two thumbs down for Zpacks customer service

[fastfoxengineering]

I had a somewhat dissapointing experience with Zpacks on my AT thru if anyone wants to hear it. On the other hand I also had a really good experience with Zpacks on my thru. After spending big bucks on Zpacks gear, I learned their stuff isn't really all that great. Its good. Its functional. Its bloody expensive for what you get.

I think theres better options.

However, Zpacks did steal the game for newbie wannabe ultralight hikers. There name got plastered all over youtube and new hikers still think there the BEST ul gear company ever.

After playing with gear from lots of different manufacturers, I've moved away from Zpacks.

It's just not what I need or want. If I was building a specific FKT pack for a very specific trip, Id probably use some of their stuff sacks.

I use some of their patches and tape for my repair kit. I still use my stake sack Ive had since 2014.

But, in all honesty, Zpacks has become the one stop shop for the uninformed, wannabe, ultralight hiker. They got me too.


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[capehiker]

But, in all honesty, Zpacks has become the one stop shop for the uninformed, wannabe, ultralight hiker. They got me too.

They owe their early success to Red Beard and his YT videos and the continued momentum to Following Bigfoot and Facebook thru hiking pages. All it takes is one good YouTube channel to pimp other products and it’s over for them.

[Deacon]

I had a somewhat dissapointing experience with Zpacks on my AT thru if anyone wants to hear it.....

I think theres better options.

After playing with gear from lots of different manufacturers, I've moved away from Zpacks.

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Can you elaborate? I’m interested as to why.


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[MuddyWaters]

They owe their early success to Red Beard and his YT videos and the continued momentum to Following Bigfoot and Facebook thru hiking pages. All it takes is one good YouTube channel to pimp other products and it’s over for them.

Zpacks was successful long before that.
Joe was successful and growing fast from the start with the bpl ul crowd.
It was several years later before any mainstream facebook ul wannabees or whiteblazers heard of it.

In fact , the ul brain trust at time was Ron, Ron, Henry, and Glen.
Joe was an outsider, wasnt included in any reindeer games.


Their customer service is poor compared to before adding other people and scaling up.

When joe and cheryl were hiking in new zealand, i placed an order for some little items. This was right after hiring someone else to help. Cord, linelocks, mitten hooks, etc. It totalled under $10. There was an item missing. I let it slide, it was under $1.

I placed another order for small items about 1yr ago. Again, 1 small under $1 item missing. Wrong # of linelocks or such. And they were loose in envelope, not sealed in little baggie.

So yeah, zpacks has gone way downhill from when joe knew customers names, exchanged emails during day, did custom work, ofered suggestions, etc.

While the ul wannabees are scooping it up, with the ridiculous additions to placate their desires, (heavier shelters, heavier packs, etc) ul hikers have moved on in many cases to others that will still do custom work. The arc blast weighs 1/4 lb more than originally, and most also add a butt pad too. Thats a lot, about 25% more. This came about due to failures /complaints because people overloaded it.

[fastfoxengineering]

They owe their early success to Red Beard and his YT videos and the continued momentum to Following Bigfoot and Facebook thru hiking pages. All it takes is one good YouTube channel to pimp other products and it’s over for them.

Zpacks was successful long before that.
Joe was successful and growing fast from the start with the bpl ul crowd.
It was several years later before any mainstream facebook ul wannabees or whiteblazers heard of it.

In fact , the ul brain trust at time was Ron, Ron, Henry, and Glen.
Joe was an outsider, wasnt included in any reindeer games.

This ^

They owe their early success to Red Beard and his YT videos and the continued momentum to Following Bigfoot and Facebook thru hiking pages. All it takes is one good YouTube channel to pimp other products and it’s over for them.

Yes, Will really put Zpacks on the map for the public. Back then, everything was still pretty much generation 1 designs and Zpacks was still doing custom work. Also, I have read, and have seen for myself with my own gear that the gear back then was made with more attention to detail.

Can you elaborate? I’m interested as to why.


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For a few reasons. The biggest being I developed new skills as a backpacker and therefore my mentality towards my kit changed. I needed different gear and Zpacks didn't have what I was looking for. So I started looking to other cottage gear manufacturers. Since then I've bought and used gear from Mountain Laurel Designs, Hyperlight Mountain Gear, Yama Mountain Gear, Light Heart Gear, etc. I have something from most of the well known cottage companies. What I have noticed, and one thing that truly bugs me, is that Zpacks gets top dollar for their stuff but the craftsmanship isn't there. They are one of the highest priced gear companies. On par with other "tier 1" ul cottage companies. I was okay with it until I got gear from other vendors. In my experience, MLD and HMG absolutely blow away Zpacks in the craftsmanship category. All of my Zpacks gear has been 100% functional, but when your paying top dollar, I now expect a certain level of craftsmanship. You can just feel and see it when comparing my MLD products to my Zpacks products. I know it sounds like I'm just praising MLD but many others would agree with what I'm saying. I've seen plenty of sloppy, but functional, sewing on Zpacks gear. However, when paying $600 for a shelter, I find it unacceptable now. Call me picky I guess, but I know I can pay that elsewhere and get perfection so why wouldn't I.

Durability. I've used and abused alot of DCF gear over the past few years. I'm now on the side of MLD, Yama, and HMG's mindset towards DCF gear. I know there are plenty of .51 shelters out there with a decent amount of miles on it. However, I prefer .75DCF by a long shot. It's a much bomber shelter for a minuscule weight penalty. I use my gear alot in inclement weather so I'm willing to carry the extra ounce for the durability and storm worthiness.

I much prefer .75 over .51 shelters. My old .51 shelters were "delicate". Functional but delicate. My .75 shelters just seem that much sturdier in all conditions. I know you can go to .74 for their tents but it just doesn't seem right to me. The mediocre stitching and lack of reinforcements just don't install confidence to me anymore. Once you setup an MLD Solomid... You realize what a true ultralight "bomber" shelter is. I trust a solo mid in a gnarly storm over any ZPacks design. To me Zpacks tents are for mild weather. I know.. they get carried on the triple crown trails. That doesn't prove much though seeming you can go the whole PCT with setting your tent up a dozen times. Serious weather and your gonna feel it in a Zpacks tent.

Stuff Sacks. Simply put 0.51 DCF stuff sacks do not last. Honestly, DCF stuff sacks don't last in general. DCF is a bad choice for a stuff sack. Just the abrasion of taking it in/out of your pack will degrade it quickly. You'll notice MLD uses Silnylon for all his stuff sacks, including DCF shelters for this reason. I agree.

I think their packs are too intricate and have personally seen a lot of failures with them. They're getting better, but they had to reinforce a bunch of stuff and therefore increase weight. I also just don't find their packs comfortable. Personal preference.

After seeing Nunatak and Katabatic quilts, everyone else is inferior. So when I invest in another quilt, I might as well invest in what I consider the best, and the prices are very similar.

Their clothes? I just think the price is way too high for what your getting. There's clothes out there that perform the same for half the cost. lol again... my MLD Rain Mitts were cheaper than Zpacks and after seeing some Vertice mitts, mine are constructed better. It's all in the little details for long term durability.

So why did I gravitate away from Zpacks? I prefer other pack designs, I prefer other shelter designs, I prefer other clothes, and I prefer other quilt designs. It's as simple as that, I found gear that works better for ME. I feel the value isn't there with Zpacks. My MLD and HMG gear was just as expensive, but I'm going to get much more life out of it, and it their gear performs better for me.

My bad experience with Zpacks? I've spent thousands on Zpacks gear over the years. The short story, I got a brand new duplex before the AT. 700 miles in and ALL the seam tape started lifting right off the tent. I talked to the CEO directly through email. The best they would do was send me repair tape to redo all the seams myself on trail. I insisted the tent was under warranty (it was, being a month old) and that it was a defect of materials. They insisted I redo all the seams myself and move on. They would send me free tape. I just bought a $600 tent. The materials are failing due to poor bonding of the DCF tape, the tent is under warranty, and I'm suppose to fix it? I simply wasn't having it. My tent was actually defective. In the end. I redid the seams myself. After my hike, Zpacks took my tent back and gave it a once over for free. Idk why, but I just felt like the factory should've owned that one. Should have gave me a loaner while they redo my tent. I even had to pay to mail it back to them? I was just displeased with how they handled it. I expected a little more from them, and was let down. So I found it negative. Take that for what it's worth.

What Zpacks gear do I still use? My stake sack is still going strong after 4 years of abuse. But.. it's a stake sack. I also still use their Zip Wallet on the daily after a few years of everyday use. But it's a simple zip pouch. Everyone makes those now. I still use their Food Bag and it looks great after 2500+ miles of use. However, I'm changing to a new system for that as well.
I also use their patches and tape in my repair kit.
For everything else, I found higher quality gear that's better designed for my uses at the same price point or cheaper.
I'm not saying Zpacks gear is bad. But I do recommend buying from MLD, Yama, HMG to see the difference yourself. I'm not interested in SUL gear. I use ultralight gear. There's a difference.
Zpacks gear I would consider nowadays?
I would consider purchasing a 6x9 .51 tarp from them for a PCT hike. But you can't anymore. Reason being, I would primarily cowboy camp and therefore my tarp would be dead weight for the majority of the trip. I'd be looking to shave every gram possible off my overhead shelter.
If I was planning an FKT or fast pack. I'm not, but If I was, I'd consider some of their stuff sacks to shave grams, that 6x9 tarp, etc. But I don't hike like that and have no plans to, so I really have no use for it.
If Zpacks still did some customization I'd be more interested. But the fact they're not willing to budge on anything anymore has me looking elsewhere.
I'm pretty picky! but were talking big $$$ here.
In the end, I have found a piece of equipment that serves my purposes better than anything Zpacks sells. So I have moved away from them.

Shelters - I prefer MLD
Quilts - I prefer Katabatic
Clothes - I like Montbell
Packs - I use Gossamer Gear, HMG, and looking at an MLD Burn
Stuff Sacks and Dry Bags - I don't use em anymore
Tent Stakes - MSR, Lawson, Ruta Locura
Guylines - Lawson
Cookpots - Evernew... Zpacks sells those! So doesnt amazon
Trekking Poles - Leki and Gossamer Gear
Shoulder Pouches - Zimmerbuilt
Everything else - I'm not going to buy a Zpacks branded buff, fleece hat, or trucker cap. That's silly.

Everything else on their site I simply have no use for.


All just a personal preference. Happy Trails

[fastfoxengineering]

They also stopped selling materials. I understand why, but I use to buy DCF from them.

Like muddy waters has said... once the custom work ended, a lot of us moved on.

I feel like Zpacks markets themselves heavily towards new, inexperienced, wanna be ultralight long distance hikers. And that's why if you go down to Georgia in late March, you'll see some people in 100% Zpacks gear. 100%. It's the one stop shop for the new hiker.
I think it's fair to say Valesko got into the game and sold SUPER ULTRALIGHT GEAR. He no longer does and therefore, lost most of his original customers. However, that doesn't mean he's not wildly successful.
Knowing what I know now, I probably wouldn't own any Zpacks gear.

[capehiker]

Zpacks was successful long before that.
Joe was successful and growing fast from the start with the bpl ul crowd.
It was several years later before any mainstream facebook ul wannabees or whiteblazers heard of it.

In fact , the ul brain trust at time was Ron, Ron, Henry, and Glen.
Joe was an outsider, wasnt included in any reindeer games.


Their customer service is poor compared to before adding other people and scaling up.

When joe and cheryl were hiking in new zealand, i placed an order for some little items. This was right after hiring someone else to help. Cord, linelocks, mitten hooks, etc. It totalled under $10. There was an item missing. I let it slide, it was under $1.

I placed another order for small items about 1yr ago. Again, 1 small under $1 item missing. Wrong # of linelocks or such. And they were loose in envelope, not sealed in little baggie.

So yeah, zpacks has gone way downhill from when joe knew customers names, exchanged emails during day, did custom work, ofered suggestions, etc.

While the ul wannabees are scooping it up, with the ridiculous additions to placate their desires, (heavier shelters, heavier packs, etc) ul hikers have moved on in many cases to others that will still do custom work. The arc blast weighs 1/4 lb more than originally, and most also add a butt pad too. Thats a lot, about 25% more. This came about due to failures /complaints because people overloaded it.

I should rephrase. Will Wood took Zpacks from the niche group on BPL and put Zpacks on the thru hiking map.

[ARambler]

fastfoxengineeringwrote:
>

Durability. I've used and abused alot of DCF gear over the past few years. I'm now on the side of MLD, Yama, and HMG's mindset towards DCF gear. I know there are plenty of .51 shelters out there with a >decent amount of miles on it. However, I prefer .75DCF by a long shot. It's a much bomber shelter for a minuscule weight penalty. I use my gear alot in inclement weather so I'm willing to carry the extra >ounce for the durability and storm worthiness.

>I much prefer .75 over .51 shelters. My old .51 shelters were "delicate". Functional but delicate. My .75 shelters just seem that much sturdier in all conditions. I know you can go to .74 for their tents but it >just doesn't seem right to me. The mediocre stitching and lack of reinforcements just don't install confidence to me anymore. Once you setup an MLD Solomid... You realize what a true ultralight "bomber" >shelter is. I trust a solo mid in a gnarly storm over any ZPacks design. To me Zpacks tents are for mild weather. I know.. they get carried on the triple crown trails. That doesn't prove much though >seeming you can go the whole PCT with setting your tent up a dozen times. Serious weather and your gonna feel it in a Zpacks tent.

>Stuff Sacks. Simply put 0.51 DCF stuff sacks do not last. Honestly, DCF stuff sacks don't last in general. DCF is a bad choice for a stuff sack. Just the abrasion of taking it in/out of your pack will degrade it >quickly. You'll notice MLD uses Silnylon for all his stuff sacks, including DCF shelters for this reason. I agree.

I agreed with your thinking, and my first Soloplex was 0.75 mil. It had a tragic death after 3 full seasons (after minor repair it probably would have lasted a fourth but more likely would have been a backup for many years). I then bought the "standard" .51 mil Soloplex to 1) save money, 2) save weight, 3) it rolls up and fits in the stuff sack easier. The second Soloplex is in good shape after 2 seasons and should last a third season (The zipper has stuck twice recently; Does anyone know if Zpacks has good customer service for repairs?) I should get a Duoplex for backup and then maybe save the now discontinued Soloplex for faster hikes. I need two stuff sacks for three seasons. About the same frequency for their much heavier food bag. So, it seems you are piling on due to a defect and POOR CUSTOMER SERVICE. I cannot say I have had great customer service. They are so popular now, I just assumed they were out buying convertibles for their mistresses (or maybe still hiking).