View Full Version : Newbie here looking for some advice.
nebulight
11-04-2013, 16:47
First, I'm new here so if this is in the incorrect section, please let me know or move the thread.
Hello all. I'm new to the forum and to backpacking. I love the outdoors but typically my hikes are a max of full day hikes. I've never done an overnight stay on any hike I've done. I was recently in the catskills a few weeks back and after a long day of hiking, I was sitting at the summit and told myself that I need do this more often and I should start training for a thru hike. I've been thinking about it ever since.
I currently have ZERO gear (minus my day pack Talon 22 and an Osprey water pack). I've been doing a lot of reading online and am liking the idea of "Ultra-Light" for somethings, but still prefer the cheaper price of non-UL as well as comfort in tent size/options. Based off online reviews, i have a few things here tentatively picked out:
Item
Weight
Cost
Notes
Osprey Exos 46
2 lbs 5 oz
150
Light enough but still has a frame
Kelty Cosmic Down 20
2 lbs 11 oz
125
No super light, but inexpensive
Big Agnes Copper Spur UL2
3 lbs 7 oz
280
Room enough for my wife if she comes along on weekends
Snowpeak LiteMax Titanium Stove
1.9 oz
60
Good reviews
Snow Peak Trek 700 Titanium
4.8 oz
45
Good reviews
Therm-a-Rest NeoAir XLite
12 oz
130
small and light
Sawyer Squeeze Water Filter
2.5 oz
40
Everyone loves this thing
Black Diamond Alpine Carbon Cork
1 lbs 1 oz
160
Not sure if these are needed as I don't use poles now
Black Diamond SPOT HEADLAMP
3.2 oz
30
Good reviews
Total:
11 lbs .4oz
1020
I really have no local options to go check out these products in person, but even if I did, I really wouldn't know what's what. I'd like to get some feedback from members here as my ultimate goal would be to use this equipment for a thru-hike, however these would be items I would be using during weekend trips/hikes until I would have the money saved up where I could take off work for 5-7 months.
thanks!
Get the best sleeping bag you can comfortably afford. Take your pole budget which you don't currently use and upgrade the bag. Maybe sacrifice the stove for a cat food can alcohol stove if you need more for the bag.
Western Mountaineering
Enlightened Equipment Quilts
Marmot
Slo-go'en
11-04-2013, 17:00
You might find the exos 46 a little small for anything but a summer overnight where you don't need much for clothes or food. 60L is more typical for longer trips.
For example, the pack has 2807 cu-in of volume. I looked up the specs for you base gear (bag/matt/tent) and they add up to about 1700 cu-in. That only leaves about 1100 cu-in left for everything else.
nebulight
11-04-2013, 17:01
Get the best sleeping bag you can comfortably afford. Take your pole budget which you don't currently use and upgrade the bag. Maybe sacrifice the stove for a cat food can alcohol stove if you need more for the bag.
Western Mountaineering
Enlightened Equipment Quilts
Marmot
Thanks Rasty for the input. That's a very valid point about the poles, however I've been told for any long distance hikes, poles are a good idea (I always have sore knees from coming down).
As for the sleeping bag, would the issue just be weight? Is $200 worth the pound I'd save? (serious question because I honestly have no idea).
nebulight
11-04-2013, 17:02
You might find the exos 46 a little small for anything but a summer overnight where you don't need much for clothes or food. 60L is more typical for longer trips.
Thanks, I was unsure about the size of the bag because I'm not sure what all I could fit in. The Exos 58 (I think) is only a few oz heavier so would that be a good option?
Thanks Rasty for the input. That's a very valid point about the poles, however I've been told for any long distance hikes, poles are a good idea (I always have sore knees from coming down).
As for the sleeping bag, would the issue just be weight? Is $200 worth the pound I'd save? (serious question because I honestly have no idea).
The Kelty Cosmic is a decent bag but realistically it's a 35 degree bag. Your going to need a warmer bag. In mid March it's anywhere from 10 to 50 degrees at night in the Smokies. If you start later in April to avoid the cold then you will have the same situation in Maine at the end of your hike.
QHShowoman
11-04-2013, 17:09
I really have no local options to go check out these products in person, but even if I did, I really wouldn't know what's what.
Isn't there an Eastern Mountain Sports in Lancaster? I know sometimes their selection can be limited, but it's a good place to at least check out gear and then you can go online and find the best bargains. Also, Cabela's in Hamburg, PA might have some of the stuff you're looking at. They're not great for lightweight gear, but it's worth a trip (besides, it's an awesome store).
max patch
11-04-2013, 17:10
Consider getting one of the self inflating Thermarests instead of the Neoair. I think the Neoair would be a PITA to use, and at 30 you don't necessarily have to choose what may be the most comfortable.
nebulight
11-04-2013, 17:11
The Kelty Cosmic is a decent bag but realistically it's a 35 degree bag. Your going to need a warmer bag. In mid March it's anywhere from 10 to 50 degrees at night in the Smokies. If you start later in April to avoid the cold then you will have the same situation in Maine at the end of your hike.
So what rated bag should I look at. What about summer months, would I be too hot? Or do people typically leave a sleeping bag behind during the summer months?
nebulight
11-04-2013, 17:13
Isn't there an Eastern Mountain Sports in Lancaster? I know sometimes their selection can be limited, but it's a good place to at least check out gear and then you can go online and find the best bargains. Also, Cabela's in Hamburg, PA might have some of the stuff you're looking at. They're not great for lightweight gear, but it's worth a trip (besides, it's an awesome store).
There is an EMS in Lancaster, but it's a very small store. I might be able to check out packs, but I'm not sure about their sleeping bag selection. I figured the sleeping bag and pack I need to buy in person. Maybe the pad too.
I've been close to Cabelas, but I thought it was just a hunting store?
Consider getting one of the self inflating Thermarests instead of the Neoair. I think the Neoair would be a PITA to use, and at 30 you don't necessarily have to choose what may be the most comfortable.
+1 on this ... I went with the Prolite, one of the "self inflating" pads because I was afraid that the Neoair is too fragile. I think the Prolite is a great pad and, at 16 ounces for a 72 inch long version, good on weight. They are also much cheaper. I got mine on sale for $60 during the holiday season last year.
nebulight
11-04-2013, 17:16
Consider getting one of the self inflating Thermarests instead of the Neoair. I think the Neoair would be a PITA to use, and at 30 you don't necessarily have to choose what may be the most comfortable.
Do you have models numbers/names so I can do some research? What about weight and packed size?
So what rated bag should I look at. What about summer months, would I be too hot? Or do people typically leave a sleeping bag behind during the summer months?
I have a cheap 40 bag and a 0 degree Enlightened Equipment quilt. I'm also using my down jacket, pants and socks to act as a sleep system. I'm not "normal" but this system works for me because I'm comfortable in camp without having to be in my sleeping bag to stay warm. If I only had one bag for 3 seasons it would be a 20 degree Western Mountaineering.
Second Hand
11-04-2013, 17:25
I know you mentioned that you don't live near any outfitters, but I would advise you take the trip out to an REI or EMS and try on some different packs. You can watch youtube videos to figure out how to measure yourself and how a bag should sit on your hips. I spent 5 years walking around with a bag that was way to big for me without even knowing it. When I got a new bag that fit properly, it felt like I traded in a bag full of bricks for a bag full of feathers. My only other suggestion is, before your spend a grand on all of this gear, I would check out craigslist and whiteblaze for some gently used gear at a good price. My trail name is second hand, because I purchased 90% of what I own used. Don't get me wrong, I always did a lot of research and tried to make intelligent purchases, but the more you hike, the more your going to relize what you need and want. You can spend a lot of cash up front and find yourself not using 90% of the gear a year later. Things like Kelty sleeping bags, Osprey backpacks and Big Agnes are pretty common in the second hand market.
FarmerChef
11-04-2013, 17:30
So what rated bag should I look at. What about summer months, would I be too hot? Or do people typically leave a sleeping bag behind during the summer months?
I'm glad that you asked cuz I was going to answer it anyway ;) Most thru hikers and section hikers (at least I do it) have two bags - one for the colder shoulder seasons (fall and spring) and a lighter weight bag for summer. If you thru hike you're probably going to want two. I haven't done this but I certainly don't lug my 20 degree quilt when my 50 degree bag will do just fine in July. Also, pay attention to Rasty's "sleep system" comment - a lot of wisdom in those two words. My summer bag is technically a cheap, $20 sleeping bag liner from Amazon that weighs a bit over a pound. But I also factor my clothes into sleeping comfortably if summer temps dip into the 40s. During the winter I bring a 20 degree synthetic quilt (homemade) that sleeps two. My wife and I together add about 10 degree to that 20 degree quilt, plus the clothes I choose for cold weather and I'd be able to make it through a 0 degree night without any fear for me or my wife's life (though we wouldn't choose to do it if it was expected).
The clothes you take can augment your sleeping bag by 15 degrees or more. If you need to save money and are going in the colder months, get thick fleece jackets (front zip if available) from the second hand store. Bring flannel pajama bottoms for camp pants. Sure, you could buy smartwool or icebreakers for $100+ a garment and they are great. But when you're starting on a budget, fleece and thick flannel can keep you just as warm even if you look like the stay-puff marshmallow man :D
If I was in your shoes and just starting out, I would focus my time on fair weather/warm weather camping. You need less gear and it is cheaper. As you gain experience and learn what you like, move up to more challenging weather and more technical gear/clothing. I would also borrow as much equipment as I could from friends and try it out to learn what I liked and didn't like. That backpack might feel ok in the store but after 20 miles you might curse the day you bought it. Experience is worth its weight in gold.
Good luck! Enjoy the hiking.
nebulight
11-04-2013, 17:38
I have a cheap 40 bag and a 0 degree Enlightened Equipment quilt. I'm also using my down jacket, pants and socks to act as a sleep system. I'm not "normal" but this system works for me because I'm comfortable in camp without having to be in my sleeping bag to stay warm. If I only had one bag for 3 seasons it would be a 20 degree Western Mountaineering.
I'm glad that you asked cuz I was going to answer it anyway ;) Most thru hikers and section hikers (at least I do it) have two bags - one for the colder shoulder seasons (fall and spring) and a lighter weight bag for summer. If you thru hike you're probably going to want two. I haven't done this but I certainly don't lug my 20 degree quilt when my 50 degree bag will do just fine in July. Also, pay attention to Rasty's "sleep system" comment - a lot of wisdom in those two words. My summer bag is technically a cheap, $20 sleeping bag liner from Amazon that weighs a bit over a pound. But I also factor my clothes into sleeping comfortably if summer temps dip into the 40s. During the winter I bring a 20 degree synthetic quilt (homemade) that sleeps two. My wife and I together add about 10 degree to that 20 degree quilt, plus the clothes I choose for cold weather and I'd be able to make it through a 0 degree night without any fear for me or my wife's life (though we wouldn't choose to do it if it was expected).
The clothes you take can augment your sleeping bag by 15 degrees or more. If you need to save money and are going in the colder months, get thick fleece jackets (front zip if available) from the second hand store. Bring flannel pajama bottoms for camp pants. Sure, you could buy smartwool or icebreakers for $100+ a garment and they are great. But when you're starting on a budget, fleece and thick flannel can keep you just as warm even if you look like the stay-puff marshmallow man :D
If I was in your shoes and just starting out, I would focus my time on fair weather/warm weather camping. You need less gear and it is cheaper. As you gain experience and learn what you like, move up to more challenging weather and more technical gear/clothing. I would also borrow as much equipment as I could from friends and try it out to learn what I liked and didn't like. That backpack might feel ok in the store but after 20 miles you might curse the day you bought it. Experience is worth its weight in gold.
Good luck! Enjoy the hiking.
Thanks for the comments guys. I assumed that clothing would be part of the sleep system. Having two bags sounds like a great idea.
Also take a look at the ULA circuit backpack. Light, comfortable and made in America.
SipseyFreak
11-04-2013, 17:40
What SH said above about getting a pack that fits. That's one of the most important things you can do. I have a Big Agnes Fly Creek UL2. It's really a 1.5 person tent, but my wife and I slept in it a couple of nights on the PCT, so it'll work for you. It's lighter than the Copper Spur. Bags are rarely accurate in their temp ratings ...
QHShowoman
11-04-2013, 17:41
There is an EMS in Lancaster, but it's a very small store. I might be able to check out packs, but I'm not sure about their sleeping bag selection. I figured the sleeping bag and pack I need to buy in person. Maybe the pad too.
I've been close to Cabelas, but I thought it was just a hunting store?
Cabela's is primarily hunting, but they do have a camping section and I've been surprised to find Big Agnes and North Face sleeping bags there, in addition to the heavy car camping crap they sell. They also carry a pretty wide variety of Thermarest pads, although selection will vary by store. At any rate, it's worth a look. And it's a fun store.
How tall are you? The Black Diamond Alpine poles only extend to 125cm (could be off 5cm going from memory) and may be short for anyone over 5'9". I'm 5'11" and use poles that adjust up to 135cm which I normally set at 130cm unless going down hill for an extended time then I adjust longer. The Black Diamond Distance FL poles are great.
My sister is 54 years old and just started backpacking this year and this is pretty much the equipment that she bought. Pretty much the only difference is she bought a Big Agnes 20 degree bag and a larger pack.
She's been really happy. I think that we have been out about 12 days, and she has felt like her $1000ish bucks were well spent.
Only thing I'd add is that you can't drink from that mug when it is hot. Don't know if that is important to you.
I... am liking the idea of "Ultra-Light" for somethings, but still prefer the cheaper price of non-UL as well as comfort in tent size/options. Yeah, that is the quandary. It is also very individual. "Heavy", "expensive", "comfortable", "practical", etc, etc are all very subjective. I'm still figuring out rain wear and how much I want to spend, vs how much I want to carry. Still can't decide between down and synthetic bag. Tent vs tarp? Full length pad vs 3/4? Alky stove vs pocket rocket? Puffy jacket vs thrift store fleece? Needs vs wants? :) Not sure that it ever ends... And honestly all the online advice in the world won't help because it is my wallet, and me walking and my stuff on my back and me sleeping. Just put the stuff on your back and go... and it is what it is and you make the best of it.
Tent - Room enough for my wife if she comes along on weekends. This is me, but I'd get a one person tent. My husband will come on weekends, but we are talking PERFECT weather weekends and a 4 pound, $30 Target dome tent works fine. It leaks, but it doesn't matter because my husband won't go out in a chance of rain and we are only 4 miles from the car. He uses an old 3 lb car camping sleeping bag. Works great for us. And I don't need to carry a 2 person tent for 10 days, because my husband will NEVER be coming out for 10 days. We have something like this: http://www.target.com/p/embark-red-2-person-dome-tent-4-6-x7-6-x48/-/A-13054998?reco=Rec|pdp|13054998|ClickCP|item_page.v ertical_1&lnk=Rec|pdp|ClickCP|item_page.vertical_1
I wouldn't worry about buying for a thru hike. Your stuff will change between now and a thru hike. And your stuff will most likely change after you start a thru hike. Right now, you need to determine if you like backpacking for 10 days or 100 miles first, me thinks!
Best of luck figuring it all out!
Another Kevin
11-04-2013, 18:24
What SH said above about getting a pack that fits. That's one of the most important things you can do. I have a Big Agnes Fly Creek UL2. It's really a 1.5 person tent, but my wife and I slept in it a couple of nights on the PCT, so it'll work for you. It's lighter than the Copper Spur. Bags are rarely accurate in their temp ratings ...
This. Plus - Get the pack once you have your other gear. The pack has to fit your gear, and if you have too much extra space, you'll be tempted to fill it. Buy the pack last!
How tall are you? The Black Diamond Alpine poles only extend to 125cm (could be off 5cm going from memory) and may be short for anyone over 5'9". I'm 5'11" and use poles that adjust up to 135cm which I normally set at 130cm unless going down hill for an extended time then I adjust longer. The Black Diamond Distance FL poles are great.
You and I must be proportioned differently, or else I'm doing it all wrong. I find that 120-125 cm is a comfortable pole length, and I'm a couple inches taller than you.I don't recall offhand how far my Komperdell poles extend, because it's Far Enough. And I should know better than to get into a discussion with anyone about the size of his pole.
To the original poster:
If you are using poles, you might want to consider a trekking-pole-supported tent. They can be a lot lighter. The TarpTent Notch that I bring on solo trips is 1 pound 12 ounces - the standard one is 1 lb 10 ounces, but I got the partial-solid interior for cold weather. The 2-person TarpTent Squall 2 is 2 pounds 2 ounces.
There's a lot you can get away with dirtbagging at first, rather than dropping a ton of money your first few trips until you know what you want in the way of gear. http://hikinghq.net/dirtbag.html (http://hikinghq.net/dirtbag.html) has a lot of ideas.
Clothing is the most obvious example. A fleece jacket or hoodie and fleece lounge pants from Salvation Army or the job lot store will keep you just as warm as fancy ones from the outfitter, and not even be that much heavier. (By the same token, a cotton work shirt from Eddie Bauer or LL Bean will s*k just as much as one from Goodwill!) I've not noticed a C9 baselayer from Target being any colder than an expensive one from EMS.
For a sleeping pad, the infamous blue foam pad from Wal-Mart is fine for the first few trips. You can lash it to the outside of your pack. It's reasonably light, and reasonably warm, it's just bulky. And as time goes on, you'll find other uses for blue foam, and you'll wind up cutting it up and making other bits and pieces.
I still carry a K-mart grease pot and a homemade soda-can stove in all but deep winter. (For melting snow, you really need a gasoline-fired stove.) I might invest in Snow Peak or Evernew if the pot ever comes to grief. It hasn't happened yet.
A hardware-store headlamp will take drug-store batteries and only be an ounce or two heavier. And you likely already have one around the house.
Don't forget sources like Goodwill and Craigslist. You don't have to start out with all new gear.
:welcome, and hope to see you on the trail!
Also take a look at the ULA circuit backpack. Light, comfortable and made in America. I used a $5 thrift store external frame backpack for 5 years since I didn't want to invest a ton of $$$ in case I liked reading about backpacking more than actually doing it. :) Upgraded to a ULA Catalyst this summer and I'm really happy. I'm on the west coast and have to carry a lot of water sometimes and a bear can.
ULA is giving away a free Sawyer mini water filter... btw. http://www.ula-equipment.com/product_p/catalyst.htm
Odd Man Out
11-04-2013, 18:55
I have the same poles. I am 6'0" and don't need to fully extend them. You could save a lot of $ by getting cheap poles and spend the savings on a better bag as suggested. You could also save a little by shopping around. I think I got my poles last year for $80 on sale somewhere. $160 seems high.
I have and like the carbon corks but they are pricy. The Costco trekking poles are cheap and suggested as an alternative by Andrew Skurka
http://andrewskurka.com/2012/costco-trekking-poles/
fins1838
11-04-2013, 22:35
Big Agnes Scout 2 is cheaper & lighter. I love it. Just my opinion.
If you're hiking any distance, I wouldn't save weight by losing the hiking poles. Helps the knees a lot, and saved me from a fall or two as well!
nebulight
11-05-2013, 09:08
Also take a look at the ULA circuit backpack. Light, comfortable and made in America.
I have not, but I'll check it out. Do they sell them at any national chains? There is an REI fairly close.
What SH said above about getting a pack that fits. That's one of the most important things you can do. I have a Big Agnes Fly Creek UL2. It's really a 1.5 person tent, but my wife and I slept in it a couple of nights on the PCT, so it'll work for you. It's lighter than the Copper Spur. Bags are rarely accurate in their temp ratings ...
I like the idea of the Fly Creek, but I showed my wife both the Copper Spur and the Fly Creek and having two doors seemed like a better option when there would be two of us. However I might take her to Cabela's after hearing that they sell them.
Cabela's is primarily hunting, but they do have a camping section and I've been surprised to find Big Agnes and North Face sleeping bags there, in addition to the heavy car camping crap they sell. They also carry a pretty wide variety of Thermarest pads, although selection will vary by store. At any rate, it's worth a look. And it's a fun store.
Good to know about the Thermarest pads, I'm curious to see what they are like.
How tall are you? The Black Diamond Alpine poles only extend to 125cm (could be off 5cm going from memory) and may be short for anyone over 5'9". I'm 5'11" and use poles that adjust up to 135cm which I normally set at 130cm unless going down hill for an extended time then I adjust longer. The Black Diamond Distance FL poles are great.
6 feet even. I'd have to try them out before I buy them.
My sister is 54 years old and just started backpacking this year and this is pretty much the equipment that she bought. Pretty much the only difference is she bought a Big Agnes 20 degree bag and a larger pack.
She's been really happy. I think that we have been out about 12 days, and she has felt like her $1000ish bucks were well spent.
Only thing I'd add is that you can't drink from that mug when it is hot. Don't know if that is important to you.
Yeah, that is the quandary. It is also very individual. "Heavy", "expensive", "comfortable", "practical", etc, etc are all very subjective. I'm still figuring out rain wear and how much I want to spend, vs how much I want to carry. Still can't decide between down and synthetic bag. Tent vs tarp? Full length pad vs 3/4? Alky stove vs pocket rocket? Puffy jacket vs thrift store fleece? Needs vs wants? :) Not sure that it ever ends... And honestly all the online advice in the world won't help because it is my wallet, and me walking and my stuff on my back and me sleeping. Just put the stuff on your back and go... and it is what it is and you make the best of it.
This is me, but I'd get a one person tent. My husband will come on weekends, but we are talking PERFECT weather weekends and a 4 pound, $30 Target dome tent works fine. It leaks, but it doesn't matter because my husband won't go out in a chance of rain and we are only 4 miles from the car. He uses an old 3 lb car camping sleeping bag. Works great for us. And I don't need to carry a 2 person tent for 10 days, because my husband will NEVER be coming out for 10 days. We have something like this: http://www.target.com/p/embark-red-2-person-dome-tent-4-6-x7-6-x48/-/A-13054998?reco=Rec|pdp|13054998|ClickCP|item_page.v ertical_1&lnk=Rec|pdp|ClickCP|item_page.vertical_1
I wouldn't worry about buying for a thru hike. Your stuff will change between now and a thru hike. And your stuff will most likely change after you start a thru hike. Right now, you need to determine if you like backpacking for 10 days or 100 miles first, me thinks!
Best of luck figuring it all out!
thanks for this. I'm not a huge hot beverage drinker so I don't think that will be drinking out of it. As for the rest of the gear, I'll have to find a nice middle ground.
This. Plus - Get the pack once you have your other gear. The pack has to fit your gear, and if you have too much extra space, you'll be tempted to fill it. Buy the pack last!
You and I must be proportioned differently, or else I'm doing it all wrong. I find that 120-125 cm is a comfortable pole length, and I'm a couple inches taller than you.I don't recall offhand how far my Komperdell poles extend, because it's Far Enough. And I should know better than to get into a discussion with anyone about the size of his pole.
To the original poster:
If you are using poles, you might want to consider a trekking-pole-supported tent. They can be a lot lighter. The TarpTent Notch that I bring on solo trips is 1 pound 12 ounces - the standard one is 1 lb 10 ounces, but I got the partial-solid interior for cold weather. The 2-person TarpTent Squall 2 is 2 pounds 2 ounces.
There's a lot you can get away with dirtbagging at first, rather than dropping a ton of money your first few trips until you know what you want in the way of gear. http://hikinghq.net/dirtbag.html (http://hikinghq.net/dirtbag.html) has a lot of ideas.
Clothing is the most obvious example. A fleece jacket or hoodie and fleece lounge pants from Salvation Army or the job lot store will keep you just as warm as fancy ones from the outfitter, and not even be that much heavier. (By the same token, a cotton work shirt from Eddie Bauer or LL Bean will s*k just as much as one from Goodwill!) I've not noticed a C9 baselayer from Target being any colder than an expensive one from EMS.
For a sleeping pad, the infamous blue foam pad from Wal-Mart is fine for the first few trips. You can lash it to the outside of your pack. It's reasonably light, and reasonably warm, it's just bulky. And as time goes on, you'll find other uses for blue foam, and you'll wind up cutting it up and making other bits and pieces.
I still carry a K-mart grease pot and a homemade soda-can stove in all but deep winter. (For melting snow, you really need a gasoline-fired stove.) I might invest in Snow Peak or Evernew if the pot ever comes to grief. It hasn't happened yet.
A hardware-store headlamp will take drug-store batteries and only be an ounce or two heavier. And you likely already have one around the house.
Don't forget sources like Goodwill and Craigslist. You don't have to start out with all new gear.
:welcome, and hope to see you on the trail!
Thanks. Yes, I will be buying my pack last as that will be bought in person so I can hopefully have the rest of my gear ready to try it out in the pack. As for a tent that requires the poles, I didn't want to do that in case there were hikes were I didn't want to take my poles. However I guess it could be offset by the fact that I'd be carrying tent poles instead ;)
Clothing I'd have covered. I could never bring myself to buy expensive clothing for hiking with the exception of a nice down jacket.
I used a $5 thrift store external frame backpack for 5 years since I didn't want to invest a ton of $$$ in case I liked reading about backpacking more than actually doing it. :) Upgraded to a ULA Catalyst this summer and I'm really happy. I'm on the west coast and have to carry a lot of water sometimes and a bear can.
ULA is giving away a free Sawyer mini water filter... btw. http://www.ula-equipment.com/product_p/catalyst.htm
I'll have to do more research into the brand. You hear a lot online about Osprey, but that could just be their marketing.
I have the same poles. I am 6'0" and don't need to fully extend them. You could save a lot of $ by getting cheap poles and spend the savings on a better bag as suggested. You could also save a little by shopping around. I think I got my poles last year for $80 on sale somewhere. $160 seems high.
Prices aren't accurate. Some were retail, others were ebay quick searches for pricing. Budget is around 1000-1250ish.
Big Agnes Scout 2 is cheaper & lighter. I love it. Just my opinion.
I saw that one. But having two doors when I'd be with my wife would be a huge plus. However maybe I could talk her into it if we go check them out in person.
If you're hiking any distance, I wouldn't save weight by losing the hiking poles. Helps the knees a lot, and saved me from a fall or two as well!
Thanks for this. I can do full day hikes with no problems, but steep descents are what get my knees.
Thanks Rasty for the input. That's a very valid point about the poles, however I've been told for any long distance hikes, poles are a good idea (I always have sore knees from coming down).
As for the sleeping bag, would the issue just be weight? Is $200 worth the pound I'd save? (serious question because I honestly have no idea).
Buy quality once.
A really well made, high quality goose down bag may outlive you. Multiple decades is certainly possibly. On a cost/per night basis, something like the WM Ultralite (http://www.westernmountaineering.com/index.cfm?section=products&page=Sleeping%20Bags&cat=ExtremeLite%20Series&ContentId=17) or Sycamore (http://www.westernmountaineering.com/index.cfm?section=products&page=Sleeping%20Bags&cat=Microfiber%20Series&ContentId=21) are bargains. If you watch the internet like a hawk, you can find discounted Western Mountaineering bags.
Before spalshing out for the NeoAir, find out if you are comfortable on an inexpensive foam pad. If you are, then you will have more money for a quality bag.
A pair of closeout (read: cheap) Komperdell poles from Sierra Trading Post (http://www.sierratradingpost.com/komperdell-trekking-poles~bs~11384~351/?afsrc=1&gclid=CN2u6rfwzboCFUVp7AodgXcAGA&codes-processed=true) saved me from a potentially horrific fall on the Berg Lake Trail in British Columbia. Reason enough for me to continue to use them. Besides, hiking poles hold up TarpTents. Another reason to have them.
Sierra Trading Post is a great source for heavily discounted decent gear.
Think Smart, Budget Friendly Light. Not Expensive Ultralight regardless of function.
Good luck! Have fun!
Wayne
There are a few other two man tents out there that are lighter and about the same price. The Tarptent Stratospire 2 is about a pound lighter (and a little more expensive). It's got a "his and her" door :) I take it on solo trips and only receive mild teasing about setting up a palace.
You can pick up lots of hiking poles for less cash. Folks here recommended the Black Diamond Ergo Corks (aluminum poles) and I've been very pleased with them. They saved my butt during a fall on the Standing Stone Trail and I swear the pole bent to 45 deg and didn't break. It did bend the lower shaft enough that the poles won't collapse anymore but it was usable for hiking and putting up tent. I did replace the lower shaft when I got home ($9 and came with a new tip!) I suspect the pole would have snapped had it been carbon fiber.
And I second all the comments about keeping an eye on sales. Make your list and wait for things to drop to 50% or more off. It'll happen eventually!
nebulight
11-05-2013, 11:50
Buy quality once.
A really well made, high quality goose down bag may outlive you. Multiple decades is certainly possibly. On a cost/per night basis, something like the WM Ultralite (http://www.westernmountaineering.com/index.cfm?section=products&page=Sleeping%20Bags&cat=ExtremeLite%20Series&ContentId=17) or Sycamore (http://www.westernmountaineering.com/index.cfm?section=products&page=Sleeping%20Bags&cat=Microfiber%20Series&ContentId=21) are bargains. If you watch the internet like a hawk, you can find discounted Western Mountaineering bags.
Before spalshing out for the NeoAir, find out if you are comfortable on an inexpensive foam pad. If you are, then you will have more money for a quality bag.
A pair of closeout (read: cheap) Komperdell poles from Sierra Trading Post (http://www.sierratradingpost.com/komperdell-trekking-poles~bs~11384~351/?afsrc=1&gclid=CN2u6rfwzboCFUVp7AodgXcAGA&codes-processed=true) saved me from a potentially horrific fall on the Berg Lake Trail in British Columbia. Reason enough for me to continue to use them. Besides, hiking poles hold up TarpTents. Another reason to have them.
Sierra Trading Post is a great source for heavily discounted decent gear.
Think Smart, Budget Friendly Light. Not Expensive Ultralight regardless of function.
Good luck! Have fun!
Wayne
i'll keep my eyes peeled.
There are a few other two man tents out there that are lighter and about the same price. The Tarptent Stratospire 2 is about a pound lighter (and a little more expensive). It's got a "his and her" door :) I take it on solo trips and only receive mild teasing about setting up a palace.
You can pick up lots of hiking poles for less cash. Folks here recommended the Black Diamond Ergo Corks (aluminum poles) and I've been very pleased with them. They saved my butt during a fall on the Standing Stone Trail and I swear the pole bent to 45 deg and didn't break. It did bend the lower shaft enough that the poles won't collapse anymore but it was usable for hiking and putting up tent. I did replace the lower shaft when I got home ($9 and came with a new tip!) I suspect the pole would have snapped had it been carbon fiber.
And I second all the comments about keeping an eye on sales. Make your list and wait for things to drop to 50% or more off. It'll happen eventually!
I'm not going to lie, tents that require hiking poles don't give me piece of mind when it comes to durability in bad weather. But then again, I have zero experience with tents of any kind.
I'm not going to lie, tents that require hiking poles don't give me piece of mind when it comes to durability in bad weather. But then again, I have zero experience with tents of any kind.
Fair enough! I'll let others weigh on on that one. I haven't been in any strong wind situations lately to be able to tell. I do note that my hiking poles are significantly thicker than any tent pole and far less bendy. I wouldn't put my tent up against a 4 season snow-capable tent like a Hilleberg though. I do have bad memories of waking up in an old dome tent (fiberglass poles, 1980's era) that resembled a TP the night after a strong wind storm. All three poles snapped at the top. Fun times!
I'm not going to lie, tents that require hiking poles don't give me piece of mind when it comes to durability in bad weather. But then again, I have zero experience with tents of any kind.
I had a BA Copper Spur before I switched to a Hexamid Twin which is supported by trekking poles. I would say that the CS seemed more stable and secure in wind than the Hexamid but I'm not sure how much of that is perception vs. reality. I had the Hexamid out in some very strong winds this year and it was totally solid. I use the Black Diamond Carbon Corks and have a lot of confidence in these poles. The caveat with the pole supported shelters is that a poor pitch could cause problems. A tent like the CS is easier to set up overall. For me the weight savings and extra space in the Hexamid make it a better choice.
nebulight
11-05-2013, 12:13
I had a BA Copper Spur before I switched to a Hexamid Twin which is supported by trekking poles. I would say that the CS seemed more stable and secure in wind than the Hexamid but I'm not sure how much of that is perception vs. reality. I had the Hexamid out in some very strong winds this year and it was totally solid. I use the Black Diamond Carbon Corks and have a lot of confidence in these poles. The caveat with the pole supported shelters is that a poor pitch could cause problems. A tent like the CS is easier to set up overall. For me the weight savings and extra space in the Hexamid make it a better choice.
That's another thing. After watching assembly videos of the CS and trekking poll tents, it looks WAY easier to setup (the copper spur).
I am a long time weekender and "newbie go lighter".
I have accumulated a lot of gear of the years. I pretty much had to start over to get lighter.
Here is what I did/plan to do (finances are somewhat limiting)
- 32oz - pack (GoLite Jam 50L)
- carbon fiber trekking poles (14oz per pair)
- 54oz 32deg bag syn bag (need to replace with 2# 20deg down bag)
- 11 oz Thermareest Prolite and a 5oz piece of cutdown Thermarest Ridge Rest (used as structure for pack and insulation)
- 36 oz - currently using a 10ft x 10ft urethane tarp + ground sheet/bivy + stakes and small piece of mozi netting - Need to buy a "tarptent type shelter" that will weigh less than 20 oz complete. Currently looking at SixMoonDesigns Wild Oasis or Shires TarpTent both SilNy
- 16 oz - alcohol cat can stove, alum windscreen, anodized alum pot, pot cozy, small plastic cup,soap, pad,GSI coffee filter. Very happy with alc stove. Could by Ti pot to save a couple of oz.
- 54 oz - clothing ( water proof S2S Event compression sack, down vest, merino base layer, silk long johns, extra shirt, x-tra pair Merino socks, thin hat/gloves, thermasilk long johns, bandana) need to get a wind shirt
- 12 oz - Frogg Toggs rain gear disposable.
- 21 oz - junk drawer in a gallon ziplock bag (FAK, Aqua Mira, cordage, repair kit, bic lighter, UCO storm matches, leatherman Juice, Fenix E11 flashlight, x-tra AA battery, Wet Ones)
-5 oz - 2 @ 1 liter Platy bottles, 16oz nalgene with cozy for my morning coffeee
By using the above gear my current pack weight is 15# without food, fuel and water.
FooFighter'12
11-05-2013, 12:42
I have to disagree with the previous comment that the Kelly cosmic 20 is only comfortable to 35 degrees. I used one on my thru, starting in february, and had several nights in the low 20's. I stayed warm every night and I am skinny. However, it is a little bulky so you definitely want a good compression bag to put it in. But if you want something better and eventually you will, go with one of the aforementioned bags.
I would recommend checking out ULA packs. They have a few good options. For a good review, check out shug Emory's page on YouTube.
Tarptent makes some nice lightweight tents. Take a look at the Tarptent Double Rainbow, it is plenty big for two people and light enough to carry on solo trips.
It is good that you are asking questions and doing research before buying anything. You will save a lot of money by buying quality gear in the first place.
nebulight
11-05-2013, 12:56
I am a long time weekender and "newbie go lighter".
I have accumulated a lot of gear of the years. I pretty much had to start over to get lighter.
Here is what I did/plan to do (finances are somewhat limiting)
- 32oz - pack (GoLite Jam 50L)
- carbon fiber trekking poles (14oz per pair)
- 54oz 32deg bag syn bag (need to replace with 2# 20deg down bag)
- 11 oz Thermareest Prolite and a 5oz piece of cutdown Thermarest Ridge Rest (used as structure for pack and insulation)
- 36 oz - currently using a 10ft x 10ft urethane tarp + ground sheet/bivy + stakes and small piece of mozi netting - Need to buy a "tarptent type shelter" that will weigh less than 20 oz complete. Currently looking at SixMoonDesigns Wild Oasis or Shires TarpTent both SilNy
- 16 oz - alcohol cat can stove, alum windscreen, anodized alum pot, pot cozy, small plastic cup,soap, pad,GSI coffee filter. Very happy with alc stove. Could by Ti pot to save a couple of oz.
- 54 oz - clothing ( water proof S2S Event compression sack, down vest, merino base layer, silk long johns, extra shirt, x-tra pair Merino socks, thin hat/gloves, thermasilk long johns, bandana) need to get a wind shirt
- 12 oz - Frogg Toggs rain gear disposable.
- 21 oz - junk drawer in a gallon ziplock bag (FAK, Aqua Mira, cordage, repair kit, bic lighter, UCO storm matches, leatherman Juice, Fenix E11 flashlight, x-tra AA battery, Wet Ones)
-5 oz - 2 @ 1 liter Platy bottles, 16oz nalgene with cozy for my morning coffeee
By using the above gear my current pack weight is 15# without food, fuel and water.
Thanks!
I have to disagree with the previous comment that the Kelly cosmic 20 is only comfortable to 35 degrees. I used one on my thru, starting in february, and had several nights in the low 20's. I stayed warm every night and I am skinny. However, it is a little bulky so you definitely want a good compression bag to put it in. But if you want something better and eventually you will, go with one of the aforementioned bags.
I would recommend checking out ULA packs. They have a few good options. For a good review, check out shug Emory's page on YouTube.
Tarptent makes some nice lightweight tents. Take a look at the Tarptent Double Rainbow, it is plenty big for two people and light enough to carry on solo trips.
It is good that you are asking questions and doing research before buying anything. You will save a lot of money by buying quality gear in the first place.
Yea, I was checking out ULA and was a bit shocked at some of their videos, mainly their sizing video, hahaha.
Your last sentence makes a lot of sense. I don't want to buy a bunch of gear only to end up selling it at a loss if I don't like it and can't return it.
Sleeping bags - there are 2 factors that make a good down bag an excellent investment - weight and volume. As a bigger hiker, the Montbell bags are perfect for me. Once you find a good bag, it will be good for your for many, many years.
Shelter - without a lot of experience, you might have difficulty finding the "right" shelter for you. Most people don't go straight to a tarp. You might need to go from a traditional tent (like the CS 2 that you mention) for your first few outings. Once you are comfortable, then you can experiment with a tarp tent or a tarp and bivy.
Stove - start with a simple alcohol stove. upgrade if you need to, but save money for a good sleeping bag.
Sarcasm the elf
11-05-2013, 13:17
So what rated bag should I look at. What about summer months, would I be too hot? Or do people typically leave a sleeping bag behind during the summer months?
For many many years i had one 15* down bag that i used year round, in the winter i used it like normal and in he summer i unzipped it and used it like a quilt, this would likely work for you as well if you dont have the money for two bags.
I own several pads including a neoair and a pro-lite, but i keep going back to my z-lite foam pad (http://m.rei.com/mt/www.rei.com/product/829826/therm-a-rest-z-lite-sol-sleeping-pad) if i was planning to thru hike this is what I'd bring, it's very durable, can't leak, and gets strapped to the outside of your pack which lowers the pack volume (and pack weight) that you need.
As far as the inflatables, In my experience, the neoair is far superior to the pro-lite. The neoair is much lighter, much more compact, and much more comfortable, additionally, while the pro-lite looks more durable, i've found this to be an illusion, most hazards that would puncture a neoair will puncture a pro-lite just as easily. I have put multiple holes in both, and can tell you that it sucks when you wake up in the middle of the night because your pad deflated. If you do buy a therma-rest or other inflatable, bring a couple of patches made by the manufacturer, i have found that the therma-rest patches work very well and now keep one in my first aid kit if i have an inflatable with me.
As far as packs, check out ULA, theyre the best lightweight packs I've seen. If you dont have a retailer near you give them a call and they can work with you and will probably let you buy a pack to try it while letting you return (as long as it's still in new condition)it if it doesn't fit right or you don't like it.
The Big Agnes Copper spur 2 is good but really expensive, check out tarptent.com and lightheartgear.com for other options that you might prefer. But you can't go wrong with any if them.
Edit: just so you know, the two person Tarptent Double rainbow does come with a pole that supports it. The hiking poles are optional and can be used to either make the tent fully freestanding, or alternately placed to supplement the main pole in severe bad weather. I got one this spring and so far it's been bombproof, I can't think of a tent that beats it for it's combination of size/weight/price,
I don't want to buy a bunch of gear only to end up selling it at a loss if I don't like it and can't return it.
About a year ago, I faced the task of buying all new gear for my John Muir Trail thru hike because my existing backpacking equipment from the 1990s was functionally obsolete - not in the sense that it couldn't be used but equipment has made such strides that I could cut more than half the weight without sacrificing comfort. As I went through the process, I definitely ended up buying gear that in retrospect were not the best choices. I purchased a backpack as one of my first purchases - a mistake because I ended up requiring a smaller pack. I was able to sell my very lightly used Catalyst on WhiteBlaze and purchase a Circuit - sure, it cost me some money but not a huge amount. I also purchased a Copper Spur UL1 which is a good tent but after using it I felt that I wanted more space and a lighter/more compact package. So I purchased the Hexamid Twin. I spoke to REI about the situation and they actually told me that returning the Copper Spur was a perfectly acceptable use of the return policy. So I returned it - no financial loss. I made some similar mistakes on other gear but I'm happy overall with what I have today. Could my gear be a couple of pounds lighter without giving up much if any functionality? Yes, I think so, but I have found that my comfort level is not too different carrying 22-23 pounds versus 26-28 pounds (30+ is where I start to feel it).
I'm not nearly as experienced as many people here but as someone who went through this gear acquisition process not so long ago I would say that it isn't a disaster to buy the "wrong gear" because most lightly used gear can be sold at a decent price and +- a few pounds on base weight isn't likely to make or break a trip.
Also take a look at the ULA circuit backpack. Light, comfortable and made in America.
Also consider the Catalyst for the extra capacity.
Also consider the Catalyst for the extra capacity.
The Circuit just fits my winter kit with 6 days of food. The Key word is Just.
nebulight
11-05-2013, 15:04
Thanks everyone. I want to say that while I'm getting a ton of different answers, that was to be expected. I love hearing what everyone thinks. I think the best option for me might be to purchase retail through REI or similar vendor that has a long return policy. Since I'm just starting out, I need to find what I like by actually using it.
This is a great forum.
Don't take this the wrong way, (and I am a long time REI customer), but quite a bit of the UltraLight gear discussed on this thread is not available at REI. ULA, GoLite, Shires, MLD, sixmoondesigns, etc.
nebulight
11-05-2013, 15:41
well, maybe other online retailers that have longer return policies.
Sarcasm the elf
11-05-2013, 15:48
Don't take this the wrong way, (and I am a long time REI customer), but quite a bit of the UltraLight gear discussed on this thread is not available at REI. ULA, GoLite, Shires, MLD, sixmoondesigns, etc.
Well of course not, :sun those are specialty companies who manufacture specialized gear, most of which is made right here in the USA. If you have any issue with a Tarptent or ULA pack then you can call them and talk to the owner of the company directly. I'll take that over REI's one year guarantee on chinese made equipment any day.
well, maybe other online retailers that have longer return policies.
Do a bit of research on ULA and Tarptents customer service. It's incredible. My Henry Shires Tarptent is a Double Rainbow at $260 and 40 ounces. I called about something prior to ordering and spoke to Henry.
One word of warning. Once you go cottage industry gear you won't go back to REI very much except for clothing and shoes.
fishfeet
11-05-2013, 15:59
All of the equipment you listed are things I saw used successfully this year on my thru-hike. And they're plenty light enough. Go for the best sleeping bag possible, it definitlely helps to have some piece of mind when things get COLD out there. Only concern is if you'd have enough room in a 46 liter pack for longer 4-5 day resupplies of food. Although i saw people successfully get away with 33 liter packs this year as well. You'll be fine.
nebulight
11-06-2013, 08:58
Do a bit of research on ULA and Tarptents customer service. It's incredible. My Henry Shires Tarptent is a Double Rainbow at $260 and 40 ounces. I called about something prior to ordering and spoke to Henry.
One word of warning. Once you go cottage industry gear you won't go back to REI very much except for clothing and shoes.
Thanks. I called up ULA and had a long talk with Chris. Sounds like a great guy who is very passionate about the industry in general.
All of the equipment you listed are things I saw used successfully this year on my thru-hike. And they're plenty light enough. Go for the best sleeping bag possible, it definitlely helps to have some piece of mind when things get COLD out there. Only concern is if you'd have enough room in a 46 liter pack for longer 4-5 day resupplies of food. Although i saw people successfully get away with 33 liter packs this year as well. You'll be fine.
Good to hear. Thanks!
sadlowskiadam
11-06-2013, 09:41
Here is a great website for new hikers: http://theathiker.com/
I had no hiking experience before my 2013 AT thru hike, but used this site to plan. It was very helpful. Remember, less is more on the AT. My base pack weight (everything minus water and food) was about 16 lbs. You shouldn't have a problem getting there. Best of Luck, Counselor
nebulight
11-06-2013, 11:26
Here is a great website for new hikers: http://theathiker.com/
I had no hiking experience before my 2013 AT thru hike, but used this site to plan. It was very helpful. Remember, less is more on the AT. My base pack weight (everything minus water and food) was about 16 lbs. You shouldn't have a problem getting there. Best of Luck, Counselor
thanks, I'll bookmark that.
Sarcasm the elf
11-06-2013, 23:47
I just saw that the 2012 EMS mountain light 15* bag is on clearance on EMS.com, don't know if it would be of any interest to you, but I thought I'd throw it out there.
I have the zero degree version of the same bag and am quite happy with it.
http://www.ems.com/product/index.jsp?productId=4434442&cp=3677338.24088286
I just saw that the 2012 EMS mountain light 15* bag is on clearance on EMS.com, don't know if it would be of any interest to you, but I thought I'd throw it out there.
I have the zero degree version of the same bag and am quit happy with it.
http://www.ems.com/product/index.jsp?productId=4434442&cp=3677338.24088286
If your quit happy why are you recommending it? :rolleyes:
Sarcasm the elf
11-07-2013, 00:41
If your quit happy why are you recommending it? :rolleyes:
For the same reason that I'm not happy with Autocorrect...
nebulight
11-18-2013, 15:34
okay, I've got a revised list based off some suggestions here and elsewhere:
http://lighterpack.com/r/e526pg
My only concern is durability of the circuit as it's carbon. If I were to travel, throwing the bag in the overhead bin or even checking the bag would worry me as the info on their site kinda scares me.