Hikers sick in Shenandoah

[Blissful]

Heads up - just got an e-mail from my trail bosses (I'm the ridgerunner in Shenandoah this year) - some hikers sick in SNP right now. They are saying a water source at Calf Mtn shelter but I feel it unlikely as it takes 1-2 weeks for symptoms of giardia to show. Not sure yet what it is. I did meet a hiker that had giardia from a source farther south (he was confirmed).

[Meriadoc]

Thanks for the heads up Blissful.

[aficion]

"What difference does it make?" "Death is part of life."

[The Kisco Kid]

I did meet a hiker that had giardia from a source farther south (he was confirmed).

The only way to confirm giardia is through a stool sample tested in a laboratory. Was this the case? Otherwise, you may be incorrectly attributing giardia to an outbreak of another virus, such as norovirus, due to improper hygiene.

[Colter]

...They are saying a water source at Calf Mtn shelter but I feel it unlikely as it takes 1-2 weeks for symptoms of giardia to show...

FWIW giardiasis symptoms can develop 3-25 days or more from exposure (https://www.google.com/search?q=giardiasis+symptoms+3-25+days&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a#q=giardiasis+symptoms+3-25+days&client=firefox-a&hs=Ogr&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&ei=Z7SKUYfPJbOqyQGip4Bo&start=10&sa=N&bav=on.2,or.r_qf.&bvm=bv.46226182,d.aWc&fp=3e5278bae6458e76&biw=1525&bih=659) (some sources say occasionally within one day). You are right about the 1-2 weeks median.

[aficion]

..........

[Chaco Taco]

Heads up - just got an e-mail from my trail bosses (I'm the ridgerunner in Shenandoah this year) - some hikers sick in SNP right now. They are saying a water source at Calf Mtn shelter but I feel it unlikely as it takes 1-2 weeks for symptoms of giardia to show. Not sure yet what it is. I did meet a hiker that had giardia from a source farther south (he was confirmed).
The Shennies were bad when we went through in 08. Saw a couple of hikers not doing so well...

[Lone Wolf]

it's all about what they ate and drank in waynesboro. ain't nothin' bad with the water sources

[Del Q]

1st thought? There was a serious norovirus outbreak this year, I came home from Erwin mid April, was in Damascus by then............run the math

I have had giardia and yes, stool sample............this is different.

[bfayer]

The Shennies were bad when we went through in 08. Saw a couple of hikers not doing so well...

There are the Blue Ridge Mountains, and there is Shenandoah National Park (Named after the Shenandoah river valley), but there is no place in VA called the "Shennies". Every time I hear that I feel like my head will explode. There is a Shenandoah Mountain, but it is in George Washington National Forrest on the west side of the valley (also called Great North Mountain). Sorry had to say it, it's just one of those nights.

Blissful, thanks for the info.

[Tony Lagana]

I had some folks staying with me last week that came down with it . They told me that they drank some water from Brown Mountain Creek down near long Mtn wayside . Calf mountains water source is very protected in my opinion , Spring Pipe coming out of the mountain . I know the one fellow that stayed with me was in fact confirmed with giardia and treated . As for his partner I am not sure if she got sick. As of Sunday a.m. she had not .

[Malto]

There is a reason that I carried Fishzole on my thru. Now here is the real question. How many of these sick hikers treated their water. I suspect it cut across the whole gambit from non treaters to chemical to filter and beyond.

[Chaco Taco]

There are the Blue Ridge Mountains, and there is Shenandoah National Park (Named after the Shenandoah river valley), but there is no place in VA called the "Shennies". Every time I hear that I feel like my head will explode. There is a Shenandoah Mountain, but it is in George Washington National Forrest on the west side of the valley (also called Great North Mountain). Sorry had to say it, it's just one of those nights.

Blissful, thanks for the info.
Well The Shennies are beautiful none the less..

[Captain Blue]

... but there is no place in VA called the "Shennies"

I wonder if people feel the same way about the term "Smokies"?

[WingedMonkey]

I wonder if people feel the same way about the term "Smokies"?

The Great Smoky Mountains are a mountain range where the park is located, often shortened to "The Smokies", plural because there are many mountains in the range.

Shenandoah Mountain is a mountain ridge, and not, as stated before, even in the park. The park was named for the nearby valley, also no plural.

[Malto]

The Great Smoky Mountains are a mountain range where the park is located, often shortened to "The Smokies", plural because there are many mountains in the range.

Shenandoah Mountain is a mountain ridge, and not, as stated before, even in the park. The park was named for the nearby valley, also no plural.

Also there is no such thing as the Sierras. It is the Sierra. Maybe we need a mountain vocabulary.

[BostonBlue]

NYOH = Name Your Own Hike!

[Alligator]

If you guys are going to argue, could you at least argue about whether this a plague or something? It's kind of a freebie.

[WingedMonkey]

I've never gotten the giardias in all my hiking life.

[rocketsocks]

Clearly this is rocky mountain spotted back side

[hikerboy57]

i think its the plague

[HikerMom58]

i think its the plague

I'm glad you didn't get it and I don't want to get it!

Thanks for the heads up Blissful. :)

[Colter]

it's all about what they ate and drank in waynesboro. ain't nothin' bad with the water sources

You don't know that. Apparently that doesn't stop you from presenting your conjecture as fact.

[Bucketfoot]

Unclean hands, unfiltered water,contamination from other hikers. all kinds of questions here.

[Chaco Taco]

If you guys are going to argue, could you at least argue about whether this a plague or something? It's kind of a freebie.
Seriously......... thanks Gator

[Chaco Taco]

There are the Blue Ridge Mountains, and there is Shenandoah National Park (Named after the Shenandoah river valley), but there is no place in VA called the "Shennies". Every time I hear that I feel like my head will explode. There is a Shenandoah Mountain, but it is in George Washington National Forrest on the west side of the valley (also called Great North Mountain). Sorry had to say it, it's just one of those nights.

Blissful, thanks for the info.
Maybe, you spend way too much time thinking about it. When you get "in a mood" maybe dont hit the "post" key.
Thank Blissful for getting the RIGHT info out there!

[aficion]

If you guys are going to argue, could you at least argue about whether this a plague or something? It's kind of a freebie.

"What difference does it make?." "Death is part of life."...............It's just dying....all good...and all that happy hooh hah.

[Blissful]

Update on the sickness. It seems many hikers are sick in Waynesboro and were holed up at the Quality Inn. It's a quick bug - lasts about 24 hrs with some vomiting, not like the one down near Erwin. Some are out back hiking now, but weak. A few did hike out early and then were sick at Pinefield and Hightop huts. SO be careful out there.

[bfayer]

Thanks Blissful.

Good to know this one is short lived as its heading towards my backyard so to speak.

[Coosa]

I suggest "hand washing stations" with soap & warm water & a fingernail brush and a separate bowl for rinse water as TRAIL MAGIC

Dispose of dirty water in a "cat hole"

1- clean hands before and after using privy & eating >> use some soap as anti-bacterial gel does not clean hands, only sanitizes them.
2- do not share food bags
3- treat water >> you do know deer tend to pee IN streams & water sources, right?

[Donde]

i think its the plague

Bring out your dead!!! bring out your dead!!

[Chaco Taco]

Update on the sickness. It seems many hikers are sick in Waynesboro and were holed up at the Quality Inn. It's a quick bug - lasts about 24 hrs with some vomiting, not like the one down near Erwin. Some are out back hiking now, but weak. A few did hike out early and then were sick at Pinefield and Hightop huts. SO be careful out there.
Thanks for the information Blissful. Glad to know you will be out there!!!

[HikerMom58]

Thanks Blissful, we can always count on you for good info...

FYI to everyone concerned.... The first "Noro Virus" sickness thread that I posted came directly from Blissful. I'm a friend of her FB page. I trust this person for reliable information. She wasn't a ridge runner in the "hot zone" but she had been hiking down that way. THANK YOU BLISSFUL!!

And I will also throw in some other useful info since she brought up the hotel name.... that Quality Inn in Waynesboro where sick hikers are holed up. .... It has been reported, by another source I trust, to have an infestation of bed bugs in at least one of their rooms.

[Slo-go'en]

There are all kinds of ways to get tummy ackes on the trail. Without extenstive testing, the exact cause is impossible to determine. Some of the privies look so gross, you can get sick just walking by them. Groundhog Creek shelter, just north of Standing Bear was by far the worse so far. But I'm about to head into the Norovirus section, so we'll see.

[Chaco Taco]

There are all kinds of ways to get tummy ackes on the trail. Without extenstive testing, the exact cause is impossible to determine. Some of the privies look so gross, you can get sick just walking by them. Groundhog Creek shelter, just north of Standing Bear was by far the worse so far. But I'm about to head into the Norovirus section, so we'll see.
lots of booze dude, drink lots of booze :)

[Bronk]

1. Nobody knows this is "norovirus." Nor has any health practitioner described the problem as "severe."
2. Something like this happens every year. It is widely discussed and then discounted.
3. It is increasingly well-reported and discussed as more and more hikers spend too much time on-line each year.
4. These episodes of danger or "hiker plague" are usually greatly exaggerated.
5. This includes accounts of "contaminated" shelters, hostels, trail facilities, etc.
6. These reports tend to do little except worry hikers and their families needlessly.

A bit of calm might seem in order. Words like "severe"; "outbreak;" "contamination"; etc. probably do not help here. This is not England in 1348; this is not a plague year. It would generally be imprudent to read too much into what one might read in a a trail journal or two. Until we hear some sort of corroboration from a Trail official, or better yet, a medical person on the ground in the "affected" area, I suggest that everyone take a deep breath.

Have any state or county heath departments confirmed this is norovirus?

Define:"SEVERE"
There's a 48 hour cold bug going around, but posting there's a Norovirus outbreak?
Are you a doctor? So it's Norovirus? Avoid the area?
O.K. I'll bypass 75 miles of trail because of what you said.
I talked today with 5 hikers 30 miles South of Shennandoah....no problem.
Every time hikers leave town they have problems with their guts....gorge themselves on "normal food" in town and within the first 10 miles leave everything they ate in a cat hole somewhere along the trail.
Best thing to do is never shake hands with anyone....do the hiker shake...Fist Bump and move on.

so yet again, we have case of he said, she said. This is all speculation. Until the health department puts out some sort of warning, Ill just go with folks getting on the internet and freaking out......


naturally because of the post by the WB member, people are freaking out on facebox, get a grip folks

Today, I did shuttles to Shenandoah, 6 hrs. on the road. Typical everyday for me.
I saw at least 20 hikers throughout my travels and talked to 5 hikers, (the other 15 were bleeding out their noses...what disease is that? I was to scared to talk with them), a fellow shuttler, another hostel owner and the owner of an outfitter.
Not one nor the hikers said anything about some kinda disease.
So I'm in the trenches and you're surfing FB/WB and telling us 1 person said blah blah blah?
3k posts and 3 miles of hiking don't mean much.

I love you man but your numbers don't add up and it makes u look stupid.
"More than half the hikers in the past 5 days have become sick"?
There's easily 100 hikers between A & B and more than half have become sick?
What did you do sit there at some gap and survey everyone that passed.
I'm done.

[Chaco Taco]

1. Nobody knows this is "norovirus." Nor has any health practitioner described the problem as "severe."
2. Something like this happens every year. It is widely discussed and then discounted.
3. It is increasingly well-reported and discussed as more and more hikers spend too much time on-line each year.
4. These episodes of danger or "hiker plague" are usually greatly exaggerated.
5. This includes accounts of "contaminated" shelters, hostels, trail facilities, etc.
6. These reports tend to do little except worry hikers and their families needlessly.

A bit of calm might seem in order. Words like "severe"; "outbreak;" "contamination"; etc. probably do not help here. This is not England in 1348; this is not a plague year. It would generally be imprudent to read too much into what one might read in a a trail journal or two. Until we hear some sort of corroboration from a Trail official, or better yet, a medical person on the ground in the "affected" area, I suggest that everyone take a deep breath.

Have any state or county heath departments confirmed this is norovirus?

Define:"SEVERE"
There's a 48 hour cold bug going around, but posting there's a Norovirus outbreak?
Are you a doctor? So it's Norovirus? Avoid the area?
O.K. I'll bypass 75 miles of trail because of what you said.
I talked today with 5 hikers 30 miles South of Shennandoah....no problem.
Every time hikers leave town they have problems with their guts....gorge themselves on "normal food" in town and within the first 10 miles leave everything they ate in a cat hole somewhere along the trail.
Best thing to do is never shake hands with anyone....do the hiker shake...Fist Bump and move on.

so yet again, we have case of he said, she said. This is all speculation. Until the health department puts out some sort of warning, Ill just go with folks getting on the internet and freaking out......


naturally because of the post by the WB member, people are freaking out on facebox, get a grip folks

Today, I did shuttles to Shenandoah, 6 hrs. on the road. Typical everyday for me.
I saw at least 20 hikers throughout my travels and talked to 5 hikers, (the other 15 were bleeding out their noses...what disease is that? I was to scared to talk with them), a fellow shuttler, another hostel owner and the owner of an outfitter.
Not one nor the hikers said anything about some kinda disease.
So I'm in the trenches and you're surfing FB/WB and telling us 1 person said blah blah blah?
3k posts and 3 miles of hiking don't mean much.

I love you man but your numbers don't add up and it makes u look stupid.
"More than half the hikers in the past 5 days have become sick"?
There's easily 100 hikers between A & B and more than half have become sick?
What did you do sit there at some gap and survey everyone that passed.
I'm done.
This guy gets it. Although, if the information comes from Blissful, Ill take it for what it is worth. She is a ridgerunner in the area and relays alot of the information from that section. I do agree with about 99% of the rest of what you said though.

[moytoy]

I don't know if it's the flu, or a virus, or a plague, or bad hamburger but down here we just call it the creeping crud. If I have it don't try to cheer me up with that dang harp/ http://wp.patheos.com.s3.amazonaws.com/blogs/pantheon/files/2012/07/550px-51-aspetti_di_vita_quotidiana_sonnoTaccuino_Sanitatis _Cas.jpg

[HikerMom58]

1. Nobody knows this is "norovirus." Nor has any health practitioner described the problem as "severe."
2. Something like this happens every year. It is widely discussed and then discounted.
3. It is increasingly well-reported and discussed as more and more hikers spend too much time on-line each year.
4. These episodes of danger or "hiker plague" are usually greatly exaggerated.
5. This includes accounts of "contaminated" shelters, hostels, trail facilities, etc.
6. These reports tend to do little except worry hikers and their families needlessly.

A bit of calm might seem in order. Words like "severe"; "outbreak;" "contamination"; etc. probably do not help here. This is not England in 1348; this is not a plague year. It would generally be imprudent to read too much into what one might read in a a trail journal or two. Until we hear some sort of corroboration from a Trail official, or better yet, a medical person on the ground in the "affected" area, I suggest that everyone take a deep breath.

Have any state or county heath departments confirmed this is norovirus?

Define:"SEVERE"
There's a 48 hour cold bug going around, but posting there's a Norovirus outbreak?
Are you a doctor? So it's Norovirus? Avoid the area?
O.K. I'll bypass 75 miles of trail because of what you said.
I talked today with 5 hikers 30 miles South of Shennandoah....no problem.
Every time hikers leave town they have problems with their guts....gorge themselves on "normal food" in town and within the first 10 miles leave everything they ate in a cat hole somewhere along the trail.
Best thing to do is never shake hands with anyone....do the hiker shake...Fist Bump and move on.

so yet again, we have case of he said, she said. This is all speculation. Until the health department puts out some sort of warning, Ill just go with folks getting on the internet and freaking out......


naturally because of the post by the WB member, people are freaking out on facebox, get a grip folks

Today, I did shuttles to Shenandoah, 6 hrs. on the road. Typical everyday for me.
I saw at least 20 hikers throughout my travels and talked to 5 hikers, (the other 15 were bleeding out their noses...what disease is that? I was to scared to talk with them), a fellow shuttler, another hostel owner and the owner of an outfitter.
Not one nor the hikers said anything about some kinda disease.
So I'm in the trenches and you're surfing FB/WB and telling us 1 person said blah blah blah?
3k posts and 3 miles of hiking don't mean much.

I love you man but your numbers don't add up and it makes u look stupid.
"More than half the hikers in the past 5 days have become sick"?
There's easily 100 hikers between A & B and more than half have become sick?
What did you do sit there at some gap and survey everyone that passed.
I'm done.

Actually, hikers in Erwin tested positive for the norovirus!! The ATC and the local health Dept worked together to come up with the diagnosis a week or so ago. I don't believe anything thing you say Bronk or Chaco Taco. You guys are sitting in FL and NH. You know NOTHING about the situation and your words are meaningless. I have no respect for your opinions on this at all. You are making total fools of yourselves by posting things like this.....

[10-K]

I have no idea how many hikers I've shuttled since March but a lot of them have been pretty sick. It was worse in April but this week so far I've picked up 5 hikers who were sick that I can recall and it's Wednesday and there are fewer hikers in town every day as the bubble moves north.

[Chaco Taco]

Actually, hikers in Erwin tested positive for the norovirus!! The ATC and the local health Dept worked together to come up with the diagnosis a week or so ago. I don't believe anything thing you say Bronk or Chaco Taco. You guys are sitting in FL and NH. You know NOTHING about the situation and your words are meaningless. I have no respect for your opinions on this at all. You are making total fools of yourselves by posting things like this.....
Your sitting behind a computer.

[Chaco Taco]

people can disagree with how you tend how to handle these situations. Dont like it, thats your problem. We are all a work in progress. Its ok if people disagree with what you say. I just think there is a way to get the right information out and a way to freak people out. Im not the best with differing opinions sometimes, but atleast Ill admit when Im wrong. I think you just get a little carried away, thats all. Dont take it personally.

[Rasty]

Actually, hikers in Erwin tested positive for the norovirus!! The ATC and the local health Dept worked together to come up with the diagnosis a week or so ago. I don't believe anything thing you say Bronk or Chaco Taco. You guys are sitting in FL and NH. You know NOTHING about the situation and your words are meaningless. I have no respect for your opinions on this at all. You are making total fools of yourselves by posting things like this.....

How is Norovirus a serious problem for the general public? It is a illness that only effects people that cannot figure out basic personal sanitation. Rule #1 - Assume everyone else didn't wash their hands (Don't shake hands) without washing your hands before eating or touching your clean food. Rule #2 - Wash you hands after touching probable contaminated surfaces. Rule #3 - Don't be touching your face or picking your nose. Norovirus is a notorious illness from 3rd world countries where some don't have access to soap and clean water. AT thru hikers have no excuse for getting Norovirus. I'm not a qualified "hiking expert" but I did stay at the Holiday Inn last night!

[WingedMonkey]

How is Norovirus a serious problem for the general public? It is a illness that only effects people that cannot figure out basic personal sanitation. Rule #1 - Assume everyone else didn't wash their hands (Don't shake hands) without washing your hands before eating or touching your clean food. Rule #2 - Wash you hands after touching probable contaminated surfaces. Rule #3 - Don't be touching your face or picking your nose. Norovirus is a notorious illness from 3rd world countries where some don't have access to soap and clean water. AT thru hikers have no excuse for getting Norovirus. I'm not a qualified "hiking expert" but I did stay at the Holiday Inn last night!


Soap and water folks.

Not hand sanitizer.

[HikerMom58]

Your sitting behind a computer.

Duh... really? Here's the difference. If I'm typing things, I like to think that some kind of thought, knowledge and creditability goes into all my posts/threads. I was paying attention & gathering information about this sickness on the trail. As I have already stated, I feel good about my judgement calls on who I trust with good information. In this case, it was Blissful and CM. Where were you and Bronk getting your info from to be able to "weigh in" on the subject or were you just sitting behind your computer poo, pooing what was being said.

In this case, you were poo pooing Blissful's own words. Would it make a difference to you if the info came from HikerMom or Blissful? I think the answer is YES!! That's so unfair.
Blissful, CM and I could have been wrong about the sickness being the norovirus... it's not a big deal. A lot of others made that point. CM and Blissful used the words norovirus, I didn't think anything of it. A lot of hikers were getting sick.. that was the most important thing to let people know about. I personally was thanked through PM's for putting out the thread. So I really don't care if you didn't like it. You weren't out there hiking near that area. I wasn't either but I cared about the ones that were hiking. The ones that were hiking, thanked me.

Y'all can be the thread posting police if you want too... have at it. YOu can make people feel like fools for posting things, asking certain questions, on and on... if you are choosing to be like that then I will put your arse on ignore. It's NOT about disagreeing on handling different situations. It's not about disagreeing with others, it's about treating people with respect. I'll admit when I'm wrong but I won't bow down to disrespectful thread policing.

[Chaco Taco]

Duh... really? Here's the difference. If I'm typing things, I like to think that some kind of thought, knowledge and creditability goes into all my posts/threads. I was paying attention & gathering information about this sickness on the trail. As I have already stated, I feel good about my judgement calls on who I trust with good information. In this case, it was Blissful and CM. Where were you and Bronk getting your info from to be able to "weigh in" on the subject or were you just sitting behind your computer poo, pooing what was being said.

In this case, you were poo pooing Blissful's own words. Would it make a difference to you if the info came from HikerMom or Blissful? I think the answer is YES!! That's so unfair.
Blissful, CM and I could have been wrong about the sickness being the norovirus... it's not a big deal. A lot of others made that point. CM and Blissful used the words norovirus, I didn't think anything of it. A lot of hikers were getting sick.. that was the most important thing to let people know about. I personally was thanked through PM's for putting out the thread. So I really don't care if you didn't like it. You weren't out there hiking near that area. I wasn't either but I cared about the ones that were hiking. The ones that were hiking, thanked me.

Y'all can be the thread posting police if you want too... have at it. YOu can make people feel like fools for posting things, asking certain questions, on and on... if you are choosing to be like that then I will put your arse on ignore. It's NOT about disagreeing on handling different situations. It's not about disagreeing with others, it's about treating people with respect. I'll admit when I'm wrong but I won't bow down to disrespectful thread policing.
Point taken. I personally think you are an alarmist and take the information you get and blow it up a little bit. I always apreciate good information. I have people that I care about out hiking and living in the area. My point that Im making and I think some others have tried making is that this is something that is part of hiking the AT now. It was an issue when I hiked in 08, towards the same area then again in Northern Va. It gets hot and nasty out there. Town food is had, beer is consumed, sometimes sickness happens. It really is not a big deal. Sometimes trailtowns feel the effect of this alarmist attitude. Hikers skip places because of over exageratted claims that there is a major sickness in towns like Hot Springs. Again, I can appreciate your concern for folks, I tried to convey that to you in a PM and at other times in our conversations but you want to take this public. I admit, Im not the best at expressing myself on the internet but I feel like your efforts and concern are over the top sometimes and Im sorry if that upsets you. Relaying the information from Blissful was well done on your part, its the other stuff you like to throw in sometimes like "see I was right" or the "I told you so" kind of attitude. I tried to deal with you privately over this matter but whatever.......

[MDSection12]

Duh... really? Here's the difference. If I'm typing things, I like to think that some kind of thought, knowledge and creditability goes into all my posts/threads. I was paying attention & gathering information about this sickness on the trail. As I have already stated, I feel good about my judgement calls on who I trust with good information. In this case, it was Blissful and CM. Where were you and Bronk getting your info from to be able to "weigh in" on the subject or were you just sitting behind your computer poo, pooing what was being said.

In this case, you were poo pooing Blissful's own words. Would it make a difference to you if the info came from HikerMom or Blissful? I think the answer is YES!! That's so unfair.
Blissful, CM and I could have been wrong about the sickness being the norovirus... it's not a big deal. A lot of others made that point. CM and Blissful used the words norovirus, I didn't think anything of it. A lot of hikers were getting sick.. that was the most important thing to let people know about. I personally was thanked through PM's for putting out the thread. So I really don't care if you didn't like it. You weren't out there hiking near that area. I wasn't either but I cared about the ones that were hiking. The ones that were hiking, thanked me.

Y'all can be the thread posting police if you want too... have at it. YOu can make people feel like fools for posting things, asking certain questions, on and on... if you are choosing to be like that then I will put your arse on ignore. It's NOT about disagreeing on handling different situations. It's not about disagreeing with others, it's about treating people with respect. I'll admit when I'm wrong but I won't bow down to disrespectful thread policing.

HM, we all know you mean well and 99% of the time your intentions match the result, but you seem to take things upon yourself as a 'spokesperson' for the trail more often than not and I can see how that rubs people the wrong way. You say that Chaco isn't out hiking, then go on to say you aren't either... Well he didn't speak up as an authority, you did. All he did was question your authority, which no offense but it's certainly debatable. I understand that you are trying to be careful and pick and choose your sources, but the information is still second hand by the time you pass it on here. I think that's the only issue people are taking; you pass on second hand information but say 'I trust these people...' and get upset when someone questions it. We all have our own level of skepticism with any second hand information and it's normal for someone to not necessarily take yours at face value.

[bfayer]

How is Norovirus a serious problem for the general public?

Its a serious problem because people without adequate access to clean drinking water can and do die from Norovirus.

And before you jump in with the "how do you know" comments, I have bagged the bodies of folks that have died from dehydration due to Noro. So yes it happens.

You can talk about prevention all you want, but once an outbreak occurs it is a serious problem and people need to know.

You are right about proper hygiene, its the only way to prevent spreading it or getting sick. If more hikers used common sense and followed the hygiene rules they learned in preschool, we would not be arguing about this on the internet.

[finish9]

Just WOW! People need to hit the trail more often to workout their internal struggles and not vent at others who are just trying to be helpful by passing on "news" or info that hikers need to know. Hiker Mom and others have done an excellent job at trying to keep people informed about issues on the trail. They pass on what they have learned and some of it is not 100% accurate but that is life, get over it. Forewarned is forearmed.

[jeffmeh]

I suggest cooler heads and thicker skins all around, as I certainly did not see ill intent on either side of this discussion. It's not unreasonable to point out that people are getting sick, nor is it unreasonable to question whether the sickness rate is high enough above normal expectations to warrant high levels of concern. We certainly live in a society where perceived risks tend to be greater than real risks, and honest skepticism is healthy. Cheers.

[turtle fast]

Like others have said before, basic hygene is important. I don't know why but when some folks go out into the wilds they forgo basic hygenic practices like hand washing. Now I understand that a shower is not available every day, yet a wash down every few days goes a long way not only making you slightly less stinky, but assisting you on keeping down bacteria like Staph, or making you less vulnerable to impetigo or other skin breakdowns.

[HikerMom58]

Point taken. I personally think you are an alarmist and take the information you get and blow it up a little bit. I always apreciate good information. I have people that I care about out hiking and living in the area. My point that Im making and I think some others have tried making is that this is something that is part of hiking the AT now. It was an issue when I hiked in 08, towards the same area then again in Northern Va. It gets hot and nasty out there. Town food is had, beer is consumed, sometimes sickness happens. It really is not a big deal. Sometimes trailtowns feel the effect of this alarmist attitude. Hikers skip places because of over exageratted claims that there is a major sickness in towns like Hot Springs. Again, I can appreciate your concern for folks, I tried to convey that to you in a PM and at other times in our conversations but you want to take this public. I admit, Im not the best at expressing myself on the internet but I feel like your efforts and concern are over the top sometimes and Im sorry if that upsets you. Relaying the information from Blissful was well done on your part, its the other stuff you like to throw in sometimes like "see I was right" or the "I told you so" kind of attitude. I tried to deal with you privately over this matter but whatever.......

Chaco.. you have gone public with your attitude towards me on here and on FB hiking pages. You went out of your way to stalk me in the Cafe purposely finding ways to mock me. I let it all go.... I didn't PM you or call you on any of that stuff.

If I have cocked a "see I was right" or the "I told you so" kind of attitude, it was in defense of being needlessly hammered or censored for no good reason. I am not an alarmist. I don't accept labels from others that are incorrect.

I understand starting rumors can pose problems for hostel owners etc... I also understand that hostel owners have some "skin" in it and their reaction can be coming from that place, as well. There's two ways to look at situations. It's not all one-sided.

MDSection12... I'm not a "spokesperson" for the trail. I didn't speak up as an authority. I was passing along info from people that I trusted to know what they were talking about... it's called responsible posting. YOu can spin things any way you want. If I just posted stuff for the heck of it you would tell me I wasn't being responsible for my threads. One can't win. If everyone only posted things that were known first hand then this site wouldn't be 100% helpful either. There's a balance that needs to be found... it's not black and white. I don't feel like I crossed any lines in maintaining that balance. People can be skeptical. No prob. It's the way you present that skepticism that isn't reasonable, at times. Go back and look at the thread... see if you think the people posting on there were being reasonable. If I reacted improperly I will apologize.

[Chaco Taco]

Chaco.. you have gone public with your attitude towards me on here and on FB hiking pages. You went out of your way to stalk me in the Cafe purposely finding ways to mock me. I let it all go.... I didn't PM you or call you on any of that stuff.

If I have cocked a "see I was right" or the "I told you so" kind of attitude, it was in defense of being needlessly hammered or censored for no good reason. I am not an alarmist. I don't accept labels from others that are incorrect.

I understand starting rumors can pose problems for hostel owners etc... I also understand that hostel owners have some "skin" in it and their reaction can be coming from that place, as well. There's two ways to look at situations. It's not all one-sided.

MDSection12... I'm not a "spokesperson" for the trail. I didn't speak up as an authority. I was passing along info from people that I trusted to know what they were talking about... it's called responsible posting. YOu can spin things any way you want. If I just posted stuff for the heck of it you would tell me I wasn't being responsible for my threads. One can't win. If everyone only posted things that were known first hand then this site wouldn't be 100% helpful either. There's a balance that needs to be found... it's not black and white. I don't feel like I crossed any lines in maintaining that balance. People can be skeptical. No prob. It's the way you present that skepticism that isn't reasonable, at times. Go back and look at the thread... see if you think the people posting on there were being reasonable. If I reacted improperly I will apologize.
I am sorry if you think I stalked you in any respect. You respond to stuff I post here and on FB so I respond back. Get over yourself....

[Chaco Taco]

I am sorry if you think I stalked you in any respect. You respond to stuff I post here and on FB so I respond back. Get over yourself....
Ill assure you that I am happily married :)

[max patch]

For some reason this thread reminds me of an old Seinfeld clip. :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BnuR3y8HUm8

[Chaco Taco]

Nice max patch :)

[Waynesboro]

Update on the sickness. It seems many hikers are sick in Waynesboro and were holed up at the Quality Inn. It's a quick bug - lasts about 24 hrs with some vomiting, not like the one down near Erwin. Some are out back hiking now, but weak. A few did hike out early and then were sick at Pinefield and Hightop huts. SO be careful out there.
It is far too easy, on Whiteblaze, to start rumors about a city, with no substantiating facts or references. I live in Waynesboro, and shuttle hikers frequently, and haven't heard of anybody being sick (other than the usual human maladies). I was at the Quality Inn just yesterday, and hauled out two healthy hikers. "Many hikers" are sick? Yeah, that's a nice, precise number.

Waynesboro is a dedicated hiker town that has been a good memory for an awful lot of AT hikers of all kinds. Unfortunately, there is no way to prove the negative, here. If nobody actually contracted any illness in Waynesboro, then there is no way to prove that. The damage is done. Sad.

[MDSection12]

MDSection12... I'm not a "spokesperson" for the trail. I didn't speak up as an authority. I was passing along info from people that I trusted to know what they were talking about... it's called responsible posting. YOu can spin things any way you want. If I just posted stuff for the heck of it you would tell me I wasn't being responsible for my threads. One can't win. If everyone only posted things that were known first hand then this site wouldn't be 100% helpful either. There's a balance that needs to be found... it's not black and white. I don't feel like I crossed any lines in maintaining that balance. People can be skeptical. No prob. It's the way you present that skepticism that isn't reasonable, at times. Go back and look at the thread... see if you think the people posting on there were being reasonable. If I reacted improperly I will apologize.
Your first thread on this topic was titled 'SEVERE norovirus outbreak,' that's not responsible posting. When people pointed that out you got defensive and then carried that defensive attitude into this new thread. I agree that some people chose to show their distaste for your word choices poorly, but I don't feel that I am one of them. I'm simply pointing out that this isn't just a case of someone 'being mean' to you.

You may not intend to come off this way, but you really do post on this site as though you are some self-appointed spokesperson for the trail. I don't condone the way some people respond to it, but I do see why it rubs them the wrong way. Bickering is very common on this site and right, wrong or indifferent you almost always have a dog in the fight.

[HikerMom58]

I am sorry if you think I stalked you in any respect. You respond to stuff I post here and on FB so I respond back. Get over yourself....

I think you need to get over yourself.


Ill assure you that I am happily married :)

I think I just threw up a lil in my mouth.


Your first thread on this topic was titled 'SEVERE norovirus outbreak,' that's not responsible posting. When people pointed that out you got defensive and then carried that defensive attitude into this new thread. I agree that some people chose to show their distaste for your word choices poorly, but I don't feel that I am one of them. I'm simply pointing out that this isn't just a case of someone 'being mean' to you.

You may not intend to come off this way, but you really do post on this site as though you are some self-appointed spokesperson for the trail. I don't condone the way some people respond to it, but I do see why it rubs them the wrong way. Bickering is very common on this site and right, wrong or indifferent you almost always have a dog in the fight.

Whatever you think of me is fine!! :)

[johnnybgood]

This bickering only lowers the standards of how we
as human beings should treat one another.

Turn off your computer and take a walk. Its a beautiful day outside today.

[MDSection12]

Whatever you think of me is fine!! :)

I don't think poorly of you. If I did I just wouldn't bother posting. :)

[Yukon]

I think I just threw up a lil in my mouth.

Oh no, maybe YOU have the norovirus!! LOL


Sorry, I had to do it...

[MDSection12]

I think I just threw up a lil in my mouth.

Oh no, now you've got it? Didn't you read the thread? You gotta wash your hands more. :p

[MDSection12]

Dang, beaten to it. Touche, Yukon, touche. :banana

[Yukon]

Dang, beaten to it. Touche, Yukon, touche. :banana

I couldn't resist!

[HikerMom58]

I have to admit, you guys are pretty funny!!! :banana Thanks for the laugh! :)

[Trillium]

It is far too easy, on Whiteblaze, to start rumors about a city, with no substantiating facts or references.You're right. It is easy to start rumors. HOWEVER, I have to stand up for Blissful here. I do not believe for one second that she was starting rumors. First of all, she has a lot of hiking cred. She's done a NOBO and a SOBO and she's been a ridge runner for at least 2 yrs. She's out there on the trail on pretty much a daily basis interacting with hikers.

Second, her first post in this thread said that she received an e-mail from her supervisors with the info. Then after interacting with current hikers, she came on to update that it's a quick 24 hr bug that has affected many hikers who 'were holed up at the Quality Inn in Waynesboro'. I am sure that she was not making this up. I'm sure that she had spoken to current hikers who gave her this info. I believe what she said and am grateful for her service on the AT. She didn't say that they contracted this bug in Waynesboro, only that the hikers were holed up in Waynesboro while they had a quick bug. So, I don't think any damage has been done and that this reflects badly on Waynesboro. I think it's more of a warning to hikers to be careful.

[Chaco Taco]

I just want to publicly apologize to Hikermom. I am not the best on the internet and as I keep saying, Im working on it. I still do hold the same opinion of her reactions to events but I should be better about how I go about saying things. I could have used better words in conveying what I meant to say. Anyone else I have offended, my apologies to you as well, Im not trying to be an a**hole but I admit, I am an a**hole sometimes on this site. But I do owe Hikermom an apology for my behavior because I do, in all honesty, come across as a jerk on WB some of the time. Hikermom, I apologize

[bfayer]

You're right. It is easy to start rumors. HOWEVER, I have to stand up for Blissful here. I do not believe for one second that she was starting rumors. First of all, she has a lot of hiking cred. She's done a NOBO and a SOBO and she's been a ridge runner for at least 2 yrs. She's out there on the trail on pretty much a daily basis interacting with hikers.

Second, her first post in this thread said that she received an e-mail from her supervisors with the info. Then after interacting with current hikers, she came on to update that it's a quick 24 hr bug that has affected many hikers who 'were holed up at the Quality Inn in Waynesboro'. I am sure that she was not making this up. I'm sure that she had spoken to current hikers who gave her this info. I believe what she said and am grateful for her service on the AT. She didn't say that they contracted this bug in Waynesboro, only that the hikers were holed up in Waynesboro while they had a quick bug. So, I don't think any damage has been done and that this reflects badly on Waynesboro. I think it's more of a warning to hikers to be careful.

+1 About Blissful. I don't know her personally, but she is one of a small group of members on here that I stop and listen to when she speaks.

[HikerMom58]

I just want to publicly apologize to Hikermom. I am not the best on the internet and as I keep saying, Im working on it. I still do hold the same opinion of her reactions to events but I should be better about how I go about saying things. I could have used better words in conveying what I meant to say. Anyone else I have offended, my apologies to you as well, Im not trying to be an a**hole but I admit, I am an a**hole sometimes on this site. But I do owe Hikermom an apology for my behavior because I do, in all honesty, come across as a jerk on WB some of the time. Hikermom, I apologize

I accept your apology CT.... Thank you soo much. I'm sorry for anything that I said to offend you as well. You are a good guy!! :) Thanks again. I feel like a huge weight has been lifted off my chest. I know I really cared about you cause it really bothered me that you and I wouldn't be friends. I'll try really hard not to say or do to offend you in the future. Let me know right away if I ever do. :D HM.

[Kookork]

I try my best not to be biased about what has been going in this thread. I am not an AT authority but I used to be a medical doctor and had been in practice long enough to have a good grasp about the issue of infectious diseases both in underdeveloped countries( Afghanistan) developing countries( Iran) and developed countries(UK).

The system of informing the public about any disease ( endemic, epidemic, outbreak,...) is not as effective and fast to react as you expect. there are lots of paperwork and forms to be filled and calls to be made and tests to be done that in some cases the authorities( including ATC) and especially field doctors acould be one of the last to raise the red flag. So the fastest way to inform the hikers from any" potential "infectious disease is social media these days( including WB, Facebook, Trail Journals and...) .In many cases authorities reaction could be too late to prevent the disease from spreading( due to formalities and ...).

This website is doing what it is supposed to do to inform hikers from potential dangers on the trail thanks to many of hikers, trail authorities , posters that care about the well being of the hikers and the safety of the trails in general.

There is not "serious" downside starting a thread about the potential infectious disease in here in WB but there could be a serious downside if we do not spread the words because we are not sure , or we have not been in the field hiking, or because we are not an official authority , or because the disease is not yet confirmed by laboratory tests. What is the downside? A real outbreak with real morbidity or mortality. If just One hiker dies due to an infectious disease the media will explode and all the hiker related businesses will feel the financial stroke of it due to the scarcity of the hikers and in long run we all will feel the effects of it.

If I am forced to choose between the words of a hostel owner and a hiker about who is telling the truth about the presence or absence of a certain disease on the trail I will always go for the hikers because they have no money or interest in telling the truth and they have no dog in this fight whatsoever.

I am thankful of HikerMom and Blissful and anybody else who cares about the safety of the hikers and I wish they continue to do what they have been doing .

Kudos to Chaco Taco for being brave enough to apology to HikerMom.

Prevention is always better and cheaper and wiser thing to do especially about the infectious diseases.

[Waynesboro]

You're right. It is easy to start rumors. HOWEVER, I have to stand up for Blissful here. I do not believe for one second that she was starting rumors. First of all, she has a lot of hiking cred. She's done a NOBO and a SOBO and she's been a ridge runner for at least 2 yrs. She's out there on the trail on pretty much a daily basis interacting with hikers.
I admire your loyalty, but I also have to deal with reality, and reality says "It doesn't matter how many NOBO and SOBO you have done. You shouldn't be tossing these comments around, lightly. I've participated in several conversations on Whiteblaze where similar baseless comments were made that probably hurt some people's businesses. I will always stand in opposition to this method of gaining "trail cred".


Second, her first post in this thread said that she received an e-mail from her supervisors with the info. Then after interacting with current hikers, she came on to update that it's a quick 24 hr bug that has affected many hikers who 'were holed up at the Quality Inn in Waynesboro'. I am sure that she was not making this up. I'm sure that she had spoken to current hikers who gave her this info. I believe what she said and am grateful for her service on the AT. She didn't say that they contracted this bug in Waynesboro, only that the hikers were holed up in Waynesboro while they had a quick bug. So, I don't think any damage has been done and that this reflects badly on Waynesboro. I think it's more of a warning to hikers to be careful.
I think you are being too generous. Of course rumors like this cause damage to the communities they are associated with. Anybody would avoid a town where they believed they might catch a nasty infection, even if it was only for 24 hours. If there really were "many hikers" who had this bug in Waynesboro, then have a few of them say so on WhiteBlaze. There don't appear to be any negative consequences for posting falsehoods here, and that is a dangerous thing.

[bfayer]

...I've participated in several conversations on Whiteblaze where similar baseless comments were made that probably hurt some people's businesses. I will always stand in opposition to this method of gaining "trail cred".

With all due respect for the the good town of Waynesboro (and it is a good town), hurting or helping someones business is not mine or most other posters on this site major concern. Blissful was looking out for the hiking community and if that hurts someones business, well, too bad.

The job of hikers is not to keep people in business, the job of businesses that serve hikers is to make money by keeping hikers happy. Quite frankly by putting making money above the safety of customers is a good way to go out of business.

So how about posting something like: We want the hiking community to know that Waynesboro is taking the health of hikers seriously. Our walk in clinic is available xx hours a day and you can arrange a ride from the trail by calling XXX-XXXX any time before xxxx in the evening. Our lodging operators have taken precautions by disinfect their rooms and have plenty of sports drinks available if needed....

Instead we get, "don't spread rumors we could loose money".:confused:

[Kookork]

With all due respect for the the good town of Waynesboro (and it is a good town), hurting or helping someones business is not mine or most other posters on this site major concern. Blissful was looking out for the hiking community and if that hurts someones business, well, too bad.

The job of hikers is not to keep people in business, the job of businesses that serve hikers is to make money by keeping hikers happy. Quite frankly by putting making money above the safety of customers is a good way to go out of business.

So how about posting something like: We want the hiking community to know that Waynesboro is taking the health of hikers seriously. Our walk in clinic is available xx hours a day and you can arrange a ride from the trail by calling XXX-XXXX any time before xxxx in the evening. Our lodging operators have taken precautions by disinfect their rooms and have plenty of sports drinks available if needed....

Instead we get, "don't spread rumors we could loose money".:confused:

bfayer:That was a thoughtful brilliant comment . Loved it .

[Waynesboro]

Instead we get, "don't spread rumors we could loose money".:confused:
That may be the message you received, but it is not the one I sent.

The simple fact is that I am here in Waynesboro, and I can't find anyone who knows anything about this alleged infection that hit "many hikers". If there was one, I assure you that there would be an effort to prevent it from spreading.

Which returns us to the disturbing lack of consequences for posting falsehoods.

[bfayer]

..The simple fact is that I am here in Waynesboro, and I can't find anyone who knows anything about this alleged infection that hit "many hikers". If there was one, I assure you that there would be an effort to prevent it from spreading.

Why do I think of Monty Python when I read this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4vuW6tQ0218

[MDSection12]

For clarification, I don't think 'Waynesboro' has any official affiliation with Waynesboro. Could be wrong, though.

Unrelated note: Just had dinner at The Old South Mountain Inn in Boonsboro, MD just off the AT and very near Dahlgren Backpackers Campground (which has a free shower for hikers) for my wife's birthday... Absolutely top notch dining, and if you can get a decent shirt and some Axe on they'll welcome hikers. If you're passing through Maryland on the AT keep it in mind. (Didn't see any sick hikers while I was there.)

[Waynesboro]

Why do I think of Monty Python when I read this
Probably because you can't come up with a logical response. A Monty Python clip often provides good cover.

Back to facts:
No baseless rumor has ever helped a hiker to avoid trouble.
There are so many rumor mongers, seeking prestige on the Internet, that, if you listen to them all, you can't stop in any town.
You ARE responsible for what you write on the Internet.
The fact that you run a business does not mean that you are not a hiker.
The behavior of some hikers harms the reputations of all hikers.
The symbiotic relationship between hikers and trail businesses IS important.
Support a "lynch mob" mentality and we all hang together.

[BostonBlue]

Although I am fairly new, I have been impressed with this thread. Hats off to several who have been the 'voice of reason' in stating that it is always prudent to warn hikers when there seems to be several hikers falling ill. I personally did not perceive any sort of "alarmist" attitude and I appreciated the news. Kudos to Blissful and HikerMom for having the insight to tell folks to be a little more careful. I believe that Blissful used to be a nurse? Chaco, it takes a lot to admit that you were wrong and offer the apology that you did. I think a whole lot of people admire you all the more.

Waynesboro - I don't know your intent, but the impression you are making concerning this topic is not a good one. Somehow, I just can't see Ron Haven acting in a similar manner. We have a lot of older hikers out there where this potentially could be life threatening. I think that most of us would prefer that you put our health/welfare first. Even if some are avoiding Waynesboro - there are others who will be staying there to recouperate. It doesn't matter if this is a "mass epidimic" or more "business as usual." Hikers have a right to know that there have been cases of illness and have others warn us to be careful, without fear of verbal assault because a few just see the almighty dollar sign. Again, this may not have been your intent - but it was how your posts came across to several of us.

[Praha4]

there's more hikers on the trail every year it seems, filthy conditions along the trail, shelters, privies, etc. ... more chance of contracting a virus or bacterial infection.

plus there are still hikers on the AT who do not filter or treat the water, don't carry hand sanitizers, don't wash their hands. IMO that is like playing russian roullete with catching something. Of course there are many testimonies from thru hikers who hiked the entire AT without treating or filtering, and never got sick. If you are very careful, there are no doubt clean springs along the trail that don't need treatment.

thanks to Blissful for the heads up... I was just hiking up in VA south of Wanesboro last week, would not drink the water up there without some kind of treatment... read a couple Trail Journals of some hikers getting sick lately up in Shenandoah Nat Park. Not going to slam any trail town, it could happen anywhere along the trail.

[Waynesboro]

If anyone has ever wondered why America is such a litigious society, they have but to peruse these illogical arguments, in support of the distribution of unsubstantiated rumors.

[Rasty]

Probably because you can't come up with a logical response. A Monty Python clip often provides good cover.

Back to facts:
No baseless rumor has ever helped a hiker to avoid trouble.
There are so many rumor mongers, seeking prestige on the Internet, that, if you listen to them all, you can't stop in any town.
You ARE responsible for what you write on the Internet.
The fact that you run a business does not mean that you are not a hiker.
The behavior of some hikers harms the reputations of all hikers.
The symbiotic relationship between hikers and trail businesses IS important.
Support a "lynch mob" mentality and we all hang together.

Well said Waynesboro. Last month Uncle Johnny's was being accused of spreading disease without any evidence to support the accusations.

[bfayer]

Unrelated note: Just had dinner at The Old South Mountain Inn in Boonsboro, MD just off the AT and very near Dahlgren Backpackers Campground (which has a free shower for hikers) for my wife's birthday... Absolutely top notch dining, and if you can get a decent shirt and some Axe on they'll welcome hikers. If you're passing through Maryland on the AT keep it in mind. (Didn't see any sick hikers while I was there.)

Told ya so :) Did you get the crab cakes?

As for Waynesboro see his other posts, he is very connected to the city of Waynesboro. I don't fault him for that at all, and Waynesboro is a great town, but he is not a disinterested party in this discussion. I think Lone Wolf's comment earlier in the post set him off a little.

[MDSection12]

I've been going there since I was a kid actually, I live pretty close. No crab cakes this time... Finally tried the wasabi salmon, I'm usually pretty set on prime rib. :)

[aficion]

Told ya so :) Did you get the crab cakes?

As for Waynesboro see his other posts, he is very connected to the city of Waynesboro. I don't fault him for that at all, and Waynesboro is a great town, but he is not a disinterested party in this discussion. I think Lone Wolf's comment earlier in the post set him off a little.

The Basic City
Luncheonette in Waynesboro
Kicks butt and takes names.

[hikerboy57]

well i spent 6 weeks on the trail, and it always seemed like we had just come too late and avoided this bubble of norovirus that always seemed a few towns ahead of us. yes i knew people who got sick.but the overwhelming majority did not.slept in uncle johnnies bunks 2 nights.didnt treat my water until i was a few days out of hot springs, where the supposed hotbed of norovirus was lurking.but people still dont bury their poop, conditions at some of the shelters were horrendous, and ,by the way, big big kudos to the cleaner, who did a wonderful job, donating bleach new brooms and spades at a few of the shelters.
i used hand sanitizer, washed my hands with soap and water when i was in town, and im not surprised some people get sick. theres a ton of people that started out with little or no backpacking experience, certainly not used to carrying a pack for 15-20 miles a day, day after day. restistances get loweered as your body deals with stresses it isnt used to. i found for the most part, older people werent getting sick at all.with a few exceptions, it seemed to be limited to the kids.
although i did have some chest congestion early on around neels gap, it went away after a few days,never had any kind of stomach distress.

[canoe]

If anyone has ever wondered why America is such a litigious society, they have but to peruse these illogical arguments, in support of the distribution of unsubstantiated rumors.
Exactly what info are you calling unsubstantiated rumors? Please list

Thank you HM Blessful for your credible info.

[hikerboy57]

i think some of you need to revisit this thread:http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php?86178-cant-we-all-get-along&highlight=.
the bickering is silly

[HikerMom58]

i think some of you need to revisit this thread:http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php?86178-cant-we-all-get-along&highlight=.
the bickering is silly

I don't disagree with ya...

I have to add this to your post, HB... Reality is - there will always be conflict, among us. You can take that to the bank. No two people will ever see eye to eye on everything. Here's the deal... if we can learn to resolve conflict then, we've got it made. We have successful relationships.

I think a party should be thrown for Chaco for apologizing. It's not easy. It shows everyone what you are made of...good stuff!! :) Not everyone is capable of apologizing... it's not something to be taken lightly.

The day I learned that conflict was OK (it happens) but I really needed to concentrate & learn how to be great at resolving conflict... that was a good day!! :) I'm still learning/trying to be great at it....:eek:

[HikerMom58]

With all due respect for the the good town of Waynesboro (and it is a good town), hurting or helping someones business is not mine or most other posters on this site major concern. Blissful was looking out for the hiking community and if that hurts someones business, well, too bad.

The job of hikers is not to keep people in business, the job of businesses that serve hikers is to make money by keeping hikers happy. Quite frankly by putting making money above the safety of customers is a good way to go out of business.

So how about posting something like: We want the hiking community to know that Waynesboro is taking the health of hikers seriously. Our walk in clinic is available xx hours a day and you can arrange a ride from the trail by calling XXX-XXXX any time before xxxx in the evening. Our lodging operators have taken precautions by disinfect their rooms and have plenty of sports drinks available if needed....

Instead we get, "don't spread rumors we could loose money".:confused:



[QUOTE=Kookork;1472972]bfayer:That was a thoughtful brilliant comment . Loved it .

AGREED Koko.... bfayer... you knocked this one out of the ballpark!! I couldn't agree with you more!!!

[BostonBlue]

[QUOTE=bfayer;1472969]With all due respect for the the good town of Waynesboro (and it is a good town), hurting or helping someones business is not mine or most other posters on this site major concern. Blissful was looking out for the hiking community and if that hurts someones business, well, too bad.

The job of hikers is not to keep people in business, the job of businesses that serve hikers is to make money by keeping hikers happy. Quite frankly by putting making money above the safety of customers is a good way to go out of business.

So how about posting something like: We want the hiking community to know that Waynesboro is taking the health of hikers seriously. Our walk in clinic is available xx hours a day and you can arrange a ride from the trail by calling XXX-XXXX any time before xxxx in the evening. Our lodging operators have taken precautions by disinfect their rooms and have plenty of sports drinks available if needed....

Instead we get, "don't spread rumors we could loose money".:confused:





AGREED Koko.... bfayer... you knocked this one out of the ballpark!! I couldn't agree with you more!!!


HM: Agree with you on this 100%. You showed concern, rather than an alarmist attitude. Any Trail City could learn from the example you posted. You should get a job in P.R. or in Waynesboro's case - "Damage Control." He sure isn't helping his city...

[HikerMom58]

With all due respect for the the good town of Waynesboro (and it is a good town), hurting or helping someones business is not mine or most other posters on this site major concern. Blissful was looking out for the hiking community and if that hurts someones business, well, too bad.

The job of hikers is not to keep people in business, the job of businesses that serve hikers is to make money by keeping hikers happy. Quite frankly by putting making money above the safety of customers is a good way to go out of business.

So how about posting something like: We want the hiking community to know that Waynesboro is taking the health of hikers seriously. Our walk in clinic is available xx hours a day and you can arrange a ride from the trail by calling XXX-XXXX any time before xxxx in the evening. Our lodging operators have taken precautions by disinfect their rooms and have plenty of sports drinks available if needed....

Instead we get, "don't spread rumors we could loose money".:confused:


bfayer:That was a thoughtful brilliant comment . Loved it .


[QUOTE=HikerMomKD;1473081]


HM: Agree with you on this 100%. You showed concern, rather than an alarmist attitude. Any Trail City could learn from the example you posted. You should get a job in P.R. or in Waynesboro's case - "Damage Control." He sure isn't helping his city...

bfayer is the brilliant poster on this one BostonBlue!! :) I agree with bfayer 2!!

btw... welcome to WB, BostonBlue.. looks like you're new here! :)

[Blissful]

It is far too easy, on Whiteblaze, to start rumors about a city, with no substantiating facts or references. I live in Waynesboro, and shuttle hikers frequently, and haven't heard of anybody being sick (other than the usual human maladies). I was at the Quality Inn just yesterday, and hauled out two healthy hikers. "Many hikers" are sick? Yeah, that's a nice, precise number.

Waynesboro is a dedicated hiker town that has been a good memory for an awful lot of AT hikers of all kinds. Unfortunately, there is no way to prove the negative, here. If nobody actually contracted any illness in Waynesboro, then there is no way to prove that. The damage is done. Sad.


I am getting this from the thru hikers. Yes, I have also seen healthy hikers but also sick hikers. Multiple reports of sick hikers. That does NOT mean Waynesboro is the cause (!) by any means. But hikers are getting sick. That is a FACT. Even the outfitter at Rockfish Gap said they were sick and was worried about it (maybe you should talk to them - ask for Rich). I dislike it when I am discredited from multiple reports I am told on the trail and by SNP (whop were the ones to FIRST report it to me! The park rangers, and from a shuttler who had taken sick hikers out of the park 10 days ago). So please also get the facts straight.

[Rasty]

It is far too easy, on Whiteblaze, to start rumors about a city, with no substantiating facts or references. I live in Waynesboro, and shuttle hikers frequently, and haven't heard of anybody being sick (other than the usual human maladies). I was at the Quality Inn just yesterday, and hauled out two healthy hikers. "Many hikers" are sick? Yeah, that's a nice, precise number.

Waynesboro is a dedicated hiker town that has been a good memory for an awful lot of AT hikers of all kinds. Unfortunately, there is no way to prove the negative, here. If nobody actually contracted any illness in Waynesboro, then there is no way to prove that. The damage is done. Sad.


I am getting this from the thru hikers. Yes, I have also seen healthy hikers but also sick hikers. Multiple reports of sick hikers. That does NOT mean Waynesboro is the cause (!) by any means. But hikers are getting sick. That is a FACT. Even the outfitter at Rockfish Gap said they were sick and was worried about it (maybe you should talk to them - ask for Rich). I dislike it when I am discredited from multiple reports I am told on the trail and by SNP (whop were the ones to FIRST report it to me! The park rangers, and from a shuttler who had taken sick hikers out of the park 10 days ago). So please also get the facts straight.

Reread your opening post where you doubt your own information.

[Praha4]

....again, thank you Blissful for trying to help other hikers by passing on the info you heard about hikers getting sick along the AT in areas near Shenandoah National Park. Read some of the Trail Journals of thru hikers in that area, I've read a couple this last week that said they themselves came down with symptoms similar to noravirus. "Rash" is one hiker who got sick this past week in that area. In his case, it sounded like it cleared up within 24 hours.

[Ktaadn]

1. Regardless of whether there is a "serious outbreak of xyz that is making LOTS of hikers sick" or not, some people are going to practice good hygiene and some aren't. The choice is yours.

2. If you don't want to read someone's posts, just click "Ignore". I discovered that some time ago and I love it.

[ChinMusic]

I am getting this from the thru hikers. Yes, I have also seen healthy hikers but also sick hikers. Multiple reports of sick hikers. That does NOT mean Waynesboro is the cause (!) by any means. But hikers are getting sick. That is a FACT. Even the outfitter at Rockfish Gap said they were sick and was worried about it (maybe you should talk to them - ask for Rich). I dislike it when I am discredited from multiple reports I am told on the trail and by SNP (whop were the ones to FIRST report it to me! The park rangers, and from a shuttler who had taken sick hikers out of the park 10 days ago). So please also get the facts straight.
Don't let these folks bother you. I was chastised, even had a thread killed, when it was first reported, later confirmed, of norovirus south of Erwin. Some WB posters are just not worth your time.

Can you find out whether any of the folks sick in your area also had a similar sickness near Erwin?

It is my understanding that once one gets NV they have at least some limited immunity from a reinfection.

Side note: I am at an Urgent Care facility in Abingdon as I type. A fellow hiker is being seen with symptoms common to giardiasis. I'll start a new thread if a Dx is confirmed.

edit: The MD "suspects" giardiasis based on symptoms. He suggested the meds route instead of waiting for the results of a test. This is probably best for the hiker but without a test to confirm it, (hard Dx sans test IMO) I'm not starting another thread.

[Astro]

i think some of you need to revisit this thread:http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php?86178-cant-we-all-get-along&highlight=.
the bickering is silly

Leave it to a guy who has actually been out for a month or two "really hiking" the trail to notice how silly the cyber-hikers are being. :)

[oruacat2]

What's the over/under for how long it takes someone to obtain the trail-name "Captain Trips"? :)

[Theosus]

There are the Blue Ridge Mountains, and there is Shenandoah National Park (Named after the Shenandoah river valley), but there is no place in VA called the "Shennies". Every time I hear that I feel like my head will explode. There is a Shenandoah Mountain, but it is in George Washington National Forrest on the west side of the valley (also called Great North Mountain). Sorry had to say it, it's just one of those nights.

Blissful, thanks for the info.

No problem with that attitude there...
It might be just me but a lot of people seem to be shortening words like that these days.
"ressies" for "reservations"
"piccies" for "pictures"
etc. etc.
Of course - this seems to be among the self absorbed over-achieving soccer mommy types
(add "totes" for totally and they start sounding like 80's valley girl wanna-bees)
but thankfully most of us don't run into that sort of ilk on a daily basis.
Generally you have to make an appointment for that sort of thing.
(Check craigslist when their hubbsies are out of town...)

now you've got me doing it!

To stay on topic - so far my hikes have been short enough that if I get sick I'll be home.
Even if the water is to blame, don't most people filter or treat it? It seems to me the more likely suspect
is some type of norovirus. If you ever see me on the trail, don't expect me to shake hands.
Keep your germs to yourself.

[Coffee]

No problem with that attitude there...
It might be just me but a lot of people seem to be shortening words like that these days.


Side effect of text messages.