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View Full Version : is it just me or are trails in the White Mountains (NH) getting more crowded?



DavidNH
08-19-2012, 08:10
I've done several day hikes in the Whites this year. I don't expect to be alone by any means, but I've never seen crowds like this.

Garfield Trail to summit of Mount Garfield. The trail felt like a highway. There were nearly 30 people on the summit. It was a nice summer Saturday.

Ammanoosic Ravine Trail to Lakes of Clouds, the AT to Mt Washington, down via Jewell trail. I think i let someone by ever 5-10 minutes. The hut was full, even at cost of 150$ (!!) per person per night (weekend rate, non AMC member).

I didn't find many folk atop Mount Osceola.. but I went up there early in the summer.

Haven't had the gumption yet to go up Mount Lafayette. Maybe in early September.


So what are your impressions? Are more people out on the trails this year? If so, to me it's a double edged sword. I am happy they are out enjoying the mountains, just wish they didn't all come to the same places I do.


David

HikerMom58
08-19-2012, 08:21
So jealous... I wish I were there. I can see what you are saying tho about the crowds... bittersweet.

jakedatc
08-19-2012, 08:33
You have easily accessed trails, within a few hours of a few major cities, on a weekend. go do Isolation, Tripyramids, Moriah.. something away from the road a bit. or, go on a tuesday.. bet you will have a lot less company.

VT-Mike
08-19-2012, 08:50
Lots of folks around Lonesome Lake last month. Looking across to the ridge with binocs lots of people up there too.

quilteresq
08-19-2012, 10:17
The whole reason for the 4000 footer club is to spread the use among the lesser peaks in the Whites. Still, a lot of folks want to do the big ones. If you want fewer folks and can arrange to hike during the week, it's a lot less crowded. For me, hiking season is just starting up again - haven't been anywhere since May. I avoid summer hiking if I can - I'm sure I'll be miserable in the heat on the trail next year. Spring and fall - just perfect! Fall is better, though, because the bugs are gone.

Deadeye
08-19-2012, 10:50
That's why I do the trailless peaks on weekends, and save the more popular peaks for times when I can get out mid-week. I don't actually expect to be alone on most peaks, but it's more manageable this way.

Bobby
08-19-2012, 10:53
went up Mount Lafayette on Saturday - great day - nice weather. encountered Well over 100 people on the trail (old Bridal Path). Parking was backed onto the highway for this trail head. Everyone is there for the same reason - hard to keep in mind sometimes when proper trail Etiquette is not followed by most of the people out there.
All in all a great day of hiking. I was hiking with my 8 and 9 year old and they flew up and down this trail even with all the human obstacles.

Bobby
08-19-2012, 10:54
didn't mean to bold that part in there!

Pedaling Fool
08-19-2012, 10:56
didn't mean to bold that part in there!
Yeah, I hate when the computer does that :mad:




;)

coach lou
08-19-2012, 10:57
I have not been to the Whites in over 15 years because of the crowds. This is the east coast....you will not escape the crowds no matter where you go.

Driver8
08-19-2012, 11:32
Everyone is there for the same reason - hard to keep in mind sometimes when proper trail Etiquette is not followed by most of the people out there.

Your experience is very different from mine, Bobby. I've found all but a few of the hundreds of hikers I've come across in the Whites to be very polite and respectful, both of fellow hikers and of the often delicate environment in which they tread. The worst I've seen is a few people veering off trail onto the sedge on the Gulfside Trail near Mt. Clay and one surly young guy out with his dad on Father's Day treating me rudely. I'd put the figure at about 99% good, 1% not so good from what I've seen. Maybe you're running into more bad apples than I am, or maybe they're just making a bigger impression on you.

I've done eight hikes in the Whites this spring and summer and found it quiet on May 5 on Moosilauke, somewhat busy on Ammo Ravine Trail on May 12, very, very busy on OBP up Lafayette 5/26 and Tuckerman up W on July 22 and busy up Jewell on June 17. Not busy from Lincoln Woods to campsite on 6/16 nor on Mt. Pemi or to Glen Ellis Falls on 6/16. Wasn't busy on my descents on 5/12, 6/17 or 7/22, the last when I ill-advisedly took the knee-crushing Lion Head trail down instead of Tuckerman's, to my regret, though I lived to tell the tale.

Tuckerman's and the Bridle Path are busy for good reason - they're extraordinarily beautiful trails and have huts en route for respite, food, water, safety, etc. I've told everyone I've spoken with about Tuck's to do it even if they don't like crowds, as the views are incredible and it's a good, safe, though challenging trail. If you want to avoid crowds going up Washington, try Nelson Crag, Boott Spur, Great Gulf or Glen Boulder. Longer and/or harder than the more popular routes, with less water except in the case of Great Gulf. To avoid crowds on Lafayette, go up Skookumchuck or maybe Greenleaf all the way from the Notch, though it will be busy from the hut onward.

MamaBear
08-19-2012, 14:51
There are a lot of hikers out, especially on the more popular and easy to get to trailheads. Of course this is the height of the summer season, too. I hike pretty much at least once a week in the Whites, year round, and off-season, mid-week, there have been times where I've seen either one or two people and once in a while no one else at all. Funny thing is, it is usually the smaller, easier peaks where I've seen no one: Tecumseh, Cannon, Hale, Jackson. I've seen the crowds, too. My son and I counted over 100 cars on Ravine Lodge Road - starting point of many trails to Moosilauke - on Columbus Day weekend last year. There were over 25 when we arrived very early, which validated why I wanted to get out of the house early that day! It is same feeling driving through Franconia Notch on nice weekend with cars lining the sides of the highway because the lots are so full.

At any rate, while there is sometimes more company on the trails than some are comfortable with, it is good that people are getting out of the house, off the couch and out into nature. They might just get hooked like the rest of us and keep on hiking.

hikerboy57
08-19-2012, 15:24
Try the trails n and w of adams and madison.kings ravine,great gully,among a few where youll see very few people till you get to gulfside.franconia ridge has always been crowded,for good reason,its spectacular
but there are plenty of trails left for solitude.i did howker ridge trail last august saw 2people the whole day.

johnnybgood
08-19-2012, 15:27
Caretaker at Greenleaf Hut told me during any given weekend during the summer he estimates upwards to 800 people hike up the Old Bridle/Lafayette trail.

Pedaling Fool
08-19-2012, 15:43
Try the trails n and w of adams and madison.kings ravine,great gully,among a few where youll see very few people till you get to gulfside.franconia ridge has always been crowded,for good reason,its spectacular
but there are plenty of trails left for solitude.i did howker ridge trail last august saw 2people the whole day.This is true, there are tons of trails in the Whites and they are very much off the beaten path. Probably be a good time to explore them when the crowds are out.

Bobby
08-19-2012, 17:32
Your experience is very different from mine, Bobby. I've found all but a few of the hundreds of hikers I've come across in the Whites to be very polite and respectful, both of fellow hikers and of the often delicate environment in which they tread. The worst I've seen is a few people veering off trail onto the sedge on the Gulfside Trail near Mt. Clay and one surly young guy out with his dad on Father's Day treating me rudely. I'd put the figure at about 99% good, 1% not so good from what I've seen. Maybe you're running into more bad apples than I am, or maybe they're just making a bigger impression on you.

I've done eight hikes in the Whites this spring and summer and found it quiet on May 5 on Moosilauke, somewhat busy on Ammo Ravine Trail on May 12, very, very busy on OBP up Lafayette 5/26 and Tuckerman up W on July 22 and busy up Jewell on June 17. Not busy from Lincoln Woods to campsite on 6/16 nor on Mt. Pemi or to Glen Ellis Falls on 6/16. Wasn't busy on my descents on 5/12, 6/17 or 7/22, the last when I ill-advisedly took the knee-crushing Lion Head trail down instead of Tuckerman's, to my regret, though I lived to tell the tale.

Tuckerman's and the Bridle Path are busy for good reason - they're extraordinarily beautiful trails and have huts en route for respite, food, water, safety, etc. I've told everyone I've spoken with about Tuck's to do it even if they don't like crowds, as the views are incredible and it's a good, safe, though challenging trail. If you want to avoid crowds going up Washington, try Nelson Crag, Boott Spur, Great Gulf or Glen Boulder. Longer and/or harder than the more popular routes, with less water except in the case of Great Gulf. To avoid crowds on Lafayette, go up Skookumchuck or maybe Greenleaf all the way from the Notch, though it will be busy from the hut onward.


didn't mean social skills and normal public politeness. Referring to simple trail common sense. If you are moving slow and there are faster hikers behind you - move over. Don't take a break and block the trail. Moving up hill has the right of way - unless special circumstances apply. Don't be really loud and disturb others. Stuff like that. Everyone is pretty much friendly - just a little clueless about how to hike with a bunch of other people on the same narrow trail. It's kind of like using a bike path with a bunch of people that don't follow the established norms for proper use with others. Not rude - just clueless.

Just take a deep breath, say excuse me and keep hiking....

Driver8
08-19-2012, 20:16
didn't mean social skills and normal public politeness. Referring to simple trail common sense. If you are moving slow and there are faster hikers behind you - move over. Don't take a break and block the trail. Moving up hill has the right of way - unless special circumstances apply. Don't be really loud and disturb others. Stuff like that. Everyone is pretty much friendly - just a little clueless about how to hike with a bunch of other people on the same narrow trail. It's kind of like using a bike path with a bunch of people that don't follow the established norms for proper use with others. Not rude - just clueless.

I'm taking those issues all into account, Bobby, and I reported in my prior post the very few issues I've encountered this year in the Whites. Yielding right of way, whether descending or ascending, is common sense. I've let many descenders pass me thoughtI had the right of way in order to catch my breath - a nod or a wave gets the job done.

As to yielding to faster hikers passing in same direction, I always do and have had little problem with passing others and their yielding. Maybe, I don't know, but possibly you're a bit impatient or rush people? Maybe not, not saying one way or the other. But if you're in a rush, does it bother you if there's even the slightest delay in someone's letting you pass? If so, you might could do to be more patient. Wouldn't be much fun to go around the world with some chip on your shoulder that all these slow pokes, lesser mortals one and all, just won't get out of your way or off your trail. Personally, I'm too busy taking in the views and breathing the fresh air. Just sayin'. ...

Papa D
08-19-2012, 20:23
I just hiked nearly the whole range last month - US4 in VT to Pinkham Notch, NH - - the only place there were "crowds" were around Mt. Madison and Mt. Washington which were to be expected - trail was moderately populated - did see a few people with the hallmarks of being a newbie but no one that wasn't polite, etc.

Bobby
08-19-2012, 21:21
I'm taking those issues all into account, Bobby, and I reported in my prior post the very few issues I've encountered this year in the Whites. Yielding right of way, whether descending or ascending, is common sense. I've let many descenders pass me thoughtI had the right of way in order to catch my breath - a nod or a wave gets the job done.

As to yielding to faster hikers passing in same direction, I always do and have had little problem with passing others and their yielding. Maybe, I don't know, but possibly you're a bit impatient or rush people? Maybe not, not saying one way or the other. But if you're in a rush, does it bother you if there's even the slightest delay in someone's letting you pass? If so, you might could do to be more patient. Wouldn't be much fun to go around the world with some chip on your shoulder that all these slow pokes, lesser mortals one and all, just won't get out of your way or off your trail. Personally, I'm too busy taking in the views and breathing the fresh air. Just sayin'. ...

How does 5 to 10 minutes trying hard not to walk into the person in front of you sound?

no chip dude

just an observation regarding hiking conditions in these extremely crowded areas


I don't think I've ever experienced a stretch of trail as crowded as I did this weekend and I hike Monadnock at least twice a year.


Seems common sense would dictate these trails would be crowded on a nice summer weekend, but I was not expecting anything like I saw.

Tinker
08-19-2012, 21:50
Lots of folks around Lonesome Lake last month. Looking across to the ridge with binocs lots of people up there too.

It's a very popular day hike for beginners and folks with young children.

For less traffic, if you want to climb Washington, use the Dry River Trail. Beware, though, the river becomes VERY wet in heavy rains.

Driver8
08-20-2012, 06:06
How does 5 to 10 minutes trying hard not to walk into the person in front of you sound?

And this happened once? 20 times? I'm betting once. Which would stink, though I find it hard to see how you couldn't have gotten past this/these rude slowpoke/s. You gave the impression that a large number, maybe even most, of your fellow hikers in the Whites were badly behaved. I responded b/c I found that very unlikely.

Bobby
08-20-2012, 08:05
And this happened once? 20 times? I'm betting once. Which would stink, though I find it hard to see how you couldn't have gotten past this/these rude slowpoke/s. You gave the impression that a large number, maybe even most, of your fellow hikers in the Whites were badly behaved. I responded b/c I found that very unlikely.

"Everyone is there for the same reason - hard to keep in mind sometimes when proper trail Etiquette is not followed by most of the people out there."


you seem to be fixated on the idea of "people behaving badly". I would not use that characterization. I simply said "trail etiquette" - which to me is something that comes with experience or mostly just common sense I guess. I also indicated that I understood we were all "there for the same reason" - commenting that it required patience on occasions.

Perhaps most is an over statement - I'll change that to a lot - more than I have experienced before.

My comment appears to have bothered you some how. why are you so hung up on it?

oh yeah.....
twice and it's a long story

DavidNH
08-20-2012, 17:22
Caretaker at Greenleaf Hut told me during any given weekend during the summer he estimates upwards to 800 people hike up the Old Bridle/Lafayette trail.

That's ridiculous! It's crowds like that (800 people hiking to or past Greenleaf hut each summer weekend) that are starting to turn me off from the whites. But where else but Whites can I go within a two hour drive? (I'm in Concord, NH).

hikerboy57
08-20-2012, 18:10
Youve got about 50 trails all around you that you can find solitude.there were about 40 people atop katahdin the day i summited,baxter was packed and i was never alone in the 100 mile wilderness except for the half hour I spent waiting for the boat at white horse landing. it's august it's the busy season and the popular trails are crowded. but there's plenty of trails to hike if you want to be alone right in your backyard.

Deadeye
08-20-2012, 20:34
There's a bit of irony that we're commenting on the crowds on the trails that we're hiking, no? There's lots of solitude to be found if you decide that panoramic views are not important to you. Take the long way up, or the trail up the backside, and you'll rarely see people except at the summits. Even better, avoid summits, and you'll find you have a lot of trail to yourself.

Driver8
08-20-2012, 21:52
There's a bit of irony that we're commenting on the crowds on the trails that we're hiking, no? There's lots of solitude to be found if you decide that panoramic views are not important to you. Take the long way up, or the trail up the backside, and you'll rarely see people except at the summits. Even better, avoid summits, and you'll find you have a lot of trail to yourself.

I like people and enjoy seeing them on the trails. I also love the long views, the smell of spruce and fir below treeline, the strong, clear-running streams, the waterfalls. The Whites work well for me. After a while I'll want to do Maine (already getting that itch) and the Adirondacks (probably next year). But loving the Whites when I can get to them.

Chaco Taco
08-20-2012, 21:56
I have noticed the crowds are insane. I also find that when we do hike, the earlier you get out the better. Not just fro parking but for overall enjoyment of the trails. With the shuttles running, it makes it crazier. Parking lots have been just stupid as well.
I also noticed that its obviously busier on weekends. The Pemi, especially the Bondcliff Trail isnt as heavily travelled but once you get to Guyot, its a s*** show. This was one of the reasons we decided to go into Maine, off of the AT, for Labor Day. The trash and disposal of human waste has been of major concern as well. People are just being irresponsible when it comes to trash and waste.

DavidNH
08-21-2012, 08:46
There's a bit of irony that we're commenting on the crowds on the trails that we're hiking, no? There's lots of solitude to be found if you decide that panoramic views are not important to you. Take the long way up, or the trail up the backside, and you'll rarely see people except at the summits. Even better, avoid summits, and you'll find you have a lot of trail to yourself.


But panoramic views ARE important to me. The views are why I go to the whites. Heck, if I didn't care about views.. I could just drive 20 minutes to Bear Brook State Park or go outside of Keene, or parts of southern VT or Mass. Views are one of the big reasons TO hike!

IrishBASTARD
08-21-2012, 09:26
But panoramic views ARE important to me. The views are why I go to the whites. Heck, if I didn't care about views.. I could just drive 20 minutes to Bear Brook State Park or go outside of Keene, or parts of southern VT or Mass. Views are one of the big reasons TO hike! PERHAPS the views are why others hike to. ALL too many people consider because its in someone's state its your own personal...playground. WE ALL PAY TAXES to up keep these areas of natural wonder and beauty. NOT a single state pays all its own costs...its impossible and would crush that State. But perhaps suggest we allow everyone who cannot afford such luxuries be damned to Hell...for shame you bothering a Nh resident. The trails are for ALL HIKERS regardless if they are in your way or not.

Driver8
08-21-2012, 09:36
The trash and disposal of human waste has been of major concern as well. People are just being irresponsible when it comes to trash and waste.

This is a big frustration for me. Hiking through beautiful terrain and seeing drink containers, candy wrappers, etc., alongside the trail is awful. The adage about one bad apple spoiling a barrel applies here - I'm sure only a small percentage of hikers litters, as only a small percentage tramples tundra flora off trail, but it only takes a few. The thing is, the perps, as to littering, almost never do it when someone is watching. I pick stuff up a lot, but it's impossible for one person to pick it all up and keep in the enjoyment of the hike. ...

Chaco Taco
08-21-2012, 11:56
This is a big frustration for me. Hiking through beautiful terrain and seeing drink containers, candy wrappers, etc., alongside the trail is awful. The adage about one bad apple spoiling a barrel applies here - I'm sure only a small percentage of hikers litters, as only a small percentage tramples tundra flora off trail, but it only takes a few. The thing is, the perps, as to littering, almost never do it when someone is watching. I pick stuff up a lot, but it's impossible for one person to pick it all up and keep in the enjoyment of the hike. ...
This was a huge frustration when I spent over an hour trying to wash off human feces off my montrails then cleaning it off of the tent platform when I tracked it across. Its been a dirty summer in The Whites. I will say that I have seen alot more hikers calling out people in parking lots and on trails for flicking cigarette butts and dropping trash and burning trash

Tom Murphy
08-21-2012, 13:00
That's ridiculous! It's crowds like that (800 people hiking to or past Greenleaf hut each summer weekend) that are starting to turn me off from the whites. But where else but Whites can I go within a two hour drive? (I'm in Concord, NH).

2 hours ~ 120 miles, so

Sandwich Range
Carter-Moriah Range
Kinsman Range
Kilkenny Range

Driver8
08-21-2012, 13:04
This was a huge frustration when I spent over an hour trying to wash off human feces off my montrails then cleaning it off of the tent platform when I tracked it across. Its been a dirty summer in The Whites. I will say that I have seen alot more hikers calling out people in parking lots and on trails for flicking cigarette butts and dropping trash and burning trash

Ack. Disgusting in the extreme. Sorry you had to endure that, Choc.

Deadeye
08-21-2012, 13:16
But panoramic views ARE important to me. The views are why I go to the whites. Heck, if I didn't care about views.. I could just drive 20 minutes to Bear Brook State Park or go outside of Keene, or parts of southern VT or Mass. Views are one of the big reasons TO hike!

Well then, young Skywalker, deal with the crowds you must! But do take the road less traveled by, it will make all the difference.

Chaco Taco
08-21-2012, 15:40
Ack. Disgusting in the extreme. Sorry you had to endure that, Choc.
The good thing about all of it was that afterward, went down to the pond and listened to the 2 loons in the middle of the pond. Such a beautiful place that seems to take a beating. The shelter needs to go and people just need to learn. Thoreau Falls is a great place to stop. If you are responsible and can just be considerate of the various regs and guidelines, some that arent written, it would remain that way. Wak and I are pretty good about picking up trash but some of the stuff you see when its as busy as it has been and as busy as its about to get with the foliage, baffles me. I definitely am not trying to self righteous about it or anything. The part that always baffles me is seeing the parents setting the examples for their kids when it comes to respecting nature and the outdoors. The busier it gets up here the more it makes me want to just go out into the middle of Maine. I was out memorial weekend and was so glad it rained as much as it did because it stopped the massive flood of people. We drove through the notch 2 weeks ago and the highway was lined with cars. Lincoln and North Woodstock have been pretty busy. That area needs it with warm wintah.

Chaco Taco
08-21-2012, 15:45
Well then, young Skywalker, deal with the crowds you must! But do take the road less traveled by, it will make all the difference.

I agree with both of you. There are some sweet spots that are off the beaten path and not overpopulated by the tourons. Just know the traffic on the major ridges. I live about 10 mins from Bear Brook and their are some great trails and a great campground. I really like the forests up here. The way the trails crawl through some of the wildernesses of Maine and Vermont are beautiful, NH also. Im so glad I moved up here. I love friggin New England

Driver8
08-21-2012, 15:47
The good thing about all of it was that afterward, went down to the pond and listened to the 2 loons in the middle of the pond. Such a beautiful place that seems to take a beating.

I think we might need a new public relations campaign, one less positive and more focussed on shaming bad behavior. Not "give a hoot, don't pollute." More "losers litter." Scorn and shame have been shown to be very effective in stopping bad behavior of this sort.

Chaco Taco
08-21-2012, 16:02
I think we might need a new public relations campaign, one less positive and more focussed on shaming bad behavior. Not "give a hoot, don't pollute." More "losers litter." Scorn and shame have been shown to be very effective in stopping bad behavior of this sort.
Most of the time people are really good. Its the few jerk holes that just dont give a damn. I feel like the AMC does a pretty good job with it. The caretakers are always good about keeping the order and the experienced backpackers in the bunch always step it up. Have only really seen one incident up here where a guy hassled a caretaker when the caretaker called him out on leaving foil packs and fuel canisters in the shelter and trying to hike out without it.

Tom Murphy
08-21-2012, 16:09
There are some sweet spots that are off the beaten path and not overpopulated by the tourons. Just know the traffic on the major ridges.

So is it the crowds that bother you OR a few inconsiderate hikers OR both?

I find that having no expectations of solitude while hiking on any of the trails in the WMNF makes my trips more enjoyable.

That way, on those few times when I only see a few people [or none], I feel a special blessing.

Chaco Taco
08-21-2012, 16:18
So is it the crowds that bother you OR a few inconsiderate hikers OR both?

I find that having no expectations of solitude while hiking on any of the trails in the WMNF makes my trips more enjoyable.

That way, on those few times when I only see a few people [or none], I feel a special blessing.

I stopped with expectations a long time ago. I typically am the last person to set up camp and the first one out. I think the solitude is there, but on some the lesser travelled trails. The campsites and shelters are where the crowds are and I have managed to meet some cool folks that have told me some of the good private spots to stealth, legally. I dont really mind the crowds. I think its awesome to see so many people getting out on the trails. Especially families. But I have noticed that the crowds are larger this year as opposed to last year. We are going to go up into Maine next weekend and check out the Grafton Loop Trail. Pretty excitted!

hikerboy57
08-21-2012, 16:31
Did graftoon loop last year-beautiful.please dont tell everyone.

hikerboy57
08-21-2012, 16:34
By the way the 100 mile wilderness was a lot more crowded than i expected.damn all these nature lovers.

Chaco Taco
08-21-2012, 16:40
Did graftoon loop last year-beautiful.please dont tell everyone.
Saw pictures from someone that did it last week and Im impressed. Its Maine, of course its going to be awesome.

johnnybgood
08-21-2012, 16:58
Did graftoon loop last year-beautiful.please dont tell everyone.

Is this the loop hike at Grafton Notch State Park ?

kofritz
08-21-2012, 17:03
good info on this thread. i have yet to see the Whites but will soon. i've learned midweek may be best time to go

hikerboy57
08-21-2012, 17:14
Is this the loop hike at Grafton Notch State Park ?

Yessaw only 3 others on the eastern leg,4 more on the west leg and 4 nobos taking a break before climbing down and up to baldpate
.took 5 days.

Chaco Taco
08-21-2012, 17:17
Is this the loop hike at Grafton Notch State Park ?
Yep, the AT runs a couple of miles just north of Speck Pond and the Baldpates. 26 runs right across it twice. The MATC and the AMC worked together to make it look nice. Look on VFTT for the pics, great looking trail.

Chaco Taco
08-21-2012, 17:18
good info on this thread. i have yet to see the Whites but will soon. i've learned midweek may be best time to go
yes, espcially after school starts. Lots of college kids on the weekends

hikerboy57
08-21-2012, 17:25
Yep, the AT runs a couple of miles just north of Speck Pond and the Baldpates. 26 runs right across it twice. The MATC and the AMC worked together to make it look nice. Look on VFTT for the pics, great looking trail.
there are pictures in my gallery too.

Chaco Taco
08-21-2012, 17:48
there are pictures in my gallery too.
yea just spent the last 15 lookin at em. Very nice

Tinker
08-22-2012, 03:37
I just recieved a message that the Dry River Trail, which I recommended as a less traveled way up Mt. Washington, is in disrepair after tropical storm Irene last year. The upper part of the trail is supposed to be clear, but the lower part supposedly has a bunch of blowdowns (and flood debris, I assume). When I hiked it three or four years ago, the bridge was barricaded due to damage, but it was passable and an enjoyable hike.

Chaco Taco
08-22-2012, 07:02
I just recieved a message that the Dry River Trail, which I recommended as a less traveled way up Mt. Washington, is in disrepair after tropical storm Irene last year. The upper part of the trail is supposed to be clear, but the lower part supposedly has a bunch of blowdowns (and flood debris, I assume). When I hiked it three or four years ago, the bridge was barricaded due to damage, but it was passable and an enjoyable hike.
The Wild River Trail/ Wilderness seems to take a beating alot as well with little maintaining on it.

peakbagger
08-22-2012, 08:08
The Wild river area is experiencing what happens when an area is declared "wilderness", typically there is an uptick in activity due to the designation. The trails got trashed by Tropical Storm Irene and unfortunately wilderness standards limits the type of maintenance and repairs that can be done. My understanding is once you get into the area, the trails are in less bad shape but signage and blazing is going to be substantially reduced in the future so real live land navigation skills may need to be used.

Chaco Taco
08-22-2012, 08:38
The Wild river area is experiencing what happens when an area is declared "wilderness", typically there is an uptick in activity due to the designation. The trails got trashed by Tropical Storm Irene and unfortunately wilderness standards limits the type of maintenance and repairs that can be done. My understanding is once you get into the area, the trails are in less bad shape but signage and blazing is going to be substantially reduced in the future so real live land navigation skills may need to be used.
That sounds great actually. Those trails intrigue me on teh map and looking out from The Carters are inviting because of the remoteness.

Chaco Taco
08-22-2012, 08:41
and a note on Davids OP, I have been calling and looking online at some of the State Parks here in NH the last hour and they are all FULL. Tripoli Road is always full.

DavidNH
08-22-2012, 08:54
I have done the Grafton Loop Trail back in 2007 Labor Day weekend. practically deserted and beautiful. Helps that the weather was picture perfect. Back in the Whites .. Many of the trails have become pedestrian highways (Ammanoosic and Crawford Trails on Mt Washington, Falling waters to haystack and Lafayette then down via Greenleaf, even Glencliff (the AT) up Moosilaukee. I am particularly surprised at how the huts are all still full in peak season despite the exorbitant prices now charged. I've never been to the Wild River Wilderness, maybe I should look into that.

I've been wanting for sometime to do a trip to Mount Davis.. but it's no less than six miles each way (book time) and the resolution shelter is now closed. I am not a fast hiker so not sure How I can pull this off. Any ideas anyone short of getting an alpine start?

Chaco Taco
08-22-2012, 09:01
I have done the Grafton Loop Trail back in 2007 Labor Day weekend. practically deserted and beautiful. Helps that the weather was picture perfect. Back in the Whites .. Many of the trails have become pedestrian highways (Ammanoosic and Crawford Trails on Mt Washington, Falling waters to haystack and Lafayette then down via Greenleaf, even Glencliff (the AT) up Moosilaukee. I am particularly surprised at how the huts are all still full in peak season despite the exorbitant prices now charged. I've never been to the Wild River Wilderness, maybe I should look into that.

I've been wanting for sometime to do a trip to Mount Davis.. but it's no less than six miles each way (book time) and the resolution shelter is now closed. I am not a fast hiker so not sure How I can pull this off. Any ideas anyone short of getting an alpine start?
Im actually looking at my WMNF maps right now and trying to look at an overnite not too far, this saturday.

Pedaling Fool
08-22-2012, 09:23
By the way the 100 mile wilderness was a lot more crowded than i expected.damn all these nature lovers. I went through there in '81 and it was empty, then again, about the same time of year in 2006 and couldn't believe the numbers of people. They have a parking lot near Gulf Hagas and I remember seeing tons of people coming from that direction and it reminded me of a documentary I watched of the crash of United Airlines Flight 232 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Airlines_Flight_232

I remember during that documentary that a witness said he couldn't believe his eyes when he saw all these people (survivors) walking out of the cornfield -- it was very surreal. I just thought of that account when I saw all those people. So much for the 100-mile wilderness.

hikerboy57
08-22-2012, 13:20
I went through there in '81 and it was empty, then again, about the same time of year in 2006 and couldn't believe the numbers of people. They have a parking lot near Gulf Hagas and I remember seeing tons of people coming from that direction and it reminded me of a documentary I watched of the crash of United Airlines Flight 232 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Airlines_Flight_232

I remember during that documentary that a witness said he couldn't believe his eyes when he saw all these people (survivors) walking out of the cornfield -- it was very surreal. I just thought of that account when I saw all those people. So much for the 100-mile wilderness.
every site was full from K to monson

Chaco Taco
08-22-2012, 13:34
I think we will go to Zealand and do the AZ to Ethan Pond Loop on Saturday and Sunday. Id like to go back to Thoreau Falls again. Great waterfall and awesome places to pitch. Its not as far of a drive for us. I feel like the trail is easier than most of the stuff in The Whites. It will help gets us ready for Maine!

hikerboy57
08-22-2012, 13:35
i dont remember the shelter, but one day i arrived to find 3 couples out of an ll bean catalog who had commandeered the shelter. i asked one of the guys where the water source was, he pointed it out to me and offered if i wanted to use his bucket!! i declined the offer, and went about my business.later me mandela and terracotta made a campfire, cooked sang talked. at around 8:30 ,not even dark yet, a ladys voice yells from the shelter"are you guys going to be very long, cause we have a long day ahead tomorrow."im thinking ive got about 20 more long days, the sobos i was with have about 100 more long days, and shes worried about the 5 hour hike back to their car.in any eent we were aslppe by 9 anyway. in the am they packed up their tennis rackets and golf shoes and hiked out.

Tom Murphy
08-24-2012, 13:16
i dont remember the shelter, but one day i arrived to find 3 couples out of an ll bean catalog who had commandeered the shelter. i asked one of the guys where the water source was, he pointed it out to me and offered if i wanted to use his bucket!! i declined the offer, and went about my business.later me mandela and terracotta made a campfire, cooked sang talked. at around 8:30 ,not even dark yet, a ladys voice yells from the shelter"are you guys going to be very long, cause we have a long day ahead tomorrow."im thinking ive got about 20 more long days, the sobos i was with have about 100 more long days, and shes worried about the 5 hour hike back to their car.in any eent we were aslppe by 9 anyway. in the am they packed up their tennis rackets and golf shoes and hiked out.

Not sure what the point of this story is.

People on short 1-2 night trips bring more with them than long distance hikers? yup

A long distance hikers idea of what a long day is different than a weekend backpacker? yup

Some people like to go to bed eariler than others? yup

When staying at a shelter you need to be deal with people who are different than you? yup

Using a bucket to fetch water is not accpetable if you want o be considered a real hiker? nope

hikerboy57
08-24-2012, 16:58
Tom the only point was the 100 mile wilderness is a lot more accessible than it sounds. it was just funny that's cool

Rain Man
08-26-2012, 10:53
good info on this thread. i have yet to see the Whites but will soon. i've learned midweek may be best time to go

I just returned from the Whites and we had BEAUTIFUL weather and frankly, I expected MORE crowds. Spent almost an hour on Mt. Garfield soaking up sunshine and saw only four people. Haystack, Lincoln, Lafayette, Moosilauke, Washington, ... none of them were "packed" with people, though I did realized when it was a Saturday. Definitely more friendly faces than weekdays.

What's odd to me is anyone going on the Appalachian Trail anywhere on a beautiful weekend, and then whining about other people being there too.

Rain:sunMan

.

HikerMom58
08-26-2012, 11:57
I just returned from the Whites and we had BEAUTIFUL weather and frankly, I expected MORE crowds. Spent almost an hour on Mt. Garfield soaking up sunshine and saw only four people. Haystack, Lincoln, Lafayette, Moosilauke, Washington, ... none of them were "packed" with people, though I did realized when it was a Saturday. Definitely more friendly faces than weekdays.

What's odd to me is anyone going on the Appalachian Trail anywhere on a beautiful weekend, and then whining about other people being there too.

Rain:sunMan

.


I'm glad you had such good weather in the Whites. The weather can really make or break the experience up there, I've heard. Thanks for sharing!

This way of communicating is not the best, IMHO. I love the fact that we can instantly hear about your experience on the trail. We are so happy to receive this information so quickly. But, there's a downside to everyone communicating like this. So much gets lost AND it's so easy to just say things without really thinking through your thoughts and how you are coming across.... I don't think he the OP was whining about other people enjoying what he was enjoying, himself. I think he was honestly expressing his feelings about what he experienced, at the time. I'm happy to hear how you felt about your trip and I appreciated hearing about the OP's experience, as well. Everyone is allowed to feel what they feel... feeling are not right or wrong.

It's all good, thanks again for sharing, Rain man!!

Chaco Taco
08-27-2012, 18:15
I think the rain on Saturday lured people to others places. There were about 10 people at Ethan Pond, nice bunch. Lots leaving outta Zealand and Crawford on Sunday. Saw a mess of people coming up. The Willeys were crowded as well as the AZ. The thrus all headed to stealth at Crawford or go into Gorham.

jakedatc
08-27-2012, 21:08
Osceolas parking lot was packed saturday, pretty spread out on the trail.. saw some people but not that many, main summit was busy but quiet, trail to East "summit" had a few people. Parking lot was almost empty when we got back down. 1 thunder might have scared would be E. summit'ers away, ended up with only a few sprinkles of rain.

Monday I did a loop of sorts from the Basin over the Kinsmans then back up to Cannon and down past Lonesome Lake Hut. didn't see anyone until a AT nobo at the S kinsman summit. few groups on the Cannon tower and at Lonesome Lake. Bunch of day hikers down at the Basin but what do you expect 1/4mi from rt 93.

so psyched to be back in the Whites

Del Q
08-28-2012, 06:12
I will be there in early October, peak leaf season................will be curious how crowded it will be.

Chaco Taco
08-28-2012, 07:37
I just returned from the Whites and we had BEAUTIFUL weather and frankly, I expected MORE crowds. Spent almost an hour on Mt. Garfield soaking up sunshine and saw only four people. Haystack, Lincoln, Lafayette, Moosilauke, Washington, ... none of them were "packed" with people, though I did realized when it was a Saturday. Definitely more friendly faces than weekdays.

What's odd to me is anyone going on the Appalachian Trail anywhere on a beautiful weekend, and then whining about other people being there too.

Rain:sunMan

.

I knew youd love it up here. Glad you had fun and look forward to your pictures

and this "etiquette" you speak of on this thread. What do you mean specifically? Im just curious because I find chowderheads to have more "etiquette" than southern hikers

And DELQ, if you really want to avoid crowds up here and get some alone time on the trail in The Whites, get up here early and start hiking. We are always out of camp by 6:30-7am and have the trail to ourselves til about lunchtime.