Bear canister in the Smokies

[joec]

I have put off the Smokies as I would rather not sleep in the shelter areas. I cannot any longer as I am done with the south except the Park. I have been carrying a canister as I prefer the ease of storing it at night rather than hanging, or sleeping with my food. Just wondering how that would work, or not, in the SMNP?

[Malto]

I have put off the Smokies as I would rather not sleep in the shelter areas. I cannot any longer as I am done with the south except the Park. I have been carrying a canister as I prefer the ease of storing it at night rather than hanging, or sleeping with my food. Just wondering how that would work, or not, in the SMNP?

Why would carrying and using a canister in SMNP be any different there than anywhere else?

[illabelle]

Using a bear canister in the Park should be no different than using it elsewhere.

Each spring and summer the Park temporarily closes shelters and campsites where bears have learned to hang out hoping to snatch an easy meal. I remember at Cosby Shelter there was a bear wandering around that afternoon. Everybody in tents and hammocks nearby changed their minds and crowded into the shelter. At the outer edge of the sleeping platform were small stockpiles of rocks to be used as bear repellent in case he came into the shelter. My point is that some of the bears are smart, persistent, and not afraid - which may lead to them being euthanized. Good food management is important.

[Siestita]

And, at each SMNP shelter or campsite that I have used during recent years the bear cables provided have been operational. So, for trips taking place entirely within the Park, I leave my canister at home and instead use the installed bear cables to secure my food overnight. I've also learned to keep my food close at hand at other times, for example always taking it with me during detours from the trail to obtain water or take potty breaks.

Being required to sleep only at designated shelters or campsites in SMNP is inconvenient, but these days that constraint at least makes carrying a bear canister unnecessary. In theory, I could arrive at a Smokies shelter or campsite sometime and find the cables temporarily broken there. That's a small risk I am willing to take.

[Siestita]

"...there are bear cables a plenty at the shelters and most campsites in GSMNP...."

It has been my understanding, perhaps erroneous, that bear cables have been installed at all shelters and designated backcountry campsites within GSMNP. Which campsites, if any, lack bear cables?

[HooKooDooKu]

Technically speaking, there are no rules in place that specifically permit the use of Bear Canisters for 'proper food storage' within GSMNP.
If you take the time to dig into the rules, the only 'proper food storage' methods allowed within the park are...
1. Inside a vehicle,
2. Food Storage Lockers (limited supply located at select front country campgrounds),
3. Bear Cables (available at all back country campsites and shelters).
4. Hanging (at least 10' off the ground and 4' way from objects).

I can't imagine a ranger not allowing you to use a bear canister, if it's a proven canister permitted at other national parks (such as following the canister requirements for Yosemite National Park).
But not all bear canisters are approved for use everywhere (examples not permitted in some other national parks include the Ursack and older models of the Bear Vault).

[HooKooDooKu]

"...there are bear cables a plenty at the shelters and most campsites in GSMNP...."

It has been my understanding, perhaps erroneous, that bear cables have been installed at all shelters and designated backcountry campsites within GSMNP. Which campsites, if any, lack bear cables?

Yes, every back country campsite has either bear cables OR bear poles installed. However, they are subject to damage (or in the case of AT thru hiker bubbles... simply "FULL"). So one must always come prepared to hang their food if the situation dictates.

I have encountered back country campsites where either a tree has fallen into the bear cables or one of the trees the cables are attached to have fallen. So far, in each situation the camp site wasn't very full and there were additional sets of cables available. But some camp sites are more popular than others, and a few are small enough that they have only one set of cables.

[joec]

Why would carrying and using a canister in SMNP be any different there than anywhere else?

I do not know if there is a difference or not, thus the question. With the concentration of people using the park, I did not know if using a canister, and finding some tree trunk outside the shelter area to place it, would be the thing to do, or just hang as other would do. I would think the food smell out of a canister would be the same as a food bag.

[TNhiker]

"...there are bear cables a plenty at the shelters and most campsites in GSMNP...."

It has been my understanding, perhaps erroneous, that bear cables have been installed at all shelters and designated backcountry campsites within GSMNP. Which campsites, if any, lack bear cables?

Theres only a couple that don't----and those are island or boat in sites...

all trail campsites have them...

[HooKooDooKu]

I do not know if there is a difference or not, thus the question. With the concentration of people using the park, I did not know if using a canister, and finding some tree trunk outside the shelter area to place it, would be the thing to do, or just hang as other would do. I would think the food smell out of a canister would be the same as a food bag.

The difference is that in GSMNP, bears are used to bear cables, but not bear canisters.

Part of the reason bear canisters are working so well in places like Yosemite is because a bear encounters a canister, plays with it for an hour trying to figure out how to get into it, then gives up. The next night, with the next camper, he again finds a bear canister, but this time ignores it because he already knows he can't get into it.

So in other words, since bears are not yet accustom to canisters in GSMNP, you're more likely to wind up with a bear messing with your canister in GSMNP compared to the average hiker in YNP.


BTW: I've been told that some of the bears have learned that if they shake the cables, they can sometimes get lucky and bounce a food back off the bear cables. So it's best to "back up" your hang with a carabiner.

[TNhiker]

BTW: I've been told that some of the bears have learned that if they shake the cables, they can sometimes get lucky and bounce a food back off the bear cables. So it's best to "back up" your hang with a carabiner.

this is true....

ive not only had it almost happen (my stuff was clipped on so I heard the Bears shaking the cables for hours before they gave up) but have also seen photos of bears and other vermin tightroping the cables to get to bags.....

thats the fatal flaw I see in the bear cables--having an open faced hook to hang bag from.....

[Malto]

I do not know if there is a difference or not, thus the question. With the concentration of people using the park, I did not know if using a canister, and finding some tree trunk outside the shelter area to place it, would be the thing to do, or just hang as other would do. I would think the food smell out of a canister would be the same as a food bag.

A canister needs nothing to be used properly. Fill it, close it and set it 100 feet away from camp preferrably not of the side of a cliff. It would be used there just like anywhere else and if there is any doubt in your mind regarding compliance with regulations then call the park. I am confident they will be fully supportive.

[Turk6177]

I hiked through the Smokeys last fall, just prior to the fire. The signs in the shelters even ask you to hang your pack. That being said, if you hang your pack, you can just leave your bear can in your pack. I found the bear cables very convenient. They were quite robust and could hold as many packs as could fit on the hook. I think most shelters had at least 6 cables that would hold multiple bags. Regarding the other banter in this post about staying in or out of the shelter, even though section hikers have a reserved spot in the shelters, when arriving at a shelter with other hikers, it still seemed very much like the "first come first served" protocol of other AT shelters outside the park. If you wait long enough for people to set their sleeping bags up in the shelter, you should be able to sleep outside. That is probably a little less smarmy than just lying about your starting point and getting a thru-hiker permit.

[AfterParty]

You can also dig a cat hole and bury half your canister. Then in the morning pack it up make room for lunch and fill the hole. Might keep your can from rolling off and you will probably dig a hole anyways.

[August W.]

Given that bears in GSMNP aren't yet well educated about canisters, when sleeping I would keep the canister within a comfortable distance that I could easily throw a rock at. Would be good for the bears to not only learn that they can't get food from canisters, but to also learn to fear the canisters. I use this strategy wherever I camp even if most people are using canisters.