and use chemical fuels and equipment. Safety and environmental awareness concerns have persuaded many campers to move away from traditional outdoor campfires in favor of chemical-fueled equipment used for cooking, heating, and lighting. Be aware that chemical fuels and equipment create very different hazards than traditional wood, charcoal, and other solid fuels; this policy defines how to address those hazards.
Before any chemical fuels or chemical-fueled equipment is used, an adult knowledgeable about chemical fuels and equipment, including regulatory requirements, should resolve any hazards not specifically addressed within this policy.
Definitions Chemical fuels—Liquid, gaseous, or gelled fuels.
Approved chemical-fueled equipment—Commercially manufactured equipment, including stoves, grills, burners, heaters, and lanterns that are designed to be used with chemical fuels.
Prohibited chemical-fueled equipment—Equipment that is handcrafted, homemade, modified, or installed beyond the manufacturer’s stated design limitations or use. Examples include alcohol-burning “can” stoves, smudge pots, improperly installed heaters, and propane burners with their regulators removed.
Recommended chemical fuels—White gas (Coleman fuel); kerosene; liquefied petroleum gas fuels, including propane, butane, and isobutane; vegetable oil fuels; biodiesel fuel; and commercially prepared gelled-alcohol fuel in original containers.
Chemical fuels not recommended—Unleaded gasoline; liquid alcohol fuels, including isopropyl alcohol, denatured ethyl alcohol, and ethanol; and other flammable chemicals that are not in accordance with the manufacturer’s instructions for chemical-fueled equipment.

http://www.scouting.org/scoutsource/HealthandSafety/GSS/gss06.aspx

Different Socks
01-12-2013, 16:40
I voted "Other" b/c not all shelters provide an alternative place to cook other than the sleeping platform.

bardo
01-12-2013, 19:34
How does everyone feel about dirty socks? Yay or ney?

Sarcasm the elf
01-12-2013, 20:21
For the record, I am literally cooking in a shelter as I write this.

Mountain Mike
01-13-2013, 00:11
How does everyone feel about dirty socks? Yay or ney?
Not an approved fuel for cooking in a shelter.

shelb
01-13-2013, 00:18
Are you sure about the no White Gas Stoves in the Boy Scouts? I used one last summer on a Northern Tier canoe trip. Used on summer treks at Philmont in 2007, 2008, & 2010.

It is allowed if the fuel is kept locked up and handled by adults only: http://www.scouting.org/scoutsource/HealthandSafety/Resources/policyonchemicalfuels.aspx

mtnkngxt
01-13-2013, 06:38
Non issue. People do it all the time. I will cook on a picnic table if available or look for a large rock. I try not to camp or "hang out" at the shelters. I take my 10lb pack and mosey on down the road

hermit1970
01-13-2013, 08:33
You should never cook where you sleep but I know no one follows that rule.

BirdBrain
01-13-2013, 08:53
I love Whiteblaze. It is so informative. I become more convinced day by day that I will not be going near any shelter.
It appears that the hikers that avoid them do so because of the people who do use them.
There is a pattern of why people do the wrong thing in shelters that can be summed up in these thoughts (they won't admit it though):
1) Everyone else is doing it (I can hear my mother now suggesting I should jump off a bridge with my friends because they might be doing it)
2) My actions won't make a difference (This attitude has produced our current political system)
3) It is the most convenient place (What they are really saying is I am too lazy to be bothered with doing the right thing)
4) Mice are already there (Duh- I wonder why)
I voted other (I will politely smile and let those that cause the problem sleep in the problem).
I am starting to understand the "just tear them down" mentality.
I disagree with that thought though because those that are creating the problem are also keeping the mice in one spot.

aficion
01-13-2013, 09:13
I love Whiteblaze. It is so informative. I become more convinced day by day that I will not be going near any shelter.
It appears that the hikers that avoid them do so because of the people who do use them.
There is a pattern of why people do the wrong thing in shelters that can be summed up in these thoughts (they won't admit it though):
1) Everyone else is doing it (I can hear my mother now suggesting I should jump off a bridge with my friends because they might be doing it)
2) My actions won't make a difference (This attitude has produced our current political system)
3) It is the most convenient place (What they are really saying is I am too lazy to be bothered with doing the right thing)
4) Mice are already there (Duh- I wonder why)
I voted other (I will politely smile and let those that cause the problem sleep in the problem).
I am starting to understand the "just tear them down" mentality.
I disagree with that thought though because those that are creating the problem are also keeping the mice in one spot.

I hear ya and could not agree more.

BirdBrain
01-13-2013, 09:19
Common practice. Just like hangin food in shelters ;)

I am starting to wonder what other common practices are done at shelters.
Do people cut down the surrounding trees for firewood?
Do they split the wood on the Deacon's Seat?
Do they carve their names in the shelters?
Do they piss in a corner?

I have hiked a bit in my life, but never where there was a shelter provided.
I was looking forward to these shelters. Oh well...

Lone Wolf
01-13-2013, 09:30
I am starting to wonder what other common practices are done at shelters.
Do people cut down the surrounding trees for firewood?
Do they split the wood on the Deacon's Seat?
Do they carve their names in the shelters?
Do they piss in a corner?

I have hiked a bit in my life, but never where there was a shelter provided.
I was looking forward to these shelters. Oh well...
shelters are a scar. you can smell them before you get to them. they're out of place in those woods yet "they" keep building more, elaborate, ridiculous structures

rickb
01-13-2013, 09:58
There are lone wolves and there are herd animals. The latter far out number the former.

On the AT even those thruhikers who do camp in the woods invariably will do so very, very close to the trail. They will almost never find a truly private place a few hundred feet up a stream or such. I think fear (in the literal sense of that word) of being out of site of white blaze plays a part, but the need for social connection does even more so.

gizzy bear
01-13-2013, 10:53
I have never stayed in a shelter and after reading this ... Not so sure I would even use one to cook in... Sounds disgusting... Like a sanitation nightmare... Although the thought of using one, to cook in, during a storm/rain, doesn't sound stupid, because let's face it, you can't build a fire or cook in the rain... So in light of this thread, I just added a "hazmat cooking suit" to my gear list...

And on a side note... I find it amazing that there is such a WIDE variety of hikers... Some try their best to leave nature like they found it... Others pee in corners of a shelter....

BirdBrain
01-13-2013, 15:04
Others pee in corners of a shelter....

Please do not take a rhetorical question as a fact. I have never heard of a person pissing in the corner of a shelter. It was meant as sarcasm intended to explore the extent in which thoughtless hikers would stoop to.

Miner
01-13-2013, 17:44
I like to cook in a shelter and then when I spill some of my food on the sleeping platform, I like to move on to somewhere else to sleep. :p

"Atlas"
01-13-2013, 18:20
Please do not take a rhetorical question as a fact. I have never heard of a person pissing in the corner of a shelter. It was meant as sarcasm intended to explore the extent in which thoughtless hikers would stoop to.

Last season, after a few too many beers in a shelter by a town, a guy didnt even make it out of his backpack and wizzed, from the second floor of the structure. So while it is not a common practice to pee in the corners, you just never know.

Still, I enjoyed sleeping in the shelters more nights then not.

BirdBrain
01-13-2013, 19:17
I like to cook in a shelter and then when I spill some of my food on the sleeping platform, I like to move on to somewhere else to sleep. :p

Seems all fine to me. Those that sleep in shelters don't seem to mind. Those that do mind don't sleep in shelters. It's all beginning to make sense now.

Wise Old Owl
01-13-2013, 19:25
it rains, cannot cook in tent, if there is a table it is not covered or level. the shelter is level, does not rock, and is out of the rain. Kind of make sense to cook there, what are your options, I never heard anyone complain or even question the practice.


Think outside the box - vestibule on a tent, or a poncho and some concrete string... a few pegs from the woods. come on!

Tharwood
01-13-2013, 19:28
I hear ya and could not agree more.
Hahahahahahahah ...true...true.

aficion
01-13-2013, 20:34
I have never stayed in a shelter and after reading this ... Not so sure I would even use one to cook in... Sounds disgusting... Like a sanitation nightmare... Although the thought of using one, to cook in, during a storm/rain, doesn't sound stupid, because let's face it, you can't build a fire or cook in the rain... So in light of this thread, I just added a "hazmat cooking suit" to my gear list...

And on a side note... I find it amazing that there is such a WIDE variety of hikers... Some try their best to leave nature like they found it... Others pee in corners of a shelter....

Have built a fire and cooked in the rain many, many times. Tie a corner of your tarp to a tree head high. Stake the opposite corner to the ground. Stake one other corner to the ground as well. The final corner gets guyed out over a forked stick or hiking pole. Get out your favorite wood burning cookstove and load it with sticks you have shaved the wet outer layer from. Put a ball of lint soaked in vaseline or a candle under it and light it. Cook under the tarp between the tree and the forked stick, near the edge. Try it at home. It works.

Sarcasm the elf
01-13-2013, 20:47
This thread, in it's entirety, is about one of the many topics that's really only a problem on the Internet.

All of you stop, relax, go for a hike. Seriously.

rickb
01-13-2013, 20:48
Or just unzip tent door and reach forward.

Still, hard to beat cooking in a shelter during a downpour.

aficion
01-13-2013, 20:56
This thread, in it's entirety, is about one of the many topics that's really only a problem on the Internet.

All of you stop, relax, go for a hike. Seriously.

Just got back from one. Spectacular views from Mt Pleasant.

BirdBrain
01-13-2013, 21:09
This thread, in it's entirety, is about one of the many topics that's really only a problem on the Internet.

All of you stop, relax, go for a hike. Seriously.

Advice taken. I will not be responding to this type of thread again. I was just shocked at the difference between what has been advised and what is actually done (pertaining to this thread and a few other ones involving etiquette). It is all good.

Sarcasm the elf
01-13-2013, 21:21
Advice taken. I will not be responding to this type of thread again. I was just shocked at the difference between what has been advised and what is actually done (pertaining to this thread and a few other ones involving etiquette). It is all good.

No worries, this site is a great resource but it's best to keep in mind that it is still the Internet. For the most part problems play out much more intensely when we are all safely behind our computer screens. On the trail nearly everyone is friendly, civil and look out for each other. Plus, even if there's a disagreement most folks are too tired after a day of hiking to have any energy left for arguing. :sun

rickb
01-13-2013, 21:49
Advice taken. I will not be responding to this type of thread again. I was just shocked at the difference between what has been advised and what is actually done (pertaining to this thread and a few other ones involving etiquette). It is all good.

Alternatively one could learn that some traditions are not always appreciated and/or understood by others on the Trail, and become more sensitive and understanding to others' perspectives when out in the real world.

When it comes to shelters, some of the accepted norms during the thru hiking bubble don't always apply so much outside of it.

in the end, hearing online that others see things differently can hardly be a bad thing, I think.

prain4u
01-13-2013, 22:38
My internal reaction to someone cooking in a shelter would vary depending upon the situation. I think it is one thing if someone CAREFULLY cooks in a shelter during a pouring rain--and keeps things confined to a small area and is relatively tidy. It is quite another thing if someone comes to an occupied shelter as darkness is falling (in good weather) and haphazardly and loudly spreads out all of their cooking stuff and cooks a smelly and messy meal (and then also decides to leave the bulk of their clean up until morning).

RCBear
01-14-2013, 08:29
My feeling is that anything goes in a shelter. Do whatever you want. Just do it quietly so you don't disturb me sleeping in my tent 20 yards away. :)

gizzy bear
01-14-2013, 10:46
My feeling is that anything goes in a shelter. Do whatever you want. Just do it quietly so you don't disturb me sleeping in my tent 20 yards away. :)

I think you mean OUR tent :cool: I am not sleeping with a bunch of crazies... :rolleyes:

hermit1970
01-14-2013, 20:57
I love Whiteblaze. It is so informative. I become more convinced day by day that I will not be going near any shelter.
It appears that the hikers that avoid them do so because of the people who do use them.
There is a pattern of why people do the wrong thing in shelters that can be summed up in these thoughts (they won't admit it though):
1) Everyone else is doing it (I can hear my mother now suggesting I should jump off a bridge with my friends because they might be doing it)
2) My actions won't make a difference (This attitude has produced our current political system)
3) It is the most convenient place (What they are really saying is I am too lazy to be bothered with doing the right thing)
4) Mice are already there (Duh- I wonder why)
I voted other (I will politely smile and let those that cause the problem sleep in the problem).
I am starting to understand the "just tear them down" mentality.
I disagree with that thought though because those that are creating the problem are also keeping the mice in one spot.

Totally agree with BirdBrain. He's not really a bird brain after all.

Oak88
01-14-2013, 21:00
other nobody made me the AT police