View Full Version : External or Internal packs
starbright
09-27-2012, 05:17
I am planning a thru-hike 2013 Want to know which is better internal or external. Which is lighter and which one works best for the AT.
starbright
09-27-2012, 06:19
I also need to know how an external pack is sized?
When it says 50L with in external is that the size of the pack on the frame?
Or does that include the space below the pack too?
Need help please.
Starchild
09-27-2012, 06:43
Like so many things this is not a one size fits all but a matter of personal preference, and there are main 3 choices external, internal and frameless. Most of this is coming from backpacking experience which is different then thru hiking as thru hiking seems to stress light weight comfort to make miles. Also this is how I saw and recalled it, though if someone would like to add any comments or even corrections please do.
At one time a external frame is what you got, packs and equipment were heavy and a external framed pack handles that the best as the pack and equipment attaches to the frame and the frame attaches to you, so load transfer is very good. Also ventilation of the back is also usually very good as the frame creates a airspace. But this was back in the day where backpacking loads ranged in the 35 lb + range and is still the preferred choice for such heavy loads. Fortunately equipment has gotten lighter.
With lighter equipment and also the need for free movement for backcountry skiing and such internal frame packs came along and became very popular. They moved the center of gravity closer to the body improving balance and as mentioned allowed more freedom of movement. Many backpackers found them more comfortable, and some friends described it more like putting on a coat compared to the external frames. Loads for backpacking were commonly now in the 30 lb + range. One downside was lack of ventilation which caused many sweaty backs - this is now largely eliminated due to redesign of the back area to allow airflow.
Ultralight backpacking saw the removal of the frame altogether as people pushed loads sub 20 lbs. Frameless also depends more on proper loading as the packed equipment acts as the frame to some extent.
My opinion is if you are carrying a very heavy load go external, but if you are carrying a very heavy load you either are going to make something like a Less Stroud a professional photodocumentry of your AT Thru or you should get lighter equipment and leave stuff back. So the external frame is not a good option - UNLESS you really like external.
So the choice is internal framed vs frameless and that will depend on your gear, like are you using a tent or lightweight tarp, can you get under 20 lbs pack weight? It appears to me that some sacrifices are make to get to this point. And do you want to spend care with loading a frameless.
Velvet Gooch
09-27-2012, 07:01
I also need to know how an external pack is sized?
When it says 50L with in external is that the size of the pack on the frame?
Or does that include the space below the pack too?
Need help please.
50 liters is the pack volume (capacity).
http://www.astm.org/Standards/F2153.htm (Note: this test method is not used by all manufacturers)
starbright
09-27-2012, 07:04
Yes I will be using a tent. But right now with food it seems that my weight is close to 30lbs.
starbright
09-27-2012, 07:09
Thank you that helped alot because i wasn't sure how it was measured.
Have used both. Internal's are better IMHO. They just ride better and are lighter.
I much perfer an internal frame pack. It's lighter and more comfortable. That 50L size reflects how much crap you can put inside. 50L is alot, 35L is more sensable for a thru-hike. Here is what I would do if I were you. Call 706-745-6095, it's a trusted and informed outfitter store on the AT. Ask for a person who knows backpacks. It's also a good place to ask about adjusting the straps.
Lone Wolf
09-27-2012, 09:09
if Jansport still sold a D2 framepack i would buy it. i prefer external
Velvet Gooch
09-27-2012, 09:45
if Jansport still sold a D2 framepack i would buy it. i prefer external
They do.
http://www.jansport.com/js_product_detail.php?cid=16&pid=TVU2
k2basecamp
09-27-2012, 14:57
Too bad most people today just go with the newest item thinking its the best.
I still use my Alpenlite external frame pack that I used on my first thru hike in 1981, I just love the alpenlite frame and how it wraps on the side of your hips.
Maybe its just the way I'm built but externals always feel better and ventilate my back. Everything is easily accessible
Some people just need to have the newest and or most expensive piece of equipment be it backpacks, skis, bikes, etc.
Bury me with my Alpenlite !
garlic08
09-27-2012, 15:32
Though I use frameless (thanks, Starchild, for bringing up that option), I also believe internal frame packs were embraced by the masses because they look "sexier" than externals. As I recall it, back in the 70s, internals were "introduced" by climbers and skiers who needed a narrower and more stable load. Most backpackers do not really need those features. Add some bright colors and lots of carabiner and ice axe loops--who can resist?
Get all your other crap first then find a pack that will hold it all and is comfortable for you. I would say most people on the AT carry internal frames, but you gotta see what's right for you. If you like externals but want to try to drop weight check out Luxury Lite. As for pack size get all your gear and then see what fits. Don't end up with a pack that is too small for your needs, and don't end up with crap you don't need cause you filled up your giant pack.
Odd Man Out
09-27-2012, 16:01
Doesn't ZPacks make some ultralight external frame packs? So all of them are not "old school".
Lone Wolf
09-27-2012, 16:44
They do.
http://www.jansport.com/js_product_detail.php?cid=16&pid=TVU2
i'll be damned! gonna get me one
HikerMom58
09-27-2012, 17:02
i'll be damned! gonna get me one
Ah-hah.... interesting to see what floats the "wolf man's" boat!! ;)
I'm working on making my own external frame. It's loosely based on the old army alice pack frame, but fully adjustable for length and shoulder strap width, plus a few other things. It's slow going (life gets in the way of construction) but it's looking like it will be under 3 pounds, possibly around 2.5 pounds when complete with pack. I plan on using a SMD Starlite pack initally but will try to adapt it to different packs also. It's more about my own personal preference than anything else. It will have the feaures I want.
Leapfrog^
09-27-2012, 17:34
I use a external Kelty from the late 80's. It's the only item I have that isn't lightweight or UL. Know I could shave a a good lb or two by going internal or frameless but for me it's a keeper. Surprisingly enough it seems to be somewhat of a conversation piece on the AT & has received more than a few favorable comments to date.
Pendragon
09-27-2012, 17:39
I wish they would combine the features of a ULA Catalyst with a Jansport Carson. I have an old Camp Trails McKinley which doesn't seem to be adequate volume wise, although I haven't fine tuned my load for my section hike to Damascus quite yet. I'm hoping the Black bird and Superfly I'm ordering will fit in that "sleeping bag" compartment.
Many Moons
09-27-2012, 17:44
if Jansport still sold a D2 framepack i would buy it. i prefer external
Are you going to buy one? It is Retro Orange! Hike On!!!
Miller
Lone Wolf
09-27-2012, 19:33
Ah-hah.... interesting to see what floats the "wolf man's" boat!! ;)
huh?.........
Just gotta go wth what works for you. I still use my 1969 Kelty A4, but I also use my brand-new ULA pack. Buy a bunch now and save yourself the trouble of buying them one at a time later.
sort of like asking - which works better - a sextant or a GPS - well, if you like heavy old school stuff, maybe the sextant would be your answer - the thing about the sextant is that it at least has a cool factor - I like lots of old school stuff but not external frames - external frame packs have no cool factor - - unless maybe you own one and want to take it out for the weekend - - but hike your own hike - fwiw - very few people are hiking with externals - esp. thru hikers
HikerMom58
09-27-2012, 23:00
huh?.........
I noticed you got really excited about ur favorite pack.... I thought it was interesting.:D I think you should change ur name to Wolf Man instead of going with Lone Wolf... clap for the Wolf Man. Clap Clap Clap!! Btw... I'll recommend you for shuttles. I hear you are great! :)
if Jansport still sold a D2 framepack i would buy it. i prefer external Here is another Jansport Lonewolf, $9.99 not a D2 but green!
http://www.ebay.com/itm/VTG-Vintage-World-Famous-Mont-Blanc-7-Pouch-External-Frame-Backpack-238-/140736439115