View Full Version : Looking for rain gear
This is the jacket I'm looking at: http://www.outdoorplay.com/meta-namedescription-contentMountain-Hardwear-Womens-Cohesion-Jacket-Free-Ship-No-Sales-Tx . I'm doing my entire trip on a very limited budget. Would I be hard pressed to find anything cheaper that will do the trick?
jakedatc
10-16-2012, 09:58
Driducks.. generic version of Frogg toggs. cheap, light, waterproof.
though, i have this but in mens. not very breathable but very waterproof. most raingear isn't very breathable anyway
http://www.rei.com/product/772601/sierra-designs-microlight-jacket-womens
swjohnsey
10-16-2012, 10:13
I started out with a Driduck top because it was cheap and light. It didn't hold up, pack would rub off the waterproof layer over time. Ended up with something similar to that, a light shell, Marmot Essence.
ya I was reading reviews on driducks...they weren't pretty. thanks for the imput!
The other issue with the driducks is that just overall construction quality is in proportion to cost. I used an (admittedly not new) driducks jacket near the start of the AT, but the zipper went out on me after not too long; I think I was duct taping it shut in the rain until I bought a more conventional jacket replacement in Gatlinburg.
The jacket initially listed by the OP looks fine to me, with the caveat that while they mention how light it is, in the extensive list of "specs" data they carefully don't list the weight.
REI lists the weight, however, at an "average weight" of 12 oz. This is nothing to celebrate, but not horribly bad. The jacket I used last year was about 7 oz, however, so it's not fantastic either.
Another approach: note that my size large men's driducks jacket weighs in the 7 - 8 oz range; you could seriously consider buying just two such (driducks) sets and bounce or have ready to mail a replacement jacket. Not sure what your "entire trip" is, but even if it is a thru-hike, note that after the weather warmed up I often didn't even want my rain jacket on when it was raining at those temps. Of course your personal experience (weather that year) could vary a great deal.
While just musing here, note also that with pretty minimal cut & stitchery, you could turn one of the sets of included rain pants into what are IMO more useful and lighter rain chaps. I did that with a set and found that they do a fine job; again, they won't last as well as my "real" rain chaps, but I've nonetheless found them to be useful.
jakedatc
10-16-2012, 11:42
yea.. quality of driducks you need to be careful with. I got my Sierra deigns microlight that i also listed for 20 bucks and weighs 8oz for size small and will last much longer.
Thanks BrianLe, I will consider all that. We are hiking NOBO beginning of May, I was looking at expensive, elaborate raingear but don't think I'm going to need any of those.
I'll check out Sierra too. :)
colorado_rob
10-16-2012, 12:08
Couple comments about DriDucks.... First, my DriDucks jacket, size large, weighs just under 6 oz, not 7-8. But there are different DriDuck models, mine is the $20 (for the set) variety, the "ultralight rain suit" or something like that.
Quality: Having used these for 3-4 years constantly, I've owned about 4 sets now, The fabric has always been consistent, but as alluded to here, the zippers can be flaky. I finally figured the zippers out; sometimes the opening on the main zipper pull is a bit too expanded. Squeezing this closed a bit (with pliers) makes the zipper work perfectly. Plus, I add a drop of veggie oil to the zipper pull and zip it up/down a few times and this make the zipper nice and smooth. I've found that once this is done, the jacket is good until the fabric wears out.
So bottom line: yes, a bit flaky, but at <6 oz for the jacket, and very waterproof, I'm sticking with my Dri Ducks. I do plan on needing about 3 sets ($20 each) if I manage to hang for the entire AT next year. No way one set would last the trip.
Blissful
10-16-2012, 19:16
I like my dri ducks but would question durability on a long distance hike. A thru hiker I met in MD looked like her jacket had been through a battle. Holes everywhere.
Of course a Dri Ducks jacket is going to wear out quickly. It'd take extreme care and luck for it to last an entire thru hike. For the price and weight, that's expecting too much. Don't get a Dri Ducks if you're unwilling to replace it occasionally. Many jackets that cost several times as much don't make it the entire way either.
I've yet to find "breathable" rain gear that holds up. I used dri-ducks on the AT under the theory that at least I could afford to replace them frequently at $20 instead of $100. They worked well for me, my dri-ducks vastly outlasted my girlfriends gortex. That said they aren't at all durable, if you aren't careful or you fall, you could destroy them instantly.
Other cheap options include non breathable rain jackets or you could say nuts to the whole jacket idea and get an umbrella for $15 http://www.golite.com/Half-Dome-Travel-Umbrella-wCase-P900.aspx
turtle fast
10-16-2012, 23:28
The Marmot Precip jacket is about the same price at backcountry.com for $69.96....sometimes you can get better deals checking the web as I saw some closeout colors for I think it was $55. These are a trail staple as a lot of hikers have them.
1stgenfarmboy
10-16-2012, 23:30
I know there kinda pricey, but we have been happy with the FT's, we have put many miles on them with no problems.
yea.. quality of driducks you need to be careful with. I got my Sierra deigns microlight that i also listed for 20 bucks and weighs 8oz for size small and will last much longer.
I see that listed as a wind shell with the comment:
"Seams are not sealed; jacket offers water resistance in light rain for a short period of time"
How water resistent have you actually found it to be?
jakedatc
10-17-2012, 00:28
i have not had it in anything extended so it has been ok so far. in light rain i tend to just wear my t shirt and not worry about being a little wet.
i have not had it in anything extended so it has been ok so far. in light rain i tend to just wear my t shirt and not worry about being a little wet.
Yeah, I usually will do this too. That's why I think that a rain jacket is best used as a wind jacket and an early morning chill stopper as its primary use. There will be times the rain jacket will be needed as a rain jacket.
I think that best strategy is to carry as light a jacket as possible because a rain jacket will be inside the pack 95% (or so) of the time.
I went with a Z Packs cuben rain jacket. Only 4.7 oz. much more reasonable to carry. Mostly used in late evening in camp, or early morning, and oh, by the way, is completely waterproof in those few times it rains hard. But during most light rains, not worth pulling out of the pack; just wear the tee shirt.
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yellowsirocco
10-17-2012, 07:28
Just get a Packa, it works much better than conventional jackets. I combine mine with a rain skirt on the bottom and in colder temps use knee high gaiters. It is a bit more than the jacket in the original post, but it will make you happier and when you are happier on the trail you are less likely to spend time in town where you will blow your budget. Good gear is an investment in you happiness.
Whatever you do, don't use dri-ducks/frogg-toggs. They will fall apart on you and you will have to end up paying a lot of money to a local outfitter or paying for express shipping if you order online.
Just get a Packa, it works much better than conventional jackets. I combine mine with a rain skirt on the bottom and in colder temps use knee high gaiters. It is a bit more than the jacket in the original post, but it will make you happier and when you are happier on the trail you are less likely to spend time in town where you will blow your budget. Good gear is an investment in you happiness.
That's incompatible with the way I hike. I take a break about once an hour. Especially when it's raining, I'll have a sit pad that I remove from my pack so I have somewhere dry and warm to sit. I'll also dig into the front pouch of my pack to get food. With a poncho, all I have to do is swing my pack in front of me. It stays under the poncho the entire time. I just pull my head under to see what I'm doing. Doing it in reverse isn't quite as easy, but it works and me and my pack stays dry.
If you want to keep your arms dry while using trekking poles, spend a dollar on tyvek sleeves.
Whatever you do, don't use dri-ducks/frogg-toggs. They will fall apart on you and you will have to end up paying a lot of money to a local outfitter or paying for express shipping if you order online.
That's a non-issue if you can get to a Walmart, have an Amazon Prime membership or do mail drops.
yellowsirocco
10-17-2012, 08:11
That's incompatible with the way I hike. I take a break about once an hour. Especially when it's raining, I'll have a sit pad that I remove from my pack so I have somewhere dry and warm to sit. I'll also dig into the front pouch of my pack to get food. With a poncho, all I have to do is swing my pack in front of me. It stays under the poncho the entire time. I just pull my head under to see what I'm doing. Doing it in reverse isn't quite as easy, but it works and me and my pack stays dry.
If you want to keep your arms dry while using trekking poles, spend a dollar on tyvek sleeves.
That is great if you can swing a poncho. I was talking about the stupid rain jackets where you sweat as much as it is raining. Poncho's can be difficult if it is very windy though and the bulge from your pack is kind of awkward. A good compromise is the Altus Poncho Atmospheric (http://www.barrabes.com/barrabes/product.asp?pf_id=20884).
That's a non-issue if you can get to a Walmart, have an Amazon Prime membership or do mail drops.
How many Wal-marts are easily accessible to the trail though? Probably every hundred miles so a week's walk at a good pace, two weeks for a lot of starting NOBO thru hiker. And if you have it shipped from Amazon or home, you have to first get cell reception and then wait send it far enough ahead that you won't be waiting in town forever. Let's call it a week. Either way you have to wait a week for another piece of crap and the money you spend on this junk keeps piling up.
Any thoughts on rain pants? I am about to start a section hike from springer to NC this weekend and have rain pants on the list. I was thinking about using them in case it got cold but now are rethinking the weight vs. usefullness.
Thoughts?
Just get a Packa, it works much better than conventional jackets. I combine mine with a rain skirt on the bottom and in colder temps use knee high gaiters. It is a bit more than the jacket in the original post, but it will make you happier and when you are happier on the trail you are less likely to spend time in town where you will blow your budget. Good gear is an investment in you happiness.
Whatever you do, don't use dri-ducks/frogg-toggs. They will fall apart on you and you will have to end up paying a lot of money to a local outfitter or paying for express shipping if you order online.
No doubt the Packa is the Cadillac of raingear. I have an eVent Packa. However it weighs 17 oz. As a general rule, the most comfortable gear is also the heaviest gear.
You just have to find that sweet spot between weight and comfort. As nice as I've found the Packa to be, I'm no longer willing to carry the weight.
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Any thoughts on rain pants? I am about to start a section hike from springer to NC this weekend and have rain pants on the list. I was thinking about using them in case it got cold but now are rethinking the weight vs. usefullness.
Thoughts?
The problem with rain pants is a hiker will not usually decide to put them on until it starts raining. If on the trail, your feet are wet/muddy. You'll need to stop, take off yor pack, dig them out of your pack, sit on a wet rock and pull them on over your wet, muddy shoes. They really get to be a mess.
If you really want to shield your lower half, I believe a better strategy is to use a wraparound rain skirt. Better ventilation, stays mud free.
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Hosaphone
10-18-2012, 02:27
Regarding DriDucks... A friend of mine thru-hiked the whole way on ONE set. I'm not 100% sure I believe his claim, but I guess if you baby them maybe it's possible.
Someone said the material doesn't breathe very well - I disagree. Maybe it's simply due to the fact that they are more baggy than "normal" rain gear, but I find them to breathe much better than any other jacket I've tried.
And keep in mind that DriDucks weigh around half as much as something like a Marmot Precip...
Also, the purpose of rain gear is not to keep you dry - it's to keep you warm. If you are exerting yourself hiking up a mountain in a 100% humidity environment, you're going to get wet from sweat and condensation. No avoiding it. Really, the jacket is mainly there to block wind and keep cold rain from chilling you. Even if the jacket gets some holes, etc, it's still going to be able to do its job.
The problem with rain pants is a hiker will not usually decide to put them on until it starts raining. If on the trail, your feet are wet/muddy. You'll need to stop, take off yor pack, dig them out of your pack, sit on a wet rock and pull them on over your wet, muddy shoes. They really get to be a mess.
That is a big problem. Part of that can be solved by taking off shoes too, but that's another hassle. Of course if you wait too long to put on rain pants, the bottom of your pants will already be muddy.
Also, the purpose of rain gear is not to keep you dry - it's to keep you warm.
I underestimated how much of an effect cold rain can have. After a cold wet hike I remembered my chemistry classes, and how water has a great capacity to absorb heat. Then it made sense.
No doubt the Packa is the Cadillac of raingear. I have an eVent Packa. However it weighs 17 oz. As a general rule, the most comfortable gear is also the heaviest gear.
You just have to find that sweet spot between weight and comfort. As nice as I've found the Packa to be, I'm no longer willing to carry the weight.
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Interesting. The silnylon Packa I have here weighs 12 oz., in what I believe is the "standard" medium size. Go figure.
As another data point, I also have a Packa, brand new (arrived Monday, in fact), size small. It weighs 11.35 ounces (including the rubber band I used to corral it while I did the weighing).
For reasons unknown to me, Cedartree doesn't advertise the eVent Packa on their website. It definitely is a little heavier, but breathes "way more" (technical units) than the standard sil-nylon.
Edit: I just looked on their website and the eVent is now offered.
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I have the cuben fiber Packa (which is the Rolls Royce of rain gear) and it weighs 5.5 oz.
Being a pack cover makes it a multi use item.
When not being used it takes up little room in the pack's outer mesh pocket.
Yep,.....it's pricey. But it will still be a Rolls Royce for years to come after the Frog Toggs Yugos have been left to burn in a fire pit.
I truly believe cheap gear is more expensive in the long run.
swjohnsey
10-18-2012, 14:07
Cuben ain't gonna last long.
Cuben ain't gonna last long.
I suppose we will find out in time, won't we?
My cuben tarp has been through some high winds and doesn't show any sign of duress.
I've had some cuben stuff sacks for a while. They have seen some abuse and abrasion but are still functional.
The biggest threat I see for the Packa would be hiking through thorns such as sunny blackberry topped ridges.
Even nylon is fragile when going through the briar patch.
Hosaphone
10-18-2012, 15:38
I suppose we will find out in time, won't we?
My cuben tarp has been through some high winds and doesn't show any sign of duress.
I've had some cuben stuff sacks for a while. They have seen some abuse and abrasion but are still functional.
The biggest threat I see for the Packa would be hiking through thorns such as sunny blackberry topped ridges.
Even nylon is fragile when going through the briar patch.
That's the thing... I would expect a tarp or stuff sacks to last forever. Rain gear is much easier to destroy if you aren't super careful and baby it all the time, or if you don't hike on trails that are super well maintained.
ChinMusic
10-18-2012, 15:44
Cuben ain't gonna last long.
I think you are thinking about the first generation of cuben packs. The newer cuben packs will last longer. For something like raingear cuben should last a LONG time and is VERY easy to repair.
bannerstone
10-18-2012, 16:31
Cuben ain't gonna last long.
Cuben is just so much more repairable than silnylon and certainly worth the time to perform considering the initial cost. I saw a small burn hole repaired on a .51oz cuben tarp recently, very flexible patch, good adhesion, nicely done. I would think it would last a good long time.
I'll have a cuben packa eventually. Thanks for the reminder Cadenza, it really needs to move back toward the top of my wish list. :)
David
swjohnsey
10-18-2012, 21:27
Again, cuben ain't gonna last long as rain gear. I used several items from Z-pack including a pack cover, dry sack, mitten covers and several stuff sacks. Everything that was subject to abrasion wore out. The pack cover lasted as did the mitten cover but the mitten covers were only used a couple of times.
Again, cuben ain't gonna last long as rain gear. I used several items from Z-pack including a pack cover, dry sack, mitten covers and several stuff sacks. Everything that was subject to abrasion wore out. The pack cover lasted as did the mitten cover but the mitten covers were only used a couple of times.
I recently bought a Z Packs Exo pack, 13.5 oz. There is a nylon outer laminated layer that significantly toughens the fabric. I haven't worn it a lot yet, but I'm convinced it will be at least comparable to silnylon as far as wear resistance.
swjohnsey
10-19-2012, 08:01
Like any new material, folks are still learning how to work with cuben and its limitations. For some stuff it is great.
gearfreak
10-19-2012, 08:11
I think that best strategy is to carry as light a jacket as possible because a rain jacket will be inside the pack 95% (or so) of the time.
Really? I sectioned 19E to Damascus a couple of weeks ago and had one day of sunshine out of five days hiking.
Every material has its advantages and disadvantages.
Cordura is waterproof, but also non breathable, yet absorbs water.
Laminates like goretex are "breathable", but tear, don't really allow air to blow through, don't work when dirty, and don't transmit liquid water.
Silnylon is super slippery, and can't be repaired well with duct tape.
Cuben fiber is very strong and it's waterproof, and can be easily and strongly repaired with duct tape, but it doesn't breathe, and doesn't handle abrasion well.
Waterproof breathable cuben has obvious advantages, but still has abrasion problems.
Hybrid cuben is still waterproof, and more resistant to abrasion, but not breathable, and still prone to abrasion on one face.
PU and other mylar laminates are also waterproof, and durable, but not breathable, and prone to delamination.
The trick to any material, especially those pushing the boundaries of lightness and backpacking technology, is knowing how to use it, and knowing what not to do with it.
staehpj1
10-19-2012, 08:13
I see that listed as a wind shell with the comment:
"Seams are not sealed; jacket offers water resistance in light rain for a short period of time"
How water resistent have you actually found it to be?
FWIW, I have an older model of the Microlight jacket and it worked great on a coast to coast bicycle trip and some short, but pretty wet backpacking trips. I really do not expect to be dry though. I figure that if I wear something wind proof that is good enough. I have gone as far as switching to an extremely light DWR jacket (Stoic Wraith). Not sure if I would go with something more substantial for a thru hike at least for the first part which I assume would be the coldest/wettest part (I have no real long distance hiking experience and have only done multi month bicycle trips).
I have never really like any of the goretex or other breathable fabrics of it's ilk that I have tried. I did a lot of winter and Spring kayaking and found that non breathable was the way to go for really wet and cold conditions. I basically worry about being warm and forget about dry.
Take all that for what it is worth since most of my wet and cold weather outdoor experience has been bicycling and kayaking, not backpacking.
Not sure if I would go with something more substantial for a thru hike at least for the first part which I assume would be the coldest/wettest part (I have no real long distance hiking experience and have only done multi month bicycle trips).
The beginning and the end (at least for the average NOBO) are where you really need to worry about protective clothing. My girlfriend got so fed up with gortex that she didn't bother with rain gear for much of the middle.
Maybe I'm starting a horrible flame war here but there is another vastly different option.
http://www.tacticalwholesalers.com/Emergency-Poncho-Yellow_p_64977.html
They don't last long but it's easy to find places to pick up a new one and at less than $1 everybody can afford to replace it.
This is the jacket I'm looking at: http://www.outdoorplay.com/meta-namedescription-contentMountain-Hardwear-Womens-Cohesion-Jacket-Free-Ship-No-Sales-Tx . I'm doing my entire trip on a very limited budget. Would I be hard pressed to find anything cheaper that will do the trick?
Mdj05f, YES that will work for you as a wind/true rain jacket. It's Waterproof(WP) and it's on sale at a decent price with free shipping. Conduit DT is WP. I had a Mountain Hardware climbing jacket made of Conduit DT. This is a true rain jacket with some nice features and has good durability. The DriDucks or Togg Froggs are cheaper, about 1/3 the cost and could do in a pinch, but IMHO I think breathability and durability are questionable If you like I have an extra set of DriDucks in XL and Lg almost brand new. If you are on a really tight budget let me know. Pay postage and you can have a set(jacket/pants).
DO NOT get the Sierra Designs Microlight jacket as a true all weather rain jacket. Although being rather inexpensive, I picked up last yr's model at REI for $24, IT IS NOT seem taped or has WP zippers and the material does eventually wet out in all but the most benign of misty rain!
While ponchos have their place in some hikers gear arsenals they are not for everyone or for everyone's hiking style. And, when talking about ponchos made from pricey fabrics(WP technologies) such as EVent or Cuben thye $$$ goes up.
Have you decided on type of stove you will be using or if you will be going stoveless? I have a almost brand new MSR Pocket Rocket isobutane stove that I'll sell. you at 1/2 price retail. PM me.
Hosaphone
10-19-2012, 14:13
Maybe I'm starting a horrible flame war here but there is another vastly different option.
http://www.tacticalwholesalers.com/Emergency-Poncho-Yellow_p_64977.html
They don't last long but it's easy to find places to pick up a new one and at less than $1 everybody can afford to replace it.
Can you really hike through freezing rain in a poncho and not be miserable? I think I could do it for a day hike, but multiple days of cold rain with only a poncho would probably make me cry. HYOH though, if a poncho really works for you then I'm jealous.
I could see using full rain jacket+pants for cold weather, and then switching out to a poncho for warm weather. Can also save a ridiculous amount of weight with a poncho-tarp + bivy combo vs a dedicated shelter and rain gear.
Can you really hike through freezing rain in a poncho and not be miserable? I think I could do it for a day hike, but multiple days of cold rain with only a poncho would probably make me cry. HYOH though, if a poncho really works for you then I'm jealous.
Probably not with a poncho and no other rain protection. Using a poncho in those conditions while using trekking poles is horrible. That's why I got tyvek sleeves. It will also help to protect your lower legs because a poncho does very little for the lower body when the wind is blowing, and does nothing for splashing through puddles.
People like to say a poncho won't keep you dry in windy conditions, but I haven't had a problem keeping rain off my torso. I suppose this is a problem for people that don't have buttons on the side of their poncho, or don't use them.
Adding some type of belt is supposed to help tremendously too, but I haven't used one yet. Last time out I was planning to use the belt from my pants, but hadn't counted on my pants getting so heavy from the rain that I really needed the belt to keep my pants up.
rmitchell
10-19-2012, 20:27
For warmer weather, you might consider a broad brimed rain hat. No jacket or rain pants if the temperature is 50 degrees or warmer. For me an Outdoor Research hat keeps my head and some of my upper body dry and keeps the rain off my glasses. As it cools down use as jacket. If really cold and rainy inexpensive rain pants such as Red Ledge are useful.
Can you really hike through freezing rain in a poncho and not be miserable? I think I could do it for a day hike, but multiple days of cold rain with only a poncho would probably make me cry. HYOH though, if a poncho really works for you then I'm jealous.
That's what my girlfriend did through NH and it wasn't like we got good weather. She was just super sick of gortex, she went without in warm weather and picked up the emergency poncho when I argued that she really needed something for the White Mountains.
It worked out ok, certainly didn't involve crying.
Hosaphone
10-19-2012, 21:37
For warmer weather, you might consider a broad brimed rain hat. No jacket or rain pants if the temperature is 50 degrees or warmer. For me an Outdoor Research hat keeps my head and some of my upper body dry and keeps the rain off my glasses. As it cools down use as jacket. If really cold and rainy inexpensive rain pants such as Red Ledge are useful.
I bring a rain hat no matter what the temperature is. I always tell people it's my #2 piece of gear in terms of how much it increases my enjoyment of hiking (first place goes to my waterproof mitten shells).
Wearing a hat instead of a hood keeps the rain out of your face, lets you keep your peripheral vision, and lets you hear the sounds of the forest. I would go crazy being cooped up under a hood where all you can hear is rain pounding against your jacket and you can only see directly in front of you.
+1 on frogg toggs.. You can even cut up the poncho and make a rain jacket if you have a sewing machine. Works well, just not very breathable that way
"Adding some type of belt is supposed to help tremendously too, but I haven't used one yet. Last time out I was planning to use the belt from my pants, but hadn't counted on my pants getting so heavy from the rain that I really needed the belt to keep my pants up."
I keep a length of thin/light stretch cord and a cord connector with my poncho, but just a length of the same general purpose cord that I presume we all carry (paracord or ideally something lighter than that) does a fine job too. I wouldn't be comfortable going on a trip in a poncho without some way to belt it.
I too carry tyvek sleeves with my poncho, though I've as yet not had many occasions where I find it worth putting them on.
"Can you really hike through freezing rain in a poncho and not be miserable?"
Given that it's a sort of combination rain jacket, pack cover, and rain skirt all in one item --- and given that for me and I think many others, rain gear is more about temperature control than "staying dry" --- sure. If I know the weather will be evil, I'd go for a packa instead, but a poncho is a great general purpose thing in all sorts of conditions. Except for bushwhacking or hiking on trail that has lots of blowdowns and brush; then not so much.
The even-better time to use a poncho for me, though is shoulder season weather (few or no bugs) when the extended weather forecast is pretty good. It's an awesome piece of kit when it also serves as an at-need tent.