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  1. #1
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    Default Question/advise needed re cold spot..

    Last trip on my coolest night (upper 30's) i had a cold spot right around chest/sternum area. I use
    a neo air x lite and a hammock gear reg/wide 20 burrow overquilt with 2 oz overstuff.
    This was my first trip going to ground and my theory is when i gathered the sides of the quilt around me, some of the down "slid down" to them (redistributed)...
    You guys think this was the case? Also, to remedy, simply shake some down towards the center (top) of the bag?
    thanks
    -s

  2. #2
    Registered User egilbe's Avatar
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    That may have happened and that's the remedy, or you can drape your puffy over that spot that's cold.

  3. #3

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    Quote Originally Posted by cr115 View Post
    Last trip on my coolest night (upper 30's) i had a cold spot right around chest/sternum area. I use
    a neo air x lite and a hammock gear reg/wide 20 burrow overquilt with 2 oz overstuff.
    This was my first trip going to ground and my theory is when i gathered the sides of the quilt around me, some of the down "slid down" to them (redistributed)...
    You guys think this was the case? Also, to remedy, simply shake some down towards the center (top) of the bag?
    thanks
    -s
    I have the same quilt. I cinch the quilt a bit at the top to make more down concentrate around the chest area. Makes a significant difference. If it's not cinched at all, it will be too spread out.
    I also use 1 pad attachment cord if it's cold, using the pad attachments second from the top of the quilt. I find that's good enough to give flexibility and keeps it in place

  4. #4
    Registered User Venchka's Avatar
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    What were you wearing? R value of the pad?
    This wouldn’t be the first 20 degree quilt, or sleeping bag, that was really a 30 something quilt or bag.
    Wayne

  5. #5
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    Had on merino mid weight top and bottoms with merino socks, thin baclava

  6. #6
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    Tony Stark has invented an electromagnetic chest warmer for such occasions.

  7. #7
    Registered User Venchka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cr115 View Post
    Had on merino mid weight top and bottoms with merino socks, thin baclava
    My theory was wrong.
    Perhaps the down did shift.
    Wayne

  8. #8

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    An older Burrow? (That's not a nice thing to accuse Wayne of though )

    The current Burrow has vertical baffles in the torso- though sometimes when folks shake out a vertical baffle quilt at camp they can accidentally shift down to the foot end.
    Otherwise with horizontal baffles down shift is common and the reason most vendors got away from it in quilts (makes more sense in sleeping bags).

    To make Wayne happy- an Xlite is 'about there' as you hit 30* and it's a good time to swap in the Xtherm just in case.

    Hiking Jim makes a good point as well. Not only does cinching the top help shape the quilt a bit, but if you're tucking in the sides too much you can actually compress the loft of the down up top. So if draft busting is an issue then using a pad strap would help with that better by pulling the quilt tight to the pad without chewing up any width. This is an issue that won't affect you in your hammock since your UQ is doing the bulk of the work to cover your sides and your top quilt typically lies fairly loosely over you. When you're on the ground you're pulling, tugging, tucking and stretching it to wrap the 2/3 to 3/4 of your body not insulated by the pad.

    Much like my beer belly now compresses the loft of my down puffy into general uselessness... your chest (or shoulder/hip for side sleepers) becomes the high spot where loft can get compressed when the quilt is pulled too tight.
    So after down shift... look into how the quilt is laying on you and if it's not lying loosely and fully lofted then it won't function properly.

  9. #9

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    Generally speaking, yes, you should shake the quilt to move the down away from the edges that are under you to where it'll do more good. It shouldn't be moving around on its own, though(especially with 2oz overfill), so paint me skeptical over down distribution being the issue.

    Thermarest mats with baffles in lieu of actual insulation seem to be a common denominator among people complaining about their sleep system not being up to snuff online.
    Apparently they don't work well for people who sleep cold to begin with in particular. Maybe something to do with the reflective layer, compression under the hips and torso lessening it's insulative properties, perhaps in addition to some people being "active sleepers" and getting the air moving inside the mat, don't know. Whatever the reason, I'm assuming you do sleep cold given we're talking an overstuffed 20F quilt in the high 30s. There'd have to be an awful lot of misplaced down...


    I always tend to look at the pad first, either way, because it makes a huge difference in the lower limits of my own sleep system. I sleep exceptionally warm, and use the same "30F"(teens for me) Katabatic Palisade with everything from boxer briefs and a T at 30-50F to grid fleece bottoms and a down parka into negative single digits, but switch from a r3.3 Synmat Hyperlite to a r5.9 Downmat UL7 when temps get below freezing. And I'm sometimes sweating on the Downmat at temps I'm comfortable on the Hyperlite.

  10. #10

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    Weird coincidence, I was reading about the vertical baffles I'd seen some of these makers had gone to, and there were complaints about the down shifting in Hammock Gear quilts. Maybe so, then!

  11. #11
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    It's not just the pad underneath that contributes to warmth. It can be the switching out of a polycro, DCF, or Tyvek groundcloth to an aluminized mylar or metalized polyethlene(SOL emergency blanket material) one. It reflects/radiates heat back to you. That's the primary way Thermarest adds R Value to their NeoAir XTherm compared to the NeoAir XLite. Thermarest calls it their tech savvy sounding Thermacapture with Triangular Core Matrix construction. They use more reflecting layers though to do it with the X therm compared to the Xlite. If you ever cut one open or shorten a longer one up you'll noticed the layers.

    Instead of so many different pricey inflatable mats one might be able to achieve the warmth increase desired by switching to a $5 aluminized ground sheet from a polycro, DCF or Tyvek one. Try it I bet you'll sleep warmer possibly warm enough without the bulk and additional $$$ of a NeoXTherm or Downmat UL7. It works off the greater breakdown into modular or compartmentalization components idea.

  12. #12

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    Problem is widespread

    Poorly made quilts
    Non differential cut
    Insufficient down
    No draft collar

    Leakage around sides

    Compression /no down at shoulders/neck

    $hitty flat footboxes on some

    Because fools are worried about a couple oz
    So go ahead, be cold

    A quilt is not as warm as a bag
    Nope, nope, nope
    Most are 10 f less than rating suggests...at least

    Use head....

    And yeah, distribute down on that underfilled quilt
    Lengthwise long baffle are no better. Too easy to have maldistribution. Looks dumb too. Problem is non-differential cut mostly, and insufficient down.

    Quilts still have benefit of being less tangly
    But many buyers today who get extra long, extra wide save no weight vs a bag. And are less warm too.
    Last edited by MuddyWaters; 11-10-2018 at 05:38.

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