trail idiots

[brancher]

...The thing about carrying a gun is, are you prepared TO SHOOT SOMEONE? Because that's what a gun is for, and having one on your person is---IMO---inviting that scenario. I think there are circumstances where it is warranted, but the thought of shooting someone and actually firing that weapon into another human being are two completely different things.

I also have a CC permit and have been thru training - including IDPA training. You are right on point. 'ARE YOU PREPARED', not only to pull the trigger, but also manage the automatic manslaughter investigation the WILL happen afterward, not to mention the psychological stuff. After all the legal and liability issues, as well as the training, I just have to question the motives of an open carrier.

Man, let's talk about something else. Otherwise I will have to find another 2 lbs in my pack.....

[Another Kevin]

Let's see, I think I set a record for myself sleeping in a shelter five times in the past year. I dislike shelters, and finding one occupied is almost always enough to make me hike on.

But one night last year, there was a hellacious thunderstorm and only three other hikers in the shelter, who invited me in and even offered me a treat or two. I repaid their kindness by letting them share my bag hang - which took care of my major worry, that they were sleeping with their food in a place where I know there's a problem bear. There were no problem with vermin of the human variety, but the place smelt like a hamster cage. There were widowmakers crashing down in the woods all night long, and wind and lightning and hail, so "any port in a storm." My two hiking partners were hammocking, and one of them had his tarp shredded by either the wind or wind-borne debris. He wound up "going to ground" and sleeping with the group in the shelter. The place smelt like a hamster cage, but I didn't bring any food into it, and any port in a storm!

Three of the nights (Ouluska Pass, Rodney Point #2, and Mud Lake shelters on the Northville-Placid Trail), I had the place to myself. Each time, I arrived close to or after dark on a cold and rainy evening to find that I had the place to myself, and decided to just eat dinner, hang my bearbag and turn in. It was very much "shoulder season" (mid-late October) and there was sleet at least one night. No encounters with vermin of either the two- or four-legged varieties.

At Ouluska, there was a ford half a mile down trail (the bridge is out at Seward Brook), and didn't want to chance it until morning. I stayed at Rodney Point because I'd seen a mouse at Plumley's Landing and decided not to camp there. It's only another mile and a half between them. I saw a fisher, or possibly an unusually large marten, hunting on the shore of Mud Lake, which probably accounts for the lack of mice at that shelter.

The fifth shelter night was at the Big Hill shelter on the NY Long Path. I was one of a party of four, two hammockers and two ground dwellers. I set up in the shelter out of laziness and to hang out with the other guy. He decamped in the night (a problem with his bivy, from what I understand). It wasn't cold that night: it was damned cold that night. I had no problems with mice, but woke up to a raccoon dragging my pack away! (There was no food in it - but raccoons have learnt that backpacks contain food.) And in the morning, I was quite aware that I'd have been warmer in my tent. It was about -3F out, according to the snivel meter on my zipper pull.

So, five nights in shelters, one fistfight with the local wildlife, one annoying odor from the local wildlife, and one shelter passed because of the local wildlife. On the other hand, at Rodney, it was full dark when I arrived. I heard water lapping, but didn't see any view. Then in the morning, I woke up to this astonishing view,


Rodney Point by ke9tv, on Flickr

which I'd have missed entirely if I hadn't hiked the quarter-mile to the shelter.

So, five nights in shelters: four good nights' sleep. One fight with the local wildlife (plus a bad smell and a shelter skipped) and one superb view I'd have missed without the shelter detour. Only one night with sheltermates who weren't in my group. They were congenial enough. All in all, not a bad deal, but I'd still mostly rather tent.

[Sarcasm the elf]

This thread reminds me of a story I read a while back:

“…I would always remind her of the story of the couple that was moving into a new city. They stopped at a gas station just outside the city to ask for directions (must have been the wife who wanted to stop because men do not usually stop until they know they are lost.” Once she received the directions she asked the gentleman who happened to be the owner what was the new city like. He answered with a question? “What was it like where you lived before?” Her answer was, “Everyone was so rude. The neighbors were loud. It was a very unfriendly town. I couldn’t make any new friends. The school where my kids attended was horrible; my kids were not learning anything.” His answer to her was, “That’s pretty much the way it is here ma’am.”
They went off on their way. Shortly after that another couple pulled up in a moving van. They were just moving into town and stopped to get gas. They were friendly and engaging. While they were buying sodas and snack for their kids, the mom asked the gentleman behind the counter, who once again happened to be the owner, “What’s this community like?” And he answered once again with a question. “What was it like where you are coming from?” She responded, “We just loved it. Everyone was so friendly. We got to know our neighbors and they helped us get settled in. My kids loved the school and the teachers were concerned about how they were doing. My husband was transferred, if not, we would still be there.” The gentleman looked at her and said, “Ma’am you’ll find this city much like your last.”…

- Robert Mano

[atraildreamer]

[QUOTE=Old Hiker;1956693]

I chased it down to get the exact quote and found there is no consensus about who said it, although it’s attributed to Mr. Burke.

I know. So did I. I used it because it it had a nice graphic!

[MuddyWaters]

Shelters, per the ATC, are specifically NOT for groups travelling together. That group could be scouts, youth groups, wounded warriors, or thru hikers. Somehow thru hikers think this doesnt apply to them.

Any confrontation will not result in anything good. You wont sleep well. Best to just move along.

Experienced hikers wont unpack their gear untill they see who else shows up.

[Traveler]

This thread reminds me of a story I read a while back:

“…I would always remind her of the story of the couple that was moving into a new city. They stopped at a gas station just outside the city to ask for directions (must have been the wife who wanted to stop because men do not usually stop until they know they are lost.” Once she received the directions she asked the gentleman who happened to be the owner what was the new city like. He answered with a question? “What was it like where you lived before?” Her answer was, “Everyone was so rude. The neighbors were loud. It was a very unfriendly town. I couldn’t make any new friends. The school where my kids attended was horrible; my kids were not learning anything.” His answer to her was, “That’s pretty much the way it is here ma’am.”
They went off on their way. Shortly after that another couple pulled up in a moving van. They were just moving into town and stopped to get gas. They were friendly and engaging. While they were buying sodas and snack for their kids, the mom asked the gentleman behind the counter, who once again happened to be the owner, “What’s this community like?” And he answered once again with a question. “What was it like where you are coming from?” She responded, “We just loved it. Everyone was so friendly. We got to know our neighbors and they helped us get settled in. My kids loved the school and the teachers were concerned about how they were doing. My husband was transferred, if not, we would still be there.” The gentleman looked at her and said, “Ma’am you’ll find this city much like your last.”…

- Robert Mano

If you liked that story, you would like a lot of the other Aesop's Fables that was taken from. Lots of wisdom about the human condition from the 6th century BCE.

[Fredt4]

As someone who CC in the years past, and a regular hunter I'm not disturbed when I see a weapon and it's being handled properly, whether it's worn by a LEO or non LEO. If the person is acting inappropriately I'll move on, rarely hare I confronted someone. Choosing one's battles is wise. Many times I suspected someone was CC by the nature of their job or so other clue. I suspect many more were CC but they never revealed such. Basically avoiding shelters is a good policy but sometimes they're nice during a storm. If the possibility of someone having a weapon disturbes you perhaps the outdoors is not right for you, as there's many who do CC.

[timeless_man]

Has anyone heard anything about Geraldine Largay aka Inchworm , who disappeared in 2013?

[Rain Man]

If the possibility of someone having a weapon disturbes you perhaps the outdoors is not right for you, as there's many who do CC.

You've got it backwards. If you think you need a weapon to hike the AT, perhaps the out-of-doors is not for you.

[Kevin108]

Do you carry more than one way to purify water or start a fire? For most that carry a gun, it's for the same reason: just in case you should need it.

[BirdBrain]

The internet is the only place I ever see a debate about conceal carry. I have a permit. I carry.... sometimes. Never have I discussed it in person while carrying. Never have I shown anyone that I was carrying. It kinda defeats the purpose of concealment to do otherwise. Why is it concealed in the first place if it is advertised?

Not coming after anyone. I don't have strong feelings on the subject other than the freedom to chose and safety of all. I just find the conversation curious.

[Fredt4]

You've got it backwards. If you think you need a weapon to hike the AT, perhaps the out-of-doors is not for you.

I don't think I need a weapon and I didn't carry one on my thru-hike. However I'm not green enough to believe others don't. I can and do regularly identify others than do carry. Just saying.

[squeezebox]

I just don't want to get shot for accidently knocking over someones stove or such.

[Doctari]

MY story (2000 or so): at one of the double springs shelter (or twin springs or two springs or ????) It had been raining maybe 16 hours, well less than 24 hours. Got to the shelter, said "HI" to the lone occupant. His response was "I've been here 3 days cause I don't hike in the rain!" No, he did not say hi or any other pleasantry. I said "allrighty then" & left. It had not rained for at least 4 days, weather forecast had said no rain for at least 3 days.
Story I heard this year: "We were in the Smokies, got to whatever shelter it was & there was a dad & 3 kids. Dad said: I have reserved this shelter, you can't stay here!!!!! This was a 12 person shelter! The 3 of us tried to explain to him that he had only reserved 4 SPOTS in the shelter not the whole shelter, & surely not for just $20.00 for an OBVIOUSLY 12 person shelter." Said the story teller, after a few minutes dad & kids left.
As Ron White says: You can't fix stupid!

[Sarcasm the elf]

The folks who burned away part of this shelter were idiots, I'll give them that. Usually I meet very few idiots on the trail, all the exercise and walking usually weed them out.

IMG_2744.jpg

[thecyclops]

Just work up a number 6 on them...

[Just Tom]

What do they do? As a BSA leader who is about to take our troop on a backpacking trip, I'd like to know what we can do to make sure we don't bother others.

Our troop just did a section here in CT, and I defy anyone to find anything to complain about with their behavior or adherence to LnT. We even supplied filtered water to several thru hikers that stopped by just for the water source. I

[Sarcasm the elf]

Our troop just did a section here in CT, and I defy anyone to find anything to complain about with their behavior or adherence to LnT. We even supplied filtered water to several thru hikers that stopped by just for the water source. I

Any chance your troop stayed at Belter's campsite on or around April 18th?

[Just Tom]

No, we stayed just this weekend at Pine Swamp, the first visit of the year for us to the AT.

[Sarcasm the elf]

No, we stayed just this weekend at Pine Swamp, the first visit of the year for us to the AT.

Cool, I met an excellent troop of scouts when I was at Belters, just thought it might have been you guys. Either way You have my thanks for getting those kids on the trail.