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  1. #1
    Registered User Storyguy's Avatar
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    Default Fuel Canister Size for AT Thru Hike

    For an AT thru hike, do you recommend a 4 oz or 8 oz Isopro fuel container? I plan to use my Pocket Rocket once in the AM and once in the PM- cooking solo.

    Thanks for input!

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    4 oz, they last for weeks that way (and if they don't you need to redo your stove system). Hated when I had to carry 8 oz. But I was able to use it 'to the last drop, and very comfortable with estimating how much fuel is left. Others get nervous after a couple of boils and seek to renew it ASAP, for those people it would be better to carry two 4 oz ones then a 8 oz.

  3. #3

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    If you havent built a hanging windscreen for your pot, do it before you go and then if you are on budget buy 8 oz cans. Two burns a day should get you 14 burns or 7 days. Realize that a lot of folks get real paranoid and swap out cannisters before they are empty. In the vast majority of the AT if you run out of fuel you can collect some twigs build a small fire and cook you food.

    One caveat is in cold conditions, as the tank empties out the stove does not burn as well unless you keep it warm. Some folks think they are out of fuel but whats really going on is they can only get a low flame as the tank is cold. Warm it up and you can get a couple of more meals.

  4. #4
    Registered User Crossup's Avatar
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    +1 on the windscreen. I bought a Bushbox Ultralight which as it turns out can accept my stove inside creating a windscreen. Obviously if I run out of fuel, then I can burn wood and it only weights only 70grams and takes up next to no room in same bag as my pans. It also allows me cook two things at once, which I sometimes do when I'm short on time but MUST have my raspberry crumble.

  5. #5
    Registered User 4eyedbuzzard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Storyguy View Post
    For an AT thru hike, do you recommend a 4 oz or 8 oz Isopro fuel container? I plan to use my Pocket Rocket once in the AM and once in the PM- cooking solo.

    Thanks for input!
    To answer with any degree of accuracy a lot more information is needed. And we've been down this rabbit hole before on WB (it's actually kind of fun - for some of us). But you (we) can over-analyze it to death - as follows:
    How much water would you be heating at each meal time?
    At which meals would you only be bringing water to the "fisheyes" @180° point (good for coffee, tea, oatmeal, etc.), or going for a pre-boil stream of bubbles @205° (better for freeze dried meals, ramen, etc), or a full rolling boil @212°?
    Would you be doing any simmering?
    What pot are you using? A pot like the Olicamp with the heat exchanger will be more efficient. Wider pots generally are a little better than tall ones as well. Do you have a pot or freezer bag cozy to let the food cook completely cooking AFTER removing it from the stove?
    Windscreens make a big difference, as does the temp. of the water you start with and the temp of the ambient air. [You'll use less fuel in summer months]

    So, having said all that, just start out with two small (4 oz) canisters and you'll quickly find out how much you need between resupply points. A full small canister weighs just under 8 oz. It won't break your back, but running out of fuel two days from resupply will leave you without hot coffee/tea and eating crunchy ramen or cooking over a wood fire (if you can get the wet wood going). Now, usually, some kind fellow hiker will help out and heat some water for you, and you might even find a partial filled canister in a hiker box. But that means scrounging and yogi-ing and probably isn't in your nature. Carrying an extra until you get your fuel usage down is only an extra 8 oz, and you'll have it figured out by the time you hit GSMNP or sooner. Then you'll know if you can go the usual 4-5 days between resupply on a 4 oz canister or if it might be better to carry the 8oz in certain sections.
    Last edited by 4eyedbuzzard; 04-09-2019 at 19:34.

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by Crossup View Post
    +1 on the windscreen. I bought a Bushbox Ultralight which as it turns out can accept my stove inside creating a windscreen. Obviously if I run out of fuel, then I can burn wood and it only weights only 70grams and takes up next to no room in same bag as my pans. It also allows me cook two things at once, which I sometimes do when I'm short on time but MUST have my raspberry crumble.
    I'm not familiar with the BushBox, but the key thing in a windscreen is a HANGING windscreen. For safety reasons, you don't want the canister to be heated by the windscreen. Search the DIY section here and you'll see some photos of various windscreens that hang from the pot stand arms. You can also make a heat shield disc which clips in above the canister.
    Go afield with a good attitude, with respect for the wildlife you hunt, and the forest and field in which you walk. Immerse yourself in the outdoor experience. It will cleanse your soul.--Fred Bear

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  7. #7
    GSMNP 900 Miler
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    Quote Originally Posted by peakbagger View Post
    In the vast majority of the AT if you run out of fuel you can collect some twigs build a small fire and cook you food.
    I don't recommend this as a backup plan on several levels.
    First of all is the black soot that will get on your cook pot that will be darn near impossible to ever completely clean off.
    And if it's been raining, YOU might not even be able to build a fire. Sure, those with some mad fire burning skills can start a fire with just a hunk of wet wood and a chocolate bar... but the vast majority of those on the AT will NOT have fire skills on that level.

  8. #8
    Registered User Crossup's Avatar
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    First off, let me concede that you are more experienced than me. That said, its only takes a split O-ring to kill a canister stove, my guess is even less people carry spare parts/tools to fix a stove than who carry a wood stove for backup.
    So my question is what is you recommendation for backup cooking assuming you either have no gas(so a backup stove wont help) or a broken stove?
    As to the soot, someone forgot to tell me so I've been cooking with my Ti pans for 4 years over wood fires(car camping) and they clean right up, no trace. And that is without resorting to abrasives(excepting softscrub) which obviously can remove anything. To me the only real issue is having to clean soot before stowing the pan and stove. Well worth it to have a hot meal.

    Quote Originally Posted by HooKooDooKu View Post
    I don't recommend this as a backup plan on several levels.
    First of all is the black soot that will get on your cook pot that will be darn near impossible to ever completely clean off.
    And if it's been raining, YOU might not even be able to build a fire. Sure, those with some mad fire burning skills can start a fire with just a hunk of wet wood and a chocolate bar... but the vast majority of those on the AT will NOT have fire skills on that level.

  9. #9
    GSMNP 900 Miler
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    I'm not experienced enough cooking over a camp fire to know what caused me such grief. Perhaps it was resins in the wood burning on my pot. But the time I had to resort to cooking over a camp fire left me with some serious efforts to try to clean my MSR Titanium pot once I was home, and I don't think I EVERY got it back to as clean as it was when I had only used it over a camp stove.

    The best backup would be a hiking partner carrying a similar stove as well, or making sure you have enough no-cook foods you can still a dinner for a while if you're having issues with your stove.

    I'd love to hear some input from those with positive experiences cooking over a campfire. I just know that after my experience trying, I'd rather go a little hungry during a weekend trip than cook over a campfire again.

  10. #10
    Registered User Venchka's Avatar
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    From a cost perspective, the 8 ounce, 230 gram, canisters are the clear winner.
    How long will an 8 ounce canister last?
    https://youtu.be/cWmBkWp1S_I

    Wayne

  11. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by HooKooDooKu View Post
    I don't recommend this as a backup plan on several levels.
    First of all is the black soot that will get on your cook pot that will be darn near impossible to ever completely clean off.
    And if it's been raining, YOU might not even be able to build a fire. Sure, those with some mad fire burning skills can start a fire with just a hunk of wet wood and a chocolate bar... but the vast majority of those on the AT will NOT have fire skills on that level.
    Been there done that and survived. I dont plan to run out of fuel but I have the skills to start a fire in most conditions. I dont mind a black pot, it improves the heat transfer, I dont eat what is on the outside of the pot. I actually keep track of my fuel pretty closely so running out is not a big surprise. If I was cutting it close I would probably do the wood fire a night before so if the weather does turn I have fuel if I need it. If I was in the situation where I need to start a fire, I usually keep an eye out for fuel and for the last few miles before I get to my intended campsite. There is usually a human browse line at or near campsites so the fuel options are not great but most folks are lazy to a 5 or 10 minute walk usually gets me to spot where there is easy picking. Since I am in northern New England based, there is usually a white or yellow birch nearby and even in the rain a pocket full of loose birch curls will dry off damp dead twigs I find under any softwood. In cold conditions I usually carry some reserve anyhow in case I need to do the hot water bottle trick. Carrying extra fuel is a lot lighter than carrying extra gear. Fuel doesn't weight much its the dead load of the cans that adds the weight.

    BTW, a little bit of wet sand or gravel will clean off soot pretty quick. Soot is carbon so I am not worried about fouling a water source scrubbing off soot.
    Last edited by peakbagger; 04-10-2019 at 06:18.

  12. #12
    Registered User gbolt's Avatar
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    2018 Thru Hike, I carried a 4 oz that was in use and then purchased another 4 0z backup to swap out. I would use the one until completely empty (usually just shy of a full boil at the most inconvenient time, lol). Switch and pick up the next 4oz the next RS or two later (depending on # of days). Really a personal choice though. No one else is carrying your weight.
    "gbolt" on the Trail

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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by HooKooDooKu View Post
    I'm not experienced enough cooking over a camp fire to know what caused me such grief. Perhaps it was resins in the wood burning on my pot.

    … Snip … snip … snip …

    I'd love to hear some input from those with positive experiences cooking over a campfire. I just know that after my experience trying, I'd rather go a little hungry during a weekend trip than cook over a campfire again.
    My experience is that the type of wood I burn makes a huge difference to the amount and ‘stickiness’ of the soot, as does the hotness/completeness of combustion. Resinous coniferous wood (pine’s, spruces, balsam fir, cedar) can lead to thick sticky soot buildup. Hardwoods (such as maple, oak, beech) burn hotter and produce a different less troublesome but hard buildup. The efficiency of the fire is also related to how well I build and then manage the fire. And on my equipment.

    I found an ancient dead pitch-filled Red Pine in Quetico back in the 1970s, and carried little sticks of it (for sentimental reasons …) until I finally used the last a couple of year’s ago. Fantastic fire starter — and huge soot producer.

    I prefer dry Sugar Maple or dry Oak (of any sort) as my firewood, with White Cedar (Arbor vitae) and birchbark as starter. In the wood-burning Inferno of my Caldera Cone, I get hot efficient burns from finger-thickness-&-length wood. My titantium pot has a lovely thin black sheen that I swipe at with duff after each use, and occasionally scrub at when I’m back home.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  14. #14
    Registered User Crossup's Avatar
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    A couple tips for wood fire cooking- smear a thin film of soap on pan bottom. That make the soot no stick so much, making trail cleanup easier. At home, use diluted vinegar to soak the pan. It helps to warm it. If you cook several times and end up with areas with built up residue(likely resins) often kerosene and solvent cleansers will take it right off. I also find using a soot stained pan(Ti anyway) over a canister stove will slowly "cook" most stains off. And if you really want to restore the original look of the pan finish use SoftScrub after the above steps.

    And yes, I carry dish soap for this as well as use it to do trail laundry and a 1" sq. piece of Scotchbrite/foam pad

    Many videos online on the subject, heres one which also claims chalk will help on rough finished pans
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F3PDEA0I-mk

  15. #15
    Registered User colorado_rob's Avatar
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    As alluded to already, it does all depend on your usage and stove efficiency.

    I'm a heavy fuel user, doing 4 heats of water a day; 2 big cups of coffee most mornings, a big cup or two of tea in evenings along with a FD meal. I carried both sizes, depending on how long before resupply. A 4 oz is 7.5 oz total, an 8 is 13.5. Sometimes those extra 6 total ounces were worth it. The rest of my pack is pretty UL, so I don't sweat this much.

    I carry the extremely efficient Jetboil, and get 16 2-cup heats out of a 4 oz canister, twice that out of an 8 oz. My testing shows that a pocket rocket uses about 30% more fuel, meaning with a PR you will get about 11-12 heats out of a 4oz, etc. BTW, I don't let my water get to a full rolling boil, just right to the edge, meaning the temperature is close to boiling. Sometimes, of course, I don't turn it off in time and waste a gram or two of fuel.

    So bottom line, if I can resupply in 4 days, a small one will do, if bigger than that, I go with the 8 oz.

    Backup: Those little trioxane tablets (very similar to Esbit tabs) make the best emergency fire starters out there, so I always carry one on BP trips pretty much anywhere, and they also work as a backup for heating water. On my complete AT hike, I used these tablets twice to heat water when I did run out of fuel. I just plop the tablet on a flat rock, light it, and set the JB pot on top (it has a cavity for the HX on the bottom). I never had to build an actual fire to heat water.

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