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  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Weasel View Post
    Your permit is not transferable. You use it or lose it. If lost or not used in the shelter you . must leave.
    Technical correct, but so long as the shelter is full before tents/hammocks start going up, the spirit of the rule is being followed... Seems like I've been at a shelter during the bubble and even the ridge runner didn't care who was and who was not in the shelter so long as the shelter was full and reservation holders had first option at the shelter.

    So long as the spirit of the rules are being followed, there isn't the danger of more restrictive rules getting put in place.

  2. #42
    Registered User scope's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Weasel View Post
    Your permit is not transferable. You use it or lose it. If lost or not used in the shelter you . must leave.
    No one is getting a citation for being in overflow instead of the shelter as long as the shelter is full. To force one person out who wants to be in the shelter to ensure that there are only reserved folks in the shelter is trifling. There is no clear advantage there one way or the other.

    The only rule I see on the subject is that if someone with a reservation wants to stay in the shelter, a thru hiker must give up the space. This language would seem to leave plenty of room for not giving up that space if itís the reservation holderís choice to not enforce.


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  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by scope View Post
    No one is getting a citation for being in overflow instead of the shelter as long as the shelter is full. To force one person out who wants to be in the shelter to ensure that there are only reserved folks in the shelter is trifling. There is no clear advantage there one way or the other.

    The only rule I see on the subject is that if someone with a reservation wants to stay in the shelter, a thru hiker must give up the space. This language would seem to leave plenty of room for not giving up that space if itís the reservation holderís choice to not enforce.

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    I love you people. Mrs. The Weasel has several expensive needs, and your fees will help me make them possible. Please try these tricks only in North Carolina, where I can appear in federal court with you. Visa/MC and other major cards accepted.


    TW


    "Thank God! there is always a Land of Beyond, For us who are true to the trail..." --- Robert Service

  4. #44
    Registered User LittleRock's Avatar
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    Does anyone else here find it ironic that a guy named "The Weasel" is lecturing people on following the rules?
    It's all good in the woods.

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by rmitchell View Post
    Madgoat, is there possibly a typo for day 4 & 5.

    Day 4 - 26 to 46 - 13.5mi +4600ft -5300ft
    Day 5 - 46 to Newfound Gap - 10.2mi +3800ft -2600ft

    Do you intend to say campsite 68?

    Campsite 46 is way down Indian Creek toward Deep Creek.
    Yes, I meant 68. Sorry for the confusion. Not sure how I mixed that up.

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by LittleRock View Post
    Does anyone else here find it ironic that a guy named "The Weasel" is lecturing people on following the rules?
    Not ironic at all when you see his profession.

  7. #47

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    Quote Originally Posted by grubbster View Post
    Not ironic at all when you see his profession.
    Dang, you beat me to it
    The older I get, the faster I hiked.

  8. #48

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    Quote Originally Posted by grubbster View Post
    Not ironic at all when you see his profession.
    All lawyers are weasels? You might be on to something. From now on any hiking lawyer I meet gets the trail name Weasel.

    Nobody has violated user agreement in this thread re: commitment of illegal acts.

  9. #49

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Weasel View Post
    I love you people. Mrs. The Weasel has several expensive needs, and your fees will help me make them possible. Please try these tricks only in North Carolina, where I can appear in federal court with you. Visa/MC and other major cards accepted.


    TW


    I like this guy!

  10. #50
    GSMNP 900 Miler
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    Quote Originally Posted by trailmercury View Post
    Nobody has violated user agreement in this thread re: commitment of illegal acts.
    You need the rest of that sentence...
    4. Discussions involving how to commit illegal acts ... are forbidden.
    This thread includes discussing the "rules" of Great Smoky Mountains National Park, and these "rules" are not simply suggestions or management desires. These "rules" carry the weight of law.

    So any discussion on how to get away with not following these rules is a discussion on how to commit an illegal act.

  11. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by MtDoraDave View Post
    I like this guy!
    Spread the word. I can use the help.
    "Thank God! there is always a Land of Beyond, For us who are true to the trail..." --- Robert Service

  12. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Weasel View Post
    Speaking as a disability lawyer, I would get a letter from a licensed MD confirming this, and then contact the Park HQ. Direct the letter/call to the Handicap Accommodation office. I suggest providing assurances that you will have non-destructive collars to tie to trees and get exact locations set out. They will have very appropriate safety concerns about scavenging animals where you set up, including bears, so you should address those concerns up front. Frankly, speaking as a backpacker, I have some problems with it: (1) It's a dumb idea; if your bones are so bad that you can't pad yourself, it raises medical questions about whether you should be out there in the first place. (2) It sets a poor example with others in the shelters, some of whom will resent you even if they shouldn't, since you're basically getting a guaranteed spot at the shelter. (3) It's potentially dangerous, as noted. But, legally, the Park has to provide a reasonable accommodation, if you can establish medical necessity.

    TW
    Yeah, similar to all those who do GSMNP with 'necessary' emotional support dogs, cats, and ferrets.

  13. #53
    GSMNP 900 Miler
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dogwood View Post
    Yeah, similar to all those who do GSMNP with 'necessary' emotional support dogs, cats, and ferrets.
    While you might be able to get on a plane with an "emotional support dog", you're not going to be able to legally take an emotional support dog in the GSMNP back country.

    Rewind a few years ago and the park service didn't allow animals of any kind to be taken into the back country. But then word came down from Washington that the park service was to comply with ADA rules and regulations.
    But the ADA only applies to "service animals". That means the animal has to be able to perform a task for the disabled individual... emotional support animals to NOT fall under the ADA.

    I started to question why emotional support animals are even allowed on planes since they are not covered by ADA. But I googled the subject and apparently there was a law passed known as ACAA (Air Carrier Access Act) that specifically includes emotional support animals.

  14. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by HooKooDooKu View Post
    While you might be able to get on a plane with an "emotional support dog", you're not going to be able to legally take an emotional support dog in the GSMNP back country.

    Rewind a few years ago and the park service didn't allow animals of any kind to be taken into the back country. But then word came down from Washington that the park service was to comply with ADA rules and regulations.
    But the ADA only applies to "service animals". That means the animal has to be able to perform a task for the disabled individual... emotional support animals to NOT fall under the ADA.

    I started to question why emotional support animals are even allowed on planes since they are not covered by ADA. But I googled the subject and apparently there was a law passed known as ACAA (Air Carrier Access Act) that specifically includes emotional support animals.
    As an attorney with a 100% disability (deaf, but largely corrected by cochlear implants) who has litigated major handicap/animal cases, this is pretty much gospel: (1) ONLY trained (and recognized) dogs are "service animals" under ADA and similar laws, and ONLY for blind and deaf handicappers. (2) "Assistance animals" such as untrained dogs, cats and the rest are not generally covered by any specific law. (3) Airlines only are required to recognize these principles, and allow other animals only to minimize confrontations.

    While exceptions exist, it's not as "free and easy" as people think.

    TW
    "Thank God! there is always a Land of Beyond, For us who are true to the trail..." --- Robert Service

  15. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by grubbster View Post
    Not ironic at all when you see his profession.
    Jam it, dude.

    Yeah, not only am I "The Weasel" (not A weasel, but "The Weasel") and an attorney, but that's how I got my trail name, not by self-anointing as a lot of lowlifes seem to do: In 2000 I was going to meet Joe Tallant (who became my best trail friend from meeting here on WB) in February to start at Springer. A few weeks before we were to start, I called his daughter to ask for him, and he was ill. She wasn't sure who "Russ Boltz" was, so I said, "I'm the lawyer from Michigan who's gonna hike with Joe." That led her to exclaim, "Oh! You're the weasel he's always talking about." Hence the Trail Name.

    As for the snark, yeah: Rules are there for reasons, and lawyers make a living out of people who think they're too smart to have to follow the rules that the rest of the world honors. Sorry about that. If everyone was a saint, me and my priest would be out of jobs. Until then, you folks can make us a pretty good living.

    The Weasel
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    "Thank God! there is always a Land of Beyond, For us who are true to the trail..." --- Robert Service

  16. #56
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    While exceptions exist, it's not as "free and easy" as people think.


    well------the abuse of people claiming their dogs (or whatever) are service animals has seemed to increase...

    ive seen way too many dogs at concerts i attend where the animal doesnt have a vest, yet the venue is letting them in as thats what the owner is telling them...

    and these animals are not displaying the signs of a service animal-----as in, better trained than a normal pet...

    same with other businesses...

    last week, i was in a fast food establishment, and a lady brought her dog in...

    she let it off leash and it wandered around the seating area....

    clearly that dog was not a service animal but the restaurant let them in believing the owner...

  17. #57
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    There is a difference between "exceptions" and "not enforcing rules."

    TW
    "Thank God! there is always a Land of Beyond, For us who are true to the trail..." --- Robert Service

  18. #58

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    This isn't a service dog thread, that was a hijack by Dogwood. Stick to the thread topic please.
    "Sleepy alligator in the noonday sun
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  19. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alligator View Post
    This isn't a service dog thread, that was a hijack by Dogwood. Stick to the thread topic please.
    As the OP, please feel free to close this thread. I simply wanted to know if there is a route that can taken and I have my answer thanks to madgoat and rmitchell.
    .................................................. .................................................. .................................................. ..........
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  20. #60

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    Question sufficiently answered to OP's satisfaction.
    "Sleepy alligator in the noonday sun
    Sleepin by the river just like he usually done
    Call for his whisky
    He can call for his tea
    Call all he wanta but he can't call me..."
    Robert Hunter & Ron McKernan

    Whiteblaze.net User Agreement.

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