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View Full Version : What "refrigerate" after opening products hold up well on the trail?



RITBlake
04-13-2005, 18:25
Talk about what foods people might be suprised to find out don't really need to be refrigerated (unlike the package might suggest) and that can still be ok to eat after a couple days.

RITBlake
04-13-2005, 18:27
On our shakedown hike this summer, I noticed quite a few thru hikers had bags of the hummel, pre cut, pepperoni. Except for being a little oily they were still good even after several days on the trail.

Brock
04-13-2005, 18:47
I have found precooked chicken in sealed packages that only required to be heated were pretty good. They were in the tuna isle in kRoger or Meyer.

stupe
04-13-2005, 19:01
Good old SPAM, out of it's can and into a zip lock lasts three days in all but the hottest weather. As long as it has it's healthy pink hue, I think it's ok.

The Cheat
04-13-2005, 19:16
....
butter

SGT Rock
04-13-2005, 19:23
Summer sausage, itallian dressing, block of cheddar, hot mustard.

saimyoji
04-13-2005, 20:24
Jalapenos, peperoncinis...

Nightwalker
04-13-2005, 22:44
Thin-sliced meat. There's enough preservatives there to keep 'em for 2-3 days.

java
04-13-2005, 22:54
Most people think eggs need to be refridgerated, but they don't (not for a few days at least). And they're really not as breakable as most people think either. Plus, the cardboard carton makes good fire starter once your eggs are eaten.

Tha Wookie
04-14-2005, 00:38
CHEESE!!!! Carry a block with you for at least 3 days. Trust me, it's been gone, but it's never gone bad.

Doctari
04-14-2005, 01:47
Most people think eggs need to be refridgerated, but they don't (not for a few days at least). And they're really not as breakable as most people think either. Plus, the cardboard carton makes good fire starter once your eggs are eaten.

My granny used to keep them for weeks (14+ days) until she had "enough", then she would incubate them for a new batch of chicks. Or, we would eat them, depended on what the needs were that week. Usually she had a 90% hatch rate, which was pretty good for the incubators of the day, & none of the grandkids ever got sick from eating them & granny lived to be 95.

Doctari.

Just Jeff
04-14-2005, 08:44
Most people think eggs need to be refridgerated, but they don't (not for a few days at least). And they're really not as breakable as most people think either. Plus, the cardboard carton makes good fire starter once your eggs are eaten.
If you drop them in boiling water for a minute, they'll form a layer just inside the shell that will make them more durable and will last a bit longer. Just take them out before they're actually boiled.

I read that somewhere, anyway...never tried it.

MadAussieInLondon
04-15-2005, 09:51
egg shells are porous, but hard boiled eggs will last longer than not. a couple of days probably...

i liked the little bags of pre-cut turkey-peperoni, that was goood stuf!

YerbaJon
04-15-2005, 11:40
Egg storage without refrigeration is something well discussed in literature, most of it is literature that is over 80 years old. Still, I post the following information from http://www.alpharubicon.com/primitive/eggstoragereport.htm. It involves an 8 month test. Although 8 months storage is not needed for a hiker, one could adopt some of these stratagies to help themselves feel better about eating unrefrigerated eggs.

Scientific American Cyclopedia of Formulas copyright 1910 by Nunn & Co., Inc. {Due to the age of this book and the state of technology when it was printed, this writer makes no assurances as to the suitability or safety of the following information. Use of the following information is at your own risk!!} One condensation of methods comes from a set of experiments made by Director Strauch, of the Agricultural School, in Neisse (Germany), with various methods for keeping eggs fresh. At the beginning of July (the year was not given) 20 fresh eggs were treated by the same method, and examined at the end of February (an 8-month test). The results are given below:
o Kept in brine: all unfit for use; not decayed, but unpalatable from being saturated with salt.
o Wrapped in paper: 80% spoiled.
o Kept in a solution of salicylic acid and glycerin: 80% spoiled.
o Rubbed with salt: 70% spoiled.
o Packed in bran: 70% spoiled.
o Coated with paraffin: 70% spoiled.
o Painted with a solution of salicylic acid and glycerin: 70% spoiled.
o Immersed in boiling water 12 - 15 sec.: 50% spoiled.
o Treated with solution of Alum: 50% spoiled.
o Kept in a solution of salicylic acid: 50% spoiled.
o Coated with soluble glass: 40% spoiled.
o Coated with collodian: 40% spoiled.
o Coated with varnish: 40% spoiled.
o Rubbed with bacon: 30% spoiled.
o Packed in wood ashes: 20% spoiled.
o Treated with boric acid and soluble glass : 20% spoiled.
o Treated with Potassium permanganate: 20% spoiled.
o Coated with Vaseline and kept in lime water: all good.
o Kept in soluble glass: all very good.

See above link for more information, more links, and to read some more studies.
----------------------------------------------
I would think that just some vaseline rubbed on the egg shell would reduce the pourousness of the shell and allow it to go a number of days with little concern. I would also add that the above links discuss ways of determining if an egg is going or has gone bad; perhaps as important as storage is recognition of problems.

SGT Rock
04-15-2005, 12:00
I had heard of the boil for 15 second treatment, looks like it is only 50% effective.

Pencil Pusher
04-15-2005, 12:14
Hmmm, vaseline and eggs... perhaps this is one thought I shouldn't post...:-?

Nightwalker
04-15-2005, 13:48
Hmmm, vaseline and eggs... perhaps this is one thought I shouldn't post...:-?
Thank you ladies and gentlemen! And for my next trick...

I guess that this is as good of a lst-post-for-awhile as any. I'm back to the trail tomorrow. See y'all at Trail Daze. :D

Topcat
04-15-2005, 15:24
boiling was only 50% effective, after 8 months....may be a quick fix for a week or more. Very interesting thread. I always carry eggs for the first morning but never longer. I might change my mind now

Kerosene
04-15-2005, 15:31
On our shakedown hike this summer, I noticed quite a few thru hikers had bags of the hummel, pre cut, pepperoni. Except for being a little oily they were still good even after several days on the trail.I concur. Add a packet of Gulden's Brown Mustard, stuff into a pocket pita, and it's a great tasty lunch!

Tin Man
04-15-2005, 18:51
Hmmm, vaseline and eggs... perhaps this is one thought I shouldn't post...:-?

I know it sounds funny, but my uncle did this when he was sailing across the Atlantic and they kept for over 6 weeks.... I think a supply town on the trail might come up sooner.

Panzer1
04-16-2005, 02:18
So then as far as hiking is concerned, you could for example buy 6 eggs and they should keep in your pack for 3 to 4 days, even in the summer without any problem. Is that right?

Panzer

bogey
04-16-2005, 04:40
I had heard of the boil for 15 second treatment, looks like it is only 50% effective.
but but only 50 % effective after 8 MONTHS! right? ya could transport the token eggs for the whole NOBO, and serve 'em over easy the summit.

Rendezvous01
04-16-2005, 12:25
Re: EGGS
Ed Garvey, in his The New Appalachian Trail (1997), stated
"I can't leave the subject of eggs without passing on a method of keeping eggs fresh for incredible lengths of time without refrigeration. Here's how: immerse a fresh egg in boiling water for just five seconds--not five minutes but five seconds. It will then keep for weeks without refrigeration. When I first read of this little trick, it seemed hard to believe so I conducted my own test. On May 31, I put three fresh eggs in boiling water for five seconds. I then put them up in my attic...On July 21, some seven weeks after the five-second boiling, I fried the last one. It too tasted just like a fresh egg, but the yolk appeared almost flat when put into the griddle."
Garvey nearly always carried hard-boiled eggs with him for lunch on his 1990 thru.

On my 2001 hike, several times I bought a dozen eggs in town and carried them for the next day's breakfast, along with some cheese and ham and a stick of butter. Making omelets for breakfast for your fellow hikers is a sure way to make yourself popular!

"ME & U"
04-16-2005, 16:10
CHEESE!!!! Carry a block with you for at least 3 days. Trust me, it's been gone, but it's never gone bad.
I'm with you Wookie. Cheese is the best (in a block). We ate it for days on the trail. It does get a little soft but it's got so much salt and preservative in it that even if it grows a little penicillin I don't think that'll kill ya. Try the stick kind. They pack well and last forever. "ME"

Rancid
04-16-2005, 21:16
Jack Daniels ;)

Panzer1
04-16-2005, 23:20
Cheese and crackers...

This is the ticket. I would buy "heluva good" cheese. (no preservatives) It comes in a 8 ounce block and in a reclosable zip lock package. That made it convenient. It would always last 4 days in the heat of the summer. I tried to eat it within 3 days though.

It says on the package
"refrigerate after opening"
"use within 3 -5 days of opening"

On town house crackers it was real good.

Panzer

fiddlehead
04-16-2005, 23:51
Eggs and Leftover Rice are never refrigerated. Pork and Beef are usually NOT refrigerated. Fish and Ice are the only things i see that are ALWAYS refrigerated.

It is hot here year round. About 90 degrees fahrenheit on average and I am amazed when i see the flatbed truck that brings the pig quarters to the marketplace, sells them to the lady who hangs them in the sun and desperately tries to wave the flies off of them with not much success. My girlfriend buys this pork, sometimes the next day, brings it home and cooks it (sometimes) (see below) and if we have any leftovers, sets it in a screened in box (from the flies) for up to 2 days, until we eat it all. They waste nothing! One time last year I got sick (diarrhea) and asked her if she had any idea why i would get sick. She asked if i ate the light colored pork last night, when i said, i ate a little of everything last night, she said possibly I got sick from the light colored pork because it was not cooked pork. They often eat this here but i no longer do.
I believe the really really spicy food helps their stomach take care of the bacteria they eat. but i have learned that you can smell when meat goes bad. I hiked with a doctor on the PCT in 96 and learned from him that one of the best sources of fat is Kraft Salad Dressing (mayonaise substitute) He was eating it in the hot desert!

Anyway, living in Asia, perhaps my stomach is stronger than most but not much scares me anymore, unless its' here in Thailand and it's not cooked. (Fresh blood is a delicacy here also, another thing i try to stay away from ) A lot can be learned here about minimalist hiking: footwear, food, water, clothes, sun protection, (Thai's all want to be white), eating bugs (another delicacy) including cicadas, ants, beetles, larvae, worms, and many others i can't say in English. (some fried, some eaten raw, some eaten alive!)

I believe Thai's could live off the land here although in America of course, it's many different vegetables and fruits and they don't grow everywhere. But it would be interesting to see what they would eat if they had to. Of the perhaps 30 families i know here, 2 have refrigerators.

tlbj6142
04-18-2005, 09:12
I know tortillas keep fairly well. I have yet to find a brand that doesn't have the "Refrigerate after opening" message stamped on the bag somewhere.

I believe the key is to avoid those that contain egg? Or is it milk?

Just Jeff
04-18-2005, 09:29
Did you know that Hershey's Syrup says to refrigerate after opening? It's like 100% sugar!

In college, every table in the chow hall had a bottle on it...sat there until it was empty and was never in a fridge. No one that I know of got sick from it and we all used it.

I wonder why so many things in America say that. Maybe it's just a CYA thing for legal reasons?

RITBlake
04-18-2005, 13:52
[QUOTE=Just Jeff]
In college, every table in the chow hall had a bottle on it...sat there until it was empty and was never in a fridge. No one that I know of got sick from it and we all used it.
/QUOTE]

Now that I think about it...kethup and mustard bottles probably tell you to refridge them, but at our restaurant, we leave them out in the open all day every day.

lumpy
04-20-2005, 23:29
I like good ole "Hard Tack" with Cheddar and Mustard.

MedicineMan
04-21-2005, 00:09
and others like it? seems like it says to refrigerate too but i've seen many who have not????

Seraphim
04-21-2005, 17:11
Parkay keeps quite well out in da heat. A little bird told me it's quite delicious on Fudge Rounds...:D

Marta
04-21-2005, 18:41
In any European or Asian country I have lived in or visited, eggs are not kept refrigerated in grocery stores and markets--they are stored at room temperature. However, unwashed eggs have a thin natural coating which helps protect against spoilage. In the US, eggs sold commercially have to be washed, which removes that coating and shortens their room-temp. storage life. However, I doubt if anyone here wants to carry an egg in their backpack for more than a week, so that's not an issue.

All eggs, washed and unwashed, have a membrane inside the shell which is the real barrier to the organisms which would cause dangerous spoilage. If you want to keep an egg at warm temps for a while, make sure it doesn't have cracks big enough that gooey stuff (please forgive the technical term) is leaking out of the egg, which would show that that membrane has been breached. (This is the rule of thumb for using raw eggs to make homemade mayonnaise.)

So is that more than anyone wanted to know, or what?

Marta

Marta
04-21-2005, 18:51
Oh, yah. If you're wondering whether that egg you left at home on the counter the whole time you were out hiking is any good or not, you can drop it gently into a pan of water. It should sink or at least be completely submerged. If it floats like a cork, arrange not to be in the neighborhood when it is broken--it will sound like a small bomb going off and the smell is unbelievable. If, for example, you let a hen set on a clutch of eggs for a month or so and none of them hatch, a couple of 10-year-old boys can have a blast (literally) with the eggs, as long as they can get at least a quarter of a mile away from any habitation.

crane egan
04-13-2006, 17:46
In Costa Rica they do not refrigerate eggs.Have been on a boat for 7 days eating eggs every day.

Uncle Silly
04-13-2006, 18:09
I'll third (or fourth) the block-cheese recommendation.

Also, cream cheese will keep for a week. Some cream cheese, a 3-oz tuna packet, and a bagel makes for a great lunch. Goes good on those Combos snacks too.

crutch
04-13-2006, 18:13
Eggs and cheese are great. When you're in the south try some country ham. The salt content is high and it lasts a good 4-5 days, it's also great with the eggs and cheese.

Footslogger
04-13-2006, 18:31
Might have already been suggested but ...another option with eggs is to hardboil them in your room when you hit a town for re-supply and then carry them in your cookpot. GREAT SNACK !!

'Slogger

Two Speed
04-13-2006, 19:13
Haven't seen veggies mentioned, yet. Onions, carrots and to a lesser extent, celery, travel well. Small tomatoes, cherry or roma tomatoes, will keep for two or three days least. Only caveat I have on veggies is don't let 'em freeze in cold weather; freezing wrecks the texture.

I'll add to the chorus of cheese comments, and add that smoked cheeses seem to do better, if you can find them. Maybe a lower water content?

Doctari
04-13-2006, 19:32
Olive oil!

I have a bottle (about 7 OZ left in a 10 Oz bottle) that is at least 2 years old, NO rancid taste or smell. It has been opened several times on trail, I even used it monday night on a overnigher, no ill after effects so far.

Yes to: CHEESE, Pepperoni, Salami!

Squeeze Parkay, mine lasted at least 12 days, then I ran out.



Doctari.

Sparkplug
04-13-2006, 21:22
I agree with cheese! Even when our favoriate Cabot cheese got a bit oily it still tasted good! And of course, there is Laughing Cow (triangles of cheese spread) that lasted forever...

Also, Snowman says "Bacon"! He bought the pre-cooked bacon a few times to add to sandwiches and it never went bad before he ate it all up :)

Carrots and apples also tend to hold up well.

~Sparkplug

Ridge
04-14-2006, 00:18
I've boiled two dozen eggs on my sierra zip and ate the last one 9 days later, tasted as good as the first one. This done on the AT in early summer.

Ridge
04-14-2006, 00:23
Also, Honey is the only thing I know that comes from a living creature and never needs refrigeration, maybe theres something else out there. But, besides boiled eggs, I ate a lot of honey, peanut butter and condensed soups.

RITBlake
04-14-2006, 00:42
I was thinking about this thread the other day and I was going to re open it. Glad someone beat me to it.

Here are some things we carried on the trail that I was suprised stayed fresh for days:
Cream cheese
String cheese
Fresh Fruit (packed carefully)
Beer

2Questions
04-14-2006, 18:59
Want scrambled eggs for breakfast? Try these. They taste great, need no refrigeration, and are whole eggs. Great mixed with ham cubes and hash browns. They last for 12 months after container has been opened. I re-package 1 cup egg powder into freezer bags and freeze until use. They last years. Check it out. http://store.honeyvillegrain.com/index.asp?PageAction=Custom&ID=2

Vi+
04-15-2006, 22:05
Stores stock eggs many of which are more than a year old. After a certain period - I don't know what the length of time is - the remaining unsold eggs are wholesaled to manufacturers to use in products you buy from other shelves, e.g., mayonnaise, frozen pastries.

A friend loved to carry from one dozen to two dozen eggs, sans shells, in a plastic bag in his pack. He’d just tilt the bag, open side down, and pinch the lower corner to allow the number of eggs he wanted to cook slip out. The eggs almost always remained intact. He had no idea how long they lasted; he always ate them before they went bad.

Another friend, years ago in the army, ironed slices of bread so he could carry more of them in his pack - now you can buy them pre-ironed, they’re called "wheat tortillas."

Vi+
04-15-2006, 22:09
I synopsed this thread to make it more user friendly for my purposes, as I do with threads I believe are useful. I ask two questions at the end.

“REFRIGERATE AFTER OPENING" FOOD WHICH LASTS LONG ENOUGH FOR HIKING USE.

Apples: Fresh

Bacon, Pre-cooked: Add to sandwiches. Never went bad.

Beef: Usually NOT refrigerated in Asia.

Carrots: Fresh.

Catsup packet.

Cheese

- Block: At least 3 days. Gets soft and oily, salt and preservatives keep it safe.

- Cream: One week. On a bagel with a 3-oz tuna packet.

- Heluva Good Cheese (no preservatives) 8 oz block: Eat within 3 hot days.

- Laughing Cow: Triangles of cheese spread. Lasts forever.

- Smoked: Lasts longer (lower water content?)

- String

Chicken: Precooked, in sealed packages, only require being heated.

Dressing, Salad

- Kraft: One of the best sources of fat.

- Italian

Fish: ALWAYS refrigerated in Asia.

Fruit, Fresh: Packed carefully

Ham, Country: High salt content. Lasts a good 4-5 days.

Hard Tack

Hershey's Syrup is almost 100% sugar.

Honey: Never needs refrigeration.

Hummel

Margarine (Squeeze Parkay, etc): At least 12 days in hot weather.

Meat: Smells when it goes bad. Thin-sliced has preservatives to keep 2-3 days.

Mustard packet: Hot & Gulden’s Brown

Olive Oil: At least 2 years.

Onions: Fresh.

Peanut Butter.

Pepper:

- Jalapeno

- Peperoncini

Pepperoni: Pre cut remains good for several days, just becomes a bit oily. Spread a packet of Gulden's Brown Mustard on a pita pocket, then stuff hummel and pre cut pepperoni inside.

Pork: Usually NOT refrigerated in Asia.

Rice

Salami

Sausage: Summer

Soup, Condensed

Spam: Keep in a zip lock three days in all but the hottest weather. Healthy pink is OK.

Spicy food may help your stomach take care of the bacteria you eat.

Tomatoes, Small - Cherry and Roma: At least two or three days.

Tortillas: Avoid those containing egg? Or is it milk?

Turkey: Pre-cut

Vegetables: Don't let them freeze.

**

Eggs are typically stored at room temperature in some other countries. Unwashed eggs have a thin natural coating which helps protect against spoilage. Eggs sold commercially in the US have to be washed, removing the protective coating, shortening the room-temperature shelf life. All eggs, whether washed or not, have a membrane inside the shell protecting them from organisms which cause spoilage. Make sure the egg doesn't have cracks large enough to allow leakage, which indicates the membrane has been compromised.

You should be able to carry fresh untreated eggs three to four days, even in summer, without a problem. Eggs are fairly durable, and the cardboard egg carton makes a good fire starter.

Fresh Egg Test: Gently drop an egg into a pan of water. It should sink or be completely submerged. If it floats like a cork, discard without breaking.

Storage Treatment #1-A: If you drop eggs in boiling water for a minute, and take them out before they're actually boiled, they'll form a layer just inside the shell which makes them more durable and extends their shelf life. The boil-for-15-seconds treatment is only 50% effective - AFTER 8 MONTHS OF STORAGE- which is longer than the typical Thru-Hike.

Storage Treatment #1-B: Immerse a fresh egg in boiling water, for ONLY FIVE SECONDS. After seven weeks, without refrigeration, the yolk will be almost flat but, fried, the egg will taste fresh. - - Ed Garvey, “The New Appalachian Trail,” 1997 (Paraphrased).

Storage Treatment #2: Hard-boiled eggs taste fresh 9 days after they’ve been cooked.

Storage Treatment #3: Vaseline rubbed on the shell reduces the porosity and extends the eggs shelf life. (On one occasion, for over 6 weeks.)

Buy a dozen eggs, cheese, ham, and a stick of butter, in town. Make an omelet for breakfast.

Hard-boil eggs in your room in town, or on your hike, then carry them in your cookpot. They’re great at lunch.

Egg Powder: Lasts a year after the container has been opened, without refrigeration. Re-package a Cup Egg Powder into Freezer Bags; freeze until use. Mix with ham cubes and hash browns, and scramble. http://store.honeyvillegrain.com/ind...on=Custom&ID=2

Eight Month Egg Test (circa 1910): Scientific American Cyclopedia of Formulas. Twenty fresh eggs were treated, then examined at the end of eight months. http://www.alpharubicon.com/primitiv...ragereport.htm.

Results, below, ranked from best to worst test results:

ALL GOOD:
- Coated with Vaseline and kept in lime water.
- Kept in soluble glass.

80% GOOD / 20% SPOILED:
- Packed in wood ashes.
- Treated with boric acid and soluble glass.
- Treated with Potassium permanganate.

70% GOOD / 30% SPOILED:
- Rubbed with bacon: 30% spoiled.

60% GOOD / 40% SPOILED:
- Coated with soluble glass.
- Coated with collodion.
- Coated with varnish.

50% GOOD / 50% SPOILED:
- Immersed in boiling water 12 - 15 sec.: 50% spoiled.
- Treated with solution of Alum: 50% spoiled.
- Kept in a solution of salicylic acid: 50% spoiled.

30% GOOD / 70% SPOILED:
- Rubbed with salt.
- Packed in bran.
- Coated with paraffin.
- Painted with a solution of salicylic acid and glycerin.

20% GOOD / 80% SPOILED:
- Wrapped in paper.
- Kept in a solution of salicylic acid and glycerin.

UNPALATABLE: From being saturated with salt.
- Kept in brine.

* The U.S. Department of Agriculture continually updates recommended cooking practices. Their recommendations have become more conservative with the passage of time, and I doubt the USDA would currently approve any of the foregoing.

Question #1: What is “Lime Water” as in “Coated with Vaseline and kept in lime water.”?

Question #2: What is “Soluble Glass” as in “Kept in soluble glass.”?

P.S. A friend and I were wandering about the desert one day, along with his Irish Setter dog. We stopped to eat. He opened a can of Spam and gave portions to each of us. His dog smelled it and refused to eat. ALERT! ALERT! > > A DOG REFUSED TO EAT SOMETHING ALLEGED TO BE MEAT. My friend, his dog, and I went hungry. I haven’t eaten Spam since.

Vi+
04-15-2006, 23:06
Does anyone know why Country Ham, which is cured in a warm, moist environment, and was developed to be used where refrigeration was very limited shouldn't be considered indestructible and last forever?

I really should go to a ham curing place and ask this question, just hoping someone will know.

Thanks.

starvingmusician
04-15-2006, 23:11
Soluble glass = sodium silicate solution used in preserving eggs. 1 pint of sodium silicate solution to 9 or 10 pints of water yielding a little more than a gallon should preserve 75 to 100 dozen eggs. Keep the eggs in a crock under 2" of the solution, covered with a lid, in a cool, dark place. Wash the solution off before using...if hard boiling, prick the shell with a pin to allow steam to escape because the sodium silicate seals the pores of the shell.

Limewater is a calcium hydroxide solution.

Judy

starvingmusician
04-15-2006, 23:27
Actually, a Virginia/country ham is dry cured, and is usually stored hanging in a cool, dry place away from walls and other hams. It is not necessary to refrigerate. Smithfield says that their "Smithfield Hams" will keep up to one year and their uncooked country hams 6 months without deterioration. I think that's a little conservative (cover thy ass comandment?).

The mold that may form on the outside of the ham is the same mold found on aged cheeses. It is formed during the curing process by a reaction of the moisture from the ham with heat and humidity in the air. Wash the ham in hot water and scrub off the mold with a stiff vegetable brush.

Judy

Vi+
04-16-2006, 11:09
Thanks, Judy.

With your knowledge, a “starvingmusician” could survive on Green Eggs and Ham alone.

starvingmusician
04-17-2006, 09:15
This is what Mrs. Child (The American Frugal Housewife, 1833) has to say about preserving eggs:

Eggs will keep almost any length of time in lime-water properly prepared. One pint of coarse salt, and one pint of unslacked lime, to a pailful of water. It there be too much lime, it will eat the shells from the eggs; and if there be a single egg cracked, it will spoil the whole. They should be covered with lime-water, and kept in a cold place. The yolk becomes slightly red; but I have seen eggs, thus kept, perfectly sweet and fresh at the end of three years."

(Tongue firmly planted in cheek here) Now, for all of you ultralight backpackers -- don't bother carrying Chapstick. Mrs. Child recommends:

"Ear Wax -- Those who are troubled with cracked lips have found this remedy successful when others have failed. It is one of those sorts of cures, which are very likely to be laughed at; but I know of its having produced very beneficial results."

We only think this works becuase it tastes so horrid that you'll do anything to keep from licking the ear wax off of your lips.

Judy
AKA The Goodewyfe Judith

the goat
04-17-2006, 09:43
Actually, a Virginia/country ham is dry cured, and is usually stored hanging in a cool, dry place away from walls and other hams. It is not necessary to refrigerate. Smithfield says that their "Smithfield Hams" will keep up to one year and their uncooked country hams 6 months without deterioration. I think that's a little conservative (cover thy ass comandment?).


definitely conservative, i've eaten one after three years of hanging. a little more mold to scrub off, but tasted fantastic:sun

astrogirl
04-18-2006, 08:21
I carry salted butter and I've had no problem with it for a week in the spring. I always leave the butter dish on the counter at home. Salted butter won't go bad at (cool) room temperature at least two weeks. I also carry a block of cheddar and that also had never formed a bit of mold after a week or so.

That cooked bacon in a box wouldn't go bad, I'm sure, and I would carry it too but the preservatives give me a very nasty headache.

I don't really hike in the summer weather but warm spring days haven't caused any trouble for me with the dairy products I carry.

Critterman
04-19-2006, 09:37
I remember reading that in the navy they used to take "oiled eggs" on board at the start of a cruise and did not refrigerate them. Probably much like the vasoline method.

Ewker
06-16-2006, 10:52
Lots of good ideas esp on eggs

RITBlake
06-16-2006, 13:07
yah this is a great thread to read pre-thru hike or pre-section hike

Heater
06-16-2006, 14:45
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pencil Pusher
Hmmm, vaseline and eggs... perhaps this is one thought I shouldn't post...:-?



I know it sounds funny, but my uncle did this when he was sailing across the Atlantic and they kept for over 6 weeks.... I think a supply town on the trail might come up sooner.

But the big question is... did he go blind?

mweinstone
06-16-2006, 14:59
i carry butter,cheese,peperoni,garlic and ginger all freash and they last as long as you fast. and they good like they should be and they last weeks (3).eggs last a month and freash milk in the scorching suns heat just makes buttermilk not bad milk. and raw meat gets better and life continues to be freash long befor and after the age of the fridge.

BDT
06-16-2006, 19:18
I work in the dairy department of our local grocery. I can tell you most dairy prouducts are good for at least a month after the expiration date! Also most dairy products dont need refrigeration at all until you open the package. The only reason we need to refrigerate most dairy is because of osha and their regulations. I have had cheese last for 10 days in the woods and it was fine. I would not suggest keeping it any longer than that except in very cold weather. And once opened cheese might last 3-4 days in hot weather. hope that helps anyone.

kayak karl
03-23-2008, 11:55
Talk about what foods people might be suprised to find out don't really need to be refrigerated (unlike the package might suggest) and that can still be ok to eat after a couple days.
i tripped over this thread again, very informative. has any one tried the suggestions in the thread on eggs (or any other food) in the past year or 2?

Mrs Baggins
03-24-2008, 19:17
Did you know that Hershey's Syrup says to refrigerate after opening? It's like 100% sugar!

In college, every table in the chow hall had a bottle on it...sat there until it was empty and was never in a fridge. No one that I know of got sick from it and we all used it.

I wonder why so many things in America say that. Maybe it's just a CYA thing for legal reasons?

I HAVE seen opened bottles of Hershey, not refrigerated, with MOLD inside the bottle. You may not have tasted it but it was there. I will not refrigerate the plastic containers of grated parmesan cheese even though they say to. The moisture from being in the 'fridge builds up inside the bottle and then you a big ol' chunk of green cheese. Never happens when I leave it in the pantry. Things like mustard and ketchup have so much vinegar in them that it keeps the spoilage down. Same with mayo - to a point. It also contains eggs. Mayo left out for a little while does not spoil (we're talking a few hours here). It's when it's combined with any other protein, like meat or potato salad with more eggs--that's when it goes bad. Remember the old term "summer complaint"??? It was food poisoning - foods taken outdoors for long family/group picnics and left outdoors for several hours in the heat.

aaroniguana
03-24-2008, 20:31
As cheese goes, I carry 8oz blocks of Dubliner Irish cheddar. It's harder (almost like a block of romano and REAL cheddar, not that orange stuff you buy at Safeway. In a ziplock it's lasted 2 weeks. But it is a stronger cheese than most people are used to so you might not eat as much. Or if you like it as I do you might eat it all at one sitting. :)

Bulldawg
03-24-2008, 20:33
How about canned corned beef? Believe it or not my daughter loves it (I like it pretty good myself). She wants it for supper on our first overnighter later in the spring. Could I open it before we leave the truck and it be OK in ziploc until supper 8 or 10 hours later?

Skidsteer
03-24-2008, 20:42
How about canned corned beef? Believe it or not my daughter loves it (I like it pretty good myself). She wants it for supper on our first overnighter later in the spring. Could I open it before we leave the truck and it be OK in ziploc until supper 8 or 10 hours later?

A better question is does spoiled canned corned beef cause more gastric distress than unspoiled....

Panzer1
03-24-2008, 21:08
as a practical matter most food only needs to last for 3 or 4 days on the trail because after that you will have probably eaten it.

It doesn't really matter to us that eggs can last 8 months. You will have consumed most of your food by your next resupply point.

Panzer

budforester
03-24-2008, 21:50
How about canned corned beef? Believe it or not my daughter loves it (I like it pretty good myself). She wants it for supper on our first overnighter later in the spring. Could I open it before we leave the truck and it be OK in ziploc until supper 8 or 10 hours later?
With cold weather and good sanitation it could work, but would you gain anything that is really worth the risk? And will she think that is acceptable practice?

Appalachian Tater
03-24-2008, 22:13
http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dbmd/diseaseinfo/foodborneinfections_g.htm

What are the most common foodborne diseases? The most commonly recognized foodborne infections are those caused by the bacteria Campylobacter (http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dbmd/diseaseinfo/default.htm#C), Salmonella (http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dbmd/diseaseinfo/default.htm#S), and E. coli O157:H7 (http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dbmd/diseaseinfo/default.htm#E), and by a group of viruses called calicivirus, also known as the Norwalk (http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dvrd/revb/gastro/norovirus.htm) and Norwalk-like viruses.

Campylobacter (http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dbmd/diseaseinfo/default.htm#C) is a bacterial pathogen that causes fever, diarrhea, and abdominal cramps. It is the most commonly identified bacterial cause of diarrheal illness in the world. These bacteria live in the intestines of healthy birds, and most raw poultry meat has Campylobacter on it. Eating undercooked chicken, or other food that has been contaminated with juices dripping from raw chicken is the most frequent source of this infection.

Salmonella (http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dbmd/diseaseinfo/default.htm#S) is also a bacterium that is widespread in the intestines of birds, reptiles and mammals. It can spread to humans via a variety of different foods of animal origin. The illness it causes, salmonellosis, typically includes fever, diarrhea and abdominal cramps. In persons with poor underlying health or weakened immune systems, it can invade the bloodstream and cause life-threatening infections.

E. coli O157:H7 (http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dbmd/diseaseinfo/default.htm#E) is a bacterial pathogen that has a reservoir in cattle and other similar animals. Human illness typically follows consumption of food or water that has been contaminated with microscopic amounts of cow feces. The illness it causes is often a severe and bloody diarrhea and painful abdominal cramps, without much fever. In 3% to 5% of cases, a complication called hemolytic uremic syndrome (HUS) can occur several weeks after the initial symptoms. This severe complication includes temporary anemia, profuse bleeding, and kidney failure.

Calicivirus, or Norwalk-like virus (http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/diseases/submenus/sub_calicivirus.htm) is an extremely common cause of foodborne illness, though it is rarely diagnosed, because the laboratory test is not widely available. It causes an acute gastrointestinal illness, usually with more vomiting than diarrhea, that resolves within two days. Unlike many foodborne pathogens that have animal reservoirs, it is believed that Norwalk-like viruses spread primarily from one infected person to another. Infected kitchen workers can contaminate a salad or sandwich as they prepare it, if they have the virus on their hands. Infected fishermen have contaminated oysters as they harvested them.

Some common diseases are occasionally foodborne, even though they are usually transmitted by other routes. These include infections caused by Shigella (http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dbmd/diseaseinfo/default.htm#S), hepatitis A (http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/diseases/hepatitis/a/index.htm), and the parasites Giardia lamblia (http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dpd/parasites/giardiasis/factsht_giardia.htm) and Cryptosporidia (http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dpd/parasites/cryptosporidiosis/default.htm). Even strep throats have been transmitted occasionally through food.

In addition to disease caused by direct infection, some foodborne diseases are caused by the presence of a toxin in the food that was produced by a microbe in the food. For example, the bacterium Staphylococcus aureus can grow in some foods and produce a toxin that causes intense vomiting. The rare but deadly disease botulism occurs when the bacterium Clostridium botulinum (http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dbmd/diseaseinfo/default.htm#C) grows and produces a powerful paralytic toxin in foods. These toxins can produce illness even if the microbes that produced them are no longer there.
...........

The way that food is handled after it is contaminated can also make a difference in whether or not an outbreak occurs. Many bacterial microbes need to multiply to a larger number before enough are present in food to cause disease. Given warm moist conditions and an ample supply of nutrients, one bacterium that reproduces by dividing itself every half hour can produce 17 million progeny in 12 hours. As a result, lightly contaminated food left out overnight can be highly infectious by the next day. If the food were refrigerated promptly, the bacteria would not multiply at all. In general, refrigeration or freezing prevents virtually all bacteria from growing but generally preserves them in a state of suspended animation. This general rule has a few surprising exceptions. Two foodborne bacteria, Listeria monocytogenes (http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dbmd/diseaseinfo/default.htm#L) and Yersinia enterocolitica (http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dbmd/diseaseinfo/default.htm#Y) can actually grow at refrigerator temperatures. High salt, high sugar or high acid levels keep bacteria from growing, which is why salted meats, jam, and pickled vegetables are traditional preserved foods.

Microbes are killed by heat. If food is heated to an internal temperature above 160oF, or 78oC, for even a few seconds this sufficient to kill parasites, viruses or bacteria, except for the Clostridium (http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dbmd/diseaseinfo/default.htm#C) bacteria, which produce a heat-resistant form called a spore. Clostridium spores are killed only at temperatures above boiling. This is why canned foods must be cooked to a high temperature under pressure as part of the canning process.

The toxins produced by bacteria vary in their sensitivity to heat. The staphylococcal toxin which causes vomiting is not inactivated even if it is boiled. Fortunately, the potent toxin that causes botulism (http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dbmd/diseaseinfo/default.htm#B) is completely inactivated by boiling.

budforester
03-24-2008, 22:30
Yep, Tater, those are most of the nasties. There are a few more bacteria and viruses that cause gastroenteritis; and molds can be troublesome, but usually slower in growth and toxin production. Backcountry is not a good place to be ill... better careful than sorry.

sarbar
03-25-2008, 01:15
You may not have tasted it but it was there. I will not refrigerate the plastic containers of grated parmesan cheese even though they say to. The moisture from being in the 'fridge builds up inside the bottle and then you a big ol' chunk of green cheese. Never happens when I leave it in the pantry.

I agree!! In the pantry (where until a few years ago everyone kept it!) the cheese stays dry in most cases. The moisture in a frig just isn't good for it! Only recently did we start seeing "store in frig after opened" on everything.

I am careful with meat and fresh dairy - but shelf stable cheese? Nope, it is safe to carry it :)

max patch
03-25-2008, 06:43
How about canned corned beef? Believe it or not my daughter loves it (I like it pretty good myself). She wants it for supper on our first overnighter later in the spring. Could I open it before we leave the truck and it be OK in ziploc until supper 8 or 10 hours later?

Just take the can.

kayak karl
03-25-2008, 07:22
What are the most common foodborne diseases?
i have been told (but please correct me if i'm wrong) that u have a better chance of getting sick from poor hygeine (not washing hands or putting your hand in others GROP) and poor sanitation (pot and cup not cleaned). i know from resturant work the rolled edge of pots and trays collected alot of food particles. one reason i will not drink out of a pot with rolled edge.

Cookerhiker
03-25-2008, 08:18
Supposedly flaxmeal needs to be refrigerated but I've carried it and sent it in mail drops where it's been at room temperature or higher for at least a month.

max patch
03-25-2008, 08:47
Supposedly flaxmeal needs to be refrigerated but I've carried it and sent it in mail drops where it's been at room temperature or higher for at least a month.

Just thinking out loud...perhaps it needs to be refrigerated so as to not degrade the omega 3s.

Fiddleback
03-25-2008, 09:41
I agree with kyak karl...note that none of those baddie diseases posted above were caused by the lack of refrigeration. We've all heard the stories about mayonaise...yet mayo isn't refrigerated to begin with. On the other hand, fine cuts of meat, good cheese, and rabbits for stew in France all need to 'age.':D And around this area, the deer and elk hang a very long time before being cut up and put in the freezer.

Refrigeration retards spoilage for a long time but so does effective hygiene. Keep the food sealed from air, keep the insects away from it, don't repeatedly dip dirty untensils and hands into the container...you'll be surprised how long foods will last on the trail. Don't let food needlessly heat up in the sun. In concert with those precautions, schedule the more problematic foods to be eaten first/early in the trip. Thorough cooking does wonders, too.

Still, care is always warranted. The wagon trains put up with that slow travel so that they could carry their refrigerators...:rolleyes:

FB

Cookerhiker
03-25-2008, 10:28
Supposedly flaxmeal needs to be refrigerated but I've carried it and sent it in mail drops where it's been at room temperature or higher for at least a month.


Just thinking out loud...perhaps it needs to be refrigerated so as to not degrade the omega 3s.

That could be. I've also heard that flaxmeal can get rancid w/o refrigeration.

MamaCat
03-25-2008, 10:29
Pepperoni: Pre cut remains good for several days, just becomes a bit oily. Spread a packet of Gulden's Brown Mustard on a pita pocket, then stuff hummel and pre cut pepperoni inside.



This might be a dumb question, but what is hummel ?

Cookerhiker
03-25-2008, 10:42
This might be a dumb question, but what is hummel ?

Hummus?:-?

Lone Wolf
03-25-2008, 10:43
This might be a dumb question, but what is hummel ?

http://www.hummelsatadiscount.com/

envirodiver
03-25-2008, 10:47
LW those Hummels look pretty crunchy

ki0eh
03-25-2008, 11:32
I HAVE seen opened bottles of Hershey, not refrigerated, with MOLD inside the bottle.

The "lite" syrup and the other flavored syrups are considerably less shelf stable (higher water activity) than the old fashioned Hershey's chocolate syrup. Hence the newer types of products are more likely to spoil in storage.

More than likely if it was the old fashioned syrup it was just surface layer mold due to repeated condensation/water buildup as happens with real maple syrup. Probably due to refrigeration. ;)