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View Full Version : How Difficulty is Mt. Mooseilauke in Comparison to the rest of the Whites?



HighLiner
09-17-2012, 11:04
I just completed a section hike that ended by climbing Mt. Moosilauke from South to North. As expected, the climb was hard, the toughest I have done. For those who have completed the Whites how does this climb/descent compare to what's ahead? Thanks.

Tom Murphy
09-17-2012, 11:18
Mt. Mooseilauke is typical of the ascents/descents in the Whites.

So you have Kinsman, Liberty, Lafayette, South Twin, Webster, Wildcat, Great Gulf, Carter Notch, Moriah ahead of you. I think they are all in the same general neighborhood.

I think you stopped this section at a good spot. Now you know what to expect for the rest of New Hampshire.

Tom Murphy
09-17-2012, 11:21
Slightly Out of Order

Kinsman, Liberty, Lafayette, South Twin, Webster, Great Gulf, Wildcat, Carter Notch, Moriah

The climb out of the col on the south side of Garfield always feels tough to me too.

10-K
09-17-2012, 11:30
The Whites are just a place where you have to accept that every day is going to be hard and that, this too shall pass.

hikerboy57
09-17-2012, 11:38
Franconia notch nobo thruu the twins is probably the single most difficult stretch.
it's also the most spectacular.

swjohnsey
09-17-2012, 11:53
The Moosilauke decent was one of the hardest for me.

jeffmeh
09-17-2012, 12:09
The Moosilauke decent was one of the hardest for me.

Yes, the Glencliff Trail (S-N) is a cake walk relative to the Beaver Brook Trail (N-S). Beaver Brook is among the toughest trails in the Whites, and I would much rather ascend it than descend it, particular if it is at all wet. If the OP did the Glencliff Trail and descended the same way, then that is about average terrain for the Whites.

tdoczi
09-17-2012, 12:33
in my mind the whites do not start in glencliff. they start ON TOP of moosilauke, if walking northbound. from the top of moosilauke down to kinsman notch is the first stretch that feels like the whites. the hike on the glencliff side of the mountain is very easy by comparison.

rustmd
09-17-2012, 12:52
NOBO, descent of Moosilaukee was tough, glad to have all those wood steps and that rebar! still, it was fun once it was over. the other section i thought was very challenging, scary even was the ascent of S. Kinsman. . .wow, the trail gets steeper and more narrow then POP, you're up & over the top, great views! i had great weather (july) when i did the NH section, it was a blast!

.com

Cookerhiker
09-17-2012, 14:08
The Moosilauke descent was one of the hardest for me.


in my mind the whites do not start in glencliff. they start ON TOP of moosilauke, if walking northbound. from the top of moosilauke down to kinsman notch is the first stretch that feels like the whites. the hike on the glencliff side of the mountain is very easy by comparison.


NOBO, descent of Moosilaukee was tough, glad to have all those wood steps and that rebar! still, it was fun once it was over...

Agree with all of this. As a section hiker, I did Moosilauke SOBO and was glad I did. I also thought how treacherous a NOBO descent would be in wet conditions.

Cookerhiker
09-17-2012, 14:10
I just completed a section hike that ended by climbing Mt. Moosilauke from South to North. As expected, the climb was hard, the toughest I have done. For those who have completed the Whites how does this climb/descent compare to what's ahead? Thanks.

I realize you only asked about the Whites but be advised that many of the ups & downs in Maine are equally (or more) difficult than the Whites - at least through the NOBO descent from Avery Peak into Safford Notch.

HighLiner
09-17-2012, 20:23
All the comments have been good. I figured I will deal with Maine when I get to it....as you know section hiking is a journey over several years. I'm getting close! Thanks.

Del Q
09-17-2012, 20:33
As a section hiker (Damascus to Franconia Notch - short of 100 miles in VT skipped last year due to the Green Mountains being closed / Hurricane Irene), to me the Whites began at Moosilauke. Game changer for sure.

In 10 days back to complete VT and pick up at Franconia Notch. Really looking forward to the Fall and being back on the AT.

The maps and mileage cannot accurately illustrate NH or Maine.

The AT is tough.............NH North of Moosilauke and Maine define Tough +

swjohnsey
09-17-2012, 20:40
IMHO the first couple of days in the 100 mile wilderness are worse than the Whites.

Papa D
09-17-2012, 21:53
Moosilauke is a legit hike - - the main body of the whites are pretty similar in terms of ascent difficulty - Franconia and the Presidents are a little more sustained but the vertical gain is about the same. I think that I remember climbing Webster Cliffs was pretty straight up - not sure that was mentioned in earlier posts

jakedatc
09-17-2012, 23:45
I get confused with which way I do different trails when they coexist with the AT...so it's hard to judge what mountains compare to what. The whites are the whites. You get used to it

dropping from Wildcats to Carter hut is tough, going up South twin is steep but rock stairs, the downs off some of the Presi's are tough rock hopping.

as part of my weekend loop, today i did Zeacliff Trail.. 1.4mi 1500ft in 1.3mi down.. then just to mess with you .1mi similar steepness UP to the Ethan Allen trail. harder than Moosilauke by far.

7 more 4k's left to do in NH

Prime Time
09-18-2012, 08:50
Moosilauke up from Glencliff is the first climb in the Whites NOBO and gains a respectable amount of elevation, but it is easily graded and the footing is pretty good. Actually most of the AT through the Whites is somewhat moderate for the region. If you want a good tough climb, try Huntington Ravine, Six Husbands, upper Great Gulf, or Sphinx trails. Huntington is the closest thing you can do to technical rock climbing and still be on an actual trail! When you get to the Whites, you just have to slow down, watch your foot placement carefully, and STOP to enjoy the many incredible views. This should be the best part of the hike for you, but only if you take it easy and be extra cautious.

MamaBear
09-18-2012, 09:08
Agreed, Glencliff is about average for the Whites, Beaver Brook is harder both ascending or descending but a good example of the steepness and roughness found elsewhere in the Whites. There certainly is some tougher stuff, no one mentioned ascending Wildcat Ridge Trail from Rt. 16, Pinkham Notch.

jakedatc
09-18-2012, 09:18
There certainly is some tougher stuff, no one mentioned ascending Wildcat Ridge Trail from Rt. 16, Pinkham Notch.

has a few spots for sure. i actually find it easier when you can grab on with your hands rather than a gradual sloggy calf burner.

PJWetzel
09-18-2012, 12:37
http://www.everytrail.com/view_trip.php?trip_id=1676412

As with every piece of the AT, I hiked Moosilauke both ways the same day, Glenclff to Kinsman Notch and then back. I loved it, particularly Beaver Brook Trail, because I'm a waterfall lover, and the trail gets 'up close and personal' with cascade after cascade. Still, that climb is one of the tougher ones in the Whites, partly simply because of how much elevation change there is with sustained rock scrambling.

The one feature common in the Whites that this particular stretch does not have is what I call 'dead zone' trail, where there is a solid slab of steep bedrock (slippery sometimes even when dry) where the only way to get up or down is to cling to the vegetation at the edges and trample the roots there, thus gradually killing back that vegetation you're depending on and widening the 'dead zone' of unclimbable steep bedrock slab with no ladders or metal holds emplaced to end this ongoing destruction. This is by far the most annoying type of trail I encountered in the Whites, and to me toughness equates to my mental state as much as physical - so if I'm annoyed, I think it's tough.

jakedatc
09-18-2012, 12:59
go hike the northern section of the Long Trail if you want slippery rock even when dry. then come back to the Whites and you'll feel like spiderman. my background in rock climbing certainly helps with route selection and climbing ability but I have not been stumped by too many rocks in the Whites. I think they choose where they put ladders fairly carefully and it should be done with care. I think hiker skill should improve not dumb down the trail to the lowest denominator. There are plenty of "easy" trails without ruining the tough ones.

had to down climb this section yesterday. was a body length tall to the rail at the bottom with nice holds on top but had to down mantle to get my feet to the bottom.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v115/Socjake/Hiking/IMG_0586.jpg (click the link cuz the attachment is rotated)

PJWetzel
09-18-2012, 13:24
go hike the northern section of the Long Trail if you want slippery rock even when dry. then come back to the Whites and you'll feel like spiderman. my background in rock climbing certainly helps with route selection and climbing ability but I have not been stumped by too many rocks in the Whites. I think they choose where they put ladders fairly carefully and it should be done with care. I think hiker skill should improve not dumb down the trail to the lowest denominator. There are plenty of "easy" trails without ruining the tough ones.

had to down climb this section yesterday. was a body length tall to the rail at the bottom with nice holds on top but had to down mantle to get my feet to the bottom.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v115/Socjake/Hiking/IMG_0586.jpg (click the link cuz the attachment is rotated)

When it comes to the AT, I have to respectfully disagree, jakedatc. It's just my opinion, but the AT is a "National Scenic Trail" and envisioned for the use of the common man. It's not the "National Macho Adrenaline Junkies Only Trail".

I'm fully aware of the ongoing century-long debate in the Whites between the Macho types and those, like Randolph, who they called 'Sissies'. This debate far predates the AT. And the AT chose to follow some tough trails there. But when the tough trails were built, the builders did not envision the gradual but inevitable destruction. All trails get harder with time due to erosion and vegetation kill. If you hiked these trails in the condition that they were when they were first cut more than a century ago, and compared them to what they are today ... well, they were far easier back then. For proof, I offer any number of recent reroutes, and some of far newer and less trampled pieces of trail on similar terrain in Maine.

jakedatc
09-18-2012, 13:33
Seeks It, I'm reading your journal about your time through the Whites to see where you are coming from. (and may have misunderstood, thinking you would want ladders on the slabs) It is great you did Moriah and Height.. i think they are easily skipped and have awesome views. It does take practice to acclimate to the Whites. I definitely find my familiarity with them to be an advantage doing other Whites hikes and when traveling to other places.

congrats on your yo-yo the funny way ;)

jakedatc
09-18-2012, 13:45
It is a national scenic trail. and the Whites are probably some of the MOST scenic of all of it. I am not sure where else you want the AT to go. There are going to be difficult places throughout the NH section regardless of where you re-route it to.

I feel that after 1500+ miles an AT hiker should have the strength and hiking skill to negotiate the White without a problem. Hundreds do every year. Thousands of day hikers, section hikers, peak baggers, children and dogs negotiate the same mountains on a yearly basis.

you hit some tricky sections while they were wet. that is unlucky and made things more difficult but you can't judge a trail by bad weather. What next, re-route the southern section because they are hot?

The trail is erroded due to people not hiking on the rock. Yes, it takes some SKILL to hike up and down granite slab. by dumbing it down, people make it worse.

swjohnsey
09-18-2012, 14:02
It is a national scenic trail. and the Whites are probably some of the MOST scenic of all of it. I am not sure where else you want the AT to go. There are going to be difficult places throughout the NH section regardless of where you re-route it to.

I feel that after 1500+ miles an AT hiker should have the strength and hiking skill to negotiate the White without a problem. Hundreds do every year. Thousands of day hikers, section hikers, peak baggers, children and dogs negotiate the same mountains on a yearly basis.

you hit some tricky sections while they were wet. that is unlucky and made things more difficult but you can't judge a trail by bad weather. What next, re-route the southern section because they are hot?

The trail is erroded due to people not hiking on the rock. Yes, it takes some SKILL to hike up and down granite slab. by dumbing it down, people make it worse.


The trail is erroded due to water flowing down the trail uncontrolled. Most of the AT trail in New Hampshire hasn't been maintained in years.

Driver8
09-18-2012, 14:53
I think they choose where they put ladders fairly carefully and it should be done with care. I think hiker skill should improve not dumb down the trail to the lowest denominator. There are plenty of "easy" trails without ruining the tough ones.

I agree and like how tough the trails are in the Whites, as I expect I will in Maine. Part of the fun - figuring out a tricky scramble is invigorating and stimulating. In New England, little else compares.

Seeks It: I really enjoy your journal - you and I seem to like a lot of the same things and share a lot of perspective when it comes to the trail. One question: why does your journal not flag as updated more recently than November 2011, when you have over 100 entries, as recently as this month? Yours is the only journal I've seen with this issue. You'd have more readers if more people saw it flagged as recently updated. May not be important to you, but I think yours is an excellent and interesting journal and others would profit by reading it.