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evansprater
10-01-2012, 17:48
So I'm planning on starting at Springer here in the next two weeks or so, and I'm not sure how far I'm gonna go but I don't have any other obligations right now and enough money so who knows? Any tips on starting this late in the season? I have plenty of warm gear and a +20 Kelty Cosmic with a fleece liner so I think I should be ok at least until the winter really kicks in. I've also read that the fall hike can be even better because of no bugs/snakes and amazing views of the leaves changing colors and extended views once the leaves fall. Any thoughts are much appreciated.

Blissful
10-01-2012, 18:12
Could get winter conditions in the Smokies. Be sure to have blaze orange; will be in the middle of hunting season.

evansprater
10-01-2012, 19:08
Yes, definitely! I plan on getting a bunch of orange stuff at Walmart... Vest, hoodie, maybe some orange tape or something for my pack as well.

moldy
10-01-2012, 19:10
I would guess that you will make it to Harpers Ferry by Xmas. In the Southern Appalachains if you see Winter weather coming don't sleep up when a few miles further will take you down. It can be a huge difference between 6000 ft and 3000ft. It's pointlessly up and down anyway. Sleep down. Big storm coming...find a town.....

Whack-a-mole
10-01-2012, 20:10
I've been on Roan Mtn Thanksgiving weekend and it was 9 degrees with a 40mph wind blowing. Don't under estimate the weather. A little extra fuel and food never hurts in case you have to hunker down. If you are going with a partner, you could each carry a med size plastic tarp. Stretch them across a shelter face to block the wind, and you can make a cozy little nook. Also, surveyors flagging is bright orange and weighs next to nothing. Could hang a few strips off your pack for almost zero weight gain.

ParkRat09
10-01-2012, 20:16
Def true about the colors/views just be prepared for winter conditions in November in the Smokies for sure and do NOT trust any weather forecasts you hear for the park. Most of the park is fairly high up and weather changes a lot. I did an overnight on the AT last November and the forecast was for sunny and in the 30s. Turned out to be 3 inches of snow and single digits at night...luckily I was prepared.

Slo-go'en
10-01-2012, 20:17
Definately a better plan then starting at the other end this time of year :)

I would think you'll have a couple of months of decent hiking before it gets a bit too crazy to continue. Get your reading list together, you'll be doing a lot of it for something to do during those long evenings. Think about getting an old fashion candle lantern. They put out a decent amount of light.

ParkRat09
10-01-2012, 20:17
Oh and carry extra fuel in case you get stuck in one place AND bc water will take much longer to boil when it's 45-50 degrees

swjohnsey
10-01-2012, 20:23
White gas stoves work much better in cold/windy weather.

ParkRat09
10-01-2012, 20:27
White gas stoves work much better in cold/windy weather.

True. I forgot to ask what kind of stove he was taking. Def recommend something like a Whisperlite Universal or Simmerlite or something similar

kayak karl
10-01-2012, 21:25
ive used an alcohol stove down to 0 and in wind. never a problem. everybody told me later that it wouldn't work?

Slo-go'en
10-01-2012, 21:54
ive used an alcohol stove down to 0 and in wind. never a problem. everybody told me later that it wouldn't work?

It will work, but it takes a long time and eats a lot of fuel. I used a lot more alcohol then I expected last week in Maine, and it wasn't even especially cold. I nearly ran out.

White gas is a much better way to go for a long haul in consitantly cold weather.

fiddlehead
10-01-2012, 22:03
ive used an alcohol stove down to 0 and in wind. never a problem. everybody told me later that it wouldn't work?

And I've seen expeditions in Nepal coming off 8,000 meter peaks with butane/propane stoves very similar to the Pocket Rocket. You just have to warm up the fuel if it's really cold.
Those whisper-lite's are heavy and anything but whisper-like.
I'd definitely carry some good fire starters as you'll be spending a lot of time in camp with the long nights.

Donde
10-01-2012, 22:49
I'd consider a warmer bag, though if you are careful about what elevations you sleep at and have plenty of dry clothes you can get away with it.

Feral Bill
10-01-2012, 22:52
And I've seen expeditions in Nepal coming off 8,000 meter peaks with butane/propane stoves very similar to the Pocket Rocket. You just have to warm up the fuel if it's really cold.
Those whisper-lite's are heavy and anything but whisper-like.
I'd definitely carry some good fire starters as you'll be spending a lot of time in camp with the long nights. At very high elevations canisters boil out at much lower temps than on the AT. Go for the white gas stove.

Tipi Walter
10-01-2012, 23:37
I've been on Roan Mtn Thanksgiving weekend and it was 9 degrees with a 40mph wind blowing. Don't under estimate the weather. A little extra fuel and food never hurts in case you have to hunker down. If you are going with a partner, you could each carry a med size plastic tarp. Stretch them across a shelter face to block the wind, and you can make a cozy little nook. Also, surveyors flagging is bright orange and weighs next to nothing. Could hang a few strips off your pack for almost zero weight gain.

I've been saying this pretty much all along. This is where the "right tool for the job" goes haywire. You spend the night in a valley in a bivy bag at 50F. Two days later you're at 6,000 feet in a four season tent bolted down with every stake in a 10F blizzard wind. The right tool is a multitool.


It will work, but it takes a long time and eats a lot of fuel. I used a lot more alcohol then I expected last week in Maine, and it wasn't even especially cold. I nearly ran out.

White gas is a much better way to go for a long haul in consitantly cold weather.

Definitely go with the white gas. A 22 oz fuel bottle typically last me 17+ days without resupply. In the dead of winter a bottle will go close to 10 days. I've seen enough guys fumbling with alcohol stoves on winter trips to rethink that option. It's sort of comical. They'll be sitting around cooking but the flame blew out 10 minutes ago.

evansprater
10-02-2012, 18:28
I've been saying this pretty much all along. This is where the "right tool for the job" goes haywire. You spend the night in a valley in a bivy bag at 50F. Two days later you're at 6,000 feet in a four season tent bolted down with every stake in a 10F blizzard wind. The right tool is a multitool.



Definitely go with the white gas. A 22 oz fuel bottle typically last me 17+ days without resupply. In the dead of winter a bottle will go close to 10 days. I've seen enough guys fumbling with alcohol stoves on winter trips to rethink that option. It's sort of comical. They'll be sitting around cooking but the flame blew out 10 minutes ago.

Alright! SO - what I've gathered is:

1) White gas! (this will work with a regular screw on stove-top I'm assuming?)
2) Sleep "down": Get to low elevation if possible for the night.
3) Be prepared for cold and for unexpected weather: I've got plenty of layers and my poncho doubles as a tarp.
4) Plenty of orange: Got a bright orange gore-tex cap today at Academy. Found an all orange nike dri-fit shirt at Marshall's. I like the idea about the orange tape.

Other than that, I have some good thermals, two pairs of wool socks (might need to wear both at once if its super cold right?), a lands end shell w/ fleece zip in, and a "layer 8" running thermal (exactly like nike dri fit). I also got an insert for the Cosmic that adds another 20 F of warmth, so it'll be a 0 F bag with that in it.

Thank you guys so much for the responses!

Any other thoughts/ideas? Do you know if I'll get cell reception in spots in case anything happens?

kayak karl
10-02-2012, 19:04
are white gas stoves and canister stoves the same thing??

evansprater
10-02-2012, 19:08
Yeah, I'm just wondering if I can burn white gas in my regular camping stove?

Slo-go'en
10-02-2012, 22:59
Yeah, I'm just wondering if I can burn white gas in my regular camping stove?

No. White gas is like gasoline, but more refined and without the additives. "Coleman fuel" is the common brand name. White gas stoves are more complicated then canister stoves and have a definate learning curve to them. The Coleman "Peak one" stove is still available and is one common version of a white gas stove. The MSR whisper light is another.

Cadenza
10-03-2012, 00:28
If I were going in cold weather I'd take the Optimus 123 Svea.
RELIABILITY. I've had one for over 30 years and it still works like a champ.

Feral Bill
10-03-2012, 01:15
If I were going in cold weather I'd take the Optimus 123 Svea.
RELIABILITY. I've had one for over 30 years and it still works like a champ. Best stove ever. 43 years on mine. Prime with an eyedropper. Practice using it a few times before setting out.

10-K
10-03-2012, 06:06
I use esbit stove if I carry one.

One thing to think about when it gets below freezing is what kind of food is in your bag. Tuna and chicken packets turn into foil bricks. Peanut butter gets hard as a rock.

Slo-go'en
10-03-2012, 09:50
I use esbit stove if I carry one.

One thing to think about when it gets below freezing is what kind of food is in your bag. Tuna and chicken packets turn into foil bricks. Peanut butter gets hard as a rock.

Ahh, but if it stays below freezing, you can carry frozen dinners or ice cream :)

evansprater
10-03-2012, 15:13
Man these white gas stoves are ridiculously expensive. Won't it be cheaper to just buy extra butane? I feel like even with the extra use it wouldn't equal $100 over the course of the journey.

10-K
10-03-2012, 15:27
Skip the white gas station you don't need it. Extra weight extra hassle extra expense.

Canisters are easy to find and it's not like they're completely useless below freezing.

evansprater
10-03-2012, 19:43
[QUOTE=10-K;1344725]Skip the white gas station you don't need it. Extra weight extra hassle extra expense.

Canisters are easy to find and it's not like they're completely useless below freezing.[/QUOTE

evansprater
10-03-2012, 19:46
Oops sorry about that. This site is funky on my phone. That's what I like to hear - I feel like regular gas will be fine. And you'll all be happy to know I couldn't fit everything in my kelty goshawk, so I upgraded to an apricot (bright orange) kelty Lakota! So ill be a big ball of bright orange on the trail with my hat and hunting tape. Should be fun.