Such Thing as Waterproof Boots?

[HooKooDooKu]

I never used to understand gear reviews on waterproof boots when people would report that they were not waterproof.

Well, then me and my son's hiked up to LeConte Lodge in GSMNP yesterday in the rain. We all had rain pants and water proof boots (some hardly used, most were well known name brands). All three of us had socks that were dry at the neck, but the insides of all our boots were soaking wet from the rain and wet trail (at times a running creek 1/2" deep).

[ChinMusic]

Waterproof footware is for dayhikes or weekend hikes. I would not recommend them for anything longer.

[Kerosene]

Yes, I would argue that there are new boots that are waterproof. Of course, water can easily seep in through the laces, and such boots hold water in also (your sweat). Frankly, I only wear waterproof boots for day hikes now.

[Dogwood]

There are plenty of trail shoes that are truly WP. I look for a one piece WP membrane w/ a high hydrostatic pressure. Even then I know all too well how dry my feet stay in WP shoes depends on me and things other than the WP shoe. However, I so see WP shoes, or ones advertised as such, that don't work as well as others in side by side at home bath tub tests. Be mindful not to immediately jump to the conclusion that the shoes(boots) aren't WP though. Again, how one uses them and in what conditions play all important factors in keeping feet dry.

[Dogwood]

Also, look for a WP shoe that is highly gusseted w/ the gusseted material also being WP. Perahps, some shoes aren't as WP in as deep water as some might think.

[Sarcasm the elf]

Waterproof boots don't let rain in, that much is true, but they certainly dont keep your feet dry. As you hike your feet sweat and beefy "waterproof" goretex boots do a great job of keeping all that sweat inside the boot. Goretex (and it's competitors) is breathable in ideal conditions, but unfortunately once the goretex and outer material become waterlogged, the water vapor inside the boot can no longer escape, instead it just collects inside the boot. Of course with all that said, even the good goretex boots seem to start leaking after 500-1000 miles of hard use.

Personally I've switched to lightweight non waterproof trail runners for hiking when it's above freezing. It's a lot less weight on my feet when compared to my goretex boots and they keep my feet so much cooler and dry so much faster that they actually keep my feet dryer than "waterproof" boots.

[mankind117]

I have almost completely given up on waterproof shoes for backpacking (I hike mostly on the east coast). Waterproofing does you little good in a downpour when the trails themselves are 6 inches of water, your feet sweat, you have to ford several deep streams, etc . . .. Then when they do get wet inside which they eventually will it is way more uncomfortable than having a breathable shoe since they will take forever to dry if they ever do. Just accept you WILL get wet feet when it is wet out during backpacking and deal with it. Make sure you have a dry pair of socks to sleep in an crocs or sandals to where in camp. The only time I will where shoes with goretex or something like it is when it is cod and I will be walking on hard packed snow.

[q-tip]

No- walk in the rain all day and your feet are soaked--I have 7 pairs.............

[Another Kevin]

Waterproof boots don't let rain in, that much is true, but they certainly dont keep your feet dry. As you hike your feet sweat and beefy "waterproof" goretex boots do a great job of keeping all that sweat inside the boot. Goretex (and it's competitors) is breathable in ideal conditions, but unfortunately once the goretex and outer material become waterlogged, the water vapor inside the boot can no longer escape, instead it just collects inside the boot. Of course with all that said, even the good goretex boots seem to start leaking after 500-1000 miles of hard use.

Personally I've switched to lightweight non waterproof trail runners for hiking when it's above freezing. It's a lot less weight on my feet when compared to my goretex boots and they keep my feet so much cooler and dry so much faster that they actually keep my feet dryer than "waterproof" boots.

Me, too. Although this past weekend, I put the big clunky leather boots back on (oof!) for foot protection more than anything else; the first day was "only" eight miles, but consisted of series of rock scramble over sandstone alternating with level, rocky, rooty, muddy, but awesome walks through balsam forest. I've come back with mangled feet after attempting that sort of stuff in trail runners. Is it even possible to foot-jam a crack in trail runners without trashing your foot?

I never assume that I'll get more than about 500 miles on a pair of either trail runners or Gore-tex boots. I wear through the linings (including the waterproofing membrane), or the midsoles collapse. Our recreation is hard on boots. Who'da thunk it? Then again, I do the same to shoes just roadwalking in them around town. They wear in different places. If I wear trail runners walking to work, the pavement eats the soles and I wind up with little tread and less grip in the worn spots.

In ice and snow, you need waterproof. It can work to wear gaiters with trail runners and Gore-Tex oversocks - one of my hiking partners does that - but I'm "old school" in that department and go with Sorel pack boots - the kind with felt underboots that you can try to field dry in a pinch (heat rocks in a campfire, put them in the inners, stand well upwind!). For long trips, you need a vapor barrier inside as well as out. Thin polyester or nylon dress socks and doubled bread bags is the dirtbag approach. Your feet will sweat and be clammy. Wash them every night or at least go over them with a baby wipe. (But while you're melting snow, why not boil up another cupful of water for washing feet, pits and bits?) Gaiters, or at the very least waterproof gussets, are a necessity in snow, even before you bring out the traction gear.

"Waterproof" boots that don't have rubber or plastic outers likely need seam sealing. If the boots have a wax finish (old-school but some manufacturers do it) then use a beeswax-based product like Sno-Seal. For ones with a silicone finish, use clear silicone bathtub caulk, thinned with mineral spirit (about one gloop of silicone, three gloops of thinner, it should come out the consistency of olive oil), painted over the stitching. Work it in with a tiny foam paintbrush. Just like sealing a tent.

And nothing on Earth will keep your feet dry in Eastern conditions. The best you can hope for is more-or-less dry socks.

[FarmerChef]

Waterproof boots don't let rain in, that much is true, but they certainly dont keep your feet dry. As you hike your feet sweat and beefy "waterproof" goretex boots do a great job of keeping all that sweat inside the boot. Goretex (and it's competitors) is breathable in ideal conditions, but unfortunately once the goretex and outer material become waterlogged, the water vapor inside the boot can no longer escape, instead it just collects inside the boot. Of course with all that said, even the good goretex boots seem to start leaking after 500-1000 miles of hard use.

Personally I've switched to lightweight non waterproof trail runners for hiking when it's above freezing. It's a lot less weight on my feet when compared to my goretex boots and they keep my feet so much cooler and dry so much faster that they actually keep my feet dryer than "waterproof" boots.

Me too. Even wearing sneakers when it was bone dry out I would take off my shoes to wet socks. GoreTex or other WP boots would have made that even worse. Ew. I know but now that I wear mesh trail-runner style shoes my feet dry out so much faster and I often take my shoes off to dry socks. When it rains or we have a stream crossing, we just walk on through. The shoes will dry back out in about an hour or so and you're back in business. The trade off is in less grip on the trail runners versus the boots. I wouldn't have minded a pair of boots on the hard stone in the Whites. After a few days, the tread on the toes was almost completely worn down on brand new shoes. :( Oh and I've worn them in snow. Not a big deal but gators make a fine addition to low-heel shoes to keep snow out. That stuff's cold!

[Slo-go'en]

Am I the only one who has dry feet using Gortex lined boots? The only time my feet get soaking wet is if the water is so deep it overflows the top or if it's raining so hard it runs down my legs into the boots. I'd rather have slightly damp socks from sweat (which is gonna happen anyway) then sloshing wet feet using non-gortex boots.

Except for the LOWA boots I used this spring. I paid way too much money for these things and apprently they didn't seam seal the stiching as they leaked like crazy. I finally put some seam sealer on them and that helped a lot. I have good luck with Scarpa boots, but they run real narrow so a lot fat footed hikers can't use them.

[HooKooDooKu]

Waterproof boots don't let rain in, that much is true, but they certainly dont keep your feet dry. As you hike your feet sweat and beefy "waterproof" goretex boots do a great job of keeping all that sweat inside the boot. Goretex (and it's competitors) is breathable in ideal conditions, but unfortunately once the goretex and outer material become waterlogged, the water vapor inside the boot can no longer escape, instead it just collects inside the boot. Of course with all that said, even the good goretex boots seem to start leaking after 500-1000 miles of hard use.

FWIW: Our hike was only 6.5 miles long (3,000' elevation change). We completed the hike in less than 4.5 hours. The rain didn't begin in earnest until about 2 hours into our hike. This was my youngest's 4th trip in his boots (so they only had just under 100 'kid' miles on them). We always hike with wicking liners and a mid-weight wool sock. The weather was cool.

While I can't say that I'm any expert on boots, in my mind, those details just don't seem to fit the notion that the goretex was worn out or the wetness was strictly from sweat.

[Dogwood]

Am I the only one who has dry feet using Gortex lined boots? The only time my feet get soaking wet is if the water is so deep it overflows the top or if it's raining so hard it runs down my legs into the boots. I'd rather have slightly damp socks from sweat (which is gonna happen anyway) then sloshing wet feet using non-gortex boots. .....

NO, that's my take on things at times too! And, my feet don't sweat all that much. Maybe it's my body and/or all the other things I do that cumulatively that add up to having drier feet more often like socks, liners, matching shoes to the conditions, additions of various gaitors/rain pants, keeping water from dripping down inside my rain pants into my shoes, stopping to air out my feet, socks, and shoes, etc. I also opt, when I can, for one piece EVent WP membranes which is the most WP breathable membrane currently available.The price of EVent has come down a bit recently too. Again, I don't approach keeping my feet reasonably dry by looking just at the WP shoe.

With all the new shoe designs, outer materials, and different WP membranes available I also don't experience huge dry times with WP shoes compared to non-WP under equal drying conditions. If the conditions are good for drying non-WP shoes than they are also good for drying WP shoes. I don't buy into all this long dry times scenario with WP shoes all of the time especially with light/UL wt low/mid cut WP trail runners. And, I tested this. I've had the exact same model shoes but one in a WP version and one in a non WP version. I switched back and forth between the two versions on a wk long hike experiencing much wetness. It didn't take the WP shoes much longer to dry out compared to the non-WP version

Don't get me wrong though. There are times when it's just better to let your feet get wet and deal with it rather than futilely trying to keep feet bone dry with a WP shoe. I'm just saying that I expand the range of usability of WP shoes and don't dismiss considering employing WP shoes.

Another option I've played with on established softer underfoot less abrasive(largely non-rocky) hiking trails in warmer very wet weather and going UL on my back is hiking in sandals with a thin neoprene bootie or WP kayaking type sock. Letting your feet get wet like this but still protecting them from abrasion and cold is sometimes the way to go. Hiking with this system on my feet when experiencing many fords is so convenient. You can also just roll with just the sandal at times. My sandals dry out incredibly fast, double as camp shoes, and are lighter wt than many of my light wt trail runners too.

[Dogwood]

FWIW: Our hike was only 6.5 miles long (3,000' elevation change). We completed the hike in less than 4.5 hours. The rain didn't begin in earnest until about 2 hours into our hike. This was my youngest's 4th trip in his boots (so they only had just under 100 'kid' miles on them). We always hike with wicking liners and a mid-weight wool sock. The weather was cool.

While I can't say that I'm any expert on boots, in my mind, those details just don't seem to fit the notion that the goretex was worn out or the wetness was strictly from sweat.

Well, it wasn't just a matter of addressing keeping feet reasonably dry when stepping in 1/2" deep puddles after all. Now, you're saying it was raining. That changes things, at least in my mind, when attempting to stay dry.

[Sarcasm the elf]

FWIW: Our hike was only 6.5 miles long (3,000' elevation change). We completed the hike in less than 4.5 hours. The rain didn't begin in earnest until about 2 hours into our hike. This was my youngest's 4th trip in his boots (so they only had just under 100 'kid' miles on them). We always hike with wicking liners and a mid-weight wool sock. The weather was cool.

While I can't say that I'm any expert on boots, in my mind, those details just don't seem to fit the notion that the goretex was worn out or the wetness was strictly from sweat.

The other question is did you check if the boots were actually waterproof in the first place?

Fill a basin or bathtub with a few inches of water, use a water level that is sufficent to test the goretex layer, but dont fill up to a level that is higher than the waterproofing on the boots should reasonably be able to keep out. Then place the boots upright into the water and add enough weight inside to keep the boot soles firmly planted on the bottom. Wait about an hour and the check to see if any water has gotten into the boots, good new or nearly new boots should keep all the water out, if they didn't then bring them back to where you bought them and ask for a replacement. Most reputable outfitters will gladly exchange waterproof boots that don't pass this test.

[Another Kevin]

FWIW: Our hike was only 6.5 miles long (3,000' elevation change). We completed the hike in less than 4.5 hours. The rain didn't begin in earnest until about 2 hours into our hike. This was my youngest's 4th trip in his boots (so they only had just under 100 'kid' miles on them). We always hike with wicking liners and a mid-weight wool sock. The weather was cool.

While I can't say that I'm any expert on boots, in my mind, those details just don't seem to fit the notion that the goretex was worn out or the wetness was strictly from sweat.

"Only" is a relative term. My personal Naismith Rule (I'm rather a slow hiker) is 30 min per mile, add 40 min for each 1000 feet of elevation change. So for me, 3.25 hours for the distance, and 2 hours for the climb, 5.25 hours. I can go faster but I can't keep a faster pace up all day. If I did your hike in 4.5 hours I'd certainly be sweating. And in 'waterproof' boots I'd have wet socks even in what passes for dry conditions in the Eastern woodlands. Faster hikers than me - well, your mileage may vary.

Saturday, 8 miles with about 3500 up and 3000 down had my sock liners awfully soggy and skanky. As noted above, I was wearing clunky leather boots, for grip and foot protection., and my leather boots are seam-sealed. But it would have been the same in Gore-Tex. And I was under cover before the thunderstorms started.

[T.S.Kobzol]

My socks are relatively dry in my leather boots. I wear them in rain or snow year round. Once summer gives a way to fall and winter, I add high gaiters.



Bumblebee Tuna

[Another Kevin]

My socks are relatively dry in my leather boots. I wear them in rain or snow year round. Once summer gives a way to fall and winter, I add high gaiters.

Yup, me too. Medium weight wool socks with wicking polyester liners, over-the-calf gaiters for snow or brush. Maybe some people's feet just sweat more than others'.

[FarmerChef]

Yup, me too. Medium weight wool socks with wicking polyester liners, over-the-calf gaiters for snow or brush. Maybe some people's feet just sweat more than others'.

Yes ;) Tee hee ........

[HooKooDooKu]

Well, it wasn't just a matter of addressing keeping feet reasonably dry when stepping in 1/2" deep puddles after all. Now, you're saying it was raining. That changes things, at least in my mind, when attempting to stay dry.

Look back at the OP:
hiked up to LeConte Lodge in GSMNP yesterday in the rain
Rain is the whole reason I started this post.

Normally, when the weather calls for lots of rain, I simply reschedule my hike. But our September trip to LeConte Lodge is a must... rain or shine. Past years we've never encountered more that occasional rain and light showers. This is the 1st time I've ever had to hike for hours in rain.

[hikerboy57]

Look back at the OP:
hiked up to LeConte Lodge in GSMNP yesterday in the rain
Rain is the whole reason I started this post.

Normally, when the weather calls for lots of rain, I simply reschedule my hike. But our September trip to LeConte Lodge is a must... rain or shine. Past years we've never encountered more that occasional rain and light showers. This is the 1st time I've ever had to hike for hours in rain.
its still possible your feet were wet from sweat, rather than rain.your feet should stay relatively dry if just dayhiking in the rain.
what kind of boots were you wearing.

[HooKooDooKu]

If I did your hike in 4.5 hours I'd certainly be sweating. And in 'waterproof' boots I'd have wet socks even in what passes for dry conditions in the Eastern woodlands.
I'm quite used to the typical dampness in my socks from sweaty feet. I've spent a much greater distance and time in my boots than this trip. Just last year I did a 16 hour hike in GSMNP in these exact same pair of boots.

But this was MUCH different. These socks were not "damp", they were WET!

[Slo-go'en]

hiked up to LeConte Lodge in GSMNP yesterday in the rain
Rain is the whole reason I started this post.


But the thread title is asking if there is such a thing a waterproof boots?

You say you were wearing rain pants, but didn't mention gaiters. If your not wearing gaiters too, the water runs right down the side of the pants and into your boots. Even short gaiters will help a lot, so long as you can keep the bottoms of the rain pants over the gaiters. Now the water runs off the pants, onto the gaiters and onto the ground, not into the boot.

I've had all my rain pants trimmed and hemed a few inches below the knee. Now I can wear long gaiters and have the rain pants over hang them. This gives me more freedom of movement, better ventulation and ensures the rain runs off my legs and onto the gaiters without any seams for the water to find it's way into. I do this in the spring and fall, in the summer the rain doesn't usually last long enough to make it worth doing anything special.

[HooKooDooKu]

its still possible your feet were wet from sweat, rather than rain.your feet should stay relatively dry if just dayhiking in the rain.
what kind of boots were you wearing.

Keep in mind that it wasn't just my boots.
I had a pair of LaSportiva that are about 4 years old with about 300 miles on them.
My oldest son (11yo) had a pair of Wrangler Waterproof boots from WalMart that are right at 1 year old with something a little under 100 miles on them.
My youngest son (7yo) had a pair of Vasque Breeze that are 6 months old with 50+ miles on them.

All of us had soaking wet feet.

The only thing out of the ordinary (other than so much rain) was that we were all wearing rain pants to keep the rain out of the cuff of our boots. The pants keep the tops of our socks dry.


The other question is did you check if the boots were actually waterproof in the first place?
And no... I have not tested any of these boots... at least not in a bath tub. The only test they have had has been field use in GSMNP with all of its typical dampness, creek crossings, mud, and the occasional light rain.

[hikerboy57]

strange....although sometimes on gtx boots, you can wear a hole in the goretex and never know it, it seems strange that 3 completely different boots would allow all of you to get soaked feet.

[HooKooDooKu]

But the thread title is asking if there is such a thing a waterproof boots?

You say you were wearing rain pants, but didn't mention gaiters. If your not wearing gaiters too, the water runs right down the side of the pants and into your boots. Even short gaiters will help a lot, so long as you can keep the bottoms of the rain pants over the gaiters. Now the water runs off the pants, onto the gaiters and onto the ground, not into the boot.

I've had all my rain pants trimmed and hemed a few inches below the knee. Now I can wear long gaiters and have the rain pants over hang them. This gives me more freedom of movement, better ventulation and ensures the rain runs off my legs and onto the gaiters without any seams for the water to find it's way into. I do this in the spring and fall, in the summer the rain doesn't usually last long enough to make it worth doing anything special.

The title sort of comes from the fact that none of us had anything close to dry feet even though all of us were wearing waterproof boots.

My eldest son and I got caught in a 10 minute heavy downpour late in a recent trip. We were close enough to the trail head that we simply pulled out our rain coats and tossed them over our heads and pack. The rain that rain down our legs soaked our socks such that I was wringing water out of the full length of the sock once we got back to the trailhead.

So for this trip, we were using the rain pants to keep the rain out of our boots. I make sure the tops of the pants covered the openings of our boots (because I didn't want to spend the money on three pair of gaiters for one hike). We also had ponchos (those $1 kind) that covered both us and our packs. So while the lower sections of our pants did get wet, the pants were partially protected by the ponchos (so we were more protected from the rain than you would be with a simple rain pants, rain coat, and rain cover).

[HooKooDooKu]

strange....although sometimes on gtx boots, you can wear a hole in the goretex and never know it, it seems strange that 3 completely different boots would allow all of you to get soaked feet.
BINGO!... and the genesis of this thread.

I could understand if it had been just my 4yo boots... or my oldest son's "WalMart" boots. But my youngest with the newest boots too?

[Dogwood]

You say you were wearing rain pants, but didn't mention gaiters. If your not wearing gaiters too, the water runs right down the side of the pants and into your boots. Even short gaiters will help a lot, so long as you can keep the bottoms of the rain pants over the gaiters. Now the water runs off the pants, onto the gaiters and onto the ground, not into the boot.

This system works well in most situations in keeping my feet NOT SOAKED as long as it's not very heavy or of long duration down pours.

WP Wrangler boots from Wally World. That can be the issue right there. The stitching on those brands are poorly designed and executed to maintain long term waterproofing under longer duration hiking conditions. My feet would probably get wet in them in one day of hiking too. They also tend to be hot as hell. When I see sewn through stitching in the rand area where the WP membrane is I'm immediately skeptical about the shoes WPness. Have you tried spraying on or rubbing in a WPer such as silicone, mink oil, NikWax, Granger product, etc?

[HooKooDooKu]

You say you were wearing rain pants, but didn't mention gaiters. If your not wearing gaiters too, the water runs right down the side of the pants and into your boots. Even short gaiters will help a lot, so long as you can keep the bottoms of the rain pants over the gaiters. Now the water runs off the pants, onto the gaiters and onto the ground, not into the boot.

This system works well in most situations in keeping my feet NOT SOAKED as long as it's not very heavy or of long duration down pours.

WP Wrangler boots from Wally World. That can be the issue right there. The stitching on those brands are poorly designed and executed to maintain long term waterproofing under longer duration hiking conditions. My feet would probably get wet in them in one day of hiking too. They also tend to be hot as hell. When I see sewn through stitching in the rand area where the WP membrane is I'm immediately skeptical about the shoes WPness. Have you tried spraying on or rubbing in a WPer such as silicone, mink oil, NikWax, Granger product, etc?

As I mentioned above... I made sure the pants were positioned such they would be pretty good substitutions for gaiters (all of them had ankle supports at least 1" tall)... and the pants were partially protected from ponchos.

And yea, the Wally World shoes would have been the weakest link (and seemed to be the wettest of the three of us)... but the relatively new Vasque as well? And yes, the Vasque were given a coating of NikWax when they were brand new. Not sure how well the NikWax would have held up after three prior trips, because with the mud we always encounter in GSMNP, after every trip I'm washing the boots (soft scrub brush and woolite).

[Dogwood]

strange....although sometimes on gtx boots, you can wear a hole in the goretex and never know it, it seems strange that 3 completely different boots would allow all of you to get soaked feet.

What if all approached attempting to keep their feet dry using basically the same system ie; wearing shorts or rain pants and letting water run down their legs right into their boots/shoes? All it takes is a bit of rain water getting into your shoe from above, dripping down onto the lower part of your sock, and you'll get wet feet. I noticed a few times despite using rain pants, gaitors, and WP shoes in the fashion Slo-go-en described that my feet were still getting wet. What I found was water was getting inside my rain jacket, dripping down my torso(also wetting my shirt), and then dripping down the inside of my rain pants into my WP shoes. I could have easily blamed it on the shoes and at first I did that! It taught me what's on the top of my head and on my torso can and does affect how dry my feet will be as well as how I AM employing a system.

IMHO, TOO OFTEN outdoors people, INCLUDING HIKERS, immediately blame gear as the cause of all their problems, like getting wet feet or a rain jacket "being useless and unbreathable", when they should be taking a closer look at what's going on, including what they themselves are doing!

[Drybones]

The only waterproof boots I've owned were rubber, the multitude of Goretex I've owned all leaked after a while. I used to bird hunt in Lacross rubber boots, all day, but wouldn't want to hike in them.

[T.S.Kobzol]

Good point Dogwood. One must also consider the build and wear and tear on the gear. Were the boots one piece leather all around with minimal stitching ? - that would give better protection than boots constructed from multiple panels and stitched together. The gear might be waterproof when you buy it but after a while the stiches stretch depending on the circumstance of the events and pieces move and before you know it the water gets in.

Water is amazing. Heard a trip slideshow from a veteran a few weeks ago. They were on the ocean with new gear (brand new dry sacks). The goods they wanted dry were in a dry bag, rolled tight and then stufffed into a second dry bag rolled tight. - - after a harrowing day of strong winds and waves they arrived at their first destination and said that the items in the dry bags were SOAKED.

[HooKooDooKu]

IMHO, TOO OFTEN outdoors people, INCLUDING HIKERS, immediately blame gear as the cause of all their problems, like getting wet feet or a rain jacket "being useless and unbreathable", when they should be taking a closer look at what's going on, including what they themselves are doing!
I hear yea, and I'm definitely open to suggestions on where the problem might have been with the hiker and not the gear here.

But so far I have not had an "AHHH... that was I was doing wrong" moment in this thread/discussion.

While I'll admit that I can get tunnel vision reasoning these things through, from as best as I can recall, my socks were basically dry from the ankle up. Everything from the top of the foot and below were WET. That seems to be telling me that the combination of low-cut pants and poncho were keeping the direct rain water from running down our legs and into the boots... at least at the very tops of them. Might need to looker at the level of the gussets compared to where the pants were sitting... but then I would think I would have noticed more wetness (at least at the start) on the upper section of my feet. These socks (and insides of the boots) seems to be completely soaked (inside and out).

The only other detail I can think to add is that my socks were not SO wet that I had water squishing under my feet. The first thing that clued me in to the fact our socks and the insides of our boots were wet was that me feet were feeling cold after we had been inside the heated lodge for about half an hour. But they were wet enough that I could leave wet foot impressions on the stone under the stove.

[Another Kevin]

There seems to be a consensus: there is no such thing as 100% effective waterproofing. All you can do is improve the odds. And it's important to look where the water is coming from because it may not be where you think. If the boots pass the "bathtub test", then the water is getting in from somewhere else.

[Slo-go'en]

I guess there is only one way to answer your question and that is to test the boots. Do the bathtube test and if they fill up with water, there you go. If they don't it was coming in down your leg, dispite your best efforts.

I don't see how you could have kept the bottom of the rain pants over the top of the shoe without a strap running under the shoe. You'd have to be constantly pulling it back down otherwise.

[Many Moons]

From the AT hiking I have seen trailrunners are best. Just change sock after hiking. May have to hike some mornings with wet shoes, but it works. Waterproof boots and shoes will make your feet hot and lots of blisters if your doing big miles. Just what I have learned by being out with the thru's the last two springs. HIKE ON!!!

Miller

I never used to understand gear reviews on waterproof boots when people would report that they were not waterproof.

Well, then me and my son's hiked up to LeConte Lodge in GSMNP yesterday in the rain. We all had rain pants and water proof boots (some hardly used, most were well known name brands). All three of us had socks that were dry at the neck, but the insides of all our boots were soaking wet from the rain and wet trail (at times a running creek 1/2" deep).

[T.S.Kobzol]

Wouldn't you be more prone to blisters with wet socks in wet trailrunners? Wet sock creates folds that then push against waterlogged (softened) skin creating blister opportunities



Bumblebee Tuna

[Dogwood]

One must also consider the build and wear and tear on the gear. Were the boots one piece leather all around with minimal stitching ? - that would give better protection than boots constructed from multiple panels and stitched together. The gear might be waterproof when you buy it but after a while the stiches stretch depending on the circumstance of the events and pieces move and before you know it the water gets in.- K.S. Kobzol

Absolutely. If the stitching is poor or not sealed properly with mulriple piece WP membranes and/or is attached to the upper with stitching in WP shoes the seams can open up letting water penetrate through the seams just as non seam sealed seams in silny shelters like tents, taps, etc. Same thing happens with somw WP shoes. I look for one piece WP membranes or multiple piece WP membranes that are stiched and seam sealed or preferably welded or glued. This is nothing new. Almost 30 yrs ago when I was a boy out hunting in supposedly WP shoes I would have to routinely reapply a WP agent like silicone and mink oil(those were the things to WP mostly leather shoes back then) to not only the leather but especially the sewn seams which were even more common back then.

[Sarcasm the elf]

Wouldn't you be more prone to blisters with wet socks in wet trailrunners? Wet sock creates folds that then push against waterlogged (softened) skin creating blister opportunities



Bumblebee Tuna

That has not been my experience, i've had far fewer blisters since I switched to trail runners. YMMV.

[hikerboy57]

That has not been my experience, i've had far fewer blisters since I switched to trail runners. YMMV.
darn tough socks.even when therye soaked dont get very squishy.

[atmilkman]

http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/images/icons/icon1.png Such Thing as Waterproof Boots? No such thing.

[Drybones]

Wouldn't you be more prone to blisters with wet socks in wet trailrunners? Wet sock creates folds that then push against waterlogged (softened) skin creating blister opportunities



Bumblebee Tuna

Your feet are going to be wet dont matter if you're wearing trail runners or Goretex. My feet blistered much worse in the goretex, did great for about a week and then the feet got wet and as most folks here say, use trail runners because they dry out faster

[T.S.Kobzol]

My feet don't get wet in my boots.



Bumblebee Tuna

[Dogwood]

Your feet are going to be wet dont matter if you're wearing trail runners or Goretex.

Depends on several things. Not to be picking on you but making blanket statements like that are misleading. :D

My feet blistered much worse in the goretex...

Expand your thinking on WP membranes. Gore Tex has several versions, a few that are used as WP membranes in footwear. AND, GoreTex isn't the the only WP membrane option you have. Look around at the outdoors market. Gore Tex isn't the only game in town in WP membranes anymore. AND, getting blisters often has several contributing factors beyond just whether or not a shoe has a GoreTex or other WP membrane. :)

[winger]

Very interesting that so many have had wet feet wearing GoreTex, or the like, boots. Yet, when I motorcycle for several days in a constant rain, 10-12 hours a day, water being blasted from ALL directions at my feet, at 70 mph, that i have NEVER had wet feet despite several different types of boots, including Gore Tex and waterproof leathers.
In every instance I had on waterproof pants (i.e.Aerostich Gore Tex Darien pants). So how would one explain the difference?

[hikerboy57]

Very interesting that so many have had wet feet wearing GoreTex, or the like, boots. Yet, when I motorcycle for several days in a constant rain, 10-12 hours a day, water being blasted from ALL directions at my feet, at 70 mph, that i have NEVER had wet feet despite several different types of boots, including Gore Tex and waterproof leathers.
In every instance I had on waterproof pants (i.e.Aerostich Gore Tex Darien pants). So how would one explain the difference?sweat. Because of the accumulation of dirt and sweat gore-tex does not breathe as well as it's marketed.

[Kerosene]

I concur. The waterproof boots do not breathe nearly enough to vent perspiration build-up, at least for me. I've wrung a cup of water out of my socks on a warmish day after 10 miles on a dry trail.

On my last section hike I went with breathable mesh boots (Montrails) which worked surprisingly well. I was trying to avoid standing water and mud puddles, but I had two major fords the last two days. I ended up fording with boots and socks, and the boots themselves were surprisingly dry after a few miles. The next time I may remove my socks.

[Drybones]

Very interesting that so many have had wet feet wearing GoreTex, or the like, boots. Yet, when I motorcycle for several days in a constant rain, 10-12 hours a day, water being blasted from ALL directions at my feet, at 70 mph, that i have NEVER had wet feet despite several different types of boots, including Gore Tex and waterproof leathers.
In every instance I had on waterproof pants (i.e.Aerostich Gore Tex Darien pants). So how would one explain the difference?

The water runs off, plus the wind removes it, it'd probably be different if you stood in water for hours....IMO.

[winger]

Hikerboy has it right. After researching it further, the GoreTex membrane is protected by an outer membrane, and if the outer membrane becomes "clogged" or loses its shedding properties, or if the GoreTex membrane becomes clogged from the inside by oils, salts etc (from sweat) then it no longer breathes and moisture builds up from the inside with no place to go. That seems to be the reason why on a motorcycle trip, even with hours of constant rain, the outer membrane never really soils and clogs sufficiently enough, and the sedentary position doesn't cause much sweating, unlike hiking. This would apply as well to Goretex jackets etc. Thats why it is recommended keeping Goretex garments, boots, clean with regular washings and reviving the outer membranes with products like Revivex etc. Here's a link: http://sectionhiker.com/restoring-the-dwr-on-a-gore-tex-jacket/
Doesn't do much for the inevitable sweat buildup and clogging though when out on the trail.

[mattyoc20]

I have never had a boot that was completely waterproof in those days where it is raining all day