Question about Bags

[starbright]

Ok by now most people know that I am on a limited budget. I have equiptment for the camping and am trying to adapt them for the AT. Yes some things should be replaced for lighter weight items but that is not possible at this time. So I need your advice not critisizim please.



I have a 30* bag purchased at Walmart about 4 years ago and I have used it in the cold and wet before but only to about 35 to 40 degrees. What can I do to make it alittle warmer for temps that we might encounter on the AT in early March.




Also have a question about waterproofing the bottom of a tent. Purchased on ebay it's light weight at 33 ozs. I said it was what I was looking for then I recieved it and discovered that the bottom not only dosent have the bathtub floor that it was supposted to have that the material isnt waterproof either. The top and side seem to be but not the bottom. How can I fix this? Will using a ground cloth help?

Please need your advice about these items probably more questions to follow. Thanks

[Datto]

When long-distance hiking in cold weather or in the desert, I always take a Mylar sleeping bag with me that goes inside my regular sleeping bag at night when I need extra warmth. That Mylar sleeping bag warms you up considerably on very cold nights and will likely make it such that you can get some sleep on very cold nights. The downside is the warmth along with the moisture is trapped inside the Mylar sleeping bag overnight so in the morning, the moisture will need to be evaporated away from your clothes and body when you first start hiking.

You can get the Mylar sleeping bags from the Space company or, for one that is a little more rugged, from a company that has the word American in their company name. Both should be available on the Internet, REI, Campmor and the like. Usually the Mylar sleeping bags, once opened, last a couple of weeks or so before they've become too tattered and holey and need to be replaced.


Datto

[Datto]

The Mylar sleeping bag weights in at about 4 ounces and cost for the Space brand Mylar sleeping bag is about $10 and the American brand company about $15 or so.


Datto

[Don H]

To make your sleeping bag more comfortable at lower temps use a sleeping bag liner. I use silk, cost about $40. Also use a sleeping pad for insulation from the cold ground.

The tent, in my opinion is a problem. Maybe you should send it back if it didn't come as advertised. I'm assuming you bought it used. A ground cloth often traps water between the floor and tent bottom ensuring that you will get wet. The only use of a ground cloth in my opinion is to protect the bottom from wear and punctures.

Quality sleeping gear and shelter is very important, in fact I consider these survival gear. I know you're on a budget but I would try to buy the best quality gear you can get. I've seen some nice gear for sale here so maybe someone can help you out.

[soulrebel]

You don't really need a waterproof floor if you use a pad. The roof however needs to be able to shed water, sil-nylon shelters that many hikers use are not really coated with a waterproof polyurethane or rubber layer but works well with a water resistant chemical like DWR or scotchguard, and needs to be retreated every now and then. For years, I've used a spinnaker sheet that weighs 3 oz and is not waterproof (I do treat it with permethrin in summer), but I also used to use a Closed cell pad and now a liferaft pad known as neobair. Tyvek sheets are the norm. They're ok, but get dirty, wet, and heavy, and ultimately water will push thru them... Mylar sheets, and painters 1mil-2mil plastic are waterproof but tear easily. If you have a durable pad you don't need one.

I also had a 30d bag in march and went thru single digit temps and a weeklong snowstorm... You need a puffy jacket of some sort, perhaps a makeshift Vapor barrier vest made out of a trash bag for sleeping if it gets in the teens. wind jacket is a nice layer. layer upon layer...I had seven layers on my torso... you need a balaclava and a nice wool cap to go over that...or a couple thinner ones....layers you know layers to trap the warm air... a full VBL sac is too wet for me..have a good safe hike...mainly carry a lil extra food. hot soup mmm. hike all day if you can..

[The Cleaner]

IMO staying warm isn't cheap.You'll get all kinds of ideas of how to make cheap gear warmer from folks here.I was outside all day yesterday on my hike at 4000ft with the temp at 28*. I was wearing a Smartwool NTS 195 LS shirt,a Marmot Dri-Clime wind shirt topped off with a Columbia waterproof/fleece bomber style hat.When I first started hiking 35 years ago I had a cheap mummy bag rated to about 40*.I bought another Wally World bag,rectangular type and used one inside the other.Carrying 2 sleeping bags:eek:.A fairly good down bag can be purchased for about 200$ if you shop around and get one that weighs a bit more than the really expensive ones.The problem with wearing everything you have to stay warm is,what do you put on when you get out of your cheap bag? Save your money,bite the bullet and get a down bag,you won't regret it on a very cold trip.....

[yellowsirocco]

I have a 30* bag purchased at Walmart about 4 years ago and I have used it in the cold and wet before but only to about 35 to 40 degrees. What can I do to make it alittle warmer for temps that we might encounter on the AT in early March.

Push back your start date to April. This sleeping bag sounds pretty worthless for March. Also if you start in April you will be able to swap out for a cheap lightweight fleece blanket earlier in Virginia which will lighten your load. March is not a good month for going on the cheap.

[The Cleaner]

Push back your start date to April. This sleeping bag sounds pretty worthless for March. Also if you start in April you will be able to swap out for a cheap lightweight fleece blanket earlier in Virginia which will lighten your load. March is not a good month for going on the cheap. One could even see single digit temps& snow in the Smokies in April :eek:.....

[Papa D]

If you go to a building supply place (not home depot) but like a real building supply place where contractors shop, you can probably get someone to give you a slice of heavy duty tyvek type house wrap. This makes a really good ground sheet. there are folks on here that will argue against ground sheets in favor of better site selection and / or footprints but I can assure you that you will be happier with a piece of tyvek - - it is light and also makes a nice light waterproof thing to sit on when the ground is wet, stand on to change shoes and put under your pad in a shelter to keep it clean. It also protects the floor of your tent from punctures and abrasions. Make sure to cut it about 3/4 inch smaller than your tent floor. If it's raining and any sticks out, it will funnel water underneath your tent - - bad. Like others have said, you can't really "waterproof" a tent floor.

As for your sleeping bag, I'm sorry but it's not very good. I know you are on a limited budget but you will incur less expenses on a thru-hike if you have a comfortable bag and the mercury doesn't chase you into a hostel as much as others. I just found this bag on e-bay for someone else. It's an example only of what is available used. You could also call local small outfitter stores and ask if they have anything old that they want to get rid of - - - you might find a deal just hanging around a store and getting them to check "the back room"

www.ebay.com/itm/MOUNTAIN-HARDWARE-DOWN-MUMMY-BAG-15-DEGREE-BIG-BANG-SL-REG-RZ-/321048559238?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4abffc3e86 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/MOUNTAIN-HARDWARE-DOWN-MUMMY-BAG-15-DEGREE-BIG-BANG-SL-REG-RZ-/321048559238?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4abffc3e86)

If you, P/M me and I'll rummage around - - I have about 15 sleeping bags - - I might have something very-well used that I could send you. Maybe not ideal but better than what you have. I'm thinking I have a North Face Cat's Meow with a tear and a bad zipper but if your are resourceful you could fix it.

[Camel2012]

I would suggest, since you have time, is to keep an eye on the gear websites for a really good deal. A long cold night in a sub-par bag makes for a very long miserable day.
A sleeping bag is one of the few areas i would make sure not to go cheap on, especially starting before April.

Just remember, it will be a lot easier and cheaper to switch out at home, before you leave, rather than doing it on the trail after some miserable nights.

I'm sure there have been plenty of people to carry a wal-mart bag the whole way, but it's all about what you're willing to endure. A better bag also means carrying less clothes to bundle up in at night. You could lose significant weight with a down bag around $100-$120 or even more for more expensive bags.
I seen a few of those walmart bags left in shelters in 2012, they just aren't made for what we do.

[Papa D]

I would suggest, since you have time, is to keep an eye on the gear websites for a really good deal. A long cold night in a sub-par bag makes for a very long miserable day.
A sleeping bag is one of the few areas i would make sure not to go cheap on, especially starting before April.

Just remember, it will be a lot easier and cheaper to switch out at home, before you leave, rather than doing it on the trail after some miserable nights.

I'm sure there have been plenty of people to carry a wal-mart bag the whole way, but it's all about what you're willing to endure. A better bag also means carrying less clothes to bundle up in at night. You could lose significant weight with a down bag around $100-$120 or even more for more expensive bags.
I seen a few of those walmart bags left in shelters in 2012, they just aren't made for what we do.

Listen to this guy - this is a very good comment and I agree wholeheartedly - - I have spent some absolutely miserable nights out with good gear - - it sucks and it ruins your whole day

[G-FOURce]

i believe it has been mentioned earlier in this thread, but i would absolutely reach out to the seller and see if they'll accept a return on the item since what you received was not what was described. if they're disagreeable, then i would file a dispute with eBay and let them resolve it.

[The Cleaner]

Steep& Cheap has a good MH bag on today,Better hurry...

[Hosaphone]

Buy this, quick: http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php?90422-REI-Sub-Kilo-20Degree-750-fill-down-sleeping-bag

If not, then this:


Push back your start date to April. This sleeping bag sounds pretty worthless for March. Also if you start in April you will be able to swap out for a cheap lightweight fleece blanket earlier in Virginia which will lighten your load. March is not a good month for going on the cheap.

[G-FOURce]

Buy this, quick: http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php?90422-REI-Sub-Kilo-20Degree-750-fill-down-sleeping-bag

i tried to buy it a week ago but he's holding it for his brother. its a good price if you can get it.

[Hosaphone]

i tried to buy it a week ago but he's holding it for his brother. its a good price if you can get it.

Ahhh, didn't see the original posting date.

[Tinker]

Craigslist - buy a good used sleeping bag. Folks have hiked the AT before without so much as a poncho for emergency rain protection (most have been lucky enough to find room each night in a shelter). Don't skimp on your sleeping bag. In my opinion it's only second in importantance as a piece of gear- your footwear being first.

Ps. Do yourself a favor - don't try "beating the crowds" by leaving in March - that's when "the crowds" leave these days. In the days before the 1990s nearly everybody hiking northbound left in early to mid April. You'll start off carrying fewer warm clothes, less food, and therefore, you'll hike farther, faster, and with less effort. Leave too early and you'll spend too much time in town waiting out bad weather.

Or...............you could hike southbound and not worry (right away) about having warm gear - you can learn as you go. Of course, many more people start a thruhike than finish, but we'll assume that you will complete the hike.

As far as the tent floor is concerned, you'll probably be better off putting a piece of 4 mil plastic inside the tent to cover the floor than trying to recoat old nylon. Once it's dirty you need to get it as close to clean as new as possible before you recoat it, and often recoating can add more weight than a piece of plastic.

[starbright]

Thanks everyone for the advice. But it is a question of three bags not just one. Two of my kids are going to and they have the same bag.

As for the tent it is new but with no returns. I didnt notice the no returns until I had already purchased them. It read right and was the weight that I was looking for. I compaired what it said to tents at REI and Campmore and it had the same material and weight to ones there so I thought great I'm really getting a good deal. Until I recieved it and it was nothing like it said so I have to make it work. Purchased three of them two are the same and the other is a little different my son is 6'3" so he needed one a little longer. They all came from same seller. I did contact seller and they told me that it's not their fault that someone put the wrong dicription and because they put on there no returns ebay said there was nothing that I could do about it. So I'm stuck with them.

[Don H]

Who other than the seller puts a description on an eBay add?
So a seller can misrepresent an item on eBay and they're not responsible?
Please tell us the sellers name so we all will know not to deal with them!
Did you mention that you are very willing to leave bad feedback?
Did you use a credit card to make the purchase? If so you can stop payment if it hasn't been 30(?) days.

Sorry, I wouldn't put up with that kind of treatment.

[starbright]

http://thumbs4.ebaystatic.com/m/mkL6OYRDMTrQjzhhLzLw3Mw/96.jpg (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Snugpak-92870-Tent-Scorpion-2-Polyurethane-Aluminum-/370685402443?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item564e925d4b)http://thumbs4.ebaystatic.com/m/mp8-ZpAF8zVjXuST_Il4zeQ/96.jpg (http://www.ebay.com/itm/HLY-Z2003-Double-Person-Single-Layer-Family-Outdoor-Hiking-Camping-Folding-Tent-/130829497191?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1e760bb367)The first tent is what I thought I was getting and the second is what I got. I went back on ebay to get the seller name and info but the seller has either changed their id or not on there now because I could not find them. When I went thru my buying options it said seller could not be found that their store no longer existed. I did find many other sellers that have the tent that I recieved on there but the dicription matches the tent. The first picture listed is a different color than the one that I thought I was getting but other wise looks pretty much like it. The wording for the second matched a tent
on REI so I thought that I was getting a great deal.


Please help on making the second tent work for the AT.

[Papa D]

you're trying to thru hike with two kids too? on a tight budget? mmmm - I might sound like Lone Wolf here but good luck with this. Stuff goes wrong on the trail - - a resourceful solo hiker has options and can dodge and roll but with kids? I don't know - - how old are these kids?

[WalksInDark]

Both E-Bay and Paypal have buyer protection clauses. E-Bay, for example, will open a case if a seller has sold something that does not fit the description they placed in their ad.

I would follow up with both of those avenues first. Lastly, did you per chance send your payment via the mail...or better yet, did you pay with a USPS money order? If you did , you have lots of avenues to get your money back via the USPS.

Good luck!

[MuddyWaters]

Looks waterproof doesnt cut it.
The tent needs to be waterproof
Or you and your sleeping gear will be wet.

Usual way to test is put newspaper inside and turn sprinkler on or wait till it rains. Check in few hrs.


If you keep the tent, check if the seams are taped on the inside. If they arent, they will all need to be sealed.
I doubt the design is very good, or the fabric is very waterproof.

You dont need a floor in the tent at all. Particularly if it isnt waterproof. It will just turn into heavy wet weight .
A piece of tyvek makes an OK waterproof floor.
You will want tyvek anyway for putting under you when you sleep in shelters.
couple sticks and rocks under the edges on uphill side will let water run under no problem.

Careful site selection where the water drains away from you is all thats needed to do without a bathtub floor.. Whats above you is more critical.

You could always sew a tyvek floor in to for cheap

Guy in my scout troop sleeps in a cheap walmart kids tent. He has to sleep cata-corner to fit. When it rains he puts a blue plastic tarp over the tent, stays dry and snug. not the lightest solution.

Plenty of people hiked the trail in the past with few of the comforts most have today. They might have been exceptional people though. Even with the gear today, 80% still dont make it. 25% dont make it out of Georgia. 20% dont make it past Neel Gap.

[Train Wreck]

Starbright, did you use Paypal to pay for the tent? If you did, Paypal - not the seller - will refund your money, so it doesn't matter if the seller disappeared. In fact, it will probably validate your claim all the more.

[starbright]

you're trying to thru hike with two kids too? on a tight budget? mmmm - I might sound like Lone Wolf here but good luck with this. Stuff goes wrong on the trail - - a resourceful solo hiker has options and can dodge and roll but with kids? I don't know - - how old are these kids?



Ok to clarify my kids are 22 and 17 years old I call them kids, sorry for the confusion.
Tight budget yes, but they have their own money saved for the trail.
I ordered the tents because it was easier to get them all at the same time.




did you per chance send your payment via the mail...or better yet, did you pay with a USPS money order?

No I paid with paypal. They told me that the seller has closed all accounts that were used when I made my purchase so there was nothing that they could do. But that they are still investigating it because I was not the only one that this happened to. Apparently someone bought alot of tents like the one that I recieved from another seller and then posted pictures and info for other tents that where on ebay at that time to get the money then sent everyone the other tent.

At least I know that I'm not the only one that this happened to. Just wish I had know before it happened. Now got to figure out how to fix tent.

[Train Wreck]

Ok to clarify my kids are 22 and 17 years old I call them kids, sorry for the confusion.
Tight budget yes, but they have their own money saved for the trail.
I ordered the tents because it was easier to get them all at the same time.





No I paid with paypal. They told me that the seller has closed all accounts that were used when I made my purchase so there was nothing that they could do. But that they are still investigating it because I was not the only one that this happened to. Apparently someone bought alot of tents like the one that I recieved from another seller and then posted pictures and info for other tents that where on ebay at that time to get the money then sent everyone the other tent.

At least I know that I'm not the only one that this happened to. Just wish I had know before it happened. Now got to figure out how to fix tent.

That doesn't sound right. I thought that was the whole point of Paypal instituting that policy, to provide a sort of "insurance" if the purchase went sour. Otherwise bad sellers could routinely do this, which is no kind of "purchase protection" at all. I understand you need to fix your immediate problem but I would stay on Paypal's case about it.

[MuddyWaters]

Funds are released when tracking shows the package delivered.
They either had a paypal link to a credit card or checking acct.
I suppose if you empty the acct or close the credit card, Paypal cannot do much.

Hard to believe they could do it so quick that everyone was screwed.

Ive had one paypal dispute with a retailer. Paypal decided in my favor in just a few hrs and refunded my money. That quick.

[Train Wreck]

Funds are released when tracking shows the package delivered.
They either had a paypal link to a credit card or checking acct.
I suppose if you empty the acct or close the credit card, Paypal cannot do much.

Hard to believe they could do it so quick that everyone was screwed.

Ive had one paypal dispute with a retailer. Paypal decided in my favor in just a few hrs and refunded my money. That quick.

It was my impression that Paypal almost acted as an underwriter of sorts, especially after eBay forced buyers/sellers to use Paypal and pretty much eliminated other forms of payment. Anyway, I guess the responses need to get back to fixing the tent situation.

[starbright]

I've been fighting this for almost 3 weeks. They told me yesterday that they were still investigating but there was nothing else they could do.

What I don't understand about it was that they showed to have a good rating and lots of sales with great feedback then all this happened.

I'm just wondering if they had the same problem that I did one time. Someone in Australia got into my account and was trying to sell cell phones on it. Luckly they caught it in time and called me to see why I had not changed my information on where I was located.

The seller that I got these from was showing out of NJ. And the tent was sent from Japan. So I don't know who I actually ordered from. I think this is why they are having so many problems trying to find them.

[Papa D]

Ok to clarify my kids are 22 and 17 years old I call them kids, sorry for the confusion.
Tight budget yes, but they have their own money saved for the trail.
I ordered the tents because it was easier to get them all at the same time.






No I paid with paypal. They told me that the seller has closed all accounts that were used when I made my purchase so there was nothing that they could do. But that they are still investigating it because I was not the only one that this happened to. Apparently someone bought alot of tents like the one that I recieved from another seller and then posted pictures and info for other tents that where on ebay at that time to get the money then sent everyone the other tent.

At least I know that I'm not the only one that this happened to. Just wish I had know before it happened. Now got to figure out how to fix tent.

Oh - ok that's better - good - last year we had a crazy mom and a bunch of little wild kids loose in Virginia and it was wild there (and here)

[Papa D]

I've been fighting this for almost 3 weeks. They told me yesterday that they were still investigating but there was nothing else they could do.

What I don't understand about it was that they showed to have a good rating and lots of sales with great feedback then all this happened.

I'm just wondering if they had the same problem that I did one time. Someone in Australia got into my account and was trying to sell cell phones on it. Luckly they caught it in time and called me to see why I had not changed my information on where I was located.

The seller that I got these from was showing out of NJ. And the tent was sent from Japan. So I don't know who I actually ordered from. I think this is why they are having so many problems trying to find them.

I have a friend who is an absolute E-Bay EXPERT - he has one or two E-Bay stores and he makes his living on E-Bay (he sells antique printing presses, antique watches, and all sorts of stuff) - - anyway, if you want to P/M me, I'll give you his e-mail info - he's a helpful guy and might have some e-bay tricks for you. Just an idea ....