Sequester

[Mother Natures Son]

Within a week, the goverment will start, Sequester. What it will mean is huge cut back in all most everything that the federal goverment does. The local news is already reporting that Gettysburg N.P. is braceing for massive cut back from the goverment. "If" this does happen, how will it effect hikers who must travel through areas like SNP?

[Rasty]

Within a week, the goverment will start, Sequester. What it will mean is huge cut back in all most everything that the federal goverment does. The local news is already reporting that Gettysburg N.P. is braceing for massive cut back from the goverment. "If" this does happen, how will it effect hikers who must travel through areas like SNP?

Just keep walking! No one will be there to stop you!

[Wise Old Owl]

An Alice in wonderland moment.... Rasty nailed it.... MNS... before Alligator says it ... NO Politics. I wish the member political forum was up as I never posted there.

[Lone Wolf]

Just keep walking! No one will be there to stop you!

correct. one year back in the day the entrance stations at SNP weren't manned due to cuts.

[jeffmeh]

Within a week, the goverment will start, Sequester. What it will mean is huge cut back in all most everything that the federal goverment does. The local news is already reporting that Gettysburg N.P. is braceing for massive cut back from the goverment. "If" this does happen, how will it effect hikers who must travel through areas like SNP?

Yeah, huge cut backs. It looks like for fiscal year 2013 cuts might reach $44 billion, or a whopping 1.2% of federal spending.

[johnnybgood]

The hiker will be less affected than the tourists that pay for the park's amenities with their lodging.

[wnderer]

Here's the Washington Post Article.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/federal-eye/wp/2013/02/21/new-details-emerge-of-cuts-to-national-parks-during-sequester/

Five campgrounds and picnic areas would close in the Smoky Mountains. Don't think that would effect back country camping.

[hikerboy57]

Here's the Washington Post Article.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/federal-eye/wp/2013/02/21/new-details-emerge-of-cuts-to-national-parks-during-sequester/

Five campgrounds and picnic areas would close in the Smoky Mountains. Don't think that would effect back country camping.


it would help if they laid off the bears

[Alligator]

If there are places that this will affect AT hikers that's fair game(for instance wnderer's post.) Posts outside of that will be removed.

[rocketsocks]

If there are places that this will affect AT hikers that's fair game(for instance wnderer's post.) Posts outside of that will be removed.Yep, spose mine was abit of a reeeeeach, I jux a little to far...was going for the woods swallowing the trail theme, when no one around to groom trail.

[Old Hiker]

Yep, spose mine was abit of a reeeeeach, I jux a little to far...was going for the woods swallowing the trail theme, when no one around to groom trail.

You mean ALL those people out there trimming brush, clearing deadfalls, relocating the privys, maintaining the shelters are all guv'mint employees who are going to be laid off when the sequestration occurs???? :eek:

Wait, does this mean I won't have to stay in the shelters in the Smokies now? No one to check up on us?

[rocketsocks]

You mean ALL those people out there trimming brush, clearing deadfalls, relocating the privys, maintaining the shelters are all guv'mint employees who are going to be laid off when the sequestration occurs???? :eek:

Wait, does this mean I won't have to stay in the shelters in the Smokies now? No one to check up on us?Well, if 2% of the population is left...how many could be bonefied trail maintainers...But seriously No, Kudo's to all who serve the trail faithfully...I just knew I shoulda splained my thread drift better...i'm slippin

[Wild Blue]

On the bright side as a government employee I will have 20% more hiking time to go along with my 20% pay cut.

[vamelungeon]

Too bad I'm not thru hiking this year, I could avoid the shelters in the Smokies.

[Teacher & Snacktime]

You mean ALL those people out there trimming brush, clearing deadfalls, relocating the privys, maintaining the shelters are all guv'mint employees who are going to be laid off when the sequestration occurs???? :eek:

Wait, does this mean I won't have to stay in the shelters in the Smokies now? No one to check up on us?

It was my understanding that they were mostly volunteers maintaining the trail.

[johnnybgood]

I'm sure we will know more details once the sequestion deadline is reached in one week, March 1,2013. Anything mentioned before then is speculative, as nothing yet has been implemented.

[rocketsocks]

I don't know that they know just exactly what will happen.

[Doc]

It was my understanding that they were mostly volunteers maintaining the trail.
You are correct. The AT is maintained almost entirely by volunteers, usually as part of the local maintaining clubs.

[Furlough]

[QUOTE=Old Hiker;1423176]You mean ALL those people out there trimming brush, clearing deadfalls, relocating the privys, maintaining the shelters are all guv'mint employees who are going to be laid off when the sequestration occurs???? :eek:

In my case I am both a Government employee and a volunteer trail maintainer. The impending furlough will have no impact on my trail maintaing, unless the 20% reduction to my income starts to become an issue in the long term.

[Furlough]

I'm sure we will know more details once the sequestion deadline is reached in one week, March 1,2013. Anything mentioned before then is speculative, as nothing yet has been implemented.

We have already implemented a reduction of personnel in temp. or term positions and frozen hiring actions against vacant positions. Plus formal notification of intent to furlough went from the SECDEF to Congress this week and each Service Secretary notified Civilians of the intent to furlough. Next step on 1 March will be the official 30 day notification to employees that they will be furloughed if sequestration occurs.

[Prime Time]

I am hard pressed to come up with one negative effect to backpackers and hikers of having less governmental involvement in the parks. I'm not saying it's a good thing for the parks in general, but I don't think it effects what we do at all. Practically all of the maintenance of the AT is volunteer or private.

[Furlough]

I am hard pressed to come up with one negative effect to backpackers and hikers of having less governmental involvement in the parks. I'm not saying it's a good thing for the parks in general, but I don't think it effects what we do at all. Practically all of the maintenance of the AT is volunteer or private.

Fire season could be an issue. I am sure they can muster the emergency skeleton crews, but may not have the funds necessary to bring in the extra folks they normally do.

[Prime Time]

Then again, on the other hand, the flip side of the equation is that as some politicians believe raising revenue is the way to solve our problems, you could see fee increases in places like the Smokies and new ones in SNP. Just speculating here.

[Furlough]

Then again, on the other hand, the flip side of the equation is that as some politicians believe raising revenue is the way to solve our problems, you could see fee increases in places like the Smokies and new ones in SNP. Just speculating here.

Could be, but that is always the problem with budgets. Higher use fees could be used to supplement Operations and Maintenance Budgets, but generally can't be used against employee pay budgets. O and M budgets get hit pretty hard when you have to use them for contingincies like fighting forest fires, particularly long term. Those dollars get spent fast. But then again in today's fiscally constrained environment every dollar that can come in via raising revenue is welcome.

[Rasty]

Fire season could be an issue. I am sure they can muster the emergency skeleton crews, but may not have the funds necessary to bring in the extra folks they normally do.

National Guard, Military Boot Camps, Military Academy's, Other personel from government agencies have all been used in the past for fire fighting. The best line in most job descriptions is at the end "Other duties as needed".

[Furlough]

National Guard, Military Boot Camps, Military Academy's, Other personel from government agencies have all been used in the past for fire fighting. The best line in most job descriptions is at the end "Other duties as needed".

DOD is hit very hard by sequestration. The funds we tap into to logistically be able to use our forces for discretionary contingincies (to include the Military Academies) like fire fighting are the first in the budget to be hit. Responding to a major national disaster (think katrina) would occur, but something like forest fire fighting may not be an option. I know we used our reserve component and maybe our Service Academies, but I can't recall using our recruits in basic training.

[Slo-go'en]

The massive cuts amount to about 3% of the annual budget.

It's not so much the amout of the cuts, its the way they are doing them - with absolutely no common sense. Locking the doors to restrooms in parks - give me a break! Where the heck do they expect me to get my TP now?

....I had to delete the rest of my rant as it was becoming too political...

[Dogwood]

I am hard pressed to come up with one negative effect to backpackers and hikers of having less governmental involvement in the parks. I'm not saying it's a good thing for the parks in general, but I don't think it effects what we do at all. Practically all of the maintenance of the AT is volunteer or private.

Who takes care of/maintains/oversees the trail in NPs, SPs, possibly Wilderness Area? Is it also ALL volunteers? When govt(Fed,State, county, regional)budgets are curtailed it doesn't always entail less paid employess on the ground it can also sometimes entail less services or maintainance on things that hikers can have the benefit of. For example, water spigots being turned on/off, garbage removal eliminated or curtailed, nearby info sevices lost, possible nearest medical assistance eliminated or curtailed, possible food and lodging services curtailed or eliminated, historical site maintainance and manned open hrs eliminated, etc. I suspect any budget decreases wil not just entail less employees or less employee hrs.

This is a trend happening right now, not only in areas immediately affecting the AT, but in most of America! If we in the hiking community, whether it be the AT hiking community, or the entire national hiking/outdoors community as a whole, sit back and let this continue to occur without raising our voting voices in unison and letting the powers that be know of the economic impact that hikers and the outdoors community commands it will continue and in all most likelyhood to a greater and greater degree! The writing is on the wall! These areas are being tested for further budget decreases as other forms of govt and govt programs get larger and more complex!

BTW, there's a principle being invoked by some here that says although it doesn't directly affect me, which may be an incorrect assumption, it makes it somehow more permissible to let others deal with these potential problems. Well these types of budget talks can and will be visited upon our doorstep if we continue alienating oursleves from these issues or simply choose to ignore them.

[Sly]

I am hard pressed to come up with one negative effect to backpackers and hikers of having less governmental involvement in the parks. I'm not saying it's a good thing for the parks in general, but I don't think it effects what we do at all. Practically all of the maintenance of the AT is volunteer or private.

Really? How about we start with less trail. While the AT may be set, in some areas it's just a very narrow corridor. Sections of other trails like the PCT and CDT, are left unprotected and are still on private land.

[Rasty]

Maybe the long term solution is more wilderness areas and less parks. Volunteers are already doing the lion's share of the trail maintence. Reallocate the smaller budget into purchasing the land and less for guided nature walks and bathrooms.

[RedBeerd]

On the bright side as a government employee I will have 20% more hiking time to go along with my 20% pay cut.
Now that is looking on the bright side of life!

[Alligator]

Folks forget about arguing about whether you consider the cuts large or small. Address this from the standpoint of how it affects the services or bow out of the thread. There's a gazillion other sites where you can argue about politics.

[Rasty]

Are there specific areas that will affect the AT excluding a trash can or bathroom that won't be available? I have only hiked maybe 10% of the trail and cannot think of anything.

[Slo-go'en]

It's still way to early to tell what, if any, effect this will have on us as hikers, so all we can do at this point is engage in pointless speculation. Which, as best I can tell, is what is happening at all levels of goverment and the news media. Maybe in 6 months we'll actually have something to complain about.

[Seatbelt]

For that matter, we don't know for sure that certain Nat'l Park services won't have cuts even without the sequester.....hike on and take it as it comes--adapt.

[Dogwood]

Maybe the long term solution is more wilderness areas and less parks. Volunteers are already doing the lion's share of the trail maintence. Reallocate the smaller budget into purchasing the land and less for guided nature walks and bathrooms.

UHH, guided nature walks and bathrooms, while perhaps not seemingly immediately useful TO YOU, they do provide benfits to others and perhaps even to you in ways you don't yet understand. And, uhh, in general, land particularly in the east adjacent to the AT corridor is, UHH, EXPENSIVE!, probably more so than several bathrooms and guided nature walks.

[Rasty]

Maybe the long term solution is more wilderness areas and less parks. Volunteers are already doing the lion's share of the trail maintence. Reallocate the smaller budget into purchasing the land and less for guided nature walks and bathrooms.

UHH, guided nature walks and bathrooms, while perhaps not seemingly immediately useful TO YOU, they do provide benfits to others and perhaps even to you in ways you don't yet understand. And, uhh, in general, land particularly in the east adjacent to the AT corridor is, UHH, EXPENSIVE!, probably more so than several bathrooms and guided nature walks.

Then don't spend money on either.

[Teacher & Snacktime]

Fire season could be an issue. I am sure they can muster the emergency skeleton crews, but may not have the funds necessary to bring in the extra folks they normally do.

Essential emergency personnel are normally excluded from cutbacks....forest fires won't be permitted to just burn for lack of personnel and injured hikers won't be forced to climb down the mountain with broken bones for want of EMT's.

[Teacher & Snacktime]

I am hard pressed to come up with one negative effect to backpackers and hikers of having less governmental involvement in the parks. I'm not saying it's a good thing for the parks in general, but I don't think it effects what we do at all. Practically all of the maintenance of the AT is volunteer or private.

One major concern I have is the oversight of hunting regulations. I'm not thrilled with the idea of being shot on the trail because a zealot with a shotgun figures no one is around to enforce the border restrictions or seasonal regulations. It might be a good idea to wear orange yearround...or even kevlar.

[Rasty]

I am hard pressed to come up with one negative effect to backpackers and hikers of having less governmental involvement in the parks. I'm not saying it's a good thing for the parks in general, but I don't think it effects what we do at all. Practically all of the maintenance of the AT is volunteer or private.

One major concern I have is the oversight of hunting regulations. I'm not thrilled with the idea of being shot on the trail because a zealot with a shotgun figures no one is around to enforce the border restrictions or seasonal regulations. It might be a good idea to wear orange yearround...or even kevlar.

Aren't game wardens mostly state employees?

[Furlough]

Essential emergency personnel are normally excluded from cutbacks....forest fires won't be permitted to just burn for lack of personnel and injured hikers won't be forced to climb down the mountain with broken bones for want of EMT's.

Correct. That is why I said the emergency skeleton crews would be in place.