Please Explain

[Teacher & Snacktime]

I made a trip to REI and Dick's yesterday to check out hammock camping gear. It looks like something that Snacktime might enjoy, and everything seemed so light I suspected it might be a weight-saving option. Unfortunately, what I found is that it would actually almost double our shelter weight....requiring each of us to tote our approx. 4lbs instead of the shared 4lb tent.

Also, I didn't care much for the insulation or dryness factors.

So what's the attraction? It still looks so "cool" to me, but the downsides seem to many.

[perdidochas]

I made a trip to REI and Dick's yesterday to check out hammock camping gear. It looks like something that Snacktime might enjoy, and everything seemed so light I suspected it might be a weight-saving option. Unfortunately, what I found is that it would actually almost double our shelter weight....requiring each of us to tote our approx. 4lbs instead of the shared 4lb tent.

Also, I didn't care much for the insulation or dryness factors.

So what's the attraction? It still looks so "cool" to me, but the downsides seem to many.

Dryness factors?

The main attraction is comfort. I don't sleep well when camping. I sleep even less well on the ground. On a hammock, I sleep almost as well as in a bed.

[Teacher & Snacktime]

The picture of the tarp set up on the ENOs tag seems to allow a great deal of open area on the sides. I was thinking it would provide little protection against lateral rain or even heavy morning dew. Thus my dryness factor question.

Essentially then, if the comfort factor is not the issue, then it may not really be of any benefit to me?

[Old Hiker]

Solo - makes sense. With a partner - maybe not so much. I love mine, but hated it when I had to get out of it to get ready for the Trail on bad days.

Pros for me: Comfortable, warm (lots of opinions on under quilts - I've never had to use one), I could actually sit to put my boots on or eat, etc., off the ground in really hard rains (saw 2-3 inches of flowing water under me several times camping), lighter than my old ALPS tent, same as my new LightHeart Gear SoLong 6, hang almost anywhere.

Cons: not much privacy, getting out on bad days, VERY warm here in FL - the bug netting does NOT let wind through.

Went back to a tent after blowing cold rain. Couldn't get the hang of getting out without getting damp, if not wet.

I have an older Clark jungle hammock, extra large fly.

[JustaTouron]

Unfortunately, what I found is that it would actually almost double our shelter weight....requiring each of us to tote our approx. 4lbs instead of the shared 4lb tent.



I am not a fan of hammocks, but when you do your calculations subtract the weight of the sleeping pads you won't need.

[tiptoe]

Another attraction is being able to set up camp almost anywhere, as opposed to having to hunt for a flat open area for a tent.

[imscotty]

Teacher,

Weight seems to be about the same as tenting to me when going solo. You are correct about the weight penilty for two, when I bring the kids I pack a tent.

Dryness: I have no problem staying dry in my hammock, get a good size tarp and pitch it tight. In my tent I have been flooded when I chose my site poorly.

Insulation: I have been as warm (or as cold) in my hammock as my tent. It all depends on what you want to haul for underquilts and top quilt.

Comfort: No competition here. My hammock is so comfortable, even more so than my bed. At my age I have begun to suffer in a tent. When I am on my own there is no question, I am bringing my hammock.

[Teacher & Snacktime]

I am not a fan of hammocks, but when you do your calculations subtract the weight of the sleeping pads you won't need.

Actually the sleeping pad is a necessity for warmth for me, and ENOs makes one just for the hammock, so the weight is included for myself which actually brought it up to about 5lbs

[Teacher & Snacktime]

Another attraction is being able to set up camp almost anywhere, as opposed to having to hunt for a flat open area for a tent.

unless of course you're on top of a bald

[Teacher & Snacktime]

I guess the issue here is that I always assume that if I can't see the appeal of something so popular, or if the downsides seem to outweigh the benefits, I must be missing something.

I can see here that I was pretty accurate in seeing the downsides that would be important to me, and for that confirmation I thank you.

I will probably try it out for the "fun" factor when I don't have to haul it in our current manner.....or pick up the set up for Strife on our next 3-person outing as the tent only holds 2.

[HooKooDooKu]

The picture of the tarp set up on the ENOs tag seems to allow a great deal of open area on the sides. I was thinking it would provide little protection against lateral rain or even heavy morning dew. Thus my dryness factor question.

Morning dew doesn't fall sideways, so anything overhead is going to keep out the morning dew.

As for sideways driving rain, it would seem that that just requires you to pitch the tarp close enough to the hammock to keep the rain out. The hammock setups I've seen while hiking around GSMNP have not left we wondering if those people would stay dry during a heavy rain.

Interestingly enough, I was hiking this past weekend at a site where there was about a dozen people. The setups that had the largest footprint (as measured by the extents of guylines) were the hammocks.

[JustaTouron]

I guess the issue here is that I always assume that if I can't see the appeal of something so popular, or if the downsides seem to outweigh the benefits, I must be missing something.



I hear ya.

Took me four internal frame backpacks to realize that for *ME*a cheap external pack beats even an expensive internal frame pack. Yes, it weights a few pounds more, but even for relatively light load 20 lbs on my back with an external pack is more comfortable than 18 lbs with an internal and as the weight goes up even more so.

[Teacher & Snacktime]

I fully appreciate the "hyoh" idea, but a novice needs experience to learn what "yoh" is, and advice can make that experience so much more pleasant!

[DeerPath]

The picture of the tarp set up on the ENOs tag seems to allow a great deal of open area on the sides. I was thinking it would provide little protection against lateral rain or even heavy morning dew. Thus my dryness factor question.

Essentially then, if the comfort factor is not the issue, then it may not really be of any benefit to me?

22757
June 12, 2012 Tropical Storm Debbie dumped 12 inches of rain, including horizontal rain and not one drop got in my Hennessy Hammock. I believe you can depend on a good hammock keeping you dry.
Happy Trails

[Teacher & Snacktime]

Out of curiosity....why were you hammock camping in a tropical storm?

[Teacher & Snacktime]

What's the likelihood of snake friendliness in a hammock? I imagine it would be easy enough to snuggle in for some warmth? Is that an issue?

[perdidochas]

The picture of the tarp set up on the ENOs tag seems to allow a great deal of open area on the sides. I was thinking it would provide little protection against lateral rain or even heavy morning dew. Thus my dryness factor question.

Essentially then, if the comfort factor is not the issue, then it may not really be of any benefit to me?

I can't comment on the tarp you mentioned--I have a huge tarp, 12x12. I find it to be drier than a backpacking style tent, as I don't have to crawl in and out of it. That said, to me, comfort is the main reason. It's especially good in the summertime. In a hammock without bottom insulation, 72 degrees is almost cold.

[perdidochas]

What's the likelihood of snake friendliness in a hammock? I imagine it would be easy enough to snuggle in for some warmth? Is that an issue?

Snakes can't get in if you have a bugnet.

[Teacher & Snacktime]

I can't comment on the tarp you mentioned--I have a huge tarp, 12x12. I find it to be drier than a backpacking style tent, as I don't have to crawl in and out of it. That said, to me, comfort is the main reason. It's especially good in the summertime. In a hammock without bottom insulation, 72 degrees is almost cold.

Yeah, I was thinking it would be pretty nice in the heat.....unless the nylon hammock itsel doesn't breathe?

[perdidochas]

Yeah, I was thinking it would be pretty nice in the heat.....unless the nylon hammock itsel doesn't breathe?

Unless it's coated, it will breath. I don't know of non-breathable hammocks--mine are homemade. It's great in heat. I was cold with a fleece bag liner in 72 degrees this summer (but I am a wimp when it comes to cold).

[Just Bill]

I made a trip to REI and Dick's yesterday to check out hammock camping gear. It looks like something that Snacktime might enjoy, and everything seemed so light I suspected it might be a weight-saving option. Unfortunately, what I found is that it would actually almost double our shelter weight....requiring each of us to tote our approx. 4lbs instead of the shared 4lb tent.

Also, I didn't care much for the insulation or dryness factors.

So what's the attraction? It still looks so "cool" to me, but the downsides seem to many. The attraction is three-fold. 1)- this one is true-for some folks- there is increased comfort and security in a hammock. No risk of crawlies or other nighttime visitors- adding the bug nets also eliminates insects. No lumps or bumps, no issues with a leaky tent floor in heavy rain. There is a bit of joy to "swinging in the breeze" that can't be beat. On the relatively wet and buggy AT they also allow you to pack up a bit cleaner shelter. New hammock designs let you lay more or less flat once you have it down- ESPECIALLY with the aid of a sleeping pad. This is the main attraction- a good night's sleep is worth your money and the weight if you can't find it elsewhere. 2)-because of all these reasons- it does look "cool" There is also a bit of cool factor in coming up with and mastering a new technique and set of gear. 3) This one is false- Hammocks are a weight saving shelter. Solo- they are not, as you mentioned- for a pair it's even worse. While you may choose a hammock for comfort or other personal preferences, and you are certainly free to do so; there is a certain amount of delusion among the hangers that they are saving weight. FOR THE MOST PART- you are spending a fair amount of money to get a full system, especially in colder weather- dollar for dollar you can get a lighter system elsewhere- when comparing tandem options- there is no comparison. Hammocks make sense for; winter travel, swamps, extreme elevations (Steep slopes) and those who have trouble getting a good night's sleep otherwise. As mentioned- Hammocks don't pitch to well on Max Patch or other spots you may want to enjoy. Tarps have their limits too, but generally speaking a hammock is the most limited shelter option, and a pretty big investment if you choose to travel anywhere outside "the woods". While there are systems that let you pitch on the ground too- you are adding more weight and features to gain that benefit, in addition to cost. Lest anyone accuse me of it; I've spent several years camping in hammocks- for all the pleasant reasons listed- and still sleep in them a few times a year. But for backpacking- unless you CANNOT sleep well otherwise- they are a bust if you run the numbers. (Dollars, weight, feature for feature, bulk, complexity of use, and overall convenience.

[Teacher & Snacktime]

Thank you, Just Bill and everyone. Lots of constructive info here, thus lots of help.

[Just Bill]

What shelter are you considering?

[Teacher & Snacktime]

nothing specific....I was just looking into the idea of hammock camping more than anything, and didn't get many answers at the two places I went to see gear. I just looks like something my grandson in particular might enjoy, but I'm not willing to add weight to his pack. I wanted to get some more impressions before I even broached the subject with him.

And if you'd like to have some fun with your knowledge, join us on the Creative Corner post and add to our current "Thoughts On Hammock Camping" group effort....:)

[Just Bill]

I think you have all your hammock answers, including a conclusion (perhaps) to your poem. Check out Zpacks stuff, especially if you are stick swingers (trekking pole users) Their Shelters are light- you and snacktime could probably fit in the solo plus size- that way you'd have another shelter when you have three- but still be covered when it's just you two. The true two person is only an ounce or two more, probably a better call as 11 year olds quickly turn into full sized folks in no time, lol. You can easily drop $500 on a hammock setup, I think a cuben shelter is a much better bet- especially at well under a pound per person. http://www.zpacks.com/

[HooKooDooKu]

...hammock camping... seemed so light I suspected it might be a weight-saving option...
Come to think of it, I've sort of always assumed that. But when you break it down, it suddenly doesn't seem like a huge weight savings:
1. Tarp - Likely to be about as heavy as a tent rain fly.
2. Hammock - Likely to be about as heavy as the floor of a tent.
3. Bug Net - Likely to be about as heavy as the walls of a tent.
4. Hanging system - Likely to be almost as heavy as tent poles.
5. Guy Lines and stakes - Likely to be about as heavy as same for a tent.

Of course there are always options where these "estimates" do not hold up. There's heavy weight tents, and light weight tents. There's heavy weight hammocks, and light weight hammocks.

[Drybones]

I am not a fan of hammocks, but when you do your calculations subtract the weight of the sleeping pads you won't need.

But add the weight of an under quilt, if you want to stay warm. I've looked at hammocks several times and and backed away because it would be adding weight. The only advantage I see may be sleeping comfort, if you like sleeping in a hammock. I could not get used to my knees being locked...that may be a matter of experience.

[Teacher & Snacktime]

Come to think of it, I've sort of always assumed that. But when you break it down, it suddenly doesn't seem like a huge weight savings:
1. Tarp - Likely to be about as heavy as a tent rain fly.
2. Hammock - Likely to be about as heavy as the floor of a tent.
3. Bug Net - Likely to be about as heavy as the walls of a tent.
4. Hanging system - Likely to be almost as heavy as tent poles.
5. Guy Lines and stakes - Likely to be about as heavy as same for a tent.

Of course there are always options where these "estimates" do not hold up. There's heavy weight tents, and light weight tents. There's heavy weight hammocks, and light weight hammockxs.

The clerk at REI did an ounce to ounce comparison for us....the hammock system came in at 5lbs 3 oz each compared to our tent of 4lbs 8oz and 2 15 oz pads tot 6lbs 6oz shared.

[max patch]

Do you want to be one of the cool kids is what it really all comes down to.

[Rocket Jones]

I realized early on that hammocks are not a magical weight-saving solution. They are for me, however, a magical better-night's-sleep solution.

[Teacher & Snacktime]

Yeah....I've been caught out again.....it would be cool to be one of the cool kids....but maybe, just MAYBE mind you, I'm getting a little old for "cool kid" envy. So now I blame it all on my son and/or grandson and try to get them stuff so they can be the cool kids and I can be the wicked-awesome mom/grandmom!

[Teacher & Snacktime]

I think you have all your hammock answers, including a conclusion (perhaps) to your poem. Check out Zpacks stuff, especially if you are stick swingers (trekking pole users) Their Shelters are light- you and snacktime could probably fit in the solo plus size- that way you'd have another shelter when you have three- but still be covered when it's just you two. The true two person is only an ounce or two more, probably a better call as 11 year olds quickly turn into full sized folks in no time, lol. You can easily drop $500 on a hammock setup, I think a cuben shelter is a much better bet- especially at well under a pound per person. http://www.zpacks.com/



Go check out the finished work....and thanks for the contribution. Neat twist.

[R1ma]

Wanna borrow my setup?

With my underquilt, I was hot last summer in Wells SP (outside Sturbridge, MA), it was in the high 70s during the day, 60s at night.

My setup consists of a heavy Hennessey, a DIY UQ, and a down bag I'm about to replace with an overquilt I'm building this month.
Hammock: 1 kg
Fly: 334g (OEM Hennessey)
UQ: 884g
Sleeping bag: 36oz
Treehuggers: 90g

All told, thats over 7lbs!

A different hammock could lower that 1000g to 525g. I could use a 250g ridge rest instead of the UQ, but if it's colder than 60, the UQ so much more comfortable. I could cut my sleeping bag weight in half easy (it's an old campmor down bag). That would cut it down to 3.6 lbs.

I could use that 16oz quilt, that 250g ridge rest, and a 10.5oz ZPacks tent and be at 2.2 lbs.

BUT, in a hammock, I'll sleep in to 8 am. In a tent, I'm up with the sun. That to me means I sleep much better hanging. That's worth a couple lbs to me ;)

[Just Bill]

"That to me means I sleep much better hanging"- you said it all- the only valid (and a damn good one) for a hammock. Sleep is too important to mess with. Happy Hanging!

[lilricky]

Yep, getting all ENO equipment can get heavy, thats why we have hammockforums.net, a place to go to learn about the hammock cottage industry. I guarantee you can get a hammock setup at 1/2 the weight of ENO's. Just off the top of my head, the Weight Weenie Micro hammock at 6oz, and the Buginator net at 8oz both from Buttinasling.com, a Hanger 10 tarp from Undergroundquilts.com at 11oz or the Cuben fiber hex tarp at hammockgear.com at only 5.2oz if you want to spend the money(I have one and love it!) Of course there are the hammocks with built in bug nets, like the famous Warbonnet Blackbird, as low as 18.5 oz(there are several options to choose there). And yes you could use your favorite sleeping pad, but most hammock hangers use underquilts and top quilts instead of the traditional sleeping bag and pad. Again, don't just go by whats in the big box stores, there's a ton of other options to choose from! I haven't even mentioned a tenth of whats out there. So if you're interested, come join us at www.hammockforums.net(a sister site to Whiteblaze), we even have hangers from RI!

[lilricky]

And oh yeah, in case you haven't found him yet on Youtube, check out Shugemery. He has a 10 part series on how to make the most of hammocking. He makes it fun and entertaining to learn about hammocks. you can start here! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7NZVqpBUV0&feature=c4-overview&playnext=1&list=TL5aoZqMGHJvI)

[Teacher & Snacktime]

My head is spinning....what is cuben fiber? If you have a hammock pad do you still need an underquilt? How does the netting work? This sounds much more compex than I had anticipated. I will certainly check out the hammockforums site and the Shugermery videos.....thanks!

[oruacat2]

I'm a hanger - though I haven't taken The Big Plunge into topquilts, underquilts, ridgelines, etc - just a small pad and a sleeping bag suitable for the temperature.
The biggest and most important reason I prefer the hammock is the comfort. I sleep like a baby. Screw "the cool kids" and "the haters". lol
The fact that I'm not saving a huge amount of weight is secondary to that comfort. Besides, what I lack in weight-savings I make up for in compactability. The hammock packs up into a fist-sized ball, the straps that wrap around the tree pack even smaller, and the tarp isn't much bigger. I keep them all loaded up in a TriZip pack that I can grab-and-go on a moment's notice for trips of a night or two in my nearby national forest of choice - it's reallly only the sleeping bag and extra shirt or two that changes depending on the weather.
Obviously I still own a tent for when it's appropriate, but I definitely prefer the hammock. I'm getting more efficient at set-up, and I just bought a Nemo Zor Short sleeping pad that I think will be perfect for three-season use, and I can't wait to get back out and hang some more.

ps - Shug is a genius!

[Just Bill]

that is a good series. Cuben Fiber is a cloth used for sailboat sails that made it's way to our little hobby- and is the lightest fabric out there today. Zpacks has some decent info on their site, Mountain Laurel Designs has some info too- but there isn't much to it- it's awesome- but it's $30 a yard (Sil Nylon can be as cheap as $7) so the Cuben gear is expensive, but up to half the weight or more. All of my hammock camping has always been done with a regular self inflating therm-a-rest, and a regular mummy bag. They work good enough. You can also just wear a headnet too. If you feel you have the bug- you need a hammock- all other gear can come from your regular kit. The hammock can also turn into a CRITICAL piece of car camping gear- so not a horrible investment. Unfortunately, I think the hangers generally went overboard- although there are some very good reasons to do so- it's not as easy as finding two trees. Put your pad in the hammock- get into your mummy bag ON THE GROUND, and sit down in your hammock- you're done. String a tarp (8x10) is a good size overhead and the rain will (mostly) stay away.

[scooterdogma]

Here is Sgt. Rock's one pound kit, you can go lighter when you get away from the "big box" stores. Add your mat and sleeping bag and you are good to go :)


- Hammock: Grand Trunk Nano7 - without the biners. 4.91 ounces ~$70

- Suspension: 6' Dynaglide Whoopie Slings from www.whoopieslings.com (http://www.whoopieslings.com). 0.64 ounces $18.55. Arrowhead Equipment also sells them but I don't know the weight.

- Toggles: Arrow toggles from www.whoopieslings.com (http://www.whoopieslings.com) 0.18 ounces $4

- Tree Straps: Variety of sources. Your pick... ~2.00 ounces. ~$15

- Hammock Ridge-line: 1.75mm utility line from Arrowhead Equipment. Length will vary based on your comfort and how you tie knots, but 9' of line would probably be a good start. ~0.21 ounces $2.25

- Stuff Sack: Medium cuben stuff sack from www.Zpacks.com (http://www.Zpacks.com). 0.25 ounces $12.95

- Tarp Ridge-Line and Strings: 50' of yellow and 50' of black 1.25mm spectra cord from Zpacks. You won't need all this but they sell it in 50' lengths. you need about 26' of black and 40' of yellow. 0.32 ounces for the ridge-line and 0.35 ounces for the tarp strings. $25.90

- Tarp: To exactly replicate my tarp you need a 7'x9' cuben tarp from Zpacks.com with 16 tie out points. That would be 4.45oz for $210. There are other tarp options out there if you don't want the rectangle.

So far to get all that you only need to know a couple of knots and have some cash. It would get you at about 13.31 ounces for the hammock, suspension, weather protection, and storage - for about $360 not including shipping from these various places.

[magneto]

I hike mostly in the Whites in New Hampshire. Very few places to pitch a tent outside official campsites and there mostly on wooden platforms - very uncomfortable wooden platforms. The weight of the hammock with the rain fly, line, webbing straps, etc. is comparable to ultralight tent systems. The hammock offers the ability to sleep away form campsites on ridges without regard to unlevel ground, even when the ground is pitching away at 20 or 30 degrees.

Condensation from respiration / dew is no different than in a tent. Given the right combination of temperature and moisture, you will get dripped on, but not soaked. My Hennessy hammock has kept me dry in the rain - no issues.

As for the sleeping pad, I don't carry one. I have a light-weight down sleeping bag (Western Mountaineering Summerlite) that I use with two other Western Mountaineering products: their down flash pants and flash jacket. This combination is more than warm enough and I need to carry the pants and jacket anyway, even in the summer, as we can have winter conditions here any time of the year.

[Nutbrown]

The eno accessories are quite heavy compared to others. My DIY silnylon tarp is about 10oz. Their underquilt seems a bit thin, and it's heavier than I would take. A regular pad works fine. My entire sleep system weighs 2 lbs. ...but even if it weighs the same as a tent, I'd still hammock. My back never hurts, and I sleep better on the trail than I do at home.

[The Old Boot]

The big store stuff you were looking at is just that! - big store stuff. Just like the cottage industry vendors doing tents, the hammock cottage industry has devised much better equipment with much lighter weights. For me, going to hammocking has allowed me to get back out into the woods again. I quit 30 odd years ago when arthritis and sleeping on the ground ruined my enjoyment of it all. Take a wander over to hammockforums.com and browse through the information there - we're a wonderfully friendly bunch and yes, some are more fervent than others but it's because we're enthusiastic about how comfortable we are!

[DeerPath]

Out of curiosity....why were you hammock camping in a tropical storm?

I had just received my hammock the day before and hung it in the backyard to try it out. I think the best sleep I've ever had camping.

[CB1821]

If you are comparing a standard backpacking tent and hammock set up, the weights are comparable from what I found (see below from our Backpacking Excel Spreadsheet). In the end, it is still all personal preferences and the expected conditions of any particular trip that should guide your choice, but I am not sure dismissing hammocks for weight reasons is a logical means of making a decision.
My son and I finished Springer to 64/Franklin in a week-long trip this spring “hanging” for the first time, and although we may still find times when we will want to tent (or use a tarp), we definitely consider ourselves diehard fans of (Blackbird 1.1) hammocks.




Shelter/Sleeping




Tent




MH Lamina +35 Sleeping Bag
39



2/3 ThermaRest RidgeRest Sleeping Pad
10



SOL Emergency Blanket
2.5



Pillow
5.6



Big Agnes Fly Creek UL- 1 person (w/o foot print)
30
Big Agnes Fly Creek UL2 is only 4 oz more







Tent Subtotal
87.1
5.44







Hammock
26
Warbonnet Blackbird 1.1 Dl


Top Quilt* (40 Degree) & stuff sack
17.2
Shenandoah JRB 40d w/ compression sack 1.2 oz


Under Quilt* (20 Degree) & stuff sack
12.5
Yeti 3 season 20d 12.5 oz (or use ThremaRest @10 oz)


Pillow*
5.6
* 2.36 lbs for sleep system (not counting hammock)


SOL Emergency Blanket*
2.5
lowers top quilt rating to below 30 degrees


Edge Tarp, Para Cord, & Stuff Sack
11.25
Warbonnet Edge Tarp 10 oz, 100' para cord 8 oz


Edge door kit
3.2
4 doors/7.2 oz total - using 2 each 3.2 oz


Stakes
2.1
Warbonnet Stakes x 6


Hammock Subtotal
80.35
5.02

[Just Bill]

Solo systems-
COWBOY- SOL Escape Bivy ($50, 8.1 oz.) No stakes or lines, no poles. Headnet added (Sea to Summit basic, $10, 1.3oz).
COWBOY PLUS-Z-Packs Pertex Quantum Bivy ($175, 6 oz.) Add 6 ti stakes($20, 1.75oz.) and 25' of triptease($10, .5 oz.) Mini tarp- homemade- 4' x 6', about $30, 4oz. Headnet added (same)
SIMPLE TARP-Mountain Laurel Designs Super Tarp, 8'x10' ($205, 16 oz.) Add poles, MLD front and rear pole set($50, 2.75 oz). ( Includes guyline, add MLD ultimate stake kit ($38, 4.7 oz- field weight for normal use 3.5 oz), add basic headnet.
TARP TENT-Z-Packs Hexamid Solo Tent w/screen ($295 9.3 oz.) 48" Hexamid Solo pole ($22, 1.5 oz.) Add 8 ti stakes($24, 2.25oz.) and 25' of triptease($10, .5 oz.) Solo Cuben Groundsheet ($95, 2.7 oz.)
BIVY SHELTER- The North Face Asylum Bivy ($230, 26 oz.) add 6 TI stakes ($20, 1.75oz.)
SOLO TENT CHEAP-REI Passage 1 Tent ($120, 60 oz) use included stakes and guylines, no groundsheet.
SOLO TENT-Mountain Hardware Supermega UL 1 ($350, 30oz.) use included stakes and guylines, no groundsheet.
Two man systems-
SIMPLE TARP-2-Mountain Laurel Designs Super Tarp, 10.5'x10.5' ($205, 20 oz.) Add poles, MLD front and rear pole set($50, 2.75 oz). ( Includes guyline, add MLD ultimate stake kit ($38, 4.7 oz- field weight for normal use 3.5 oz), add basic headnet (x2).
TARP TENT-2-Z-Packs Hexamid twin Tent w/screen ($350 11.2 oz.) 48" and 32" Hexamid Twin poles ($37, 2.4 oz.) Add 8 ti stakes($24, 2.25oz.) and 25' of triptease($10, .5 oz.) Twin Cuben Groundsheet ($120, 4.3 oz.)
TWO MAN TENT 1-REI Camp Dome 2 tent, ($100, 80 oz.) use included stakes and guylines, no groundsheet.
TWO MAN TENT 2-The North Face Mica FL 2 ($380, 50oz.) use included stakes and guylines, no groundsheet
TWO MAN TENT 3-Mountain Hardware Supermega UL 2 ($450, 36oz.) use included stakes and guylines, no groundsheet.



SHELTER TYPE-

CORE-

STAKE & LINE KIT

POLES-

EXTRAS-

TOTAL WEIGHT

PER PERSON WEIGHT

TOTAL COST

PER PERSON COST



COWBOY-

8.1



1.3

9.4

9.4

$ 60.00

$ 60.00



COWBOY PLUS-

5.5

2.25


5.3

13.05

13.05

$ 245.00

$ 245.00



SIMPLE TARP-

16

3.5

2.75

1.3

23.55

23.55

$ 303.00

$ 303.00



TARP TENT-

9.3

2.75

1.5

2.7

16.25

16.25

$ 446.00

$ 446.00



BIVY SHELTER-

26

1.75



27.75

27.75

$ 250.00

$ 250.00



SOLO TENT CHEAP-

60




60

60

$ 120.00

$ 120.00



SOLO TENT-

30




30

30

$ 350.00

$ 350.00














SIMPLE TARP-2

20

3.5

2.75

2.6

28.85

14.425

$ 313.00

$ 156.50



TARP TENT-2

11.2

2.75

2.4

4.3

20.65

10.325

$ 541.00

$ 270.50



TWO MAN TENT 1-

80




80

40

$ 100.00

$ 50.00



TWO MAN TENT 2-

50




50

25

$ 380.00

$ 190.00



TWO MAN TENT 3-

36




36

18

$ 450.00

$ 225.00

[Hoop]

Teacher and Snacktime, The big box stores' stock is heavy, as you found out. There are many cottage vendors who make high quality gear - hammocks, tarps, underquilts, topquilts and various accessories. Those drawn to things hammocky inevitably migrate to hammockforums.net, a very informative user-friendly site (an offshoot of WB) where members go out of their way to help new hangers and folks interested in learning. You can equip yourself with a kit that is no heavier than a tent system (been there done that), but is so much more comfortable. Hammocks are not for everyone, but my experience has been that the vast majority of people who go that route - after a bit of a learning curve at first to get dialed in - don't return to the ground. You might want to attend a "hang" to see some set-ups and meet some people whose hips and other joints feel just fine in the morning...

[gunner76]

I could not get used to my knees being locked

What are you talking about ? I have never experienced that in any of my hammocks, DIY or commercial made and I am 6ft2 and 280lbs. I sleep on my back and both sides.

Highly recommend that you attend a group hang where you can see many different setups and learn a lot in short time.

Weight wise you usually will not save any weight, works out about the same but a hammock can be much more comfortable.

ENOs, Grand Trunks ect are Ok but can be on the heavy side.


From I spread sheet I did for a AT hike I took.....



SHELTER










BB 1.1 double


29


w/Dutch Clips


T' Thingies


2.2






Cuben tarp


11.6


w/ridgeline & tieouts


Hammock Sock


9.8






Stakes


3.9






TQ w/stuff sack


24


Down 30 deg


UQ w/stuff sack


20


Down 20 deg








100.5 ounces
6.28125 lbs



Total 6.3 lbs good down to 20 degrees. I could have left the hammock sock at home and saved few ounces

[Teacher & Snacktime]

Well, I certainly have enough info here to keep me busy for a while....thank you all. I can see that each and every one of you is passionate about your "hanging"!

[rhjanes]

I was canoeing on the Buffalo National River this past May, when that bad storm with the tornado's which hit Moore Oklahoma then moved over us. I was in my Warbonnet Black Bird hammock, hanging under a Warbonnet Superfly. With an underquilt and a top quilt. Those storms pounded us from 9:15 PM until 6 AM the next day. I was completely dry. Warm. Comfortable. The only item I had to dry out or pack wet, was the tarp (superfly). My tent buddy had slept on his thin pad on the slightly unlevel ground. He had to dry out his rain fly, the bath tub (underside) of his tent and his ground sheet. He and I actually had about the same amount of material to dry. My set up weighs the same as a tent with pad and sleeping bag. My hang every night is exactly the same, No worry about roots, rocks, sticks, unlevel ground.
I'd suggest you get on Amazon and buy "The Ultimate Hang" for like $14. It tells and shows with nice funny drawings, all things hammock related and all the options. Also, get over to HammockForums.NET

[Teacher & Snacktime]

OK...I've registered over at HammockForums.NET.....It's going to take me a while to sift through all this info. Thanks again, Everyone!

[rhjanes]

BTW, Hammock camping isn't for everyone. Some folks don't want to try, or get frustrated by the options. Or declare they are a stomach sleeper (my canoe buddy is one). Hey, this weekend is a hammock "hang out" here in Texas. Maybe one by you. Go and check out options. I want to check out a "Bridge hammock". It is like sleeping in a bath tub. Folks who are stomach sleepers, love them. Or folks who don't like the "pinch" up at the shoulders of a gathered-end hammock.
Anyway, check out that Ultimate Hang book.
And see about a "hang out" near you. Drive over on Saturday, just to check it out and see if hammocks work for you.

[chief]

It's interesting to show up at a nice campsite with plenty of flat ground for tents and plenty of trees for hammocks. The tent or tarp people will pitch their shelters and move on to more important things like hanging out with other campers, cooking and such, while the hammock people will spend a good 20 minutes deciding on the perfect trees to hang from, spend the next 20 minutes setting up the perfect hang, then at least another 20 minutes tweaking their hang or often starting over when perfection eludes them. Tons of fun to watch.

[Just Bill]

just a thought- I spent several summers on just a twenty dollar sporting goods hammock (one step up from the super cheapies, with the built in spreader bars on either end) They always come in handy for car camping, and if you shove a self-inflating mattress in there they are fairly pleasant. Not as flat as a "real" hammock, but a bit like sleeping in a Lazy-Boy. For $20...give it a shot. like this- http://www.amazon.com/Nylon-Hammock-Spread-Includes-Carry/dp/B00468UJ9Y/ref=sr_1_2?s=lawn-garden&ie=UTF8&qid=1374118616&sr=1-2&keywords=hammock+with+spread+bars Or maybe even this one- with a pad- http://www.walmart.com/ip/Hammaka-Parachute-Silk-Hammock/15397877?findingMethod=rr

[Flounder940]

It's interesting to show up at a nice campsite with plenty of flat ground for tents and plenty of trees for hammocks. The tent or tarp people will pitch their shelters and move on to more important things like hanging out with other campers, cooking and such, while the hammock people will spend a good 20 minutes deciding on the perfect trees to hang from, spend the next 20 minutes setting up the perfect hang, then at least another 20 minutes tweaking their hang or often starting over when perfection eludes them. Tons of fun to watch.

That's funny. I seem to recall several times this year on The AT where those with tents spent over well over 20 minutes looking for perfect level ground devoid of rocks or other obstacles. Meanwhile, I had my hammock already set up and was in the process of cooking dinner.

[Nutbrown]

After the learning curve, it takes exactly the same amount of time to set up a tent or a hammock. It's scientifically proven.

[rhjanes]

After the learning curve, it takes exactly the same amount of time to set up a tent or a hammock. It's scientifically proven.
That was what I noticed both years on the Buffalo. My very-experianced canoe buddy in his tent, and me with hammock. We finished within just a few minutes of each other on set up or tear down.
What I DID notice was that by day two or three, he was having sore shoulder pain (me also, due to paddling), but he was usually complaining of a sore back. I'VE got L1 to L7 screwed up from when I was 20 (I'm 55). One year, we hit a downed tree in a class-2 rapid. Half the gear and both of us got rolled out of the canoe. I realized I'd tweaked the rotten back. While he pumped out the canoe and repacked, I stretched the back. That night I took my prescription for the back and two Ibuprofen-PM and went to bed at 9. At daybreak, I carefully tried out the back. MUCH improved. I got up and started packing up. My buddy slowly extracted from his tent, went to bending and toe-touching. He commented about his back and asked how mine was. I just said much improved.

[perdidochas]

It's interesting to show up at a nice campsite with plenty of flat ground for tents and plenty of trees for hammocks. The tent or tarp people will pitch their shelters and move on to more important things like hanging out with other campers, cooking and such, while the hammock people will spend a good 20 minutes deciding on the perfect trees to hang from, spend the next 20 minutes setting up the perfect hang, then at least another 20 minutes tweaking their hang or often starting over when perfection eludes them. Tons of fun to watch.

And then you have to wake up the hammockers in the morning, because they are sleeping so well......

I notice that when I'm hammocking while the Boy Scouts tent, I can get my hammock and tarp down and packed before they have their tents down, much less packed. In a not so perfect area, you'd have the tenters also spending 20 minutes looking for a place without prominent roots.

[Snow>TP]

I made a trip to REI and Dick's yesterday to check out hammock camping gear. It looks like something that Snacktime might enjoy, and everything seemed so light I suspected it might be a weight-saving option. Unfortunately, what I found is that it would actually almost double our shelter weight....requiring each of us to tote our approx. 4lbs instead of the shared 4lb tent.

Also, I didn't care much for the insulation or dryness factors.


you can pee still in your sleeping bag, enjoy great breeze and relaxation, cook in it, I stay dry in hurricanes (tarp closes around hammock), less vegetation trampling on the ground, stay cooler with breeze under your butt, you can hang anywhere with trees.

o and my set up is much lighter than that and cheaper than ENO

www.deepsouthmountaineering.com

So what's the attraction? It still looks so "cool" to me, but the downsides seem to many.

[ChuckT]

I am also in a puzzlement. Seems like Hammock + Fly + Underquilt + Sleeping Bag = ## not #. The dry provides the dryness. Cvt

Dryness factors?

The main attraction is comfort. I don't sleep well when camping. I sleep even less well on the ground. On a hammock, I sleep almost as well as in a bed.

[Tri-Pod Bob]

After a trial run in a hammock over the 4th of July weekend, I'm hooked!! My Hennessy Explorer Deluxe Asym & accessories are on the way. I've been ground bound since the age of 6 (my 1st campout in the yard) & now 50 yrs later I can't wait to be a dedicated "Hanger" for the next 50!!!! Well, hopefully at least 30 or so!!!! LMAO

[markdek]

Please explain, best you can, how you can sleep straight in a hammock, and as someone else said, and not lock your knees. A good link to video or pic might help.

[The Old Boot]

Please explain, best you can, how you can sleep straight in a hammock, and as someone else said, and not lock your knees. A good link to video or pic might help.
There are two major types of camping hammocks - a gathered end type and a bridge hammock. The gathered end type people sleep diagonally across the hammock (not end to end). The width of the hammock along with proper hanging (tension etc) allows for a fairly flat lay. The bridge hammock lays flat to begin with and as long as you don't hang one end higher than the other by mistake, you get a completely flat lay out of it.
Sorry, no pics or videos but you can google or go to hammockforums.net for a ton of them.

[rhjanes]

Check out "Shug" channel. Very entertaining (he is a retired Ringling Brothers Clown). That is him playing bluegrass also. And makes TONS of videos on all things hammock.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7NZVqpBUV0

[Yukon]

It's interesting to show up at a nice campsite with plenty of flat ground for tents and plenty of trees for hammocks. The tent or tarp people will pitch their shelters and move on to more important things like hanging out with other campers, cooking and such, while the hammock people will spend a good 20 minutes deciding on the perfect trees to hang from, spend the next 20 minutes setting up the perfect hang, then at least another 20 minutes tweaking their hang or often starting over when perfection eludes them. Tons of fun to watch.

There is so much wrong in this statement, I wouldn't even know where to begin...

[perdidochas]

I am also in a puzzlement. Seems like Hammock + Fly + Underquilt + Sleeping Bag = ## not #. The dry provides the dryness. Cvt

Well, if you are interested in saving weight, you wouldn't want UQ (underquilt) + sleeping bag. You would either go to a pad and sleeping bag, pad and a topquilt (TQ) or a UQ and a TQ. A TQ is lighter than a sleeping bag. Regardless, if a hammock is a few ounces more (or even a pound or two more), it would be worth it. The comfort makes a big difference in quality of life.

[perdidochas]

Please explain, best you can, how you can sleep straight in a hammock, and as someone else said, and not lock your knees. A good link to video or pic might help.

Basically, you sleep at an angle. Your head is at one edge of the side of the hammock, your feet at the other edge. I often sleep on my side as well.

This pic illustrates it fairly well

22873

http://www.treklightgear.com/treklife/angle-relax-sleep-comfortably-hammock/

[rocketsocks]

Check out "Shug" channel. Very entertaining (he is a retired Ringling Brothers Clown). That is him playing bluegrass also. And makes TONS of videos on all things hammock.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7NZVqpBUV0I love "Shug"

[R1ma]

If you have a hammock pad do you still need an underquilt? How does the netting work?

Pad vs. UQ.
It's a personal choice. I'm good to about 45F with a pad. At 40F, a pads not enough insulation. Pads can move around in the night too. I've been woken up by freezing ankles lol. You won't need both unless your going to Mt Washington in February. Here's a very good write up: http://tothewoods.net/HammockCampingWarm.html

Some hammocks have an integral bug net. Some don't.

Now that your on HF, you could go to this: https://www.hammockforums.net/forum/showthread.php?t=74524 in September to check out other people setups.

[oruacat2]

A TQ + UQ is, in the most simple terms, nothing more than a lightweight sleeping bag minus the zippers, drawstrings, hoods, etc, and both you AND your hammock hang inside it.

[chief]

There is so much wrong in this statement, I wouldn't even know where to begin...Wow, you sure told me!

[Hoop]

Hey everybody, I've noticed something remarkable in this thread about hammocks - see if it ain't so!

Almost all the comments have been made in a spirit of good will, and it somehow has managed to stay on topic. Way to go, WB!!

It's refreshing not to hack through the gratuitous criticism that infects so many discussions here.

[Teacher & Snacktime]

I noticed it too, Hoop....but I'm not surprised. If you check out the credo of the HammockForum, you may note a lot of the posters here cross over, and stick to the friendly structure. :)

[chiefduffy]

I noticed it too, Hoop....but I'm not surprised. If you check out the credo of the HammockForum, you may note a lot of the posters here cross over, and stick to the friendly structure. :)

Nicely put, thank you. I like to think I resemble that remark. :)

[Grits]

Actually the sleeping pad is a necessity for warmth for me, and ENOs makes one just for the hammock, so the weight is included for myself which actually brought it up to about 5lbs

I have an ENO and it is a fun day hike hammock but not what I would try to build a kit out of when backpacking. It is way to heavy. There is a large cottage industry out there with 9 oz 10x11 tarps 10 oz. hammocks and 20 deg. underquilts and top quilts each under 20 0z. I will link you to some of them. My 4 season kit with a tarp with doors and 20 deg setup weights in at 5 lbs and that is with tarp hammock and quilts. Mine is a little heavy as I like the ease of setting up my blackbird hammock with the cinch buckle suspension. Check out www.hammockforums.net


tarps http://www.hammockgear.com/tarp-cf3-winter-palace/ or http://www.zpacks.com/shelter/tarps.shtml
quilts http://www.hammockgear.com/quilts/
hammocks http://www.buttinasling.com/hammocks.html or http://www.dream-hammock.com/DarienUL.html http://www.warbonnetoutdoors.com/blackbirds.php

[gunner76]

Please explain, best you can, how you can sleep straight in a hammock, and as someone else said, and not lock your knees. A good link to video or pic might help.

Try a Bridge hammock if you want to sleep straight and flat in a hammock. Other wise in a gathered end style hammock (type most hangers use) you sleep with your head on one side and your feet on the other. It also helps if you sleep with your foot end a few inches higher than the head end.

[Dogwood]

Yeah ENO has the Duo hammock that's sold at Dicks and REI but I wouldn't want to share a hammock with anyone on a thru on a regular basis even if it was Heidi Klum or Halle Berry. No room for me with all the damn lingerie and make up they would be carrying.

[Tuckahoe]

I have been considering setting up a hammock since last December. I've settled on the Ridge Runner bridge hammock and Cloudburst tarp from Warbonnet Outdoors and te Ridge Creek underquilt from Arrowhead Equipment. So now I just have to actually buy the gear.

[WalksInDark]

A couple of quick observations:

You are unlikely to save a meaningful amount of weight be going to a hammock.
Unless you are in the desert or on a bald, you have lots more sites to set up on when using a hammock.
No matter how much you read about hammocks and/or hammock camping, you can't really tell if you are going to like it without actually spending a couple of nights sleeping in a hammock.

Most importantly, there are weekend hang events setup throughout the year on Hammock Forums.net If you make plans in advance you can normally borrow a hammock setup for the weekend and give it a try. Alternately, you can just show up at one of the events, be a "groundling" if necessary (someone who sleeps in a tent)...and spend the weekend dropping your parts into various hammocks.

Hammock camping is something that is very easy to over think. JUST DO IT!

[Tuckahoe]

Well, I went ahead and placed an order for a hammock.

[Yukon]

Well, I went ahead and placed an order for a hammock.

What did you order?

[Tuckahoe]

What did you order?

I ordered the Warbonnet Ridge Runner.

[perdidochas]

A couple of quick observations:

You are unlikely to save a meaningful amount of weight be going to a hammock.
Unless you are in the desert or on a bald, you have lots more sites to set up on when using a hammock.
No matter how much you read about hammocks and/or hammock camping, you can't really tell if you are going to like it without actually spending a couple of nights sleeping in a hammock.

Most importantly, there are weekend hang events setup throughout the year on Hammock Forums.net If you make plans in advance you can normally borrow a hammock setup for the weekend and give it a try. Alternately, you can just show up at one of the events, be a "groundling" if necessary (someone who sleeps in a tent)...and spend the weekend dropping your parts into various hammocks.

Hammock camping is something that is very easy to over think. JUST DO IT!

I agree totally. Hammocking is more comfortable if you can stand it (not all can). For me, it changes a night from being 2 hrs of sleep interspersed with no rest on the ground to 5 or 6 hrs of sleep interspersed with restful awakeness in the hammock. It's not lighter, but is worth the extra weight, IMHO.

[dla]

Sleep comfort.

[Tuckahoe]

My hammock arrived today. Heard a knock at the door and there it was...
23173

Not having suitable trees I went over to one of the walking trails on the campus of William and Mary and set it up for the first time.

23174

It was easy to set up. And then I got in. Good God it was comfortable and I dont think that my description can do the comfort justice. No hard ground or pressure on my hips. Soft, comfy and felt like I was in my own bed. Now I get it. Now I understand the appeal of hammocks.

23175

[Teacher & Snacktime]

You appear to be laying straight in the hammock Tuckahoe....I've been told it's a diagonal lay. Does that depend on the bag type?

[Tuckahoe]

You appear to be laying straight in the hammock Tuckahoe....I've been told it's a diagonal lay. Does that depend on the bag type?

I am laying very flat. It is the difference between the bridge hammock I am laying in and the gathered end hammock. It is in the gathered end hammocks that you would need to lay diagonally, while the bridge hammocks allow a straight flat lay.

Have you been to hammockforums.net yet?

[oruacat2]

Tuckahoe (or anyone) - do the poles at either end - those that make it a "bridge hammock" - collapse or fold? How exactly would someone pack a bridge hammock?

[Teacher & Snacktime]

I am laying very flat. It is the difference between the bridge hammock I am laying in and the gathered end hammock. It is in the gathered end hammocks that you would need to lay diagonally, while the bridge hammocks allow a straight flat lay.

Have you been to hammockforums.net yet?


I have, and I'm registered. But I haven't had much time to go exploring there yet.

[Tuckahoe]

Please keep in mind that I am rather new to hammocks and have only begun to purchase my gear. There are many more folks that know more than I do.

The poles on the Ridge Runner are sectional aluminum that are not linked or shockcorded together. Arrowhead Equipment offers for sale a pole bag that secures to the pack, that I intend to buy myself -- http://www.arrowhead-equipment.com/ridgerunner-gear.html.

The hammock comes in a doubled ended stuff sack that packs down pretty small.

Here is a video about the Ridge Runner from Warbonnet Outdoors --

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=crsmtPu9fL0&feature=youtube_gdata_player

[XTrekker]

I made a trip to REI and Dick's yesterday to check out hammock camping gear. It looks like something that Snacktime might enjoy, and everything seemed so light I suspected it might be a weight-saving option. Unfortunately, what I found is that it would actually almost double our shelter weight....requiring each of us to tote our approx. 4lbs instead of the shared 4lb tent.

Also, I didn't care much for the insulation or dryness factors.

So what's the attraction? It still looks so "cool" to me, but the downsides seem to many.

Hammocking isnt for everybody but for those who take part in it, generally never go back to ground sleeping..Backpacking became something I could no longer do because of back pain and hammocks solved that issue..As far as weight goes. You must be looking at the heavier end of shelter options. There are much lighter options out there. I have seen complete kits right at a pound (including tarp). If you are comfortable sleeping on the ground then there may not be a need to go out and buy a whole new system.

[XTrekker]

What's the likelihood of snake friendliness in a hammock? I imagine it would be easy enough to snuggle in for some warmth? Is that an issue?

With a zippered bugnet, its the same chances of that happening with a tent.

[A.T.Lt]

Maybe a silly question, but can you side sleep in a hammock ?

[mudsocks]

Maybe a silly question, but can you side sleep in a hammock ?

Yes. Though your mileage may vary. Depending on your size, weight and hammock type. I am 5'10.5"/135lbs and typically start out sleeping on my back but at some point in the night I end up half way between back and side. For me it's the best sleep of the night.

[Darwin13]

Hammock 15oz
Tarp 8oz full coverage with doors

Good all year.

Top insulation western mountaineering bag 24oz
Bottom insulation hammock gear 20/40 degree bag (depending on time of year) 13oz/17oz respectively

So for most of the year my shelter and insulation weight is 3lbs 12oz. Not bad plus I need the biggest bag and weight for fabric because I'm heavy and tall

Always comfortable. Always dry. Always warm. Anywhere.

[Ape 99]

And oh yeah, in case you haven't found him yet on Youtube, check out Shugemery. He has a 10 part series on how to make the most of hammocking. He makes it fun and entertaining to learn about hammocks. you can start here! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7NZVqpBUV0&feature=c4-overview&playnext=1&list=TL5aoZqMGHJvI)
This thread rocks, thanks Teacher & Snacktime. Sooo I've registered in at hammockforums & have begun lurking, & watched Shugemery's vids (super entertaining, by the way, anybody know who makes that short sleeve puffy jacket/sweater he wears in all of them?).
Anywhoo just popped in to say thanks for piquing my interest.

[Drybones]

Hammock 15oz
Tarp 8oz full coverage with doors

Good all year.

Top insulation western mountaineering bag 24oz
Bottom insulation hammock gear 20/40 degree bag (depending on time of year) 13oz/17oz respectively

So for most of the year my shelter and insulation weight is 3lbs 12oz. Not bad plus I need the biggest bag and weight for fabric because I'm heavy and tall

Always comfortable. Always dry. Always warm. Anywhere.

Every time I've looked at hammocks I've backed off because it increased my weight but what you have there looks good. Can you tell us what hammock and tarp you have and I'd be interested to know what your entire set up cost was if you dont mind sharing. Thanks.

[No Directions]

I only have one night in a hammock but it was the most comfortable night I have ever had in the woods. I am a light sleeper and wake up frequently when camping. Even with an air mattress I am uncomfortable sleeping on the ground after a few hours. By the time daylight arrives I can't wait to get out of my tent. Also the floor of my tent isn't water tight so if it rains I am going to get some water in the tent. The one time I did sleep in the hammock it rained hard that night. I have a Warbonnet Superfly which is pretty large and has doors to keep out wind and blowing rain. The next morning I laid in my hammock snug and comfy and was in no hurry to get up. No sore spots from laying in the hammock for 10+ hours.23356

[rickycodie]

The attraction is three-fold. 1)- this one is true-for some folks- there is increased comfort and security in a hammock. No risk of crawlies or other nighttime visitors- adding the bug nets also eliminates insects. No lumps or bumps, no issues with a leaky tent floor in heavy rain. There is a bit of joy to "swinging in the breeze" that can't be beat. On the relatively wet and buggy AT they also allow you to pack up a bit cleaner shelter. New hammock designs let you lay more or less flat once you have it down- ESPECIALLY with the aid of a sleeping pad. This is the main attraction- a good night's sleep is worth your money and the weight if you can't find it elsewhere. 2)-because of all these reasons- it does look "cool" There is also a bit of cool factor in coming up with and mastering a new technique and set of gear. 3) This one is false- Hammocks are a weight saving shelter. Solo- they are not, as you mentioned- for a pair it's even worse. While you may choose a hammock for comfort or other personal preferences, and you are certainly free to do so; there is a certain amount of delusion among the hangers that they are saving weight. FOR THE MOST PART- you are spending a fair amount of money to get a full system, especially in colder weather- dollar for dollar you can get a lighter system elsewhere- when comparing tandem options- there is no comparison. Hammocks make sense for; winter travel, swamps, extreme elevations (Steep slopes) and those who have trouble getting a good night's sleep otherwise. As mentioned- Hammocks don't pitch to well on Max Patch or other spots you may want to enjoy. Tarps have their limits too, but generally speaking a hammock is the most limited shelter option, and a pretty big investment if you choose to travel anywhere outside "the woods". While there are systems that let you pitch on the ground too- you are adding more weight and features to gain that benefit, in addition to cost. Lest anyone accuse me of it; I've spent several years camping in hammocks- for all the pleasant reasons listed- and still sleep in them a few times a year. But for backpacking- unless you CANNOT sleep well otherwise- they are a bust if you run the numbers. (Dollars, weight, feature for feature, bulk, complexity of use, and overall convenience.

someone may have said this earlier,

i have to disagree with you on this last sentence, my hammock setup comes in at 8oz. my 20 degree underquilt comes in at 12oz, my top quilt in at a pound or so and tarp at 7.2 oz; for a total of 2.3 lbs. Cost for me is $80 for the hammock, $50 for the tarp, and maybe $20 for the misc. stuff. the insulation could be done cheaply by substituting a closed cell pad for the UQ, then the whole setup would be around $350. try to find a 2lbs. tent for under that, not to mention the down TQ and sleeping pad.

here is a link to my weight speadsheet if you would like to see my setup a little more closely: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AvFrn_o7eXuddHdxVW1jUTd2UWtZY25QX2d1dy02d FE&usp=sharing

[Drybones]

someone may have said this earlier,

i have to disagree with you on this last sentence, my hammock setup comes in at 8oz. my 20 degree underquilt comes in at 12oz, my top quilt in at a pound or so and tarp at 7.2 oz; for a total of 2.3 lbs. Cost for me is $80 for the hammock, $50 for the tarp, and maybe $20 for the misc. stuff. the insulation could be done cheaply by substituting a closed cell pad for the UQ, then the whole setup would be around $350. try to find a 2lbs. tent for under that, not to mention the down TQ and sleeping pad.

here is a link to my weight speadsheet if you would like to see my setup a little more closely: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AvFrn_o7eXuddHdxVW1jUTd2UWtZY25QX2d1dy02d FE&usp=sharing

Ricky...forgive me, but I'm a sceptic. Would you provide details on each piece, I cant see a cuben tarp weighing what you have. How cold can you go?

[gunner76]

7+ ounces for a cuben tarp is right on. My cuben Winter Palace tarp from Hammock Gear weighs 8 ounces.

Be warned that cuben tarps are very expensive.

[Camoxjeep]

I've been hammock camping for a while now and love it. Won't sleep in a tent unless I'm car camping, even then will still be in my hammock. I've tried plenty of hammocks, my current setup is a XLC Warbonnet Blackbird 1.7 Double layer, Hammock Gear 20' underquilt, working on a lightweight tarp right now. I can lay completely flat in that think and even on my stomach. I'm only 5'6" though which might be why I can sleep on my stomach. It is a very nice hammock. I even swapped to an adjustable ridgeline so I can adjust my lay. Right now Sierra Madre Research is in the process of creating a perfect hammock tarp system http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1313173787/nube-the-perfected-hammock-shelter-by-sierra-madre I've already paid my money to get one of the first ones and cant wait. I've got both of their hammocks and love them, very well made and comfortable. I think this will be the system that will really start them apart.
I do agree that hammock systems are expensive, not a weight savings over a tent but for being a lone Hiker hammocks are perfect for me. Once you get the right setup for YOU, because not all hammocks are created equal.
Now if I had unlimited money and could make everything from cuben fiber B-)

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 4 Beta

[Tuckahoe]

Well there went another 180 bucks... ordered my tarp, carabiners and guylines.

Shopping from the comfort of your own bed before getting up for work -- PRICELESS!!!

[Venchka]

I made a trip to REI and Dick's yesterday to check out hammock camping gear. It looks like something that Snacktime might enjoy, and everything seemed so light I suspected it might be a weight-saving option. Unfortunately, what I found is that it would actually almost double our shelter weight....requiring each of us to tote our approx. 4lbs instead of the shared 4lb tent.

Also, I didn't care much for the insulation or dryness factors.

So what's the attraction? It still looks so "cool" to me, but the downsides seem to many.

I don't get it either.
Jacks R Better Special Deal: Hammock, tarp, bunch of stuff to make it work, overunderinsideoutside 20°-25° quilt pair, more stuff to make that work, on SALE for $800.
Weight: Don't ask.

Shopping on my own. Go anywhere. 3 seasons. Set up ANYHERE. Sleep well. Sleep dry. Sleep well & dry ABOVE timberline.
WM Ultralite 20° bag 29 ounces $415
NeoAir Xlite regular pad R-3 14 ounces $160
TarpTent Notch 26 ounces $259
Total weight: 4 pounds 3 ounces $834
I still don't get it. The hammock "system" is a few dollars cheaper and a lot heavier. Won't work above treeline unless you add more money and more weight with a NeoAir Xlite.
Shaking his head.........

Wayne

[Tom Murphy]

I guess the issue here is that I always assume that if I can't see the appeal of something so popular, or if the downsides seem to outweigh the benefits, I must be missing something.

I can see here that I was pretty accurate in seeing the downsides that would be important to me, and for that confirmation I thank you.


You are correct. A hammock has only downsides for you.

What you are missing is this: For others, especially solo off-trail backpackers like myself, a hammock improves sleeping comfort and significantly increases available campsites with no weight penalty.

[Venchka]

You are correct. A hammock has only downsides for you.

What you are missing is this: For others, especially solo off-trail backpackers like myself, a hammock improves sleeping comfort and significantly increases available campsites with no weight penalty.

About half of the world's surface is not hammock friendly. In the half that is hammock friendly, there is a weight penalty.
I'm with Teacher. We don't get it.

Wayne

[Venchka]

I meant..."the world's solid surface."

Wayne

[Tuckahoe]

So, you've determined your tent is all you need and you are happy with that. Good. There is no need for you to change anything then. Your comfort in your tent is what matters for you.

For myself, I'll probably never go to those places that you have determined are not hammock friendly, and I am ok with the weight penelty that I'll pay switching from a tent to a hammock. The penelty between my tent set up and my hammock set up is about 7 ounces. I'm ok with that.

[SQWERL]

This thread rocks, thanks Teacher & Snacktime. Sooo I've registered in at hammockforums & have begun lurking, & watched Shugemery's vids (super entertaining, by the way, anybody know who makes that short sleeve puffy jacket/sweater he wears in all of them?).
Anywhoo just popped in to say thanks for piquing my interest.


I think Shug said in one of his vids that the down sleeves came from jacks r better. But I could be wrong. I am a convert to hammocks. I love it. My back loves it too. One day soon I will take the plunge and go full time and ditch my bed at home. I am no expert on hammocks so here is my .02. I have an eno double nest it is on the heavy end of the weight spectrum. I am looking at making a DIY one made from a tablecloth from tableclothfactory.com. There is a sticky on the hammock forms on how to do this and I believe it is supposed to be much lighter. If you get an eno, first thing is get rid of the industrial mega heavy carabiners. Don't buy eno's straps they suck. Get a set of tree huggers and whoopie slings. I tried using a pad and could never get the hang of it. So I finally bought a UQ from hammock gear. Yeah they are pricey but worth it and oh so toasty warm. Or you can make your own. There is a vendor that makes the shell for cheap and you put your own insulation in it: down,synthetic, or whatever. I have the eno profly. It does its job but again it is heavier. I will be saving up probably for a cuben tarp from hammock gear. Right now I use a fleece sleeping bag liner as my top quilt and am I going to buy a top quilt sometime soon. Right now I just weighed my bag with everything in it except water and its about 15#. Set up for a single night out and back. I am not UL by any stretch though I am slowly working on it. Again check out the hammock forums and watch Shug's videos, MedicineMan's videos, and Fronkey's videos. They are educational as well as entertaining. And go to hang.

[SQWERL]

Correction that short sleeve sweater he is wearing is a Montbell down shirt.

[Ape 99]

Sweet! Thanks man