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nastynate
11-14-2013, 06:53
I tested out my new setup last night on the back porch. Neoair xlite on concrete and it got down to 25. 20 revelation x quilt with 2oz overfill. I was wearing polypro longjohns, wool socks, and a wool/fleece lined hat with ear flaps. My body stayed comfortable but my feet and face were very cold so I came in around 4:00. I know a down balaclava and down booties would help a ton, but is there a cheaper way? Thick fleece balaclava and socks maybe?

aficion
11-14-2013, 07:08
I tested out my new setup last night on the back porch. Neoair xlite on concrete and it got down to 25. 20 revelation x quilt with 2oz overfill. I was wearing polypro longjohns, wool socks, and a wool/fleece lined hat with ear flaps. My body stayed comfortable but my feet and face were very cold so I came in around 4:00. I know a down balaclava and down booties would help a ton, but is there a cheaper way? Thick fleece balaclava and socks maybe?

Medium weight balalclava works for me under the hood of my thermawrap jacket. I use down booties that are made to walk in so I can get up and go pee. I very much enjoy getting up for a bit at night and only resort to a pee bottle in heavy rain. My booties have ensolite soles covered in cordura. If my feet get cold when I'm not carrying my booties, I double up my medium weight wool socks. Keeping my head warm goes a long way towards keeping the rest of me warm.

JAK
11-14-2013, 07:12
If it was a clear night sky overhead, and you aren't under a tarp or tree or roof or anything, you will radiate a lot of heat to the clear night sky and you will feel colder than you would if it was overcast or you were under a shelter and the air temperature was the same. Similar to lying in the sun vs the shade only in reverse. So that factors into it. I think clear night vs overcast is the equivalent of maybe 5 degrees, and adding a shelter like a tarp might help by another 5 degrees, and then a tent is the same as the tarp radiation wise. So if unsheltered under a clear night sky, you need a little extra. As far as where to add it, it is more a matter of where you are losing the heat than wear you are feeling the cold. Dress evenly. Extremities like hands and feet don't maintain as high skin temperature as armpits, groin, neck, face, head, so they need a little less layer. The adage is if your hands or feet are cold, wear a hat. So maybe thick balaclava and just thin socks. I would suggest wool over fleece though, as long as you wear the wool by day to dry it back out.

nastynate
11-14-2013, 08:24
Yeah it was very clear. I had a layer of frost on my quilt when I got up as well. Possum down socks seem to get pretty decent reviews for the price. Any brand recommendations for a fleece or wool balaclava or just get something from target or Walmart?

10-K
11-14-2013, 09:31
If you have an army surplus store nearby I'd start there. The one I shop at has all kinds of cold weather clothing, cheap, and mainly wool.

It won't be UL necessarily but you can't beat the price.

Tipi Walter
11-14-2013, 09:32
First off, the Xlite is not a winter pad as it's got an Rvalue of 3.2---too low for winter and more of a summer pad. You need at least 5R and preferably something like an Exped downmat at 8R.

In addition, all sleeping bags and/or quilts have company ratings which should be bounced up 15 degrees for comfort, so a 20F bag works well to 35F. In my opinion, if you had a beefier sleeping pad and a beefier bag/quilt your body would be much warmer resulting in warmer feet and head. In the winter I sleep in a balaclava covered with a toboggan on top. These two are enough even when temps dip to -10F or -15F---as long as you have overkill geese.

squeezebox
11-14-2013, 09:41
During the day a thin layer of vasoline on your face will keep out the cold breeze, I figured that out when reading about the channel swimmers greasing up. Soaks in during the day and wipes off with TP.

chasing shadows
11-14-2013, 11:12
You should look into buying a buff. They work well keeping you warm in the winter and cool in the summer. You can wear them multiple ways so you get more bang for your buck.


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FooFighter'12
11-14-2013, 12:36
You should look into buying a buff. They work well keeping you warm in the winter and cool in the summer. You can wear them multiple ways so you get more bang for your buck

I agree, the buff served me well.

Nasty Nate, I'm more concerned with how you are going to protect yourself from the Squirrel Master.

nastynate
11-14-2013, 12:55
I agree, the buff served me well.

Nasty Nate, I'm more concerned with how you are going to protect yourself from the Squirrel Master.


Hmmm, I feel like I should know what you are talking about.....but I don't, lol.

Looks like a buff would be great, combined with a beanie when its real cold.

Dogwood
11-14-2013, 13:04
I know a down balaclava and down booties would help a ton, but is there a cheaper way? Thick fleece balaclava and socks maybe?

How cheap? Hot Feet(Hot Hands) are like $1. I will suggest you look at staying warm from different angles gear wise, personal knowledge, techniques, etc AND combine them effectively for your different sleeping scenarios/conditions/etc. What I'm saying is that staying warm is not just about buying gear.

chasing shadows
11-14-2013, 13:34
I agree, the buff served me well.

Nasty Nate, I'm more concerned with how you are going to protect yourself from the Squirrel Master.

I have an original buff but I saw they make different kinds such as thicker ones for cold weather and wind proof ones. I think I may buy a wind proof one for my winter hikes.


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yaduck9
11-14-2013, 13:41
If the above suggestions don't work, an option is a Ray Jardine kit with a buff for your neck.

http://www.rayjardine.com/ray-way/Insulated-Hat-Kit/index.htm

at times it can be a bit overkill

T.S.Kobzol
11-14-2013, 14:31
I have used a wool buff for the past 2 weekends. It is thin. I combine it with wool hat, fleece neck gaiter onto an interchangeable system from neck to head to sternumstrap and back ... depending on conditions and elevation

Sent from my vivid imagination and delusions of grandeur

Blissful
11-14-2013, 16:03
I'd use a thin insulation pad over the neoair. Like from Gossamer Gear.
As far as a quilt, I think a good quality mummy traps air better for better insulation. But I'm particular that way.

FarmerChef
11-14-2013, 16:35
I'm surprised no one has mentioned tucking your head under your quilt. Oh wait, I think you said your quilt was down so perhaps that's not such a good idea. I tuck my head under my quilt if it's really cold. I trap more of my exhaled breath that way and preserve a bit of the heat. Of course, I leave a crack open where my nose and mouth are but that's not a big deal.

GoodGerman
11-14-2013, 18:33
Check out the "Polar Buff". Basically a buff with fleece on one end. I always bring one of these and a fleece beanie when I'm out with a Quilt.

For the cold feet.. My mom made me some insanely thick socks from alpaca wool. They are awesome but pretty heavy.
I hear PossumDown Socks are also very warm.

In very cold nights a bottle filled with hot water might be a good idea too.

MuddyWaters
11-14-2013, 19:57
If you are using a quilt at 20 F, you should also be using a hood with it.

Zpacks hood, $60. ~1.5 oz.

Ive worn my melanzana hoody and cinched the face up down into the 20s and been fine with just a fleece beanie on under it as well.

If the rest of your body is warm enough, ie wear your fleece and puffy too, your head will stay warmer. I have slept with my head uncovered and totally outside of mummybag thru the face hole in the 20s before when I just got too hot inside. Woke up with ice in my hair in the early morning, (cowboy camping) , then decided to put my head back in. My body had cooled off some by then.

Rocket Jones
11-14-2013, 20:26
Definitely think about another layer of padding under you. CCF is light and cheap. I carry both the polar buff and a regular buff. The polar buff acts as a neck gaiter and hood, and the regular buff goes over it as a beanie and if needed can be pulled down like a balaclava. Layers for the ol' noggin.

slowfeet
11-14-2013, 20:32
pull polypro bottoms down a little and cover feet. or hot water bottle in feet area

pyroman53
11-15-2013, 12:15
Listen to Tipi. I agree. Sleeping on concrete in these temps is an extreme test. Even in summer it will such your heat. You need higher R.
As to using an extra pad...it doesn't add all that much. Maybe 2 points. Probably better underneath. I think Neoair works by reflecting your heat back to you. A pad on top would defeat this effect.

Check out this site:
http://sectionhiker.com/sleeping-pad-r-values/

jdx1177
11-17-2013, 15:41
+1 on a lightweight balaclava or buff, I feel they reduce your tendency to pull your top layer or top quilt up over your face.

MuddyWaters
11-17-2013, 21:25
+1 on a lightweight balaclava or buff, I feel they reduce your tendency to pull your top layer or top quilt up over your face.


or a hoody that serves as that too:

24910

fredmugs
11-20-2013, 10:36
When I know it's going to be cold I bring thick merino wool socks. I never hike in them but they do a great job keeping my feet warm.

Whack-a-mole
11-25-2013, 01:06
I also use a fleece neck gator. Very light weight and helps cut down on the draft a little. You can also pull it up over your chin and ears, or wear it like an ear band. It's not the fix to your problem, but it can be another piece for your puzzle.

Traffic Jam
11-25-2013, 09:38
Check out the "Polar Buff". Basically a buff with fleece on one end. I always bring one of these and a fleece beanie when I'm out with a Quilt.

For the cold feet.. My mom made me some insanely thick socks from alpaca wool. They are awesome but pretty heavy.
I hear PossumDown Socks are also very warm.

In very cold nights a bottle filled with hot water might be a good idea too.

Do you know the weight of the Alpaca yarn used for your socks and what size needles? I have some alpaca and you've given me some ideas.

Things knitted from dog hair is also extremely warm.

GoodGerman
12-02-2013, 09:50
Do you know the weight of the Alpaca yarn used for your socks and what size needles? I have some alpaca and you've given me some ideas.

Things knitted from dog hair is also extremely warm.

Sorry, took me a while to see your post :)

I believe she used "LANA GROSSA" branded Alpaca wool, that was 65% alpaca, 20% merino and 15% polyamid.
Yardage was 70m / 76 yards and weight was 50g / 1,76 oz.
She used size 12 needles even though they recommeded a size 10.

Hope that will help you.

Hat+Socks made from Alpaca wool are just awesome :)