View Full Version : Dog Bite - 2012 AT Thru Hiker (SOBO)
Cherokee Bill
06-06-2012, 17:46
"I woke up in the rain and broke camp and hiked out on a still sore ankle realizing I could work my way through the pain. I made it to Wadliegh Lean-to which was full so I set up camp in the rain. about five I got out of my tent, peed and started to look around. A hiker had his big black German shepherd loose and the dog came over barking and bit on the leg and didn't break the skin but then he bit me in the arm and made a sizeable gash. I walked toward the owner who took control of the dog. I cleaned the wound with some help from some of the other hikers then decided I should hike another 8.5 miles to get to a lodge. Mountain Goat went with me. Linda, one of the lodge owners helped me clean the wound some more and then I took a shower and slept. We'll access in the morning. "
I have been bitten by dogs twice in my 65-yrs! Many years ago my youngest son about had his head removed by a neighborhood dog. He was in surgery for 6-hour afterward. To day as an adult, he still bears the facial scars!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
Had I been the Thru hiker above and a German Shepard bit me twice, I would have shot the dog DEAD on the spot!
Say what you will, but I will NOT tolerate a large dog that bites folks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
kayak karl
06-06-2012, 18:23
sorry to hear that. hope he got all the hiker and dog info. friend of yours?
rocketsocks
06-06-2012, 18:32
Wow,that's super unfortunate,I too would have trouble tolerating a dog that is a known biter,and if I had the slightest inkling that that was the case the dog would not and should not go on the trip,did the hiker say if in fact the dog has bitten before?Sounds like the dog may have been startled or unsure,some older dogs when they have poor vision can get a little unrest from someone approaching not offering any excuses here,just an observation as to why this may have happened,due to the hour of the day in that it sounds like early morning and maybe he too just woke up.
Cherokee Bill
06-06-2012, 18:38
Have NO idea who he is! Just read his recent Journal!
atmilkman
06-06-2012, 18:42
Zero tolerence rule is in effect.
hikerinnc
06-06-2012, 19:35
People laugh at my bear spray. That's cool. But I carry it for dogs way more than bears. Been bitten once while hiking. Sorry to hear about your experience.
kayak karl
06-06-2012, 19:39
looks like he got back on the trail today. hope all goes well for him. http://www.trailjournals.com/entry.cfm?id=381424
Mrs Baggins
06-06-2012, 19:56
Why wait for the owner to do the right thing? I'd have killed the dog myself.
JT is having a rough start, hope his luck changes.
He says the dogs owner assured him that the dog had all it's vaccinations. I would not take the owners word for it. Hope the victim got the dog owner's information so he can confirm the dog had it's rabies vaccination.
The victim has 30 days to file a complaint with local authorities.
"A person who owns or keeps a dangerous dog commits a civil violation for which the court shall adjudge a fine of not less than $250 and not more than $1,000. The dog may be ordered to be muzzled, or euthanized if it has killed, maimed or inflicted serious bodily injury upon a person or has a history of a prior assault."
Hey Mrs Baggins, don't know if you're familiar with Maryland's dog bite laws but the victim has little protection from the law in our great state.
I agree with all of the above posts. My thought about the dog owner: If you don't keep your dog restrained, and he is not trained to be civil in public, he has no business in any public place. Send the dog home and make sure the victim's injuries are taken care of on your nickel.
Cherokee Bill
06-07-2012, 06:19
BTW................ this kid ended up in an ER (at the next town) to get the wounds properly cleaned, dressed and got some antibiotics for a possible coming infection from the bite! Guess what this must have cost him $$$......
Why wait for the owner to do the right thing? I'd have killed the dog myself.
I don't agree with killing the dog. It's just being a dog. The owner is the problem here. Now if you were to impart some wisdom in that direction...
If it is shown the owner has allowed the dog to beocome a habitual biter then drastic action might be taken against the dog. But the owner should also face significant consequences. I say this a a dog lover and owner (maybe she owns me). My dog, the friendliest in the world, is always on leash so this doesn't become a problem for me.
Cherokee Bill
06-07-2012, 06:30
The damn dog that tried to take my sons head off, as a child, was "the friendliest in the world" in our neighborhood!
Your dog tries to bite me or mine, it's DEAD.
Enough said
Yes! This is a major thorn in my side, and is why I continue to post here, on the subject! This is a growing problem, that is, dog-owners allowing their dogs to roam free on the trail.
A bitting dog, is always a bitting dog!
5-times in the past 18-mo, I have been threatened by such dogs on various trails. This last incident of the Thru Hikes having been bitten twice, has now given me the ZERO TOLERANCE attitude!
I am with you Billyboy. One of my pet peeves is letting your dog run with no leash. Also not cleaning up after the dang thing. But the problem is the lazy owners. My mini schnauzer was attacked and killed by an unleashed mutt running in the neighborhood.
kayak karl
06-07-2012, 08:09
But the problem is the lazy owners. i agree 100%. should be more responsibility put on owners.
not to minims this or make light of it, but it looks like the hiker is trying to put this behind him. any injury or setback right in the beginning of a hike can have traumatic consequences. maybe be we could sign his guestbook and cheer JT Pynne (http://www.trailjournals.com/entry.cfm?id=381424) on his hike. :)
I don't agree with killing the dog. It's just being a dog. The owner is the problem here. Now if you were to impart some wisdom in that direction...
If it is shown the owner has allowed the dog to beocome a habitual biter then drastic action might be taken against the dog. But the owner should also face significant consequences. I say this a a dog lover and owner (maybe she owns me). My dog, the friendliest in the world, is always on leash so this doesn't become a problem for me.
I am in total agreement with you as an Ex professional dog trainer. You definately do need to know your dog and he should have had him on a leash but dogs are dogs and freak accidents happen. I hope JT had a good and successful hike.
Feral Bill
06-07-2012, 12:37
I don't agree with killing the dog. It's just being a dog.
No, It's a dog being a viscious dog. Most dogs do not bite people.
It does not belong out in public, off leash or on, ever.
SassyWindsor
06-07-2012, 12:55
Did the dog owner have proof the dog had rabies inoculation? Being bit by a potential rabies carrier could ruin a hiking trip. These thoughtless hikers who carry their dogs into the woods with no physical restraints are the worst. The standard canned reply from these people, after their dog has attacked is "He, or She, has never done that before!" or "what did you do to cause him, or her, to attack you" blah, blah, blah
dogs are dogs and freak accidents happen.
A dog off it's leash biting a person is not an accident, for sure not a "freak accident". It's a predictable maiming or even fatal attack on a human caused by a negligent irresponsible dog owner.
Velvet Gooch
06-07-2012, 14:28
I don't wait till they bite. Tap, tap. I will not hesitate in an emergency. Truth
Sarcasm the elf
06-07-2012, 14:58
I don't wait till they bite. Tap, tap. I will not hesitate in an emergency. TruthI just love when people brag about their willingness to shoot things. Comments like that make me wonder why they allow guns on the trail. Truth.
I don't wait till they bite. Tap, tap. I will not hesitate in an emergency. Truth
Wow this is good, we have dogs and guns in the same thread, can someone work in hanging/sleeping with food and treating/not treating water. We could settle everything right here :)
I love dogs, but they are not people. It's the owners that need to be held accountable. Please if you have a dog on the trail, keep it under control for the dogs sake. If my dog attacked someone without cause, I would put him down myself, or make sure he spent the rest of his life in a place where he could do no harm.
People come first.
Well, if you carry some old/bad cheese where you can get to it fast and give it to the dog, maybe it won't bite you. Not sure how long you have to carry the cheese before it gets old/bad.
kayak karl
06-07-2012, 15:27
Well, if you carry some old/bad cheese where you can get to it fast and give it to the dog, maybe it won't bite you. Not sure how long you have to carry the cheese before it gets old/bad.
do you put it on the end of a trekking pole and stick it outside the tent?
Well, if you carry some old/bad cheese where you can get to it fast and give it to the dog, maybe it won't bite you. Not sure how long you have to carry the cheese before it gets old/bad.
do you put it on the end of a trekking pole and stick it outside the tent?
First you must use said cheese as a pillow!
Pedaling Fool
06-07-2012, 16:18
This is one of those subjects that hit a nerve with me, because I've been dealing with dogs since I started riding my bike to work in the late 80's and now I got to deal with them when I run on the beach :mad:.
Just the other day I had a huge rottweiler (it was a cop's dog, boy was he apologetic :D) come at me. They say not to look a dog in the eyes, but that's exactly what I do; I look him in the eye with the full intent of kicking his teeth out if he comes any closer - 9 times out of ten it works, I really think they can sense your strong emotions. But there have been a few times I've had to kick them.
It is the owner's fault, but that really doesn't matter when a dog is coming at you, your only thought is to keep from getting bit and I'd have no problems killing a dog if one kick doesn't work. So if there's any legal action between me and a dog owner, it'll probably be the dog owner trying to sue me :)
Derek81pci
06-07-2012, 16:26
Going to catch grief for this, I know, but I don't care. Never understood why people would want to hike with their dog. Maybe on a super private trail like BMT or PCT, but not the AT... way too many people. It's your hike, not your dogs. If you are so uncomfortable hiking by yourself, perhaps you should find yourself a new hobby. My brother took his dog on a 3 day hike here in Ohio last year, dog cut his pad on a piece of glass wondering off the trail... my brother carried his 60 pound dog like 3 miles back to the car with a gushing paw wound... He has 4 dogs that he looks at as his children, and said he will never do it again. Leave the animals at home. Just my $.02.
WIAPilot
06-07-2012, 16:46
I love dogs and I train mine well. And I seriously thought about getting a younger dog to accompany me. I then decided that it just wouldn't be fair to the dog. In many of the journals, you read of dog after dog who is sent home because they have hurt or cut their paws. Likewise, there are snakes, bears, ticks, and other dangers that could really compromise his health and I'm not strong enough to carry him to a vet, who may be quite a distance. If a bear is approaching, I don't think that any amount of training would prevent the breed I have to not go after the bear in an attempt to "protect" me. So even though I would truly enjoy a dog on the trail, I think that it is generally too hard on the majority of dogs. And probably the biggest reason is that I live 1800 miles from the closest spot on the AT. I don't have a family member that I can just call and have them quickly pick up the dog if he's having problems.
Cherokee Bill
06-07-2012, 18:30
"So if there's any legal action between me and a dog owner, it'll probably be the dog owner trying to sue me"
I would rather be tried by 12, than carried by 6........................
Sarcasm the elf
06-07-2012, 19:03
[COLOR=#FF0000] I would rather be tried by 12, than carried by 6........................
Following that logic, Either outcome you will cause you to be removed from society.
That tired old slogan gets thrown around a lot on this site and it doesn't add anything to the conversation aside from making the person that posted it sound like a fool.
On the plus side, that slogan also signals that this thread is about devolve to the point where the mods close it, so have fun!
If a dog bit me or a member of my family, I wonder how far I'd go to make sure the animal was properly vacinated. I'd start by asking politley, of course.
One thing I have never seen discussed on WB is whether dog owners routinely carry proof of thier animals' vaccinations.
There are all kinds of folks that have to deal with mean, untrained nasty dogs as an occupational hazard everyday. They don't carry guns and shoot dogs. I think some folks that talk about guns and......never mind.
AngryGerman
06-07-2012, 20:02
To quote the OP "Had I been the Thru hiker above and a German Shepard bit me twice, I would have shot the dog DEAD on the spot!"
I am not trying to beat up on you BillyBoy however, I totally don't understand where the hiker was going to get a gun if not already carrying one and as experienced hikers and advocates of trail safety we should be preaching the use of non-lethal techniques to fend off those two and four legged critters.
As a dog owner it is our responsibility to the dog and society that we train and leash our dogs regardless of the animals demeanor! With that being said, I now have two very dog aggressive pooches because a fellow animal lover decide to take his dog for a walk in the woods (on the A.T. in PA) w/out a leash and his dog attacked my dogs that were on leash. First inclination was to let my dogs kill the other however that would not be fair so I fended off the dogs attack while holding back my boys (135lbs and 90lbs) injurying myself in the process. The owner was very apologetic but I could not resist in the berating that ensued after his apology.
In short, dog owners need to police their animals and people need to police their thought process regarding animal and firearm education; to include state and national park regulations as 40 plus parks along the A.T. do not allow firearms!
Education is imperative in the fight ag
I love dogs but I don't particularly support them on the trail. Most hikers with dogs (not all) are scared of something and "pack the dog" along with the rest of their fears. Someone with a threatening dog (in my opinion) is like someone brandishing a pistol on the trail - - it is one of the very most dangerous and scary things out there - I've never been bitten but I've been growled at and I've been afraid. Someone who owns a threatening dog (unless they are a working member of the military police or something) is a BAD person and an animal abuser in my book - - absolutely the worst sort of person. I feel so very sorry for bad and (usually) mistreated dogs but they top my list of most feared things on the trail (and often when crossing rural farm roads). Next comes ticks and limes disease, bees, lightening, people with guns (I don't really like them either - sorry to the military gung-ho types here) - - way down on my list are things like poisonous snakes. Here is how I deal with dogs on the trail:
1) If the dog is obviously friendly - slobbering on me, licking me, etc., I go ahead and make friends - - if I can, I gently and carefully touch on dog subjects with the owner - - mainly involving the dog's safety and well-being on the trail.
2) If I am approaching a road - usually rural and hear baying and barking - - sometimes this is bear dogs (esp, in NC and TN) - - I go into stealth mode. I look very carefully for threatening dogs and try to go quietly and calmly through the area - - always with an eye out for a boulder or tree to climb - - unlike bears, dogs are not good climbers
3) If I am actually threatened by a dog, I do not run. I try not to make eye contact but I do casually pick up a big stick if I can find one. I give the dog a wide berth and make sure not to corner them - - I move laterally (off trail as necessary) and well around the dog. So far, knock on wood, this has worked. I suppose that if it was required, I'd clock the dog on the head with the stick or a rock as hard as I could if attacked but this would be an absolute last resort.
Wise Old Owl
06-07-2012, 20:35
Going to catch grief for this, I know, but I don't care. Never understood why people would want to hike with their dog. Maybe on a super private trail like BMT or PCT, but not the AT... way too many people. It's your hike, not your dogs. If you are so uncomfortable hiking by yourself, perhaps you should find yourself a new hobby. My brother took his dog on a 3 day hike here in Ohio last year, dog cut his pad on a piece of glass wondering off the trail... my brother carried his 60 pound dog like 3 miles back to the car with a gushing paw wound... He has 4 dogs that he looks at as his children, and said he will never do it again. Leave the animals at home. Just my $.02.
Naa Mate if you are talkin from the heart - no grief required. Posting while drinking Kool Aid and talkin crap about killing Animals has no place here. Your brother has empathy... Its good to have family like that and that's cool.
By the way I am in Wildlife Control... Pest Control
Wise Old Owl
06-07-2012, 20:38
Papa D just saw your post..
Add NEVER let a dog get behind you...
Cherokee Bill
06-07-2012, 20:41
To you cry-babies about guns!
We were killing each other, thousands of years before there were guns! So get off that kick! If there were NO GUNS, people would still find ways to kill each other!
Guns no more kill people, than pencils mis-spell words!
People, kill people!
Therefore, what U R saying, I/we no longer have our 1st Amendment rights?
I'll bet the 1st time one of your family is violated, raped, mauled, etc., your opinion changes!
Let's consider this thread closed, and the dead-horse, dead!
Going to catch grief for this, I know, but I don't care. Never understood why people would want to hike with their dog. Maybe on a super private trail like BMT or PCT, but not the AT... way too many people. It's your hike, not your dogs. If you are so uncomfortable hiking by yourself, perhaps you should find yourself a new hobby. My brother took his dog on a 3 day hike here in Ohio last year, dog cut his pad on a piece of glass wondering off the trail... my brother carried his 60 pound dog like 3 miles back to the car with a gushing paw wound... He has 4 dogs that he looks at as his children, and said he will never do it again. Leave the animals at home. Just my $.02.
I agree with this
Spirit Walker
06-07-2012, 22:23
So my question is - what happened to the dog? Is it still on the trail or did its owner get smart and take it home?
SassyWindsor
06-08-2012, 01:19
The really bad, or sad thing, is the irresponsible dog owner is putting other hikers in a situation to harm the dog in order to stave off a potentially bad bite or mauling. Then a ticked off owner will have to be dealt with afterwords. Being injured miles from help would not be pleasant, and I wouldn't count on the dog owner to assist you. I would never consider shooting any animal unless there was just no way around it. I would use pepper spray, if I was carrying it, and my poles before actually shooting the animal. I refuse to be injured because of someone else's ignorant, selfish, neglect and will do what is necessary to protect myself and avoid injury. Keep your pet leashed.
The one time I have been badly bitten by a dog, the owners (who were friends of mine) had the dog put down by a vet before I was released from the ER. They were responsible pet owners and realized that a large dog capable of one unprovoked attack could never again be trusted to be unrestrained.
Dog bites are very messy injuries, dirty, jagged, and slow to heal.
Hiking poles are quite effective against aggressive dogs. I've never had to stab a dog, but they are usually kept at bay by the poles until their owners take control. When I was hiking in NY, an idiot was walking two unleashed Dobermans. The dogs rushed at me. They were not just trying to make friends. I kept them away from me with my poles. The owner insisted they wouldn't hurt me but I wouldn't relent until he held them by their collars until I was out of sight. He thought I was being a idiot. I know he is one.