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JoshL
05-20-2012, 23:24
I just got back from a weekend hike and I have noticed getting comfortable and falling asleep is definitely a problem. I have a comfy marmot down sleeping bag, a thermarest neoair trekker sleeping pad, and an exped inflatable pillow so I feel that I have a pretty comfortable setup while still relatively light-weight. However, I just can't seem to get comfortable falling asleep.

I started my hike on Saturday after only sleeping about 2 hours the night before. We hiked about 5 or 6 hours and the last part was very difficult, scrambling up a steep boulder covered incline. Needless to say when it was finally bed time I was exhausted. Still, I was up for at least an hour or two before falling asleep and woke up several times during the night and couldn't fall back asleep.

I think the problem is that I am a side sleeper and sleep with a large body type pillow at home. I just can't fall asleep lying flat on my back. I am a pretty sound sleeper so noises and such don't keep me up, I think it is primarily just a comfort issue. My last time out I had similar issues. Anybody else a side sleeper or a pillow hugger and have problems getting sleep on the trail? I am worried that for long distance hiking lack of sleep is going to be a problem eventually. I would like to think that I would be so exhausted that I could fall asleep standing on my head, but this weekend gives me doubts.

Wise Old Owl
05-20-2012, 23:31
Uhh hike more and practice out back of the house.

Ok look have a warm glass of water mixed with Nido and pack a quick dissolving Diphenhydramine the main ingredient in almost all sleep medicine.(Benadryl)

scree
05-20-2012, 23:40
You may want to consider a hammock. Look at Hennesy and Warbonnet or check out the forum here. I'm a slide sleeper and sleep best in a hammock, only way I'm truly comfortable.

jakedatc
05-20-2012, 23:43
I agree... getting used to it helps. during late spring- late fall i rock climb a lot and spend a lot of time sleeping in a tent and i find it a lot easier to sleep after a few trips out.

also i find that finding a good pillow really helps. I recently got an exped air pillow and have been dialing in the right inflation

Velvet Gooch
05-20-2012, 23:46
Diphenhydramine the main ingredient in almost all sleep medicine.(Benadryl)

This is better: doxylamine succinate (the hypnotic in NyQuil). It's the most powerful OTC sedative available in the United States.

Theosus
05-21-2012, 06:53
Benadryl is so light, I take two before bed on a hike. I wonder if the nyquil stuff comes in dry form? Carrying a bottle of nyquil seems counter productive.

WIAPilot
05-21-2012, 07:13
NyQuil comes in capsules as well. Maybe some earplugs too?

hikerboy57
05-21-2012, 08:51
Some of it is adremeline from a workout your bodys not used to
.after a few days it gets easier. I take advil pmwith me.

chelko
05-21-2012, 09:23
I have had good success with both Nyquill capsules and Tylenol PM. Suppliment these with a few ounces of Knob Creek at bedtime and you are off to lala land. Sweet Dreams.

Hooch
05-21-2012, 09:36
If you want a crutch, use the drugs. If you want a good night's sleep without that crap contaminating your body, try other avenues first.

1) Are your pillow and/or your sleeping mat too soft or too firm?
2) Is your sleeping position comfortable? If you're a side sleeper at home, try side sleeping if your tent.
3) Are you using the right pillow and/or sleeping mat for you? If not, experiment with others.
4) Are you warm/cool enough?
5) Look at giving a hammock a go. (Stand by for the hammock hater comments from that crowd, because here they come!)

rocketsocks
05-21-2012, 09:43
I have taken NyQuill before,and yes it works great for nocking me out,and like clock work 2 hours later "Bing",wide awake.every time.

bfayer
05-21-2012, 09:49
If you are looking for something to take, I would suggest Magnolia Bark. It does not knock you out but it does help you unspool so you can sleep.

Some call it a natural equivilant to valium, I dont know about that, but it does help with getting to sleep without the side effects if antihistamines.

Sent from my Kindle Fire using Tapatalk 2

Deadeye
05-21-2012, 09:59
Skip the drugs, try a hammock.

FlyPaper
05-21-2012, 10:36
I literally stuff a side sleeper pro into my backpack. https://www.sidesleeperpro.com/

I know I risk getting a new trail name. Also, I bring a pillow case and cram clothes I'm not wearing into it for an additional head support while sleeping on my side.

I've found that sleeping on my side on a thermorest is still difficult. To sleep on your side, you need to bend your knees, and the low friction thermorest does not allow my legs to stay relaxed enough and still stay bent enough. To deal with that, I usually find something to put under my thermorest near the knees so I can keep them bent and allow them to relax in that position.

dale1627
05-21-2012, 10:41
I agree with the hammock theory. You can even sleep on your side if it is hung correctly.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk

atraildreamer
05-21-2012, 11:17
I just got back from a weekend hike and I have noticed getting comfortable and falling asleep is definitely a problem. I have a comfy marmot down sleeping bag, a thermarest neoair trekker sleeping pad, and an exped inflatable pillow so I feel that I have a pretty comfortable setup while still relatively light-weight. However, I just can't seem to get comfortable falling asleep.

I started my hike on Saturday after only sleeping about 2 hours the night before. We hiked about 5 or 6 hours and the last part was very difficult, scrambling up a steep boulder covered incline. Needless to say when it was finally bed time I was exhausted. Still, I was up for at least an hour or two before falling asleep and woke up several times during the night and couldn't fall back asleep.

I think the problem is that I am a side sleeper and sleep with a large body type pillow at home. I just can't fall asleep lying flat on my back. I am a pretty sound sleeper so noises and such don't keep me up, I think it is primarily just a comfort issue. My last time out I had similar issues. Anybody else a side sleeper or a pillow hugger and have problems getting sleep on the trail? I am worried that for long distance hiking lack of sleep is going to be a problem eventually. I would like to think that I would be so exhausted that I could fall asleep standing on my head, but this weekend gives me doubts.

Here are some images to contemplate that will help you get into the sleep mode! :)

Bobby
05-21-2012, 11:27
I just got back from a weekend hike and I have noticed getting comfortable and falling asleep is definitely a problem. I have a comfy marmot down sleeping bag, a thermarest neoair trekker sleeping pad, and an exped inflatable pillow so I feel that I have a pretty comfortable setup while still relatively light-weight. However, I just can't seem to get comfortable falling asleep.

I started my hike on Saturday after only sleeping about 2 hours the night before. We hiked about 5 or 6 hours and the last part was very difficult, scrambling up a steep boulder covered incline. Needless to say when it was finally bed time I was exhausted. Still, I was up for at least an hour or two before falling asleep and woke up several times during the night and couldn't fall back asleep.

I think the problem is that I am a side sleeper and sleep with a large body type pillow at home. I just can't fall asleep lying flat on my back. I am a pretty sound sleeper so noises and such don't keep me up, I think it is primarily just a comfort issue. My last time out I had similar issues. Anybody else a side sleeper or a pillow hugger and have problems getting sleep on the trail? I am worried that for long distance hiking lack of sleep is going to be a problem eventually. I would like to think that I would be so exhausted that I could fall asleep standing on my head, but this weekend gives me doubts.




Yeah - seems pretty normal to me

This happens to me most hikes. First night or two I don't sleep well, but after a few I have no real problems. Takes awhile for the body to adjust and get used to it. Wouldn't worry about it on a long hike - you'll sleep soon or later. Short hikes it can be annoying, but...

G.G.
05-21-2012, 11:30
Have a couple kids. It should work on many levels.

Cherokee Bill
05-21-2012, 19:21
Benadryl is so light, I take two before bed on a hike. I wonder if the nyquil stuff comes in dry form? Carrying a bottle of nyquil seems counter productive.

--------------------------------------
Be VERY CAREFUL with Benadryl, as it has a bad habit of sneaking up on folks and causing A-Fib. At about 62-yo, I woke up one morning from an 8-hr sleep, with a pulse of 200+, ended up in the ER, with about 6 IV's running with God knows what in an effort to SLOW the heart & restore an even rhythm.

They had given up and where preparing to administer a relaxant, in prep of Shocking (Defib) my heart into submission, then suddenly, thank God, I converted and was back to normal in another 15-min

I know of at least 2 other folks having suffered the same thing, after taking Benadryl to sleep.

If A-fib, similiar to mine, happens 2 U on the AT in the middle of nowhere, you may well not live to tell the story!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!

Wishing good health to all ............................ my 2-cents

BigRing
05-21-2012, 19:54
I have the same problem, but have noticed that the problem does seem to go away after a couple nights. You might also try a hot cocoa, small glass of wine, etc..

johnnybgood
05-21-2012, 20:15
I'm surprised that there was no mention of Melatonin. The human body produces this substance naturally so this is not addicting.
It comes in soft pill form which can be dissolved quickly to allow for fast absorption. Ideally it should be taken about half hour before bedtime.

Still looking for just the right pillow myself. I think the key to getting a good nights sleep is finding the right sleeping pad and pillow.

....and zzzzz for the win.

WIAPilot
05-21-2012, 20:17
ATrailDReamer: You ROCK! What sweet pictures. :)

I miss Mtns.
05-21-2012, 20:44
I am a side sleeper and experience the same problem all the time while camping. At least I used to until I started using a hammock. But I still bring the whiskey (just in case). :rolleyes:

kayak karl
05-21-2012, 21:10
i agree with Hooch. why is everybody going right to pills?
it is not uncommon for the body's need to adjust to hiking. sleep, hunger and dijestive can get out of kilter. the OP said he only hiked 5-6 hours. not much to get tired. did you eat a lot of sugar snacks that day? for me my body takes 3 days to get used to trail and even 10 days for hunger to set in. i just think going to drugs because of one nite loss of sleep is not a good idea.

Wise Old Owl
05-21-2012, 21:17
I'm surprised that there was no mention of Melatonin. The human body produces this substance naturally so this is not addicting.
It comes in soft pill form which can be dissolved quickly to allow for fast absorption. Ideally it should be taken about half hour before bedtime.

Still looking for just the right pillow myself. I think the key to getting a good nights sleep is finding the right sleeping pad and pillow.

....and zzzzz for the win.

Ok I thought I posted but it didn't stick. Melatonin is so mild - good luck with that. It just doesn't kick in for most folk, for some... well you get the picture.

bwburgin1015
05-21-2012, 21:27
As far as pillows go...check out the therms rest compressible pillow....light and as comfy as the pillow in my bed. It has revolutionized tent camping in my mind!

Wise Old Owl
05-21-2012, 21:41
huh? pillow? whats wrong with a horizontal branch? Are you some sort of perfectionist?

JoshL
05-21-2012, 21:49
Thanks for all the recommendations. I do have benadryl with me when i go out and will probably try that next time, although I think it was more a comfort issue than not being sleepy. Whiskey is always great, and I did have plenty of that in the evening at camp and that didn't help. I have thought about going the hammock route, but have spent too much lately on tents and sleeping bags and pads to just give up on that entirely. I mainly just wonder if there are any pads/pillows, or other tricks that might be better for a side sleeper to get comfortable.

ChinMusic
05-21-2012, 21:50
Yeah - seems pretty normal to me

This happens to me most hikes. First night or two I don't sleep well, but after a few I have no real problems. Takes awhile for the body to adjust and get used to it. Wouldn't worry about it on a long hike - you'll sleep soon or later. Short hikes it can be annoying, but...

I agree with this. I have trouble sleeping early on during a section hike. By the end I have no problem. Hammock or tent it is the same.

Now that I know the pattern I just bring a few Zolpidem with me to get me by the first couple nights. Works like a charm and no dependency. VMMV

Jan LiteShoe
05-21-2012, 22:10
I have had good success with both Nyquill capsules and Tylenol PM. Suppliment these with a few ounces of Knob Creek at bedtime and you are off to lala land. Sweet Dreams.

Just a heads up, as many don't put this together, but Tylenol plus liquor is very damaging to the liver - to the point of "oh-oh:"
http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/2354/does-tylenol-alcohol-liver-failure-plus

Just would hate to see someone do a damage to themselves by combining two things best left seperate.

By the way, sometimes 600 mg of magnesium helps the muscles relax, and many folks are deficient in it anyway.

happy hiking!

JoshL
05-21-2012, 22:36
Just a heads up, as many don't put this together, but Tylenol plus liquor is very damaging to the liver - to the point of "oh-oh:"
http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/2354/does-tylenol-alcohol-liver-failure-plus

Just would hate to see someone do a damage to themselves by combining two things best left seperate.

By the way, sometimes 600 mg of magnesium helps the muscles relax, and many folks are deficient in it anyway.

happy hiking!

This is definitely true and good advice. I will only take ibuprofen, naproxen, or aspirin after drinking. Tylenol is really not a very effective pain reliever to begin with. Overdosing on Tylenol is more likely to cause liver failure than alcohol, and the two together make things even worse. For all the people out there who take Tylenol PM, the sleeping agent diphenhydramine is the same thing that is in benadryl. If you want pain relief with a sleep aid Advil PM contains diphenydramine and ibuprofen, and ibuprofen is an anti-inflammatory and better for sore muscles than Tylenol anyway.

leaftye
05-21-2012, 23:04
I had real big trouble sleeping when I started getting back into backpacking a few years ago. I think the first night I stayed up the entire night, and then the next night maybe 10 minutes total in bits and spurts, and then a little more every night out there. I am still a little slow to sleep on the first night of trips, but I still get enough.

Point is, experience helps.

I am also a side sleeper, and have found that sleeping on UNeven ground helps me sleep more comfortably. I also fill my stuff sack and use it as a pillow, sometimes on my pack for extra thickness.

rocketsocks
05-21-2012, 23:54
I'm surprised that there was no mention of Melatonin. The human body produces this substance naturally so this is not addicting.
It comes in soft pill form which can be dissolved quickly to allow for fast absorption. Ideally it should be taken about half hour before bedtime.

Still looking for just the right pillow myself. I think the key to getting a good nights sleep is finding the right sleeping pad and pillow.

....and zzzzz for the win.I have not tried the melintonin thing,my doctor recomended this to me as well,just got a new pillow this week,will see it needs a few days before i can call it fixed.Sears pillow $23 for two,seally no crush or something,Oops,not a camping pillow I just use a "camp trails" pillow,though it weighs about 11oz.s I think.my winter pillow is a down coat that doubles as a pillow by folding up into it's own pocket,9x12 weighs about 13oz if memory serves,haven't used it as such yet.pillow that is.

texas&fla
05-22-2012, 00:22
Josh, I am a side sleeper as well and had quite a few nights of intermittant sleep on various backpacking trips. I changed out several pieces of equipment before I found the magic sleep combo. I have a Big Agness Insulated Air core....so I do like that you got the NeoAir. Tip: don't fill it completely full. This way you have some give in it to 'sink' needed parts of your body. I tried several pillow options. The final thing that worked for me is the Thermarest synthetic compression pillow. As soon as you stop, get it out and let it start expanding. It expands to a height of about 5 inches and its very comfy yet still firm. It keeps my head perpendicular to my shoulders....which I found is critical to a good nights sleep. The key (for me at least) is getting a system where my neck and back are essentially in a straight line while laying on my side. This is why using a air mattress is so much better than a flat pad for side sleepers.

I stopped and thought about what works for me at home. I cannot sleep on a very firm bed...or with a thin or flat pillow. So I tried to replicate that situation as much as possible. Hope this helps.

peakbagger
05-22-2012, 07:56
I ma surprised no one mentioned foam earplugs. I find that they really help.

ChinMusic
05-22-2012, 09:33
I ma surprised no one mentioned foam earplugs. I find that they really help.

They sure helped at Trail Days. The cackling was annoying as hell.

flemdawg1
05-22-2012, 11:18
If you want a crutch, use the drugs. If you want a good night's sleep without that crap contaminating your body, try other avenues first.

1) Are your pillow and/or your sleeping mat too soft or too firm?
2) Is your sleeping position comfortable? If you're a side sleeper at home, try side sleeping if your tent.
3) Are you using the right pillow and/or sleeping mat for you? If not, experiment with others.
4) Are you warm/cool enough?
5) Look at giving a hammock a go. (Stand by for the hammock hater comments from that crowd, because here they come!)

I agree with the above. No need running to chemicals. I side sleep and most of the time I have trouble drifting off its 1 or 4 above.

ChinMusic
05-22-2012, 11:52
I agree with the above. No need running to chemicals.
Hikers avoiding "chemicals"? Now that's a hoot.

atraildreamer
05-22-2012, 11:52
ATrailDReamer: You ROCK! What sweet pictures. :)

Thank you. I just read my post again and I am feeling a bit sl-e-e-e-e-py.........ZZZZZ!

pyroman53
05-22-2012, 12:28
I mainly just wonder if there are any pads/pillows, or other tricks that might be better for a side sleeper to get comfortable.

A little Vit. I helps to soothe sore muscles and quiet the restlessness.

I actually use two pillows. As you mentioned, having a pillow to lean on when side sleeping makes all the difference to me, so I use one or two empty 2L Platy's (blown up with air) in a stuff sack. Maybe throw in a some spare clothes, and I'm good. Trouble is there's never enough clothes to fill both side and head pillows. Its important enough that I plan to carry an inflatable pillow (when I can find one that is light enough)

As mentioned, uneven ground is good too. I often scrape out a little hip depression if sleeping on duff. Shelter floors suck and I seldom sleep well there the first few days.

FlyPaper
05-22-2012, 12:31
I'm surprised that there was no mention of Melatonin. The human body produces this substance naturally so this is not addicting.
It comes in soft pill form which can be dissolved quickly to allow for fast absorption. Ideally it should be taken about half hour before bedtime.

Still looking for just the right pillow myself. I think the key to getting a good nights sleep is finding the right sleeping pad and pillow.

....and zzzzz for the win.


I always take Melatonin on the trail. It's not real strong, and it is a natural substance. Doesn't guarantee
sleep, but it helps, especially in falling asleep.

Also, as mentioned, it is non-addictive. As an example, I've been taking Melatonin every single
day for almost 9 years and have not become addicted.

lemon b
05-22-2012, 13:35
My experience is having the correct headrest. Rolled up Fleece works for me. When I get tired enough I can sleep almost anywhere that is semi dry.

Creek Dancer
05-22-2012, 13:46
This idea might not help with your comfort issue, but it might help you get to sleep faster. Someone here on WB suggested to me to follow the same bedtime routine in the woods that you do at home, to the extent that is possible. So if your routine at home is...bathe, brush teeth, read , sleep...in that order, do the same routine in the woods and you may find that you relax faster and get to sleep faster. This does seem to help me get to sleep faster, but I am creature of habit.

Creek Dancer
05-22-2012, 13:47
Benadryl can be helpful, but it can also dehydrate you.

rocketsocks
05-22-2012, 13:52
I like to listen to a documentary on the TV,anything kinda non-descript,or monotone,bokks on tape,or Ipod.

WhiplashEm
05-22-2012, 20:54
I have chronic insomnia in my regular life that I'm hoping quitting my job and going for a long walk in the woods will help to cure. Some of the best sleep-related advice my doctor has given me is, "When your body needs to sleep it will sleep, even if you are driving behind the wheel of a car", which is oddly comforting.

quilteresq
05-22-2012, 21:13
I have a fairly screwed up thyroid situation, which stresses the body a lot and can lead to rounds of insomnia. My doctor prescribed Pharma-GABA for me. It's a natural hormone that your body needs to slow down. In about two nights, a month of insomnia came to an end! I was doing the benadryl AND having a drink at night at night to get sleepy, but it wasn't working, so I was pretty happy. Sleep helps everything! Problem solved - and I could cut out the calories I didn't need from the drink at night.

For more info: http://doctormurray.com/2011/06/pharmagaba-natural-support-for-stress-anxiety-and-insomnia/

I just picked a random web page that popped up on the search for it. Feel free to do more of your own research.