At least we agree liberals suck.
Easy,
just proves that ALL chicks (even old chicks) love a guy in a kilt!
"Wilderness is not a luxury but a necessity of the human spirit"- Ed Abbey
"I realized the post encouraging Cog Moonage would result in several outrgaed replies. I was not disappointed."
Just to clarify, Jack, I am not "outraged." Just simply stating my opinion, as you did. Also, I find it interesting that you would take such delight in attempting to "outrage" people with your opinion. It was my understanding that this forum was to be used as a mean to educate people who might be attempting their first hike, provide first hand experience from past hikers, and discuss some of the more unneccessarily controversial topics about hiking the trail. A question was asked and I answered it. Unlike yourself, (apparently) I wasn't looking to pick a fight.
My point was simply that I wouldn't moon the cog any more than I would moon a grandmother who had driven to the top of Roan Mtn. with her grandchildren in their car, or sneer and moon a couple of nice folks who happened to be at the top of Clingmans' Dome taking in the view. The mountains are for everyone, not only the selct few who have the fortunate ability to be able to walk on their own two feet.
The cog railway was in place on Mt. Washington long before the Appalachain Trail existed, and while I agree that there is no way it would be put about in place today, it is an important artifact that contributes to the history of making the White Mountains what they are today.
Tourist attractions are what they are; they are to ATTRACT TOURISTS, and that has been the goal of Mt. Washington for at least a century and a half. The cog was originally put into place because tourists were seeking a "safer" route to the summit. The Mt. Washington summit has never been the exclusive wilderness,"the backcountry", that you would like it to be, it has been a destination for "tourists" for as long as people have realized you could get up there. There are plenty of other places the mountains where you can enjoy your "pristine wilderness experience"...I don't think it's asking too much to leave at least one or two for the reamining 99% of the population to enjoy.
And just because you can see "more skin in a TV commercial" doesn't make it the right thing to moon the cog railway as unsuspecting young children look on.
And while I don't think what we are discussing is the end-all-be-all of trail controversy, I disagree with you that it is an unimportant point. I live in this state, and I love the mountains here, and expect the visitors (ie: thru-hikers) to my mountains to treat it and more importantly, the people who visit here, with the respect that I would give them. As a thru-hiker, yuo are a guest here. I'm not going to moon the Ober-Gatlinburg tram, ..don't come to my state and moon my railway. Nothing wrong with displaying a little common human decency, and respect for others.
"It's a dangerous business, going out your door...if you don't keep your feet, there's no telling where you might be swept off to."-The Hobbit
<<<<<<I don't think it's asking too much to leave at least one or two for the reamining 99% of the population to enjoy>>
one or two???
clingmans (large parking lot ..paved trail.. flush toilets)
roan ( the top of which is one huge paved parking lot)
mt mitchell(yea I know it 's not on the AT )
washington(top of which is one big mess)
Wayah (well the roadd id dirt and the parking lot small and
the toilet doesn't flush)
the whole blue ridge parkway.....waterrock knob has a huge parking lot
the top of mt pisgah is developed
Brass town bald..the highest point in GA...shuttle buses coke machines..movie theatre
Mt leconte..well there no road but the lodge there has added a HUGE propane tank farm.
<<<I love the mountains here, and expect the visitors (ie: thru-hikers) to my mountains to treat it and more importantly, the people who visit here, with the respect that I would give them.>>
I love mtns too...you expect visitors (ie thruhikers) to treat the more importantly PEOPLE who visit ..thru hikers aren't people???.
<<<I'm not going to moon the Ober-Gatlinburg tram,>>
GREAT IDEA!!!..
<<don't come to my state and moon my railway.>>
oh.... so you own the state and railway...wouldn't want to cut into YOUR profits
I'm with you Jumpstart.
Jack may be right that those on the train always find the whole spectacle simply delightful, but so long as hikers sending thier special semiphore view the riders as fat slobs who should be held in disdain, I say keep the shorts up.
There would need to be a whole lot more love for the mooned to eclipse my reservations regarding the practice.
Rick B
Jumpstart:
After reading both of your posts I see that you disagree with the tradition of Moon the Cog. Not a problem...everyone is entitled to their opinion.
You wrote:
>>"It was my understanding that this forum was to be used as a mean to educate people who might be attempting their first hike"<<<
Yes, that is one of the reasons WHY I posted the thread in the first place. I became very interested in this tradition on another BB and after reading many posts from different backgrounds of people, AT'er who mooned, AT'ers who did not moon, people who had friends that rode the Cog and looked forward to the moons etc. The first I had read heard about it was a few months ago. I thought it was appropriate because I felt that others may not be aware of the tradition, hence my attempt at mentioning it. Baltimore Jack gave a wonderful background of the deed and why it is done which added even more to the thread.
You also wrote:
>>"My point was simply that I wouldn't moon the cog any more than I would moon a grandmother who had driven to the top of Roan Mtn. with her grandchildren in their car""<<
Nothing in life is black and white...sometimes you need to think in terms of "in the spirit in which it was given". This is one of those times. It is my sincere understanding that the riders of the train are NOT the recipients of the moons. It is the Cog itself and what it represents that is the recipient. The riders are given warning and may turn their heads if they want. It is reported that they in fact enjoy it and are disappointed if the moonage does NOT occur. It is reportedly a TOURIST ATTRACTION!
You also wrote:
>>"The cog was originally put into place because tourists were seeking a "safer" route to the summit."<<
I really don't even want to go there. But my guess is that it was put there for someone to "make money".
You also wrote:
>>"I live in this state, and I love the mountains here, and expect the visitors (ie: thru-hikers) to my mountains to treat it and more importantly, the people who visit here, with the respect that I would give them."<<
Well so don't I and I love the mountains also. BTW, they are NOT YOUR mountains...they are EVERYONE'S mountains. (You said "my mountains".) I've hiked in the White Mountains since I was 6 years old and I'm almost 50 and I find it MORE disrespectful to see trash that is discarded from the herds of tourists who are hauled up there with no respect for the mountains than someone expressing themselves towards as Baltimore Jack put it, "an ill placed piece of modern technology". Sorry Jumpstart but as a someone who livesand hikes frequently in this state I invite and encourage anyone who so desires to help perpetuate this wonderful and appropriate TRADITION. I LOOK FORWARD to doing it myself when I get a chance to do my thru-hike.
I am certain that I will not convince you to enjoy or embrace this tradition but I would ask you to let others DECIDE for themselves if they wish to partake in this lighthearded and seemingly fun tradition.
Finally, yes there are MUCH bigger issues to get worked up about. I could fill a page of problems that exist in the backcountry of NH that are much bigger than this and this area is just a small piece of the puzzle. I sure there are even bigger issues elswhere.
Speaking of the idea that this is a long-standing tradition, does anyone have knowlede of when the tradition began? I reviewed my copy Forest and Craig, and found no mention of it. Unfortuanately, I don't have a Rodale set to consult.
There must be some record of the early pioneers of mooning. I wonder if the practice began with thru-hikers, or if they just became the standard bare-ers. When I searched the the extensive ATC web site, I came up short. Not something I like to admit in a thread about dropping trou, but so be it.
I guess my central thesis is that the tradition may not be as long-standing or ingrained in thru-hiking as some suggest. I took note that an earlier poster who has spent many years on the trail simply said that its been around as long as he could remember.
But hey, that could decade, a lifetime or a week.
Rick B
Rick, I think this so-called tradition is only 7 or 8 years old. In the early 90s nobody was doing it. At least it wasn't talked about in trail registers leading up to the Whites. I think thru-hiker types did start it cuz they think of themselves as real "environmentalists" and in tune with the woods. The cog is SO offensive. But if one of thier tree huggin asses needed a quick way down in an emergency and the auto road was closed, they'd be on it.
every tradition began somewhere...every hike begins with putting your boots on ....
I am shocked
I truly thought everyone mooned the train. I have mooned it every time through. As for children seeing it I know of two families who took the train just to see some moons. One was my Doctor who brought his three young teenage daughters to see how they would react. He was upset because the train staff warned them at the bottom. The train staff do try to chuck coal at the moons but just for fun not to hurt anyone. It's a big joke to everyone on both sides. I am truly in shock that this was taken soooo seriously.
I love this site
You people are wonderful. This time of the year I'm usually massively depressed. I have tried to run for the last two days and below Zero winds have driven me back. I'm reading a book a night. If it was not for this site i would be climing the walls with cabin fever and Trail Withdrawl. This "discussion" (which by the way you are all banned from Trialplace for life(don't start)), has made me feel like I'm back on the Trail reading one of the more amusing journals. Thankyouthankyouthankyou all of you, and Lone Wolf how can you of all people, the only member more offensive than me, be against mooning. I'm sorry but you're sounding more Liberal every day.
You guys are all crazy. Just put one foot in front of the other and smile.
I'm too sexy for my ass, Blue Jay. Your mama is a liberal.
Is seeing a bare arse really such a shocking moment for people that it might scar them for life? I suppose there are some out there whose vertical smile is particularly revolting, but this (un)fortunate group is probably very small. Besides, mooning seems to be a world wide phenomenon. I was mooned repeatedly in Nepal by little children. I thought it was rather funny and they giggled as I rained rocks down upon them.
Originally Posted by Bandana Man
With luck, you're right.
Sloetoe
(who mooned 'em in '79,
and who just missed, with his 9 year old twins,
mooning 'em again in '02)
I had a great reason why I couldn't moon the cog this year. I left out of the Lakes Hut very early on July 4th and got to the summit by 7:00am. It was sunny, 60º, dead calm winds, decent visibility, AND I was totally ALONE walking around the summit on JULY 4th! Anyway, it was too early for the cog to be running and I wanted to keep going to keep enjoying having the Presidentials to myself for as long as possible. I walked for over two hours in the Presis on July 4th without seeing another soul.
(btw, my name has nothing to do with the practice of topic. Moon is my last name:-)
Enough about the freakin' children. THEY DON'T CARE! Adults are the ones who are horrified and complain of being scarred for life by briefly seeing somone's back end.
Yeah, that's a responsible adult. Teach a child to act like a little victim every time something happens that they don't like.
Using Dharma logic let's all go to our local elementary school and moon kids on the playground.
No, that's L. Wolf's logic. I cannot take credit for it.
You missed my point completely.
Nothing new there, Dharma. Its true, if it wasn't for the adults, children would be running around nekkid all the time. Kids just are not moddest, and most of them would find a "mooning" to be quite funny.
Not to mention, mooning is just funny. Hell, at Thanksgiving this year, my cousin and I mooned our grandmother and aunt as they were driving away. No, I don't know what caused that, it was was funny... on all sides. Good times.
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