UL or not to UL... I answered the question. At least for myself.

[Nutbrown]

Here's an update on my first ul trip. I hiked the Maryland section over 4 days with my friends. We had the luckiest weather ever, sun and shade...pure beautiful. My pack was maxed at 12 or 13 pounds, and it was soooo comfortable. I did not bring a knife, and will change that for next time. I like being self sufficient, and constantly borrowing it (or so it seemed) was unnerving.

Shelter:
hammock/tarp/UQ/TQ

Food:
alcohol stove/fuel
cook pot
food
water filter

Clothes: (for sleeping really)
long sleve silk shirt
long johns
socks-x2
unders

Extras:
tiny 1st aid kit (pills and duct tape)
bug spray
tp/bandana
poncho
head lamp
bandana
Poles(that I didn't add to the weight)

I think the biggest down side to ul hiking for me was not the stuff I didn't bring, but the weight I didn't have. It may sound weird, but I felt like I cheated. When we stopped for a break, or at the end of the day, I didn't get that wash of relief when I took off my pack. I didn't think I would miss that, but I did. My friends were working, I was strolling. Part of why I hike is the energy spent working for the peaks, and feeling my muscles burn on the hills. I didn't get much of that.

I did like knowing just how little I needed to be comfortable. It was fun showing off my diy pack and other stuff, but Garlic was right when he suggested UL is better for solo hikes. I would have gone farther and hiked more days with this pack. But all I really wanted was to have the experience with my best friends. I sacrificed some of that experience for comfort.

[rocketsocks]

+1 on the self sufficiency....many styles to choose from....23341

[Wise Old Owl]

Here is my take... I am a huge fan of UL and you have put some thought into this... but you had great weather... How does your kit change if it was 5 days of rain... cold ... wind...black flies, mosquitos etc... does it still work for U?

What is going to keep you upbeat?

[Wise Old Owl]

+1 on the self sufficiency....many styles to choose from....23341


Last time we were together you had one of these on the AT which I found disturbing...



23342


Oh and what was with those five porters?

[rocketsocks]

Last time we were together you had one of these on the AT which I found disturbing...



23342


Oh and what was with those five porters?I always bring those shoes, they'are my favorites...and really Woo, This coming from a guy whose house is a fire hazard?

23343

[Just Bill]

Nutbrown- looks like you're learning what Garlic (and Mags) have figured out and mentioned here and in your other post. UL is a tool, like any other tool it has it's place. The biggest secret to UL is that once you learn how to carry only what you need, you can carry whatever you want. You have to walk the path to learn it though. Congrats on your first UL trip! Keep it up- and keep something in mind. Just because you learn UL, doesn't mean you graduated to some point of no return. When I go with other folks, my UL kit simply gets some very un-ultra light additions. (Such as my son.) I can carry things now that make me a very popular guy- Freeze some steaks and pull them out on day 2, along with taters, onions, olive oil and spices to make up a feast for your buddies. Use your newfound ease of travel to get to camp a bit earlier on that rainy day and have a blazing fire and hot drinks ready. Pull out a bag of wine on day 3 to cheers your mates. Experience the joy of pulling a small watermelon out of the bottom of your pack to share on a hot day.

Consider Ryan Jordan, founder of Backpacking Light, once he mastered SUL (base load under 5 pounds) you know what he did? He strapped a packraft, fishing gear, wetsuit and paddle to his kit and found new ways to enjoy floating and fishing that were never possible for him before. Freedom from weight has many benefits- when you're solo it's easier to travel. Freedom goes both ways though- now that your base weight is down- toss in that book you always meant to read, carry those luxuries that will make your friend's day, be free to carry whatever makes you happy.

[rocketsocks]

Nutbrown- looks like you're learning what Garlic (and Mags) have figured out and mentioned here and in your other post. UL is a tool, like any other tool it has it's place. The biggest secret to UL is that once you learn how to carry only what you need, you can carry whatever you want. You have to walk the path to learn it though. Congrats on your first UL trip! Keep it up- and keep something in mind. Just because you learn UL, doesn't mean you graduated to some point of no return. When I go with other folks, my UL kit simply gets some very un-ultra light additions. (Such as my son.) I can carry things now that make me a very popular guy- Freeze some steaks and pull them out on day 2, along with taters, onions, olive oil and spices to make up a feast for your buddies. Use your newfound ease of travel to get to camp a bit earlier on that rainy day and have a blazing fire and hot drinks ready. Pull out a bag of wine on day 3 to cheers your mates. Experience the joy of pulling a small watermelon out of the bottom of your pack to share on a hot day.

Consider Ryan Jordan, founder of Backpacking Light, once he mastered SUL (base load under 5 pounds) you know what he did? He strapped a packraft, fishing gear, wetsuit and paddle to his kit and found new ways to enjoy floating and fishing that were never possible for him before. Freedom from weight has many benefits- when you're solo it's easier to travel. Freedom goes both ways though- now that your base weight is down- toss in that book you always meant to read, carry those luxuries that will make your friend's day, be free to carry whatever makes you happy.
JB...you just said what I have always felt about ultra light....it's draw for me would be to bring more stuff( field guides, fishing equipt, plein air painting supplies in the form of a pochade box) kudos on your eloquence....your a very bright guy, I think I have a crush on you....;)

[Just Bill]

It's the pig-tails- does it every time. ;) Coolest thing hands down about UL- when you want to move- there's no better option. When you want to carry extra stuff- turns out the same tool does the job!

[JustaTouron]

IMHO, groups should be used to lighten your load. However, it should be fair and equitable.

1 person leaving home knife and other items and borrowing from the full weight packers is not ideal. But neither is there a need for 5 water filters, 5 knives, 5 stoves, 5 cooking pots, 5 containers of garlic powder, 5 bottles of bug spray, etc.

Pre-trip have meeting decided on what items can be shared (toothpaste can, toothbrush can't) and who is going to bring what. Five people might not mean one stove, maybe you need two or three. But this allows all of you to lighten your load. And if you are doing this way, you aren't bumming a knife off of someone, it is part of the group plan.

[MuddyWaters]

I cant remember the last time I used a knife , or even a razor blade.
I know I havent in the last 500 miles.

I clearly recall one time when a bag of Mountain House was defective and did not have a tear notch.


What did you have to keep borrowing a knife for???

UL, and SUL , are stops on a learning curve.

You are learning to take only what you need, and really evaluate what you want. And balance those against desired comfort and trip length.

After that, you choose your gear for each trip based on what is best overall for you. Not based on fears, not based on what others are taking, and not based on marketing hype.

Based on experience.

[Nutbrown]

WOO, I had the poncho and my night clothes that I kept in a ziploc bag in case I got soaked through. It was warm, and I planned on just wearing my wet clothes until they dried. If I was planning a hike in weather that was less than perfect, of course my weight would have been a bit more. Prob a fleece sweater with better rain gear. And more coffee and fuel :)

Justatouron, even though I was ul, I was part of the group effort. I have the stove and fuel for at least 2 of us. Bug spray too. I do like hiking in a group and sharing some equipment. I also brought the dirty water bag and the filter for the 4 of us.

Muddy, the knife was for slicing an apple and making some small sewing repair on my pack. It was not equipment that I couldn't live without, but it sure is nice when you could use one.

I love the idea about bringing a watermelon. Won't they be surprised!

And Bill, it definitely is the pig tails ;)

[shakey_snake]

You're learning.

Go ultralight to carry luxuries.

A "Tool" really isn't a good analogy--it's a mindset. Ultralight isn't *a tool* anymore than Buddhism is. Once you achieve enlightenment what the **** do you do from there, right?

Ultralight is a mindset that asks to to realistically approach your fears and comforts and assign a value to those things. It's a type-A, planner's mindset for something people typically approach with a laissez-faire, and uncritical mindset.

[JustaTouron]

Justatouron, even though I was ul, I was part of the group effort. I have the stove and fuel for at least 2 of us. Bug spray too. I do like hiking in a group and sharing some equipment. I also brought the dirty water bag and the filter for the 4 of us.



If someone else was using your bug spray, what's the big deal you were using someone else's knife? Maybe b/c of hiking of done, but I have never thought twice about the idea of sharing/borrowing gear.

[MuddyWaters]

IF, I carried a knife, Id use it to clean the dirt from under my nails, and pick my teeth.

Who wants to borrow it?

[Nutbrown]

Shakey, your point hit home. I am never a type-a until my section hike.

Justatouron, I just like to be self sufficient. I like sharing what I brought with the group, but I feel better when I have what I need. Just a personal preference.

[garlic08]

Your gear list is an inspiration--it has fewer than 20 items. Most you see posted here exceed 60 items! That's a key to lightening the load--don't spend a lot of money on light-weight things, just don't bring stuff. Even things that "weigh practically nothing" (like an extra pair of socks) are usually three or four ounces, and thirty or forty of those "things" can really pack on the pounds.

Definitely bring a blade next time. I use a single-edged razor blade in a little plastic scraper-holder thing I found at a hardware store. I use it for opening food packages, cutting cord, and the occasional minor surgery like removing a splinter or cactus spine. I can undertake all my food prep tasks with my spoon.

Thanks for the follow-up, and good luck developing this useful tool.

PS: I went on a long, strenuous day hike with some old buddies yesterday and couldn't help but make the light vs. heavy comparison there, too. I "cut my teeth" in the Colorado high country with these guys thirty years ago. My style is so different than theirs now after so much light weight long distance experience, we were practically on different hikes. It was sort of "them" and "me". It wasn't just the pack, but the clothing, the food, hiking speed and gait, resting, etc. By comparison, last week I was on a longer day hike with Mags, Pickle, and GreasePot (all accomplished long trail hikers) and the group was perfectly cohesive.

[QiWiz]

This is what I usually carry for a knife. It's often sold as a Derma-Safe utility/survival knife. Easier to work with than a plain blade and nearly as light.

23363

[Nutbrown]

we were practically on different hikes. It was sort of "them" and "me". It wasn't just the pack, but the clothing, the food, hiking speed and gait, resting, etc..

That's what it was... two different hikes. Mine and theirs. Funny you mention the clothing difference, I had my hiking shirt and shorts, and my sleep shirt and long johns. I think my friends had a clean shirt for each day on the trail, and at least 2 pairs of either pants or shorts. I had split huge dehydrated meals into ziploc bags, I got 2 meals from one. From experience, I knew hiker hunger wouldn't kick in on the 4 day hike. They brought quite a bit more.

We were all happy with what we brought on an individual basis, so I'm not judging in the least... some of their food looked really good, and my mouth was watering watching them eat. I just figured that for 4 days, I don't have to eat fancy and heavy. After this trip though, I will add more to the kitchen. :)

[joshuasdad]

I use UL as a tool to make big miles (for me) on long sections, especially when those long sections require a lot of rock scrambling. I just did Caribou Pond Rd. to ME 17, a 24 mile section with a lot of vertical change and difficult climbing/descending. I started at 4 PM, reasonably assured that it would not rain, so if there was no room at the shelter, I could cowboy camp, or bivy under my pack cover and rain jacket (there was room at the shelter). There is no way I could have done the 18.7 miles the next day if I did not bring a pack that was smaller than most school backpacks, weighing in at around 10-11 lbs dry. 2 lb 20 degree (backless) bag, 1 lb Neo Air, 2 lb microspikes (not worth bringing), pack cover, some dry food, my < 1 lb necessities (first aid, backup water purification, backup light), 2 L camelback, maybe 2 lb in extra clothing (socks, long sleeve shirt, pant legs, rain coat) used for pillow, gatorade bottle, Sawyer squeeze, smart phone, and a head lamp.

May go this route for Mahoosic Notch soon, which while shorter, is comparable to MD in effort. May add a puffy jacket (better pillow...) and a tarp.

[JustaTouron]

Here is my take... I am a huge fan of UL and you have put some thought into this... but you had great weather... How does your kit change if it was 5 days of rain... cold ... wind...black flies, mosquitos etc... does it still work for U?

What is going to keep you upbeat?

My two cents: Ya can't do this if you are going on a thru-hike, but pack for the weather. If the weekend forecast calls for a clear sky and warm temps you can leave home gear that you would bring if the forecast is different.

[shakey_snake]

Sure you can.
If you know your going to be doing more miles-per-day in Georgia, right out of the chute because your load is lighter, then you can start in mid April rather than late February and therefore you can carry even less weight, in terms of insulation.

[Nutbrown]

I agree with Shakey. My pack had just what I needed, and I could have gone farther. The only extras I would have had were more clothes for weather, and more food. But all the extra weight with clothes and food would not, in my opinion, take me out of the ul category. The only difference between a thru and a sectioner, in terms of packs, is the just in case scenarios in terms of weather.

[Starchild]

Interesting. Hopefully your ul hike will inspire others to go lighter or you can carry some trail magic to share at the camp site. Beer is almost always appreciated.

Or perhaps bring a luxury item such as a more complete kitchen and cook a real meal.

Peace