REI ends return policy...

[Toli]

http://seattletimes.com/html/businesstechnology/2021116265_reireturnsxml.html

[atmilkman]

Still seems like the honest customer will be taken care of.

[max patch]

Thats good news. People that abuse the policy raise the prices for others.

[Pedaling Fool]

Thats good news. People that abuse the policy raise the prices for others.I agree, too many people return stuff that they themselves were at fault for the failure.

[shakey_snake]

Thats good news. People that abuse the policy raise the prices for others.

Sure, but ending abuse isn't going to lower prices. ;)

[atmilkman]

Thats good news. People that abuse the policy raise the prices for others.

Returning a stroller cause the kids outgrew it. C'mon.

[Old Hiker]

When jerks like Karlstrom actually brag about doing it and then "can't stop", sheesh. No fear of consequences, no nothing. I wonder if REI went after him, he'd change his tune.

How could anyone be so stupid to admit to it?

Might not lower prices, but maybe the price increases will slow somewhat.

[bfayer]

Frankly I'm surprised they waited this long.

Every hiking site I go to has more than a few posts that brag about screwing over REI.

I even read a post on one site about a guy that bought an expensive MT bike and road the crap out if it and took it back for a refund after he threw it off a cliff just for the fun if it.

Ya think maybe REI reads those posts too?

Another case of the few screwing things up for the many.

[atmilkman]

When jerks like Karlstrom actually brag about doing it and then "can't stop", sheesh. No fear of consequences, no nothing. I wonder if REI went after him, he'd change his tune.

How could anyone be so stupid to admit to it?

Might not lower prices, but maybe the price increases will slow somewhat.

I was thinking the same thing. Increases may be able to be put on hold for a while or at least keep pace with inflation. I'm an REI member but I have to admit I don't use them exclusively. I use Campmor, Backcountry, and a host of others. It just depends on where I get the best deal.

[coach lou]

I love walking thru Campmor..........they got everything ....right there!

[Nutbrown]

Good for them.

[Ktaadn]

I'm a pretty regular attendee of their Garage Sales and I have seen some really beat-up stuff there. Some people have no shame. I've seen coats and sleeping bags that were obviously used for years and even had burn holes in them. Some shoes have basically no tread left on them.

It's good to see that they will still stand behind defective merchandise and certain things that just didn't work out for the customer after short-term use.

[atmilkman]

Frankly I'm surprised they waited this long.

Every hiking site I go to has more than a few posts that brag about screwing over REI.

I even read a post on one site about a guy that bought an expensive MT bike and road the crap out if it and took it back for a refund after he threw it off a cliff just for the fun if it.

Ya think maybe REI reads those posts too?

Another case of the few screwing things up for the many.

We all talked about this not too long ago when someone got on here and "bragged" about abusing the policy. Thankfully a few WhiteBlaze members called him out and gave him an earful. Some members catch some grief for being so "abrupt" at times but at that time it was well warranted. We said at that time it would only be a matter of time and low and behold that time has come. I think all the idiots deserve a big hand and a thank you. Thanks a lot idiot. :clap

[JustADude]

2 experience with REI.com return. Montrail sole fell off after 4 months, REI paid for shipping and just wanted info about the return. Returned La Sprortiva because a size too small to REI.com, but had to pay for shipping for the return. For shoes, I may switch over to Zappos, since they have free returns, but not sure about the limits on their returns. Just bough a youth PFD through REI and bug netting, but don't plan to return either.

[Nutbrown]

Zappos has a 30 day return policy.

[JustADude]

Only 125 MI or less on the shoes.

[Rain Man]

This makes me feel a bit better. Not 100% better, but somewhat.

“For 90 percent of our customers, this isn’t going to impact them. And for the other 10 percent, a good chunk are still going to be protected by this,” he said.

“If you buy that tent, and the seam blows out after two or three years, and you feel that it’s defective, I want you to bring it back and we’re going to take care of you,” he said. “We’re always going to stand behind our products not to be defective.”

Rain:sunMan

.

[Studlintsean]

I dont blame them

[max patch]

I think if you buy a pair of shoes that end up not fitting that expense should be on you. Not rei.

[Feral Bill]

As I've pointed out before, REI is not a them, It is a we, a co-op owned by it;s members. Nobody takes any profit out of the business, excepting the annual dividend base on purchases. Returns fraud does result in higher prices and/or lower dividends.
And maybe now the garage sales will have less outright junk to sort through.

[V Eight]

A guy around here was buying REI branded gear, mostly clothing
from ebay, crags list and garage sales and taking them to the store
for a refund of the full price.

I don’t mind the correction in policy. That is how I look at this move, a correction.

[finish9]

I fully agree with REI!! However, I once purchased a pair of pants from REI in Atlanta and within 3 months the front zipper totally blew out. When I returned the item I was hassled beyond belief by a store employee about the return. Stupid me then purchased a replacement pair of the same style/make and within 9 months the exact same problem with the pants occurred. So instead of incurring the wrath of REI I just threw the pants away. Since then REI has not been my store of choice.

[rocketsocks]

Good, for to long people have been taking advantage, and we all pay higher pricing for it. I've worked with many who would return a craftsman tape measure after it breaks cause they dropped it.....That's BS, and again causes me to pay more for the products I use. I only recently joined REI's co-op, and am glad to see them finally running the company right....anyone who knowing returns something they used for years, just because they could....is a scum bag in my book...that is all :)

[Cookerhiker]

REI is being entirely reasonable.

[Shutterbug]

As I've pointed out before, REI is not a them, It is a we, a co-op owned by it;s members. Nobody takes any profit out of the business, excepting the annual dividend base on purchases. Returns fraud does result in higher prices and/or lower dividends.
And maybe now the garage sales will have less outright junk to sort through.

I agree. It isn't like an unfair return is cheating REI. When someone abuses the system, it is their fellow members that are being abused. Every dollar spent for buying back returns either increases prices or reduces dividends.

I have returned a number of products to REI over the years, but I have also thrown away some that could have been returned because I didn't think I it would be fair to my fellow members. I fully support this clarification of the policy.

[Shutterbug]

A guy around here was buying REI branded gear, mostly clothing
from ebay, crags list and garage sales and taking them to the store
for a refund of the full price.

I don’t mind the correction in policy. That is how I look at this move, a correction.

I don't understand how he could have done that. It is my understanding that REI keeps a computer record of every member's purchases. If you return an item, they check the computer to verify how much you paid. That is the amount of the refund.

If one is not a member of REI, they have to have a receipt to return merchandise.

How would a person who bought an REI brand item at a garage sale come up with a receipt or a computer record?

[Feral Bill]

I fully agree with REI!! However, I once purchased a pair of pants from REI in Atlanta and within 3 months the front zipper totally blew out. When I returned the item I was hassled beyond belief by a store employee about the return. Stupid me then purchased a replacement pair of the same style/make and within 9 months the exact same problem with the pants occurred. So instead of incurring the wrath of REI I just threw the pants away. Since then REI has not been my store of choice. Very much the exception, fortunately.

[Feral Bill]

I don't understand how he could have done that. It is my understanding that REI keeps a computer record of every member's purchases. If you return an item, they check the computer to verify how much you paid. That is the amount of the refund.

If one is not a member of REI, they have to have a receipt to return merchandise.

How would a person who bought an REI brand item at a garage sale come up with a receipt or a computer record?



Over indulgent staff, I would expect.

[RF_ace]

More of a reason to shop at backcountry.com

[bfayer]

Over indulgent staff, I would expect.

I'm not sure over indulgent is the issue. People that do this kind of crap know how to work the system.

I worked retail long ago in a former life. People would return stuff that the store did not even sell.

Management would always grant the refund because the scumbags would always put on a show in front of other customers. It was better to grant a small refund than to leave the other paying customers thinking that the company was not serious about "Satisfaction Always" policy.

[rocketsocks]

I fully agree with REI!! However, I once purchased a pair of pants from REI in Atlanta and within 3 months the front zipper totally blew out. When I returned the item I was hassled beyond belief by a store employee about the return. Stupid me then purchased a replacement pair of the same style/make and within 9 months the exact same problem with the pants occurred. So instead of incurring the wrath of REI I just threw the pants away. Since then REI has not been my store of choice.Maybe the pants weren't the problem, some would say your gifted and that this was a blessing in desguise.:D

[bfayer]

Maybe the pants weren't the problem, some would say your gifted and that this was a blessing in desguise.:D

You did not need to go there. :banghead:

[Pedaling Fool]

Maybe the pants weren't the problem, some would say your gifted and that this was a blessing in desguise.:D
That's my problem -- I'm gifted, it's a blessing and sometimes a curse. :D


Whenever I get a bike I usually break something, because of my powerful "pistons" I don't return, despite having a warrenty, I simply upgrade to match my gifted legs;):)

I just broke an axle on my bike, still under warrenty, but didn't return, because with my gift comes responsibility to know I can't hold the manuf. to my higher level of performance. So I simply upgraded and rebuilt my wheel to withstand the extra horsepower.



...OK, maybe I'm laying it on a little too thick, but it feels so good....:D ;)


http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/m484/76gunner/Broken%20%20Axle%20Diamondback/008_zpsfa0122ef.jpg (http://s1128.photobucket.com/user/76gunner/media/Broken%20%20Axle%20Diamondback/008_zpsfa0122ef.jpg.html)

http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/m484/76gunner/Broken%20%20Axle%20Diamondback/005_zpsdd444169.jpg (http://s1128.photobucket.com/user/76gunner/media/Broken%20%20Axle%20Diamondback/005_zpsdd444169.jpg.html)

[rocketsocks]

That's my problem -- I'm gifted, it's a blessing and sometimes a curse. :D


Whenever I get a bike I usually break something, because of my powerful "pistons" I don't return, despite having a warrenty, I simply upgrade to match my gifted legs;):)

I just broke an axle on my bike, still under warrenty, but didn't return, because with my gift comes responsibility to know I can't hold the manuf. to my higher level of performance. So I simply upgraded and rebuilt my wheel to withstand the extra horsepower.



...OK, maybe I'm laying it on a little too thick, but it feels so good....:D ;)


http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/m484/76gunner/Broken%20%20Axle%20Diamondback/008_zpsfa0122ef.jpg (http://s1128.photobucket.com/user/76gunner/media/Broken%20%20Axle%20Diamondback/008_zpsfa0122ef.jpg.html)

http://i1128.photobucket.com/albums/m484/76gunner/Broken%20%20Axle%20Diamondback/005_zpsdd444169.jpg (http://s1128.photobucket.com/user/76gunner/media/Broken%20%20Axle%20Diamondback/005_zpsdd444169.jpg.html)Your a Machine :D

oh and i'll have the Ruben w/ extra corned beef.

[rocketsocks]

You did not need to go there. :banghead:You are abbsolutely right....sometimes (most times) I have no filter.

[atmilkman]

Your a Machine :D

oh and i'll have the Ruben w/ extra corned beef.

No corna beef. This a Chinese wesawant.

[rocketsocks]

No corna beef. This a Chinese wesawant.there goes the neighborhood.....Drifting!

[rocketsocks]

Sorry, Now back to our regularly scheduled show :D

[coach lou]

Sorry, Now back to our regularly scheduled show :D


You soooooo fuuuuunnnny!

[rocketsocks]

You soooooo fuuuuunnnny!Everybody funny, now Lou funny too.:D

[FarmerChef]

Just chiming in to say I agree with the policy change. There are lots of times I don't return a product because I did something for which I feel directly responsible, not the manufacturer. But even in that case, I think it would have been ok with the policy. What's truly above and beyond is folks passing off knock-off goods as legit REI goods and somehow getting refunds. That's just plain thievery imho. Just raises the prices/lowers the dividend for the rest of us.

[Feral Bill]

. That's just plain thievery imho. J. That's not an opinion, it's a fact.

[Uff Da]

Just thought I should let everyone know, this new policy only applies to products purchased on 06/04/13 or later. This does not apply to purchases made before the return policy change.

I slowly put together my gear for my thru hike next year using 20% off coupons and was very concerned until I contacted REI to clarify their policy regarding purchases made before the return policy changed.

[Nooga]

I agree, too many people return stuff that they themselves were at fault for the failure.

Totally agree!

[Blissful]

The only issue I see that for backpacking equipment, you only take it out so much in a given year typically (unless you are a thru hiker). I had a piece of gear I only used a few times in the course of a year, then it gave way the following year with an obvious defect (my neo air pad). I returned the defected item to my nearby outfitter who handles them through the manufacturer (no money loss for them). But it has to be a defect, and they take pictures of it. I think gear defects should be more than a year, imo.

[Dogwood]

I knew this would happen. Too many abuse REI's return poilcy. Same happened with Home Depot, Walmart, etc. I'm not overly concerned though. I'll see what happens in practice. This thing of using gear for a yr and then returning it for a full refund is largely bogus abuse anyhow. Glad REI is putting a halt to it.

[Onedawg]

As a member, I received an email from REI today informing me of their new policy. Still seems like one of the best return policies out there.

[AllenIsbell]

Good call on their part. I think giving customers 1 year to return items is still extremely generous. I can't think of any one single thing in my life that I have needed to return after 1 year of owning it...

If they still have this "issue," they could always offer extended warranties for items for a reasonable fee.

[Rasty]

Darn, I blew my chance of returning the kayak I bought in 1986

[MuddyWaters]

The peace of mind offered by buying some expensive items from REI at full price, was the only reason to buy from them.

I hope it works out for them, but they will have to discount prices to sell me items, they are ridiculously expensive compared to other online sources.

I went into my first REI store ever last weekend in Dallas.

I wasnt impressed.

[Lone Wolf]

I went into my first REI store ever last weekend in Dallas.

I wasnt impressed.it's for yupsters and noobies. Campmor is the real deal :cool:

[Drybones]

One year is more than fair but I doubt REI is losing money on the returns, If you've ever been to one of thier scratch and dent sales you understand what I mean. They sale the returns for half price, which is about what the product cost them and the stuff goes in a matter of minutes, what a zoo! I bought a returned, torn sleeping bag for $100 and saw it on sale a few weeks later new for $126. I do business with them mainly because I like the folks in thier store, not thier return policy.

[Wise Old Owl]

I love walking thru Campmor..........they got everything ....right there!

Take a peek at this store,, I do not think there is a comparison.

71 Raymond Road
West Hartford, CT 06107
(860) 233-2211

[scrabbler]

I hope this works out for them, I enjoy having their stores available locally. However, I do question whether the loss of "peace of mind" customers will be worse or not. As someone hinted at earlier, this could be a stepping stone to "for an extra $X.XX we can give you a lifetime, no questions asked, warranty" - which on some expensive items maybe worth it. At any rate, taking away of benefits is rarely a path to greater rewards down the road.

[coach lou]

Take a peek at this store,, I do not think there is a comparison.

71 Raymond Road
West Hartford, CT 06107
(860) 233-2211

You are correct. Do you know that there has been some kind of backpack/climbing/ outdoors store on that city block since I was a boy scout!

[rocketsocks]

So what store is this?

[coach lou]

So what store is this?

REI....West Hartford, Ct

[rocketsocks]

REI....West Hartford, Ctah.....missed that part

[Bronk]

This makes me feel a bit better. Not 100% better, but somewhat.

“For 90 percent of our customers, this isn’t going to impact them. And for the other 10 percent, a good chunk are still going to be protected by this,” he said.

“If you buy that tent, and the seam blows out after two or three years, and you feel that it’s defective, I want you to bring it back and we’re going to take care of you,” he said. “We’re always going to stand behind our products not to be defective.”

Rain:sunMan

.

It actually sounds to me like the policy hasn't really changed. They are just making a public statement trying to discourage people from abusing the policy. Those that abuse it will continue to do so. As someone who worked the refund desk at a big box store for a couple of years I can tell you that it was a very rare occurance to tell somebody they wouldn't be getting a refund...usually only if we could prove you stole it. I once had a customer return a Christmas tree in March with the tinsel still on it...when asked the reason for return "You know what, I just don't need this anymore."

I'm betting only a very small percentage of returns will refused.

[Offshore]

I think REI is increasingly becoming irrelevant. They are going the same way as Abercrombie and Fitch, Eddie Bauer, and LL Bean - from outfitter to outdoor/active lifestyle fashion retailer. Looking at their on-line offerings, most of the products available at REI (with the exception of their private label, of course) are available at often substantially lower cost through a lot of other retailers, including Backcountry and Amazon. The other retailers also offer faster free shipping and more convenient returns using prepaid labels at a nominal cost. (Living on the east coast and 30 miles from the nearest REI, its often prohibitively expensive to ship a return back to Washington state, even though REI has a distribution center in Pennsylvania.) It also seems that the great majority of items shown on line are not available in their retail stores anyway, so there is no "see it first in person" advantage. Lately I've shopped at REIs in East Hanover, NJ and the new SoHo store in NYC and was pretty unimpressed with the disinterested "experts" and messy stores.

My shopping preference is local outfitters, Backcountry and Amazon.

[Ktaadn]

I think gear defects should be more than a year, imo.

Did you read the article?

[Ktaadn]

I think REI is increasingly becoming irrelevant. They are going the same way as Abercrombie and Fitch, Eddie Bauer, and LL Bean - from outfitter to outdoor/active lifestyle fashion retailer. Looking at their on-line offerings, most of the products available at REI (with the exception of their private label, of course) are available at often substantially lower cost through a lot of other retailers, including Backcountry and Amazon. The other retailers also offer faster free shipping and more convenient returns using prepaid labels at a nominal cost. (Living on the east coast and 30 miles from the nearest REI, its often prohibitively expensive to ship a return back to Washington state, even though REI has a distribution center in Pennsylvania.) It also seems that the great majority of items shown on line are not available in their retail stores anyway, so there is no "see it first in person" advantage. Lately I've shopped at REIs in East Hanover, NJ and the new SoHo store in NYC and was pretty unimpressed with the disinterested "experts" and messy stores.

My shopping preference is local outfitters, Backcountry and Amazon.

I think it is commonly understood that REI is "full retail price" but there are also other advantages of shopping there inlcuding the return policy and I think the Garage Sales are outstanding bargins if you are willing to deal with it.

It has been my experience that the "local outfitters" are also "full retail price" but have a smaller selection and no other benefits. They will sometimes have brands that REI does not carry though.

End of the day, most of my stuff was bought on sale, clearance, Garage Sale, or online. Very little of what I own was bought for full retail both for hiking gear and non hiking gear.

[Feral Bill]

You are all aware that REI very often has a large selection of items at less than full retail, no?

[HooKooDooKu]

I think REI is increasingly becoming irrelevant.

I would disagree.

For one, some brands of gear are only ever sold at full retail price. For items such as these, you at least get the 10% rebate on the backend if you buy it at REI.

Second, from what I've experiences REI brand gear is a legitimate competitor with other brands.

Third, this change in policy doesn't change the core of the original return policy... namely that you can return USED gear if it doesn't meet your expectations. By contrast, other merchants "officially" require the merchanise to be unused. As an example, an excerpt from Campmor's Return Policy states "All merchandise in resellable condition may be returned for a full refund within one year of purchase".

Now when it comes to retail stores, these differences might be irrelevant (i.e. perhaps REI isn't the best brick-n-morter seller). But it makes a huge difference for those who don't have access to retail stores and do most of thier gear purchases online.

Add to that, REI frequently has lots of stuff on-sale, along with the regular 20% off any single item sales.

IMHO, these things keep REI relevant enough that I would say my purchases are typically evenly split between Campmor and REI.

[Hiker Trash Dude]

Can't say as I blame 'em.

[Seatbelt]

One year is more than fair but I doubt REI is losing money on the returns, If you've ever been to one of thier scratch and dent sales you understand what I mean. They sale the returns for half price, which is about what the product cost them and the stuff goes in a matter of minutes, what a zoo! I bought a returned, torn sleeping bag for $100 and saw it on sale a few weeks later new for $126. I do business with them mainly because I like the folks in thier store, not thier return policy.
I wonder how much of this decision was fueled by REI's suppliers scaling back their "acceptable returns" policies to REI--thus requiring them to sell things at scratch and dent sales??

[Sailing_Faith]

I like REI, and will continue to do business with them.

They are SO much better then any of my local stores. Around here, folks only go in the woods to kill something for dinner or to dump their old sofa. :rolleyes:

[bfayer]

I like REI, and will continue to do business with them.

They are SO much better then any of my local stores. Around here, folks only go in the woods to kill something for dinner or to dump their old sofa. :rolleyes:

That's not true, and I have pictures of the mattresses and tires to prove it :)

[stillatit]

About time they cracked down on those without principles! Maybe now the % on our annual rebate check will go up...

:D

[Feral Bill]

About time they cracked down on those without principles! Maybe now the % on our annual rebate check will go up...

:D
Or more/better sales
Or greater selection of low profit items
Or more money to environmental causes
Or more educational programs
Or more R and D for new products
Or less crap to sift through at the garage sales

[Drybones]

I wonder how much of this decision was fueled by REI's suppliers scaling back their "acceptable returns" policies to REI--thus requiring them to sell things at scratch and dent sales??

They've already been selling the returns at scratch and dent sales, went to one, what a zoo, a person could get trampled to death, everything is gone in a matter of minutes. I'm guessing they price the items at about what it cost them so they dont really lose much money, if any.

[Freedom Walker]

I'm not sure over indulgent is the issue. People that do this kind of crap know how to work the system.

I worked retail long ago in a former life. People would return stuff that the store did not even sell.

Management would always grant the refund because the scumbags would always put on a show in front of other customers. It was better to grant a small refund than to leave the other paying customers thinking that the company was not serious about "Satisfaction Always" policy. I work in retail as well and the company has a satisfaction guarantee too. People do take advantage of them, but the company as a whole is doing very well, so something is working. I totally agree with the changes. There is no reason we can't decide within a year if we are satisfied. I bought a pair of Oboz Yellowstone 11 boots last year. I bought a exact pair three years ago from someone else, and have worn them out. If I was dishonest, I could return them as my newest ones under the old policy. I will continue to shop REI whenever possible.

[Wise Old Owl]

I will continue to shop REI whenever possible.I prefer to get the best price vs value, I work the clearance I appear to need an intervention and get out hiking... Anyone have any ideas on how to reduce weekend Honey Dew's? The owl might need some help here...

[rocketsocks]

I will continue to shop REI whenever possible.I prefer to get the best price vs value, I work the clearance I appear to need an intervention and get out hiking... Anyone have any ideas on how to reduce weekend Honey Dew's? The owl might need some help here...



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=91euERWH2M4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=91euERWH2M4