Nutrition mistakes I'm seeing on the trail

[Connie]

I would not carry bacon grease in bear country. I am interested for ordinary camping. In what ambient temperatures does bacon grease keep? How do you carry it?

I am interested in coconut oil. How do you use it?

I am interested in what the statin-users are saying about fat. I have a low-salt low-fat medical diet order, not statins, because I find if I am active my body self-regulates body weight and I seem to get good LDL's from my food choices. I do not concetn myself so much about the medical diet order when I am out hiking in the mountains. I do not have the saltiest food choices, but a small lunch box size Fritos or small Planter's mixed peanuts goes well.

I have the impression special diets are for living indoors and a more sedentary lifestyle. Really.

My body seems to know how to regulate and manage everything well when I am leading an active life outdoors.

I was just told no-milk no-wheat. I will find out how I will do that. I like barley, oats, quinoa, rice and and spelt. I will have to find out if spelt avoids what I cannot have for wheat, or leave that out. I may be able to have aged-cheese, or is it no milk or milk products entirely. I will have to find out.

It looks like I will have to do more food prep for the hike.

In general, I was told fats solid at room temperature are harmful. Now, I see recommended use of coconut oil and it looks solid in the jar at the store kept at room temperature. How is coconut oil used, while hiking?

I would think it would make good home-recipe "energy bars".

[Maydog]

My simvastatin experience: I've been on simvastatin for about a decade now. Had open heart surgery 8 years ago. Maybe 5-6 years ago, I was reading my wife's Pharmacy newsletter. (She's a pharmacist and this helps her stay abreast of changes and updates.) In the newsletter, they published a report that showed that most statin users could reduce their statin dosage by 50% and still get 80-90% of the cholesterol reduction compared to a full dose. So I started cutting my simvastatin in half and after several months I had my bloodwork done and all my cholesterol (LDL, HDL, total) and triglyceride levels were still in the safe range. My cardiologist was happy, and so was I. After a few more months, I decided to try cutting my dosage by half again, which put me at 25% of my originally-prescribed dosage. Again, when I went back for a checkup, all my cholesterol and triglyceride levels were still in the safe range. Cardiologist was happy, I'm happy. Not crazy about taking statins anyway, but if I can take 25% of the recommended dosage and get satisfactory results, I'm all in.

[colorado_rob]

Studies have shown that the type of instant Ramen noodles most hikers eat are terrible for your health. They may not contain any cholesterol, but they appear to be devastating for your cardiovascular health. A 'tasty little death.'

https://foodrevolution.org/blog/food...ramen-noodles/

"Study". not "Studies", and if you read it, not so bad, really, and seems to affect only women if I read it right?

Anyway, good post, good info from some folks. I do carry fairly high-fat foods, mostly nut-based though, and consume those foods in the evenings and mornings. Along the trail, it's all carbs and sugars, that's what burns efficiently while actively hiking. Another data point: I eat in the low 3000's calories per day on the trail, much more on town stops, and I don't lose weight. 180 pound, 6'1" male. I just don't get the 5000/day thing, and in fact, I think those types of numbers are inaccurate except for somewhat heavier folks.

[MuddyWaters]

Depends on how much one hikes. I have no doubt I burn 4500-5000 cal per day doing 20 mile days in strenuous terrain. Someone doing low miles or easy flat walking would no doubt burn much less.

Your likely going to burn 100-300 cal/hr with walking excercise. So how many hrs and how intense makes difference of 1000 cal/day or more.

155-160 lb, fit, low bodyfat, I lose 1-2 lb per week eating 3000-3500 cal/day and pigging out in town. I like to hike 18-25 mile days, rarely less than 16 or so if theres daylight.

[greenmtnboy]

There may be a few cases where statins are needed at least short term but personally I am pretty disgusted how doctors put people on various meds. especially when they aren't really necessary with all the alternatives.

https://www.lewrockwell.com/2015/06/...r-harming-you/
com
http://articles.mercola.com/sites/ar...e-statins.aspx
http://statins.mercola.com/

[JC13]

All of this information makes me curious now. I am 6'1" 190lbs, 7.3% BF on my last skinfold. I maintain currently on 3875 cal with a 39% carb/37% fat/24% protein breakdown. Working on figuring out how many calories I need to carry for a 8-10 AT section in July. We will be most likely moving at 2 mph, possibly up to 10 hrs a day depending on how it all shakes out. Springer to wherever we end up.

[rafe]

We will be most likely moving at 2 mph, possibly up to 10 hrs a day depending on how it all shakes out. Springer to wherever we end up.

I can believe 20 miles with a pack, on typical AT terrain will burn 5K calories. But most thru hikers do not sustain 20 miles per day.

[Malto]

All of this information makes me curious now. I am 6'1" 190lbs, 7.3% BF on my last skinfold. I maintain currently on 3875 cal with a 39% carb/37% fat/24% protein breakdown. Working on figuring out how many calories I need to carry for a 8-10 AT section in July. We will be most likely moving at 2 mph, possibly up to 10 hrs a day depending on how it all shakes out. Springer to wherever we end up.

My rough rule of thumb..... 1 calorie per mile per lb of weight. In your case use 210 for weight (pack) and 20 mpd would give you about 4200 calories.

[JC13]

I can believe 20 miles with a pack, on typical AT terrain will burn 5K calories. But most thru hikers do not sustain 20 miles per day.

I agree that most don't/won't maintain 20 mpd. I have been using a wrist fitness tracker to log steps but I have found that it reads poorly when I use trekking poles. GPS data from an 17.4mi hike last week clocked 5148 calories burned over 8:39 including stops. Pace was 29.48 min/mile.

My rough rule of thumb..... 1 calorie per mile per lb of weight. In your case use 210 for weight (pack) and 20 mpd would give you about 4200 calories.

Gotcha, Ppck is looking like it will be 30 lbs with food so 4400 will be the target. Looks like I need to find a source for those 500 calorie honey buns. One of those added to the current meal plan would put me at 4450 calories.

Thank you both for the input!

[MuddyWaters]

There may be a few cases where statins are needed at least short term but personally I am pretty disgusted how doctors put people on various meds. especially when they aren't really necessary with all the alternatives.

https://www.lewrockwell.com/2015/06/...r-harming-you/
com
http://articles.mercola.com/sites/ar...e-statins.aspx
http://statins.mercola.com/

Heres the truth:

People are lazy idiots and gluttons.

When a dr says eat better, exercise. Lose wt, most do minimal if any of that. For a dr to be able to help weak minded people, only thing he can do is give them drugs. And thats the vast majority of population. If he doesnt do that, they wont come back.

Medication should be last resort, not first, for sure.

[SGTJones]

All of this information makes me curious now. I am 6'1" 190lbs, 7.3% BF on my last skinfold. I maintain currently on 3875 cal with a 39% carb/37% fat/24% protein breakdown. Working on figuring out how many calories I need to carry for a 8-10 AT section in July. We will be most likely moving at 2 mph, possibly up to 10 hrs a day depending on how it all shakes out. Springer to wherever we end up.

Hey your stats are similar to mine. When I left I was 197lbs 14% bf, at 6'1".

I'm aiming for 5k/day out here, don't always hit it but I get fairly close. Have not really tracked macros but I know I'm getting at least 80g protein and roughly 300-400g carbs day with the rest coming from fat. That has allowed me to maintain most of my muscle mass and keep my energy up. Last week I averaged 16 miles/day with a 45lb pack and calculated that to burn roughly 4500-5k cals.

Main indicator hat I'm eating enough is the fact I'm not super hungry even when I get to a town. 8-10 days or 8-10 weeks? If it's 8-10 days you really should t worry you'll drop probably 2-3lbs of body fat and any muscle loss will be negligible and come right back when yiu get back to civilization.

Edit: also I wouldn't try to maintain a low body fat on the trail. You'll need lots of carbs to refill glycogen. Don't be afraid to eat sugar out here it really does help keep you going through the day.

[JC13]

Hey your stats are similar to mine. When I left I was 197lbs 14% bf, at 6'1".

I'm aiming for 5k/day out here, don't always hit it but I get fairly close. Have not really tracked macros but I know I'm getting at least 80g protein and roughly 300-400g carbs day with the rest coming from fat. That has allowed me to maintain most of my muscle mass and keep my energy up. Last week I averaged 16 miles/day with a 45lb pack and calculated that to burn roughly 4500-5k cals.

Main indicator hat I'm eating enough is the fact I'm not super hungry even when I get to a town. 8-10 days or 8-10 weeks? If it's 8-10 days you really should t worry you'll drop probably 2-3lbs of body fat and any muscle loss will be negligible and come right back when yiu get back to civilization.

Edit: also I wouldn't try to maintain a low body fat on the trail. You'll need lots of carbs to refill glycogen. Don't be afraid to eat sugar out here it really does help keep you going through the day.

8-10 days, I wish I had 8-10 weeks! Not too worried about muscle loss, just trying to figure out a decent goal for intake. I generally avoid sugar if I can, it makes me crave it pretty bad. Trying to maximize my nutritional bang for the buck against weight carried.

I think another portion of the "hiker hunger" is that lack of nutritional variation most hikers ingest. There have been multiple insightful posts on here that lead me to the conclusion that it is better to carry a bit more food weight to get what you will eat and enjoy than trying to go UL at the expense of nutrition.

Before adding the 500 calorie honey bun, sitting at 3950 cal with 417g carbs/180g fat/190g protein. Definitely looking to add more carbs, going no cook so that adds a little to the challenge.

[CalebJ]

8-10 days, I wish I had 8-10 weeks! Not too worried about muscle loss, just trying to figure out a decent goal for intake. I generally avoid sugar if I can, it makes me crave it pretty bad. Trying to maximize my nutritional bang for the buck against weight carried.

I think another portion of the "hiker hunger" is that lack of nutritional variation most hikers ingest. There have been multiple insightful posts on here that lead me to the conclusion that it is better to carry a bit more food weight to get what you will eat and enjoy than trying to go UL at the expense of nutrition.

Before adding the 500 calorie honey bun, sitting at 3950 cal with 417g carbs/180g fat/190g protein. Definitely looking to add more carbs, going no cook so that adds a little to the challenge.

What about liquid carbs? A liter of water mixed with 2/3 cup of maltodextrin gives you 250 calories, 63g of carbohydrates, and only 2 g of sugars. Much slower energy burn than the pure sugar honey bun. Perfect for a no cook meal plan.

[Connie]

The calories/ounce and nutritional value/gram is how light weight and low volume in the backpack is achieved.

These discussion threads have hikers making that goal at 1.5 to 2 lbs food per day (not me, I am at 2.5 lbs food per day because I carry a compliment of fresh food so I like a roll-top backpack that can give me more volume inside the pack leaving re-supply) but that 1.5 to 2 lbs per day food weight carried is achieved by thru-hikers.

I am a section hiker.

My goal is healthy activity outdoors in a nature-made environment, not the end of a long trail in one season.

I have a calories/ounce food items to include list: sweets are way down the list.

Nutritional value/gram food items to include will make a more interesting list, as far as I am concerned.

I wish I had that list ready..

[Greenlight]

He's right. Doctors are finally admitting they've been feeding us a line of B.S. for the past 50 years. Fat does not make you fat. Empty carbs, sugar, and highly processed foods are what has been killing us. Want to eat a healthy diet? Mostly salad and as wide a variety of both raw and cooked veggies as you can get, beans, fungi ('shrooms), onions, nuts, berries, seeds, and about 4 ounces of meat per day. If you're sedentary, watch the salt intake. And yes, animal fats are fine. Be more worried about all the hormones and antibiotics they're putting in your meat if you have a local supplier of grass fed beef or bison, chickens, pigs, ect...make sure they're only giving them antibiotics if they get sick, and no growth hormones.

As I have said before, I dehydrate greens (collard, mustard, turnip, spinach, etc) scrunch them up and pack them in a gallon zip lock baggie and take them on my hikes. You can add them to anything you're putting water in, just add a bit more water and you have all the greens you can stand every day!

Hey, I like butter. But if I'm gonna eat a plate of pasta, or butter my toast - I'm not gonna use a whole stick!
And , regarding that link - well, there's lots of less than accurate stuff posted out there on tge internet. I bet it wouldn't be hard to find reputable folks who have posted opposing views..

[JC13]

What about liquid carbs? A liter of water mixed with 2/3 cup of maltodextrin gives you 250 calories, 63g of carbohydrates, and only 2 g of sugars. Much slower energy burn than the pure sugar honey bun. Perfect for a no cook meal plan.

Might be a good option, would have to use water bottles though. I could mix it in the blender bottle I am bringing for my shakes and refill it from my bladder.

I guess I didn't even think about doing gatorade or some similar type of electrolytes. Bottle of course required there as well.

[Connie]

I like Champion Nutrition Cytomax sticks for electrolytes, with the added benefit of preventing lactic acid buildup if I have to push for any reason.


Greenlight,

Here, in this forum, there was a discussion about glycemic index.

I read it is the glycemic index of food items or food products that causes weight gain, and the food items and food products that have a high glycemic index are a surprise.

I have also read about crisping cut up kale in the oven.

What kind of temperature and drying time for those leafy vegetables?

[Tipi Walter]

Heres the truth:

People are lazy idiots and gluttons.

I really like the way your mind thinks.

As I have said before, I dehydrate greens (collard, mustard, turnip, spinach, etc) scrunch them up and pack them in a gallon zip lock baggie and take them on my hikes. You can add them to anything you're putting water in, just add a bit more water and you have all the greens you can stand every day!

Dehydrating raw greens sounds interesting and I've done my share of dried spinach but nothing else. Does it matter if the greens are steamed first or raw?

I have also read about crisping cut up kale in the oven.

What kind of temperature and drying time for those leafy vegetables?

The only greens I have ever dried are frozen organic spinach available at grocery stores.


I take several bags of this product and dry the whole wad for field use. I just don't know if this stuff is cooked first and then bagged for sale??


Here are a couple bags on my tray ready for drying. Looks cooked.

[Connie]

Tipi Walter,

We you thaw it, do you squeeze or drain the water?

My family had a quite extensive vegetable garden when I was a child.

We "blanched" all vegetables the amount of time we had on printed information, before putting in plastic we had for small waxed freezer boxes.

I would think all frozen vegetables are "blanched" first. I would have to find out if they are treated with "sulphured" or treated with a solution of vit C, for example.

[Tipi Walter]

Tipi Walter,

We you thaw it, do you squeeze or drain the water?

Once the frozen spinach is thawed I drain the water and place on silicone sheets for dehydrating.