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alxflwrs
02-08-2013, 21:50
So, I've researched a little and it seems these practices were mostly cracked down on back in 06/07/08. It's been 5 years since then, so I'm wondering--

Are there still undercover officers riding the Cog, looking to charge anyone who moons it?

Anyone going to participate in Hike Naked Day?
(As for Hike Naked, I'll probably find a hidden forest clearing, and spend a few hours there with no pack and be free and au naturale. Many people have strong opinions on this.)

Again, many people have strong opinions on this, and BEFORE you reply, REMEMBER HYOH and--if they decide to do it they understand the certain risks they're undertaking. I.E.--No Nudity BASHING--but you can respectfully disagree.

S'more
02-08-2013, 23:20
Eh. I don't care. HYOH. If it floats your boat,it's all good.

Zippy Morocco
02-09-2013, 00:15
This reminds me of my first AT hike. For several weeks I was keeping pace with a nudist hiker. There was certainly a buzz around about him but never anything too mean. He was a nice man and certainly HYOHed. Wish I could remember his name? Curious to know if he made it. I was only section hiking at the time.

I've never had the nerve nor desire for hike naked day. I suppose I am too shy.

As for the morning bit. I'm going to have to go Google that.

Sarcasm the elf
02-09-2013, 00:15
I'm fine with hike naked day in theory just as long as folks use a bit of tact. Bareassing a bunch of families traveling on the cog railway is a great way to make people dislike the hiking community as a whole. If you want to hike naked in a remote area then go for it, but try to avoid popular tourist areas and especially don't do it in a way that's purposely intended to be disrespectful and offensive. Just my two cents.

pyroman9
02-09-2013, 00:41
Hiking naked was epic! We were up in maine by the time the summer solstice came around last year. It was priceless because the three of us hiked completely naked for about 10 miles or so. After that the chafing on the back from the pack started to hurt. Hiking on a exposed ridge was the best part - so freeing!!! It was priceless when a southbounder walked up and obviously did not know what day it was. very funny!

As far as doing it on the trail - be smart... we had bandana's tucked in a waist band ready to deploy at any time. We also had a hiker who did not want to hike naked hike a few hundred yards ahead as a lookout for kids. And please do not do it in a public spot where there are youngings and families out for a day hike. it may be a thru hiker tradition but you have to be smart... in those cases hike in just a speedo or something that is close to it but just as funny - AND LEGAL! lol

Northern Lights
02-09-2013, 00:41
I was coming out of the Smokies in May of this passed year and someone thought it was hike naked day. As I came around a bend in the trail I saw someone up ahead pulling a shirt over their head. As we approached each other, it was a lady about 80. Shiver me timbers! Glad I didn't sneak up on her :eek:

Slo-go'en
02-09-2013, 01:32
I happen to know one of the state troopers who was on the "cog mooning sting". To hear him relate the story is halrious. Several hikers got slapped with a significant fine for their fun. As far as I know this was only done that one time, but should it become a problem again, it could happen. Bare your butt and take your chances...

Coffee Rules!
02-09-2013, 02:09
I don't know the layout of the terrain or the distance between the Cog and mooning spots on the trail, but I'd sure like to know (or maybe I wouldn't) how they could prove it was my a** they saw. I don't really care one way or the other about the right or wrong aspects of it. It's mooning, for f***'s sake. No one is wagging their junk in anyone's face. IF I make it that far next year, and there happens to be a train going by at the right moment, I guess I'll decide then and there.

As for hiking nekkid, this kid won't be participating. Nothing against others who may want to, but I'll pass. Rock on with your bad self if you have the guts.

jesse
02-09-2013, 03:01
...how they could prove it was my a** they saw...

Simple. you pay a fine of a few hundred bucks, or get a lawyer and spend thousands to beat 'um.

rocketsocks
02-09-2013, 03:01
I don't know the layout of the terrain or the distance between the Cog and mooning spots on the trail, but I'd sure like to know (or maybe I wouldn't) how they could prove it was my a** they saw. I don't really care one way or the other about the right or wrong aspects of it. It's mooning, for f***'s sake. No one is wagging their junk in anyone's face. IF I make it that far next year, and there happens to be a train going by at the right moment, I guess I'll decide then and there.

As for hiking nekkid, this kid won't be participating. Nothing against others who may want to, but I'll pass. Rock on with your bad self if you have the guts.I hear ya...moon, sure why not, hike necked day, probably most definitely NOT.


19554

Coffee Rules!
02-09-2013, 03:20
Simple. you pay a fine of a few hundred bucks, or get a lawyer and spend thousands to beat 'um.

That's their thinking, I'm sure. Along with knowing you don't want to go back months later just to go to court. A charge like that I might very well be willing to be the guy who went to court with a fool (myself) for a lawyer. In THEORY it shouldn't take anything more than saying, "PROVE that it was MY buttocks you saw." Impossible to prove, but the system is stacked against the little guy.

OzJacko
02-09-2013, 03:20
I don't know the layout of the terrain or the distance between the Cog and mooning spots on the trail, but I'd sure like to know (or maybe I wouldn't) how they could prove it was my a** they saw. I don't really care one way or the other about the right or wrong aspects of it. It's mooning, for f***'s sake. No one is wagging their junk in anyone's face. IF I make it that far next year, and there happens to be a train going by at the right moment, I guess I'll decide then and there.

As for hiking nekkid, this kid won't be participating. Nothing against others who may want to, but I'll pass. Rock on with your bad self if you have the guts.

ditto """"" It was bad enough for the calendar shoot. I ain't doing it again!

rocketsocks
02-09-2013, 03:35
That's their thinking, I'm sure. Along with knowing you don't want to go back months later just to go to court. A charge like that I might very well be willing to be the guy who went to court with a fool (myself) for a lawyer. In THEORY it shouldn't take anything more than saying, "PROVE that it was MY buttocks you saw." Impossible to prove, but the system is stacked against the little guy.uh yeah your honorship, yeah I'm here proce, and ah what i want you to no, i mean I mean...I throw myself, my whole self on the court reporter....cause dammmmmmmn

Coffee Rules!
02-09-2013, 03:41
uh yeah your honorship, yeah I'm here proce, and ah what i want you to no, i mean I mean...I throw myself, my whole self on the court reporter....cause dammmmmmmn

+10..................

rocketsocks
02-09-2013, 03:47
+10..................What can I say...it's late and i'm punchy...no no I mean lately I've wanted to punch somebody..no no I mean punchy ran away and it's gettin late, yeah yeah that's it...i think.hehe

Coffee Rules!
02-09-2013, 04:09
Looks more like you've been at the punch...spiked punch.

WingedMonkey
02-09-2013, 06:01
It's a matter of perspective.

Adam Levine mooning the Cog is entertaining, Chris Christie mooning the Cog is obscene.

Lone Wolf
02-09-2013, 08:16
So, I've researched a little and it seems these practices were mostly cracked down on back in 06/07/08. It's been 5 years since then, so I'm wondering--

Are there still undercover officers riding the Cog, looking to charge anyone who moons it?


if you like showing your naked butt to little kids then go for it. stupid thing to do though. it's not a HYOH thing

rocketsocks
02-09-2013, 08:35
if you like showing your naked butt to little kids then go for it. stupid thing to do though. it's not a HYOH thingYa know....when ya put it like that....it's criminal....best to keep the cheeks at home.

Robin2013AT
02-09-2013, 08:38
OK guilty as charged. We hiked 2 weeks in the Swiss Alps and saw very few people. The journey ended at the Jungfau where there is a tourist train up to the top. There were zillions of people there (we knew by their waistlines we weren't in Oz anymore). We were the ONLY ones hiking up and they were staring at us like we were doing something crazy (hiking in the Alps!). After the fourth train went by we mooned the fifth. It seemed appropriate at the time.

colorado_rob
02-09-2013, 09:09
So, I've researched a little and it seems these practices were mostly cracked down on back in 06/07/08. It's been 5 years since then, so I'm wondering--

Are there still undercover officers riding the Cog, looking to charge anyone who moons it?

. Charge them with WHAT? Is this act somehow illegal back there????

Karma13
02-09-2013, 09:19
Indecent exposure, I imagine. Which these days is probably an actual sex offense.

rocketsocks
02-09-2013, 09:22
OK guilty as charged. We hiked 2 weeks in the Swiss Alps and saw very few people. The journey ended at the Jungfau where there is a tourist train up to the top. There were zillions of people there (we knew by their waistlines we weren't in Oz anymore). We were the ONLY ones hiking up and they were staring at us like we were doing something crazy (hiking in the Alps!). After the fourth train went by we mooned the fifth. It seemed appropriate at the time.Hey, I hear ya, let your freak flag fly...but iffin some mother wants to press charges, and gets in the ear of some prosecutor about how little johnny is scared for life....it could be "Katie bar the door" and "Bailiff, whack his PeePee"and that'd be gettin off light

garlic08
02-09-2013, 09:38
Indecent exposure, I imagine. Which these days is probably an actual sex offense.

Somebody had to say it. It's sad, but true. Do you really want to be a registered sexual offender for the rest of your life?

Lyle
02-09-2013, 09:45
Yeah, in the scheme of things, we live in a VERY prudish society, unfortunately.

T-Rx
02-09-2013, 09:56
Mooning might be a possibility, but hiking naked is not for me. It maybe for you though if your trail name is tripod.

:D

Northern Lights
02-09-2013, 10:59
Personally I have no desire to see someone's hairy ass hanging out :eek:

peakbagger
02-09-2013, 11:07
The USFS has a special regulation in effect that bascially bans all nudity in the WMNF. Given the limited staffing I expect that enofrcement is low on most staff's priorities. Unfortunately the cog is a very profitable money maker and the owners have political connections, therefore rules of importance to the cog get enforced. Unlike the old days, the AT crosses the cog very close to the summit operation so the folks on the cog arent the only ones who get a view, all the car loads and vans also get a view. If one child get a view, I think the individual could be prosecuted for child sexual offenses. The concept of mooning the cog was partially dirven by its belching of soot and sulfur from a very primative coal boiler. They now predominately run biodiesel driven trains that sound like a tractor trailer rig coming up the mountain so they can claim to be "green". They still do run the coal trains on occasion and charge extra.

alxflwrs
02-09-2013, 11:13
Yeah in my research the mooning of the cog was in protest to its noise, pollution, and general capitalistic endeavor. I've never been to the spot where mooning takes place. Maybe I'll do it for a split second to say I did it, who knows.

alxflwrs
02-09-2013, 11:14
Apparently because it's apart of the NFS you get a FEDERAL ticket/citation because you're on gubbament property.

Karma13
02-09-2013, 11:17
Instead of mooning the cog, I'll just watch Southbounders again. ;)

Slo-go'en
02-09-2013, 11:19
In THEORY it shouldn't take anything more than saying, "PROVE that it was MY buttocks you saw." Impossible to prove, but the system is stacked against the little guy.

In the cases where hikers were busted, it was pretty easy to prove. The FS ranger and the state trooper walked up to them while they had thier pants down and tapped them on the shoulder. They were issued the fine right there on the spot. They were given a choice, a $500 fine (I forget the catagory) or a $200 fine for indecent exposure and your name on the sex offender list.

I'm pretty sure the Cog right of way is still private property, just like the auto road.

Coffee Rules!
02-09-2013, 11:23
In the cases where hikers were busted, it was pretty easy to prove. The FS ranger and the state trooper walked up to them while they had thier pants down and tapped them on the shoulder.

Well that's a whole new kettle of fish. Like I said, not familiar with the turf.

Coffee Rules!
02-09-2013, 11:24
A whole new kettle of fish and they deserved what they got for being stupid.

Lone Wolf
02-09-2013, 11:25
Yeah in my research the mooning of the cog was in protest to its noise, pollution, and general capitalistic endeavor. I've never been to the spot where mooning takes place. Maybe I'll do it for a split second to say I did it, who knows.

just a buncha sheeple hypocrites do it

WingedMonkey
02-09-2013, 11:50
Indecent exposure, I imagine. Which these days is probably an actual sex offense.

I'm not sure which states on the AT consider it criminal to sleep with your unmarried partner. Yet we read daily about hikers sharing tents and hostels and hotels with their girlfriend, boyfriend, fiancee, or what ever they want to call it.

Maybe it's time for some undercover police and some jail time?

Mountain Mike
02-09-2013, 11:57
A friend of mine did a three page article about obscure laws still on the books. How many of you have passed a car in RI without beeping your horn? That's illegal. & if a woman drives a car in that state without a man 50' in front carrying a lantern, same. To much thread drift to go on. If you are going to play, be prepared to pay.

Bobby
02-09-2013, 14:20
I did both in 98 when I was 25. Naked hiking - just my luck I came up on a very pretty young woman hiking in the other direction. I very quickly put my shorts on so as not to offend. Didn't hike naked after that. too aware of others. Than again I saw lots of naked hikers out west, but they were mostly traveling in groups. I think there is something extra creepy about people (alone) walking around in the woods naked. A gaggle of naked hikers some how seems much more OK.

Mooned the cog too - no big deal. Probably wouldn't bother today, but only because I'm lazy and don't really give a ****!
I say to each his own, but just remember there are potential consequences for all sorts of things that people do everyday - you've got to be willing to handle all that comes

Blissful
02-09-2013, 14:56
HYOH doesn't mean you get to selfishly do whatever you want and the heck with anyone else.

If you don't care about laws, then at least realize the AT is also frequently traveled by youth groups and families. Care about them

Head for the naked beaches in Europe if you really feel the need to depart from clothing.

quilteresq
02-09-2013, 15:22
Interesting - giving you a choice on the charges. It makes sense from a prosecutorial point of view. I won't be doing it as I know the federal magistrate judge in NH - wouldn't really want to have to explain it to her. Pretty sure no one would want to see me on hike nekkid day anyway. Too old.

evan_rolltide
02-09-2013, 19:03
People don't care if their children watch people burn alive and get their heads blown off and even get raped on TV..... it's just consensual sex and nudity they have a problem with.

Miner
02-09-2013, 19:15
The day I climbed Mt. Washington and passed the cog, the wind chill was well below freezing. Considering how bundled up I was, I can't imagine anyone who would have wanted to expose their flesh that day. As for hike naked day, I can't help but think of mosquitos and sunburn in the worst possible places.

Rasty
02-09-2013, 19:20
Yeah, in the scheme of things, we live in a VERY prudish society, unfortunately.

If you mooned me it would be funny. Mooning my young daughters would not be funny. The tourists areas are usually infested with kids so mooning the cog is intending to expose yourself to children. Maybe I'm a prude?

alxflwrs
02-09-2013, 20:04
People don't care if their children watch people burn alive and get their heads blown off and even get raped on TV..... it's just consensual sex and nudity they have a problem with.
AMEN.


People shouldn't be so prudish and ashamed of their bodies.

alxflwrs
02-09-2013, 20:06
If you mooned me it would be funny. Mooning my young daughters would not be funny. The tourists areas are usually infested with kids so mooning the cog is intending to expose yourself to children. Maybe I'm a prude?

If some stranger ran up out of nowhere and exposed only his butt-crack (absolutely no hole or genitalia) I wouldn't expect my daughter to be scarred for life. I would turn to her and say, "well honey, that is what the butt of a grownup looks like." I don't see the absurdity...especially since the hypothetical isn't that one would be running up within 100 feet of a child and expose their butt.

Is having a speedo on indecent exposure?

rickb
02-09-2013, 20:15
AMEN.


People shouldn't be so prudish and ashamed of their bodies.



While I tend to agree with you, others don't.

If the cost of respecting their different way of thinking is to keep your pants up, I can't see why any considerate person should do otherwise.

I do not believe those dropping their pants are driven to do so out of any deeply held sense of principle, that would outweigh being respectful of others' feelings-- be they misguided or not.

alxflwrs
02-09-2013, 20:33
While I tend to agree with you, others don't.

If the cost of respecting their different way of thinking is to keep your pants up, I can't see why any considerate person should do otherwise.

I do not believe those dropping their pants are driven to do so out of any deeply held sense of principle, that would outweigh being respectful of others' feelings-- be they misguided or not.

Hmm. I honestly can't disagree--but I will be quite offended if I am minding my own business, in my camp far from the beaten path, quite innocuously cooking or enjoying nature to have some hiker approach my camp and tell me to put clothes on. I'm talking at least a hundred yards from the trail...Isn't that then on them for sort of coming into my space?

I can't think of a reasoning that would permit me to actively hike in an area where I know the likelihood of seeing someone is high, but if I find a private space to just be naked (never anything sexual) and you come into my zone, then that's on you.

In my opinion.

Northern Lights
02-09-2013, 22:08
Is having a speedo on indecent exposure?

In some cases it should be :o

Northern Lights
02-09-2013, 22:16
People don't care if their children watch people burn alive and get their heads blown off and even get raped on TV..... it's just consensual sex and nudity they have a problem with.

I don't have an issue with consensual sex or nudity, I have an issue with not respecting that you may be exposing yourself to children. It used to be, years ago before watching people burn alive, rapes or get their heads blown off on tv, that we had respect for something. To each his own, but if I had a young child and someone mooned in their presence that person would get an earful from me. Heck even if it wasn't my child I still would. If we don't draw the line somewhere then it will just continue to escalate and at some point everyone will think it's ok to drop your trousers and waggle your gaggle at the train.

atmilkman
02-09-2013, 22:29
Hmm. I honestly can't disagree--but I will be quite offended if I am minding my own business, in my camp far from the beaten path, quite innocuously cooking or enjoying nature to have some hiker approach my camp and tell me to put clothes on. I'm talking at least a hundred yards from the trail...Isn't that then on them for sort of coming into my space?

I can't think of a reasoning that would permit me to actively hike in an area where I know the likelihood of seeing someone is high, but if I find a private space to just be naked (never anything sexual) and you come into my zone, then that's on you.

In my opinion.
Be careful cooking in camp. Don't sit to close to the fire, you might roast the wrong weenie.

Train Wreck
02-09-2013, 23:50
Hmm. I honestly can't disagree--but I will be quite offended if I am minding my own business, in my camp far from the beaten path, quite innocuously cooking or enjoying nature to have some hiker approach my camp and tell me to put clothes on. I'm talking at least a hundred yards from the trail...Isn't that then on them for sort of coming into my space?

I can't think of a reasoning that would permit me to actively hike in an area where I know the likelihood of seeing someone is high, but if I find a private space to just be naked (never anything sexual) and you come into my zone, then that's on you.

In my opinion.

You were looking for a trail name in another thread. If this is indeed the way you wanna roll, you may very well end up with the moniker "Nude Dude"

JAK
02-09-2013, 23:59
You can moon someone and be friends. Just don't befriend someone's moon.

rocketsocks
02-10-2013, 00:13
You can moon someone and be friends. Just don't befriend someone's moon.Point taken...wait , what, never mind.

rocketsocks
02-10-2013, 00:16
You were looking for a trail name in another thread. If this is indeed the way you wanna roll, you may very well end up with the moniker "Nude Dude"And let hike naked day be known as ..."Dress Down Day" hither mor', and remember boy's, if you ain't comando, it's a skirt...not a kilt...

Don't wear a skirt..lest you want to! tee hee

prain4u
02-10-2013, 02:43
I found this photo online of someone actual holding up their "United States District Court Violation Notice" :

http://www.flickr.com/photos/studiofluid/1315190599/

The citation was for "Public Nudity--Buttocks" and the fine was $125. The regulation that was allegedly violated was: 36 CFR 261.58 (j).

I looked that up:

Title 36: Parks, Forests, and Public Property
CHAPTER II: FOREST SERVICE, DEPARTMENT OF AGRICULTURE
PART 261: PROHIBITIONS
Subpart B: Prohibitions in Areas Designated by Order
261.58 - Occupancy and use.

When provided by an order, the following are prohibited:.......
(j) Being publicly nude.

jesse
02-10-2013, 03:05
People don't care if their children watch people burn alive and get their heads blown off and even get raped on TV..... it's just consensual sex and nudity they have a problem with.

You got kids?

jesse
02-10-2013, 03:22
I don't moon. I don't hike naked. Its about respect. All these hippie wannabe's have no respect for others. LW got it right. They are "follow the crowd" sheeple.

rocketsocks
02-10-2013, 03:54
I found this photo online of someone actual holding up their "United States District Court Violation Notice" :

http://www.flickr.com/photos/studiofluid/1315190599/

The citation was for "Public Nudity--Buttocks" and the fine was $125. The regulation that was allegedly violated was: 36 CFR 261.58 (j).

I looked that up:

Title 36: Parks, Forests, and Public Property
CHAPTER II: FOREST SERVICE, DEPARTMENT OF AGRICULTURE
PART 261: PROHIBITIONS
Subpart B: Prohibitions in Areas Designated by Order
261.58 - Occupancy and use.

When provided by an order, the following are prohibited:.......
(j) Being publicly nude.Righteous bucks!

Bobby
02-10-2013, 08:13
with a few exceptions - this is basically an age thing. younger folks mostly partake and the older folks complain its wrong(in both cases)- just like a lot of other things that happen on the trail and in society in general. I suppose that's why you need to be at least 35 to be President!

Karma13
02-10-2013, 08:15
Can't have the president mooning foreign dignitaries. :D

Lone Wolf
02-10-2013, 08:17
with a few exceptions - this is basically an age thing. younger folks mostly partake and the older folks complain its wrong(in both cases)- just like a lot of other things that happen on the trail and in society in general. I suppose that's why you need to be at least 35 to be President!

i was in my 20s when i first crossed over the cog railroad. i had no desire to show my azz to tourists. back then i said it was a moronic thing to do.. most 20 somethings are sheeple

Bobby
02-10-2013, 08:30
that's why my sentence starts with the words "with a few exceptions."

moldy
02-10-2013, 10:17
It's every thru-hikers duty to communicate the difference between how they got to the top of Mt Washington and how the train riders got there. It's not a successful thru-hike without it. Freedom of speech and expression!

colorado_rob
02-10-2013, 11:39
It blows my mind that mooning would be illegal anywhere in the USA, but further reading shows mixed reviews. Seems like as long as genitals not exposed, it might be OK in some places. Here's from Wiki:

United StatesIn 2006, a Maryland (http://www.whiteblaze.net/wiki/Maryland) state (http://www.whiteblaze.net/wiki/State_court_(United_States)) circuit court (http://www.whiteblaze.net/wiki/Circuit_court) determined that mooning is a form of artistic expression protected by the First Amendment (http://www.whiteblaze.net/wiki/First_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution) as a form of speech (http://www.whiteblaze.net/wiki/Freedom_of_speech).[7] (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/#cite_note-Post-7)[8] (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/#cite_note-8) The court ruled that indecent exposure (http://www.whiteblaze.net/wiki/Indecent_exposure) relates only to exposure of the genitals, adding that even though mooning was a "disgusting" and "demeaning" act to engage in, and had taken place in the presence of a minor, "If exposure of half of the buttocks constituted indecent exposure, any woman wearing a thong (http://www.whiteblaze.net/wiki/Thong_(clothing)) at the beach at Ocean City (http://www.whiteblaze.net/wiki/Ocean_City,_Maryland) would be guilty."[7] (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/#cite_note-Post-7)
Defense attorneys had cited a 1983 case of a woman who was arrested after protesting in front of the U.S. Supreme Court building (http://www.whiteblaze.net/wiki/United_States_Supreme_Court_building) wearing nothing but a cardboard sign that covered the front of her body. In that case, the District of Columbia Court of Appeals (http://www.whiteblaze.net/wiki/District_of_Columbia_Court_of_Appeals) had ruled that indecent exposure is limited to a person's genitalia. No review of the case by a higher court took place since prosecutors dropped the case after the ruling.
In California, an appellate court found in 2000 that mooning does not constitute indecent exposure (and, therefore, does not subject the defendant to sex offender (http://www.whiteblaze.net/wiki/Sex_offender) registration laws) unless it can be proven beyond reasonable doubt that the conduct was sexually motivated.[9] (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/#cite_note-9)


Still researching CO laws, can't find much, except apparently 1st offese of actual nudity is a misdemeanor, repeated convictions can lead to being registered. Sigh, sad state of affairs... probably not as bad as fear-mongers make it out to be.

Miner
02-10-2013, 16:10
I think part of the problem is that the human naked body isn't always such a beautiful thing. As an example, many nudist beaches are full of middle aged fat guys which are a big cause of visual polution on otherwise pristine beaches. If most people exposed their bodies in the wilderness, it would be a blight on the landscape and possibly leading to blindness in extreme cases along those that encounter them. Unless you have a excellent body that belogs on the cover of a magazine, please spare us from the horror.

alxflwrs
02-10-2013, 16:24
It blows my mind that mooning would be illegal anywhere in the USA, but further reading shows mixed reviews. Seems like as long as genitals not exposed, it might be OK in some places. Here's from Wiki:

United StatesIn 2006, a Maryland (http://www.whiteblaze.net/wiki/Maryland) state (http://www.whiteblaze.net/wiki/State_court_(United_States)) circuit court (http://www.whiteblaze.net/wiki/Circuit_court) determined that mooning is a form of artistic expression protected by the First Amendment (http://www.whiteblaze.net/wiki/First_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution) as a form of speech (http://www.whiteblaze.net/wiki/Freedom_of_speech).[7] (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/#cite_note-Post-7)[8] (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/#cite_note-8) The court ruled that indecent exposure (http://www.whiteblaze.net/wiki/Indecent_exposure) relates only to exposure of the genitals, adding that even though mooning was a "disgusting" and "demeaning" act to engage in, and had taken place in the presence of a minor, "If exposure of half of the buttocks constituted indecent exposure, any woman wearing a thong (http://www.whiteblaze.net/wiki/Thong_(clothing)) at the beach at Ocean City (http://www.whiteblaze.net/wiki/Ocean_City,_Maryland) would be guilty."[7] (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/#cite_note-Post-7)
Defense attorneys had cited a 1983 case of a woman who was arrested after protesting in front of the U.S. Supreme Court building (http://www.whiteblaze.net/wiki/United_States_Supreme_Court_building) wearing nothing but a cardboard sign that covered the front of her body. In that case, the District of Columbia Court of Appeals (http://www.whiteblaze.net/wiki/District_of_Columbia_Court_of_Appeals) had ruled that indecent exposure is limited to a person's genitalia. No review of the case by a higher court took place since prosecutors dropped the case after the ruling.
In California, an appellate court found in 2000 that mooning does not constitute indecent exposure (and, therefore, does not subject the defendant to sex offender (http://www.whiteblaze.net/wiki/Sex_offender) registration laws) unless it can be proven beyond reasonable doubt that the conduct was sexually motivated.[9] (http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/#cite_note-9)


Still researching CO laws, can't find much, except apparently 1st offese of actual nudity is a misdemeanor, repeated convictions can lead to being registered. Sigh, sad state of affairs... probably not as bad as fear-mongers make it out to be.


Thanks for the well researched, and well cited post. I appreciate it because it captures my sentiments. I would never think of exposing my genitalia to a child--that's simply abhorrent. Maybe I'll just bring my thong and drop a quarter as the Cog passes...

alxflwrs
02-10-2013, 16:28
I think part of the problem is that the human naked body isn't always such a beautiful thing. As an example, many nudist beaches are full of middle aged fat guys which are a big cause of visual polution on otherwise pristine beaches. If most people exposed their bodies in the wilderness, it would be a blight on the landscape and possibly leading to blindness in extreme cases along those that encounter them. Unless you have a excellent body that belogs on the cover of a magazine, please spare us from the horror.

I'm actually quite offended by this. I am a thin and quite athletic person, so I think I fit your "mold" of what it is to be "fit" to be nude, but that's simply disgraceful. Any person anywhere should be allowed to be naked if they so choose. Why should only someone who is physically fit be allowed to? There's something incredibly ethically messed up about that. It would seem your logic is: "If it's nice to look at, it's okay." And that's even more wrong because then you're making it sexual--because they have a sexually appetising body they're okay to be nude. That's so wrong. I want to see fat people. I want to see extremely hairy people. WE'RE ALL PEOPLE.

Everyone, no matter their body shape, size, or gender identification should be free to be in the clothes they were born in. That's my opinion but I'm just so saddened to see everyone say that if you're not good looking you have no right to be nude. No one has any right to lay their ideas of beauty and body image upon another. Just because you're uncomfortable in your skin doesn't mean you should put that sentiment on anyone else.


And as for all of you saying :these youngsters are just sheepies, they think they're hippies but they're just disrespectful. I think you're making gross generalizations, but frankly, I'm inheriting the earth, and you've had your time on it, so he who dies with the anti-nuditiy sentiment still DIES.

alxflwrs
02-10-2013, 16:30
The human body, no matter it's shape, size, color, quantity, scars, bruises, hair, or other attributions is absolutely the most beautiful thing that God ever created. I don't mean the JudeoChristian God, I mean God as in the Absolute.

If you can't appreciate the human form in a non sexual, non shameful, and completely platonic way then how the HELL are you going to appreciate the trail in all its colors, sizes, scars, shapes, curves and crags?

Capt Nat
02-10-2013, 16:44
Mr. alxflwrs, you're coming across as goofy. We invented clothes for protection from the elements and because we don't want to see each other naked. The only place you're going to be able to display your "beautiful body" freely is in jail. That's because as a society, we've decided that we want to have the protection from having to see that "beautiful body". Our time is not up, you've not inherited the world, and clothes will live longer than you will...

Lone Wolf
02-10-2013, 16:52
I'm actually quite offended by this. I am a thin and quite athletic person, so I think I fit your "mold" of what it is to be "fit" to be nude, but that's simply disgraceful. Any person anywhere should be allowed to be naked if they so choose. Why should only someone who is physically fit be allowed to? There's something incredibly ethically messed up about that. It would seem your logic is: "If it's nice to look at, it's okay." And that's even more wrong because then you're making it sexual--because they have a sexually appetising body they're okay to be nude. That's so wrong. I want to see fat people. I want to see extremely hairy people. WE'RE ALL PEOPLE.

Everyone, no matter their body shape, size, or gender identification should be free to be in the clothes they were born in. That's my opinion but I'm just so saddened to see everyone say that if you're not good looking you have no right to be nude. No one has any right to lay their ideas of beauty and body image upon another. Just because you're uncomfortable in your skin doesn't mean you should put that sentiment on anyone else.


And as for all of you saying :these youngsters are just sheepies, they think they're hippies but they're just disrespectful. I think you're making gross generalizations, but frankly, I'm inheriting the earth, and you've had your time on it, so he who dies with the anti-nuditiy sentiment still DIES.


The human body, no matter it's shape, size, color, quantity, scars, bruises, hair, or other attributions is absolutely the most beautiful thing that God ever created. I don't mean the JudeoChristian God, I mean God as in the Absolute.

If you can't appreciate the human form in a non sexual, non shameful, and completely platonic way then how the HELL are you going to appreciate the trail in all its colors, sizes, scars, shapes, curves and crags?

grip time.....

hikerboy57
02-10-2013, 17:02
if god didnt want us to wear clothes, we would have fur.

Darwin13
02-10-2013, 17:16
The human body is a shameful and sinful creation and everyone should feel shame and embarrassment about their naked selves. Furthermore, sex and pooping are shameful as well and all children should be taught to be ashamed of being naked or even thinking about taking a crap.

rocketsocks
02-10-2013, 17:20
The human body is a shameful and sinful creation and everyone should feel shame and embarrassment about their naked selves. Furthermore, sex and pooping are shameful as well and all children should be taught to be ashamed of being naked or even thinking about taking a crap.huh, ya lost me at poopin:-?

Tundra
02-10-2013, 17:21
I'm actually quite offended by this. I am a thin and quite athletic person, so I think I fit your "mold" of what it is to be "fit" to be nude, but that's simply disgraceful. Any person anywhere should be allowed to be naked if they so choose. Why should only someone who is physically fit be allowed to? There's something incredibly ethically messed up about that. It would seem your logic is: "If it's nice to look at, it's okay." And that's even more wrong because then you're making it sexual--because they have a sexually appetising body they're okay to be nude. That's so wrong. I want to see fat people. I want to see extremely hairy people. WE'RE ALL PEOPLE.

Everyone, no matter their body shape, size, or gender identification should be free to be in the clothes they were born in. That's my opinion but I'm just so saddened to see everyone say that if you're not good looking you have no right to be nude. No one has any right to lay their ideas of beauty and body image upon another. Just because you're uncomfortable in your skin doesn't mean you should put that sentiment on anyone else.


And as for all of you saying :these youngsters are just sheepies, they think they're hippies but they're just disrespectful. I think you're making gross generalizations, but frankly, I'm inheriting the earth, and you've had your time on it, so he who dies with the anti-nuditiy sentiment still DIES.

I agree, well said. Only in America are we so prude that a naked body is wrong or obscene. Only allowing the attractive to be nude is a gross form of discrimination. If you think a child seeing a naked ass is grounds for registering than you better start registering millions of parents, siblings and such. An ass is an ass and there seems to be quite a few on this thread. I'm not talking about flashing genitalia for sexual pleasure, I'm not talking everybody or anybody walking around naked. I'm just saying if a naked butt offends you, you're probably an ass.

rocketsocks
02-10-2013, 17:22
Mr. alxflwrs, you're coming across as goofy. We invented clothes for protection from the elements and because we don't want to see each other naked. The only place you're going to be able to display your "beautiful body" freely is in jail. That's because as a society, we've decided that we want to have the protection from having to see that "beautiful body". Our time is not up, you've not inherited the world, and clothes will live longer than you will...Hence the term "Bump ugly's"

rocketsocks
02-10-2013, 17:30
I agree, well said. Only in America are we so prude that a naked body is wrong or obscene. Only allowing the attractive to be nude is a gross form of discrimination. If you think a child seeing a naked ass is grounds for registering than you better start registering millions of parents, siblings and such. An ass is an ass and there seems to be quite a few on this thread. I'm not talking about flashing genitalia for sexual pleasure, I'm not talking everybody or anybody walking around naked. I'm just saying if a naked butt offends you, you're probably an ass.The law makes very little disticntion it would seem...I am reminded of a movie seen with johnny deep in the court when busted for smuggleing , and he says to the judge "Ah yeah your honorship...What did I really do but bring some plants across an imaginary line" And the judge say's " Well sir, unfortunately the line you crossed was real and the plants were illegal" Next!

Tinker
02-10-2013, 18:06
From original post - "cracked down on"

'Nuff said :D :p

colorado_rob
02-10-2013, 18:06
The law makes very little disticntion it would seem... So, again WHAT IS THE LAW??? Lots of folks on here either saying ir at least implying mooning is illegal. Is it? Can you cite references if you say it is? I can find nothing.

rocketsocks
02-10-2013, 18:24
So, again WHAT IS THE LAW??? Lots of folks on here either saying ir at least implying mooning is illegal. Is it? Can you cite references if you say it is? I can find nothing.I suppose it would fall under indecent expose, or perhaps public lewdness...I think there's a post in this thread where a fella holds up his ticket..No???


here it is

http://www.flickr.com/photos/studiofluid/1315190599/

atmilkman
02-10-2013, 18:28
The only place you're going to be able to display your "beautiful body" freely is in jail.

I'm sure "Big Bubba" would really love this.

Rasty
02-10-2013, 18:56
So, again WHAT IS THE LAW??? Lots of folks on here either saying ir at least implying mooning is illegal. Is it? Can you cite references if you say it is? I can find nothing.


Indecent exposure.

colorado_rob
02-10-2013, 18:59
I suppose it would fall under indecent expose, or perhaps public lewdness...I think there's a post in this thread where a fella holds up his ticket..No???

here it is

http://www.flickr.com/photos/studiofluid/1315190599/ Thank you. Finally some actual evidence that this activity might be thought, at least by some federal "law enforcement officer", illegal. Big question: Was he convicted? I suspect he did not fight it, who has the time. Was he subsequently "registered as a sex offender"? I very seriously doubt it.

Bigger question: is it worth the outside chance of paying a $125 fine to do this moon? Definitely! (IMHO) He is smiling, is he not?

Rasty
02-10-2013, 19:02
Are you really debating if you should show your ass to children?

brian039
02-10-2013, 19:10
If you really just find the human naked form beautiful and want to look at it then why don't you just get naked and look at yourself in your mirror in the privacy of your own home. Or find other people who like to look at other naked people and stand around and look at each other? I don't see why it has to become a public spectacle for you to get enjoyment out of it. That's the creepy part to me.

Lone Wolf
02-10-2013, 19:28
Bigger question: is it worth the outside chance of paying a $125 fine to do this moon? Definitely! (IMHO) He is smiling, is he not?

you got issues or you ain't too bright. or both

hikerboy57
02-10-2013, 19:42
nudity and mooning are 2 different issues. you can appreciate the naked human form(although i would bet most women would tell you they dont find the male body particularly attractive), but mooning is more on the line of lighting farts. nothing at all attractive about it. funny to some, painful to others.
remember this?:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XtzoUu7w-YM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XtzoUu7w-YM

JAK
02-10-2013, 19:48
Lone Wolf and others are right. When there are families and children, back off. Take your fun and games somewhere else. Kids are only young once, and not for very long. Not judging the way the Europeans handle public nudity at many public beaches, but as with alcohol they are much more grown up about it. So time to grow up. If you have to get it out of your system do it alone or among people your own age. In the very least, do something original.

Theosus
02-10-2013, 20:05
Somebody had to say it. It's sad, but true. Do you really want to be a registered sexual offender for the rest of your life?

Yeah unless you're an actor or a sports star, indecent exposure is pretty much a career ender. And unfortunately, being on the sex offender list makes people think you like to diddle little girls in the park (instead of mooning a train or peeing drunkenly in an alley).

Mooning the train sounds funny, but not something I care to do. Hike naked? No thanks, I don't want to inflict my nakedness on anyone. Barefoot is as naked as I get in the woods (although I suspect after three or four days in the woods, I'd be willing to get naked in a stream).

rocketsocks
02-10-2013, 20:48
nudity and mooning are 2 different issues. you can appreciate the naked human form(although i would bet most women would tell you they dont find the male body particularly attractive), but mooning is more on the line of lighting farts. nothing at all attractive about it. funny to some, painful to others.
remember this?:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XtzoUu7w-YM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XtzoUu7w-YMIt's all about the timing...nice
I couldn't do it a third time...glad you did tho.

slow mind
02-10-2013, 22:16
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a9v8hcAezkk
nudity and mooning are 2 different issues. you can appreciate the naked human form(although i would bet most women would tell you they dont find the male body particularly attractive), but mooning is more on the line of lighting farts. nothing at all attractive about it. funny to some, painful to others.
remember this?:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XtzoUu7w-YM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XtzoUu7w-YM

Tundra
02-10-2013, 23:37
Hurry, call the police. Oh my god, he plans to moon a train and there might or might not be kids looking out the window and they might or might not see his white ass. Oh dear god, we have to protect the children. Call Homeland Security too, I bet he's a terrorist. We better close all threads where someone says they're going to drink in a hostel or jump a fence. We wouldn't want to advocate illegal activities. Better close all those posts about carrying a gun without a permit too.

Alligator
02-10-2013, 23:40
AFAIK it is still illegal to moon the Cog. Also AFAIK however public nudity is not forbidden on all parts of the AT, for instance VT. So please do not post about plans to moon the Cog. Public nudity is generally not permitted, however there are exceptions.

rocketsocks
02-10-2013, 23:42
Hurry, call the police. Oh my god, he plans to moon a train and there might or might not be kids looking out the window and they might or might not see his Lilly white ass. Oh dear god, we have to protect the children. Call Homeland Security too, I bet he's a terrorist. We better close all threads where someone says they're going to drink in a hostel or jump a fence. We wouldn't want to advocate illegal activities. Better close all those posts about carrying a gun without a permit too.Fixed it for ya

Tundra
02-10-2013, 23:50
Fixed it for ya
Thanks, rocketsocks. I owe ya. ;)

rocketsocks
02-10-2013, 23:53
Thanks, rocketsocks. I owe ya. ;)No Worries.......:sun

rickb
02-10-2013, 23:55
AFAIK it is still illegal to moon the Cog. Also AFAIK however public nudity is not forbidden on all parts of the AT, for instance VT. So please do not post about plans to moon the Cog. Public nudity is generally not permitted, however there are exceptions.

There are no exceptions on the AT.

Facts matter.

You may be thinking of Brattleboro, VT -- as the laws existed recently.

Alligator
02-11-2013, 00:04
There are no exceptions on the AT.

Facts matter.

You may be thinking of Brattleboro, VT -- as the laws existed recently.Brattleboro was attempting (or did I am not current on that) to ban it. So that means it was not illegal. Last time I checked there was not a statewide regulation on it. If there is, point it out.

Rasty
02-11-2013, 01:02
There are no exceptions on the AT.

Facts matter.

You may be thinking of Brattleboro, VT -- as the laws existed recently.Brattleboro was attempting (or did I am not current on that) to ban it. So that means it was not illegal. Last time I checked there was not a statewide regulation on it. If there is, point it out.

Federal Property?

Another Kevin
02-11-2013, 01:15
I've never mooned the Cog - never had the right combination of weather and inclination.

If I were ever to do Mt Washington again, I might just applique a large crescent moon in yellow on the seat of my black baselayer, and drop my trousers to reveal that. That way, I'd be exposing only contempt for the law.

rocketsocks
02-11-2013, 01:21
I've never mooned the Cog - never had the right combination of weather and inclination.

If I were ever to do Mt Washington again, I might just applique a large crescent moon in yellow on the seat of my black baselayer, and drop my trousers to reveal that. That way, I'd be exposing only contempt for the law.And it's that kind of thinking that makes history...Brilliant!, I like it Kevin

Karma13
02-11-2013, 06:58
actual evidence that this activity might be thought, at least by some federal "law enforcement officer", illegal. Big question: Was he convicted? I suspect he did not fight it, who has the time. Was he subsequently "registered as a sex offender"? I very seriously doubt it.

It doesn't take very much googling to find instances of arrests. Here are some examples I dredged up in two 5-minute google searches. The charges seem to be mostly misdemeanors, ranging from public lewdness to endangering the welfare of a child to indecent exposure.

"A 21-year-old Orlando man, accused of committing a sex crime (http://www.topix.com/forum/city/sanford-fl/THJPA9FDHGJ766IL2) when he mooned a family, today pleaded no contest to a far less serious crime."

"South Carolina fan arrested for mooning (http://deadspin.com/5951768/south-carolina-fan-arrested-for-mooning-the-crowd-at-lsu-game) the crowd at LSU game" and charged with obscenity (http://www.nbc33tv.com/news/crimetracker/%E2%80%98mooning%E2%80%99-in-death-valley)

"Whitehall man arrested after mooning (http://poststar.com/news/blotter/police-whitehall-man-arrested-after-mooning/article_3941487c-0730-11e2-a930-001a4bcf887a.html)"

It looks like it gets much more serious when other charges are involved.

"Fast forward to 1998 when the voters of California passed “Megan’s Law” (PC 290) requiring those convicted of certain sex offences to register with the local police for the rest of their lives. Indecent Exposure (PC 314) is listed under PC 290 (http://www.counterpunch.org/2008/11/18/when-mooning-is-a-sex-crime/) and is applied retroactively."

21-year-old man in New Hampshire faces felony charges after mooning (http://www.topix.com/forum/city/lowell-ma/TUPLSUME9FMG7GBTA)

"He's been charged with two felony counts of indecent exposure (http://blogs.phoenixnewtimes.com/valleyfever/2010/09/mooning-gone-wrong_earns_peori.php), three misdemeanor counts of indecent exposure, and one count of disorderly conduct. Such serious charges are ridiculous, if you ask us. But the moral of the story: keep your ass to yourself."

Interestingly enough, page 3 of that search brings up this thread.

OzJacko
02-11-2013, 07:55
AFAIK it is still illegal to moon the Cog. Also AFAIK however public nudity is not forbidden on all parts of the AT, for instance VT. So please do not post about plans to moon the Cog. Public nudity is generally not permitted, however there are exceptions.
As I don't want to be deported mid hike I will be good and not moon the railway.
I did the nudity thing for the December calendar shoot and don't want to repeat it given how my wife spooked me that people were coming after taking the photo.
I couldn't take another adrenalin rush like that.

Alligator
02-11-2013, 10:23
Federal Property?From what I have read, there is no federal law against public nudity, it is left to the states and municipalities. The Cog situation appears to be an order (as someone posted previously). Orders come from some delegated authority, for instance on National Forests, this is typically the Forest Supervisor. When the Green Mountain NF was closed, it was the Forest Supervisor who did so by order. I have seen references to other federal property were public nudity was prohibited such as some beaches. Given the variety of possible jurisdictions, we primarily focus on AT laws here. We don't have the resources to research ever legal nuance.

Public nudity, indecent exposure, lewd conduct are sometimes defined differently. I'm not a lawyer, I am not advocating anything, but I am pretty certain about parts of VT. Whatever one plans on doing, the consequences are yours alone.

JAK
02-11-2013, 11:03
Why aren't there any threads on whether or not to moon every road crossing, every town.
Bunch of sheep.

Moon the Harper Ferry. lol

Lone Wolf
02-11-2013, 11:06
Why aren't there any threads on whether or not to moon every road crossing, every town.
Bunch of sheep.

Moon the Harper Ferry. lol
i'm sure there's more than 1 in that town

MDSection12
02-11-2013, 11:11
I never thought that mooning was that cool, even in my middle school days when it seemed most popular, but I do think it is a bit worrying that in our culture exposing a little bit of 'crack' can land someone on the sex offender list. This whole 'think of the children' argument scares me... It seems it can be (and often is) used to justify all types of nonsense legislation. Also I've noticed in the last few years that a chick in a thong has been deemed appropriate for cable TV, whereas I don't think it was before... So what's the big deal? We've all got butt cheeks... :eek:

As for hiking naked, that's another story. Exposing genitalia brings up topics that many parents don't want to discuss with their children. Personally I disagree with that, and think education is always the best answer, but I completely support a parent's right to not have that 'education' forced on them on the trail or anywhere in public. I do like the guy that said he did it with a bandana handy, and a clothed hiker out front scouting for other groups. With a few simple preparations like that I think it could be a perfectly harmless, fun tradition.

bfayer
02-11-2013, 12:07
HYOH doesn't mean you get to selfishly do whatever you want and the heck with anyone else.

If you don't care about laws, then at least realize the AT is also frequently traveled by youth groups and families. Care about them

Head for the naked beaches in Europe if you really feel the need to depart from clothing.

Blissful, very often you post what I think. Keep it up, it saves me typing :)

By the way I think we talked for a sec at Annapolis rocks last summer when I was up there with my scouts.

HikerMom58
02-11-2013, 12:49
Blissful, very often you post what I think. Keep it up, it saves me typing :)

By the way I think we talked for a sec at Annapolis rocks last summer when I was up there with my scouts.

Agree with you both-bfayer & Blissful... Isn't it interesting how everything we do & say on or off the trail always boils down to the same ole thing....

Respect for others.... we don't do that well. We want to be free to do what floats our boat. We want everyone else to think, act and believe the same things that we do. It's all about our rights. Our behavior is all over the place... so thoughtful, kind, helpful, selfless and giving. Then,to the opposite extreme:eek: & everything in between. After I read Alligator's post, this thought hit me ... we try hard to govern ourselves & we don't even do that well, sometimes... *sigh* sheeple... it knows no age.

MDSection12
02-11-2013, 12:58
Respect for others.... we don't do that well. We want to be free to do what floats our boat. We want everyone else to think, act and believe the same things that we do. It's all about our rights.
Wanting others to think, act and believe the same things that I do is completely seperate from my rights. I can have the right to do something without wanting or needing others to agree with it. It's called tolerance, and it should be a part of respect, but too often respect only applies to the person whose behavior falls outside of the norm. It is my duty to respect your beliefs by not going against them, but not your duty to respect my beliefs by tolerating them...

Both of our posts are too ambiguous to be applied directly to either situation mentioned in the OP, but I think the thought process is fairly simple to follow.

bfayer
02-11-2013, 13:19
... I can have the right to do something without wanting or needing others to agree with it. It's called tolerance,...

There is no "right" to expose sensitive body parts in public locations. Heck even San Fran passed a law against public nudity, and you can't accuse SF of being intolerant.

I know you were not addressing the subject directly.

However, there is a reason it is against the law. Some may not agree with the reason, but there is still a reason and its still against the law.

HikerMom58
02-11-2013, 13:58
Wanting others to think, act and believe the same things that I do is completely seperate from my rights. I can have the right to do something without wanting or needing others to agree with it. It's called tolerance, and it should be a part of respect, but too often respect only applies to the person whose behavior falls outside of the norm. It is my duty to respect your beliefs by not going against them, but not your duty to respect my beliefs by tolerating them...

Both of our posts are too ambiguous to be applied directly to either situation mentioned in the OP, but I think the thought process is fairly simple to follow.

It's just too hard ,sometimes, to wrap my head around it all. I agree with you- respect & tolerance work well together.

What I've come to believe is this- my "standard" for behavior can't be determined by the "laws of the land". I've found them to be lacking. This has been proven to me, again, by the OP. I will obey the laws of the land, to the best of my ability and if I do not choose to do so, ( I do have a choice in the matter) the consequences will be mine and mine alone.
When being "judged" by other humans as to what my/your "rights" are- even whether we are guilty or innocent, is flawed. Our governing system can't be trusted, completely. But, at least we try. :) We get an "A" for effort. Things change like the wind. We are constantly trying to figure it out.
There is something freeing and satisfying when you know you aren't bound 100% to "rules" that might not be in your best interest, anyway. Really think about it...there's so much you can't control but then again there's so much you can.

MDSection12
02-11-2013, 14:22
There is no "right" to expose sensitive body parts in public locations. Heck even San Fran passed a law against public nudity, and you can't accuse SF of being intolerant.

I know you were not addressing the subject directly.

However, there is a reason it is against the law. Some may not agree with the reason, but there is still a reason and its still against the law.
See my above post that was directed at this issue specifically... I think you'll find we are in agreement. :)


It's just too hard ,sometimes, to wrap my head around it all. I agree with you- respect & tolerance work well together.

What I've come to believe is this- my "standard" for behavior can't be determined by the "laws of the land". I've found them to be lacking. This has been proven to me, again, by the OP. I will obey the laws of the land, to the best of my ability and if I do not choose to do so, ( I do have a choice in the matter) the consequences will be mine and mine alone.
When being "judged" by other humans as to what my/your "rights" are- even whether we are guilty or innocent, is flawed. Our governing system can't be trusted, completely. But, at least we try. :) We get an "A" for effort. Things change like the wind. We are constantly trying to figure it out.
There is something freeing and satisfying when you know you aren't bound 100% to "rules" that might not be in your best interest, anyway. Really think about it...there's so much you can't control but then again there's so much you can.
It is a tough issue for sure, and one that each person has to address for themself. I just take issue when someone points to a form of expression and says 'that's not respectful' without taking into consideration whether or not they are respecting the people who find that form of expression to be of value. Public nudity is a bad example, because of the sexual way people view the world (in a lot of ways the onlookers are more guilty of this than the nudists,) and mooning isn't really a great example either but you get my point. Didn't mean to start an argument, just thought it was worth pointing out if we're gonna be throwing down life lessons. :)

HikerMom58
02-11-2013, 15:36
See my above post that was directed at this issue specifically... I think you'll find we are in agreement. :)


It is a tough issue for sure, and one that each person has to address for themself. I just take issue when someone points to a form of expression and says 'that's not respectful' without taking into consideration whether or not they are respecting the people who find that form of expression to be of value. Public nudity is a bad example, because of the sexual way people view the world (in a lot of ways the onlookers are more guilty of this than the nudists,) and mooning isn't really a great example either but you get my point. Didn't mean to start an argument, just thought it was worth pointing out if we're gonna be throwing down life lessons. :)

No, I've never thought of us talkin back and forth as arguing. :) I like the points you are making. I'm only making the point that there's a real need for absolutes, IMHO. I've lived long enough to realize that it's very much needed in my life, personally.

"What's right for you, may not be right for me"- just goes round & round. The hope that mutual respect and toleration for each other, just isn't cutting it. While it would seem to be a good idea in theory, this thread and many other threads, on many other subjects, all seem to hit the same wall.

We have laws that try to be fair to everyone, while trying to be sensitive to individual "rights". It's the biggest mess, IMHO. :) Basically, I believe that everyone has a bit of a bend towards wanting things to go their way, without much concern for anyone else. No worries! :)

achilles
02-11-2013, 16:23
Before my thru hike last year, most of my hiking had been done in the Whites. I've mooned the Cog several times, without any consequences. I was actually able to moon it twice last summer. And hey, the nice part of thru hiking is you can move faster than anyone who would bust you for mooning the train. Same thing goes for hike naked day. If you've been on the trail for months at a time, there's no way anyone but a thru hiker will be able to catch you. Just keep moving north!

Mags
02-11-2013, 16:25
If you've been on the trail for months at a time, there's no way anyone but a thru hiker will be able to catch you. Just keep moving north!

Radio waves may move a tad quicker. ;)

max patch
02-11-2013, 16:51
Colorado Rob and (first time poster) Achilles are both from Denver.

Must be the Coors Light that makes them want to expose themselves to others.

rickb
02-11-2013, 20:54
Most folks mooning the Cog wouldn't dream of standing by the tracks and giving the passengers the finger. That's wouldn't be cute. It wouldn't be cool. Not a hoot.

But they are, sort of. I think they fail to understand the diversity of their audience.

hikerboy57
02-11-2013, 21:05
so whats the point to "mooning".
is it the same thrill that you get when you play ring the doorbell?
when ive witnessed full moons, ive always ended up rolling my eyes. not very funny, kinda stupid looking
i prefer noisy farts

atmilkman
02-11-2013, 21:33
i prefer noisy farts

With a lighter?

hikerboy57
02-11-2013, 21:38
those crazy kids


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GkZeJbswnUkhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GkZeJbswnUk

atmilkman
02-11-2013, 21:59
It sounds as if some are actually looking for approval. Talking about how perty their ass is. Well I still say Big Bubba would love to see that lilly white ass and tell them just how perty it is.

MDSection12
02-12-2013, 09:01
It sounds as if some are actually looking for approval. Talking about how perty their ass is. Well I still say Big Bubba would love to see that lilly white ass and tell them just how perty it is.
I sincerely doubt anyone with an arrest record shorter than three pages is going to see jail time for mooning...

bfayer
02-12-2013, 09:30
I sincerely doubt anyone with an arrest record shorter than three pages is going to see jail time for mooning...

You may be correct, I have no info on this guys previous record, but it was just down then road from me.

http://www.loudountimes.com/index.php/news/article/ashburn_man_arrested_for_mooning642/

JAK
02-12-2013, 09:44
What you want to avoid is doing something that is stupid, like mooning, and then facing law enforcement that basically does not think like you, and does not react they way you might expect them too. For example, would you moon people in Saudi Arabia? How do you think the police might react? Don't expect some police and legal system in North America to act differently just because you are in North America. Usually they are pretty understanding and apply common sense even when you don't, but don't always count on it, especially when away from home.

MDSection12
02-12-2013, 09:50
You may be correct, I have no info on this guys previous record, but it was just down then road from me.

http://www.loudountimes.com/index.php/news/article/ashburn_man_arrested_for_mooning642/
He was arrested... That does not mean he did jail time. I would bet dollars for donuts he did community service, paid a fine and never saw the inside of a cell. (Except the holding tank the night of his arrest, which doesn't count... Plenty of innocent men have been there.)

According to an above poster, and wiki (,http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1587846) mooning is not even considered a crime at all in my homestate of Maryland. :banana

MDSection12
02-12-2013, 09:51
He was arrested... That does not mean he did jail time. I would bet dollars for donuts he did community service, paid a fine and never saw the inside of a cell. (Except the holding tank the night of his arrest, which doesn't count... Plenty of innocent men have been there.)

According to an above poster, and wiki (,http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1587846) mooning is not even considered a crime at all in my homestate of Maryland. :banana

Oh wow, I screwed that one up... Here's the wiki. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mooning

bfayer
02-12-2013, 10:45
He was arrested... That does not mean he did jail time. I would bet dollars for donuts he did community service, paid a fine and never saw the inside of a cell. (Except the holding tank the night of his arrest, which doesn't count... Plenty of innocent men have been there.)

According to an above poster, and wiki (,http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1587846) mooning is not even considered a crime at all in my homestate of Maryland. :banana

Even if you are correct, is it worth getting arrested for, and put in a holding cell till a judge decides to release you on OR? Then you still need to come back and answer the charges.

As for MD, they do have a law against indecent exposure, and they also have a law against disorderly conduct, you can be charged with either or both.

Is it really worth the risk especially if there is the possibility of children in the area?

atmilkman
02-12-2013, 13:01
I sincerely doubt anyone with an arrest record shorter than three pages is going to see jail time for mooning...
Big Bubba says when he gets out he's riding the cog train.

MDSection12
02-12-2013, 14:40
Even if you are correct, is it worth getting arrested for, and put in a holding cell till a judge decides to release you on OR? Then you still need to come back and answer the charges.

As for MD, they do have a law against indecent exposure, and they also have a law against disorderly conduct, you can be charged with either or both.

Is it really worth the risk especially if there is the possibility of children in the area?
I never said it was worth it... Just responding to your assertion that doing it will lead to prison rape.

If you read the link (maybe if I'd linked it properly) you'd see that 'mooning' was excluded from indecent exposure in a circuit court case. 'Disorderly conduct' would be another possible charge, but given that the circuit court has already ruled 'mooning' to be a form of protected 'speech' under the first amendment I think any decent lawyer could get you off of that one.

Again I'm not saying it's a good idea, and I wouldn't do it simply because I don't think it's that 'cool' or funny, but that doesn't mean I can't state facts about the legality of it.

MDSection12
02-12-2013, 14:43
Big Bubba says when he gets out he's riding the cog train.
Having never seen the 'cog' I imagine it as a rather large train or trolley and given that I don't think it's entirely implausible to think that some of those that have 'mooned the cog' have provided some eye candy for someone they might not have chosen to do so for in a private setting. :p

atmilkman
02-12-2013, 14:48
Having never seen the 'cog' I imagine it as a rather large train or trolley and given that I don't think it's entirely implausible to think that some of those that have 'mooned the cog' have provided some eye candy for someone they might not have chosen to do so for in a private setting. :p
Big Bubba says he'll eat that eye candy public or private.

max patch
02-12-2013, 14:59
If Freud was alive today I wonder what he'd say about a man who bends over and shows his nekkid azz to another man.

MDSection12
02-12-2013, 15:03
If Freud was alive today I wonder what he'd say about a man who bends over and shows his nekkid azz to another man.

He'd mumble something about that man's mother, then ask for some cocaine.

Train Wreck
02-12-2013, 15:05
If Freud was alive today I wonder what he'd say about a man who bends over and shows his nekkid azz to another man.

"When the Moon hits your eye like a big pizza pie, that's amore'"?

rocketsocks
02-12-2013, 15:11
If Freud was alive today I wonder what he'd say about a man who bends over and shows his nekkid azz to another man.More than likely he'd say..."Yo Mama"

rocketsocks
02-12-2013, 15:15
He'd mumble something about that man's mother, then ask for some cocaine.And now I see that's already been covered...it pays to catch-up on the reading! :(:sun

bfayer
02-12-2013, 16:27
I never said it was worth it... Just responding to your assertion that doing it will lead to prison rape.

If you read the link (maybe if I'd linked it properly) you'd see that 'mooning' was excluded from indecent exposure in a circuit court case. 'Disorderly conduct' would be another possible charge, but given that the circuit court has already ruled 'mooning' to be a form of protected 'speech' under the first amendment I think any decent lawyer could get you off of that one.

Again I'm not saying it's a good idea, and I wouldn't do it simply because I don't think it's that 'cool' or funny, but that doesn't mean I can't state facts about the legality of it.

Not that it matters, but it wasn't me that said anything about prison or rape.

I did read your link. A circuit court ruling in MD does not change law, the prosecution decided it was not worth appealing to the state appeals court where the law can been changed (with a published decision). So this decision only applies to the specific case, and is not binding law. In other words there is no law in MD that states mooning is not a crime, it leaves it up to the discretion of the prosecutor. I would personally not take legal advice from any site with the words wiki in the URL or any other internet site for that matter :)

Even if the decision was law, mooning in MD can still be indecent exposure if it includes showing anymore than the cheeks themselves. Since most people do not have the ability to see what they are exposing and what they are not, they could still be charged with a sex crime. Drop your pants, take your chances.

All this leads to my original point, even if someone does not think mooning is wrong, it is still against the law in most states and on federal property. Even if someone does not care about the law, at least have respect for other people especially families and kids.

Prime Time
02-12-2013, 16:37
I think walking around naked in a public place is disrespectful of others who may be offended by your actions. You could come across families with little kids and that just isn't right. What's the point of it all anyway? If a hiker did that to me with my little girl I'd probably make it a really bad day for the hiker and for me.

Train Wreck
02-12-2013, 16:45
Drop your pantses,
Take your chances!

jeffmeh
02-12-2013, 21:29
I haven't done a longitudinal study, but I suspect the number of hikers who moon the cog is inversely proportional to their ages. I know that is true in my case.

Map Man, do you wish to compile the data? ;)

Slo-go'en
02-12-2013, 21:42
Darn shame our moral laws are largely influenced by beliefs held by Puritan fanatics who got thrown out of England 400 years ago!

Rasty
02-12-2013, 21:43
Darn shame our moral laws are largely influenced by beliefs held by Puritan fanatics who got thrown out of England 400 years ago!

My people got throw out of Ireland, Lithuania and Italy!

bfayer
02-12-2013, 21:48
Darn shame our moral laws are largely influenced by beliefs held by Puritan fanatics who got thrown out of England 400 years ago!

You need to keep my family out of this :D

rocketsocks
02-12-2013, 22:30
Darn shame our moral laws are largely influenced by beliefs held by Puritan fanatics who got thrown out of England 400 years ago!


You need to keep my family out of this :D

Immigrants please! :D

jesse
02-12-2013, 22:50
Darn shame our moral laws are largely influenced by beliefs held by Puritan fanatics who got thrown out of England 400 years ago!
You're in way over your head.

Another Kevin
02-13-2013, 14:25
You're in way over your head.

Well, if he's in at least up to his waist, he's not showing anything, right? ;)

Train Wreck
02-13-2013, 16:28
http://www.examiner.com/article/liam-warriner-mooned-the-queen-now-just-a-nuisance-valentine-s-day-sentencing

I think that OzJacko needs to weigh in on this one :)
Apparently exposing Aussie heinie is a heinous crime indeed :D

hikerboy57
02-24-2013, 15:24
I think farting is way funnier.

Pedaling Fool
02-24-2013, 15:33
I think farting is way funnier.
So you must really like farting while mooning...yuk

:D

Hairbear
02-25-2013, 10:20
My people got throw out of Ireland, Lithuania and Italy!

they looked that bad naked huh?

Hairbear
02-25-2013, 10:28
When i first moved to missouri my new neighbor decided we needed to celebrate. A good part of a half gallon of whiskey later im being arrested for d w i.
When they took my picture i was drunk enough that i told them to get my good side,mooning the guy with the camera. He took the picture,needless to say my mooning days were over.
Funniest thing is that the cop with the camera ended up being a close friend that sat next to me in church. He seemed to like to tell that story often,much to my humility.

bamboo bob
02-25-2013, 10:31
There is no need to moon the cog anymore. It needed to be mooned when it befouled the air with black smoke everyday. It doesn't do that anymore.

bfayer
02-25-2013, 10:54
There is no need to moon the cog anymore. It needed to be mooned when it befouled the air with black smoke everyday. It doesn't do that anymore.

So exposing your backside to little kids and old ladies was an environmental protest?

That makes even less sense than doing it because your young and stupid.

MDSection12
02-25-2013, 11:07
It's funny to me how preparing children for 'the real world' so often involves sheltering them from it... :confused:

Lone Wolf
02-25-2013, 11:15
There is no need to moon the cog anymore. It needed to be mooned when it befouled the air with black smoke everyday.

by showin' your ugly, hairy azz you think it was gonna stop? childish

Prime Time
02-25-2013, 11:28
There is no need to moon the cog anymore. It needed to be mooned when it befouled the air with black smoke everyday. It doesn't do that anymore.
What? oh yes it does. They replaced one engine with diesel but he other 3 are still the same old wood and coal burning monstrocities. Just awful.

Sarcasm the elf
02-25-2013, 11:31
by showin' your ugly, hairy azz you think it was gonna stop? childishWell it worked in Braveheart!

bfayer
02-25-2013, 11:37
It's funny to me how preparing children for 'the real world' so often involves sheltering them from it... :confused:

Growing up is a process, its the same reason we don't let a 3 year old drink and smoke.

Other than that its not about sheltering people, its about respecting others.

WingedMonkey
02-25-2013, 11:38
I save my mooning now for purveyors of jesus burgers at trail crossings.

HikerMom58
02-25-2013, 11:42
It's funny to me how preparing children for 'the real world' so often involves sheltering them from it... :confused:

Duh... In the "real world" other people's behavior is not always cool. We don't neccessarily need an example of it, in our face or our children's face. If you are fine with nudity, yourself, that's cool but no one needs to force it upon others that don't agree. Some people may think it's funny and grab a camera. Some people find it rude and ugly. The "law" agrees that is not acceptable. If you don't agree with the law, work to change it. Your children wouldn't need to be "sheltered", if the laws change. I wonder what, if anything, you would shelter your children from....

Different Socks
02-25-2013, 13:38
Never done Hike Naked Day, but I did do a whole day in Penn on the AT wearing just shoes, socks, shirt. Then did the same thing for a few warm days on my PCT-California hike. Very enjoyable and liberating.

bfayer
02-25-2013, 13:46
Never done Hike Naked Day, but I did do a whole day in Penn on the AT wearing just shoes, socks, shirt. Then did the same thing for a few warm days on my PCT-California hike. Very enjoyable and liberating.

You can accomplish the same thing with a kilt.

Traveling teacher
02-26-2013, 00:15
I hiked naked on the appointed day but evidently I was the only one who got the memo. Every passer gave me a wide berth. But I gotta admit free-ballen in the summer sun with nothin but pack straps as cover was fantastic. I also mooned the cog cause I hated all those rotund buns taking the easy way up Washington. The conductor threw lumps of coal at my denuded ass but his aim was poor.

SunnyWalker
02-27-2013, 23:22
I think its part of our "dumbing down" of America and a sign of the coarsening of our culture. Persoanlly I am against it. People seem to get by with it in that State. I don't think you can assume everywhere that it will be overlooked. (thinking of trails out West at this point). Yeah, hyoh. If it happens around me I am going to just keep my comments to myself and keep hiking, fully clothed!

Pedaling Fool
02-28-2013, 09:47
Mooning can be instructional in Cosmological Bodies http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k1YUmJBN6vs

MDSection12
02-28-2013, 10:03
I wonder what, if anything, you would shelter your children from....

Harm......

HikerMom58
02-28-2013, 10:04
Harm......

Fair enough...

Prime Time
02-28-2013, 11:32
To me, this is about respecting the law and respecting others. Hike naked? If the exhibitionist in you wants to walk around in the buff, at least cover your genitals or be prepared to do so at the first sign of other hikers. Moon the train? Not cool. You're forcing people to watch your lewd, indecent behavior, young and old alike. What exactly is your point? You hate the smoke? You hate the people who don't walk up the mountain? What? So your actions aren't just disgusting to most, they don't even have a clue why you're doing it. Truly pointless.

Let me ask this another way. Do you walk around your own house naked in front of your children? No, of course you don't. Then why do it in front of other's children?

Lastly, a lot of people dislike thru hikers for absolutely no good reason. You don't have to give them one.