I received my permit today. May 6th.
What's the difference with starting a week earlier than your permit dictates, and starting a week earlier at Warner Springs, hiking south, then flipping back to Warner and heading north?
I may get some shade for this subversion of the permit system, but I think you could get a permit for earlier, then just start later. If queried, who is to say you didn't get injured walking down the first hill and ended up staying in a hotel for a few weeks.....Originally Posted by AllDownhillFromHere
^^^ They have PCT Crest Runners who are Forest Service employees with access to law enforcement on the trail the first day.
You don't actually need a permit until like mile 6 or something but you are going to have a hard time explaining to the permit checker on May 1 at mile 10 that although your permit is for starting April 20 you are only making a 1 mile per day pace.
What do they do, arrest you for walking?
I'm starting on April 29th!
No. They give you a ticket for which you must appear before a federal judge for federal land or a state judge for state land. The federal judge can give you up to a $5,000 fine or 6 months in jail but apparently the usual for no permit is a $150 fine. Unless of course you are a dick to the Ranger and/or judge and/or don't appear. Then it can be much more.
So there is a real possibility that you would get cited with a federal court date maybe 45 to 60 days away. You want to cut your hike short to fly back to go to court?
.... Oh also, after seeing you have no permit they can order you immediately off the trail. If you refuse you can be arrested. If you resists you can (will) be charged with assaulting a federal officer.
This is all if you don't have a permit though. If you do and it's just for the wrong date then I suppose after the first 2 or 3 days you would be in the clear as no one can dispute your hiking speed. However, the Pacific Crest Runners are stationed on the first 100 miles. They are federal employees. I forget their names but there names and pictures are on the internet somewhere. There are two of them.
Like I said - what's the difference if you start at Warner 1 week early, hike south and then flip? Or two weeks early at Idylwild? None. Impact on the trail, during the same time period, is exactly the same. They can't permit the entire trail.
The PCTA fails. Permits do not solve their impact problem. Better built trails, established campsites, and privvies do. If they're going to manage a busy trail, they have to manage a busy trail.
Apparently some people have not learned anything from the AT/ATC/BSP fiasco? Entitled hikers who think the rules should not apply to them end up ruining it for everyone else. Don't be selfish, your actions have consequences.
“For of all sad words of tongue or pen,
the saddest are these, 'It might have been.”
John Greenleaf Whittier
I don't fault Scott Jurek for that one bit, the whole thing was contrived, he celebrated breaking a record with a little champagne, boo hoo.
Explain how this ruins it for everyone else.
Hi all, Jim here, no trail name for PCT. Had to abort last year. 2017 NOBO start April 30.
Wow, knee-jerk much? it's not a question of being selfish. Its pointing out that the permit system doesn't solve the problem they say it does.
Also, re: BSP - http://appalachiantrail.org/home/exp...mit-limit-faqs
What will happen to me if I arrive at Baxter State Park after all of the thru-hiker permits have already been claimed?
Katahdin will not be closed to A.T. hikers if the A.T. hiker permit limit is reached...
Will I need to speed up the pace of my thru-hike in order to make sure I get a permit?
No. Katahdin will not be closed if the A.T. Hiker Permit limit is reached...
AllDownHllHere, I have no problem with a discussion of the limits and faults of the PCT permit system. I agree it is an imperfect attempt to mitigate the problems associated with the PCT's increasing popularity. What I criticize is any suggestion that people subvert the permitting system by showing up on any given day or anywhere they choose. Please understand, I am not saying that you did this, but I wanted to raise this subject since some of the posts above might suggest to a reader that this would be OK to do.
I argue that when hikers flout these rules, they do harm to the hiker community. We have already seen on the AT how the misbehavior and entitled mentality of a small segment of the population has alienated segments of the AT community, and led to stricter regulation in BSP in particular. The actions of a single person did not do this, but collectively rule breakers have created a problem.
Whiteblaze is an education resource utilized by many first time hikers. I think that our postings should promote following the permitting rules. The PCTA's permitting system is not complicated or difficult to follow. In fact, it is a great benefit to hikers to be able to obtain a single permit for the entire trail. Try navigating obtaining permits for each of the Wilderness areas that require them for every other hiker but PCT thru-hikers and you will see what I mean. This is a privilege, and a great benefit that I would not want to see lost because of the actions of a few individuals abusing the system.
I hope we can agree ands work together to encourage hiker to make their best effort to follow the rules and their requested start dates of the PCTA permitting system. Injuries and acts of God cannot be helped, most every Ranger I have ever met would be understanding in that regard. But they are not stupid, no one likes being taken advantage of, we need to keep the rangers and other permitting authorities on our side. If you see ways to make the permitting system more effective, I am sure the PCTA would love to receive your help and constructive suggestions.
“For of all sad words of tongue or pen,
the saddest are these, 'It might have been.”
John Greenleaf Whittier
It should be pointed out that for all this talk of 3,000 PCT hikers possibly destroying thousands of miles of trails by not hiking on their exact date, MILLIONS actually use those same trails each year. I mean how many people hike in Yosemite each year? Sequoia? Kings? Crater? Tahoe?
... but it should also be pointed out that I think most of the known trail angels won't take you to the trail head unless they see you have a permit for that day. Or am I wrong? Does Frodo check?
The least I can do as a thru hiker is following all the rules, legal and/or moral to the full extent. There is no exception for anybody . There are too many" anybodies " using the trail every day already. LNT is a Must not an option.
The trailhead quotas in SEKI, Yosemite and the Inyo are quite restrictive. Of the trails that cross the east side over to the PCT Kearsarge Pass at 60 allows the most daily entries. Other popular trailheads are in the 10 per day range. It's certainly not millions.
The PCTA permit overrides all these quotas and is quite a benefit to thruhikers.
Judging from some 2016 videos of the first 200 miles or so, I am sure PCTA and the trail itself is quite happy that not all the hikers who begin as a thru don't finish it.
You know how many videos I have seen that hikers poke a rattler just to make it rattles and they take a proud video and publish it on youtube? What happened to trail animal rights? They are not there to amuse us.
I'm sorry if you thought I meant that. My point was that an arbitrary # of people starting in Campo is not a solution to overuse.
A permit to cross the patchwork of parks is definitely a super convenience, and a privilege. But in reality, it's only that - a paperwork convenience. It doesnt prevent boneheads from trashing facilities, poking rattlesnakes, or leaving trash around - and to say that it does ignores the realities that some areas need better trail maintenance and facilities.
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