Hawk Mountain Shelter On Georgia AT To Be Torn Down

[NewHeart]

So, I'm a Newbie NOBO leaving late April, will Hawk Mtn. be open? Is there a better place to hang?

[WingedMonkey]

So, I'm a Newbie NOBO leaving late April, will Hawk Mtn. be open? Is there a better place to hang?

You're in a National Forest.

Dispersed camping is allowed almost anywhere if you follow the guidelines.

Dispersed crapping is also allowed, did a hole.

All these ridge runners and caretakers should be teaching hikers how to get off the trail and into the woods to camp and crap.

[TexasBob]

............................All these ridge runners and caretakers should be teaching hikers how to get off the trail and into the woods to camp and crap.

"Hey John, what did you do this summer?"
"Well Fred, I was a camp and crap coach on the Appalachian Trail"
"Uhh John, leave that off your resume."

[WingedMonkey]

"Hey John, what did you do this summer?"
"Well Fred, I was a camp and crap coach on the Appalachian Trail"
"Uhh John, leave that off your resume."

I come from a long line of poachers, moonshiners, and hunters.

Leave no trace was taught as a way of not getting caught.

It amazes me how many wanna be thru-hikers don't know how to walk off into the woods off the trail (where it is allowed) and not leave a trace.

It amazes me even more that is is worse 20 years after my own first thru-hike.

Yes if the GATC is going to man the trail 24 hours a day during the "bubble" they need to tech how to camp and crap off the trail.

It anyone at the Forrest Service or ATC thinks all of this new crop of hikers in Georgia is going to hike an extra 3/4 of a mile to tent or crap (mile and half round trip) they need to get out more. Most won't 3/4 mile to get a pizza if they can call it in.

[NewHeart]

I come from a long line of poachers, moonshiners, and hunters.

Leave no trace was taught as a way of not getting caught.

It amazes me how many wanna be thru-hikers don't know how to walk off into the woods off the trail (where it is allowed) and not leave a trace.

It amazes me even more that is is worse 20 years after my own first thru-hike.

Yes if the GATC is going to man the trail 24 hours a day during the "bubble" they need to tech how to camp and crap off the trail.

It anyone at the Forrest Service or ATC thinks all of this new crop of hikers in Georgia is going to hike an extra 3/4 of a mile to tent or crap (mile and half round trip) they need to get out more. Most won't 3/4 mile to get a pizza if they can call it in.

I too am quite at home in the woods. I spent 40+ years hiking, camping, and hunting in the woods of Wisc. and Minn. I know how to get off the trail, but that said, I am a first timer on the AT and didn't know what the rules were as to that. I heard stealth camping was frowned upon and one need to camp at designated spots. So I asked, better safe then sorry.

[WingedMonkey]

I too am quite at home in the woods. I spent 40+ years hiking, camping, and hunting in the woods of Wisc. and Minn. I know how to get off the trail, but that said, I am a first timer on the AT and didn't know what the rules were as to that. I heard stealth camping was frowned upon and one need to camp at designated spots. So I asked, better safe then sorry.

Didn't mean to imply that you are afraid of the woods, my first reply was an answer to what if the shelter is closed.

You won't have a problem finding an animal trail or old fire break or abandoned woods road to get off and camp/hang.

On National Forests the rules are much kinder than else where, and it's not necessary to break any laws to "stealth camp"

The rant was about the folks that need to be taught that it's OK, and the GATC should be encouraging more of it.

[WingedMonkey]

Chattahoochee-Oconee National Forests

Dispersed (primitive) camping—Dispersed camping is available in multiple locations throughout the forest, and is intended to provide a rustic, less manicured and natural experience. Whether you decide to camp within a Congressionally-designated Wilderness or the general forest area, we ask that you follow the principles of Leave No Trace. By leaving no trace you are reducing your impact to the natural environment and preserving the quality of experience for future visitors. Basic Leave No Trace principles include the following:

• Secure all food and keep safe from bears.
• Do not feed wild animals.
• Do not leave campfires unattended.
• Be sure to completely put out any campfire before leaving your site unattended.

[1234]

Remember Hawk Mt shelter is day 1 or day 2 for the majority of thru hikers. From my own experience bubble season is 50% spring breakers or curious folks watching the thru's start. They all look at a guide book and set there goal for the day to be Hawk Mt shelter. Only when they get there it looks like a campground, tents everywhere. So, being normal they follow the crowd, and find a bald spot and set up there tent. After years of use and during bubble season the area all around Hawk shelter has become bald, a series of dirt spots all over. It is these dirt spots that are the objection. The leave no trace is to not camp in a dirt spot. Think newbys, where to camp, day 1 and 2 and the first week the places are limited, LOOK IN THE guide books, where does it say if Hawk is full go 300 yds turn left at low spot and walk 150 yards to a spring and camp spot. It doesn't, Most folks are just following the guide book that exist. Yes every flat spot in Georgia has a camp spot with a big rock fire ring, and folks continue to camp in these spots. What is the solution to 100 people starting on the same day? The campground trail is 3/4 of a mile long WITH Campsites ALL along the way, not just at the end. This is an entirely new approach to solving a over use issue. Will it work? If it is in the guide books it has a chance. The AT is not to be a series of campsites ON THE trail, but off the trail. The leave no trace part of this it the flat ground under a tent that gets over used creating bald spots.

[hikehunter]

Many hiker drop out at Neel Gap.....then more @ Hiawassee.
The closer a shelter is to a road the trashyer they tend to be.....all those weekend party warriors. I have see it on other trails. I think the litter laws need to be enforced and the Judge needs to hit them with the max. fine. It starts to happen a bit and the word will get out

"pick up your trash, if you get busted you will be poorer for it, the cops and rangers come by here all the time"

If you start to here that and see stories in the news it could do some good. Maybe Here is hoping.

[JaketheFake]

I come from a long line of poachers, moonshiners, and hunters.

Leave no trace was taught as a way of not getting caught.

It amazes me how many wanna be thru-hikers don't know how to walk off into the woods off the trail (where it is allowed) and not leave a trace.

It amazes me even more that is is worse 20 years after my own first thru-hike.

Yes if the GATC is going to man the trail 24 hours a day during the "bubble" they need to tech how to camp and crap off the trail.

It anyone at the Forrest Service or ATC thinks all of this new crop of hikers in Georgia is going to hike an extra 3/4 of a mile to tent or crap (mile and half round trip) they need to get out more. Most won't 3/4 mile to get a pizza if they can call it in.

What amazes me is that you would start your post by attempting to build credibility by stating your lineage consists of a bunch of scoundrels? But at least you made the distinction between poacher and hunters.

[Gambit McCrae]

Many hiker drop out at Neel Gap.....then more @ Hiawassee.
The closer a shelter is to a road the trashyer they tend to be.....all those weekend party warriors. I have see it on other trails. I think the litter laws need to be enforced and the Judge needs to hit them with the max. fine. It starts to happen a bit and the word will get out

"pick up your trash, if you get busted you will be poorer for it, the cops and rangers come by here all the time"

If you start to here that and see stories in the news it could do some good. Maybe Here is hoping.

I can see head lines now! "Broke Hiker gets fined for throwing spam can in fire pit by police stakeout on the Appalachian Trail"....I don't think so lol

[MuddyWaters]

Remember Hawk Mt shelter is day 1 or day 2 for the majority of thru hikers. From my own experience bubble season is 50% spring breakers or curious folks watching the thru's start. They all look at a guide book and set there goal for the day to be Hawk Mt shelter. Only when they get there it looks like a campground, tents everywhere. So, being normal they follow the crowd, and find a bald spot and set up there tent. After years of use and during bubble season the area all around Hawk shelter has become bald, a series of dirt spots all over. It is these dirt spots that are the objection. The leave no trace is to not camp in a dirt spot. Think newbys, where to camp, day 1 and 2 and the first week the places are limited, LOOK IN THE guide books, where does it say if Hawk is full go 300 yds turn left at low spot and walk 150 yards to a spring and camp spot. It doesn't, Most folks are just following the guide book that exist. Yes every flat spot in Georgia has a camp spot with a big rock fire ring, and folks continue to camp in these spots. What is the solution to 100 people starting on the same day? The campground trail is 3/4 of a mile long WITH Campsites ALL along the way, not just at the end. This is an entirely new approach to solving a over use issue. Will it work? If it is in the guide books it has a chance. The AT is not to be a series of campsites ON THE trail, but off the trail. The leave no trace part of this it the flat ground under a tent that gets over used creating bald spots.

Neither shelters nor tent pads or established campsites are LNT. They are concentrated impact, sacrificed areas which protect others areas from use. LNT doesnt apply to these areas.

Heres what matters, unless it has the only water around, or pizza, few will walk 0.5 miles off trail for a campsite when they can camp just off trail. 0.5 is for the most part the upper limit that people will go off trail for a shelter as well. If they move the shelter, new site will be successful, if they dont, I doubt it.

[WingedMonkey]

What amazes me is that you would start your post by attempting to build credibility by stating your lineage consists of a bunch of scoundrels? But at least you made the distinction between poacher and hunters.

I know my lineage back to the Revolution (or before).

A lot of lawyers and preachers and politicians and other scoundrels mixed in with the bunch.

Not all hunters are poachers, never met a poacher that didn't call himself a hunter.

[bemental]

Guthooks's app has the HMS campsite as opening for the 2016 season, and as such has placed the on the map.

Found that interesting.

[George]

I think the litter laws need to be enforced and the Judge needs to hit them with the max. fine. It starts to happen a bit and the word will get out

"pick up your trash, if you get busted you will be poorer for it, the cops and rangers come by here all the time"

If you start to here that and see stories in the news it could do some good.

what kind of a bleeding heart liberal are you? - why are you so soft on these hardened criminals ?

- this obviously needs marshal law and summary executions - photos/ news stories of the beheadings, impalements, and hangings, would be a good beginning

[FatMan]

I was talking to one of the GATC coordinators today and here's the scoop. Hawk Mtn shelter will remain open this season. They have hired two additional ridge runners and one will be stationed at Hawk Mtn shelter. Once the shelter area is full the ridge runner will move to the trail junction for the new tent pads and direct hikers to the new sites.

The other ridge runner will be stationed at Black Gap shelter on the approach trail. With trail runners at these two shelters plus the traditionally located ridge runner at Springer it gives the GATC good coverage early on in providing LNT guidance to the herd.

[FatMan]

oops. "trail runners" = "ridge runners" above

[shelb]

. It enables rotten hikers to continue on a higher mental note and is a trash magnet/ bear magnet. I hiked GA sobo last year during the spring and was disgusted at the amount of not only trash, but gear as well. Thermorests, dry bags, stoves and canisters.
.

This is so sad! Hikers really need to be trained in LNT.
Trail Maintainers - and Hikers who know about LNT - thank you for your work to clean up and educate these children of the trail.

[Venchka]

This is so sad! Hikers really need to be trained in LNT.
Trail Maintainers - and Hikers who know about LNT - thank you for your work to clean up and educate these children of the trail.

Seems to me that many of them are barely potty trained. Training? LNT? Right Sure.

Wayne


Sent from somewhere around here.

[MuddyWaters]

Seems to me that many of them are barely potty trained. Training? LNT? Right Sure.

Wayne


Sent from somewhere around here.

That is the function of the Ridge Runners, to inform hikers how to be LNT, in a friendly supportive and non-confrontational manner.

Do it work?

Well, NC is cleaner than GA, so maybe. A little.

To hell with LNT, staying at a shelter has nothing to do with LNT. Just pack out your fricking trash, dont leave crap behind, and dont write on things with a $%^&*# sharpie.